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View Full Version : Great Choices at #16



Frank B
03-22-2006, 12:34 PM
Looking at players tha will realisticly be available at #16, I think the pick should come down to 2 players.

1. Winston Justice - Could be the LT we have been looking for since Richmond Webb left town. Yes he played on the right side in college, but most scouts believe LT will be his pro position. Yes, we have addressed the line with the L.J. Shelton signing, and we could have some more potential coming in with the return of Alabi and Tony Pape, but adding Justice would serve to strengthen depth at both Guard and Tackle.

2. Tye Hill - I can't believe how underrated this guy is. With the exception of Ferguson, Hill might have been the best player on the field during practices. In today's NFL with smaller receivers becoming more dominant, size isn't as important as having the skills to shadow receivers off the line. Right now, Jimmy Williams is ranked ahead of Hill in the DB ratings, but I think Hill will turn out to be a better pure corner.

Boomer
03-22-2006, 12:48 PM
Looking at players tha will realisticly be available at #16, I think the pick should come down to 2 players.

1. Winston Justice - Could be the LT we have been looking for since Richmond Webb left town. Yes he played on the right side in college, but most scouts believe LT will be his pro position. Yes, we have addressed the line with the L.J. Shelton signing, and we could have some more potential coming in with the return of Alabi and Tony Pape, but adding Justice would serve to strengthen depth at both Guard and Tackle.

2. Tye Hill - I can't believe how underrated this guy is. With the exception of Ferguson, Hill might have been the best player on the field during practices. In today's NFL with smaller receivers becoming more dominant, size isn't as important as having the skills to shadow receivers off the line. Right now, Jimmy Williams is ranked ahead of Hill in the DB ratings, but I think Hill will turn out to be a better pure corner.

Frank, whilst I agree that these 2 are prime targets, I don't see them as the TWO main targets. First of all, whilst scouts agree Justice could play left tackle, most concede that it would be futile moving him to the left side, essentially getting him to re-learn a new position. Just look at how that affected Kwame Harris. If Justice signs, it's to play RT and it's because of the intimate knowledge that Tim Davis has of him.

I agree with your assessment of Hill to a point. Clealry the best cover guy in the draft and the height issue is well overplayed, but you'll find very few boards where Jimmy Williams is ranked ahead of him. Williams hada mediocre workout at VT, was described as 'emotionally unstable' in his combine interviews and is an NFL FS not a corner.

To fully consider who we'll draft, you have to add in Chad Jackson, a player we were all over at the Combine, Marcus McNeil, another player who we are keen on, Broderick Bunkley, who we love, Manny Lawson, Chad Greenway, Demeco Ryans, Ernie Sims, Antonio Cromartie and Jason Allen.

Geforce
03-22-2006, 12:51 PM
Looking at players tha will realisticly be available at #16, I think the pick should come down to 2 players.

1. Winston Justice - Could be the LT we have been looking for since Richmond Webb left town. Yes he played on the right side in college, but most scouts believe LT will be his pro position. Yes, we have addressed the line with the L.J. Shelton signing, and we could have some more potential coming in with the return of Alabi and Tony Pape, but adding Justice would serve to strengthen depth at both Guard and Tackle.
That is the question? Can Justice move to the left side and be as effective as he was as a RT?


2. Tye Hill - I can't believe how underrated this guy is. With the exception of Ferguson, Hill might have been the best player on the field during practices. In today's NFL with smaller receivers becoming more dominant, size isn't as important as having the skills to shadow receivers off the line. Right now, Jimmy Williams is ranked ahead of Hill in the DB ratings, but I think Hill will turn out to be a better pure corner.
Hill is underrated by no one. Some have their preferences but he is one of the best pure cover corners in the draft.

arsenal
03-22-2006, 12:53 PM
i think justice would be fine on the right side for us... shelton at LT, justice at RT, carey moves to RG... hadnot at center james at LG and we're cooking wth gas...

Geforce
03-22-2006, 12:55 PM
Frank, whilst I agree that these 2 are prime targets, I don't see them as the TWO main targets. First of all, whilst scouts agree Justice could play left tackle, most concede that it would be futile moving him to the left side, essentially getting him to re-learn a new position. Just look at how that affected Kwame Harris. If Justice signs, it's to play RT and it's because of the intimate knowledge that Tim Davis has of him.

I agree with your assessment of Hill to a point. Clealry the best cover guy in the draft and the height issue is well overplayed, but you'll find very few boards where Jimmy Williams is ranked ahead of him. Williams hada mediocre workout at VT, was described as 'emotionally unstable' in his combine interviews and is an NFL FS not a corner.

To fully consider who we'll draft, you have to add in Chad Jackson, a player we were all over at the Combine, Marcus McNeil, another player who we are keen on, Broderick Bunkley, who we love, Manny Lawson, Chad Greenway, Demeco Ryans, Ernie Sims, Antonio Cromartie and Jason Allen.
Those are some excellent names we are interested in. I still have a difficult time believing Bunkley did the short shuttle in 4.16.

Boomer
03-22-2006, 12:55 PM
Justice is a RT.

Motion
03-22-2006, 12:59 PM
Frank, whilst I agree that these 2 are prime targets, I don't see them as the TWO main targets. First of all, whilst scouts agree Justice could play left tackle, most concede that it would be futile moving him to the left side, essentially getting him to re-learn a new position. Just look at how that affected Kwame Harris. If Justice signs, it's to play RT and it's because of the intimate knowledge that Tim Davis has of him.


Justice is a RT.

Couldn't agree more Boom. I've been saying that for a long time now. Quite a few people here think we should draft him and he could easily switch to LT. I believe that its far more difficult to just switch places like that. I don't care if he protected Leinart's blindside or not, its not the same.

arsenal
03-22-2006, 01:00 PM
Justice is a RT.

i know thast what im saying, that we wouldn't need to move him to LT like people have been saying

Frank B
03-22-2006, 01:00 PM
Frank, whilst I agree that these 2 are prime targets, I don't see them as the TWO main targets. First of all, whilst scouts agree Justice could play left tackle, most concede that it would be futile moving him to the left side, essentially getting him to re-learn a new position. Just look at how that affected Kwame Harris. If Justice signs, it's to play RT and it's because of the intimate knowledge that Tim Davis has of him.

I agree with your assessment of Hill to a point. Clealry the best cover guy in the draft and the height issue is well overplayed, but you'll find very few boards where Jimmy Williams is ranked ahead of him. Williams hada mediocre workout at VT, was described as 'emotionally unstable' in his combine interviews and is an NFL FS not a corner.

To fully consider who we'll draft, you have to add in Chad Jackson, a player we were all over at the Combine, Marcus McNeil, another player who we are keen on, Broderick Bunkley, who we love, Manny Lawson, Chad Greenway, Demeco Ryans, Ernie Sims, Antonio Cromartie and Jason Allen.

Boomer,

Thanks for your reply. Your information regarding Williams' workout and interveiws is something I had not seen reported anywhere else.

I still believe Justice could handle the LT spot better than many other prospects in the past few years that were targeted to make the switch. I think guys like Kwame Harris and Wayne Hunter out of Hawaii a few years ago were a bit overrated.

With regards to the other players you named, I would be ecstatic with the addition of Bunkley, Lawson, Greenway at #16, but that spot seems a little too high for the players with question marks, such as Ryans, Sims, Cromartie, and Allen.

One follow up question, do you think Marcus McNeil will play LT or RT in the NFL?

Boomer
03-22-2006, 01:08 PM
Those are some excellent names we are interested in. I still have a difficult time believing Bunkley did the short shuttle in 4.16.

It was aqn outstanding time. But then if you watch him play, you see how explosive he is off the ball and how well he moves laterally. Regardless, that's a great time. To put it in persepctive, that's faster than Chad Greenway, Thomas Howard, Ernie Sims, Daniel Bullocks, Ko Simpson, Charles Gordon, Jonathan Joseph, Richard Marshall, Mark Anderson, Manny Lawson, Daryl Tapp, Mario Williams, Kam Wimberley, etc.

Boomer
03-22-2006, 01:09 PM
i know thast what im saying, that we wouldn't need to move him to LT like people have been saying

I know you were dude. ;)

I also think Winston has the feet to play the left side, but why? We have just inked a solid LT and Justice is a superb RT.

FinzCrazy
03-22-2006, 01:12 PM
How much will McNeils back troubles impact his draft status???

phinfan_1
03-22-2006, 01:13 PM
There's no way we pick Justice with the 16th pick with the intention of him playing RT. You don't use the 16th pick in the 1st round on a RT.
If we pick him it would be with the intention of him playing LT.
I can't say for sure whether he will be able to make the switch but of all the OT's in the draft he has the athleticism part to make the switch.
I just hope we don't pick McNeill.

Boomer
03-22-2006, 01:13 PM
Boomer,

Thanks for your reply. Your information regarding Williams' workout and interveiws is something I had not seen reported anywhere else.

I still believe Justice could handle the LT spot better than many other prospects in the past few years that were targeted to make the switch. I think guys like Kwame Harris and Wayne Hunter out of Hawaii a few years ago were a bit overrated.

With regards to the other players you named, I would be ecstatic with the addition of Bunkley, Lawson, Greenway at #16, but that spot seems a little too high for the players with question marks, such as Ryans, Sims, Cromartie, and Allen.

One follow up question, do you think Marcus McNeil will play LT or RT in the NFL?

No worries Frank. The Williams situation is interesting. I researched quite deeply into his past for a piece for the VIP and found a young man who had matured some and for whom teammates and coaches were proud of because of the way he'd turned his attitude around. But getting lobbed out of the Bowl game, the very bad interviews in Indianapolis and the average workout, including something like a 33 inch vertical and 16 on the bench, really didn't stand out as the sort of workout you'd expect from a Super Blue Chipper.

Ryans has no question marks at all. He has far less than Greenway. Sims.....again, I don't see any question marks. Lawson must have question marks because you're getting him to play a totally new position.

I think Marcus could play either. Personally I'd play him on the right.

Boomer
03-22-2006, 01:15 PM
There's no way we pick Justice with the 16th pick with the intention of him playing RT. You don't use the 16th pick in the 1st round on a RT.
If we pick him it would be with the intention of him playing LT.
I can't say for sure whether he will be able to make the switch but of all the OT's in the draft he has the athleticism part to make the switch.
I just hope we don't pick McNeill.

Let me point you in the direction of a player I like to call Jammal Brown. He is a RT and was the 13th pick of the 2005 draft. Did you not notice that we signed a career left tackle about 10 days ago? If Justice comes to Miami it's as a RT.

FinzCrazy
03-22-2006, 01:16 PM
Lawson must have question marks because you're getting him to play a totally new position.

Didn't Manny start out at OLB before switching to DE?

Boomer
03-22-2006, 01:16 PM
How much will McNeils back troubles impact his draft status???

I'm not sure. I think it will concern some teams a lot and others not so much. It hasn't bothered him for a long time and the Bucs are the team who seem most likely to pull the trigger.

@@@
03-22-2006, 01:17 PM
No worries Frank. The Williams situation is interesting. I researched quite deeply into his past for a piece for the VIP and found a young man who had matured some and for whom teammates and coaches were proud of because of the way he'd turned his attitude around. But getting lobbed out of the Bowl game, the very bad interviews in Indianapolis and the average workout, including something like a 33 inch vertical and 16 on the bench, really didn't stand out as the sort of workout you'd expect from a Super Blue Chipper Boomer i can't believe you mentioned Jimmy Williams without using the "million dollar body....ten cent head" quote, i'm dissapointed :wink:

Boomer
03-22-2006, 01:19 PM
Didn't Manny start out at OLB before switching to DE?

He did, but the switch was midway through 2003, so it's not like he's going to step straight in. Sims and Ryans have far less question marks than him.

Boomer
03-22-2006, 01:19 PM
Boomer i can't believe you mentioned Jimmy Williams without using the "million dollar body....ten cent head" quote, i'm dissapointed :wink:

I was saving it in case someone wanted to argue :D

FinzCrazy
03-22-2006, 01:22 PM
Boomer,
I'd like your opinion on my this thread, if you don't mind.
http://www.finheaven.com/boardvb2/showthread.php?t=132408

phinfan_1
03-22-2006, 01:27 PM
Let me point you in the direction of a player I like to call Jammal Brown. He is a RT and was the 13th pick of the 2005 draft. Did you not notice that we signed a career left tackle about 10 days ago? If Justice comes to Miami it's as a RT.
Thats just it Boomer...In my opinion I just don't think we'll pick Justice to play RT. And we won't pick him to play LT because we just signed a LT. Although I wouldn't mind if we did pick him.

Boomer
03-22-2006, 01:31 PM
Thats just it Boomer...In my opinion I just don't think we'll pick Justice to play RT. And we won't pick him to play LT because we just signed a LT. Although I wouldn't mind if we did pick him.

You said that no-one would use a high pick on a RT, and yet just a year ago, the Saints did and Brown had a very solid year. Your argument holds no water. Miami wants to protect it's franchise passer and open holes for it's franchise tailback. Justice makes huge sense. He won't be signed to man the left side.

DaunteFin
03-22-2006, 01:33 PM
what about chad jackson? (if he is still available) i think he would be the best choice.

Boomer
03-22-2006, 01:37 PM
He's certainly an option.

phinfan_1
03-22-2006, 01:49 PM
You said that no-one would use a high pick on a RT, and yet just a year ago, the Saints did and Brown had a very solid year. Your argument holds no water. Miami wants to protect it's franchise passer and open holes for it's franchise tailback. Justice makes huge sense. He won't be signed to man the left side.
I wasn't argumenting w/you Boomer. Sorry if you felt like I was.
And yeah no one but the Saints.