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View Full Version : Hanley Ramirez: NL ROOKIE OF THE YEAR



DeathStar
11-13-2006, 03:52 PM
Hanley Ramirez (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7488) of the Florida Marlins (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/clubhouse?team=fla) won a tight race for NL Rookie of the Year, and Detroit Tigers (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/clubhouse?team=det) pitcher Justin Verlander (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7590) took home the AL award Monday. Ramirez beat out Washington Nationals (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/clubhouse?team=was) third baseman Ryan Zimmerman (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7627) by only four points in balloting by the Baseball Writers' Association of America. The speedy shortstop got 14 of 30 first-place votes and finished with 105 points. Zimmerman received 10 first-place votes and totaled 101 points.


Three of the top four NL finishers were Marlins. Second baseman Dan Uggla (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7692) came in third, getting the other six first-place votes, and pitcher Josh Johnson (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7669) was fourth.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2660401

we so won the deal we made with the sox.

Ray Finkle
11-13-2006, 04:02 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2660401

we so won the deal we made with the sox.

:lol:

Eric Hinske, Angel Berroa, Ben Grive, Todd Hollensworth, Marty Cordova are all past ROTY winners who’s carrers never amounted to anything past their first year (not saying Hanley will end up like them but the guy’s been in the game for only 1 year). Let’s give the deal a few move years before you put Hanley in the HOF and Beckett hanging out to dry.

ChambersWI
11-13-2006, 04:54 PM
Angel Berroa only won the award because Matsui was in his 30's, and the Royals had such a great season. Plus, there really wasn't many good rookies that year.

Hinski had a decent rookie year, but he got lost in the shuffleonce the Jays got Hillenbrand, then Koskie, then Glaus.

GreenMonster
11-13-2006, 04:54 PM
The Sole reason the Marlins have 2 World Titles and not 1 is Josh Beckett.. I would give this deal a little more time before you claim victory..

Don't forget Ken Hamelin or Jason Jennings also..

Ray Finkle
11-13-2006, 05:07 PM
Angel Berroa only won the award because Matsui was in his 30's, and the Royals had such a great season. Plus, there really wasn't many good rookies that year.

Hinski had a decent rookie year, but he got lost in the shuffleonce the Jays got Hillenbrand, then Koskie, then Glaus.

Look at Hanley's numbers this year and Berroa's the year he won the award. They're extremely similar. I'm not saying Hanley will turn into Berrora because he's a great talent but it's worth noting none the less.

It will be interesting to see how Hanley adapts the the league in his 2nd year when teams have scouting reports and learn how to pitch to him.

Ray Finkle
11-13-2006, 05:08 PM
The Sole reason the Marlins have 2 World Titles and not 1 is Josh Beckett.. I would give this deal a little more time before you claim victory..

Don't forget Ken Hamelin or Jason Jennings also..

There are a lot of names on the list that never amounted to anything past their first year and guys in the Hall of Fame or going to get into the Hall that never won the award.

gillderais
11-13-2006, 05:34 PM
Glad to see Hanley won it, he deserved it.

Vertical Limit
11-13-2006, 05:36 PM
:rolleyes: @ the Haters

Go Hanley Ramirez! w00t.

RWhitney014
11-13-2006, 05:49 PM
One more time in 2006...

OH, HANLEY!

And Hanley Ramirez' numbers in 2006 are on par in rookie seasons with Derek Jeter, Tris Speaker, Craig Biggio, and many other HOF types.

Angel Berroa hit for fewer doubles and triples, thus much lower slugging percentage, lower average, lower OBP, half the SBs, less than half the walks, much fewer hits, and 20 fewer runs. Hanley's rookie year was also a year earlier than Berroa's and is generally much higher regarded than Berroa ever was.

And if we want to list the ROY busts, let's talk about all the WS MVPs that had sterling careers as well. Guys like Pat Borders, Jose Rijo, Ray Knight, Bret Saberhagen, Gene Tenace, Larry Sherry, so on. Come on, that is ridiculous reasoning.

Ray Finkle
11-13-2006, 06:27 PM
One more time in 2006...

OH, HANLEY!

And Hanley Ramirez' numbers in 2006 are on par in rookie seasons with Derek Jeter, Tris Speaker, Craig Biggio, and many other HOF types.

Angel Berroa hit for fewer doubles and triples, thus much lower slugging percentage, lower average, lower OBP, half the SBs, less than half the walks, much fewer hits, and 20 fewer runs. Hanley's rookie year was also a year earlier than Berroa's and is generally much higher regarded than Berroa ever was.

And if we want to list the ROY busts, let's talk about all the WS MVPs that had sterling careers as well. Guys like Pat Borders, Jose Rijo, Ray Knight, Bret Saberhagen, Gene Tenace, Larry Sherry, so on. Come on, that is ridiculous reasoning.

So is people saying the Marlins got the better deal or this was the worst trade in baseball history. Let's relax a little bit. Year 1 certainly goes to FL.

But let's wait and see how the next 3 years play out before people knock the trade.

Hey I'm a big Hanley fan, but as I said it will be interesting on how he does once a scouting report is out on him and how he adapts to the league. He deserved the award and I'm glad he got it.

RWhitney014
11-13-2006, 07:22 PM
So is people saying the Marlins got the better deal or this was the worst trade in baseball history. Let's relax a little bit. Year 1 certainly goes to FL.

But let's wait and see how the next 3 years play out before people knock the trade.

Hey I'm a big Hanley fan, but as I said it will be interesting on how he does once a scouting report is out on him and how he adapts to the league. He deserved the award and I'm glad he got it.

Yes, but considering the Marlins were the ones who made the trade for the future and Red Sox made it for the present, if any year was supposed to go to Boston, it was this one. We're not even talking about the two relief prospects in Garcia and Delgado, both of whom have legit shots to crack the majors by Opening Day 2008. But in a one-for-one basis, Sanchez was better than Beckett this year and Ramirez was better than Lowell while being what, 12 years younger? Can we say conclusively that Florida won the trade? Of course not, but you couldn't say that about the Pierzynski to SF deal at the beginning, either, but everyone knew Minnesota won the deal 10 minutes after it was announced.

Scouting reports don't take a year to materialize. I thought the honeymoon was over after his .346 start when he went 0-for-the-month, but instead he became a rock at the top of the order. You realize that his doubles total would have been a franchise record if not for Cabrera setting it himself this year? You know who had the foothold on that record for a while? Yep, Mikey Lowell. Absolutely everything that happened this year and that is projected for the future favors the Marlins in this trade, and injury is, to me, the only foreseeable thing that would prevent that. But even if they put up the exact production next year, Boston's guys will be doing it for $18 million and Florida's for $800,000. That's incredible.

Ray Finkle
11-13-2006, 07:46 PM
Yes, but considering the Marlins were the ones who made the trade for the future and Red Sox made it for the present, if any year was supposed to go to Boston, it was this one. We're not even talking about the two relief prospects in Garcia and Delgado, both of whom have legit shots to crack the majors by Opening Day 2008. But in a one-for-one basis, Sanchez was better than Beckett this year and Ramirez was better than Lowell while being what, 12 years younger? Can we say conclusively that Florida won the trade? Of course not, but you couldn't say that about the Pierzynski to SF deal at the beginning, either, but everyone knew Minnesota won the deal 10 minutes after it was announced.

Scouting reports don't take a year to materialize. I thought the honeymoon was over after his .346 start when he went 0-for-the-month, but instead he became a rock at the top of the order. You realize that his doubles total would have been a franchise record if not for Cabrera setting it himself this year? You know who had the foothold on that record for a while? Yep, Mikey Lowell. Absolutely everything that happened this year and that is projected for the future favors the Marlins in this trade, and injury is, to me, the only foreseeable thing that would prevent that. But even if they put up the exact production next year, Boston's guys will be doing it for $18 million and Florida's for $800,000. That's incredible.

I'm not going to get into it for the 3499818th time on this site alone. Let's just sit back and wait to see how the next 3 years pan out.

Perfect23
11-13-2006, 07:50 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2660401

we so won the deal we made with the sox.


you know else was once a rookie of the year todd hollandsworth u know who else mary cordova u know who else ben greve exactly wait a few more years.

Get Up And Go
11-13-2006, 09:43 PM
Yeah, congrats Hanley. So far good trade. Beckett needs to get rid of those injury plagued seasons. But love em both. Go Fish

PressCoverage
11-14-2006, 12:38 AM
how long before the Marlins dump Hanley in their next salary purge?

oh, sorry...

Get Up And Go
11-14-2006, 01:00 AM
how long before the Marlins dump Hanley in their next salary purge?

oh, sorry...

After we win our next WS ring.

RWhitney014
11-14-2006, 01:13 AM
how long before the Marlins dump Hanley in their next salary purge?

oh, sorry...

Oh, don't worry, he'll always be ready for the Sox by 2020.

MikeO
11-14-2006, 01:54 AM
It was a bad deal for Boston. You give up on this kid he wins ROY and you gave up on him for Edgar Renteria who only stayed 1 year. You also give up a pitcher who throws a no-hitter late in the year in the middle of a playoff run. That is a huge spot. All around bad trade, no need to wait 3 years on this!

Boston got Josh Beckett who when he isn't injured is getting beat up in the AL. Not to mention the guy has only had 1 hot playoff run in his life and aside from that struggles to win 10 games a year.

It was a brilliant move for the Marlins. And moves like this that lets them stay competitive at a $15 mill payroll.

Vertical Limit
11-14-2006, 10:30 AM
It was a bad deal for Boston. You give up on this kid he wins ROY and you gave up on him for Edgar Renteria who only stayed 1 year. You also give up a pitcher who throws a no-hitter late in the year in the middle of a playoff run. That is a huge spot. All around bad trade, no need to wait 3 years on this!

Boston got Josh Beckett who when he isn't injured is getting beat up in the AL. Not to mention the guy has only had 1 hot playoff run in his life and aside from that struggles to win 10 games a year.

It was a brilliant move for the Marlins. And moves like this that lets them stay competitive at a $15 mill payroll.
You nailed it.

Rather have Anibel Sanchez than bidding 45 million dollars to some japanese pitcher just to talk. More risk spending that money and the japanese pitcher turns out to be a bust than paying a guy a few hundred thousands. :lol:

Alex44
11-14-2006, 01:17 PM
Hanley Ramirez is going to be amazing, he has the power to hit 30+ home runs also. In fact Id bet that at some point in his career he will be a 40/40/40 guy (40 Home runs, steals, and doubles) maybe he wont hit 40 but 30 is a very possible number

Anibal Sanchez.....there isnt enough you can say about the guy, everytime he steps on the mound you expect something special, and this was even before the no-hitter.

MikeO
11-14-2006, 01:22 PM
Hanley Ramirez is going to be amazing, he has the power to hit 30+ home runs also. In fact Id bet that at some point in his career he will be a 40/40/40 guy (40 Home runs, steals, and doubles) maybe he wont hit 40 but 30 is a very possible number

Anibal Sanchez.....there isnt enough you can say about the guy, everytime he steps on the mound you expect something special, and this was even before the no-hitter.

He ain't hitting 40 home runs in that ballpark. Maybe when the team moves to San Antonio, Portland, Nashville...etc. But NOT in dolphins stadium.

He's a stud though, no doubt. A steal of a trade for Florida!! Sanchez and Hanley for a washed up Lowell, Mota, and an inconsistent Beckett.

Alex44
11-14-2006, 01:25 PM
He ain't hitting 40 home runs in that ballpark. Maybe when the team moves to San Antonio, Portland, Nashville...etc. But NOT in dolphins stadium.

He's a stud though, no doubt. A steal of a trade for Florida!! Sanchez and Hanley for a washed up Lowell, Mota, and an inconsistent Beckett.

Or when they build a new stadium here.


But your right it probably wont happen in Dolphin Stadium. You never know though if he can hit 15 at home and 25 on the road thats 40 right there. But like I said 30 is probally a more reachable number.

miamikid92
11-14-2006, 04:58 PM
Han Ram!!!!!

305TillIDie
11-14-2006, 05:03 PM
Hanley is the man :up:

Ray Finkle
11-14-2006, 06:45 PM
It was a bad deal for Boston. You give up on this kid he wins ROY and you gave up on him for Edgar Renteria who only stayed 1 year. You also give up a pitcher who throws a no-hitter late in the year in the middle of a playoff run. That is a huge spot. All around bad trade, no need to wait 3 years on this!

Boston got Josh Beckett who when he isn't injured is getting beat up in the AL. Not to mention the guy has only had 1 hot playoff run in his life and aside from that struggles to win 10 games a year.

It was a brilliant move for the Marlins. And moves like this that lets them stay competitive at a $15 mill payroll.

Ok so if let's say Beckett wins a total of 48 games over the next 3 years, finishes in the top 5 in the Cy Young voting each year and leads the Sox to a WS appearance while Hanley turns into an Angel Berrora and Anibal Sanchez wins a total of 35 games with an ERA of around 4 over the next 3 years the deal will still be better for FL?

Who knows what's going to happen in the next 3 years, Sanchez could blow out his arm (which was a major concern of the Sox and why they traded him), Hanley could turn into the player he was in 2004 in Double A, Beckett could finally find himself and turn himself into a pitcher. Who knows. Of course all 3 of them could suck too.

RWhitney014
11-14-2006, 08:22 PM
Ok so if let's say Beckett wins a total of 48 games over the next 3 years, finishes in the top 5 in the Cy Young voting each year and leads the Sox to a WS appearance while Hanley turns into an Angel Berrora and Anibal Sanchez wins a total of 35 games with an ERA of around 4 over the next 3 years the deal will still be better for FL?

Who knows what's going to happen in the next 3 years, Sanchez could blow out his arm (which was a major concern of the Sox and why they traded him), Hanley could turn into the player he was in 2004 in Double A, Beckett could finally find himself and turn himself into a pitcher. Who knows. Of course all 3 of them could suck too.

And Beckett could blow out his arm and Lowell could decide to abruptly retire. That could be said about any trade.

Ray Finkle
11-14-2006, 08:27 PM
And Beckett could blow out his arm and Lowell could decide to abruptly retire. That could be said about any trade.


Yes Beckett could throw out his arm.

All I'm saying is you can't judge a trade fairly after only 1 year due to baseball being so unpredictable. Beckett could turn into a Hall of Famer, so could Hanley or Anibal. All three guys could just flat out suck for the rest of their careers. Hey the trade could even work out for everyone.

Again all I'm saying is let's just wait and see before the trade is dubbed by some "the worst trade in the history of baseball".

FinsNYanksFan13
11-14-2006, 08:35 PM
Beckett's arm will fall off sometime next season. He just logged 204 innings which means he's due for a nice long stint on the DL at some point during the 07 season!

MikeO
11-15-2006, 12:57 AM
Again all I'm saying is let's just wait and see before the trade is dubbed by some "the worst trade in the history of baseball".

I have waited and seen enough. It's a bad trade.

Lowell is washed up. Mota stinks. And Beckett is a flash in the pan.

Hanley did enough in 1 year to make this a good trade for Florida. The no-no by Sanchiez was just the icing.

Prime Time
11-15-2006, 02:10 AM
The Sole reason the Marlins have 2 World Titles and not 1 is Josh Beckett.. I would give this deal a little more time before you claim victory..

Don't forget Ken Hamelin or Jason Jennings also..

Carl Pavano threw 2 light out performances as well. Beckett should not get ALL the credit. Yes he went 9 shutout innings in Game 6, but the hits, defense etc. were also a part of the WS.

EDIT - - Conrgats to Han Ram. Well deserved. Nice to see 3 of the top 4 guys voted for where Marlins.

SpurzN703
11-15-2006, 12:12 PM
Congrats Hanley, you did my fantasy team proud.

Ryan Zimmerman will have done more then Hanley Ramirez by the time their careers are over with.

Book it and Go Nats

Alex44
11-15-2006, 12:18 PM
Congrats Hanley, you did my fantasy team proud.

Ryan Zimmerman will have done more then Hanley Ramirez by the time their careers are over with.

Book it and Go Nats

I doubt it

Zimmerman is a very very good player dont get me wrong, but he is a doubles and home runs guy basically who plays good defense

Hanley not only hits doubles and home runes, but he also steals bases, hits triples, his defense will be up there and he already plays great D in spurts. And will hit for a very high average ( Would have been pretty high last year but he went through a very long streak with no hits)

Vertical Limit
11-15-2006, 01:03 PM
Hanley Ramirez = Next Alfonso Soriano

GreenMonster
11-15-2006, 01:06 PM
Hanley Ramirez = Next Alfonso Soriano

Nope he is more a contact hitter than a slugger like Soriano.. He may get to the 30-35 range but I don't see him hitting 46 like Soriano.. I could be wrong though.. He is bigger than Soriano, and faster maybe..

Ray Finkle
11-15-2006, 01:11 PM
Nope he is more a contact hitter than a slugger like Soriano.. He may get to the 30-35 range but I don't see him hitting 46 like Soriano.. I could be wrong though.. He is bigger than Soriano, and faster maybe..

I agree I can't see Hanley hitting more than 30 home runs in a season either. I'd love to have still have Hanley and also have Zimmerman on my team.

Hanley is the next Reyes and Zimmerman is the next Wright, in my opinion.

RWhitney014
11-15-2006, 01:55 PM
I agree I can't see Hanley hitting more than 30 home runs in a season either. I'd love to have still have Hanley and also have Zimmerman on my team.

Hanley is the next Reyes and Zimmerman is the next Wright, in my opinion.

Except the Marlins already have a third baseman better than Wright.

SpurzN703
11-15-2006, 03:32 PM
I doubt it

Zimmerman is a very very good player dont get me wrong, but he is a doubles and home runs guy basically who plays good defense

Hanley not only hits doubles and home runes, but he also steals bases, hits triples, his defense will be up there and he already plays great D in spurts. And will hit for a very high average ( Would have been pretty high last year but he went through a very long streak with no hits)

I guess I shouldnt have compared the 2 due to my own beliefs about comparing athletes.

Hanley Ramirez isnt asked to do the same things Zimmerman is. HR is faster, and looked upon to steal and make contact. Zimmerman is expected to play good D, and produce HRs and RBIs.

I retract my previous statement. Besides, you yoyos had like 6-7 candidates for ROY. Give us cheapo Nats fans a break

:wink:

RWhitney014
11-15-2006, 04:29 PM
I guess I shouldnt have compared the 2 due to my own beliefs about comparing athletes.

Hanley Ramirez isnt asked to do the same things Zimmerman is. HR is faster, and looked upon to steal and make contact. Zimmerman is expected to play good D, and produce HRs and RBIs.

I retract my previous statement. Besides, you yoyos had like 6-7 candidates for ROY. Give us cheapo Nats fans a break

:wink:

Then maybe Hanley won because he had only 3 fewer HR and a higher slugging percentage as the speed/contact hitter than the power/production hitter. :tongue: