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View Full Version : Re: "Brady Quinn Draft Scenarios" by Phil Unwin



phinphanforever
04-11-2007, 07:46 PM
Just a tad biased, are we?

http://www.finheaven.com/news.php?extend.24

Captain Lou
04-11-2007, 08:24 PM
Just a tad biased, are we?

http://www.finheaven.com/news.php?extend.24 (http://www.finheaven.com/news.php?extend.24)


Who's Phil Irwin, and the Dolphins organization hasn't made it clear one way or another what route they will go in the 1st round, and much less have they showed great interest in Quinn anymore than they have Russell, Stanton, or Edwards.

Jaj
04-11-2007, 08:25 PM
Oh comon. That's just ridiculous.

They've shown tremendous interest in Quinn and it's more than a given that they're going to select him if he's in range.

alan huber
04-11-2007, 08:29 PM
Oh comon. That's just ridiculous.

They've shown tremendous interest in Quinn and it's more than a given that they're going to select him if he's in range.

i agree ,, quinn his worth much more then the 9 overall pick . i would give 2 first rounders for him . but im crazy :goof:

Dol-Fan99
04-11-2007, 08:30 PM
i hope we do whatever it takes to get Quinn, or at least give it the old college try, he is worth it!

TRUEPHIN
04-11-2007, 08:32 PM
Nice read.

I would be extremely disappointed if we drafted Quinn but good article anyways.

Dol-Fan99
04-11-2007, 08:34 PM
Nice read.

I would be extremely disappointed if we drafted Quinn but good article anyways.

Hey, at least is we drafted Quinn or a "franchise QB", we wouldnt be here speculating who our QB will be this year.:sidelol:

phunwin
04-11-2007, 08:37 PM
Who's Phil Irwin, and the Dolphins organization hasn't made it clear one way or another what route they will go in the 1st round, and much less have they showed great interest in Quinn anymore than they have Russell, Stanton, or Edwards.

I dunno. I've never met "Phil Irwin" before in my life.


Just a tad biased, are we?

http://www.finheaven.com/news.php?extend.24

Everyone has their own particular draft day favorite. He's mine. I'm not sure how that necessarily is supposed to make my opinion somehow less valid. Nevertheless, it's naive at best and down right ridiculous at worst to suggest that Quinn is anything but Miami's prime target on draft day. The organization's been drooling over the kid for two years now.

alan huber
04-11-2007, 08:39 PM
Nice read.

I would be extremely disappointed if we drafted Quinn but good article anyways.

why man , why ???:confused:

Phinja
04-11-2007, 08:48 PM
Hey, at least is we drafted Quinn or a "franchise QB", we wouldnt be here speculating who our QB will be this year.:sidelol:


Actualy the speculation would heat up, in the form of "Quinn: Sit or Start?" I think he would sit a year behind (insert QB here).

TRUEPHIN
04-11-2007, 08:52 PM
why man , why ???:confused:

I could ask the same of you. lol

I just don't get what people are seeing in him. I've seen him play a lot and thought he was solid but nothing special. I'm not impressed with what he has done in any of their big games. I also think Weis's system makes him look better than he actually is.

I do agree, though, that we need a franchise qb. Unfortuantely for us, this year is a very weak year for qbs in the draft imo. I wish Brohm would have declared because he is the real deal.

I'm not trying to be a smart*** or anything but what is it you see that makes you want us to draft him?

GCD960
04-11-2007, 09:06 PM
I dunno. I've never met "Phil Irwin" before in my life.



Everyone has their own particular draft day favorite. He's mine. I'm not sure how that necessarily is supposed to make my opinion somehow less valid. Nevertheless, it's naive at best and down right ridiculous at worst to suggest that Quinn is anything but Miami's prime target on draft day. The organization's been drooling over the kid for two years now.


Hey man, your handle name is almost like Phil Irwin AND you think the fins will draft Quinn???? i think something is up here, this has to be more than coincidence.

alan huber
04-11-2007, 09:41 PM
I could ask the same of you. lol

I just don't get what people are seeing in him. I've seen him play a lot and thought he was solid but nothing special. I'm not impressed with what he has done in any of their big games. I also think Weis's system makes him look better than he actually is.

I do agree, though, that we need a franchise qb. Unfortuantely for us, this year is a very weak year for qbs in the draft imo. I wish Brohm would have declared because he is the real deal.

I'm not trying to be a smart*** or anything but what is it you see that makes you want us to draft him?

well i belive he has all the tools you look for a QB the fact that he was coached by weis , to me is only a signal that the transformation from college to pro is not has hard has usually would be ...
i think he is very very smart . i belive he has all the fisical tools and more..
i really like his work habitts
i really feel that he is the long term answer

phinphanforever
04-11-2007, 09:51 PM
Everyone has their own particular draft day favorite. He's mine. I'm not sure how that necessarily is supposed to make my opinion somehow less valid. Nevertheless, it's naive at best and down right ridiculous at worst to suggest that Quinn is anything but Miami's prime target on draft day. The organization's been drooling over the kid for two years now.




It's this kind of smugness and self-righteousness that irritates me most about so many Quinn supporters. I have no problem with player evaluations or disagreement but I find it bizarre that so many of Quinn's supporters react in such a caustic manner the moment he is criticised.
I don't know how anyone can make a statement such as "it's naive at best and down right ridiculous at worst to suggest that Quinn is anything but Miami's prime target on draft day" unless they are part of that organisation and have been privy to draft discussions. NFL GMs are notorious for misinformation at this time of year. Quite frankly, it's amateurish at best, and down right ignorant at worst to think otherwise. To suggest that the organisation has been drooling over the kid is excessive. I would admit that there are many, including several on this site, that have been drooling over Quinn but I see no such evidence that the organisation has been doing so. Your argument is a classic case of displacement: you are presenting your bias as fact.
Again, I have no real problem if there are fans who want Quinn. I just disagree, and disagree strongly that we use a first on him.
We have been hearing that Brady Quinn is the saviour of the franchise, that he is the best Qb to come out in years, that he is cerebral, has intangibles that compare to the greats, on and on. There are, however, other more sobering opinions out there- which I tend to agree with- that talk of Quinn's inconsistency, of him being the product of a powerful hype machine in South Bend, of his innacuracies, of his inability to win big games, and of a cockiness that can be very off-putting to some.

BassFin
04-11-2007, 09:53 PM
For the record, Kim Jong Il is the supreme ruler of North Korea not South Korea :D

NJFINSFAN1
04-11-2007, 09:56 PM
Great read Phil, and I agree with you he is our #1 target.

ohiobryan
04-11-2007, 10:07 PM
hell ya phil brady quinn must be our number one target and our pick in round one even if it means moving up in the draft for him and thats most likely the case!

Dolfan32323
04-11-2007, 10:48 PM
For the record, Kim Jong Il is the supreme ruler of North Korea not South Korea :D
Yeah he knows. Read it again and you'll understand why he mentioned the South Koreans being fearful of Jong Il. It was a good read as always, Phil.

nyital571
04-11-2007, 10:59 PM
Hey Phunwin ,it's good to see someone from my hometown(Rochester) loving the dolphins like me and writing about them.Keep up the good work man!

Regan21286
04-11-2007, 11:32 PM
Good read. Great breakdown of the scenarios (unlike the game theory breakdowns my econ prof gives :tongue: ).

VT Dolphan
04-12-2007, 12:06 AM
For everyone opposed to drafting Quinn, let me remind you of something.

"________ takes the snap...drops back...looks left, fires and...it's intercepted! He's gonna take this one back to the house!"

You could insert Feidler, Feeley, Harrington, Culpepper, Lucas.... into that empty slot.

Quinn is easily the best decision maker and smartest QB in this draft. He very rarely forces throws or makes bad decisions. I would easily give up our 40th pick plus whatever Washington/Tampa/Anyone ahead of us wants in a trade up.

taylormvp99
04-12-2007, 01:25 AM
I think Miami is set if the Raiders take Calvin Johnson, which looks like more and more of a possibility everyday. This was a great article and gets me even more pumped up for the draft than I was before. April 28th can't get here fast enough.

pennPhinFan
04-12-2007, 03:04 AM
For everyone opposed to drafting Quinn, let me remind you of something.

"________ takes the snap...drops back...looks left, fires and...it's intercepted! He's gonna take this one back to the house!"

You could insert Feidler, Feeley, Harrington, Culpepper, Lucas.... into that empty slot.

Quinn is easily the best decision maker and smartest QB in this draft. He very rarely forces throws or makes bad decisions. I would easily give up our 40th pick plus whatever Washington/Tampa/Anyone ahead of us wants in a trade up.

except with harrington its more like "drops back.. looks left.. right.. left again.. now right... has happy feet..pressure coming.. dumps it off left.. intercepted!"
and with DC is "drops back.. stares at one target.. he's not open.. still not open.. sack!":D

I kid i kid... i still have some faith in DC, hope he gets healthy enough to give whatever QB we draft good competition in training camp

phinphanforever
04-12-2007, 08:25 AM
Good read. Great breakdown of the scenarios (unlike the game theory breakdowns my econ prof gives :tongue: ).
Actually, this is why I found the commentary so weak. The very arguments that Unwin uses to explain his scenarios fly in the face of the logic of his scenarios. It is faulty logic at its worst. It is difficult enough to follow any argument that contains ontological assumptions that one may find specious, however, in this case, the ver assumptions that Unwin uses at various points of the argument disapear (conveniently? magically?) at other points of the argument. For example, Unwin mentions that a team can do no harm to itself by drafting a talented QB regardless of the team's current QB position ("A surplus at QB isn’t like a surplus at, say, safety or guard") and yet he only applies this assumption to the Dolphins when picking. If Quinn is so great (the Messiah in some eyes) then wouldn't that mean it applies to all teams?
Again, the author presents scenarios in an attempt to talk about the likelihood of drafting Quinn, yet his strongest argument rests on the Dolphins FO's interest in Quinn, something that he interestingly only provides very little evidence to support. These scenarios only become believable (and even then, it is debatable) if Phil Unwin was the GM for the Miami Dolphins.
Again, I have no problem with Mocks, fantasy footbal etc. It is part of the fun of being a football fan. I do find it mildly annoying, sometimes humorous, however, when some of these pundits/fans present things in a way that is misleading, basing arguments on nothing more than speculation and wishfull thinking, and get their knickers in a twist when somebody calls them out.

Captain Lou
04-12-2007, 09:32 AM
Actually, this is why I found the commentary so weak. The very arguments that Unwin uses to explain his scenarios fly in the face of the logic of his scenarios. It is faulty logic at its worst. It is difficult enough to follow any argument that contains ontological assumptions that one may find specious, however, in this case, the ver assumptions that Unwin uses at various points of the argument disapear (conveniently? magically?) at other points of the argument. For example, Unwin mentions that a team can do no harm to itself by drafting a talented QB regardless of the team's current QB position ("A surplus at QB isn’t like a surplus at, say, safety or guard") and yet he only applies this assumption to the Dolphins when picking. If Quinn is so great (the Messiah in some eyes) then wouldn't that mean it applies to all teams?
Again, the author presents scenarios in an attempt to talk about the likelihood of drafting Quinn, yet his strongest argument rests on the Dolphins FO's interest in Quinn, something that he interestingly only provides very little evidence to support. These scenarios only become believable (and even then, it is debatable) if Phil Unwin was the GM for the Miami Dolphins.
Again, I have no problem with Mocks, fantasy footbal etc. It is part of the fun of being a football fan. I do find it mildly annoying, sometimes humorous, however, when some of these pundits/fans present things in a way that is misleading, basing arguments on nothing more than speculation and wishfull thinking, and get their knickers in a twist when somebody calls them out.


How dare you apply logic to an argument ! Finally somebody is arguing without the element of passion. A passionate argument tends be egnore the facts.

Pennington's Rocket Arm
04-12-2007, 09:34 AM
i agree with phirwin.

Regan21286
04-12-2007, 12:28 PM
Actually, this is why I found the commentary so weak. The very arguments that Unwin uses to explain his scenarios fly in the face of the logic of his scenarios. It is faulty logic at its worst. It is difficult enough to follow any argument that contains ontological assumptions that one may find specious, however, in this case, the ver assumptions that Unwin uses at various points of the argument disapear (conveniently? magically?) at other points of the argument. For example, Unwin mentions that a team can do no harm to itself by drafting a talented QB regardless of the team's current QB position ("A surplus at QB isn’t like a surplus at, say, safety or guard") and yet he only applies this assumption to the Dolphins when picking. If Quinn is so great (the Messiah in some eyes) then wouldn't that mean it applies to all teams?
Again, the author presents scenarios in an attempt to talk about the likelihood of drafting Quinn, yet his strongest argument rests on the Dolphins FO's interest in Quinn, something that he interestingly only provides very little evidence to support. These scenarios only become believable (and even then, it is debatable) if Phil Unwin was the GM for the Miami Dolphins.
Again, I have no problem with Mocks, fantasy footbal etc. It is part of the fun of being a football fan. I do find it mildly annoying, sometimes humorous, however, when some of these pundits/fans present things in a way that is misleading, basing arguments on nothing more than speculation and wishfull thinking, and get their knickers in a twist when somebody calls them out.

He doesn't need to provide all that evidence considering most people here know that Brady Quinn's been interviewed to a huge degree by Cam and did a very sharp workout for our FO. Not to mention our previous scouting of him last year.

BlueFin
04-12-2007, 02:39 PM
How dare you apply logic to an argument ! Finally somebody is arguing without the element of passion. A passionate argument tends be egnore the facts.

Thats a good one Cap'n Lou, coming from you....my insides are busting.............................................:sidelol: