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miadfins
04-28-2006, 03:25 PM
i have to be seeing things because i just saw spielman on espn answering a question about how a draft can ruin your career. :sidelol::sidelol: i just saw the the question on the bottom and couldn't hear his answer over the laughing. i did not see this posted.

dlockz
04-28-2006, 03:28 PM
i have to be seeing things because i just saw spielman on espn answering a question about how a draft can ruin your career. :sidelol::sidelol: i just saw the the question on the bottom and couldn't hear his answer over the laughing. i did not see this posted.


Whenever Speilman makes a comment on the draft I just think, Why the hell would ESPN use this clown. Its proven that he was among the worst GM's in history.

Troysif
04-28-2006, 03:29 PM
Whenever Speilman makes a comment on the draft I just think, Why the hell would ESPN use this clown. Its proven that he was among the worst GM's in history.

i laugh every time they announce his name, :sidelol:

Tpaddle
04-28-2006, 03:29 PM
he is a BUM

nough said...

dlockz
04-28-2006, 03:31 PM
i laugh every time they announce his name, :sidelol:

I can hear him saying that Indy should trade thier 2nd round pick for Lamar Gordon.

22Mercury
04-28-2006, 03:39 PM
They were talking about how the Browns have made some lousy draft picks the last few years when they mentioned it could ruin a GM's career. His response was that when you have high picks and pay them a ton of money and they don't work out it is a lot worse. I think the only reason ESPN has him is that all of the other front office guys have jobs and he is probably making minimum wage.

MiamiMan147
04-28-2006, 03:39 PM
Before Saban, the one draft we had where Spielman was in control was the best we had since the JJ era. I'd say the 2004 draft where we got Carey, Poole, Pope, Bua, and Hadnot was pretty strong, especially considering the last 4 of those were day 2 picks. You guys are ripping him for what happened when Wannstadt had final say. Had Spielman been in charge in 2003, we'd have Anquan Boldin on our roster instead of Eddie friggin Moore.

He was a terrible GM who killed us with desperation moves in 2004, but he was a pretty decent talent evaluator.

Roman529
04-28-2006, 03:43 PM
He can't pronounce half the guys up there like Ngata...even flubbed Cromartie's name and called him CRAmartie. You gotta wonder why nobody is "drafting" Slick Rick as their new GM. :D

miadfins
04-28-2006, 03:43 PM
Before Saban, the one draft we had where Spielman was in control was the best we had since the JJ era. I'd say the 2004 draft where we got Carey, Poole, Pope, Bua, and Hadnot was pretty strong, especially considering the last 4 of those were day 2 picks. You guys are ripping him for what happened when Wannstadt had final say. Had Spielman been in charge in 2003, we'd have Anquan Boldin on our roster instead of Eddie friggin Moore.

He was a terrible GM who killed us with desperation moves in 2004, but he was a pretty decent talent evaluator.
he also used one of his first day picks on lamar gordon and a think AJ. and wasted another pick to move up tp get carey

22Mercury
04-28-2006, 03:54 PM
I'm not as impressed with the '04 draft. Vernon Carey struggled almost to the point of being labeled a bust and he was our first pick, if I remember correctly. The only guy from the '04 draft that I think was a steal was Will Poole. I look for him to have a huge season in '06.

Itsdahumidity
04-28-2006, 04:03 PM
Before Saban, the one draft we had where Spielman was in control was the best we had since the JJ era. I'd say the 2004 draft where we got Carey, Poole, Pope, Bua, and Hadnot was pretty strong, especially considering the last 4 of those were day 2 picks. You guys are ripping him for what happened when Wannstadt had final say. Had Spielman been in charge in 2003, we'd have Anquan Boldin on our roster instead of Eddie friggin Moore.

He was a terrible GM who killed us with desperation moves in 2004, but he was a pretty decent talent evaluator.

Sigh ... Please tell us what your pal spielman was doing from the time wanny brought him in to right before he was named gm. Who do you think was in charge of the Phins' "talent evaluation" during this period? Who provided wanny with the name eddie moore, if the popular belief was/is dave couldn't walk & chew gum at the same time? I know spielman supporters are still around but with his embarrassing appearances on espn one would think they would finally get it.

dlockz
04-28-2006, 04:08 PM
Before Saban, the one draft we had where Spielman was in control was the best we had since the JJ era. I'd say the 2004 draft where we got Carey, Poole, Pope, Bua, and Hadnot was pretty strong, especially considering the last 4 of those were day 2 picks. You guys are ripping him for what happened when Wannstadt had final say. Had Spielman been in charge in 2003, we'd have Anquan Boldin on our roster instead of Eddie friggin Moore.

He was a terrible GM who killed us with desperation moves in 2004, but he was a pretty decent talent evaluator.

I agree he did a decent job during that draft but what about giving away a 4th round to a team that was not going to draft him anyway. We were in a no lose situation and he lost. No team wanted Carey that early to trade up. If they had traded the pick or picked Carey well pick Udeze or Wilfork. He got lucky that Poole fell. But Pope and Hadnot were good picks, Bua a reach.

Dolfan11
04-28-2006, 04:45 PM
This guy is so annoying it irritates me. How can they have him on their show giving his insight? This guy has none. He's even fortunate enough to have a job at ESPN, but would of been better if any other team in the NFL hired him.

MiamiMan147
04-28-2006, 04:58 PM
he also used one of his first day picks on lamar gordon and a think AJ. and wasted another pick to move up tp get carey

Like I said, bad GM, good talent evaluator. The moves for Feeley and Gordon were the desperation moves of a guy who had 1 year to turn around a team. Obviously, they should never have been made. Same thing with trading up one spot to get a player that would have been there anyways.


I'm not as impressed with the '04 draft. Vernon Carey struggled almost to the point of being labeled a bust and he was our first pick, if I remember correctly. The only guy from the '04 draft that I think was a steal was Will Poole. I look for him to have a huge season in '06.

Anyone who labels a guy a bust in his 1st season is ignorant. In case you didn't notice he did all right in year 2. However, he wasn't what made this draft. We had a 4th round steal in Poole, a solid starter (Hadnot in the 5th), a special teams ace (Bua 6th, who was cut because he didn't fit the new system), and a pretty good backup to Zack Thomas (Pope, 7th round). Even Pape, a 7th rounder, is still on the roster. Considering most 7th rounders don't even survive training camp, that's not bad.


Please tell us what your pal spielman was doing from the time wanny brought him in to right before he was named gm.

Sorry, I don't think it was just a coincidence that the one draft we had were Wanny wasn't allowed to muck things up was the best of his tenure. We found 2, possibly 3 starters on the second day of his one draft (Pope would start on a lot of teams). Compare that to the single day 2 starter we picked in the previous 4 years.

JTBRLZ
04-28-2006, 05:08 PM
I agree that Speilman was a good talent evaluator, just a bad GM.

dlockz
04-28-2006, 05:22 PM
I agree that Speilman was a good talent evaluator, just a bad GM.

If he was such a good evaluator how or why did he trade for Gordon or Feeley. Why did he draft a tackle that barely played a down. Speilman sucks on so many levels.

jlfin
04-28-2006, 05:29 PM
he also used one of his first day picks on lamar gordon and a think AJ. and wasted another pick to move up tp get carey

He also had a lot of pressure from Huizenga and DW to win now!

Some of you guys judge people without knowing all the facts. He has a good eye for talent and he's certainly more qualified than any of the other guys on the show.

jlfin
04-28-2006, 05:33 PM
he is a BUM

nough said...

It's unfortunate that some of you have such pitiful lives that you have to resort to insults and personal attacks against players, coaches/ GM's you don't like.
From everything I've read Spielman was hard working and very dedicated to his job. So to call him garbage, loser or bum is more a reflection of you.
He reached the pinnacle of his profession which is more that can be said for some of you.

Spray Mucus
04-28-2006, 05:38 PM
If he was such a good evaluator how or why did he trade for Gordon or Feeley.

Gordon was simply a desperation move. I think that has already been mentioned twice in this trhread. Minor got hurt, we where down to Sammie as the only RB that would be able to carry more than 20 times a game.

So the Rams took advantage of our desperation.

Feeley was one of those moves that Rick did fowl up, he thought he was a decent QB that would fit Wanny's system. The Eagles wanted a 3rd round pick in the 04 draft, we didn't have a 3rd so Rick made a bad GM move by giving the Eagles a 2nd in 05.

Trading up to get Carey was another bad GM move. as mentioned before, who cares if Carey gets taken, Wilfork is there. But I think Rick was scared he would miss out on the other OT he really wanted (and the team needed), as he watched Shawn Andrews get stolen from us from non other than the Eagles.

bottom line is, he was a decent (NOT GREAT) talent evaluator and a really bad GM.

He does get props for finding Hadnot and Pope. Poole was a no brainer, when a 1st or 2nd round talent falls to the 4th, you take him.

jlfin
04-28-2006, 05:48 PM
Gordon was simply a desperation move. I think that has already been mentioned twice in this trhread. Minor got hurt, we where down to Sammie as the only RB that would be able to carry more than 20 times a game.

So the Rams took advantage of our desperation.

Feeley was one of those moves that Rick did fowl up, he thought he was a decent QB that would fit Wanny's system. The Eagles wanted a 3rd round pick in the 04 draft, we didn't have a 3rd so Rick made a bad GM move by giving the Eagles a 2nd in 05.

Trading up to get Carey was another bad GM move. as mentioned before, who cares if Carey gets taken, Wilfork is there. But I think Rick was scared he would miss out on the other OT he really wanted (and the team needed), as he watched Shawn Andrews get stolen from us from non other than the Eagles.

bottom line is, he was a decent (NOT GREAT) talent evaluator and a really bad GM.

He does get props for finding Hadnot and Pope. Poole was a no brainer, when a 1st or 2nd round talent falls to the 4th, you take him.

He also wanted Anquan Boldin, but DW over ruled him. He wanted Kendrell Bell instead of Fletcher, but DW over ruled him. Chambers, McMichael were his picks. RS problem was that he didn't have the experience to be a GM, but he was a good talent evaluator. He also seems like a decent guy and that's what bothers me the most about the personal attacks.
If a person doesn't like the job he did, that's fine and should be stated that way.

dlockz
04-28-2006, 05:49 PM
He also had a lot of pressure from Huizenga and DW to win now!

Some of you guys judge people without knowing all the facts. He has a good eye for talent and he's certainly more qualified than any of the other guys on the show.

His results were the facts. He was under pressure to find a QB and a RB but not to take the two respective guys he took. Nobody in the league was going to give up that much for these two third stringers and neither team had leverage. If his eye for talent is so great, how come no team came knocking after this debacle. We could have had Larry Johnson for the right offer. At that time nobody wanted Johnson. The were much better Qb's to trade a second for than Feeley. Then the idiot loses a 4th round pick out of pure stupidity and Vikings later admit bluffing us. He took Tony Bua who never had a real position over Kelly Butler T from Purdue who started 16 games last year. Shane Olivea T was still on board also. fact is we are a better team without Rick Speilman here to muff things up. Big deal he liked Antoin Boldin, so did I but i'm not a GM and even I would not have had Eddie Moore that highly rated.

Spray Mucus
04-28-2006, 05:55 PM
He also wanted Anquan Boldin, but DW over ruled him. He wanted Kendrell Bell instead of Fletcher, but DW over ruled him. Chambers, McMichael were his picks. RS problem was that he didn't have the experience to be a GM, but he was a good talent evaluator. He also seems like a decent guy and that's what bothers me the most about the personal attacks.
If a person doesn't like the job he did, that's fine and should be stated that way.

I have no problems with Spiel's as a person. As a matter a fact, I think he's a class act. I remember him beeing interviewed on the NFL network a week after Ricky retired, he had the chance to bash Ricky but chose to wish him best of luck instead.

I was awar of Boldin and Bell but not Chambers and McMicheal beeing Ricks pick. Do you have anything to back that up?

Spray Mucus
04-28-2006, 06:01 PM
His results were the facts. He was under pressure to find a QB and a RB but not to take the two respective guys he took. Nobody in the league was going to give up that much for these two third stringers and neither team had leverage. If his eye for talent is so great, how come no team came knocking after this debacle. We could have had Larry Johnson for the right offer. At that time nobody wanted Johnson. The were much better Qb's to trade a second for than Feeley. Then the idiot loses a 4th round pick out of pure stupidity and Vikings later admit bluffing us. He took Tony Bua who never had a real position over Kelly Butler T from Purdue who started 16 games last year. Shane Olivea T was still on board also. fact is we are a better team without Rick Speilman here to muff things up. Big deal he liked Antoin Boldin, so did I but i'm not a GM and even I would not have had Eddie Moore that highly rated.

Hello! is this thing on? are we typing in Japanese.

everything you mentioned was the result of a BAD GM MOVE!

as for the Bua pick... instead of naming the two guys who where obviously sleeper picks, why don't you name all the picks who are no longer on NFL rosters, while your at it, name all the guys picked BEFORE BUA who never made the team they where picked by.

It is true, we are a better team now that Rick isn't around but, he isn't to blame for ALL that went wrong in 04.

dlockz
04-28-2006, 06:03 PM
I have no problems with Spiel's as a person. As a matter a fact, I think he's a class act. I remember him beeing interviewed on the NFL network a week after Ricky retired, he had the chance to bash Ricky but chose to wish him best of luck instead.

I was awar of Boldin and Bell but not Chambers and McMicheal beeing Ricks pick. Do you have anything to back that up?


The bell pick was silly also, Brees should have been the obvious pick but oh well. As a guy he seems like a good guy as GM-talent evaluator he should be unemployed which he is at that position.

Itsdahumidity
04-28-2006, 06:15 PM
Like I said, bad GM, good talent evaluator. The moves for Feeley and Gordon were the desperation moves of a guy who had 1 year to turn around a team. Obviously, they should never have been made. Same thing with trading up one spot to get a player that would have been there anyways.

What does being desperate have to do with identifying talent? Under any type of situation (even the most stressful ones - goes with the territory) the talent evaluator's skill set stays the same. They either have it or they don't. There's no overriding circumstances that would cause them to compromise how they view players.
btw - please don't be naive and think wayne gave spiel one yr to prove himself because if that was the case huizenga would've fired him right b4 Saban came aboard. If it was up to the owner rick would still be with us.



Anyone who labels a guy a bust in his 1st season is ignorant. In case you didn't notice he did all right in year 2. However, he wasn't what made this draft. We had a 4th round steal in Poole, a solid starter (Hadnot in the 5th), a special teams ace (Bua 6th, who was cut because he didn't fit the new system), and a pretty good backup to Zack Thomas (Pope, 7th round). Even Pape, a 7th rounder, is still on the roster. Considering most 7th rounders don't even survive training camp, that's not bad.

Where is Bua now? Pope will be lucky to land a roster spot this yr. Why do you insist on comparing wanny's drafts with 2004? Spiel was his right hand man the whole time.




Sorry, I don't think it was just a coincidence that the one draft we had were Wanny wasn't allowed to muck things up was the best of his tenure. We found 2, possibly 3 starters on the second day of his one draft (Pope would start on a lot of teams). Compare that to the single day 2 starter we picked in the previous 4 years.

And that is evident from all those teams beating down our door to trade for him ...?

Spray Mucus
04-28-2006, 06:24 PM
The bell pick was silly also, Brees should have been the obvious pick but oh well. As a guy he seems like a good guy as GM-talent evaluator he should be unemployed which he is at that position.

hinsight is 20/20 buddy. it's easy to say who the best pick would have been 5 years later.

you keep making examples picks when Wanny had final say.

And Brees wasn't so obviouse, we just re-uped Jay's contract. Again, Wanny and Spiel did a terrible job with there handling of picks, that's why they are not employed in the NFL. But your still brushing over the fact that Rick was a decent talent evaluator.