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SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 05:56 PM
http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm

There is no way he goes in the first round with a score like that as a QB.. A 6 on that test is like borderline braindead.

LIQUID24
02-25-2006, 05:57 PM
Maybe he spelled his name wrong.

Alex44
02-25-2006, 05:58 PM
I dont care what they said he scored, it doesnt matter

How smart you are has no measure on whether you can read a defense or not, or how much intensity you bring or your leadership skills

I hate the damn test its stupid

I dont care if he can pick out the sixth month of the year off the top of his head as long as he can make the 3rd and 4th read on a play

Phinanthropist
02-25-2006, 06:02 PM
Great news. I'll take him at 16 without hesitation.

SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 06:03 PM
I dont care what they said he scored, it doesnt matter

How smart you are has no measure on whether you can read a defense or not, or how much intensity you bring or your leadership skills

I hate the damn test its stupid

I dont care if he can pick out the sixth month of the year off the top of his head as long as he can make the 3rd and 4th read on a play

Actually it does for a QB.. Those tests are designed to test symbolic and mental processing.. Thats why its timed. If he scores so miserably on that test, it does not serve well for his potential for breaking down NFL strategic plans, reading complicated defenses on the fly, etc. They dont make atheletes take these tests for fun, they do serve a purpose.

Alex44
02-25-2006, 06:04 PM
I can see the new joke already

Which will be lower his test score or his draft position

But as I said above the test really has no bearing on your football knowledge which I have no doubt he has, I have always thought he was a little dull so to speak off the field

SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 06:04 PM
Great news. I'll take him at 16 without hesitation.

I definately wouldnt if that test score is true...

SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 06:05 PM
I can see the new joke already

Which will be lower his test score or his draft position

But as I said above the test really has no bearing on your football knowledge which I have no doubt he has, I have always thought he was a little dull so to speak off the field

IT DOES have significant bearing on QB play! The Wonderlic, like most intelligence tests, serves to test one's ability to process information quickly and accurately. With a score like 6, it throws up a serious red flag about his processing ability, and for a position like QB, the ability to process information quickly and accurately is integral.

Alex44
02-25-2006, 06:06 PM
Actually it does for a QB.. Those tests are designed to test symbolic and mental processing.. Thats why its timed. If he scores so miserably on that test, it does not serve well for his potential for breaking down NFL strategic plans, reading complicated defenses on the fly, etc. They dont make atheletes take these tests for fun, they do serve a purpose.

No just because your smart off the field doesnt mean you are smart on the field and vice versa

Some guys dedicate themselves to studying football rather than studying in school, so they learn more things on the field than they do off

The test really is stupid IMO doesnt show anything

As long as you finish the test on time your fine

Alex44
02-25-2006, 06:07 PM
IT DOES have significant bearing on QB play! The Wonderlic, like most intelligence tests, serves to test one's ability to process information quickly and accurately. With a score like 6, it throws up a serious red flag about his processing ability, and for a position like QB, the ability to process information quickly and accurately is integral.

And on the field he did process that info just fine

So why worry about how he processes off the field

Maybe he is a stupid guy, that doesnt make him a stupid player at all

making a quick read is nothing like picking which month comes 6th in the year

SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 06:09 PM
No just because your smart off the field doesnt mean you are smart on the field and vice versa

Some guys dedicate themselves to studying football rather than studying in school, so they learn more things on the field than they do off

The test really is stupid IMO doesnt show anything

As long as you finish the test on time your fine

Listen, I have taken several courses that study how testing such as IQ and other similar intelligence testing is done. This is not simply "book smarts".. Its PROCESSING. Thats where the "time" factors into the testing.. It tests how quickly and accurately a person can breakdown information, something a QB must do on the field under heavy duress..

SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 06:10 PM
And on the field he did process that info just fine

So why worry about how he processes off the field

Maybe he is a stupid guy, that doesnt make him a stupid player at all

making a quick read is nothing like picking which month comes 6th in the year

How is it not? Its the same principle. And the speed of the game in college is DRASTICALLY different than in the NFL.. When the speed increases, his ability to process that information must also increase.. This test seriously sheds doubt on whether he will be able to do that with the same success on the NFL level.

Alex44
02-25-2006, 06:13 PM
Listen, I have taken several courses that study how testing such as IQ and other similar intelligence testing is done. This is not simply "book smarts".. Its PROCESSING. Thats where the "time" factors into the testing.. It tests how quickly and accurately a person can breakdown information, something a QB must do on the field under heavy duress..

So my IQ is 134 in a timed test but when I played QB I still had a tough time breaking things down on the field, thats why I play reciever instead of QB now


And truthfully from the article I can deduct it has nothing to do with how well you process info

Lets say the question is

What is the 2nd month of the year

A- January
B- February
C- September
D- March

If he truely thinks March is the second month of the year and he anwsers it immediatly, although he is wrong, he still processed the info just fine, but he's dumb

It has no bearing on anything

dolphan117
02-25-2006, 06:15 PM
A league source tells us that there's a rumor making the rounds at the combine that Texas quarterback Vince Young scored a miserably horrible six on the Wonderlic test.

A six! That's bad. It's beyond bad. In fact, it's the lowest score that we can ever remember hearing anyone getting
Guys, this is the definition of as unconfirmed rumor. Someone (off the record) is telling PFT there is a rumor going arond, thats like a double if. I wouldnt get too worked up about this untill its confirmed by someone who has a little more credibility than PFT.

Edit-This just gets less and less credible-

Said the source, who knows a thing or two about evaluating college players:

"I predict he'll fall all the way out of the first round."

SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 06:16 PM
So my IQ is 134 in a timed test but when I played QB I still had a tough time breaking things down on the field, thats why I play reciever instead of QB now


And truthfully from the article I can deduct it has nothing to do with how well you process info

Lets say the question is

What is the 2nd month of the year

A- January
B- February
C- September
D- March

If he truely thinks March is the second month of the year and he anwsers it immediatly, although he is wrong, he still processed the info just fine, but he's dumb

It has no bearing on anything

Quickly and Accurately

And some of that is such basic general knowledge, that if you dont know the months in the year, I dont even see how you could be literate enough to read a playbook much less understand the concepts within it..

Jimmy James
02-25-2006, 06:19 PM
Let's say that PFT is right -- he did score a 6.

You know what I want to know next? I want to know if he tried. If he blew it off and answered "C" straight down the answer sheet, I just know he blew it off because he thought it was dumb to ask a football player to take an intelligence test.

If he tried and got a 6, I'm quite a bit more worried.

Phinanthropist
02-25-2006, 06:20 PM
I definately wouldn't if that test score is true...

This particular test means little to me, I don't care what his score was.

I have been holding out hope for six months that the Dolphins would be in a position to draft VY, if a low wonderlick is what it takes, so be it.

Skeet84
02-25-2006, 06:20 PM
Wow a 6! Thats horrible however Dan Marino did really bad too. It was alittle under 20 like 17 I think. So a bad test has some to do with it, But not all to do with it.

SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 06:23 PM
Let's say that PFT is right -- he did score a 6.

You know what I want to know next? I want to know if he tried. If he blew it off and answered "C" straight down the answer sheet, I just know he blew it off because he thought it was dumb to ask a football player to take an intelligence test.

If he tried and got a 6, I'm quite a bit more worried.

He would be a moron in either scenario.. Why would someone blow off something like that off knowing it would greatly impact their draft position, their reputation, and wallet? Even as a protest to the system, it would be quite a dumb thing to do.

dolphan117
02-25-2006, 06:24 PM
Guys if you read the article the "source" says he is "99% certain" that young got a six, but admits he never actually even saw the scores. This is PFT we are talking about........

Phinanthropist
02-25-2006, 06:27 PM
It tests how quickly and accurately a person can breakdown information, something a QB must do on the field under heavy duress..

Did you watch the end of the National Championship Game?

Generally speaking I would agree with your comments, but not in this case.

I have seen enough and the risk/reward ratio is simply too high.

If he is there at 16 I take him, and it would be the easiest pick of the entire draft.

LIQUID24
02-25-2006, 06:31 PM
Let's say that PFT is right -- he did score a 6.

You know what I want to know next? I want to know if he tried. If he blew it off and answered "C" straight down the answer sheet, I just know he blew it off because he thought it was dumb to ask a football player to take an intelligence test.

If he tried and got a 6, I'm quite a bit more worried.
Both scenarios would bother me.

Pennington's Rocket Arm
02-25-2006, 07:13 PM
it seems alex22 will defend young no matter what.

HysterikiLL
02-25-2006, 07:16 PM
Dan Marino got a 12. These test scores are essential to the future of a QB how?

Philter25
02-25-2006, 07:17 PM
A trained monkey can score a 6...........

Skeet84
02-25-2006, 07:18 PM
it seems alex22 will defend young no matter what.


Well when you believe something you will usally defend your answer. He is a Texas fan so he has seen probably more of Young than any of us so when he has an onpinion of Vince Young its not like he is throwing something out there. he is a Dolphin fan too so why would he have us take Young if it was gunna hurt us? Just cause Vince Young did not do great in the test does not mean he won't be a good football player.

dolfan3431
02-25-2006, 07:20 PM
man dude he should have stayed in college

Skeet84
02-25-2006, 07:20 PM
Dan Marino got a 12. These test scores are essential to the future of a QB how?


Thank you for correcting me. I knew he did really bad

musphinzfan
02-25-2006, 07:21 PM
Heres a sample.... http://espn.go.com/page2/s/closer/020228test.html

I would really have to wonder if anyone cant get better then a 6...This is rediculous....I wouldnt even do the dang thing.

LIQUID24
02-25-2006, 07:22 PM
he has seen probably more of Young than any of us
I highly doubt that.


so when he has an onpinion of Vince Young its not like he is throwing something out there.
Sure seems like it sometimes.

Alex44
02-25-2006, 07:34 PM
Well when you believe something you will usally defend your answer. He is a Texas fan so he has seen probably more of Young than any of us so when he has an onpinion of Vince Young its not like he is throwing something out there. he is a Dolphin fan too so why would he have us take Young if it was gunna hurt us? Just cause Vince Young did not do great in the test does not mean he won't be a good football player.

Exactly I judge more by what happens on the field than what happens off, I said before I didnt think he was the smartest guy in the world, but that test isnt about football or reading a defense, or how big your arm is

Some people just dont have common sense, I actually wouldnt be suprised if instead of anwsering questions he just filled it out so it looked like a big V on the the paper

ryoung8918
02-25-2006, 07:35 PM
Two things:

1. Conisder the source - PFT. Not exactly Chris Mortensen here.

2. If Saban & Mularkey scout and interview him and think he can handle the NFL, I'm going to defer to their judgement.

byroan
02-25-2006, 07:46 PM
Dan Marino got a 12.
Marino got a 16.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wonderlic_Test

EmperorPhin
02-25-2006, 08:12 PM
Well it now appears he will fall to us now that according to PFT he scored a 6 on his wonderlic test.


http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm

Skeet84
02-25-2006, 08:12 PM
Marino got a 16.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wonderlic_Test



Thanks for the info. How do you cheat on the Wonderlic? Akili Smith :sidelol:

rafael
02-25-2006, 08:13 PM
Marino got a 16.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wonderlic_Test

My link says Marino got a 14.

http://www.unc.edu/~mirabile/Wonderlic.htm

SCall13
02-25-2006, 08:13 PM
I doubt he falls that far. If he does, I don't want him. IMO, he won't be a good NFL QB.

tylerdolphin
02-25-2006, 08:15 PM
Im not the hugest Vince fan, but if he scored 0 and fell to us at 16 Id want him

Nick13
02-25-2006, 08:17 PM
interesting. might not say too much about him, some people get test anxiety. he seems more than comfortable on the football field though. i'm sure that any team interested in drafting him will look into his academic records to find if this has been a trend or not.

CubanCulebra
02-25-2006, 08:17 PM
Im not the hugest Vince fan, but if he scored 0 and fell to us at 16 Id want him
Damn skippy.

tylerdolphin
02-25-2006, 08:19 PM
Don't put much stock in the wonderlic test. Dan Marino said he scored under 10 on it. Dan scored 14
Still, I agree with you though. If the guy scored a 0 and fell to us at 16 Id take him

super_slash
02-25-2006, 08:22 PM
it means it would take him longer to learn an offense

it has little to do with making football decisions

which school did Fiedler go to? exactly

Skeet84
02-25-2006, 08:24 PM
I would still take him at 16 also.

fitskin
02-25-2006, 08:30 PM
it means it would take him longer to learn an offense

it has little to do with making football decisions

which school did Fiedler go to? exactly


Good point.

EmperorPhin
02-25-2006, 08:32 PM
I can just see it now. Saban's holding a big meeting and has to stop and yell "Vince!!!!!!! Get that pencil out of your mouth. Erasers are not food!!!!!"

TakeIt2DaHouse
02-25-2006, 08:34 PM
actually dan scored a 16 from what i saw

Ozzy
02-25-2006, 08:35 PM
Dan scored 14
Still, I agree with you though. If the guy scored a 0 and fell to us at 16 Id take him

Actually Dan Marino scored a 16.

Vertical Limit
02-25-2006, 08:36 PM
I can just see it now. Saban's holding a big meeting and has to stop and yell "Vince!!!!!!! Get that pencil out of your mouth. Erasers are not food!!!!!"
lol.. What was Ricky Williams score on the Wonderlic? :P i want to see if this is a Longhorn thing.

Nick13
02-25-2006, 08:38 PM
alright, so he isnt a QB, we still draft him and turn him into a damn good SS. we've already theorized about turning pretty much everyone from Travis Daniels to Gus Frerotte playing safety, so why not Vince?

34isback
02-25-2006, 08:45 PM
he wasnt dumb in that 4th qtr agaist usc

Dolfan2788
02-25-2006, 08:48 PM
I'm not kidding here but he could be a phenomenal blocking TE in the 2 TE set for us......just the guy we need









kidding!

That's ok with me, takes him longer to learn concepts and process the information off the field. On the field he seemed to be able to work out a pro style defense of USC. We should have a QB who can lead the team for 3-4 years after FA, that is more than enough time to teach and get him to learn the Offense in and out.

unifiedtheory
02-25-2006, 08:53 PM
Well it now appears he will fall to us now that according to PFT he scored a 6 on his wonderlic test.


http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm

So...because he is now, officially an idiot we should draft him?

I've said it for months, I don't care if he is there for us at #16....either trade him for picks or take so one else...the guy is going to bust.

Joneal7
02-25-2006, 08:57 PM
if he falls to 16...i would be dissapointed if we didnt target him

unifiedtheory
02-25-2006, 08:57 PM
He does'nt have the arm to be a good NFL quarterback and NOW he has the intelligence of a potted plant...

Great.

I'm laughing at you Alex22...trying to spin this to Vince Young's favour. A running Q.B. with a horrid delivery, who has'nt taken snaps from center, has mediocer accuracy (I don't care about the 75% thing...I've yet to see him fit passes into tight windows) and NOW he is officially an idiot.

I'll be laughing at what ever team drafts him....he will set their franchise back 5 years.

King Felix
02-25-2006, 08:59 PM
He does'nt have the arm to be a good NFL quarterback and NOW he has the intelligence of a potted plant...

Great.

I'm laughing at you Alex22...trying to spin this to Vince Young's favour. A running Q.B. with a horrid delivery, who has'nt taken snaps from center, has mediocer accuracy (I don't care about the 75% thing...I've yet to see him fit passes into tight windows) and NOW he is officially an idiot.

I'll be laughing at what ever team drafts him....he will set their franchise back 5 years.

i agree thats why i hope dolphins dont get him...............but the championship game did he even throw a 15 yard pass???

Dolphin39
02-25-2006, 09:01 PM
There is no way in the world that I would use our pick (#16), on Vince Young.:shakeno:

I don't believe he has what is takes. If he's there at 16, I'd pass and draft someone else at a different position.

Alex44
02-25-2006, 09:03 PM
He does'nt have the arm to be a good NFL quarterback and NOW he has the intelligence of a potted plant...

Great.

I'm laughing at you Alex22...trying to spin this to Vince Young's favour. A running Q.B. with a horrid delivery, who has'nt taken snaps from center, has mediocer accuracy (I don't care about the 75% thing...I've yet to see him fit passes into tight windows) and NOW he is officially an idiot.

I'll be laughing at what ever team drafts him....he will set their franchise back 5 years.

You just made yourself look like a total idiot

He is NOT a running QB he is a QB that can run there is a major difference there buddy, watch all his games and tell me how many of the times he ran were called runs and you will come back suprised by what you saw

Horrid Delivery? I dont care if he throws it underhand as long as he gets the ball there, I dont think ive ever seen a ball get knocked down at the line

Just because he didnt take snaps under center doesnt mean he cant, it just means they were maximizing his ability, the problem with the Shotgun is you cant run well out of it, but Texas could and so they used it, what does it have to be a knock on him?

His Accuracy is fine, and he has a way stronger arm than Leinart does

I'll be laughing and crying at us if we dont draft him and he is there at 16, more like his competitiveness, desire, and talent puts a team ahead 5 years not back

Vertical Limit
02-25-2006, 09:04 PM
He does'nt have the arm to be a good NFL quarterback and NOW he has the intelligence of a potted plant...

Great.

I'm laughing at you Alex22...trying to spin this to Vince Young's favour. A running Q.B. with a horrid delivery, who has'nt taken snaps from center, has mediocer accuracy (I don't care about the 75% thing...I've yet to see him fit passes into tight windows) and NOW he is officially an idiot.

I'll be laughing at what ever team drafts him....he will set their franchise back 5 years.
200% agreed.

Couldn't have said it any better. Rather have Cutler over Vince Young.

I think the QB order will be:

1. Matt Leinart
2. Jay Cutler
3. Vince Young

IAFINFAN
02-25-2006, 09:05 PM
If he falls to 16 we need to take him. I doubt he will fall that far because he is one hell of a talent. I agree that he isn't a world beater at the QB position but if we pick up Brees he wouldn't be required to step in and be the man right away. He would be too good to pass up at 16. He just makes plays happen and would be the playmaker that Saban talks about.

SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 09:07 PM
Saban wants SMART players.. I highly doubt he would want THE most important player on his team to also be the dumbest player on his team..

SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 09:13 PM
If this is true, Vince Young is the next Tee Martin... Only dumber.

King Felix
02-25-2006, 09:16 PM
guys give him a break he is from texas

BigDogsHunt
02-25-2006, 09:20 PM
I actually wouldnt be suprised if instead of anwsering questions he just filled it out so it looked like a big V on the the paper

I bet if he did that he would have scored higher than a 6! :wink:

Skeet84
02-25-2006, 09:24 PM
Wow I can't beleive all this is over Vince Young. Ok So he did poor on the TEST what does that prove ? Nothing. He was in college 3 years and I never heard or anything wrong acadimics wise. The fact he scored a 6 is only a rumor and should only be taken as that. Vince Young has problems like every other QB in this draft. If we did draft Vince at 16 I think he would have to sit, But he could become a very good QB.

Alex44
02-25-2006, 09:29 PM
I bet if he did that he would have scored higher than a 6! :wink:

Maybe but then again like I said it doesnt measure how well you proccess info

Lets say the question is what is 8x4

The anwser is 32 obviously

But lets say your dumb and think it is 31 and you have always thought that

You processed the info just fine, but unfortunatly you are wrong, but the thing is that its testing real world knowlege because of that and not football knowledge

SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 09:31 PM
Wow I can't beleive all this is over Vince Young. Ok So he did poor on the TEST what does that prove ? Nothing. He was in college 3 years and I never heard or anything wrong acadimics wise. The fact he scored a 6 is only a rumor and should only be taken as that. Vince Young has problems like every other QB in this draft. If we did draft Vince at 16 I think he would have to sit, But he could become a very good QB.

IF Vince Young scored a 6 on the Wonderlic, I seriously have to question the academic integrity of Texas Atheletics.. Im sorry, but you should not be able to pass a University Level class if you cant even score above a 6 on the Wonderlic, probably the easiest intelligence test in circulation. Seriously, I could probably find 2nd graders who would score higher than that.

dm416
02-25-2006, 09:32 PM
A year of Saban's tutoring would do him some good.

SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 09:34 PM
Maybe but then again like I said it doesnt measure how well you proccess info

Lets say the question is what is 8x4

The anwser is 32 obviously

But lets say your dumb and think it is 31 and you have always thought that

You processed the info just fine, but unfortunatly you are wrong, but the thing is that its testing real world knowlege because of that and not football knowledge

Bro, stop trying to defend his performance of this test simply because he is Vince Young. Simple multiplication involves a cognitive process just as deciphering a defense does. If you cant even successfully do basic problem solving, solving an NFL defense will certainly be daunting for him..

Just look at the success rates of QBs with low Wonderlic scores.. It is no coincidence that most with scores in the teens or below dont amount to much.. THe only exceptions I have seen are Marino and McNabb.. But none of them scored as low as SIX.. thats frickin unheard of.

nopony
02-25-2006, 09:35 PM
I have been a big Vince Young supporter on here... but, I'm sorry, if he actually scored a six... no way you draft him as a QB.

A six is so incredibly stupid he could barely wash himself.

A six is so stupid I have a real hard time believing this is true. I've heard the man speak... he's not a six.

My guess is one of two things:

1- This report is bull.

2. He can't read. No way is he a natural six, if he did score that, I have to think the man can't read.

Alex44
02-25-2006, 09:38 PM
Bro, stop trying to defend his performance of this test simply because he is Vince Young. Simple multiplication involves a cognitive process just as deciphering a defense does. If you cant even successfully do basic problem solving, solving an NFL defense will certainly be daunting for him..

Just look at the success rates of QBs with low Wonderlic scores.. It is no coincidence that most with scores in the teens or below dont amount to much.. THe only exceptions I have seen are Marino and McNabb.. But none of them scored as low as SIX.. thats frickin unheard of.

I know he has on the field knowledge, so how stupid he is off the field doesnt matter

I heard him sit there and break down USC's defense and what they would have to do against it, Ive heard him interviewed about his childhood, I dont think he is by any means a rocket scientist but I dont think he is an idiot either

Skeet84
02-25-2006, 09:38 PM
IF Vince Young scored a 6 on the Wonderlic, I seriously have to question the academic integrity of Texas Atheletics.. Im sorry, but you should not be able to pass a University Level class if you cant even score above a 6 on the Wonderlic, probably the easiest intelligence test in circulation. Seriously, I could probably find 2nd graders who would score higher than that.

Well Tee Martin scored 11 and I know that TN Vols have a very high academic institution.

Dors156
02-25-2006, 09:45 PM
i would love to take him.i really dont care what he is like off the field as long as hes not like ricky.we alll know what he could do on a football field.that would be amazing if he fell to us

Flying Pencil
02-25-2006, 09:45 PM
Well Tee Martin scored 11 and I know that TN Vols have a very high academic institution.

. . . and excellent tutors.

Alex44
02-25-2006, 09:47 PM
BTW Im looking up other guys scores not all QB's and here is what I found

Frank Gore-RB- Also got a 6 *he has a learning disability im 100% serious on that*

Aaron Rodgers scored a 35 and people are saying he doesnt have what it takes to succeed

Peyton Manning apparantly scored a 16

Ill have more later

nopony
02-25-2006, 09:52 PM
Wow a 6! Thats horrible however Dan Marino did really bad too. It was alittle under 20 like 17 I think. So a bad test has some to do with it, But not all to do with it.

I thinnk Marino got a 12. But there is a big difference between a 6 and a 12. The questions are progressive.

King Felix
02-25-2006, 09:52 PM
BTW Im looking up other guys scores not all QB's and here is what I found

Frank Gore-RB- Also got a 6 *he has a learning disability im 100% serious on that*

Aaron Rodgers scored a 35 and people are saying he doesnt have what it takes to succeed

Peyton Manning apparantly scored a 16

Ill have more later

ppl are saying he doesnt have what it takes to succeed because he doesnt have the talent its not like ppl are saying a 35 u cant succeed because of a 35

BigDogsHunt
02-25-2006, 10:09 PM
I know he has on the field knowledge, so how stupid he is off the field doesnt matter.

I am not ready to say VY couldnt succeed in the NFL as a QB whether he did or didnt actually score a 6. But his ability to comprehend and fully understand things matter on and off the field.

http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/sports/article.adp?id=20040414101609990001

The Wonderlic Personnel Test has 50 questions, which players are given 12 minutes to answer. According to the company that creates these tests, "The WPT is a short form measure of cognitive ability designed for simple administration and interpretation."

The test is designed to measure one's ability to:
· Learn a specific job
· Solve problems
· Understand instructions
· Apply knowledge to new situations
· Benefit from specific job training
· Be satisfied with a particular problem

However, the results of these Wonderlic tests are viewed differently by each team, coach and scout -- if they are viewed at all.

Pro Football Hall of Fame coach and draft wizard Bill Walsh agrees that the Wonderlic is something worth referencing in some instances, but not really the last word regarding a player's intelligence.

"Functional intelligence is the key," Walsh said. "There have been Hall of Fame quarterbacks who would have scored fairly low on these tests. But they were great football players, competitors and decision processors on the field.

Maybe he didnt score a 6, but if he did, just like many other "red flags" its just makes things harder for a professional organization to justify paying alot of money to someone when other players are there with less "known" risk.

King Felix
02-25-2006, 10:12 PM
lol 6/50 i suck at school but i think i could get better than that, of course im not from texas either.

Samphin
02-25-2006, 10:25 PM
Just to put this in perspective. The average for QB's is 24. The average for everyone who takes the test (NFL players or otherwise) is 21. A score of 20 means you have an IQ of 100. A score of 10 is literacy. Vince Young scored a six. Just keep all those other numbers in mind.

ESPN page 2 has a neat sample section of a Wonderlic test. 15 questions in five minutes. I finished in about 4 minutes and got 13 right. I didn't spend the time on the math questions as finishing three additional questions in the time it would take to finish one is silly. So, multiply my score out over to 50 questions:

13 divided by 15 = .866
50 multipled by ..866 = 43.33

Assuming I would have kept my same rate, I would have scored a 43 or 44. I am just some schlub salesman with no college experience. Vince has no excuse if you ask me. Even Nervous people can get 10.

Pennington's Rocket Arm
02-25-2006, 10:26 PM
forget about how this test relates to on-the-field reading of a defense, how bout trying to read an NFL playbook and learn it in a short amount of time? or breaking down film with coaches. something leinart has no problem with.

nopony
02-25-2006, 10:28 PM
Dan Marino was actually a 14, it seems.

A six is just difficult to believe. And it's PFT. I think I'll wait and see.

nopony
02-25-2006, 10:30 PM
Oh, and to put a six in perspective... Jeff George got a 10. He was... not smart.

Michael Vick got a 20.

There was a Bronco that got a 4, a pro-bowler... but he was dsylexic. Maybe Young is dyslexic?

While it's true that football smarts do not equal iq smarts... you have to take it into account... especially that extreme of a score. I wouldn't have really blinked if he got a 12 or 15... but six needs explaining.

nopony
02-25-2006, 10:36 PM
Hahaha. Sorry, got into a discussion with someone in another thread who was saying that Ricky Williams was stupid. Not made stupid decisions, but was just low IQ stupid. I said if anything Ricky was too smart for football, can't get out of his head.

Just dug up that Ricky Williams got a 30.

King Felix
02-25-2006, 10:41 PM
lol.. What was Ricky Williams score on the Wonderlic? :P i want to see if this is a Longhorn thing.

i bet ricky scored good, he is very smart.

HysterikiLL
02-25-2006, 10:42 PM
Quite possibly the funniest arguements over a point I've ever read in a single thread. :lol:

super_slash
02-25-2006, 10:50 PM
I'd much rather have Brodie Croyle

SkapePhin
02-25-2006, 10:51 PM
Hahaha. Sorry, got into a discussion with someone in another thread who was saying that Ricky Williams was stupid. Not made stupid decisions, but was just low IQ stupid. I said if anything Ricky was too smart for football, can't get out of his head.

Just dug up that Ricky Williams got a 30.

Thats pretty good for a football player.. High among RBs as well.

King Felix
02-25-2006, 10:55 PM
I'd much rather have Brodie Croyle

:yeahthat:

unifiedtheory
02-25-2006, 10:56 PM
You just made yourself look like a total idiot

He is NOT a running QB he is a QB that can run there is a major difference there buddy, watch all his games and tell me how many of the times he ran were called runs and you will come back suprised by what you saw

Horrid Delivery? I dont care if he throws it underhand as long as he gets the ball there, I dont think ive ever seen a ball get knocked down at the line

Just because he didnt take snaps under center doesnt mean he cant, it just means they were maximizing his ability, the problem with the Shotgun is you cant run well out of it, but Texas could and so they used it, what does it have to be a knock on him?

His Accuracy is fine, and he has a way stronger arm than Leinart does

I'll be laughing and crying at us if we dont draft him and he is there at 16, more like his competitiveness, desire, and talent puts a team ahead 5 years not back

I don't usually care about a so called "personal attack" but for you...I'll care. Enjoy the points.:wink:

truncatus
02-25-2006, 11:00 PM
Just to put this in perspective. The average for QB's is 24. The average for everyone who takes the test (NFL players or otherwise) is 21. A score of 20 means you have an IQ of 100. A score of 10 is literacy. Vince Young scored a six. Just keep all those other numbers in mind.

ESPN page 2 has a neat sample section of a Wonderlic test. 15 questions in five minutes. I finished in about 4 minutes and got 13 right. I didn't spend the time on the math questions as finishing three additional questions in the time it would take to finish one is silly. So, multiply my score out over to 50 questions:

13 divided by 15 = .866
50 multipled by ..866 = 43.33

Assuming I would have kept my same rate, I would have scored a 43 or 44. I am just some schlub salesman with no college experience. Vince has no escuse if you ask me. Even Nervous people can get 10.


The questions on the Wonderlic get progressively harder.

Alex44
02-25-2006, 11:11 PM
I don't usually care about a so called "personal attack" but for you...I'll care. Enjoy the points.:wink:


That wasnt a personal attack

i said your making yourself LOOK stupid

Not that your stupid because I dont think you are

Taking cheap shots at me for things ive said is just as much of a personal attack but I dont complain about it

Mike13
02-25-2006, 11:13 PM
That is the most overrated part of the combine. if you want to see how smart they are give them the SATs or the ACTs, I think that would be a better measurement of intelligence.

BigDogsHunt
02-25-2006, 11:25 PM
That is the most overrated part of the combine. if you want to see how smart they are give them the SATs or the ACTs, I think that would be a better measurement of intelligence.

But thats just it, the Wonderlic isnt designed to be a pure "intelligence" test, anymore than "literacy" defines "reading comphrension".

Its designed to see if people can apply intelligence to solve problems in the form of questions.

The test is designed to measure one's ability to:
· Learn a specific job
· Solve problems
· Understand instructions
· Apply knowledge to new situations
· Benefit from specific job training
· Be satisfied with a particular problem

I am not defending it as part of NFL on field results, just trying to explain what it is. The Wonderlic Personnel Test is not a neuropsychological instrument per se, but is used to help evaluate vocational abilities and potential for comparison with other neuropsychological tests in making practical prognostic decisions.

CubanCulebra
02-25-2006, 11:34 PM
He does'nt have the arm to be a good NFL quarterback and NOW he has the intelligence of a potted plant...

Great.

I'm laughing at you Alex22...trying to spin this to Vince Young's favour. A running Q.B. with a horrid delivery, who has'nt taken snaps from center, has mediocer accuracy (I don't care about the 75% thing...I've yet to see him fit passes into tight windows) and NOW he is officially an idiot.

I'll be laughing at what ever team drafts him....he will set their franchise back 5 years.
You can laugh all you want but you don't know just like I don't know just like nobody else knows. You can assume all you want but untill those five years pass you haven't the slightest idea. Ryan Leaf was suppose to be the second coming and Tom Brady was a 6th round pick.

dolphan117
02-25-2006, 11:40 PM
You DO have to figure in a possible learning dissablity as well. I have a friend who has a near photographic memory but also has a learning dissablity. It dosnt mean your dumb (He is actually a VERY smart guy) just that you only process information in certain ways. Some are visual learners, like my friend who can remeber anything he reads, and some learn by hearing. My friend can recall anything he reads but if you tell him somthing he forgets things at an astonishing rate. The differance is pretty striking actually. Its possible Young has a similar type of issue.

LIQUID24
02-25-2006, 11:44 PM
For the record, I'm not sure if I completely believe it. I mean, it wouldn't shock me if Young scored in the teens, but a 6 is just downright awful.

It would be like Reggie Bush running a 4.8 40.

Motion
02-25-2006, 11:45 PM
This shouldn't surprise anyone thats seen him in an interview.

jlfin
02-25-2006, 11:52 PM
And on the field he did process that info just fine

So why worry about how he processes off the field

Maybe he is a stupid guy, that doesnt make him a stupid player at all

making a quick read is nothing like picking which month comes 6th in the year

How about learning a playbook and then knowing it cold? Some of these playbooks are pretty thick (so is Vince Young, apparently).
Jim Druckenmiller had a great arm, but he was overmatched intellectually in the NFL and his physical ability did him no good.

Alex44
02-25-2006, 11:56 PM
How about learning a playbook and then knowing it cold? Some of these playbooks are pretty thick (so is Vince Young, apparently).
Jim Druckenmiller had a great arm, but he was overmatched intellectually in the NFL and his physical ability did him no good.

Most players problems are they get frustrated easy and thats their phycological block they cant pass, not intelligence

Like I said before Ive heard him break down the USC defense and talk about what they had to do before that game so i know he has FOOTBALL knowledge, some guys dont study to be smart they study football

Itsdahumidity
02-25-2006, 11:58 PM
Not a V. Young fan but feebles is an Ivy Leaguer, how'd that work out for him on the field?

Vertical Limit
02-26-2006, 12:01 AM
i bet ricky scored good, he is very smart.
Yeah, I know he is smart. Earlier I researched it, and found out he scored a 30. So yeah, that's pretty good. :P

dolphinfan2k5
02-26-2006, 12:04 AM
Thats pretty good for a football player.. High among RBs as well.

What's with everyone using the BK guy lately? :(

nopony
02-26-2006, 12:06 AM
Thats pretty good for a football player.. High among RBs as well.

Yeah, it's pretty good period.

The average football player is about a 19. Average person is about 21.

Flyer22
02-26-2006, 12:06 AM
5 Sample questions, from the Wonderlic website http://www.wonderlic.com/Products/sample_tests.asp?prod_id=4
Don't hurt yourselves.

1. When rope is selling at $.10 a foot, how many feet can you buy for sixty cents?


2. Assume the first 2 statements are true. Is the final one:
1 true, 2 false, 3 not certain?
The boy plays baseball.
All baseball players wear hats.
The boy wears a hat.

3. Paper sells for 21 cents per pad. What will 4 pads cost?

4. How many of the five pairs of items listed below are exact duplicates?
Nieman, K.M.
Neiman, K.M.
Thomas, G.K.
Thomas, C.K.
Hoff, J.P.
Hoff, J.P.
Pino, L.R.
Pina, L.R.
Warner, T.S.
Wanner, T.S.

5. RESENT RESERVE — Do these words 1 have similar meanings, 2 have contradictory meanings, 3 mean neither the same nor opposite?

Pennington's Rocket Arm
02-26-2006, 12:06 AM
i can see how he scored a 6 :chuckle:

nopony
02-26-2006, 12:07 AM
This shouldn't surprise anyone thats seen him in an interview.

Yes it should. A six should make him barely able to speak coherently. He speaks reasonably well.

tylerdolphin
02-26-2006, 12:10 AM
5 Sample questions, from the Wonderlic website http://www.wonderlic.com/Products/sample_tests.asp?prod_id=4
Don't hurt yourselves.

1. When rope is selling at $.10 a foot, how many feet can you buy for sixty cents?


2. Assume the first 2 statements are true. Is the final one:
1 true, 2 false, 3 not certain?
The boy plays baseball.
All baseball players wear hats.
The boy wears a hat.

3. Paper sells for 21 cents per pad. What will 4 pads cost?

4. How many of the five pairs of items listed below are exact duplicates?
Nieman, K.M.
Neiman, K.M.
Thomas, G.K.
Thomas, C.K.
Hoff, J.P.
Hoff, J.P.
Pino, L.R.
Pina, L.R.
Warner, T.S.
Wanner, T.S.

5. RESENT RESERVE — Do these words 1 have similar meanings, 2 have contradictory meanings, 3 mean neither the same nor opposite?
Wow...I wish I had gone to Harvard to learn that kind of stuff!

Pennington's Rocket Arm
02-26-2006, 12:12 AM
Yes it should. A six should make him barely able to speak coherently. He speaks reasonably well.
not really.

Alex44
02-26-2006, 12:13 AM
Yes it should. A six should make him barely able to speak coherently. He speaks reasonably well.

:yeahthat:

Its possible he has a learning disorder....or anwserd 6 questions and blew off the rest of the test lol

Frank Gore has a learning disorder and scored a 6 last year

Pennington's Rocket Arm
02-26-2006, 12:15 AM
:yeahthat:

Its possible he has a learning disorder....or anwserd 6 questions and blew off the rest of the test lol

Frank Gore has a learning disorder and scored a 6 last year
i don't think i want a QB with a learning disorder.

daniel3
02-26-2006, 12:17 AM
I scored a 0 on the wonderlic!

Motion
02-26-2006, 12:22 AM
Yes it should. A six should make him barely able to speak coherently. He speaks reasonably well.

Thats debatable

LIQUID24
02-26-2006, 01:07 AM
Update from PFT:


VINCE'S PICK-SIX IS CONFIRMED


We've confirmed that Texas quarterback Vince Young has indeed scored a measly six on the Wonderlic test, administered annually to the potential members of the draft class at the scouting combine.

Said one league insider, "It's also the number of the round he'll be drafted in."

There's a significant buzz in Indy regarding the ridiculously low marks. Though we're not quite sure that there's much of a correlation between book smarts and football ability, we've got a feeling that, of all positions, quarterback is the one that requires at least some basic cognitive ability.

Unless, of course, the offense consists of making one read and then pulling the ball down and running -- which is the very approach the team that drafts Young might have to employ.

Though the suggestion that Young will last until round six is an exaggeration, the thinking is that he lost millions of dollars via his poor performance on the test, and that it's now a virtual certainty that Vanderbilt quarterback Jay Cutler will pass him in round one.

Not good for ol' Vince. I'm curious to see how the other QB's did.

Phishstix
02-26-2006, 01:28 AM
Thats debatable

he talks like a texan. that ain't so bad. then again, our president talks like a texan, too ;)

Phishstix
02-26-2006, 01:36 AM
Vince has no escuse if you ask me. Even Nervous people can get 10.

how about a learning disability or something of that matter? not saying he has one; he might just be a card carrying dumbarse, but that is a possibility.

King Felix
02-26-2006, 01:46 AM
how about a learning disability or something of that matter? not saying he has one; he might just be a card carrying dumbarse, but that is a possibility.

who wants a qb with a learning disordeR?

Jnaledu3
02-26-2006, 01:46 AM
Update from PFT:



Not good for ol' Vince. I'm curious to see how the other QB's did.

Thats the thing that makes me go hmm..

How come Vince Youngs scores are available, yet no other scores from anyone else have been made available yet?

Last year I dont think everybodys wonderlic scores came out until at least one week after the combine.

djfresh47
02-26-2006, 01:47 AM
Didn't Fitzpatrick get a perfect score last year? Did it help his draft status alot? If Young is available at 16, I think Saban should take him if Brees or Culpepper are not brought in.

SkapePhin
02-26-2006, 01:51 AM
Thats the thing that makes me go hmm..

How come Vince Youngs scores are available, yet no other scores from anyone else have been made available yet?

Last year I dont think everybodys wonderlic scores came out until at least one week after the combine.

Probably because Vince's was so shockingly low that people just couldnt keep their mouth shut and yapped about it to everyone..

http://www.finheaven.com/clear.gif

Anyway, Stupid is as Stupid does.

LIQUID24
02-26-2006, 01:54 AM
Nice. :lol: That pic will be everywhere in a matter of days.

Phishstix
02-26-2006, 01:55 AM
who wants a qb with a learning disordeR?

as long as he gets us in the endzone, who cares?

King Felix
02-26-2006, 01:56 AM
Didn't Fitzpatrick get a perfect score last year? Did it help his draft status alot? If Young is available at 16, I think Saban should take him if Brees or Culpepper are not brought in.

he prolly did get a perfect score he went to harvard.

Coral Reefer
02-26-2006, 02:00 AM
Did you watch the end of the National Championship Game?

Generally speaking I would agree with your comments, but not in this case.

I have seen enough and the risk/reward ratio is simply too high.

If he is there at 16 I take him, and it would be the easiest pick of the entire draft.

on the flip side I think he's a reach at #16.
I'd be highly dissapointed and it has nothing at all to do with whatever he scored on his test.

Young won't be able to take over games with his running skills like he could in college. NFL is way too fast. At some point the man is going to have to learn to read defenses, stay in the pocket and make quick and correct decisions on throws. I haven't seen him do this in college.

He dinks and dunks, roll out plays with options to run or pass to underneath targets. NFL defenses will take this away from him and make him actually play QB. He won't be able to handle it IMO.

He may, but the negatives of his game make taking V. Young at 16 a bad risk.
Hopefully, we'll sign Brees and not even have to worry about this.

On another note, if the score is true, it's pretty damn amusing.

King Felix
02-26-2006, 02:05 AM
Say No To Vince

nopony
02-26-2006, 02:21 AM
Young won't be able to take over games with his running skills like he could in college. NFL is way too fast. At some point the man is going to have to learn to read defenses, stay in the pocket and make quick and correct decisions on throws. I haven't seen him do this in college.

Then you didn't watch him. At all.


He dinks and dunks, roll out plays with options to run or pass to underneath targets. NFL defenses will take this away from him and make him actually play QB. He won't be able to handle it IMO.

Where does this nonsense come from? He was the highest rated PASSER in college football. He had a phenomenal YPA so it wasn't "dinks and dunks". He made all the throws and he made them to where defenders weren't... reading defenses well. He performed better as a PASSER than either Cutler or Leinart.

Man, people love to hate Vince Young.

Coral Reefer
02-26-2006, 02:33 AM
Then you didn't watch him. At all.



Where does this nonsense come from? He was the highest rated PASSER in college football. He had a phenomenal YPA so it wasn't "dinks and dunks". He made all the throws and he made them to where defenders weren't... reading defenses well. He performed better as a PASSER than either Cutler or Leinart. .



I have watched him plenty.
I don't agree with anyting you said especially that Young performed better as a passer, so were at a stand still.


Man, people love to hate Vince Young.

Man, people love to worship Vince Young....

it can go both ways.

Personally, I don't hate Vince Young.
I just think that he isn't a 1st round value.

As a player, on a scale of 1-10, I'd give him........... hmm, for some reason a big fat 6 keeps coming to mind! :D

Pennington's Rocket Arm
02-26-2006, 02:38 AM
as long as he gets us in the endzone, who cares?
well there's no indication that young would be able to do so in the NFL, especially if he's as dumb as indicated.

Samphin
02-26-2006, 02:55 AM
The questions on the Wonderlic get progressively harder.


Still, a six? My thirteen year old sister can do better than that.

Samphin
02-26-2006, 02:57 AM
how about a learning disability or something of that matter? not saying he has one; he might just be a card carrying dumbarse, but that is a possibility.


Eh, I have heard this before an dhow people have masked it throughout college and whatnot. I just don't know. I mean, how did he get through school without anyone ever noticing it? Unless all assignments were done for him or weren't even assigned ( a likely possibility on both ends ), I don't see how someone gets that far into education without someone testing for it.

Personally, if this is true, I think he probably didn't study for it and didn't take it seriously. A six is horrid.

nopony
02-26-2006, 03:05 AM
I have watched him plenty.
I don't agree with anyting you said especially that Young performed better as a passer, so were at a stand still.

Not really a standstill. You made comments that are provably untrue.

King Felix
02-26-2006, 03:06 AM
Then you didn't watch him. At all.



Where does this nonsense come from? He was the highest rated PASSER in college football. He had a phenomenal YPA so it wasn't "dinks and dunks". He made all the throws and he made them to where defenders weren't... reading defenses well. He performed better as a PASSER than either Cutler or Leinart.

Man, people love to hate Vince Young.

where does ur nonsense come from?? he dinks and dunks to get a high rating he barely throws it past 20 yards

Alex44
02-26-2006, 03:08 AM
where does ur nonsense come from?? he dinks and dunks to get a high rating he barely throws it past 20 yards

wow

In the rose bowl yes Id agree with that

But Deep Post routes were what he threw most of the season, he hardly dinked and dunked at all

nopony
02-26-2006, 03:19 AM
where does ur nonsense come from?? he dinks and dunks to get a high rating he barely throws it past 20 yards

Well, let's see here...

Jay Cutler's yards per attempt was 6.65.

Matt Leinart's YPA was 8.85.

Vince Young's YPA was 9.34.

Who was the dinker and dunker again?

:shakeno:

That is a really sad thing around here. People here something and then they repeat it as if it's gospel, regardless of whether it was true in the first place.

It's the very worst sort of conventional wisdom.

King Felix
02-26-2006, 03:29 AM
JW whered u get those stats at?

Coral Reefer
02-26-2006, 03:29 AM
Well, let's see here...

Jay Cutler's yards per attempt was 6.65.

Matt Leinart's YPA was 8.85.

Vince Young's YPA was 9.34.

Who was the dinker and dunker again?

:shakeno:

That is a really sad thing around here. People here something and then they repeat it as if it's gospel, regardless of whether it was true in the first place.

It's the very worst sort of conventional wisdom.


You can pick and choose any stat you want to prove a point. You can throw an outlet pass to a RB that goes 90 yds. and guess what, you have a YPA of 90 yards, while you throw a pass with 50 yards of air under it and its a YPA of 50.

If you watch Texas' games and see how their coaches managed games for V. Young you'll see his strengths and weaknesses from that alone. Much more than looking at a stat sheet, which I know is your favorite end all argument on any player.

Bottom line is that none of us can prove any one of them a better prospect than the other.

We have our own opinions and only time will tell.
I'm not a parrot.
I didn't hear anything and repeat it as gospel.
I've made my own judgements and I, as in Myself, do not see NFL game in Vince Young as a QB. Not without having to overcome much more obstacles than other prospects will have to overcome. I.E. Leinart and Cutler.

nopony
02-26-2006, 03:32 AM
JW whered u get those stats at?

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/player/stats?playerId=135107

That's Vince.

Here's Leinart:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/player/profile?playerId=120511

And Cutler:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/player/profile?playerId=115374



I know there are a lot of legitimate concerns people have over Young's transition to the NFL. I have no problem with that.

But saying he was anything but a great passer last year is just not true. He was the one of if not the best in the country.

nopony
02-26-2006, 03:39 AM
You can pick and choose any stat you want to prove a point. You can throw an outlet pass to a RB that goes 90 yds. and guess what, you have a YPA of 90 yards, while you throw a pass with 50 yards of air under it and its a YPA of 50.

:shakeno:

Yeah, all Young's passes were after the catch yards and all everybody else's weren't.

Too bad Cutler's longest pass wasn't even 50 yards... air or not.

I'm not picking and choosing stats, man. He was better overall as a passer last year.

Whether or not he will be a great NFLer is a totally legitmate question, but saying he only dinks and dunks or is a bad passer is just flat wrong.

I think it's time we dispelled that notion from this board.

King Felix
02-26-2006, 03:44 AM
leinarts a better passser period.

Pennington's Rocket Arm
02-26-2006, 03:45 AM
wow

In the rose bowl yes Id agree with that

But Deep Post routes were what he threw most of the season, he hardly dinked and dunked at all
deep post? more like lots of curls and 7-10 yard passes to stationary receivers. the deep passes floated and were more jump balls than anything.

NorFlaFin
02-26-2006, 10:10 AM
How did he pass courses at Texas?

I can't see a potential 1st rd blow off the Wonderlic. too many teams consider the wonderlic a valuable evalution tool.

Motion
02-26-2006, 11:33 AM
Quite possibly the funniest arguements over a point I've ever read in a single thread. :lol:

Ditto :lol:

I personally like all the "I don't care how stupid he is off the field" comments. :shakeno::D

houstonhurrican
02-26-2006, 11:35 AM
Matt Leinart reportedly scored a 35 on the Wonderlic test.
That's a great score. Jay Cutler was supposedly testing in the high 20's before the Combine. Vince Young scored a six. Feb. 26 - 10:15 am et
Source: Nashville Tennessean (http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060226/SPORTS01/602260387/1027)

'Nuff said...

Motion
02-26-2006, 11:36 AM
Matt Leinart reportedly scored a 35 on the Wonderlic test.
That's a great score. Jay Cutler was supposedly testing in the high 20's before the Combine. Vince Young scored a six. Feb. 26 - 10:15 am et
Source: Nashville Tennessean (http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060226/SPORTS01/602260387/1027)

'Nuff said...

Impressive

Pennington's Rocket Arm
02-26-2006, 11:57 AM
Matt Leinart reportedly scored a 35 on the Wonderlic test.
That's a great score. Jay Cutler was supposedly testing in the high 20's before the Combine. Vince Young scored a six. Feb. 26 - 10:15 am et
Source: Nashville Tennessean (http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060226/SPORTS01/602260387/1027)

'Nuff said...
i'm sure it has nothing to do with his incredibly ability to read defenses and make decisions on the fly.

Marino Forever
02-26-2006, 01:01 PM
i'm sure it has nothing to do with his incredibly ability to read defenses and make decisions on the fly.

What I find most disturbing about his 6 is that someone had to be working with him on practicing for the test before he took it in Indy. So I wonder what he would have scored without the extra work?

dolphindude13
02-26-2006, 01:07 PM
Well, let's see here...

Jay Cutler's yards per attempt was 6.65.

Matt Leinart's YPA was 8.85.

Vince Young's YPA was 9.34.

Who was the dinker and dunker again?

:shakeno:

That is a really sad thing around here. People here something and then they repeat it as if it's gospel, regardless of whether it was true in the first place.

It's the very worst sort of conventional wisdom.I guess you don't think the supporting cast on the team around a QB makes any difference either? Vandy's 1st wide reciever couldn't have made USC's or Texas's team! Should Cutler be penalized for that? How about an O-line that might have a tough time competing at the high school level...should that be factored in?
What is sad as you call it, is when you see an opinion different than your own, your the 1st one to jump on and point out the so called innacuracies of that post.
Mark this down and save it or whatever....I guarantee in 5 years Cutler will be a much better QB than Young!

finfan54
02-26-2006, 01:11 PM
http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm

There is no way he goes in the first round with a score like that as a QB.. A 6 on that test is like borderline braindead.



Beautiful! Vince is dropping! Im so excited!:mdfin:

finfan54
02-26-2006, 01:20 PM
Great news. I'll take him at 16 without hesitation.


and at the very worst, some team might want to trade up with us to get him if Saban/Mularky dont like him. but Look out ladies, this is the stuff Dan Marino's are made of. Rumours and takes on stuff that wont mean a damn thing once the helmet goes on. It also may make Young more intense to show what he has now and get competitive. I see some team getting very lucky. I hope its us!

finfan54
02-26-2006, 01:22 PM
I guess you don't think the supporting cast on the team around a QB makes any difference either? Vandy's 1st wide reciever couldn't have made USC's or Texas's team! Should Cutler be penalized for that? How about an O-line that might have a tough time competing at the high school level...should that be factored in?
What is sad as you call it, is when you see an opinion different than your own, your the 1st one to jump on and point out the so called innacuracies of that post.
Mark this down and save it or whatever....I guarantee in 5 years Cutler will be a much better QB than Young!



here we go...........should Gus be penalized for CC dropping balls right in his gut? Now lets hear the spin.........:rolleyes2

les dauphins
02-26-2006, 01:26 PM
Draft threads belong in the draft forum.

that should hurt his draft stock

34isback
02-26-2006, 01:27 PM
lol. yeah right. what fantasy world you in? hell slip to 16? LOL.

SECfootball
02-26-2006, 01:28 PM
lol. yeah right. what fantasy world you in? hell slip to 16? LOL.

Do you know how bad a 6 is?

kpcane
02-26-2006, 01:29 PM
Merge this with the 500 other threads reporting this

34isback
02-26-2006, 01:29 PM
yes but do you know well he played in the 4th qtr against USC?

tylerdolphin
02-26-2006, 01:59 PM
I have to SERIOUSLY question whether or not the guy can learn a NFL playbook. Texas probably had to dumb down their college offence for somebody that incredibly stupid

AZStryker
02-26-2006, 01:59 PM
Not a shock at all. Have you heard him talk??? I bet they even spot you 6 or 7 points for getting your name right.

SeahawkFinFan
02-26-2006, 02:01 PM
...how did he get through school without anyone ever noticing it?


I immagine if you're the super-athlete star QB at UT it wouldn't be a problem - they'd do everything they could to keep you on the field, even if you had the IQ of a brick. So would almost every other big time football school.

flintsilver7
02-26-2006, 02:02 PM
here we go...........should Gus be penalized for CC dropping balls right in his gut? Now lets hear the spin.........:rolleyes2

You calmly say that as if Chambers dropped three balls in the numbers each game. While I don't want to retread this issue, the numbers on dropped pass percentage put Chambers squarely in the middle of the #1 receivers in the league. That said, a quarterback should never be penalized for what wasn't his fault.

I can think of one time off the top of my head that Chambers was hit "right in his gut." I believe it was against New England, where he slid on his knees and had a defender right in front of him. He should've caught it, but it wasn't a good pass.

HelloMotto
02-26-2006, 02:03 PM
Do you know how bad a 6 is?

you could guess and get more than 6 right. that is really bad. That is defensive lineman bad.

HelloMotto
02-26-2006, 02:04 PM
yes but do you know well he played in the 4th qtr against USC?

throw ball........no body is open...........run right.........

Pennington's Rocket Arm
02-26-2006, 02:06 PM
plenty of dumb players have gotten through college. see miami and FSU :chuckle:.

Spegg
02-26-2006, 02:06 PM
Texas probably had to dumb down their college offence for somebody that incredibly stupid

.

HelloMotto
02-26-2006, 02:08 PM
.

Originally Posted by tylerdolphin
Texas probably had to dumb down their college offence for somebody that incredibly stupid



:sidelol:

ok you were asking for it.....

MarxBrothers
02-26-2006, 02:08 PM
Drew Henson got a 42 and you see how that has helped him get on the field and produce. When the game is on the line Young will make a play no one else can make to win a game, good test taker or not, low IQ or high...

BigDogsHunt
02-26-2006, 02:08 PM
NFL Network has not said one single thing about VY and Wonderlic. Has anyone actually heard any Sport TV station mention it (not that it would necessarly mean anything), or is it still only rumor fodder on the web??

flintsilver7
02-26-2006, 02:10 PM
Now, to all those who think a score of 6 is acceptable...Alex22, who holds the title here of "Most Likely to Defend an Indefensible Position," take note.

The Wonderlic IQ test is a 50 question test that is timed out at 12 minutes. Most players don't finish; you get one point for each correct answer. The questions get progressively more difficult as you go along. The average result is supposed to be a 20. The average score for a quarterback is over 20, though I'm not sure how much. I believe it's around 24.

The president of Wonderlic has said that "a score of 10 is literacy - that's about all we can say." Jeff George scored a 10. Dan Marino a 16. Brett Favre, a 22. Tom Brady and Steve Young both scored a 33 (or around there). Akili Smith scored a 37. So, Wonderlic scores don't necessarily translate to success or lack thereof. That said, if Vince Young did score a 6, then he's borderline.....well, "special." It's for this reason I find it hard to believe.

While I think we know Vince Young is capable of playing football, he's apparently not very capable of much else.

DeeAy3000
02-26-2006, 02:11 PM
Drew Henson got a 42 and you see how that has helped him get on the field and produce. When the game is on the line Young will make a play no one else can make to win a game, good test taker or not, low IQ or high...

Thats a good point, I guess you could say theres a certain equilibrium of athleticism and intelligence you have to achieve to be a successful QB in the NFL.

Disgustipate
02-26-2006, 02:11 PM
If he really scored a 6, then that's going to take him off the board as a QB and put him on the board as a WR for alot of teams.

MarxBrothers
02-26-2006, 02:13 PM
Here is a list of QB scores over the past few years...
One that really sticks out to me is Akili Smith getting a 37! And we know how smart his decision making skills were on the field...

http://www.unc.edu/~mirabile/Wonderlic.htm

primetime23
02-26-2006, 02:13 PM
i have no idea how the wonderlic test works. What does a 6 mean Im guessing its really bad but is it like a all time bad? vince young isnt smart, in his college days, he didnt even study his playbook (freshmen) i heared because he didnt want too

Haournyie
02-26-2006, 02:14 PM
If he really scored a 6, then that's going to take him off the board as a QB and put him on the board as a WR for alot of teams.

you are not serious, are you??

finfan54
02-26-2006, 02:15 PM
I wonder........does a wonderlic measure how good of a football player you are?

unifiedtheory
02-26-2006, 02:16 PM
If he really scored a 6, then that's going to take him off the board as a QB and put him on the board as a WR for alot of teams.

I thought that before he proved he has the intelligence of a potted plant.

marino1348
02-26-2006, 02:17 PM
Didnt Marino score like a 14 on the test? He was an absolutely terrible QB. At least Vince Young doesn't do coccaine.

BigDogsHunt
02-26-2006, 02:18 PM
I wonder........does a wonderlic measure how good of a football player you are?

Indirectly it may have bearing...I am not ready to say VY couldnt succeed in the NFL as a QB whether he did or didnt actually score a 6. But his ability to comprehend and fully understand things matter on and off the field.

http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/sports/ar...14101609990001 (http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/sports/article.adp?id=20040414101609990001)

The Wonderlic Personnel Test has 50 questions, which players are given 12 minutes to answer. According to the company that creates these tests, "The WPT is a short form measure of cognitive ability designed for simple administration and interpretation."

The test is designed to measure one's ability to:
· Learn a specific job
· Solve problems
· Understand instructions
· Apply knowledge to new situations
· Benefit from specific job training
· Be satisfied with a particular problem

However, the results of these Wonderlic tests are viewed differently by each team, coach and scout -- if they are viewed at all.

Pro Football Hall of Fame coach and draft wizard Bill Walsh agrees that the Wonderlic is something worth referencing in some instances, but not really the last word regarding a player's intelligence.

"Functional intelligence is the key," Walsh said. "There have been Hall of Fame quarterbacks who would have scored fairly low on these tests. But they were great football players, competitors and decision processors on the field.

Maybe he didnt score a 6, but if he did, just like many other "red flags" its just makes things harder for a professional organization to justify paying alot of money to someone when other players are there with less "known" risk.

springsfinfan
02-26-2006, 02:19 PM
Where can you find results from this year's tests?

HelloMotto
02-26-2006, 02:19 PM
i have no idea how the wonderlic test works. What does a 6 mean Im guessing its really bad but is it like a all time bad? vince young isnt smart, in his college days, he didnt even study his playbook (freshmen) i heared because he didnt want too

the only guy on that previously supplied wonderlic test result link, that scored in the single digits was Davenport, Oscar. who is oscar?......exactly!!!!...this is really going to hurt vince....I think he may slip to the 2nd round.

Sethworld
02-26-2006, 02:25 PM
Looks like the scores don't mean too much.

Brees, Drew - 28
Feeley, A.J. - 19
Lemon, Cleo - 18
Culpepper, Daunte - 18, 21, 15
Marino, Dan - 14

So is anyone going to say Brees is twice as good as Marino?

Pennington's Rocket Arm
02-26-2006, 02:26 PM
I wonder........does a wonderlic measure how good of a football player you are?
good point. move young to receiver.

houstonhurrican
02-26-2006, 02:29 PM
I have absolutely no idea how this test relates to a qb's skill sets and ultimate success. However, I would have to think that if the other guys scored that much higher than Young, that only hurts his positioning. That being said, I would think he is still a top five to seven pick.

unifiedtheory
02-26-2006, 02:29 PM
Looks like the scores don't mean too much.

Brees, Drew - 28
Feeley, A.J. - 19
Lemon, Cleo - 18
Culpepper, Daunte - 18, 21, 15
Marino, Dan - 14

So is anyone going to say Brees is twice as good as Marino?
No one is saying that.

What people are saying is, if a guy who has to be a quick learner and a good student (to learn a complicated offense) and be able to think on his feet has the intelligence of a soap dish, it could be an issue.

B-LO, BABY
02-26-2006, 02:31 PM
Didnt Marino score like a 14 on the test? He was an absolutely terrible QB. At least Vince Young doesn't do coccaine.
A score of 14 and 6 are really different. Fourteen means you can read. Six means that you're capable enough to clean toliets without drowning.

primetime23
02-26-2006, 02:31 PM
he scored a 6, thats an all time low so i dont think you can ignore that

GRAPEAPE
02-26-2006, 02:34 PM
A score of 14 and 6 are really different. Fourteen means you can read. Six means that you're capable enough to clean toliets without drowning.:sidelol:

Alex44
02-26-2006, 02:35 PM
No one is saying that.

What people are saying is, if a guy who has to be a quick learner and a good student (to learn a complicated offense) and be able to think on his feet has the intelligence of a soap dish, it could be an issue.

Yet Marino who scored lower took less time to adjust to the pro game than Brees did

The test shouldnt even be used it has nothing to do with football knowledge

nopony
02-26-2006, 02:37 PM
I guess you don't think the supporting cast on the team around a QB makes any difference either? Vandy's 1st wide reciever couldn't have made USC's or Texas's team! Should Cutler be penalized for that? How about an O-line that might have a tough time competing at the high school level...should that be factored in?
What is sad as you call it, is when you see an opinion different than your own, your the 1st one to jump on and point out the so called innacuracies of that post.
Mark this down and save it or whatever....I guarantee in 5 years Cutler will be a much better QB than Young!

Well, clearly you are a Cutler fanatic, so I guess I understand the misplaced outrage.

I wasn't insulting Cutler. I was simply saying that the "bad passer" insults being lobbed at Young are inaccurate.

I did that by comparing him to two GOOD passers, see there?

So calm down, no one is insulting your guy.

And by the way, where was I inaccurate? Did I post the wrong numbers? No...

anthony!
02-26-2006, 02:37 PM
Yet Marino who scored lower took less time to adjust to the pro game than Brees did

The test shouldnt even be used it has nothing to do with football knowledge
Terrible comparison. There was only one Dan Marino, the only person even comparable is Peyton Manning, no one played like him. The have been many Drew Brees', he is just a good player, Marino was a great.

Dan Marino's come once in a lifetime, Drew Brees' pop up all over the place.

BigDogsHunt
02-26-2006, 02:38 PM
Six means that you're capable enough to clean toliets without drowning.

Keep getting the picture of Peter Griffin (Family Guy) with water wings on drowning in his bowl of soup.

"Lois, the water wings didnt even work"

finfan54
02-26-2006, 02:39 PM
Indirectly it may have bearing...I am not ready to say VY couldnt succeed in the NFL as a QB whether he did or didnt actually score a 6. But his ability to comprehend and fully understand things matter on and off the field.

http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/sports/ar...14101609990001 (http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/sports/article.adp?id=20040414101609990001)

The Wonderlic Personnel Test has 50 questions, which players are given 12 minutes to answer. According to the company that creates these tests, "The WPT is a short form measure of cognitive ability designed for simple administration and interpretation."

The test is designed to measure one's ability to:
· Learn a specific job
· Solve problems
· Understand instructions
· Apply knowledge to new situations
· Benefit from specific job training
· Be satisfied with a particular problem

However, the results of these Wonderlic tests are viewed differently by each team, coach and scout -- if they are viewed at all.

Pro Football Hall of Fame coach and draft wizard Bill Walsh agrees that the Wonderlic is something worth referencing in some instances, but not really the last word regarding a player's intelligence.

"Functional intelligence is the key," Walsh said. "There have been Hall of Fame quarterbacks who would have scored fairly low on these tests. But they were great football players, competitors and decision processors on the field.

Maybe he didnt score a 6, but if he did, just like many other "red flags" its just makes things harder for a professional organization to justify paying alot of money to someone when other players are there with less "known" risk.


Great insight. I have heard coaches say not to let the test be the say all. I gotta wonder if he just blew through this thing and didnt care. His speech is lazy. I dont see that as lack of intelligence but rather how cool he is and that is his rep, that he is cool under fire. One thing is for sure, people will start to dig deeper, including Saban cus VY could drop..........right into our laps. Does Mularky want him? oh, the things you could do.

Alex44
02-26-2006, 02:40 PM
Terrible comparison. There was only one Dan Marino, the only person even comparable is Peyton Manning, no one played like him. The have been many Drew Brees', he is just a good player, Marino was a great.

Dan Marino's come once in a lifetime, Drew Brees pop up all over the place.

Physical Talent isnt the point at all here

Its the mental aspect and ability to MENTALLY adjust to the NFL game

Marino Adjusted Mentally far faster than Brees who is seemingly a much smarter person.

The tests dont mean anything

Pennington's Rocket Arm
02-26-2006, 02:44 PM
Great insight. I have heard coaches say not to let the test be the say all. I gotta wonder if he just blew through this thing and didnt care. His speech is lazy. I dont see that as lack of intelligence but rather how cool he is and that is his rep, that he is cool under fire. One thing is for sure, people will start to dig deeper, including Saban cus VY could drop..........right into our laps. Does Mularky want him? oh, the things you could do.
i doubt he's too smart if he just blew through it, risking millions knowing he could drop. and the test isn't hard, why would he blow through it? he's dumb.

anthony!
02-26-2006, 02:45 PM
Physical Talent isnt the point at all here

Its the mental aspect and ability to MENTALLY adjust to the NFL game

Marino Adjusted Mentally far faster than Brees who is seemingly a much smarter person.

The tests dont mean anything

They do. Marino isn't a smart guy, Brees is much more intelligent. But the fact is Marino is one in a million. He was born to play football. He didn't adjust to the game, the game adjusted to him. Are you willing to say Vince Young is even remotely similar to Marino in that aspect? That would be sheer ignorance. Vince Young will have to adapt and go through alot of growing pains... see Mike Vick.

KTOWNFINFAN
02-26-2006, 02:45 PM
If he really scored a 6, then that's going to take him off the board as a QB and put him on the board as a WR for alot of teams.


RIIIIIGGGGHHHHHHTTTTT..........were you the one asking about swicthing Zach to SS??
Young is a QB on 32 team boards. If someone were to even suggest moving him to WR he would just flat refuse to play for them. I don't care if he scored a .o6 on the wonderlic he is not going to be a WR.

KTOWNFINFAN
02-26-2006, 02:50 PM
Terrible comparison. There was only one Dan Marino, the only person even comparable is Peyton Manning, no one played like him. The have been many Drew Brees', he is just a good player, Marino was a great.

Dan Marino's come once in a lifetime, Drew Brees' pop up all over the place.

They do?? If there are Drew Brees type talent hanging around on every street corner why oh why have the fins been able to find one since Dan left. I agree Brees is no Danny,but come on now they don't just grow on trees. Brees is a special player and person.....if ya don't believe me ask him mom.....or his agent.

flintsilver7
02-26-2006, 02:52 PM
Yet Marino who scored lower took less time to adjust to the pro game than Brees did

The test shouldnt even be used it has nothing to do with football knowledge

While there are exceptions - good quarterbacks who score low and bad quarterbacks who score high - the test is used for a reason. 20 is considered low for a quarterback. 14, assuming that's what Marino scored, is below average, and approaches cause for considerable alarm. (I saw a score reported of 16, but I've also seen 14. We'll go with 14 in case.) 6 is a score that even a 4th-grade remedial student would be disappointed with, and for a potential first-round pick you're now adding the risk his signing bonus could be blown immediately on a Ponzi scheme.

Quarterbacks who have had any measure of success with scores below 20 include:

2004: Jim Sorgi, 14
2002: David Garrard, 14
1999: Donovan McNabb, 16,12
1999: Daunte Culpepper, 18,21,15
1999: Aaron Brooks, 17
1995: Steve McNair, 15
1995: Kordell Stewart, 15,12
1987: Vinny Testaverde, 18
1985: Randall Cunningham, 15
1983: Dan Marino, 14

The lowest of these is Kordell Stewart at an average of 13.5. Stewart became known for his bonehead decisions. The next lowest average score is 14, with four guys. Marino, McNabb, Sorgi, and Garrard. One is legendary, one is pretty good, one looks good in limited time on a star-loaded team, and one looks decent.

http://www.unc.edu/~mirabile/Wonderlic.htm

In general, quarterbacks with scores that low seem destined to either never play a down in the NFL or play poorly. It's been mentioned that only Oscar Davenport (who?) scored as low as a 6.

daniel3
02-26-2006, 02:55 PM
They do. Marino isn't a smart guy, Brees is much more intelligent. But the fact is Marino is one in a million. He was born to play football. He didn't adjust to the game, the game adjusted to him. Are you willing to say Vince Young is even remotely similar to Marino in that aspect? That would be sheer ignorance. Vince Young will have to adapt and go through alot of growing pains... see Mike Vick.

Yeah, I bet he was born with a football in his hand too. Man I almost cried laughing at that comment, hehe. Also what growing pains did Vick go through, the guy went deep into the post season in his first year starting.

KTOWNFINFAN
02-26-2006, 02:56 PM
I just had another idea. Caddy was later quoted as saying he purposely didn't do his best at the combine b/c Gruden said it didn't matter, he was gonna draft him no matter what.
So taking that into consideration, could it be possible that Young has a favorite team in the top 15 or so that he has a secret deal with such as caddy had?? This is the only I see possible that a college player could score a 6. Otherwise I see this report as being a mistake.

primetime23
02-26-2006, 02:56 PM
could you guys stop, this is making me sick. Didnt vincent say he was so motivated to win the rose bowl when he didnt win the hiesman. 6 is bad but you know what he could of been nervious it happens, believe it. I was nervious one time when I was with my girlfriends parents and I had a hard time answering things they asked me which were rather simple if I answered them now

DBoston80
02-26-2006, 02:57 PM
[quote=flintsilver7]While there are exceptions - good quarterbacks who score low and bad quarterbacks who score high - the test is used for a reason. 20 is considered low for a quarterback. 14, assuming that's what Marino scored, is below average, and approaches cause for considerable alarm. (I saw a score reported of 16, but I've also seen 14. We'll go with 14 in case.) 6 is a score that even a 4th-grade remedial student would be disappointed with, and for a potential first-round pick you're now adding the risk his signing bonus could be blown immediately on a Ponzi scheme.

Quarterbacks who have had any measure of success with scores below 20 include:

2004: Jim Sorgi, 14
2002: David Garrard, 14
1999: Donovan McNabb, 16,12
1999: Daunte Culpepper, 18,21,15
1999: Aaron Brooks, 17
1995: Steve McNair, 15
1995: Kordell Stewart, 15,12
1987: Vinny Testaverde, 1
1985: Randall Cunningham, 15
1983: Dan Marino, 14

quote]


:sidelol: ..better hope rush limbaugh doesnt get a hold of these #'s!!:sidelol:

Pennington's Rocket Arm
02-26-2006, 02:58 PM
could you guys stop, this is making me sick. Didnt vincent say he was so motivated to win the rose bowl when he didnt win the hiesman. 6 is bad but you know what he could of been nervious it happens, believe it. I was nervious one time when I was with my girlfriends parents and I had a hard time answering things they asked me which were rather simple if I answered them now
isn't the biggest thing people like about him is being calm under pressure like this?

flintsilver7
02-26-2006, 02:59 PM
I just had another idea. Caddy was later quoted as saying he purposely didn't do his best at the combine b/c Gruden said it didn't matter, he was gonna draft him no matter what.
So taking that into consideration, could it be possible that Young has a favorite team in the top 15 or so that he has a secret deal with such as caddy had?? This is the only I see possible that a college player could score a 6. Otherwise I see this report as being a mistake.

It is possible. A 6 is extraordinarily low - to the point where the report is going to be questioned left and right. If it is true, those teams interested in drafting him are going to have an extended interview. You need to have the questions answered - especially those raised about his intelligence and logical thought capability.

If it's true, it isn't the end of the world for Young. He proved a lot on the field and he has the physical talent. The Wonderlic test is another useful tool that teams use to evaluate players. A quarterback can be helped or hurt by their Wonderlic scores, but not created or destroyed.

anthony!
02-26-2006, 02:59 PM
Yeah, I bet he was born with a football in his hand too. Man I almost cried laughing at that comment, hehe. Also what growing pains did Vick go through, the guy went deep into the post season in his first year starting.

So how would you explain Marino's ability? I wouldn't dare explain it as anything other than god-given. The guy was born to be a star, that is how it is. He probably would have been a half of fame pitcher if he had gone to the MLB.

As for Vick, your blind if you don't see his struggles. He didn't go to the playoffs, the Falcons did. Vick is far from a good QB.

PhenomenalPhin
02-26-2006, 03:01 PM
This is hilarious, I can't believe it to be true. I assume he will take the test again and I'm hoping it should rise alot, at least to the teens ( 15, 16 ). A grade of "6" seems to me like he was nervous his first time and was not prepared, thats what happened to me the first time i took the SAT's.

flintsilver7
02-26-2006, 03:02 PM
This is hilarious, I can't believe it to be true. I assume he will take the test again and I'm hoping it should rise alot, at least to the teens ( 15, 16 ). A grade of "6" seems to me like he was nervous his first time and was not prepared, thats what happened to me the first time i took the SAT's.

Akili Smith improved his score 22 points the second time around, from a 15 to a 37. He is still suspected of cheating.

B-LO, BABY
02-26-2006, 03:04 PM
I just had another idea. Caddy was later quoted as saying he purposely didn't do his best at the combine b/c Gruden said it didn't matter, he was gonna draft him no matter what.
So taking that into consideration, could it be possible that Young has a favorite team in the top 15 or so that he has a secret deal with such as caddy had?? This is the only I see possible that a college player could score a 6. Otherwise I see this report as being a mistake.
Dude, he was projected to go in the top three. There is NO way in hell that he would purposely do this poorly on the test. Not only is a score of 6 humiliating (10 means that you are literate), but he would lose MILLIONS of dollars in signing bonus/contract negotiations.

les dauphins
02-26-2006, 03:05 PM
Reggie Mcneal just ran a 4.37 lets maybe draft him

dolfan72734me
02-26-2006, 03:13 PM
So...because he is now, officially an idiot we should draft him?

I've said it for months, I don't care if he is there for us at #16....either trade him for picks or take so one else...the guy is going to bust.
Ditto.
Honestly, I wish we would stick with Gus and develope a young draft pick, whether it be by trading up for Cutler, or drafting someone later. I am just tired of other teams rejects. And if we wanted someone who is an athlete who has to be taught how to a true qb, well darn, lets just teach Ronnie or CC how to throw.

daniel3
02-26-2006, 03:18 PM
So how would you explain Marino's ability? I wouldn't dare explain it as anything other than god-given. The guy was born to be a star, that is how it is. He probably would have been a half of fame pitcher if he had gone to the MLB.

As for Vick, your blind if you don't see his struggles. He didn't go to the playoffs, the Falcons did. Vick is far from a good QB.

Marino worked hard to get where he was, he wasn't just born with nfl knowledge and nor was he born with the brightest of minds either. Young will be fine because he has a similar drive to succeed and will be a great nfl QB.

Oh and on the subject of Vick, the guy had 3000 passing and 800 rushing yards that year. I'm pretty sure he had a HUGE hand in getting them there.

Disgustipate
02-26-2006, 03:20 PM
RIIIIIGGGGHHHHHHTTTTT..........were you the one asking about swicthing Zach to SS??
Young is a QB on 32 team boards. If someone were to even suggest moving him to WR he would just flat refuse to play for them. I don't care if he scored a .o6 on the wonderlic he is not going to be a WR.

Yes, because switching an athletic college QB to WR is TOTALLY unheard of.

Not like Matt Jones. Or Antuan Randle El. Or Hines Ward. Or Eric Crouch. Or etc. and so on.

A 6 on your Wonderlic is borderline ******ed. Statistically, it would be improbable for you to do worst then that randomly picking your answers. Someone who was illiterate could probabaly get a better score then that. I'm almost convinced he had to do that on purpose.

An NFL team is not going to run the same kind of offense Texas did. Do you honestly expect him to be able to learn an NFL offense?

anthony!
02-26-2006, 03:24 PM
Marino worked hard to get where he was, he wasn't just born with nfl knowledge and nor was he born with the brightest of minds either. Young will be fine because he has a similar drive to succeed and will be a great nfl QB.

Oh and on the subject of Vick, the guy had 3000 passing and 800 rushing yards that year. I'm pretty sure he had a HUGE hand in getting them there.

I completely disagree. Young is nowhere near Marino in any sense what-so-ever. Marino did work hard, but he was one of those guys who just had it naturally. See Gretzky, Sanders, etc.


Yes, because switching an athletic college QB to WR is TOTALLY unheard of.

Not like Matt Jones. Or Antuan Randle El. Or Hines Ward. Or Eric Crouch. Or etc. and so on.

A 6 on your Wonderlic is borderline ******ed. Statistically, it would be improbable for you to do worst then that randomly picking your answers. Someone who was illiterate could probabaly get a better score then that. I'm almost convinced he had to do that on purpose.

An NFL team is not going to run the same kind of offense Texas did. Do you honestly expect him to be able to learn an NFL offense?

Agreed.

houstonhurrican
02-26-2006, 03:25 PM
It has been confirmed by the Herald...

YOUNG TESTS POORLY
The stunning news of the day from the combine revolved around Texas quarterback and Rose Bowl hero Vince Young.
Young, who led the Longhorns to the national championship with a great performance against USC, scored only a 6 on the Wonderlich aptitude examination. The 50-question, 12-minute exam has a maximum score of 50 points. Although several players usually score in single-digits each year, it is highly unusual for quarterbacks to score that low.
Several NFL team executives confirmed Young's score, which could hurt his draft status

www.miami.com/mld/miamihe...964940.htm (http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/sports/football/13964940.htm)

footballer
02-26-2006, 03:26 PM
doesnt matter.. he only fakes like he's gonna pass it. He makes one read ( one read??!!) then looks to run.... i think mike vick is capable of making 2 reads before he runs, but it took him 4 years..

Motion
02-26-2006, 03:26 PM
could you guys stop, this is making me sick. Didnt vincent say he was so motivated to win the rose bowl when he didnt win the hiesman. 6 is bad but you know what he could of been nervious it happens, believe it. I was nervious one time when I was with my girlfriends parents and I had a hard time answering things they asked me which were rather simple if I answered them now

So he'd be more nervous taking a written test than playing football in front of millions? :shakeno: You can't be serious. Good comparison with the gf parents thing too. :lol:

LarryFinFan
02-26-2006, 03:29 PM
Do you know how bad a 6 is?


Wow, lower than Vernon Carey's 8...but for a QB ???

Is he purposely trying not to get drafted to the Jests, Tenn, or NO ??

Gonzo
02-26-2006, 03:30 PM
Yes, because switching an athletic college QB to WR is TOTALLY unheard of.

Not like Matt Jones. Or Antuan Randle El. Or Hines Ward. Or Eric Crouch. Or etc. and so on.

A 6 on your Wonderlic is borderline ******ed. Statistically, it would be improbable for you to do worst then that randomly picking your answers. Someone who was illiterate could probabaly get a better score then that. I'm almost convinced he had to do that on purpose.

An NFL team is not going to run the same kind of offense Texas did. Do you honestly expect him to be able to learn an NFL offense?

An offense that they had to shape around him, not to utilize his talents, but because he was not coachable. I hear a lot of people talking about the USC game (not you Disgustipate). Do they honestly believe that crap is going to work in the NFL? One read, not open, run right... It didn't work for Crouch in the NFL (and he was unwilling to adjust to WR, as I think Young will be), and such play is obviously becoming an issue in Atlanta for Vick who I think is a better QB than Young (not saying much). There are simply too many question marks for this guy to go top 5 and this score adds another that pushes him out of the top ten, AT LEAST (though I agree with KB and CK that he goes to the Rams). As long as he doesn't come here, I will be happy.

RalphX19X
02-26-2006, 03:37 PM
Vince Young is a genius!

primetime23
02-26-2006, 03:40 PM
if we pass on young im going to get the same feelin i got when we passed on brees

King Felix
02-26-2006, 03:42 PM
I Pray To God Taht We Pass On Vy

King Felix
02-26-2006, 03:47 PM
modern day einstein

HaRdKoReXXX
02-26-2006, 03:53 PM
Wow a 6! Now I don't feel so bad for Brock Berlin scoring a 13

BTW if you want to check out some of the sample questions for this test you can check out this site from http://espn.go.com/page2/s/closer/020228test.html

Mike13
02-26-2006, 03:56 PM
But thats just it, the Wonderlic isnt designed to be a pure "intelligence" test, anymore than "literacy" defines "reading comphrension".

Its designed to see if people can apply intelligence to solve problems in the form of questions.

The test is designed to measure one's ability to:
· Learn a specific job
· Solve problems
· Understand instructions
· Apply knowledge to new situations
· Benefit from specific job training
· Be satisfied with a particular problem
I am not defending it as part of NFL on field results, just trying to explain what it is. The Wonderlic Personnel Test is not a neuropsychological instrument per se, but is used to help evaluate vocational abilities and potential for comparison with other neuropsychological tests in making practical prognostic decisions.

Ohh I thought it was like an IQ test.

Motion
02-26-2006, 03:56 PM
I Pray To God Taht We Pass On Vy

+1

jaxdolfan
02-26-2006, 03:56 PM
you could guess and get more than 6 right. that is really bad. That is defensive lineman bad.

Byron leftwich is supposedly smart. He can barely talk too.

JeffJewell
02-26-2006, 04:00 PM
Almost off-topic here, but...

I wanted to point out that Dan Marino was, in fact, a physical freak of nature. No one, repeat, no one, has ever had a quicker, more powerful delivery.

Marino's unique arm allowed him to overcome some less than extraordinary aspects of his game. Using Dan's score on the Wonderlic to support a choice for a qb makes about as much sense as suggesting that we should hire a crippled qb because Marino couldn't move for much of his career.

dolfan72734me
02-26-2006, 04:00 PM
So my IQ is 134 in a timed test but when I played QB I still had a tough time breaking things down on the field, thats why I play reciever instead of QB now


And truthfully from the article I can deduct it has nothing to do with how well you process info

Lets say the question is

What is the 2nd month of the year

A- January
B- February
C- September
D- March

If he truely thinks March is the second month of the year and he anwsers it immediatly, although he is wrong, he still processed the info just fine, but he's dumb

It has no bearing on anything
You don't think it will have a bearing when they toss him a playbook as big as a dictionary, and one he has never seen before, and tell him, "Here Vince, learn this"
Your point would be correct if VY was playing back yard football, where you don't have to learn a playbook.

Motion
02-26-2006, 04:02 PM
An offense that they had to shape around him, not to utilize his talents, but because he was not coachable. I hear a lot of people talking about the USC game (not you Disgustipate). Do they honestly believe that crap is going to work in the NFL? One read, not open, run right... It didn't work for Crouch in the NFL (and he was unwilling to adjust to WR, as I think Young will be), and such play is obviously becoming an issue in Atlanta for Vick who I think is a better QB than Young (not saying much). There are simply too many question marks for this guy to go top 5 and this score adds another that pushes him out of the top ten, AT LEAST (though I agree with KB and CK that he goes to the Rams). As long as he doesn't come here, I will be happy.

Very well put.

dolfan72734me
02-26-2006, 04:02 PM
Keep getting the picture of Peter Griffin (Family Guy) with water wings on drowning in his bowl of soup.

"Lois, the water wings didnt even work"
Or when his alpha bit cereal spelled out "ooooooooo", then Brian told him they were cheerios:lol:

primetime23
02-26-2006, 04:05 PM
wtf? why would the RAMS pick young isnt this the same time who has bulgar, martin, fitzpatrick, and isnt this the same time marshal fualk said ''to know are system you got to be extremely smart'' i remeber somone on espn saying thats what faulk said

Motion
02-26-2006, 04:06 PM
I can't believe some of the excuses I've seen in this thread. There comes a point when, even if he is your guy, you have to admit thats just plain bad.

capecoralfinfan
02-26-2006, 04:08 PM
Your post was edited because your last sentence was inappropriate.


You just made yourself look like a total idiot

He is NOT a running QB he is a QB that can run there is a major difference there buddy, watch all his games and tell me how many of the times he ran were called runs and you will come back suprised by what you saw

Horrid Delivery? I dont care if he throws it underhand as long as he gets the ball there, I dont think ive ever seen a ball get knocked down at the line

Just because he didnt take snaps under center doesnt mean he cant, it just means they were maximizing his ability, the problem with the Shotgun is you cant run well out of it, but Texas could and so they used it, what does it have to be a knock on him?

His Accuracy is fine, and he has a way stronger arm than Leinart does

I'll be laughing and crying at us if we dont draft him and he is there at 16, more like his competitiveness, desire, and talent puts a team ahead 5 years not back
alex22 you're 15 years old, you have zero credibility to me based on your natural ignorance. vince young is a moron plain and simple, <removed by mod>

Wareagle phin
02-26-2006, 04:21 PM
He has the tools and talents that can't be measured. I would rather have him than leinhart. But, in actuality the SEC guy Cutler is the best QB .

miamiron
02-26-2006, 05:07 PM
man dude he should have stayed in college

SHOULD HAVE STAYED IN GRADE SCHOOL WITH THAT SCORE!:sidelol:
MiamiRon

miamiron
02-26-2006, 05:36 PM
I'd much rather have Brodie Croyle

I would rather have Forrest Gump!!

MiamiRon

miamiron
02-26-2006, 05:52 PM
What I find most disturbing about his 6 is that someone had to be working with him on practicing for the test before he took it in Indy. So I wonder what he would have scored without the extra work?

At least that extra help got Vince to spell his name right
cha ching "6 points"

I hope Saban has a degree in special education.

MiamiRon

Noodle Arm
02-26-2006, 06:02 PM
Oh man, I can't wait until somebody with photoshop makes a pic of Young sitting in a class with "mentally handicapped" children, or in an elementary class...sitting in a little desk. You know it's going to happen...it's just a matter of time.

SkapePhin
02-26-2006, 06:09 PM
Oh man, I can't wait until somebody with photoshop makes a pic of Young sitting in a class with "mentally handicapped" children, or in an elementary class...sitting in a little desk. You know it's going to happen...it's just a matter of time.

I thought about it, but I didnt want to insult the intelligence of the mentally handicapped kids...

King Felix
02-26-2006, 06:14 PM
I thought about it, but I didnt want to insult the intelligence of the mentally handicapped kids...

:lol:

dolphingator
02-26-2006, 06:27 PM
What all of you young lovers think means nothing.

The FACT is that Nick Saban WILL NOT draft a player who scores so low. He wants smart players.

Last year's draft... Junior Rosegreen, outstanding DB, terrific player, scored 6 on Wonderlic... undrafted FA.

PressCoverage
02-26-2006, 06:28 PM
And on the field he did process that info just fine

So why worry about how he processes off the field

Maybe he is a stupid guy, that doesnt make him a stupid player at all

making a quick read is nothing like picking which month comes 6th in the year

Mmmm... wasn't this the knock on Quincy Carter as well?

King Felix
02-26-2006, 06:32 PM
What all of you young lovers think means nothing.

The FACT is that Nick Saban WILL NOT draft a player who scores so low. He wants smart players.

Last year's draft... Junior Rosegreen, outstanding DB, terrific player, scored 6 on Wonderlic... undrafted FA.

what round was he supposed to go??

Jimi
02-26-2006, 07:02 PM
Your post was edited because your last sentence was inappropriate.


alex22 you're 15 years old, you have zero credibility to me based on your natural ignorance. vince young is a moron plain and simple, <removed by mod>

So his age gives him zero credability to you. I assume that means my oppinion is worthless to you as well? I hate the people on this board who have an obvious lack of respect to youngsters like me. Im young but id be willing to bet i know just as much if not more than you on many subjects including the NFL.

King Felix
02-26-2006, 07:05 PM
So his age gives him zero credability to you. I assume that means my oppinion is worthless to you as well? I hate the people on this board who have an obvious lack of respect to youngsters like me. Im young but id be willing to bet i know just as much if not more than you on many subjects including the NFL.

:yeahthat: im 15 too.

ChambersWI
02-26-2006, 07:14 PM
KFFL is reporting that Young did indeed get a 6, tested again, and got another 6.

Flyer22
02-26-2006, 07:29 PM
http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm
They're now saying that the guy who graded Young's test messed up and that the NFL has re-scored all the tests.

ChambersWI
02-26-2006, 07:37 PM
http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm
They're now saying that the guy who graded Young's test messed up and that the NFL has re-scored all the tests.

and I ask, how to you mess up a scan tron, or a multiple choice test when the answers are right in front of you.

For all we know Vince could have gotten a perfect score, or he could have gotten lower than a 6.

Flyer22
02-26-2006, 07:41 PM
and I ask, how to you mess up a scan tron, or a multiple choice test when the answers are right in front of you.

For all we know Vince could have gotten a perfect score, or he could have gotten lower than a 6.
:confused2 I have no idea. If Young did have a respectable score, though, the NFL Combine is going to look really bad.

daniel3
02-26-2006, 08:06 PM
http://www.nflfans.com/x/showthread.php?t=8971


Texans | Casserly comments about Young's Wonderlic test
Sun, 26 Feb 2006 15:14:44 -0800

Houston Texans general manager Charley Casserly said at the NFL Combine Sunday, Feb. 26, he had heard about Texas QB Vince Young's score on the Wonderlic test. He also said he heard from a good source that the test results were inaccurate. "Yes, I have been told it was inaccurate, by a source good enough for me to stand up here and quote it. Otherwise I wouldn't get up here and just say it," said Casserly. He was asked how the test would impact the Texans opinion of Young and he replied, "Well, I can only speak for the Houston Texans. I can't speak for 31 other teams. I just said how we evaluate it. It doesn't make any difference what the test score is to us. We're going to go through the same evaluation. I could point to players that have high test scores but couldn't necessarily learn football. So you go through that process, and then we'll evaluate that player's ability to learn our system at the end of it."

BigDogsHunt
02-26-2006, 10:40 PM
KFFL is reporting that Young did indeed get a 6, tested again, and got another 6.

How do you score a 6 twice?

Did he answer all the questions the exact same way, but convince himself that it would produce a different score???:sidelol:

finfan54
02-26-2006, 10:58 PM
KFFL is reporting that Young did indeed get a 6, tested again, and got another 6.



Yep, its true....Vince Young just scored another 6! :sidelol: Touchdown!!!!!Vince Young!:sidelol:

truncatus
02-26-2006, 11:03 PM
I'm suprised on his second try he didn't go for 2...