PDA

View Full Version : Jake Long is the ONLY safe pick...



DOL-FAN92
01-31-2008, 05:56 PM
Hey you guys,I have been looking at EVERY thread and Dolphins related situations thats been posted,and I sumed it all up and I came up with 1 logical solution if trading our #1 overall pick falls through.In almost every postion need and explanation explained in recent threads,Offensive Line came up the most,next to Wide Reciver and Secondary.

Now,must posts say that we have our up and coming QuaterBack in John Beck,so we should waster ANOTHER draft pick on a QuaterBack.Which i agree on because there are more dier postions needed,and John Beck only had Booker(Lorenzo) to bail him out,which didnt happen often.

Running Back seems to be the only postion with depth,and most talented.Wide Reciever is a need,but cant be solved with the #1 pick overall,as there are no acceptable choices there.

Tight End is probably only of the most needed position on offense.I mean think about it,teams the go into the playoffs,SuperBowl or even Pro Bow(not important) have good Tight Ends.In free agency,theres no one who sticks out at me and make me say,"we gotta sign that guy".So,Tight End really needs to be adressed in THIS draft because the talent is running wild in it.We have the rezone threats,and thats mainly where the Tight End picks up the slack,the only Tight End I would keep is Justin Peele because he was the most sure-handed receiver(if you watched him this year you would see what Im talking about,very reliable),yet he isnt a #1 Tight End,but a solid #2,no doubt.

Offensive Line...............FINALLY,we actually played like we were TRYING to block someone.Unfortunately,when Brown(Ronnie) went down,they blocking regressed.The Offensive Line is the most important postion on Offense.Your QuaterBack is only as good as his Offensive Line,just go ask John Beck.If our line was consistant throughout,he would have played good games,even if we didnt win any,I would still be happy.So,with the in mind,our Line need re-shaping.Jake Long has experience with both positions at LT and RT.He is 6'7" 315 and can block well running the ball and pas block.Vernon Carey is 6'5" 330,he plays so much better on the right side,so we should leave him on the right,and put nJake on the left.Look at the QuaterBacks today...Tom Brady(QB) and his LT is Matt Light,Peyton Manning(QB) (when) he has Tony Ugoh,he was never touched,Carson Palmer(QB) has Lamarr Jones...and the list goes on and on...Jake Long is the poto-typical size,strength,and motor for the LT position as a LT.He would be able to contribute for us for years to come,from at least 10-15 years...Im just pointing it out,and i think Long is the best,safiest,and the smartest pick for us.....

Chris Long-doesnt have the speed to play coverage(when he does,better tackle with the first contact,or its a home run)

McFadden-we have Ronnie,Williams,Booker,Chatman(hope he re-signs),Gado(if he re-signs[i dont want him])

Matt Ryan-we have John Beck,a lot of people say the he is better than Beck when he first came out,but Matt couldnt even complete over 60% of his passes in his career

Glenn Dorsey-if we stay is a 3-4,he wont be a good fit,however,if we switch to 4-3,Miami would be sending him a contract before they draft him

Jake Long-we have.....uhh...ohh yea!!!we got....no.....hmmmm

the way i see it,Ronnie Brown will be having LaDainian Tomlinson season with this king of Line:

LT*Jake Long-6'7",315

LG*Chris Liwienski-6'5",320

C*Samson Satele-6'3",300

RG*L.J. Shelton-6'6",340

RT*Vernon Carey*6'5",330

Brown would run wild...at least seasons of over 1500+ yards,and over 10 TD's...John Beck,at least 3-5 seconds to get the ball out,and make a play

Ghetti13
01-31-2008, 06:00 PM
Jake Long is not going to play left tackle and is not going to get drafted as high as the media thinks. Just take him out of your equation.

In fact, both Otah and Clady should get drafted before he does.

zach8111
01-31-2008, 06:04 PM
jake is gonna be a franchise RTnot LT. you done draft a RT that high. id much rather take otah. you dont pay that much money (#1 money) to a RT.chris long is the best pick for us if we dont trade down

Ghetti13
01-31-2008, 06:06 PM
I disagree. Dorsey is the pick, not Chris Long.

Guys like Chris Long come out a lot more frequently than guys like Glenn Dorsey.

He is a game changer at a position where game changers are few and far between. He can do it all.

The Confessor
01-31-2008, 06:06 PM
Only "Safe" pick? IS he wearing a condom or something?....just asking???

The Confessor
01-31-2008, 06:08 PM
Oh yeah, and BTW: He is gonna be a Right Tackle not a Left Tackle in the Pros :up:

DOL-FAN92
01-31-2008, 06:08 PM
Only "Safe" pick? IS he wearing a condom or something?....just asking???

wow....i think you have been:beer1:

zach8111
01-31-2008, 06:09 PM
I disagree. Dorsey is the pick, not Chris Long.

Guys like Chris Long come out a lot more frequently than guys like Glenn Dorsey.

He is a game changer at a position where game changers are few and far between. He can do it all.

dorsey just doesnt fit our D as good as chris long, i'd love to get pat sims with our #33 pick. he is a NT.

Roman529
01-31-2008, 06:10 PM
Only "Safe" pick? IS he wearing a condom or something?....just asking???

Yeah this is football.....who wants to play it SAFE??? :shakeno:

I think our pick is either Chris Long or Ellis....both of these guys are going to be starters for a long time no matter where they go. Dorsey is ok, but I think he isn't the best fit for our Defense. I still hope we can trade down...to me that's the best option. :up:

Stitches
01-31-2008, 06:13 PM
I'm sure Jake will get a chance at LT, but I think he will wind up on the right like Leonard Davis did.

The Confessor
01-31-2008, 06:15 PM
dorsey just doesnt fit our D as good as chris long, i'd love to get pat sims with our #33 pick. he is a NT.


And I understand that. IF we pick Chris Long, we WILL pick up a huge NT or MLB.

But I question you, what exactly IS our defense? Cause if you are talking about any assemblabce of that unit we through out on the field last year, we are in for another VERY long season...

Boomer
01-31-2008, 06:16 PM
Not sure anyone comes to the conclusion that Jake Long is a safe pick.

Majpain
01-31-2008, 06:18 PM
I don't think there is a safe pick at Number 1.

Fingers
01-31-2008, 06:27 PM
There are no safe picks. However, the closest thing to one is C. Long not Jake Long. Chris Long will be a formidable starter if not pro bowl type player for years to come as a pass rusher - a premium position. If J. Long truly can't cut it as a LT, then he may be a safe pick, but not at the #1 spot where a premium position (QB, Pass Rusher, LT) needs to be filled.

zach8111
01-31-2008, 06:27 PM
And I understand that. IF we pick Chris Long, we WILL pick up a huge NT or MLB.

But I question you, what exactly IS our defense? Cause if you are talking about any assemblabce of that unit we through out on the field last year, we are in for another VERY long season...
in my perfect world our D would look like this... (and this is without FA)
DE-Marcus Spear (Dallas Trade for #1 pick)
NT-Pat Sims (#28 Pick)
DE-Jason Jones (4th round pick)
OLB-Jason Taylor
ILB-Beau Bell (3rd round)
ILB-Zach Thomas (or Channing Crowder)
OLB-Joey Porter
CB-Antoine Cason (#32 pick)
CB-Will Allen
FS-Jason Allen
SS-Yeremiah Bell

If we dont trade for Chad we would have another 2nd rounder for maybe another LB to replace ZT or WR (most likely)

The Confessor
01-31-2008, 06:31 PM
in my perfect world our D would look like this... (and this is without FA)
DE-Marcus Spear (Dallas Trade for #1 pick)
NT-Pat Sims (#28 Pick)
DE-Jason Jones (4th round pick)
OLB-Jason Taylor
ILB-Beau Bell (3rd round)
ILB-Zach Thomas (or Channing Crowder)
OLB-Joey Porter
CB-Antoine Cason (#32 pick)
CB-Will Allen
FS-Jason Allen
SS-Yeremiah Bell

If we dont trade for Chad we would have another 2nd rounder for maybe another LB to replace ZT or WR (most likely)

And once again, Cason is a HUGE downgrade from anybody we lined up in the DBackfield this year...

Aside from that not bad and a definate upgrade:up:

jim1
01-31-2008, 06:35 PM
Oh yeah, and BTW: He is gonna be a Right Tackle not a Left Tackle in the Pros :up:

From NFLDC, maybe the guy does play LT in the pros:

Scott Wright's Top 32 Prospects for the 2008 NFL DraftPlayerClassPositionSchool

1. Darren McFadden JR RB ArkansasElite talent who is destined to become one of the league's top rushers.
2. Glenn Dorsey SR DT L.S.U.Simply one of the best defensive tackle prospects we've seen in years.
3. Jake Long SR OT Michigan A left tackle who is not quite Joe Thomas but is better than Levi Brown.
4. Chris Long SR DE VirginiaTechnician who plays the run and pass and has an unparalleled motor.
5. Sedrick Ellis SR DT USC Prototypical 3-technique who can rush the passer and defend the run.
6. Jonathan Stewart JR RB OregonAn impact runner with a truly rare blend of size, speed and athleticism.
7. Vernon Gholston JR DE Ohio St. Versatile pass rusher extraordinaire and also a rare physical specimen.
8. Kenny Phillips JR S Miami (FL)Fantastic athlete and the next in a long line of elite Hurricane safeties.
9. Matt Ryan SR QB Boston CollegeOff the charts intangibles and physical tools are more than adequate.
10. Ryan Clady JR OT Boise St.You won't find many guys this size with such good feet and athleticism

Stitches
01-31-2008, 06:42 PM
From NFLDC, maybe the guy does play LT in the pros:

Scott Wright's Top 32 Prospects for the 2008 NFL DraftPlayerClassPositionSchool

1. Darren McFadden JR RB ArkansasElite talent who is destined to become one of the league's top rushers.
2. Glenn Dorsey SR DT L.S.U.Simply one of the best defensive tackle prospects we've seen in years.
3. Jake Long SR OT Michigan A left tackle who is not quite Joe Thomas but is better than Levi Brown.
4. Chris Long SR DE VirginiaTechnician who plays the run and pass and has an unparalleled motor.
5. Sedrick Ellis SR DT USC Prototypical 3-technique who can rush the passer and defend the run.
6. Jonathan Stewart JR RB OregonAn impact runner with a truly rare blend of size, speed and athleticism.
7. Vernon Gholston JR DE Ohio St. Versatile pass rusher extraordinaire and also a rare physical specimen.
8. Kenny Phillips JR S Miami (FL)Fantastic athlete and the next in a long line of elite Hurricane safeties.
9. Matt Ryan SR QB Boston CollegeOff the charts intangibles and physical tools are more than adequate.
10. Ryan Clady JR OT Boise St.You won't find many guys this size with such good feet and athleticism


A lot of people thought Brown would be a RT IIRC.

2413fanphins
01-31-2008, 06:54 PM
I'm not convinced jake long WON'T play LT.

Theres always room to improve, but I don't see why so many people are already writing him off as a RT for sure.

and as far as CB's go, if it isn't talib at this point, I don't want one.

DRC is getting some hype, and looked DAMN good in the senior bowl, but I wanna see some more b4 getting overly excited, he sure is showing some promise though.

The Confessor
01-31-2008, 06:55 PM
From NFLDC, maybe the guy does play LT in the pros:

Scott Wright's Top 32 Prospects for the 2008 NFL DraftPlayerClassPositionSchool

1. Darren McFadden JR RB ArkansasElite talent who is destined to become one of the league's top rushers.
2. Glenn Dorsey SR DT L.S.U.Simply one of the best defensive tackle prospects we've seen in years.
3. Jake Long SR OT Michigan A left tackle who is not quite Joe Thomas but is better than Levi Brown.
4. Chris Long SR DE VirginiaTechnician who plays the run and pass and has an unparalleled motor.
5. Sedrick Ellis SR DT USC Prototypical 3-technique who can rush the passer and defend the run.
6. Jonathan Stewart JR RB OregonAn impact runner with a truly rare blend of size, speed and athleticism.
7. Vernon Gholston JR DE Ohio St. Versatile pass rusher extraordinaire and also a rare physical specimen.
8. Kenny Phillips JR S Miami (FL)Fantastic athlete and the next in a long line of elite Hurricane safeties.
9. Matt Ryan SR QB Boston CollegeOff the charts intangibles and physical tools are more than adequate.
10. Ryan Clady JR OT Boise St.You won't find many guys this size with such good feet and athleticism


And I respect Scott Wrights opinion.

What I have seen in Jake Long is a guy who is tremendously strong, and has a bit of a mean streak. Good size and some athleticism
What I have also seen is a guy VERY slow to move his feet and who lacks the instinct to help out on schemes. A good speed rushing in the NFL will have a field day on him IMO.

Having a guy like that on your team means two things

Run behind him where he dominates at the initial point of contact (Right Tackle)
Dont let him cover your QB's backside (Left Tackle) cause that is gonna get your QB absolutely KILLED...


JMO though...I dont think I stand alone in that opinion either:up:


EDIT: Also, in regards to that list. I DONT think McFadden will either be the first player chosen (Perhaps not the top RB) and I also dont think he is an ELITE player. Of course only time will tell, but I was saying the EXACT same thing about Reggie Bush:up:

jim1
01-31-2008, 07:09 PM
And I respect Scott Wrights opinion.

What I have seen in Jake Long is a guy who is tremendously strong, and has a bit of a mean streak. Good size and some athleticism
What I have also seen is a guy VERY slow to move his feet and who lacks the instinct to help out on schemes. A good speed rushing in the NFL will have a field day on him IMO.

Having a guy like that on your team means two things

Run behind him where he dominates at the initial point of contact (Right Tackle)
Dont let him cover your QB's backside (Left Tackle) cause that is gonna get your QB absolutely KILLED...


JMO though...I dont think I stand alone in that opinion either:up:


EDIT: Also, in regards to that list. I DONT think McFadden will either be the first player chosen (Perhaps not the top RB) and I also dont think he is an ELITE player. Of course only time will tell, but I was saying the EXACT same thing about Reggie Bush:up:

I'm ok with Jake Long as a dominating RT. I'm also ok with Cherilius, Nicks, Collins and Baker at Tackle, that's the dilemma. But if we picked J Long and he pounded on Dlinemen for 10-15 years at a Pro Bowl level, good for us. It's time to solidify the OL, and Jake Long can help do that. Too many question marks, time to solve the problem.

Aqua4Ever04
01-31-2008, 07:11 PM
Ugh, this would send me off the deep end if it was our pick.

jim1
01-31-2008, 08:25 PM
Ugh, this would send me off the deep end if it was our pick.

My preference is to trade down. All I'm saying is that taking J Long wouldn't bother me, nor would McFadden- but why open up that can of worms. I haven't seen Chris Long play, but my guess- Dorsey. Disruptive, dominating DL. Nice fit, as J Long would be in my book, but there will be a darned good tackle waiting for us in Rd. 2.

Maybe Thomas DeCloud and Heath Benedict in rds 3 and 4.

PerfectTeam
01-31-2008, 08:47 PM
dorsey just doesnt fit our D as good as chris long, i'd love to get pat sims with our #33 pick. he is a NT.

dorsey is as much a NT as sims is and maybe better. dorsey offers alot of versatility along the line. sims i dont think does.

Aqua4Ever04
01-31-2008, 08:51 PM
My preference is to trade down. All I'm saying is that taking J Long wouldn't bother me, nor would McFadden- but why open up that can of worms. I haven't seen Chris Long play, but my guess- Dorsey. Disruptive, dominating DL. Nice fit, as J Long would be in my book, but there will be a darned good tackle waiting for us in Rd. 2.

Maybe Thomas DeCloud and Heath Benedict in rds 3 and 4.

I'm going to put this out there right now. I will hate the Parcells/Ireland/Sparano regime if we take McFadden or Jake Long. That said, I don't think Parcells is dumb enough to do so, he always drafts defense and particularly defensive line. The beautiful coincidence for us is that the two best players in the draft are defensive linemen.

The Confessor
01-31-2008, 08:53 PM
I'm ok with Jake Long as a dominating RT. I'm also ok with Cherilius, Nicks, Collins and Baker at Tackle, that's the dilemma. But if we picked J Long and he pounded on Dlinemen for 10-15 years at a Pro Bowl level, good for us. It's time to solidify the OL, and Jake Long can help do that. Too many question marks, time to solve the problem.


I absolutely agree, and if we werent in such bad shape,and having the#1 overall, Jake Long would be a GREAT PICK. I easily see him being a perrenial Pro-Bowl RIght Tackle..but the same thing has been said about MANY O-Lineman

Crowda
01-31-2008, 09:15 PM
I remember when Robert Gallery was the "safe pick"

The Confessor
01-31-2008, 09:20 PM
I remember when Robert Gallery was the "safe pick"

Yeah, he was at the top of my arguement list..along with Tony Mandarich:up:

Aqua4Ever04
01-31-2008, 09:21 PM
And once again, Cason is a HUGE downgrade from anybody we lined up in the DBackfield this year...

Aside from that not bad and a definate upgrade:up:

You know you're wrong! :shakeno:

VaFinFan
01-31-2008, 09:36 PM
Im just interested in why you guys arent thinking about Dorsey as a 3-4 DE. He has an excellent motor and plays with an aggressive tendancy. Everyone keeps saying he isnt fit for a 3-4 DT and your right. However Parcells, Ireland and Sparano are looking for best overal talent. There is no rule that says you draft a player and he stays at that same position in the pros. Dorsey is a run stopper and takes up a lot of space on the DE spot. We are going to be blitzing with our LBs Taylor and Porter next year not worrying about our DE making a crap load of sacks. Dorsey will take up both the gaurd and tackle on many plays leaving the outside pressure open. I also think this kid will be able to get up field and force the QB up or out of the pocket. If we dont shop the pick the Dolphins will take Dorsey and put him were he fits in there 3-4 defense at defensive end. I dont think you should limit a guy on his position. The combine is there to show players skills so they can fit in where needed on the team they are selected by. Dorsey and Roth will be our starting DE's next year if we keep the first pick and we will pick up big run stuffing hog to man the middle of our line in the later rounds. Like the kid from Auburn in the fourth or fifth!

sceeto
02-01-2008, 01:06 AM
I remember when Robert Gallery was the "safe pick"

Ha! Ha!... It amazes me what happened to that guy. I used to dream of us picking him up some how. I thought there is no way this guy could be a bust. Oops! on that one.

Boomer
02-01-2008, 09:17 AM
And once again, Cason is a HUGE downgrade from anybody we lined up in the DBackfield this year...

Aside from that not bad and a definate upgrade:up:

You clearly haven't seen a great deal of Antoine Cason then.

The Confessor
02-01-2008, 09:20 AM
You clearly haven't seen a great deal of Antoine Cason then.

Yeah, I guess I went a bit overboard on this one :lol:

I did make a handfull of his games this year though:up:

Boomer
02-01-2008, 09:43 AM
;)

It would be boring if we all thought the same, but Cason is going to be a very good player. He has the right mentality and character that Ireland is looking for, the same ballhawk tendancies that Bowles likes and if he can run well in Indianapolis and shake off that last feeling I have that he might be better suited to cover 2, then he has to be a legitimate pick 32 target.

The Confessor
02-01-2008, 09:48 AM
;)

It would be boring if we all thought the same, but Cason is going to be a very good player. He has the right mentality and character that Ireland is looking for, the same ballhawk tendancies that Bowles likes and if he can run well in Indianapolis and shake off that last feeling I have that he might be better suited to cover 2, then he has to be a legitimate pick 32 target.

And as always, I respect your insight-immensely. But I think he will really have a tough time at the next level.
The only opportunity for him WOULD be a true Cover-2 defense where he doesnt have to spend too much time being manhandled.

As I eluded to, he is an incredible athlete, and a real gamer. Never ever saw him shy away from contact, but I also saw guys run through his tackles.

jim1
02-01-2008, 10:03 AM
;)

It would be boring if we all thought the same, but Cason is going to be a very good player. He has the right mentality and character that Ireland is looking for, the same ballhawk tendancies that Bowles likes and if he can run well in Indianapolis and shake off that last feeling I have that he might be better suited to cover 2, then he has to be a legitimate pick 32 target.

Boomer, curious as to what you think of S Thomas DeCloud and CB Zenon from LSU. If Justin King slips, maybe he'll be a good pickup. 6th-7th rds- 2 guys who I like there are Marcus Monk and that CB from Wisconsin who popped his ACL. Pick him up on the cheap and hopefully have a steal like Cromartie from SD.

Itsdahumidity
02-01-2008, 11:12 AM
.....Chris Long-doesnt have the speed to play coverage(when he does,better tackle with the first contact,or its a home run)

I don't even know where to begin w/ my disagreement with this statement.

C. Long can and most likely will play (the majority of his time) at OLB in a NFL 3-4 defense. OLBs in the 3-4 make their money moving forward not backwards. They are not 4-3 backers. And when C. Long is called into coverage it will be zone responsibilities for the most part. The kid had 14 sacks, has long arms and something you can't coach, a non-stop motor. I would select him over J. Long 10 out of 10 times.

MrTree
02-01-2008, 11:18 AM
I would select him over J. Long 10 out of 10 times.


And twice on Sundays! Chris Long would be a major difference maker for this team. Not only is he a better talent than Jake IMO, but I also think we would do a better job at maximizing his talents.

Boomer
02-01-2008, 11:40 AM
And as always, I respect your insight-immensely. But I think he will really have a tough time at the next level.
The only opportunity for him WOULD be a true Cover-2 defense where he doesnt have to spend too much time being manhandled.

As I eluded to, he is an incredible athlete, and a real gamer. Never ever saw him shy away from contact, but I also saw guys run through his tackles.


I think he's tall and rangy and whilst I think he needs to add some weight and get up around 190, he reminds me of Asante Samuel in the way he plays and his reading of the game. 46 starts and an absolutely great kid off the field; he already has a foundation called Cason Cares and donates money to cancer charities, etc.

I think he plays faster than he times. I wouldn't be surprised to see him run a 4.50, but that will play into Miami's hands, if that's the direction they go.

Enforcerfin33
02-01-2008, 11:43 AM
I tend to worry that Jake Long is going to be this yrs. Robert Gallery.

2413fanphins
02-01-2008, 02:51 PM
so break it down for me boomer...


cason vs.. talib... vs... DRC....

I have thought for awhile that talib is the top CB, with cason next, but DRC is going to surprise people. He might just be knocking on that door before it's all said and done. It's only one game, but after the senior bowl, he was one of five players that I couldn't stop thinking about.

MrTree
02-01-2008, 02:53 PM
so break it down for me boomer...


cason vs.. talib... vs... DRC....

I have thought for awhile that talib is the top CB, with cason next, but DRC is going to surprise people. He might just be knocking on that door before it's all said and done. It's only one game, but after the senior bowl, he was one of five players that I couldn't stop thinking about.


DRC! DRC! He's the man for this team. I will do a dance if we take him at 32.

jim1
02-01-2008, 03:05 PM
1. Miami Dolphins - Long, Jake, OT Michigan (http://www.fantasyfootballjungle.com/nfl_draft_prospect/Jake_Long/782)
The Tuna will carry the biggest stick when it comes to which players are acquired for the Dolphins. Since he basically invented the "Planet Theory" (There are only so many big, strong, athletic guys on the planet, so when you find one in the draft take him) I'm sure he won't mind taking an OT with the first overall pick. C. Long is a possibility, but Parcells has historically prefered bigger DE's in his 3-4 (usually college DT's), so we'll wait and see how C. Long does in his workouts to see if he weighs in closer to 300 lbs. That also opens the debate for G. Dorsey, but he isn't worth the 1st pick until he proves in workouts that he is the same player he was before last season's injury. Players will shift positions a lot in my draft between now and late April, but J. Long won't fall out of my top five. There isn't a player available this year who is in a league of his own, but I think J. Long is the best player available. I love the aggresive attitude he plays with with. When I watch him play he doesn't just prevent his guy from reaching whoever has the ball; he dominates him. He always holds his ground on pass D and pushes guys all over field on running plays. V. Carey has not been the answer since he was drafted in '04 and should be moved back to RT or OG. J. Long is the first step in righting this team's offensive mess.

http://www.fantasyfootballjungle.com/2008_nfl_mock_draft/Bryan_Pinkston/501/1a

MrTree
02-01-2008, 03:09 PM
1. Miami Dolphins - Long, Jake, OT Michigan (http://www.fantasyfootballjungle.com/nfl_draft_prospect/Jake_Long/782)
The Tuna will carry the biggest stick when it comes to which players are acquired for the Dolphins. Since he basically invented the "Planet Theory" (There are only so many big, strong, athletic guys on the planet, so when you find one in the draft take him) I'm sure he won't mind taking an OT with the first overall pick. C. Long is a possibility, but Parcells has historically prefered bigger DE's in his 3-4 (usually college DT's), so we'll wait and see how C. Long does in his workouts to see if he weighs in closer to 300 lbs. That also opens the debate for G. Dorsey, but he isn't worth the 1st pick until he proves in workouts that he is the same player he was before last season's injury. Players will shift positions a lot in my draft between now and late April, but J. Long won't fall out of my top five. There isn't a player available this year who is in a league of his own, but I think J. Long is the best player available. I love the aggresive attitude he plays with with. When I watch him play he doesn't just prevent his guy from reaching whoever has the ball; he dominates him. He always holds his ground on pass D and pushes guys all over field on running plays. V. Carey has not been the answer since he was drafted in '04 and should be moved back to RT or OG. J. Long is the first step in righting this team's offensive mess.


http://www.fantasyfootballjungle.com/2008_nfl_mock_draft/Bryan_Pinkston/501/1a


Hey look another mock that has us making a bad pick!

Boomer
02-01-2008, 03:12 PM
so break it down for me boomer...


cason vs.. talib... vs... DRC....

I have thought for awhile that talib is the top CB, with cason next, but DRC is going to surprise people. He might just be knocking on that door before it's all said and done. It's only one game, but after the senior bowl, he was one of five players that I couldn't stop thinking about.


Talib is a cover 2 corner, who hasn't got the pace to play man. But he's a great playmaker in the right system. Cason could add some meat to that frame, is an excellent cover guy who reads the play very well and is very instinctive. Rodgers-Cromartie I've seen once, but his athletic ability absolutely stands out and in terms of the nuances of playing CB; hips, change of direction at speed, gear down ability, he has it all. He's not Antoine Winfield when it comes to playing the run though.

2413fanphins
02-01-2008, 03:51 PM
why do you say talib couldn't be our shutdown corner, I think he could definately excell in man situations, especially with the right coaching.

from watching him at kansas, I think it's not a long shot, and most of what I have read on him people have said that he has established himself as one of the best cover corners in the nation, and could absolutely be a shutdown corner.

I have a little tendancy to believe he could also play safety as well, and I would want a CB, not a S.

Enforcerfin33
02-01-2008, 04:00 PM
why do you say talib couldn't be our shutdown corner, I think he could definately excell in man situations, especially with the right coaching.

from watching him at kansas, I think it's not a long shot, and most of what I have read on him people have said that he has established himself as one of the best cover corners in the nation, and could absolutely be a shutdown corner.

I have a little tendancy to believe he could also play safety as well, and I would want a CB, not a S.

Agreed....quality corners seem harder to come by then safeties. Speaking of which is Roy Williams a FA after this yr?

Nappy Roots
02-01-2008, 04:01 PM
Agreed....quality corners seem harder to come by then safeties. Speaking of which is Roy Williams a FA after this yr?


why are we looking for LBs?

Enforcerfin33
02-01-2008, 04:03 PM
why are we looking for LBs?
:err:

Boomer
02-01-2008, 05:17 PM
why do you say talib couldn't be our shutdown corner, I think he could definately excell in man situations, especially with the right coaching.

from watching him at kansas, I think it's not a long shot, and most of what I have read on him people have said that he has established himself as one of the best cover corners in the nation, and could absolutely be a shutdown corner.

I have a little tendancy to believe he could also play safety as well, and I would want a CB, not a S.

Because he isn't quick enough to play cover corner on an island. It doesn't suit his game. Watch him against Kansas State and tell me that's an NFL press corner covering Jordy Nelson.

I don't see anyone saying he could be a shut down CB in anything other than a system set up where he works best which is when he's using his outstanding instincts. I've spoken to someone who works within the Kansas organisation who says that Talib is one of the three fastest players on the team.

If that's true, then it's either a slow team or Talib doesn't play fast. With his skill set, he could be very good in a C2.

As far as safety, he isn't overly physical, although his ball skills work in his favour in that respect.

Boomer
02-01-2008, 05:18 PM
Agreed....quality corners seem harder to come by then safeties. Speaking of which is Roy Williams a FA after this yr?

I have no idea why you'd want Roy Williams on your team.

Enforcerfin33
02-01-2008, 05:20 PM
I have no idea why you'd want Roy Williams on your team.
Why not? Sure he does a "Roy" tackle every now and then...but he's solid.

PerfectTeam
02-01-2008, 05:33 PM
Why not? Sure he does a "Roy" tackle every now and then...but he's solid.

he gets burnt solidly every time in coverage. he has to play close to the LOS because every time i see him in coverage the receiver blows by him everytime.

Boomer
02-01-2008, 05:41 PM
Why not? Sure he does a "Roy" tackle every now and then...but he's solid.

Because he's an absolute liability in coverage.

The Confessor
02-01-2008, 05:45 PM
Ummmm.....Isnt Roy Williams a WR? You guys REALLY lost me on this one????

2413fanphins
02-01-2008, 05:45 PM
talib is said to run the 40 in the 4.5 range. I don't know for sure who would consider that slow. I think he plays faster on the field than off, a good example would be the orange bowl, I thought he played outstanding in that game.

2413fanphins
02-01-2008, 05:46 PM
the only roy williams I would take on this team is the one from detroit.

I hate roy williams.... dallas version.

Enforcerfin33
02-01-2008, 05:47 PM
Ummmm.....Isnt Roy Williams a WR? You guys REALLY lost me on this one????
not that one....the cowboy.

The Confessor
02-01-2008, 05:51 PM
not that one....the cowboy.


ROFLAMOUA....

Rolling
On
Floor
Laughing
At
My
Own
Ugly
***


Sorry for being sooo dum folks. I think its the moon or something...

Yeah, I wouldnt touch Roy "Let me yank you down from behind" Williams either...
Although, regardless of them creating a rule in his honor, he really is a VERY stand up guy...

But yeah, no thanks

Boomer
02-01-2008, 06:00 PM
talib is said to run the 40 in the 4.5 range. I don't know for sure who would consider that slow. I think he plays faster on the field than off, a good example would be the orange bowl, I thought he played outstanding in that game.

Well, we'll see.

Nappy Roots
02-01-2008, 06:26 PM
he gets burnt solidly every time in coverage. he has to play close to the LOS because every time i see him in coverage the receiver blows by him everytime.


exactly what i meant by him being a LB. hes not a safety. he plays LB.

Xeticus
02-01-2008, 07:36 PM
1. Miami Dolphins - Long, Jake, OT Michigan (http://www.fantasyfootballjungle.com/nfl_draft_prospect/Jake_Long/782)
The Tuna will carry the biggest stick when it comes to which players are acquired for the Dolphins. Since he basically invented the "Planet Theory" (There are only so many big, strong, athletic guys on the planet, so when you find one in the draft take him) I'm sure he won't mind taking an OT with the first overall pick. C. Long is a possibility, but Parcells has historically prefered bigger DE's in his 3-4 (usually college DT's), so we'll wait and see how C. Long does in his workouts to see if he weighs in closer to 300 lbs. That also opens the debate for G. Dorsey, but he isn't worth the 1st pick until he proves in workouts that he is the same player he was before last season's injury. Players will shift positions a lot in my draft between now and late April, but J. Long won't fall out of my top five. There isn't a player available this year who is in a league of his own, but I think J. Long is the best player available. I love the aggresive attitude he plays with with. When I watch him play he doesn't just prevent his guy from reaching whoever has the ball; he dominates him. He always holds his ground on pass D and pushes guys all over field on running plays. V. Carey has not been the answer since he was drafted in '04 and should be moved back to RT or OG. J. Long is the first step in righting this team's offensive mess.

http://www.fantasyfootballjungle.com/2008_nfl_mock_draft/Bryan_Pinkston/501/1a
I would love for us to get Jake Long. The fact that we didn't get a LT last year really, really irritated me. Heck I wanted us to draft Joe Staley with the #9 overall pick last year even though people said he was a reach at that pick. Good LT's are really hard to come by. You can't usually get them in FA as they don't come available all that often. LT is like star QB or CB. When you get an elite level player available to you at that position take him. You might not get that chance again for a decade.

The Confessor
02-01-2008, 07:41 PM
I would love for us to get Jake Long. The fact that we didn't get a LT last year really, really irritated me. Heck I wanted us to draft Joe Staley with the #9 overall pick last year even though people said he was a reach at that pick. Good LT's are really hard to come by. You can't usually get them in FA as they don't come available all that often. LT is like star QB or CB. When you get an elite level player available to you at that position take him. You might not get that chance again for a decade.

Yeah, and IF Jake Long projected as a Left Tackle we would be in good shape taking him :up:

cnc66
02-01-2008, 07:45 PM
ROFLAMOUA....

Rolling
On
Floor
Laughing
At
My
Own
Ugly
***


Sorry for being sooo dum folks. I think its the moon or something...

Yeah, I wouldnt touch Roy "Let me yank you down from behind" Williams either...
Although, regardless of them creating a rule in his honor, he really is a VERY stand up guy...

But yeah, no thanks

http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2008/02/wolfman-1.jpg

2413fanphins
02-01-2008, 09:49 PM
it remains to be seen whether or not jake long will be a LT or RT... as you can see everyone and there dog on these boards already has him as a bust, and at the very least a failure at LT.

mxkawi1
02-01-2008, 10:28 PM
draft Long + sign Faneca = A very good line


Lets say he isn't a LT and Carey is better.
LT - Carey
LG - Faneca
C - Satele
RG -whoever Sparano feels is the best(Don't sign Hadnot)
LT - Long

I wouldn't care if Faneca is the only FA we sign. We need him.

We wouldn't have to worry about the line for a few years.

miamitd13
02-02-2008, 01:05 AM
My question is this and it's not meant to refute anyone's belief here. I really am just curious.

It seems that this is the only place that has a problem projecting Jake Long as anything but a Left Tackle. I've seen where there is talk of his slide step/technique (or lack thereof) - but I haven't read anything about the need for him to switch to the right side from any of the other so called "experts" and/or draft pundits.

My only time watching him play was against Florida in this year's bowl game and to me he looked pretty darn dominating.

How certain are we that he can't play the left side?

mxkawi1
02-02-2008, 01:20 AM
My question is this and it's not meant to refute anyone's belief here. I really am just curious.

It seems that this is the only place that has a problem projecting Jake Long as anything but a Left Tackle. I've seen where there is talk of his slide step/technique (or lack thereof) - but I haven't read anything about the need for him to switch to the right side from any of the other so called "experts" and/or draft pundits.

My only time watching him play was against Florida in this year's bowl game and to me he looked pretty darn dominating.

How certain are we that he can't play the left side?
We aren't. We won't know until he is on the field. I don't know where the experts around here get there info from. But, it doesn't really matter. If he isn't good enough, put him on the right side. Carey is fine on the left side. I'm sure Sparano could figure out who is better on what side.

#1dolphinsfan
02-02-2008, 02:29 AM
there is no SAFE PICK in the NFL draft u never know who is going to be good most people look at who is the best player in college at a postion they need and if he is supposed to be a #1 pick we would probly take him thats what i liked about Cam i am glad we didnt take Quinn i think ginn will be a much better player if we can get someone in there to get him the ball

Boomer
02-02-2008, 09:51 AM
We aren't. We won't know until he is on the field. I don't know where the experts around here get there info from. But, it doesn't really matter. If he isn't good enough, put him on the right side. Carey is fine on the left side. I'm sure Sparano could figure out who is better on what side.


If you're using the 1st pick in the draft on him, you better be sure he's a left tackle.

Alex44
02-02-2008, 10:02 AM
there is no SAFE PICK in the NFL draft u never know who is going to be good most people look at who is the best player in college at a postion they need and if he is supposed to be a #1 pick we would probly take him thats what i liked about Cam i am glad we didnt take Quinn i think ginn will be a much better player if we can get someone in there to get him the ball

Agreed.

Plus for every Joe Thomas at LT in the draft you can easy end up with a Robert Gallery.

CD13
02-02-2008, 10:42 AM
Because he's an absolute liability in coverage.

My brother is a Cowboys fan and despises Williams, he is terrible according to him. Overrated.

2413fanphins
02-02-2008, 12:07 PM
If you're using the 1st pick in the draft on him, you better be sure he's a left tackle.



I don't think I would take him at #1 overall, but perhaps if we traded down to somehwere in the 4-10 range, I would certainly consider it.

jim1
02-02-2008, 12:09 PM
http://www.finheaven.com/clear.gif


I feel sorry for #18
Dude is a beast
or a freaking Kurgan

http://www.finheaven.com/clear.gif (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Kurgan1-1-armor.jpg)

alen1
02-02-2008, 01:28 PM
achoooo! sorry im alergic to bull****....... jake long safe pick blehh.

jim1
02-02-2008, 02:06 PM
achoooo! sorry im alergic to bull****....... jake long safe pick blehh.

God bless you. Or not.

2413fanphins
02-02-2008, 07:00 PM
just looking at that pic in the sig a few posts ago.

what a freak. damn that dude is just humungous.

is that pic touched up?

Alex44
02-02-2008, 07:36 PM
http://www.finheaven.com/clear.gif

Caption: Thou Shall Not Pass!

The Confessor
02-02-2008, 08:01 PM
I don't think I would take him at #1 overall, but perhaps if we traded down to somehwere in the 4-10 range, I would certainly consider it.

IF we could trade down to about 6-10 and pick up a couple of more first day picks... I would be ALL over getting Jake Long. Ronnie could run behind that guy all day long...

MexDolfan
02-02-2008, 09:40 PM
IF we could trade down to about 6-10 and pick up a couple of more first day picks... I would be ALL over getting Jake Long. Ronnie could run behind that guy all day long...
No matter how crazy trades can come on draft day, but there's no way Jake Long can be there at 6-10 ...
I mean, he's on the top five of every rational draft board.
So please stop smoking that thing :bong2:

The Confessor
02-02-2008, 09:47 PM
No matter how crazy trades can come on draft day, but there's no way Jake Long can be there at 6-10 ...
I mean, he's on the top five of every rational draft board.
So please stop smoking that thing :bong2:


Yeah, well so are

Glenn Dorsey
Chris Long
Sedrick Ellis
Darren McFadden
Matt Ryan
Vernon Gholston
Ryan Clady


Let me know how many in the top 5 you have there then come on back and talk :up:

rdhstlr23
02-02-2008, 10:57 PM
I'd like Jake Long, but only if it was in the mid 1st round (if we got the 5th pick from the Chiefs I'd do it). However, Jake Long is probably #1 on their draft board.

Again, I think Glenn Dorsey or Chris Long are the best players in the draft. I don't see what's wrong with keeping the pick and taking one of those players.

2413fanphins
02-03-2008, 12:02 AM
right now I would bet a lot of money jake long doesn't make it past #4.

I just don't see it happening. WE have to be SUPER in love with a guy to keep the 1st pick, because if we trade down, imo...it's gonna be in the twenties somewhere.

but we will get multiple picks in return. so that would be a huge plus.

jim1
02-03-2008, 09:40 AM
Jake Long Scouting Report


Position:OL (http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/2008/profiles.cfm?pos=OL) School & Year/Status:Michigan (http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profiles_by_team.cfm?school=Michigan) - SeniorHeight & Weight:6'7 - 315 lbs.Ranked #4 on our Top 100 Prospects Board (http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/2008/top100.cfm)


2008 NFL Draft Prospect - Scouting Report
Jake Long of Michigan, despite a poor showing in the season finale against Ohio State, is without a doubt the top offensive lineman in this year's draft. Long is the centerpiece of an offensive line that has led Michigan to a 164.9 yard a game rushing average as a team. Besides being an absolutely mammoth tackle at 6'7" and 315 lbs., Long possesses elite speed and footwork for an offensive lineman. The Michigan O-line has allowed just 28 sacks under his leadership in 13 games this season, even though their quarterbacks are not exactly fleet of foot. According to ESPN, Long himself was only beaten for a sack once this season by Vernon Gholston of Ohio State. Jake Long is probably best known for his excellent pass blocking, but don't mistake Long for a finesse tackle. As good as people believe he is, his run blocking may still be underrated. He blocks with a real mean streak. Long does a terrific job of taking on (and running over) a D-lineman and moving into the next level to flatten a linebacker as well. Michigan is averaging 4.0 yards per carry this season and tends to find those tough yards behind Long on the left side. This 2 time All Big Ten performer is experienced on both the left and right side of the line, making a versatile option for an NFL team. Jake Long's years of experience blocking top notch Big Ten ends will serve him well in his professional career. Long should find himself a new home no later than the fifth pick of this year's draft.

http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profile_display.cfm?Prospect_ID=1195

2413fanphins
02-03-2008, 10:29 AM
so he gets beat one time by a very good DE, and he gets the rep for being a bad pass blocker???

by some of the other stuff I have read on here, you would think the guy is a cluts with horrible footwork. glad to see the other side of the story, I was beginning to think that maybe I have been watching the wrong guy the last few years.

I get a lot of michigan games being from the midwest, and I don't see much wrong with this dudes game.

I really don't think he will bust.

finfan54
02-03-2008, 11:26 AM
I dare you to throw that "safe pick" moniker to Parcells. he he he he!

I think the guys we are looking at are Long, Long, and Ryan.

Because the money we would have to pay and because Parcells likes OL (thank god). The problem here is that this draft is loaded with LT's and we could get one in the second round with #57 that is good who is the sleeper of the top bunch.

He also loves guys with all-the-time motors who make big plays and who you can build a defense around. That is Chris Long. The guys character and instincts and versatility and athleticism following his dads footsteps are essential to what Parcells will look for.

Ryan because he is a QB and would be well worth the money we spend if he produces and grows and knows defenses and all that good jazz.

jim1
02-03-2008, 12:07 PM
I dare you to throw that "safe pick" moniker to Parcells. he he he he!

I think the guys we are looking at are Long, Long, and Ryan.

Because the money we would have to pay and because Parcells likes OL (thank god). The problem here is that this draft is loaded with LT's and we could get one in the second round with #57 that is good who is the sleeper of the top bunch.

He also loves guys with all-the-time motors who make big plays and who you can build a defense around. That is Chris Long. The guys character and instincts and versatility and athleticism following his dads footsteps are essential to what Parcells will look for.

Ryan because he is a QB and would be well worth the money we spend if he produces and grows and knows defenses and all that good jazz.

Chris Long #1 and Cherilius #32 would be fine.

finfan54
02-03-2008, 12:15 PM
Chris Long #1 and Cherilius #32 would be fine.

...and then if we could get Flacco at 57 would be the bomb! But i think Flacco will rise fast and we would have to take him at 32. Chris Nick and others are showing some stuff at OT and there are others who can be had at 57 too and I am sure if we do not go Jake Long at 1 that BP will be searching for someone who we could take at 57, or top of the third or maybe even top of the fourth!

The real interesting thing about this year is the draft now is only 2 rounds on the first day! that means many many good players will be on the board overnight and who picks next? WE do!!!!

Think we trade down in the third? I would bet on it!

jim1
02-03-2008, 12:26 PM
...and then if we could get Flacco at 57 would be the bomb! But i think Flacco will rise fast and we would have to take him at 32. Chris Nick and others are showing some stuff at OT and there are others who can be had at 57 too and I am sure if we do not go Jake Long at 1 that BP will be searching for someone who we could take at 57, or top of the third or maybe even top of the fourth!

The real interesting thing about this year is the draft now is only 2 rounds on the first day! that means many many good players will be on the board overnight and who picks next? WE do!!!!

Think we trade down in the third? I would bet on it!

Flacco threw the hell out of the ball at the QB challenge and looked quick and mobile, too. I'd be happy with Henne at #57 or the top of the 3rd. I'm not sure that we need him, though, if Green is coming back. Too many other needs, maybe a NT or S.

The Confessor
02-03-2008, 12:45 PM
so he gets beat one time by a very good DE, and he gets the rep for being a bad pass blocker???

by some of the other stuff I have read on here, you would think the guy is a cluts with horrible footwork. glad to see the other side of the story, I was beginning to think that maybe I have been watching the wrong guy the last few years.

I get a lot of michigan games being from the midwest, and I don't see much wrong with this dudes game.

I really don't think he will bust.

I was watching him get absolutely owned against Illinois as well.

He IS going to be a very good Tackle, but he is HUGE and doesnt have the greatest footwork. Those things can be worked on (I really wish Hud Houck was still with us), but I at this point, he really looks like a road-grading Right Tackle

DOL-FAN92
02-03-2008, 01:03 PM
I'd like Jake Long, but only if it was in the mid 1st round (if we got the 5th pick from the Chiefs I'd do it). However, Jake Long is probably #1 on their draft board.

Again, I think Glenn Dorsey or Chris Long are the best players in the draft. I don't see what's wrong with keeping the pick and taking one of those players.


lol....10 out of 10 times,the Cheifs will take him with the Number 1 pick...he wont be there at 5.If we got the 5 overall pick i will be shocked if its anyone other than Vernon Ghloston.

DOL-FAN92
02-03-2008, 01:13 PM
Jake Long Scouting Report


Position:OL (http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/2008/profiles.cfm?pos=OL) School & Year/Status:Michigan (http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profiles_by_team.cfm?school=Michigan) - SeniorHeight & Weight:6'7 - 315 lbs.Ranked #4 on our Top 100 Prospects Board (http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/2008/top100.cfm)


2008 NFL Draft Prospect - Scouting Report
Jake Long of Michigan, despite a poor showing in the season finale against Ohio State, is without a doubt the top offensive lineman in this year's draft. Long is the centerpiece of an offensive line that has led Michigan to a 164.9 yard a game rushing average as a team. Besides being an absolutely mammoth tackle at 6'7" and 315 lbs., Long possesses elite speed and footwork for an offensive lineman. The Michigan O-line has allowed just 28 sacks under his leadership in 13 games this season, even though their quarterbacks are not exactly fleet of foot. According to ESPN, Long himself was only beaten for a sack once this season by Vernon Gholston of Ohio State. Jake Long is probably best known for his excellent pass blocking, but don't mistake Long for a finesse tackle. As good as people believe he is, his run blocking may still be underrated. He blocks with a real mean streak. Long does a terrific job of taking on (and running over) a D-lineman and moving into the next level to flatten a linebacker as well. Michigan is averaging 4.0 yards per carry this season and tends to find those tough yards behind Long on the left side. This 2 time All Big Ten performer is experienced on both the left and right side of the line, making a versatile option for an NFL team. Jake Long's years of experience blocking top notch Big Ten ends will serve him well in his professional career. Long should find himself a new home no later than the fifth pick of this year's draft.

http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profile_display.cfm?Prospect_ID=1195


Left Tackles are are required to be excellent pass-blockers,so why do people say he will only play RT?As you can see and look for yourself,Jake Long can do it all from either left or right

Right Tackles are known as the Run-Blocking Tackles,which Long does a great job also.I would hate to miss out on the next great Tackle.

Jake is our guy here,he will only make us better,and if Left Tackle isn't working in his favor,then he is still a top-notch right tackle.

Boomer
02-03-2008, 05:19 PM
...and then if we could get Flacco at 57 would be the bomb! But i think Flacco will rise fast and we would have to take him at 32. Chris Nick and others are showing some stuff at OT and there are others who can be had at 57 too and I am sure if we do not go Jake Long at 1 that BP will be searching for someone who we could take at 57, or top of the third or maybe even top of the fourth!

The real interesting thing about this year is the draft now is only 2 rounds on the first day! that means many many good players will be on the board overnight and who picks next? WE do!!!!

Think we trade down in the third? I would bet on it!

Apart from the Senior Bowl and a You Tube video, how much of Flacco have you actually seen to make you think picking a shotgun QB in R2 would be the right way to go when you've only allowed a better QB 3 and a half games under center.

alen1
02-03-2008, 05:52 PM
Left Tackles are are required to be excellent pass-blockers,so why do people say he will only play RT?As you can see and look for yourself,Jake Long can do it all from either left or right

Right Tackles are known as the Run-Blocking Tackles,which Long does a great job also.I would hate to miss out on the next great Tackle.

Jake is our guy here,he will only make us better,and if Left Tackle isn't working in his favor,then he is still a top-notch right tackle.

I am not comparing them or anything but didnt we all say that about Gallery? Gallery has been a hell of a .........bust