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Silverphin
04-03-2006, 10:45 PM
Here we go again. My mock draft. And as usual, I'll keep it within our team.

Assumptions: We don't land LaVar Arrington. We

Round 1:

Manny Lawson, Defensive End/Outside Linebacker, North Carolina State - This year's starting Outside Linebacker? Our future Defensive End? Both? Take your pick. Either way, we'll bring youth to an admittedly aging front seven as well as a force comparable to Jason Taylor/Julian Peterson. We'll have three 'tweeners on our D if this pick happens (Remember: Vonnie Holiday plays Defensive End and Defensive Tackle).

Round 2 (Trade):

Daunte Culpepper, Quarterback, University of Central Florida - :wink:

Round 3:

Chris Chester, Center (but can be moved to guard), Oklahoma - Just like everyone, I believe we should go Offensive line in the draft. But in my opinion, we should go center or guard. Drafting this guy would take us to either direction. He's every raw, and he is a project. But after with Hudson Houck did in San Diego with quite a few of the O-linemen being rookies, I believe this guy could excel. He's athletic, can work well in space, is a hard worker and is very smart. While he needs some work, he has a lot of the tools.

Round 4:

Marcus Hudson, Safety/Cornerback, North Caroline State - This pick, just like the aforementioned pick, can take us to either direction. But it depends on whether we need a safety more, or a cornerback. Either way, we get the needed defensive back. He is another 'tweener, just like the aforementioned picks. He'll also need some work, but he can turn into a productive defensive back.

Alternate direction:

Devin Hester, Cornerback? Wide Receiver?..., University of Miami - Uh.... I don't know what to say. He has great hands, he can turn on a dime. He has great speed. And he has actually recorded interceptions in the past. The problem is he has no position specified position. But he is versatile, and has tools to go wither direction. I also like this kid's character; he entered the draft to support his mother (Hurricane Wilma was a *****). He can also relieve Wes Welker on punt returns (but only punt returns. I like Wes on Kick Returns).

Round 5:

Manuel Wright, Defensive Tackle, University of South California - This guy is going to be a monster. While he won't contriubute in the beginning of the year, with the right coaching he can give O-linemen fits. I even expect him to notch a sack. :D

Round 7a:

Thomas Parker, Wide Receiver, Florida Atlantic University - If we're going to pikc through the bottom of the pile, then any college is in the light. And this player will definitely get some consideration. He has height, and he has speed. He's one been FAU's most productive wideouts and has been one of the only brigth spots on an owl team. Plus he has height (6-2).

Round 7b:

Domata Peko, Defensive Tackle, Michigan State - He has room to beef up. He can shed blockers or take on two of them. He can stuff the run. Yup, I smell a nose tackle.

Round 7c:

Eric Bassey, Safety, Oklahoma - This guy has blazing speed. But he only had three career interceptions. However, he does have a lot of upside, and the worst, he can be a special teams ace. Can he excel?

motioncityhifi
04-04-2006, 12:01 AM
chris chester is a 2nd round pick....

Silverphin
04-04-2006, 10:07 PM
chris chester is a 2nd round pick....

He could slip into the third. It may not be TOO likely, but it is not too unlikely either. What do you think about my other picks though?

kpcane
04-04-2006, 10:11 PM
I would absolutely love Devin Hester in the 4th. Even if all he did was return kickoffs and punts for us, he's worth a 4th. He is such a game-changer.

And the funny thing is that Saban is one of the few coaches that could turn this guy into an all-pro at corner as well. He has the physical tools.

motioncityhifi
04-05-2006, 08:42 AM
He could slip into the third. It may not be TOO likely, but it is not too unlikely either. What do you think about my other picks though?

so far everything i have read says no chance chester slips to the third but then again things happen. lawson would be a great pick at 16. third we could go alot of ways but ultimately i think its a lineman. i need to go and read about the rest but seem like solid picks. definitely dont want to see hester here. we dont need to spend a pick on a returner who has no other set position

Boomer
04-05-2006, 09:00 AM
Chester is a 2nd rounder. Slip the Oregon game into the VCR. That'll show you why.

Motion
04-05-2006, 09:18 AM
I agree that Chester is most likely a 2nd rounder. And definitely no thanks on Hester.

Spray Mucus
04-05-2006, 09:57 AM
I agree that Chester is most likely a 2nd rounder. And definitely no thanks on Hester.

as mentioned before. Chester's stock is rising and might even eek his way into the late first round, but he will most likely be a 2nd round pick.

But if he did slip to the third and we drafted him I would be happy!

Pennington's Rocket Arm
04-05-2006, 10:15 AM
I would absolutely love Devin Hester in the 4th. Even if all he did was return kickoffs and punts for us, he's worth a 4th. He is such a game-changer.

And the funny thing is that Saban is one of the few coaches that could turn this guy into an all-pro at corner as well. He has the physical tools.
we have enough returnmen, we don't need to waste a 4th on one considering we have a limited amount of picks.

burger13
04-05-2006, 10:29 AM
Hester was given all the opportunity in world to succeed as a DB and just couldn't. And this is from a program that puts out 1st round DB's all the time, so it's not like he wasn't getting coached up.

He is an electric returner.......but if that's all he's gonna be able to do, I'd pass.

Motion
04-05-2006, 10:41 AM
Hester was given all the opportunity in world to succeed as a DB and just couldn't. And this is from a program that puts out 1st round DB's all the time, so it's not like he wasn't getting coached up.

He is an electric returner.......but if that's all he's gonna be able to do, I'd pass.

I agree

kpcane
04-05-2006, 11:47 AM
And definitely no thanks on Hester.

I was at the last UM-UF game in Miami...I think it was my sophomore year...yeah it was...Brock's first year, and we were down by a boatload to the Gators. If we didn't have Devin Hester we would have lost that game. If a UF fan can't see how valuable Hester is, you're either in denial, or you're dumb.

And for those saying he "couldn't make it" in his first year as a DB, he was going up against experienced seniors for the starting jobs and lost to Maxey and Jennings, who are both likely to be 2nd rounders or better. To say that he was "given all the opportunity in the world" is just ignorant. Watch some football, then if you're willing to make a ridiculous statement like that, we'll agree on how little you know about college football.

kpcane
04-05-2006, 11:49 AM
we have enough returnmen, we don't need to waste a 4th on one considering we have a limited amount of picks.

yeah we also have enough safeties and DB's and linebackers so why take any of those?

You'd be hard-pressed to find a game-changer in the first round. It's not a wasted pick, it's a value pick...a pick that improves the team. Hester is way better than Welker, and it looks like he'd be the return guy. Hester could be a starting CB after one year of coaching by Saban. But this is all pointless, because he'll be gone by the time we pick in the 4th.

Boomer
04-05-2006, 12:14 PM
Fact is Devin Hester couldn't cut it as a cornerback at Miami. He then switched positions and couldn't cut it as a wide receiver. Even with Jennings and Maxey departing, he was told that he probably wouldn't start. So he jumped ship to the draft.

Great return man, hugely overrated player.

Spray Mucus
04-05-2006, 12:27 PM
Fact is Devin Hester couldn't cut it as a cornerback at Miami. He then switched positions and couldn't cut it as a wide receiver. Even with Jennings and Maxey departing, he was told that he probably wouldn't start. So he jumped ship to the draft.

Great return man, hugely overrated player.

so what round do you project Hester going in?

Motion
04-05-2006, 12:35 PM
I was at the last UM-UF game in Miami...I think it was my sophomore year...yeah it was...Brock's first year, and we were down by a boatload to the Gators. If we didn't have Devin Hester we would have lost that game. If a UF fan can't see how valuable Hester is, you're either in denial, or you're dumb.

All I'm saying is for a team that already has two solid return men, spending a 4th round draft pick is foolish. Our 4th rounder last year started most the year at CB, could Hester do that? Not his first year. If anyone could teach him properly it would be Saban, but even he would need some time.

Boone
04-05-2006, 12:37 PM
Manny Lawson would be a reach with the 16th pick...

Boomer
04-05-2006, 12:45 PM
Manny Lawson would be a reach with the 16th pick...

Trust me, he wouldn't be.

Boomer
04-05-2006, 12:47 PM
so what round do you project Hester going in?

Oh I think he'll probably go day 1 because there is - and rightly so - an emphasis on field position and a great return man does so much to change the momentum of a game. Look at the effect that Dante Hall had on the Chiefs.

I'm just not buying that he's this great CB prospect.

Pennington's Rocket Arm
04-05-2006, 01:26 PM
between sims and lawson, who would you take boomer? (for miami)

kpcane
04-05-2006, 01:51 PM
Oh I think he'll probably go day 1 because there is - and rightly so - an emphasis on field position and a great return man does so much to change the momentum of a game. Look at the effect that Dante Hall had on the Chiefs.

I'm just not buying that he's this great CB prospect.

Nobody's saying he's a great CB prospect. I said he's worth it in the 4th based on his return skills alone, and judging by where you think he'll go in the draft, you more than agree with me.

I'm saying it's an added plus that Saban could turn him into a great CB. Not this year, and maybe not next year. But Saban could turn a guy with his speed and agility into an all-pro CB.

kpcane
04-05-2006, 01:55 PM
All I'm saying is for a team that already has two solid return men, spending a 4th round draft pick is foolish. Our 4th rounder last year started most the year at CB, could Hester do that? Not his first year. If anyone could teach him properly it would be Saban, but even he would need some time.

We actually have depth at CB this year, unlike last year. Daniels would not have started if Will Poole stayed healthy. I think there's an outside chance Hester could be our nickel back this year, and very likely he would be the dime back.

Hester isn't a "solid return man". He's a game changer. I would even spend our 3rd on him, but he may even be gone by then. If you've ever heard the phrase "putting the best athletes on the field" you'd know why I was so high on him. With Saban's ability to turn average CB's into good CB's, I'd be very excited to see what he could do with Hester.

kpcane
04-05-2006, 01:56 PM
Trust me, he wouldn't be.

I agree. Lawson is the perfect choice for us.

Silverphin
04-06-2006, 09:18 PM
I agree. Lawson is the perfect choice for us.

I thought so as well. This year, there are plenty of DB's. More than plenty even. What's wrong with selecting a DE/OLB?

Finfan14
04-07-2006, 03:24 PM
Hester is a stud but not very bright.

He can play in Sabans system and succeed at CB.

Dolfan1000
04-07-2006, 05:44 PM
Peko would be an awesome pick in the 7th round.

Boomer
04-07-2006, 06:02 PM
between sims and lawson, who would you take boomer? (for miami)


Probably Lawson. Why? Well, he's ridiculously athletic. He comes out as the number 1 rated LB when you crunch the numbers. He has played 2 years as the Sam. He can rush the passer with his hand on the ground. He can blow past athletic left tackles. At 242, he can bullrush tackles. He moved Marcus McNeil back into the passer at the Senior Bowl practices. He gets decent depth on his drops and he can work down the line against the run.

Nick Saban loves Jason Taylor. Loves him. Loves him on the field and off it. Lawson is a spitting image of a young Taylor. Saban has said that if he'd have drafted JT, he would have made him a Hall of Fame OLB/DE. Just imagine looking at the draft board and seeing a young Taylor out there that you can mold, that you can use all over the field, with the 4.41 speed, like a Merriman or a Ware, a kick block demon (7 at NC State).

And remember, he's going to be much more highly rated in our system and the Jets and New England's and Clevelands and Pitts than in Denvers or Chicago's, etc. The draft board gets stacked to fulfil YOUR needs. Not the needs of all the other teams. That's why Lawson and Kamerion Wimbley rate so highly with us, although Wimbley I think is going to Cleveland at 12.

Boomer
04-07-2006, 06:03 PM
Nobody's saying he's a great CB prospect. I said he's worth it in the 4th based on his return skills alone, and judging by where you think he'll go in the draft, you more than agree with me.

I'm saying it's an added plus that Saban could turn him into a great CB. Not this year, and maybe not next year. But Saban could turn a guy with his speed and agility into an all-pro CB.

You actually have to have the ability to play corner to be turned into an All Pro.

DolfanChris06
04-08-2006, 01:03 AM
boom great work

Silverphin
04-08-2006, 01:16 AM
Probably Lawson. Why? Well, he's ridiculously athletic. He comes out as the number 1 rated LB when you crunch the numbers. He has played 2 years as the Sam. He can rush the passer with his hand on the ground. He can blow past athletic left tackles. At 242, he can bullrush tackles. He moved Marcus McNeil back into the passer at the Senior Bowl practices. He gets decent depth on his drops and he can work down the line against the run.

Nick Saban loves Jason Taylor. Loves him. Loves him on the field and off it. Lawson is a spitting image of a young Taylor. Saban has said that if he'd have drafted JT, he would have made him a Hall of Fame OLB/DE. Just imagine looking at the draft board and seeing a young Taylor out there that you can mold, that you can use all over the field, with the 4.41 speed, like a Merriman or a Ware, a kick block demon (7 at NC State).

And remember, he's going to be much more highly rated in our system and the Jets and New England's and Clevelands and Pitts than in Denvers or Chicago's, etc. The draft board gets stacked to fulfil YOUR needs. Not the needs of all the other teams. That's why Lawson and Kamerion Wimbley rate so highly with us, although Wimbley I think is going to Cleveland at 12.

Well said.

Motion
04-08-2006, 06:16 AM
Manny Lawson would be a reach with the 16th pick...

KFFL's mock has him going 12th to Cleveland.

Motion
04-08-2006, 06:17 AM
We actually have depth at CB this year, unlike last year. Daniels would not have started if Will Poole stayed healthy. I think there's an outside chance Hester could be our nickel back this year, and very likely he would be the dime back.

Hester isn't a "solid return man". He's a game changer. I would even spend our 3rd on him, but he may even be gone by then. If you've ever heard the phrase "putting the best athletes on the field" you'd know why I was so high on him. With Saban's ability to turn average CB's into good CB's, I'd be very excited to see what he could do with Hester.

Fair enough. If Nick's down with him, I'm down with him.

kpcane
04-08-2006, 01:13 PM
You actually have to have the ability to play corner to be turned into an All Pro.

Are you even aware that Hester was the #1 CB in the country coming out of high school?
http://scout.scout.com/a.z?s=13&p=9&c=4&yr=2002&pid=30

But I guess he has no ability to play corner because you said so. Thank god you're not a recruiter for the Canes...it was real fun to watch this guy while he was here.

Boomer
04-08-2006, 02:27 PM
Are you even aware that Hester was the #1 CB in the country coming out of high school?
http://scout.scout.com/a.z?s=13&p=9&c=4&yr=2002&pid=30

But I guess he has no ability to play corner because you said so. Thank god you're not a recruiter for the Canes...it was real fun to watch this guy while he was here.

Yes. I was well aware of that. Tragically, the history of college football is littered with players who were superstars at the HS level and didn't make it.

Lets take Tom Lemming, the best high school recruiting expert in the nations 2003 list of top HS seniors.

Reggie Bush was 4, Cromartie was 7, Ernie Sims was 16, Brady Quinn 17, 24 was JaMarcus Russell, Donte Whitner was 32, Chad Jackson 37, Vernon Davis 38, Dee Webb 42, LenDale White 53, Alley Broussard 57, Mario Williams 71.

Number one was Chris Leak. You think that rating bears out when you look at Leak's career? Number 2 was Demetrius Summers who was kicked of the South Carolina team. 10th ranked super blue chip LT Ofa Mohetau went to BYU, played G, failed academically, has now finally latched on with Texas Tech. Wesley Jefferson, the 11th rated player? 27th rated linebacker on Mel Kiper's list of sophomore (and redshirt sophomore linebackers). This is a guy rated ahead of Ernie Sims.

Robert Lane, 14th rated overall, 3rd rated QB, rathed higher than probable 2007 number 1 pick overall Brady Quinn? Now a TE at Ole Miss.

It means NOTHING.

You are reviewing Hester as a Miami fan. I am looking at him as a draft pick. 1 pick and 11 tackles last year? Come on. He has no technique, he's raw, he's not physical, he's a side shuffler, he lacks instincts, etc. Great athlete, great returner, but he's proved he's positionless.

He WAS great fun to watch..................on special teams. Dynamic return guy. But little value as anything else as we stand.

DallasDolfan
04-08-2006, 02:36 PM
I am all for picking a player from FAU...I went there!

TractorTraylor
04-08-2006, 03:49 PM
Boomer, what are your thoughts on Peko, IMO he could be a steal with one of our late picks..

and another thing, why is it that Wimbley is shooting up the boards so quickly, it seems like he jumped from a 2-3 rounder to an early 3rd. explain.

Pennington's Rocket Arm
04-08-2006, 04:00 PM
Are you even aware that Hester was the #1 CB in the country coming out of high school?
http://scout.scout.com/a.z?s=13&p=9&c=4&yr=2002&pid=30

But I guess he has no ability to play corner because you said so. Thank god you're not a recruiter for the Canes...it was real fun to watch this guy while he was here.
you're waaaay too biased to even form a coherent thought when it comes to miami players. you must think the dolphins should give the starting nod this upcoming season to brock berlin because he was the #1 QB coming out of high school, right?

Boomer
04-08-2006, 05:03 PM
Boomer, what are your thoughts on Peko, IMO he could be a steal with one of our late picks..

and another thing, why is it that Wimbley is shooting up the boards so quickly, it seems like he jumped from a 2-3 rounder to an early 3rd. explain.

Peko has the worst hair in the draft, I know that. Guy makes Polamalu's wig look halfway decent. He's probably a 3-4 nose, a back-up, could start in the right system. Was a JUCO transfer, is a great run stuffer, but that's it - he's not going to offer a threat as a pass rusher. But he can eat space and wouldn't surprise me if he ended up as the back-up to Casey Hampton in Pittsburgh.

Kamerion had a great final season at FSU. He's a stunning edge rusher, who will be a 3-4 OLB. He's strong, athletic and did well in LB drills in Mobile. Seems a few teams are very high on him. At the moment, he seems to carry an early to mid 1st round grade for some 3-4 teams.

Silverphin
04-08-2006, 05:21 PM
Hey Boomer. What about Thomas Parker of FAU?

Boomer
04-08-2006, 05:35 PM
I've not seen FAU so it wouldn't be right for me to comment mate.

Sorry.

Silverphin
04-08-2006, 05:44 PM
I've not seen FAU so it wouldn't be right for me to comment mate.

Sorry.

Eh... it was worth a shot asking. No worries.:D

kpcane
04-08-2006, 05:52 PM
Yes. I was well aware of that. Tragically, the history of college football is littered with players who were superstars at the HS level and didn't make it.

Lets take Tom Lemming, the best high school recruiting expert in the nations 2003 list of top HS seniors.

Reggie Bush was 4, Cromartie was 7, Ernie Sims was 16, Brady Quinn 17, 24 was JaMarcus Russell, Donte Whitner was 32, Chad Jackson 37, Vernon Davis 38, Dee Webb 42, LenDale White 53, Alley Broussard 57, Mario Williams 71.

Number one was Chris Leak. You think that rating bears out when you look at Leak's career? Number 2 was Demetrius Summers who was kicked of the South Carolina team. 10th ranked super blue chip LT Ofa Mohetau went to BYU, played G, failed academically, has now finally latched on with Texas Tech. Wesley Jefferson, the 11th rated player? 27th rated linebacker on Mel Kiper's list of sophomore (and redshirt sophomore linebackers). This is a guy rated ahead of Ernie Sims.

Robert Lane, 14th rated overall, 3rd rated QB, rathed higher than probable 2007 number 1 pick overall Brady Quinn? Now a TE at Ole Miss.

It means NOTHING.

You are reviewing Hester as a Miami fan. I am looking at him as a draft pick. 1 pick and 11 tackles last year? Come on. He has no technique, he's raw, he's not physical, he's a side shuffler, he lacks instincts, etc. Great athlete, great returner, but he's proved he's positionless.

He WAS great fun to watch..................on special teams. Dynamic return guy. But little value as anything else as we stand.

What a waste of your time. The point is, it's really ridiculous to say that Hester doesn't have the talent to play CB. I don't care about all those other guys, and I don't care what Hester was rated either, I was just using it to show that I'm not the only one who thinks Hester has some talent. Of course I don't think he's the best corner now, but I'm saying that Saban could do wonders with him. I think he was terribly coached in college, and if given the chance he will show the abilities that made him a blue chip recruit. He didn't play better than Maxey or Jennings, that's why his stats were so poor. At a university like ours, where politics play a huge role and it's more of a "what have you done for me lately" program, it's easy to get swept under the rug and stay there.

If you're looking at him as a draft pick, tell me how you looked at Ronnie Brown. He wasn't a starter at Auburn. He didn't put up the numbers Cedric Benson did. And he "proved" that he couldn't carry the load at Auburn. Sound a little unfair?

kpcane
04-08-2006, 05:56 PM
you're waaaay too biased to even form a coherent thought when it comes to miami players. you must think the dolphins should give the starting nod this upcoming season to brock berlin because he was the #1 QB coming out of high school, right?

Yeah...I'm so biased because I'd spend a 4th round pick on a guy that is going to be picked in the 3rd. Maybe I'm not the one who's biased.

Oh and by the way...you're hilarious :rolleyes2

Boomer
04-08-2006, 06:08 PM
What a waste of your time. The point is, it's really ridiculous to say that Hester doesn't have the talent to play CB. I don't care about all those other guys, and I don't care what Hester was rated either, I was just using it to show that I'm not the only one who thinks Hester has some talent. Of course I don't think he's the best corner now, but I'm saying that Saban could do wonders with him. I think he was terribly coached in college, and if given the chance he will show the abilities that made him a blue chip recruit. He didn't play better than Maxey or Jennings, that's why his stats were so poor. At a university like ours, where politics play a huge role and it's more of a "what have you done for me lately" program, it's easy to get swept under the rug and stay there.

If you're looking at him as a draft pick, tell me how you looked at Ronnie Brown. He wasn't a starter at Auburn. He didn't put up the numbers Cedric Benson did. And he "proved" that he couldn't carry the load at Auburn. Sound a little unfair?

Hey buddy, you were the one using the fact that Hester was the '#1 rated corner' as the basis for your argument. Hell you even cut and pasted the link. Just because your argument doesn't stand up, all of a sudden now you don't want to talk about recruiting.

Now all of a sudden it's the fault of Randy Shannon and Tim Walton? As for the swept under the carpet comment.....nonsense. If you're good enough, you start. Larry Coker wants to win Championships. The best players do that. Hester couldn't do that.

The fact remains that Devin Hester was not good enough to play corner. So he switched to WR. He wasn't good enough there either. He is coming off an 11 tackle season. There are much better players out there than Devin Hester to come in at corner. It's just a shame that your rose tinted Hurricane glasses don't see that.

Comparing Brown to Hester is utterly ludicrous. I'm not even going to justify it with an answer because it's so laughable.

kpcane
04-08-2006, 07:07 PM
Comparing Brown to Hester is utterly ludicrous. I'm not even going to justify it with an answer because it's so laughable.

Hey, I thought comparing Hester to Chris Leak was ridiculous, but I gave you the time of day you didn't deserve.

I didn't want to talk recruiting because it wasn't the point of my argument, which you missed twice. You said that he can't play corner, and I'm saying he can, and I'm not the only one who thinks so.

It's so funny to listen to people here. They care more about making jabs at people than making sense. Not once did I say Hester is the best corner out there, and I've said time and again that he wouldn't start his first year, and probably not his second either. But with Saban's help, he could be something. There's no bias, it's just rational thought. He's fast, he's agile, and he's a playmaker. I know he's raw, and I wouldn't be saying we should draft him if Wannstedt was our coach, but with Saban, I think it's a good move for the 4th round...so crucify me.

Motion
04-09-2006, 08:25 AM
Not once did I say Hester is the best corner out there, and I've said time and again that he wouldn't start his first year, and probably not his second either. But with Saban's help, he could be something. There's no bias, it's just rational thought. He's fast, he's agile, and he's a playmaker. I know he's raw, and I wouldn't be saying we should draft him if Wannstedt was our coach, but with Saban, I think it's a good move for the 4th round...so crucify me.

That was the point of my argument against him. Our 4th rounder last year ended up starting at CB most the year. If Hester couldn't even crack the starting line-up til his 3rd year where's the value?

Boomer
04-09-2006, 11:58 AM
Hey, I thought comparing Hester to Chris Leak was ridiculous, but I gave you the time of day you didn't deserve.

I didn't want to talk recruiting because it wasn't the point of my argument, which you missed twice. You said that he can't play corner, and I'm saying he can, and I'm not the only one who thinks so.

It's so funny to listen to people here. They care more about making jabs at people than making sense. Not once did I say Hester is the best corner out there, and I've said time and again that he wouldn't start his first year, and probably not his second either. But with Saban's help, he could be something. There's no bias, it's just rational thought. He's fast, he's agile, and he's a playmaker. I know he's raw, and I wouldn't be saying we should draft him if Wannstedt was our coach, but with Saban, I think it's a good move for the 4th round...so crucify me.


You're the one that started analogising, bringing up the fact that Hester was the #1 rated corner. The fact that your '#1 rated high school corner' thing doesn't stand up, you're now trying to change the emphasis. You said recruiting wasn't the point of your argument, but you bring it up as the lead point in your post.

He can play corner. Just not very well. And there are other people who think he can play corner apart from you...........his mum, his dad and his girlfriend. The people that count - Randy Shannon, Larry Coker - didn't.

The thing is, he won't be there in the 4th round.

kpcane
04-09-2006, 01:09 PM
That was the point of my argument against him. Our 4th rounder last year ended up starting at CB most the year. If Hester couldn't even crack the starting line-up til his 3rd year where's the value?

You're spoiled man. Just because Daniels turned out to be a starter and a great value pick in the 4th, doesn't mean that every 4th rounder we get from now on is going to be able to start right away. Besides, if we get an OLB in the first, we won't have that many other needs to fill...although our o-line could always use some improvement.
There would be no immediate value with Hester, except for kick and punt returns. But if he's a starting CB for us in 3 years, that's great value for the 4th. Don't judge every 4th round pick off the Travis Daniels pick. Who knows if he's even going to start this year, now that Will Poole is back and we signed Will Allen?

kpcane
04-09-2006, 01:13 PM
You're the one that started analogising, bringing up the fact that Hester was the #1 rated corner. The fact that your '#1 rated high school corner' thing doesn't stand up, you're now trying to change the emphasis. You said recruiting wasn't the point of your argument, but you bring it up as the lead point in your post.

He can play corner. Just not very well. And there are other people who think he can play corner apart from you...........his mum, his dad and his girlfriend. The people that count - Randy Shannon, Larry Coker - didn't.

The thing is, he won't be there in the 4th round.

We're just arguing about nonsense right now, and we're not going to change each other's mind.

But know that I know how you feel about Hester would you take him in the 4th round if he was there? Or what about the 3rd? As I just said in my previous post, I don't think we have too many holes to fill, but we also don't have too many draft picks. I would definitely spend a 4th on him, and I'd think long and hard about taking him in the 3rd. Wes isn't half the return man Hester is.

Boomer
04-09-2006, 01:41 PM
No I wouldn't. He's a stunning return man, but when it comes to talent in the secondary we need to be looking at a number 1 corner and a #1 safety, a Polamalu, a Taylor, a Minter, etc.

kpcane
04-09-2006, 02:43 PM
No I wouldn't. He's a stunning return man, but when it comes to talent in the secondary we need to be looking at a number 1 corner and a #1 safety, a Polamalu, a Taylor, a Minter, etc.

And that type of talent is available in the 4th?

Boomer
04-09-2006, 04:10 PM
And that type of talent is available in the 4th?

As I keep saying, he won't make the 4th. And to my mind, he simply doesn't have the ability to be a #1 CB in the NFL. There are TOO many questions.

kpcane
04-09-2006, 04:54 PM
As I keep saying, he won't make the 4th. And to my mind, he simply doesn't have the ability to be a #1 CB in the NFL. There are TOO many questions.

Take a look through this thread and see who first said, and has continued to say he won't make it to the 4th. That's not the question. I asked if you would take him in the 4th, and you responded by saying we need a Sean Taylor or a Troy Polamalu. I asked you if you think that type of talent (Taylor, Polamalu) is available in the 4th round, and you respond by regurgitating what I've already said about Hester not making it to the 4th.
I've said time and again that I'd draft him for his return skills alone, but the fact that Saban is our coach, he could actually become a solid corner too. I don't know how you achieved "draft guru" status at finheaven. Your posts to me are all over the place and don't even make sense.

Boomer
04-09-2006, 05:53 PM
Take a look through this thread and see who first said, and has continued to say he won't make it to the 4th. That's not the question. I asked if you would take him in the 4th, and you responded by saying we need a Sean Taylor or a Troy Polamalu. I asked you if you think that type of talent (Taylor, Polamalu) is available in the 4th round, and you respond by regurgitating what I've already said about Hester not making it to the 4th.
I've said time and again that I'd draft him for his return skills alone, but the fact that Saban is our coach, he could actually become a solid corner too. I don't know how you achieved "draft guru" status at finheaven. Your posts to me are all over the place and don't even make sense.

You're like the wind.....change in a moments notice. You asked me whether I'd take him in the 4th round. It's a totally redundant question as he won't be there in the 4th round.

If he was there, I might take him. AS A RETURNER. If I'm Nick Saban, I have two young number 2/3 types, one who could become a number one. I don't need another corner with so-so ability who might or night not develop.

As for the draft thing, you should ask around. Just because I don't like your Cane player, you change the emphasis of your story this way and that. It's really rather irritatating after a while.

kpcane
04-09-2006, 08:43 PM
You're like the wind.....change in a moments notice. You asked me whether I'd take him in the 4th round. It's a totally redundant question as he won't be there in the 4th round.

If he was there, I might take him. AS A RETURNER. If I'm Nick Saban, I have two young number 2/3 types, one who could become a number one. I don't need another corner with so-so ability who might or night not develop.

As for the draft thing, you should ask around. Just because I don't like your Cane player, you change the emphasis of your story this way and that. It's really rather irritatating after a while.

Dude I haven't changed a bit. It's not my fault you can't piece my argument together. Look through the thread, and you'll see the only reason I appear to change is because people make ridiculous assumptions off what I say, so I have to pat them on the head and tell them what I really said.

You might want to look up redundant too, before you're ready to use it in a sentence.

Boomer
04-10-2006, 05:45 AM
You might want to look up redundant too, before you're ready to use it in a sentence.

Redundant: "Not needed or wanted". Seeing as though we gave you the English language, I'd try checking a dictionary before calling people out.

kpcane
04-10-2006, 11:33 AM
Redundant: "Not needed or wanted". Seeing as though we gave you the English language, I'd try checking a dictionary before calling people out.

Haha!! I'm glad you looked it up and you actually made me look it up and I found this: d chiefly British : no longer needed for a job and hence laid off
http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/redundant

There's the website for you, so you don't have to do too much work...don't want you to hurt yourself over it. So even in the British sense that you used it in, is still incorrect. Nobody over here uses redundant for that meaning anyway, so save your Tony Blair lovin' words for the queen.

Motion
04-10-2006, 11:58 AM
You're spoiled man. Just because Daniels turned out to be a starter and a great value pick in the 4th, doesn't mean that every 4th rounder we get from now on is going to be able to start right away. Besides, if we get an OLB in the first, we won't have that many other needs to fill...although our o-line could always use some improvement.
There would be no immediate value with Hester, except for kick and punt returns. But if he's a starting CB for us in 3 years, that's great value for the 4th. Don't judge every 4th round pick off the Travis Daniels pick. Who knows if he's even going to start this year, now that Will Poole is back and we signed Will Allen?

I never said every 4th rounder is gonna be an instant starter. Thats just plain ridiculous. I just gave that as an example of the value. Daniels had an advantage because he knew the system. He also didn't have the questions that Hester has, as in undefined postion. Regardless, I'm down with whatever Saban decides to do. The kid is an amazing athlete no doubt.

Tureo
04-10-2006, 04:46 PM
No thanks on Hester. He has no position. Although I like Lawson he may be a tweener and he may need some time. I think we draft a player who can immediately have an impact on our team. I am not saying Lawson wouldnt but if we take a db h may have a better opportunity to play more and sooner than a lb, unless he is well seasoned or a freak. I have heard people call Lawson a freak