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View Full Version : After watching last nights game it appears we should draft...



uga3406
02-04-2008, 11:24 AM
Chris Long ....it showed that defenses do win championships and it takes a great front four to beat and rough up a guy like Brady...Im still for trading the pick but if we stay pat,then thats the guy i want...any thoughts from any 1 om the matter ?

retired opfinistic
02-04-2008, 11:26 AM
Defense does win championships, last night really proved that. The Giants forced the Patriots to play ball their way and in the end walked away victorious. I'll take the Chris Long family in heartbeat.

uga3406
02-04-2008, 11:29 AM
yup..good call on that

knoxpk
02-04-2008, 11:37 AM
Some type of Dlineman would make me happy. If not an end, a good, stout, pocket collapsing DT can make avg OLB's and De's look very good. With half the pocket gone the jobs of the other players along the front becomes that much easier.

Mike13
02-04-2008, 11:52 AM
I'll be fine with any type of Lineman.

MrTree
02-04-2008, 12:18 PM
I'll be fine with any type of Lineman.


This game was won by the D-line no doubt. But I'm curious why no one sees this as a reason to draft Dorsey. The single most disruptive player was Tuck who is a DT and more of a Dorsey style player.


The Giants did put on a clinic of how a front seven can dismantle a high octane offense though.

LouPhinFan
02-04-2008, 12:25 PM
Some type of Dlineman would make me happy. If not an end, a good, stout, pocket collapsing DT can make avg OLB's and De's look very good. With half the pocket gone the jobs of the other players along the front becomes that much easier.

Dorsey fits that to a "T". He can play NT, DT, or DE in whatever scheme we are using on that particular down.

Orange FinFan
02-04-2008, 12:30 PM
I was in favor of drafting him even before last nights Game.

South Florida
02-04-2008, 01:34 PM
Last night's game doesn't show that we need to draft Matt Ryan?

It doesn't show that we need a 6'5, calm under pressure QB?

Last two superbowls were won by 6'5, calm QBs chosen 1st overall.

Tom Brady is a 1st overall pick who was just not scouted properly.

Teams with the 1st overall usually reach if there is a top 5 caliber QB prospect as it is the most valuable position.

Matt Ryan's a top 5 lock.

I won't be unhappy with Dorsey or Long, but I am not thrilled with Beck and I like my QBs 6'5 and unflusterable (sp?), not 6'0, nervous and with small hands that fumble at every contact.

That all said, I recognize why the Giants won. It was because of Strahan, Umenyiora, Tuck, Robinson and whoever that DT that rocked Brady 10 feet backward on the last sack was.

Long or Dorsey would go a long way to helping us in that regard, but was that more important than having Eli Manning?

Would the Giants have won with that D-Line if Johnny Beck was throwing the ball?

Some might say it's too early to tell. I say we have the first pick, take the top 5 rated QB.

MrTree
02-04-2008, 01:36 PM
Last night's game doesn't show that we need to draft Matt Ryan?

It doesn't show that we need a 6'5, calm under pressure QB?

Last two superbowls were won by 6'5, calm QBs chosen 1st overall.

Tom Brady is a 1st overall pick who was just not scouted properly.

Teams with the 1st overall usually reach if there is a top 5 caliber QB prospect as it is the most valuable position.

Matt Ryan's a top 5 lock.

I won't be unhappy with Dorsey or Long, but I am not thrilled with Beck and I like my QBs 6'5 and unflusterable (sp?), not 6'0, nervous and with small hands that fumble at every contact.

That all said, I recognize why the Giants won. It was because of Strahan, Umenyiora, Tuck, Robinson and whoever that DT that rocked Brady 10 feet backward on the last sack.

Long or Dorsey would go a long way to helping us in that regard, but was that more important than having Eli Manning?

Would the Giants have won with that D-Line if Johnny Beck was throwing the ball?

Some might say it's too early to tell. I say we have the first pick, take the top 5 rated QB.

While Eli performed passably well last night, make no mistake the Giants won by a TREMENDOUS defensive effort. 14 points for the Pats in the big game is crazy.

I definitely think it showed what you can do when your defense is in order.

FINSFAN2781
02-04-2008, 01:46 PM
If we stay at #1, I think C. Long is our guy.

cnc66
02-04-2008, 01:54 PM
This game was won by the D-line no doubt. But I'm curious why no one sees this as a reason to draft Dorsey. The single most disruptive player was Tuck who is a DT and more of a Dorsey style player.


The Giants did put on a clinic of how a front seven can dismantle a high octane offense though.

"I" see it as a GOOD reason.. the g-men were collapsing the pocket from the middle.. the most unnerving thing of all to a qb..

MrTree
02-04-2008, 01:57 PM
"I" see it as a GOOD reason.. the g-men were collapsing the pocket from the middle.. the most unnerving thing of all to a qb..


That's what I was seeing too. Tuck was blowing them apart.

Regan21286
02-04-2008, 02:26 PM
I saw last night's game as a reaffirmation of why a big target WR is so important. Moss and Burress scored crucial TD's deep in the red zone for their teams. In fact, a majority of the teams who made it to the divisionals consistently field and used a WR taller than 6'3 (Cowboys, Giants, Patriots, Seahawks, Jaguars). Teams that washed out in the wild-card didn't and teams that lost in the conference champ rounds didn't.

Ghetti13
02-04-2008, 02:30 PM
Glenn Dorsey is a better player and much more rare talent than Chris Long.

And by the way, defensive tackles play on the defensive line as well.

MrEd
02-04-2008, 02:33 PM
Chris Long ....it showed that defenses do win championships and it takes a great front four to beat and rough up a guy like Brady...Im still for trading the pick but if we stay pat,then thats the guy i want...any thoughts from any 1 om the matter ?

Its amazing how beauty truly is in the eye of the beholder! Wow! I saw the game and thought, after Eli answers a Brady drive to win the game that I definitely think we should draft Matt Ryan. Chris Long? Please. We have a pass rush that has Pro Bowlers included, why would we draft Chris Long?

MrEd
02-04-2008, 02:35 PM
I saw last night's game as a reaffirmation of why a big target WR is so important. Moss and Burress scored crucial TD's deep in the red zone for their teams. In fact, a majority of the teams who made it to the divisionals consistently field and used a WR taller than 6'3 (Cowboys, Giants, Patriots, Seahawks, Jaguars). Teams that washed out in the wild-card didn't and teams that lost in the conference champ rounds didn't.

This is also correct. MIA "must" either sign Bryant Johnson or draft a tall WR at #57. But Eli and Brady convinced me we must draft Matt Ryan.

MrEd
02-04-2008, 02:37 PM
Last night's game doesn't show that we need to draft Matt Ryan?

It doesn't show that we need a 6'5, calm under pressure QB?

Last two superbowls were won by 6'5, calm QBs chosen 1st overall.

Tom Brady is a 1st overall pick who was just not scouted properly.

Teams with the 1st overall usually reach if there is a top 5 caliber QB prospect as it is the most valuable position.

Matt Ryan's a top 5 lock.

I won't be unhappy with Dorsey or Long, but I am not thrilled with Beck and I like my QBs 6'5 and unflusterable (sp?), not 6'0, nervous and with small hands that fumble at every contact.

That all said, I recognize why the Giants won. It was because of Strahan, Umenyiora, Tuck, Robinson and whoever that DT that rocked Brady 10 feet backward on the last sack was.

Long or Dorsey would go a long way to helping us in that regard, but was that more important than having Eli Manning?

Would the Giants have won with that D-Line if Johnny Beck was throwing the ball?

Some might say it's too early to tell. I say we have the first pick, take the top 5 rated QB.

Spoken like a true genius. Your absolutely right on.

cnc66
02-04-2008, 02:39 PM
Its amazing how beauty truly is in the eye of the beholder! Wow! I saw the game and thought, after Eli answers a Brady drive to win the game that I definitely think we should draft Matt Ryan. Chris Long? Please. We have a pass rush that has Pro Bowlers included, why would we draft Chris Long?

remembering I am a Dorsey fan..

because our pass rush sucked... as did our run stop.. CL would improve both.. as would Dorsey... imo, the d line is where we need to spend the first pick.

Ryan isn't even top ten imo, we need to stop the run or the qb simply won't matter.

MrEd
02-04-2008, 02:39 PM
Dorsey fits that to a "T". He can play NT, DT, or DE in whatever scheme we are using on that particular down.

The reason that Dorsey wont even be a passing thought in the draft is because most likely MIA will fix the NT spot "prior" to the draft with either Isaac Sopoaga, Shaun Rogers, or Corey Williams.

Ghetti13
02-04-2008, 02:40 PM
Matt Ryan is the only player I could justify Miami taking at number one outside of Glenn Dorsey.

That said, I would take Dorsey.

cnc66
02-04-2008, 02:40 PM
The reason that Dorsey wont even be a passing thought in the draft is because most likely MIA will fix the NT spot "prior" to the draft with either Isaac Sopoaga, Shaun Rogers, or Corey Williams.

we'll see, that would work for me, then we can draft CL..

Regan21286
02-04-2008, 02:41 PM
This is also correct. MIA "must" either sign Bryant Johnson or draft a tall WR at #57. But Eli and Brady convinced me we must draft Matt Ryan.

Actually, I wouldn't mind us signing Hackett. As for Ryan, I personally favor Chris Long, but if we end up with a Matt Ryan or a Brian Brohm, I will be more than pleased.

MrEd
02-04-2008, 02:41 PM
Defense does win championships, last night really proved that. The Giants forced the Patriots to play ball their way and in the end walked away victorious. I'll take the Chris Long family in heartbeat.

Dude, without Eli, a big QB, the defense wouldn't have won squat. Defense can keep a team in the game, but a good QB wins championships. Brady led the Pats to the "best" offense in the league. Eli led the Giants to the SB and then won it at the end. Dont take any credit from Eli Manning. It was "ELI MANNING" who was the SB MVP, not the Giants defense.

MrEd
02-04-2008, 02:43 PM
we'll see, that would work for me, then we can draft CL..

No, then we can draft Matt Ryan. Remember who was named the SB MVP. It was the Giants' QB, not no DE or anything.

MrEd
02-04-2008, 02:44 PM
remembering I am a Dorsey fan..

because our pass rush sucked... as did our run stop.. CL would improve both.. as would Dorsey... imo, the d line is where we need to spend the first pick.

Ryan isn't even top ten imo, we need to stop the run or the qb simply won't matter.

Our pass rush "led the league last season" hello? we struggled because of INJURIES this season.

MrTree
02-04-2008, 02:48 PM
Dude, without Eli, a big QB, the defense wouldn't have won squat. Defense can keep a team in the game, but a good QB wins championships. Brady led the Pats to the "best" offense in the league. Eli led the Giants to the SB and then won it at the end. Dont take any credit from Eli Manning. It was "ELI MANNING" who was the SB MVP, not the Giants defense.


Sorry but this is flat wrong. Eli played passably well, but the front four of the D obliterated the Patriots offense. You let the Pats score their standard 30+ and Eli wouldn't have even had the opportunity for late game heroics. You are trying to oversimplify the situation and downplay the importance of a phenomenal defensive effort to make your point and I think it hurts it instead.

MrTree
02-04-2008, 02:49 PM
Our pass rush "led the league last season" hello? we struggled because of INJURIES this season.


We have no defensive tackles. This was not an injury issue it was a personel issue. We let Kevin Carter go, and didn't have anyone to man the point of attack besides Keith Traylor and a RAW Paul Solial. The results that we ended up with were not smoke and mirrors.

Ghetti13
02-04-2008, 02:50 PM
Quarterbacks, running backs and wide receivers win MVP's because of the nature of their positions. That is no reason to go out and draft a quarterback. Especially if you can't stop the run, protect the passer, catch the ball, cover receivers, create running lanes, etc.

Everyone loved Beck until we threw him in behind an awful like with conservative play calling.

I love Matt Ryan, but the same thing will happen to him unless we are willing to let him sit for at least a season until we place the tools around him to allow him to succeed. Something we should have done with Beck.

cnc66
02-04-2008, 02:51 PM
No, then we can draft Matt Ryan. Remember who was named the SB MVP. It was the Giants' QB, not no DE or anything.

we aren't going to waste our first pick on the turnover kid.. forget it, our staff is not that stupid.. he's not even top 10 material. If he is still around at 32, sure, grab him then, but not the first pick.

and bro, without the defense doing something NOONE did all year, which was maul brady, all of Eli's play would be moot. It ALL starts in the trenches, the g-men won them, and subsequently the game.

Ghetti13
02-04-2008, 02:53 PM
The Giant's defensive line won that game. Problem is, you definitely can't give the MVP to a unit and very few are smart enough to give it to a defender. Given that, the quarterback is always the fail safe. See Peyton Manning last year when Bob Sanders should have won it.

cnc66
02-04-2008, 02:53 PM
Our pass rush "led the league last season" hello? we struggled because of INJURIES this season.

nonsense, it led us into the toilet, and really, injuries had little or nothing to do with our underperforming d line.. they simple stunk.

Ghetti13
02-04-2008, 02:56 PM
Please follow TOS, DO NOT attack other posters.

Go beyond the stats and actually watch the tape. Ryan is a top five pick. Period.

Turnover Kid?

Stats are so misleading. So misleading.

2413fanphins
02-04-2008, 03:05 PM
we aren't going to waste our first pick on the turnover kid.. forget it, our staff is not that stupid.. he's not even top 10 material. If he is still around at 32, sure, grab him then, but not the first pick.

and bro, without the defense doing something NOONE did all year, which was maul brady, all of Eli's play would be moot. It ALL starts in the trenches, the g-men won them, and subsequently the game.


while I don't disagree with everything you are saying, I do think it's unfair of you to call matt ryan the turnover kid.

who are you comparing him to? He had 654 attempts last year, I would venture a guess that you tell me who you want me to compare him to, I will do the research, put in on paper (type it..lol) and you will see that his TO percentage is right in line with just about anybody. I think matt ryan threw a pic 2.5% of the time. I think brom was 2.3% or so... just as an example.

with that being said, I don't think we need to draft matt ryan #1 overall.
I like him yes, but not at one. I like jake long too, but not at 1. If we trade down, but are still in the top ten maybe. More than likely if we trade down we will be in the twenties though.

other points of interest... from my pov, last night.

yes the giants D played phenomenal. I think they dominated the pats.
However, there was more than one occasion where brady had time, and either significantly underthrew or overthrew moss. Moss was open on these occastions as well. I think we finally saw brady crack under pressure.

let's face it, theres some welker lovers on here, not me, but plenty of others.

the pats weren't going to win the superbowl throwing the short stuff to welker all night long. It's as simple as brady missing moss on more than one occasion, that at the very least would have resulted in at least one more FG.
perhaps td's if a few throws had been more accurate.

as far as DL getting mvps. It's a collective effort for the D line. The qb does much more. Are you going to give a superbowl MVP award to a Dlinemen who had 2 sacks, 4 hurries, 2 knockdowns and 4 tackes.

or a qb who threw for 250ish and two tds'.

not that the qb doesn't need help as well, as I am sure somebody will turn the tables on that last comment, but unless ONE DL gets 5 sacks etc etc, I don't think you will ever see one get hands down mvp honors.

MrTree
02-04-2008, 03:11 PM
while I don't disagree with everything you are saying, I do think it's unfair of you to call matt ryan the turnover kid.

who are you comparing him to? He had 654 attempts last year, I would venture a guess that you tell me who you want me to compare him to, I will do the research, put in on paper (type it..lol) and you will see that his TO percentage is right in line with just about anybody. I think matt ryan threw a pic 2.5% of the time. I think brom was 2.3% or so... just as an example.

with that being said, I don't think we need to draft matt ryan #1 overall.
I like him yes, but not at one. I like jake long too, but not at 1. If we trade down, but are still in the top ten maybe. More than likely if we trade down we will be in the twenties though.

other points of interest... from my pov, last night.

yes the giants D played phenomenal. I think they dominated the pats.
However, there was more than one occasion where brady had time, and either significantly underthrew or overthrew moss. Moss was open on these occastions as well. I think we finally saw brady crack under pressure.

let's face it, theres some welker lovers on here, not me, but plenty of others.

the pats weren't going to win the superbowl throwing the short stuff to welker all night long. It's as simple as brady missing moss on more than one occasion, that at the very least would have resulted in at least one more FG.
perhaps td's if a few throws had been more accurate.

as far as DL getting mvps. It's a collective effort for the D line. The qb does much more. Are you going to give a superbowl MVP award to a Dlinemen who had 2 sacks, 4 hurries, 2 knockdowns and 4 tackes.

or a qb who threw for 250ish and two tds'.

not that the qb doesn't need help as well, as I am sure somebody will turn the tables on that last comment, but unless ONE DL gets 5 sacks etc etc, I don't think you will ever see one get hands down mvp honors.


Those misses by Brady were symptomatic of the pounding he was taking. He was sacked five times, but the unofficial estimate I read in the papers today was that he was hit during or after the play on 23 plays. That is a beating to take. I think his confidence in his line and his timing were shot as a result. So instead of stepping into throws or maintaining his timing he rushed some passes where he DID have time and made unforced misses. That is a direct result of the pressure he was facing and not just a result of Brady losing it. Once you get a qb rattled they can be effected even on the plays where you aren't getting there.

Also it's not as glamorous but the Giants D-Line stonewalled the Pats running game and made them one dimensional. Early in the game the Pats tried to establish a balanced attack and it did not work.


14 Points from the highest scoring offense in the history of the league in the biggest game of their collective careers is a history worthy performance from the G-mens D.

2413fanphins
02-04-2008, 03:18 PM
I agree with that Mr. Tree... but up until the last few games the patriots have been more or less one dimensional all year. I know the running game has some decent stats, but you have to admit they were a pass first team all year long.

Nothing to take away from the g mens D, they were top notch last night.

Ghetti13
02-04-2008, 03:18 PM
The bottom line is that any quarterback can play flag football. Brady got pressured and hit so it impacted his play.

It is not coincidence that the best quarterbacks in the league have the best offensive lines and the most time to set up, scan the field, and make an accurate throw. We won't be successful with any quarterback unless we can give him time in the pocket.

It is too early to judge Beck. Nobody would have been successful in that situation. If he had all the skills to be successful before he saw the field, which I believe he does, he certainly still has the skills right now after only a handful of starts where he was placed into a lose-lose situation.

He deserves another shot and I anticipate he will get it. I like Ryan, but the pick should be Dorsey. Passing on Dorsey and taking C. Long, although sexy, would be an enormous mistake. Ryan is the only other guy who they should consider.

Stitches
02-04-2008, 03:20 PM
No, then we can draft Matt Ryan. Remember who was named the SB MVP. It was the Giants' QB, not no DE or anything.

Justin Tuck should have been MVP.

In_Flames
02-04-2008, 03:21 PM
Chris Long ....it showed that defenses do win championships and it takes a great front four to beat and rough up a guy like Brady...Im still for trading the pick but if we stay pat,then thats the guy i want...any thoughts from any 1 om the matter ?
I'm with you brotha. :up:

MrTree
02-04-2008, 03:23 PM
I agree with that Mr. Tree... but up until the last few games the patriots have been more or less one dimensional all year. I know the running game has some decent stats, but you have to admit they were a pass first team all year long.

Nothing to take away from the g mens D, they were top notch last night.


Actually the Pats had started to run the ball more at the end of the regular season, and were actually running it quite a lot in the postseason. (Conincidentally coinciding with Maroney's return to health.) The Pats definitely wanted to be a two dimensional team because the Giants pass rush is fierce and headed by a future HOFer. When it became clear the Pats couldn't run the Giants pinned their ears back and were teeing off on Brady.

What got me about the game is the way the Giants handles the Pats reminded me an awful lot of how our D attacked them in our win over them in 2006. Hit Brady repeatedly and keep him off his timing. So many of Brady's throws come out so quickly and are based off of him and the receiver being in sync about when the ball will get there. When this was interrupted you started to see the uncharacteristic unforced misses. If the Pats could have fallen back on their running game and been succesful Brady would have been able to slow it down and get back in rhythm. The Giants never let it happen.

cnc66
02-04-2008, 03:25 PM
Actually the Pats had started to run the ball more at the end of the regular season, and were actually running it quite a lot in the postseason. (Conincidentally coinciding with Maroney's return to health.) The Pats definitely wanted to be a two dimensional team because the Giants pass rush is fierce and headed by a future HOFer. When it became clear the Pats couldn't run the Giants pinned their ears back and were teeing off on Brady.

What got me about the game is the way the Giants handles the Pats reminded me an awful lot of how our D attacked them in our win over them in 2006. Hit Brady repeatedly and keep him off his timing. So many of Brady's throws come out so quickly and are based off of him and the receiver being in sync about when the ball will get there. When this was interrupted you started to see the uncharacteristic unforced misses. If the Pats could have fallen back on their running game and been succesful Brady would have been able to slow it down and get back in rhythm. The Giants never let it happen.

I have maintained for awhile that WE gave the nfl the blueprint to beat the Pats.. this year, we just couldn't execute it.

2413fanphins
02-04-2008, 03:26 PM
again, I agree.


but you will never convince me the giants are a better team than the pats.

I HATE THE PATS, but if the play the giants, they will win 7 or more times out of ten.

sn9ke.eyes
02-04-2008, 03:27 PM
DL, DB, and OL.

The Giants DL was killing the Pats. The Giants secondary hung with Moss & Co pretty well. The Giants OL was just good enough to buy space for Eli and the running backs.

MrTree
02-04-2008, 03:27 PM
I have maintained for awhile that WE gave the nfl the blueprint to beat the Pats.. this year, we just couldn't execute it.


Well I'm glad the Giants at least got the memo then! :lol:

2413fanphins
02-04-2008, 03:28 PM
I have maintained for awhile that WE gave the nfl the blueprint to beat the Pats.. this year, we just couldn't execute it.



truer words were never spoken..(typed) (unless you spoke aloud as you were typing)

that game of ours, should've opened a bunch of eyes.

MrTree
02-04-2008, 03:29 PM
again, I agree.


but you will never convince me the giants are a better team than the pats.

I HATE THE PATS, but if the play the giants, they will win 7 or more times out of ten.


I don't have any problems with that assessment.

But where pro football gets it right and college football gets it wrong is it isn't about who is the better team...it's about who brings it to the field.

The Giants brought it in spades last night.

Ghetti13
02-04-2008, 03:30 PM
The blueprint has been out there for awhile. Problem is that many teams just don't have the horses on the defensive line or the balls at the coordinator position to use it properly.

The Giants have both.

uga3406
02-04-2008, 03:38 PM
No, then we can draft Matt Ryan. Remember who was named the SB MVP. It was the Giants' QB, not no DE or anything.

he may have won mvp but the real mvp was the giants D...dont forget tuck had two sacks and probe the msot important 1 before half..he also stripped brady even if the pats got a field goal out of that drive momentum would of changed

MrTree
02-04-2008, 03:40 PM
he may have won mvp but the real mvp was the giants D...dont forget tuck had two sacks and probe the msot important 1 before half..he also stripped brady even if the pats got a field goal out of that drive momentum would of changed


The Pats get a field goal there and The G men would have needed more than 17.

That play was huge.

Brad528
02-04-2008, 03:56 PM
I disagree I believe after watching the game it proves we need to draft Jake Long because it showed me that even with a qb of Bradys caliber with out a great offensive line protecting him its hard to win a championship. LT is the most important position on the field if you have a right handed qb and LTs like Jake Long dont come around that often while there are great defensive linemen in every single draft

Ghetti13
02-04-2008, 03:59 PM
Jake Long is not good enough.

Dolfan_Noles
02-04-2008, 03:59 PM
You rarely see defensive player named SB MVP. Regardless of how well their defense played, I knew right when the game was over that Manning would be the MVP...it was just a given.

I think, if anything, what last night's game showed me is the importance of good drafting and patience with players and a coaching staff.

It would have been VERY easy to write off Eli and Coughlin (heck, everyone did 6 weeks ago) in NY, but Eli finally turned in to a great QB, even if it took a couple of years.

Also, they got stars AND role players from the draft. It's not all about adding pro bowlers from every draft. The Giants attained success by adding starters and rotation players through the draft, good scouting, and good FA acquisitions. Antonio Pierce wasn't on many people's radar before they picked him up. Kawika Mitchell wasn't a big-name FA. Not many people gave Ahmad Bradshaw a look. All of these guys, plus Corey Webster, Steve Smith, Boss, and some other guys showed up in a big way.

I remember when the Dolphins gave Plex a good look and didn't pull the trigger. We really missed on that one. He's one hell of a player and would have been a great compliment to Ginn right about now.

MrTree
02-04-2008, 04:09 PM
Jake Long is not good enough.

Nor a LT.

NorFlaFin
02-04-2008, 06:14 PM
What got me about the game is the way the Giants handles the Pats reminded me an awful lot of how our D attacked them in our win over them in 2006. Hit Brady repeatedly and keep him off his timing. So many of Brady's throws come out so quickly and are based off of him and the receiver being in sync about when the ball will get there. When this was interrupted you started to see the uncharacteristic unforced misses. If the Pats could have fallen back on their running game and been succesful Brady would have been able to slow it down and get back in rhythm. The Giants never let it happen.


That's exact formula Micky Andrews has used at FSU for 20 yrs.

Xeticus
02-04-2008, 07:05 PM
I disagree I believe after watching the game it proves we need to draft Jake Long because it showed me that even with a qb of Bradys caliber with out a great offensive line protecting him its hard to win a championship. LT is the most important position on the field if you have a right handed qb and LTs like Jake Long dont come around that often while there are great defensive linemen in every single draftThis game shows how important linemen on both sides of the ball are. The patriots went 18-1 with one of the best lines in football. The giants beat them with a superior defensive line. I think our DL while older and on the verge of retirement is still in better shape than our offense. We haven't had a good offense in a long time. I think getting Jake Long makes a lot of sense. Jake long, Vernon Carey and Samson Satele would be a dominating, young offensive line for years to come that would Beck plenty of protection.

uga3406
02-04-2008, 07:31 PM
Jake Long is not good enough.


agreed !

shanem40
02-04-2008, 08:26 PM
What got me about the game is the way the Giants handles the Pats reminded me an awful lot of how our D attacked them in our win over them in 2006. Hit Brady repeatedly and keep him off his timing. So many of Brady's throws come out so quickly and are based off of him and the receiver being in sync about when the ball will get there. When this was interrupted you started to see the uncharacteristic unforced misses. If the Pats could have fallen back on their running game and been succesful Brady would have been able to slow it down and get back in rhythm. The Giants never let it happen.


That's exact formula Micky Andrews has used at FSU for 20 yrs.exactly no matter who the qb is it could be a combination of all the greats of all time if hes under pressure he will not preform well ............and i am a huggeeeeeeee micky andrews fan i would to see what he could do in the nfl but then agian i dont want him to leave FSU

#1dolphinsfan
02-04-2008, 09:06 PM
i wouldnt mind having eather Chris Long or Glenn Dorsey

uga3406
02-05-2008, 02:24 AM
forget all the talk about ryan thats a smokescreen...tuna knows to win a championship u need defense and last might proved it..if we stay at 1 it has to be chris long

Jed
02-05-2008, 09:55 PM
This game was won by the D-line no doubt. But I'm curious why no one sees this as a reason to draft Dorsey. The single most disruptive player was Tuck who is a DT and more of a Dorsey style player.


The Giants did put on a clinic of how a front seven can dismantle a high octane offense though.


I agree 100% with MrTree's posts in this thread. The middle of the Giants D (stopping the run and pressuring the pass) was the key to the game, and reaffirms how great a pick Dorsey would be for us. We need help up the middle of the defensive line more than anywhere else.

Static387
02-05-2008, 10:25 PM
Speed baby speed on the ends. How fast is long?

Digital
02-06-2008, 12:52 AM
I'm a Virginia fan and have been a big Chris Long fan since he started breaking into the team. He's going to be a very good DE in this league, I'm sure of that. But as far as speed, he's listed at 4.75 but I honestly don't think he's that fast. He's not slow, but he's no Freakish speedster. I expect him to run a 4.85 at the combine. But he is relentless, strong, quick, fairly fast, very good at reading plays, and his motor just never quits. If the lineman(men) make even one mistake, Long makes the play, he always punishes mistakes.

Looking at the NY Giants defense it played a bit like the Dallas Cowboys defense in that they had a lot of big fast athletes flying at the QB. If that's any indication of how Parland (Parcells/Ireland) are going to build our defense, I think they might opt for players even faster than Long, and certainly faster than Dorsey--who is neither an NT nor a DE in the 3-4. Someone like the UM monster Calais would be a typical Parland pick at the top of round 2, if he's there.

If we cannot trade down, I expect Jake Long to be the pick. LT's are very hard to find and command very high salaries, and since I do not believe Parland rates Ryan high enough to take at #1, and Dorsey isn't really a good fit for the 3-4, I expect it to be Jake Long if we stay at #1.

chillwill3000
02-06-2008, 03:26 PM
count me in as part of the draft doresey bandwagon.

Brad528
02-06-2008, 09:12 PM
Jake Long is not good enough.

your kidding right the guy gave up one sack all year long and had no penalties his only sack was given up in the last game to Gholston of Ohio State

knoxpk
02-07-2008, 09:22 AM
Sorry but I am all for a suffocating Defense above all.
There are plenty of teams that have shown a decent o line with "some" ability to move the ball combined with a stingy "D" can not just win but win big.
Ravens, Bucs, Bears all did it with that same strategy. All had some things in common, Active DT's, speedy LB's, bring tremendous pressure on the QB. None of them had what I would call a world class Offense either.

Fullerboy
02-07-2008, 10:37 AM
The blueprint has been out there for awhile. Problem is that many teams just don't have the horses on the defensive line or the balls at the coordinator position to use it properly.

The Giants have both.

We have the horses we just dont have the bull, and thats why Dorsey would be the perfect fit. We didnt have such a big problem with our ends, the problem was mainly our tackles they couldnt keep other teams linemen away from our linebackers, so why should we pick Long when we have a bigger need for a tackle.

Fullerboy
02-07-2008, 10:42 AM
I disagree I believe after watching the game it proves we need to draft Jake Long because it showed me that even with a qb of Bradys caliber with out a great offensive line protecting him its hard to win a championship. LT is the most important position on the field if you have a right handed qb and LTs like Jake Long dont come around that often while there are great defensive linemen in every single draft


But its not our biggest problem, your analysis is maybe correct but our d-line is hurting more than our o-line!!!