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TexPhinPhan
03-01-2006, 12:11 PM
last night on espn radio. (Another shameless plug for Sirius radio, it is great). Said Cutler did not have a great combine contrary to some reports but that he is the beneficiary of a lot of hype. He did NOT say that Cutler was going to be bad, however.

This is followed up with a Insiders article on espn.com. ANyone an Insider?

Interesting because it is different than what is being said on the internet.

DcRy82
03-01-2006, 12:22 PM
im not sold on cutler completely because i havent really seen him play other than senior bowl week but for kiper to say he didnt have a great combine, i would consider his 4.77 40 and 23 reps on the bench very impressive.. i heard he misfired on a few passes during his workout but i saw how well he threw a few out patterns..hard, on a line, and slightly outside just the way we receivers like em... im not going to argue and say he had a great combine, but i would definately say he had a good one... for the record i am a vince young fan just so no1 thinks i have a bias opinion.

Motion
03-01-2006, 12:25 PM
Maybe not great but definitely good. I'd definitely like to see the article.

Flyer22
03-01-2006, 12:28 PM
Too bad NFL GMs don't think the same way Kiper does. Then we'd have a shot at Cutler.

TexPhinPhan
03-01-2006, 12:36 PM
Here are some of the measurables I found from the combine for QB's.
http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/9269912

What is it about these numbers that have everyone so excited about Cutler? I cant find info about the passing or strenght drills.

TexPhinPhan
03-01-2006, 12:42 PM
Maybe not great but definitely good. I'd definitely like to see the article.


Me too. Kiper clearly put much more stock into the college careers of the top 3 qbs than what has been going on recently.

BTW he was also one of the guys who said that Cutler had an ok Senior bowl (along with PAt Kirwan).

Kiper said he still ranks the qbs 1) Leinert 2) Young 3) Cutler.

Last thing he said (this whole segment started with, what else, the wonderlic)
If Young did score a 6, or 16 for that matter, it would only matter as a tie breaker between to otherwise equal prospects. in his mind, Young is not equal to Leinert and is better than Cutler, so it doesnt matter. He also said that while that is his opinion, it is possible that it could still hurt Young because of the perception it creates.

DcRy82
03-01-2006, 12:42 PM
which one of those drills do you consider overly important or atleast more important than his passing skills that makes you think he's not as good as people say???

DcRy82
03-01-2006, 12:44 PM
you said you couldnt find the part about strength.. he repped 225 23 times

TexPhinPhan
03-01-2006, 12:51 PM
which one of those drills do you consider overly important or atleast more important than his passing skills that makes you think he's not as good as people say???
Dont misunderstand me, I have never seen the guy throw a football during a game, I am no expert. I am more interested in how a player's stock can rise so dramatically after a 4 year college carreer without taking a snap in a real game since.

I only point out the fact that some else in this thread used his 4.77 time and 23 reps as an indicator of a good combine. It seems to me that the 4.77 time was one of the slowest times run by qbs. I could not find info re the other drills.

The more interesting point to me is that Kiper is almost a lone voice in the media world re: Cutler. Everyone else (just google cutler) think that Cutler has made huge strides, is a cant miss prospect etc.

TexPhinPhan
03-01-2006, 12:51 PM
you said you couldnt find the part about strength.. he repped 225 23 times
What did the other qbs do?

Pennington's Rocket Arm
03-01-2006, 12:56 PM
He is fast becoming one of the most overhyped players in this draft. Cutler was OK, but not great, at the Senior Bowl, but he's drawing all these rave reviews at the NFL scouting combine. He hasn't done anything at the combine that has wowed me to move him up in the draft.

Jay Cutler is going to be a top-15 pick, but does not rank as high QBs Matt Leinart or Vince Young.

Cutler hasn't improved his draft position by what he did at the Senior Bowl or combine. He had a good senior season and finished strong. If you like Cutler based on how he finished the season, that's fine, but don't think that he's moved up dramatically based on the Senior Bowl and combine.
He's going to go in the top 15 of the first round and might even go in the top five. But what he's done since the season ended doesn't put him up with Matt Leinart or Vince Young. I still have him in the top 10 of the draft, but you shouldn't think he'll be a top-three pick.

Jnaledu3
03-01-2006, 01:12 PM
I think Cutler is the 'feel good' story of the pre-draft events.

Lets face it. The draft and everything that leads up to it is a spectacle. Its a competition between players to raise their stock and the draft itself is like a Superbowl.

The regular season is over. College football is over. Yet people are still jonesing for their football fix. The draft is the only thing to satisfy that fix.

So here is Jay Cutler. A guy who played for a small school, was underrated and overlooked throughout 90 percent of his career at Vanderbilt. Yet he has been noticed by some scouts who have said that with a good Senior Bowl and Combine could elevate his status greatly. And that is what he is doing. Cutler has participated in just about everything these events have to offer.

What we are really forgetting is that the Draft itself is overrated and overhyped show- and Cutler is the star of the show.

Samphin
03-01-2006, 01:33 PM
My favorite was Mike Mayock. Cutler would miss the target (overthrow usually ) and he would just rave about how the kid could zip it out and if he was oging to miss, he picked the right spot to miss. Then someone else would miss in virtually the same spot and Mayock would say "thats a pick." His mancrush for Cutler was evident.

nopony
03-01-2006, 01:38 PM
The more interesting point to me is that Kiper is almost a lone voice in the media world re: Cutler. Everyone else (just google cutler) think that Cutler has made huge strides, is a cant miss prospect etc.

On the NFL page at CBSsportsline they have a video report by Judge and Prisco.

Clark Judge feels the same way as Kiper does, and the way everybody did about two months ago: Leinart, Young... Cutler.... everybody else. Prisco has them Leinart... Cutler, Young.

I think as everything settles down, Leinart will go back to being the consenus top QB. Young will be interesting given his Wonderlic, but he may make it back up, too.

The Cutler climb is crazy and makes me nervous. What has he done to deserve this sudden climb? Senior bowl practices? Gotta be, because he was AWFUL in the game. He didn't have a bowl game.

nopony
03-01-2006, 01:42 PM
My favorite was Mike Mayock. Cutler would miss the target (overthrow usually ) and he would just rave about how the kid could zip it out and if he was oging to miss, he picked the right spot to miss. Then someone else would miss in virtually the same spot and Mayock would say "thats a pick." His mancrush for Cutler was evident.

Yeah... and before the Senior Bowl everybody was say he was going to dominate it like Rivers did... and when he did his stock was going to go sky high.

Then he was godawful in the senior bowl. And not a man-jack of them ate crow. They just went on about how great he was in practice as if that's what they meant all along.

Motion
03-01-2006, 01:44 PM
What did the other qbs do?

They didn't, QBs usually don't bench. Cutler wanted to do everything.

Motion
03-01-2006, 01:51 PM
Yeah... and before the Senior Bowl everybody was say he was going to dominate it like Rivers did... and when he did his stock was going to go sky high.

Then he was godawful in the senior bowl. And not a man-jack of them ate crow. They just went on about how great he was in practice as if that's what they meant all along.

For the record I've been a huge Cutler supporter and all of my Senior Bowl and Combine comments were IF he had a great showing, he'd make that Rivers like rise. Regardless, I still think he's easily a top 10 pick and still the top Qb IMO.

finfan54
03-01-2006, 01:57 PM
To me, its not that Cutler had a semi-bad Senior bowl, or that he is so hyped up from a combine, but rather what he did at Vandy. What did he do that was so impressive? I mean, you could say solid and has all the tools, but why say he is great? and now his head is all full of himself.

Just wait until the pressure comes from real teams with real defenses, who do you think will shine? Of all three, my money would be on Vince Young, even with a wonderlic of 6!

Motion
03-01-2006, 01:58 PM
To me, its not that Cutler had a semi-bad Senior bowl, or that he is so hyped up from a combine, but rather what he did at Vandy. What did he do that was so impressive? I mean, you could say solid and has all the tools, but why say he is great? and now his head is all full of himself.

Just wait until the pressure comes from real teams with real defenses, who do you think will shine? Of all three, my money would be on Vince Young, even with a wonderlic of 6!

And my money will be on Cutler cause he's seen the best defenses out of the top 3.

nopony
03-01-2006, 01:58 PM
For the record I've been a huge Cutler supporter and all of my Senior Bowl and Combine comments were IF he had a great showing, he'd make that Rivers like rise. Regardless, I still think he's easily a top 10 pick and still the top Qb IMO.

I'm sorry, by everybody I meant the experts and the media. I don't recall people on here doing that. I wasn't calling anybody on here out.

And I am not anti-Cutler... I just think there is a lot to be nervous about. I tend to agree with Clark Judge... you cannot be as comfortable with a guy who went 11-34 as you can with a guy who went 37-2, regardless of their respective teams.

But for the most part I am commenting more on the phenomenum of his rise than I am on him as a QB.

Motion
03-01-2006, 02:02 PM
I'm sorry, by everybody I meant the experts and the media. I don't recall people on here doing that. I wasn't calling anybody on here out.

And I am not anti-Cutler... I just think there is a lot to be nervous about. I tend to agree with Clark Judge... you cannot be as comfortable with a guy who went 11-34 as you can with a guy who went 37-2, regardless of their respective teams.

But for the most part I am commenting more on the phenomenum of his rise than I am on him as a QB.

Its cool. I can understand that.

finfan54
03-01-2006, 02:02 PM
And my money will be on Cutler cause he's seen the best defenses out of the top 3.

But Vince Young proved more under much more pressure and is a leader. People read wonderlic and then everyone loses themselves in the hype. Cutler will go to a crappy team, that crappy team will be playing a rookie. that rookie will have growing pains, anyway you slice it. My money would be on Vince, especially if he drops. Rothlisbeger went to Pittsburgh, who has a very good coach even though they sucked that year prior. I weigh everything, the whole enchilada, the big picture. I see alot of people losing the big picture.

Pennington's Rocket Arm
03-01-2006, 02:05 PM
But Vince Young proved more under much more pressure and is a leader.
100% false. he didn't face near the pressure cutler faced.

Motion
03-01-2006, 02:11 PM
But Vince Young proved more under much more pressure and is a leader. People read wonderlic and then everyone loses themselves in the hype. Cutler will go to a crappy team, that crappy team will be playing a rookie. that rookie will have growing pains, anyway you slice it. My money would be on Vince, especially if he drops. Rothlisbeger went to Pittsburgh, who has a very good coach even though they sucked that year prior. I weigh everything, the whole enchilada, the big picture. I see alot of people losing the big picture.

Don't even bring the wonderlic into this, you and I both know I've been anti-Young far longer than that incident. Cutler is every bit the leader and faced far more on-field pressure than Young ever has. I see the big picture just fine.

nopony
03-01-2006, 02:22 PM
100% false. he didn't face near the pressure cutler faced.

Well, I guess it depends on how you define pressure.

To me, pressure is not playing loose on a team that nobody expects to win anyway... that is a no lose, pressure-less situation to me. So they go 11-34, it's Vanderbilt, who cares. No one is going to blame Cutler.

Now being the guy your team relies on to win the NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP from behind with seconds left... that's pressure.

I think most linguists would agree that that is a more appropriate description of "pressure".

I'm waiting to see what this wonderlic stuff is all about before I make my final judgement on you.

But to say it's 100% false that Young faced more pressure than Cutler is ridiculous.

Pennington's Rocket Arm
03-01-2006, 02:35 PM
i'm talking about actual defensive pressure.

nopony
03-01-2006, 02:41 PM
i'm talking about actual defensive pressure.

Ah, ok. I don't think finfan was, so that's where i got confused. Carry on.

primetime23
03-01-2006, 02:49 PM
cutler cant compare to vince

Motion
03-01-2006, 03:07 PM
cutler cant compare to vince

Thats your opinion.

flintsilver7
03-01-2006, 05:48 PM
It would really blow my mind if Mel Kiper suddenly said that Jay Cutler was all hype.

It would blow my mind even more if Mel Kiper acknowledged that he singlehandedly made Jay Cutler such a prospect.

LIQUID24
03-01-2006, 05:52 PM
It would really blow my mind if Mel Kiper suddenly said that Jay Cutler was all hype.

It would blow my mind even more if Mel Kiper acknowledged that he singlehandedly made Jay Cutler such a prospect.
Mike Mayock was hyping Cutler WAY before Kiper.

flintsilver7
03-01-2006, 05:58 PM
Mike Mayock was hyping Cutler WAY before Kiper.

This is true. However, an analyst on NFL Network isn't going to have nearly as much effect as Mel Kiper, who becomes ubiquitous (and very annoying) just before draft time. Kiper himself was the one who pushed Cutler forward after his Senior Bowl game - which apparently Kiper didn't watch. Cutler didn't do well. Yet he improved his stock so much. How?

Rixon
03-01-2006, 06:02 PM
lets hope his stock continues to fall
although it probably wont fall down to 16.

finfan54
03-01-2006, 11:25 PM
100% false. he didn't face near the pressure cutler faced.



wow! unbelievable. Im not just talking about big games, but being behind USC in the biggest game of all. You my friend are smoking some good stuff.

Motion
03-01-2006, 11:31 PM
wow! unbelievable. Im not just talking about big games, but being behind USC in the biggest game of all. You my friend are smoking some good stuff.

Selective reading at its best. If you'd read further you'd see that she thought you were refering to defensive pressure.

finfan54
03-01-2006, 11:33 PM
Don't even bring the wonderlic into this, you and I both know I've been anti-Young far longer than that incident. Cutler is every bit the leader and faced far more on-field pressure than Young ever has. I see the big picture just fine.


sorry, you see hype. You see a guy who has all the tools. But when we see him on a stage with everyone watching, he doesnt do all that well. Can Cutler be a good QB? Sure, I dont doubt that. What I doubt is that he is so good like everyone says AT THIS STAGE!

He never had the pressure of a big game. Name me one big game where Vanderbilt was expected to win? You cant. There is no pressure on you when your the underdog. Any fool knows this.

Motion
03-01-2006, 11:35 PM
sorry, you see hype. You see a guy who has all the tools. But when we see him on a stage with everyone watching, he doesnt do all that well. Can Cutler be a good QB? Sure, I dont doubt that. What I doubt is that he is so good like everyone says AT THIS STAGE!

He never had the pressure of a big game. Name me one big game where Vanderbilt was expected to win? You cant. There is no pressure on you when your the underdog. Any fool knows this.

You like that word, huh?

finfan54
03-01-2006, 11:36 PM
Selective reading at its best. If you'd read further you'd see that she thought you were refering to defensive pressure.


whats the diff? Look You guys say POTATO and I say Potatoe. Ill just put my money on Young to once again wow the crowd while great expectations blows another one because he was supposed to be this, but you got that.

Pennington's Rocket Arm
03-02-2006, 12:51 AM
This is true. However, an analyst on NFL Network isn't going to have nearly as much effect as Mel Kiper, who becomes ubiquitous (and very annoying) just before draft time. Kiper himself was the one who pushed Cutler forward after his Senior Bowl game - which apparently Kiper didn't watch. Cutler didn't do well. Yet he improved his stock so much. How?
actually kiper said he was disappointed in cutler. the only one on ESPN that was saying cutler was great was chris mortensen. kiper always had him #3 behind leinart and young. kiper surprisingly has been pretty consistent.

Crowder52
03-02-2006, 02:31 AM
This is true. However, an analyst on NFL Network isn't going to have nearly as much effect as Mel Kiper, who becomes ubiquitous (and very annoying) just before draft time. Kiper himself was the one who pushed Cutler forward after his Senior Bowl game - which apparently Kiper didn't watch. Cutler didn't do well. Yet he improved his stock so much. How?

It turns out that scouts pay way more attention to the practices and drills during the week prior to the Senior Bowl than they do to the game itself. 11 offensive players from different teams who have been together for only a week...makes things really shaky on the offensive side of the ball.

Danny
03-02-2006, 03:10 AM
I can't believe that so much time is spend and so many threads have been started about 3 players that we're not gonna get....I don't think this has ever happen on this board before.....I know we need a QB but we have a better chance at getting Brees than getting any of the top 3 QB's in the draft.

Ozzy rules!!

ronrevog
03-02-2006, 03:37 AM
Cutler is Kyle Boller at best. He will probably end up more like Leaf tho... The kid's a hot head...

Flyer22
03-02-2006, 07:44 AM
Cutler is Kyle Boller at best. He will probably end up more like Leaf tho... The kid's a hot head...
How so?

Pennington's Rocket Arm
03-02-2006, 11:25 AM
Cutler is Kyle Boller at best. He will probably end up more like Leaf tho... The kid's a hot head...
so is roethlisberger. and so was marino. favre was called a hothead his first season in atlanta.

Phishstix
03-02-2006, 12:07 PM
cutler is the beneficiary of playing the highest profile position in all of sports, so of course he going to be overhyped and overvalued. he is not the prospect that brick, m. williams, and aj hawk are, odds are that he'll go before all of them just b/c he is a qb. imo leinart is the only legit qb worthy of top 3 consideration in this draft. young is top 10 and cutler is prob. mid to late 1st, but b/c they are qbs, and qbs generate excitement, ratings, arses in seats, etc., they'll go higher than they should.

finfan54
03-02-2006, 01:52 PM
I can't believe that so much time is spend and so many threads have been started about 3 players that we're not gonna get....I don't think this has ever happen on this board before.....I know we need a QB but we have a better chance at getting Brees than getting any of the top 3 QB's in the draft.

Ozzy rules!!

This is true, but vince could fall. I think we end up with Croyle.

DaBills4life
03-03-2006, 07:16 AM
Im telling you guys, he reminds me of JP Losman without the athletic ability. Kiper was higher on Losman also. Kiper felt Losman would have been the #1 pick last year. But anyways, all the same things are being said about Cutler that were said about Losman, except Losman was "Cocky".

All the Bret Favre comparison's. Losman even went to visit Favre because of all the comparisons. "He had no OL in college", Same quote on Losman. "He has amazing zip on the ball", same as Losman.

Jay Cutler's final 2 years total, 31 TD's and 14 ints. Losman's final 2 years, 60 td's total and 24 int's. Both played for bad teams. JP did lead Tulane to a Bowl game in his junior year though. JP also had a winning record.

The hype on Cutler is just that, Hype. Im going to jump for joy if the Jets pick him.

I dont have much faith in JP, and I wouldnt have much faith in Cutler.

finfan54
03-03-2006, 09:02 AM
Im telling you guys, he reminds me of JP Losman without the athletic ability. Kiper was higher on Losman also. Kiper felt Losman would have been the #1 pick last year. But anyways, all the same things are being said about Cutler that were said about Losman, except Losman was "Cocky".

All the Bret Favre comparison's. Losman even went to visit Favre because of all the comparisons. "He had no OL in college", Same quote on Losman. "He has amazing zip on the ball", same as Losman.

Jay Cutler's final 2 years total, 31 TD's and 14 ints. Losman's final 2 years, 60 td's total and 24 int's. Both played for bad teams. JP did lead Tulane to a Bowl game in his junior year though. JP also had a winning record.

The hype on Cutler is just that, Hype. Im going to jump for joy if the Jets pick him.

I dont have much faith in JP, and I wouldnt have much faith in Cutler.


Cutler is cocky too. He is already a champion and is a newlywed to Mike Mayock. dude is going all the way!

DaBills4life
03-03-2006, 09:06 AM
Cutler is cocky too. He is already a champion and is a newlywed to Mike Mayock. dude is going all the way!

JP had a cockiness that drove people away I guess. Mayock liked JP, just said he didnt know if his personality would work in the NFL.

IMO, the 3rd best QB is Omar Jacobs, but he doesnt have the "typical" throwing motion.

I dont understand why people really care how someone gets the ball there as long as it gets there.

Pennington's Rocket Arm
03-03-2006, 10:17 AM
because there's a difference between "getting the ball there" in college than in the NFL.

DaBills4life
03-03-2006, 10:39 AM
because there's a difference between "getting the ball there" in college than in the NFL.

But Jacons has a better than average arm and a fairly quick release. He just seems to push the ball at a lower point, but at 6'4 he shouldnt have a problem.

He has pin point accuracy. Plus, Mac QB's have been pretty good recently.

dm416
03-03-2006, 03:59 PM
Kiper is a huge hypocrite

daniel3
03-03-2006, 08:57 PM
because there's a difference between "getting the ball there" in college than in the NFL.

Tell that to roethlisberger in his rookie year when he went deep into the playoffs.

Pennington's Rocket Arm
03-03-2006, 09:03 PM
Tell that to roethlisberger in his rookie year when he went deep into the playoffs.
roethlisberger didn't have a bad release...

daniel3
03-03-2006, 09:14 PM
roethlisberger didn't have a bad release...

Ben had a release point pretty close to that of Jacobs when he came into the league and whoever said Jacobs release was bad anyway?

Pennington's Rocket Arm
03-03-2006, 09:37 PM
Ben had a release point pretty close to that of Jacobs when he came into the league and whoever said Jacobs release was bad anyway?
what???

merc80
03-04-2006, 12:07 PM
I'm a lifelong Dolphin fan who moved to the Nashville area last year. I watched bits and pieces of most of the Vandy games, and was very impressed with Cutler. First of all, for the most part he was surrounded by Division 1-AA talent. His o-line was absolutely awful. Vandy does not attract top notch prospects to begin with, but his o-line was injury riddled all season long. They frequently went in to games with only 5 or 6 healthy lineman, most of them walk-ons. Playing in the SEC, he was facing quality defenses nearly every week. He took a David Carr-like beating every Saturday. In the games I saw, he would always stand in the pocket and take the hit in order to get a good throw off. He would always bounce right back up from every hit. The only possible negative I see is that he frequently would lock on to one receiver. Many games the stat line would show one guy with 8+ catches (I can't remember the receivers name) and nobody else with more than 3. However, from what I saw, that may have been more because the other receivers were just awful. I'm no NFL gm, but I'd be pretty happy to draft a big, strong, smart, tough qb at #16. I doubt he'll drop down to us though, too many teams need QB's in front of us. Just one fans opinion...

Flyer22
03-04-2006, 12:11 PM
I'm a lifelong Dolphin fan who moved to the Nashville area last year. I watched bits and pieces of most of the Vandy games, and was very impressed with Cutler. First of all, for the most part he was surrounded by Division 1-AA talent. His o-line was absolutely awful. Vandy does not attract top notch prospects to begin with, but his o-line was injury riddled all season long. They frequently went in to games with only 5 or 6 healthy lineman, most of them walk-ons. Playing in the SEC, he was facing quality defenses nearly every week. He took a David Carr-like beating every Saturday. In the games I saw, he would always stand in the pocket and take the hit in order to get a good throw off. He would always bounce right back up from every hit. The only possible negative I see is that he frequently would lock on to one receiver. Many games the stat line would show one guy with 8+ catches (I can't remember the receivers name) and nobody else with more than 3. However, from what I saw, that may have been more because the other receivers were just awful. I'm no NFL gm, but I'd be pretty happy to draft a big, strong, smart, tough qb at #16. I doubt he'll drop down to us though, too many teams need QB's in front of us. Just one fans opinion...
That's a great analysis. Thanks for the write-up!

pigskinguy
03-04-2006, 01:01 PM
Mel Kiper is all hype.....

SackArtist
03-04-2006, 07:10 PM
Some of you guys want to argue that Cutler was playing against tougher defenses, Vince Young didn't face the pressure Cutler did, and that Cutler was on a bad team. These aren't legit arguments as to why Cutler should be drafted ahead of VY.

First of all, you guys can look at defensive rankings all you want, Vince Young had to face what I think was the best defense in Ohio State. OSU is loaded with studs on defense like Hawk, Carpenter, Whitner, Youboty (all projected 1st rounders in the draft) ,etc. Vince Young not only beat OSU, but he did it on the road, in a very tough environment, and came up clutch with a game-winning 24 yard TD pass. The only defense Cutler faced that I would compare to Ohio State is LSU, and Cutler had a horrible game. Vandy lost 34-6 and Cutler's stats were 11 for 33, 0 TDs, and 2 INTs.

If you want to argue that Cutler plays for a bad team, lets compare how he played to a more similarly matched team. On 10/1 Vandy faced Middle Tenn. State, a team that's below average in the Sun-Belt Conference. Cutler threw for 245 yards and threw 1 TD and 1 INT. He had an average game against Middle Tenn. State. BTW, stats aren't all that matters, what matters is winning right? Vandy didn't even win the game :confused: .

Every week VY faced the pressure of staying undefeated in hopes of playing for the National Title, he succeeded every time. Cutler wasn't facing nowhere near the pressure VY was, and didn't win much anyways. Vandy lost 6 of their last 7 games of the regular season. Why are some considering drafting Cutler ahead of VY? HYPE

dolfan3431
03-04-2006, 07:39 PM
dude he is hes not much better than Brodie Croyle, if Croyle didn't have all these injuries i might even take croyle before cutler

Motion
03-05-2006, 01:41 AM
Tell that to roethlisberger in his rookie year when he went deep into the playoffs.

Correction: The Steelers, who run the ball 60+% of the time went deep into the playoffs and lost when the game was in Ben's hands.


Ben had a release point pretty close to that of Jacobs when he came into the league and whoever said Jacobs release was bad anyway?

Pretty much everyone thats seen him play. Although it seems to be improving.

daniel3
03-05-2006, 11:32 AM
Correction: The Steelers, who run the ball 60+% of the time went deep into the playoffs and lost when the game was in Ben's hands.



Pretty much everyone thats seen him play. Although it seems to be improving.
Oh ok, sorry. Silly me thinking Ben had something to do with them getting to the playoffs in the first place. Also its not everyone who thinks that after seeing him play, just you and a number of people like yourself. Most other people are more enamored with his accuracy rather than with trying to dismiss it and complaining about his "mechanics".

Motion
03-05-2006, 11:37 AM
Oh ok, sorry. Silly me thinking Ben had something to do with them getting to the playoffs in the first place. Also its not everyone who thinks that after seeing him play, just you and a number of people like yourself. Most other people are more enamored with his accuracy rather than with trying to dismiss it and complaining about his "mechanics".

Me and people like myself? :rolleyes2 Unreal. Do you follow football? Because its well known that Jacobs has an unorthodox delivery. They've said during his college career, in scouting reports, and at the combine. It is improving and shouldn't be a problem with the right coaching but it is a fact.

daniel3
03-05-2006, 11:52 AM
Me and people like myself? :rolleyes2 Unreal. Do you follow football? Because its well known that Jacobs has an unorthodox delivery. They've said during his college career, in scouting reports, and at the combine. It is improving and shouldn't be a problem with the right coaching but it is a fact.

How do you make the jump from people saying his release is unorthodox to them saying that it is outright bad? How exactly could it be bad when it allows him to be extremely accurate and timely with all his throws? That's why I said "you" say its bad, others simply state that its different from the norm.

Motion
03-05-2006, 11:54 AM
How do you make the jump from people saying his release is unorthodox to them saying that it is outright bad? How exactly could it be bad when it allows him to be extremely accurate and timely with all his throws? That's why I said "you" say its bad, others simply state that its different from the norm.

Find where I said its "bad". I never said that, I said it could use some work.

Some people here are so good at putting words in other peoples' mouths.

daniel3
03-05-2006, 12:00 PM
daniel3 - whoever said Jacobs release was bad anyway?

SpeedRush99 - Pretty much everyone thats seen him play. Although it seems to be improving.

Ok, now what exactly am I supposed to imply you are stating here? You know what, forget it! Next topic!

t2thejz
03-05-2006, 12:01 PM
dude he is hes not much better than Brodie Croyle, if Croyle didn't have all these injuries i might even take croyle before cutler
Even with the injuries, if Brodie had the size of Culter he would be going first round

Motion
03-05-2006, 12:02 PM
Ok, now what exactly am I supposed to imply you are stating here? You know what, forget it! Next topic!

That its an issue. I'm not the one that said it was bad in the first place.

Flyer22
03-05-2006, 03:32 PM
How do you make the jump from people saying his release is unorthodox to them saying that it is outright bad? How exactly could it be bad when it allows him to be extremely accurate and timely with all his throws? That's why I said "you" say its bad, others simply state that its different from the norm.
The unorthodox release is bad because the ball is too low when it leaves the hand. This leads to less velocity and a better chance of a knockdown at the line. It is offset somewhat by Jacob's height, and he seems to be improving. With some coaching he'll have a better release and be evn more accurate and timely with his throws.