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View Full Version : Matt walsh tapes are audio tapes



satz
02-18-2008, 10:39 AM
yeap ,seems like the tapes walsh has are audio tapes of his conversation with scott and him .hence his whole damaging to pats thing.

his audio tapes are his conversation with scott piolli .It involves scouting info and i see something to do with how they manupulate the draft.like went allof fregurson in the draft and then pick the guy they wanted and jets believing it pick that dude.

SpaceMountain16
02-18-2008, 11:50 AM
If he gives them to Goodell they'll be destroyed by noon.

MR NFLFAN
02-18-2008, 01:16 PM
So how does one video tape a walk thru with an audio recorder?

Agua
02-18-2008, 01:22 PM
I don't see how you can logically conclude that Walsh's tapes = audio only. To be sure, Pioli said the guy surrepitiously made audio recordings of conversations between the two of them, but that doesn't exclude the existence of video tapes, unless you have some other source.

MR NFLFAN
02-18-2008, 01:57 PM
I don't see how you can logically conclude that Walsh's tapes = audio only. To be sure, Pioli said the guy surrepitiously made audio recordings of conversations between the two of them, but that doesn't exclude the existence of video tapes, unless you have some other source.

From the espn story today it just didn't sound like this Walsh guy was ever in a position with the Patriots to video tape a rams walk thru. I could be wrong who knows but the fact that he was caught and fired for secretly taping GM Pioli Mr Walsh is looking more like a guy with an ax to grind to me.

Something else bothersome is his insistance on blanket immunity weather he tells the truth or not? If were interested in the truth why should anyone be given a free pass to lie without repercussions? If you lie about me and I can prove your testimony is lies why shouldn't I have the right to defend myself and go after you? I think thats a right none of us would be willing to give up especially to someone with a shadow already haging over him.

late again
02-18-2008, 02:10 PM
From the espn story today it just didn't sound like this Walsh guy was ever in a position with the Patriots to video tape a rams walk thru. I could be wrong who knows but the fact that he was caught and fired for secretly taping GM Pioli Mr Walsh is looking more like a guy with an ax to grind to me.

Something else bothersome is his insistance on blanket immunity weather he tells the truth or not? If were interested in the truth why should anyone be given a free pass to lie without repercussions? If you lie about me and I can prove your testimony is lies why shouldn't I have the right to defend myself and go after you? I think thats a right none of us would be willing to give up especially to someone with a shadow already haging over him.

As to the immunity issue; I do understand his caution. Walsh may make a statement or answer a question which he believes to be true, however, he can't prove it one way or the other. Meanwhile the Pats dispute Walsh's statement and say he's not being truthful. Under the currently proposed indemnity agreement, Walsh would still be vulnerable to a lawsuit. Regardless of who ultimately wins the lawsuit, Walsh still loses simply because he doesn't have the resources available to him that the NFL has.
There's no easy way to resolve that issue, IMO. Obviously the NFL isn't going to agree to giving Walsh a "license to lie". And Walsh isn't going to be agreeable to leaving himself open to a lawsuit.

MR NFLFAN
02-18-2008, 02:22 PM
As to the immunity issue; I do understand his caution. Walsh may make a statement or answer a question which he believes to be true, however, he can't prove it one way or the other. Meanwhile the Pats dispute Walsh's statement and say he's not being truthful. Under the currently proposed indemnity agreement, Walsh would still be vulnerable to a lawsuit. Regardless of who ultimately wins the lawsuit, Walsh still loses simply because he doesn't have the resources available to him that the NFL has.
There's no easy way to resolve that issue, IMO. Obviously the NFL isn't going to agree to giving Walsh a "license to lie". And Walsh isn't going to be agreeable to leaving himself open to a lawsuit.


I hear ya. I wonder seeing as Mr Walsh has a lawyer that his lawyer permit him to testify on the items that he can actually prove are truthful?

Iroquois Joe
02-18-2008, 02:47 PM
If he is sly enough to tape private conversations, who knows what this weasel has?

Perhaps a detailed account of the entire Pat-cheat-agenda straight from the lips of Belichick himself, maybe parties with pretty little Thai lady boys popping out of sponge cake footballs and into the lap of Kraft....who knows?

Anyone who resorts to such tactics does it for two reasons, either for personal protection for when the hammer comes down or blackmail.

In any case, as this thing unfolds, he starts to shape up as the type who would be recruited to fit the NE culture of corruption in the first place.

MR NFLFAN
02-18-2008, 03:14 PM
If he is sly enough to tape private conversations, who knows what this weasel has?

Perhaps a detailed account of the entire Pat-cheat-agenda straight from the lips of Belichick himself, maybe parties with pretty little Thai lady boys popping out of sponge cake footballs and into the lap of Kraft....who knows?

Anyone who resorts to such tactics does it for two reasons, either for personal protection for when the hammer comes down or blackmail.

In any case, as this thing unfolds, he starts to shape up as the type who would be recruited to fit the NE culture of corruption in the first place.

If that were the true culture in NE and the type of person so desired by the franchise then why isn't Mr walsh still employed there?

As you said yourself he's a weisel and it sounds like a weisel with an ax to grind. I can see why the league won't give him blanket ammunity.

It does sound like him and Senator Specter are cut from the same cloth though.

Mike13
02-18-2008, 03:17 PM
I would like to see a source for this.

EDIT: Nevermind, I found it

From Sportsline:


Patriots vice president of player personnel Scott Pioli also told the newspaper that part of the reason Walsh was fired in January 2003 was because he secretly recorded conversations between himself and Pioli.
Michael Levy, Walsh's attorney, said Pioli's account was a "complete fabrication."
"This is a predictable and pathetic effort to smear Mr. Walsh's character rather than confront the truth about the Patriots' conduct," Levy said in the Globe story.
Levy has said his client is willing to turn over videotapes he made for the team if the NFL guarantees Walsh protection from lawsuits or other legal action.


No audio tapes were found, it seems.(maybe these tapes are completly different from the Video tapes?) Pioli claimed that Walsh was fired because Walsh taped their conversations.
Satz, I think you may have misinterpreted something there.

Iroquois Joe
02-18-2008, 03:57 PM
If that were the true culture in NE and the type of person so desired by the franchise then why isn't Mr walsh still employed there?

As you said yourself he's a weisel and it sounds like a weisel with an ax to grind. I can see why the league won't give him blanket ammunity.

It does sound like him and Senator Specter are cut from the same cloth though.

Maybe it wasn't appreciated when this weasel started practicing his craft, or should I say "Kraft", in house.

Yes, Specter should don an Eagles cap and jearsy when conducting a news confrence. The fact that remains, which tends to get over looked with the emergance of this Walsh business, is that when this whole thing came to light Goodell allowed the Pats to investigate themselves, sent a couple of 2nd tier flunkies to confirm the existance of whatever evidence emerged, then had it destroyed before it saw the light of day.

A prime example of the fox investigating the disappearance of the chickens from the hen house.

I believe the insidious way the whole operation (not investigation) was carried out to begin with is more damning in the minds of the public than anything Walsh may or may not have at this point.

It is also what probably got Specter's knickers in knot in the first place. By not being up front and forth comming, Goodell and the Pats set themselves up for the mess they are in now.

The whole shady proceedure, the way it all was handled to begin with, lends itself to the assumption of further guilt and justice denied.

MR NFLFAN
02-18-2008, 04:21 PM
Maybe it wasn't appreciated when this weasel started practicing his craft, or should I say "Kraft", in house.

Yes, Specter should don an Eagles cap and jearsy when conducting a news confrence. The fact that remains, which tends to get over looked with the emergance of this Walsh business, is that when this whole thing came to light Goodell allowed the Pats to investigate themselves, sent a couple of 2nd tier flunkies to confirm the existance of whatever evidence emerged, then had it destroyed before it saw the light of day.

A prime example of the fox investigating the disappearance of the chickens from the hen house.

I believe the insidious way the whole operation (not investigation) was carried out to begin with is more daming in the minds of the public than anything Walsh may or may not have at this point.

It is also what probably got Specter's knickers in knot in the first place. By not being up front and forth comming, Goodell and the Pats set themselves up for the mess they are in now.

The whole shady proceedure, the way it all was handled to begin with, lends itself to the assumption of further guilt and justice denied.

I think this is and has been standard operating procedure for the league as to how they've handled things in the past. Had the jets not "leaked" (I use that term very losely) the video to the press I have no doubt the league would have never even mentioned it to the public.

Single bullet Specter or not we'll never really get to the bottom of this.

HaRdKoReXXX
02-18-2008, 04:35 PM
I think this is and has been standard operating procedure for the league as to how they've handled things in the past. Had the jets not "leaked" (I use that term very losely) the video to the press I have no doubt the league would have never even mentioned it to the public.

Single bullet Specter or not we'll never really get to the bottom of this.

You know what always seems to get lost in this whole "Spygate" thing is how Mangini totally ****ed over his old coach!

I wonder if he knew the **** was gonna hit the fan like this when he blew the whistle on Bellicheat...

MattM
02-18-2008, 05:00 PM
I think this is and has been standard operating procedure for the league as to how they've handled things in the past. Had the jets not "leaked" (I use that term very losely) the video to the press I have no doubt the league would have never even mentioned it to the public.

Single bullet Specter or not we'll never really get to the bottom of this.

As Dr. Z said in his Friday column, many folks around the League think quite the opposite in that it's Goodell's relationship with Kraft (you know, the powerful owner who helped him get hired?) that many people think is causing the NFL to go easy on the Pats*. I personally agree with that theory.

I also think that Goodell knows his star is tied to there being no findings of anything else here, no matter what that takes, since he's personally going to take incredible heat for anything else that comes out here since he botched the job to protect his boss to begin with. The Pats* and Goodell's interests remain aligned here in terms of just trying to keep covering all this up. Hence things like this weekend's revelation that the League apparently has spent more time investigating Walsh's personal life using an ex-FBI man than it has in looking into what Walsh knows about the Pats* (kind of funny how a video dept. employee was not among the folks they originally contacted--a little mindboggling to us non-homers, isn't it?).

The only way this thing gets aired fairly is for Specter or Congress to look into it--that or a lawsuit forcing the League's/Pats* hands, but that latter option will take years with the high-priced lawyers the League will retain. (On that note, it's interesting that McKee Nelson, Walsh's law firm, is actually a large sized respectable law firm in NY--I've got an old colleague who's of counsel there--and not some small time shyster shop.) Personally, I suspect that once Specter and Congress have their way here, both Goodell and BB will be searching for new work.....

MR NFLFAN
02-18-2008, 05:20 PM
As Dr. Z said in his Friday column, many folks around the League think quite the opposite in that it's Goodell's relationship with Kraft (you know, the powerful owner who helped him get hired?) that many people think is causing the NFL to go easy on the Pats*. I personally agree with that theory.

I also think that Goodell knows his star is tied to there being no findings of anything else here, no matter what that takes, since he's personally going to take incredible heat for anything else that comes out here since he botched the job to protect his boss to begin with. The Pats* and Goodell's interests remain aligned here in terms of just trying to keep covering all this up. Hence things like this weekend's revelation that the League apparently has spent more time investigating Walsh's personal life using an ex-FBI man than it has in looking into what Walsh knows about the Pats* (kind of funny how a video dept. employee was not among the folks they originally contacted--a little mindboggling to us non-homers, isn't it?).

The only way this thing gets aired fairly is for Specter or Congress to look into it--that or a lawsuit forcing the League's/Pats* hands, but that latter option will take years with the high-priced lawyers the League will retain. (On that note, it's interesting that McKee Nelson, Walsh's law firm, is actually a large sized respectable law firm in NY--I've got an old colleague who's of counsel there--and not some small time shyster shop.) Personally, I suspect that once Specter and Congress have their way here, both Goodell and BB will be searching for new work.....

I wouldn't put all my eggs in the Arlen Specter basket for getting to the bottom of this. He's clearly got a conflict of interest in all this as comcast is one of his biggest campaign contributors and we know the battle that has been raging over the league owned NFLN and its denial to sell its program to the comcast and the other cable companies.

I read a copy of his first letter to the comissioner about the camera gate thing and he only asked weather the comissioner had evidence thru the tape or notes of the pats cheating in their SB vs the eagles. He's not the guy that instills truth bearing for me. I wouldn't be surprised to see the league cut a deal with the cable companies to broadcast NFLN the way they choose and the senator to hand the public some lame excuse that he's satisified and then disappear. I see way too many people in bed together on this to ever believe we'll really know the truth. Remember Specter is first and foremost an attorney and I wouldn't trust one of them as far as I could throw them. Do a google search on Arlen Specter and you'll get some insight as to his past searches for truth.

jimmy42jack0
02-18-2008, 07:33 PM
A. the comcast and specter thing has nothing to do with anything
B. this is about the patriots and the nfl allowing them to cheat
C. this should go back to tagliabue...because those other felonios pats championships happened under his watch
D. Gooddell, Belicheat, and Pioli should all be fired/forced to resign and never allowed to work in the nfl again...and i dont care how long that process takes...its the right move...because as the old saying goes...where there is smoke, there is most assuredly fire

satz
02-18-2008, 08:33 PM
The guy from boston hearld you reported the BB taping the walkthrough today changed his stance

http://www.bostonherald.com/blogs/sports/patriots/index.php/2008/02/18/belichick-denies-taping/

MattM
02-18-2008, 10:10 PM
I wouldn't put all my eggs in the Arlen Specter basket for getting to the bottom of this. He's clearly got a conflict of interest in all this as comcast is one of his biggest campaign contributors and we know the battle that has been raging over the league owned NFLN and its denial to sell its program to the comcast and the other cable companies.

I read a copy of his first letter to the comissioner about the camera gate thing and he only asked weather the comissioner had evidence thru the tape or notes of the pats cheating in their SB vs the eagles. He's not the guy that instills truth bearing for me. I wouldn't be surprised to see the league cut a deal with the cable companies to broadcast NFLN the way they choose and the senator to hand the public some lame excuse that he's satisified and then disappear. I see way too many people in bed together on this to ever believe we'll really know the truth. Remember Specter is first and foremost an attorney and I wouldn't trust one of them as far as I could throw them. Do a google search on Arlen Specter and you'll get some insight as to his past searches for truth.

This is your "hope" as a Pats*fan, that this will all go away, but why is that? Afraid there's actually something there? There are too many folks interested in this now for it it just go away. The Comcast stuff is actually sort of ridiculous considering that Specter is not running for re-election so doesn't need a war chest, but Pats* fans like to gloss that over along with the truth, too.....

PS Now that the Pats* are toast, do you, like most of "Patriot Nation" plan to go back to rooting for whoever your old team used to be, or will you wait for a new "leader" to emerge? Just curious....

jimmy42jack0
02-18-2008, 10:23 PM
This is your "hope" as a Pats*fan, that this will all go away, but why is that? Afraid there's actually something there? There are too many folks interested in this now for it it just go away. The Comcast stuff is actually sort of ridiculous considering that Specter is not running for re-election so doesn't need a war chest, but Pats* fans like to gloss that over along with the truth, too.....

PS Now that the Pats* are toast, do you, like most of "Patriot Nation" plan to go back to rooting for whoever your old team used to be, or will you wait for a new "leader" to emerge? Just curious....
LOL...as someone who lives 20 minutes from foxboro...this last part is hilarious...before 96'...i think there was all of like 5 or 10 pats fans who were diehard...and ill respect them...but the rest of bandwagoners must feel like they HAVE to find a new team...and quick

MR NFLFAN
02-18-2008, 11:39 PM
This is your "hope" as a Pats*fan, that this will all go away, but why is that? Afraid there's actually something there? There are too many folks interested in this now for it it just go away. The Comcast stuff is actually sort of ridiculous considering that Specter is not running for re-election so doesn't need a war chest, but Pats* fans like to gloss that over along with the truth, too.....

PS Now that the Pats* are toast, do you, like most of "Patriot Nation" plan to go back to rooting for whoever your old team used to be, or will you wait for a new "leader" to emerge? Just curious....


No actually my hope is they blow the doors off the league. Its time to open the flood gates of all the cheating the league has known about and for as long as they've known it. Arlen said we deserve honest games so I hope present coaches along with excoaches come crawling out of the wood work with testimony that ties up the entire congress for the next 5 yrs. The public demands blood so its time they got their fair share. Who knows the league could auction off all those rep'od Lombardy trophies just to keep the lights turned on in the league office.

TomBradyWoot
02-19-2008, 12:27 AM
This is your "hope" as a Pats*fan, that this will all go away, but why is that? Afraid there's actually something there? There are too many folks interested in this now for it it just go away. The Comcast stuff is actually sort of ridiculous considering that Specter is not running for re-election so doesn't need a war chest, but Pats* fans like to gloss that over along with the truth, too.....

PS Now that the Pats* are toast, do you, like most of "Patriot Nation" plan to go back to rooting for whoever your old team used to be, or will you wait for a new "leader" to emerge? Just curious....



:sidelol: Sorry dude, you lose all credibility with a signature that says buffalo's going to the super bowl.

adamprez2003
02-19-2008, 02:29 PM
No actually my hope is they blow the doors off the league. Its time to open the flood gates of all the cheating the league has known about and for as long as they've known it. Arlen said we deserve honest games so I hope present coaches along with excoaches come crawling out of the wood work with testimony that ties up the entire congress for the next 5 yrs. The public demands blood so its time they got their fair share. Who knows the league could auction off all those rep'od Lombardy trophies just to keep the lights turned on in the league office.

The only team in the crosshairs is the Patriots. No matter how much you wish that other teams will get ensnared it simply wont happen. I think you should apologize to all of us for defending such a sleazy organization. As penance, while on Finheaven, you should only type on your knees :oops::sorry:

MR NFLFAN
02-19-2008, 05:33 PM
Right look at what the goverment has done with its investigation with MLB. You'd have to be blind to not see whats coming here. Hang on to that one team in the cross hair theory if it makes you feel better.

nephinsfan
02-19-2008, 07:06 PM
Right look at what the goverment has done with its investigation with MLB. You'd have to be blind to not see whats coming here. Hang on to that one team in the cross hair theory if it makes you feel better.

I find it quite funny that all of their championships are now in question and they will be forever quesitoned. They are officially the Pete Rose/Barry Bonds of the NFL.


Better keep them Red sox Hats handy pats fans.......just like the day after the superbowl, they will be all that you have to talk about.

adamprez2003
02-19-2008, 07:32 PM
Right look at what the goverment has done with its investigation with MLB. You'd have to be blind to not see whats coming here. Hang on to that one team in the cross hair theory if it makes you feel better.As quick as you fans were to dismiss Shula, its amazing how brilliant he was in retrospect. Granted this season wont have the asterik. It will be the three SuperBowls that have asterisks attched, whether official or unofficial. The great asterisk dynasty. Forever questioned, forever tainted. For shame, for shame:(

MR NFLFAN
02-19-2008, 07:53 PM
Shula should pray the senator doesn't talk to Johnson. Mr perfect was a pioneer in circumventing the 15 sec cutoff.

adamprez2003
02-19-2008, 08:05 PM
Shula should pray the senator doesn't talk to Johnson. Mr perfect was a pioneer in circumventing the 15 sec cutoff.

Does Johnson have videotape proof? No. Now unto technological proof and the implications for players and coaches who are still playing. Did you type that while on your knees?:err:

MattM
02-19-2008, 10:24 PM
Right look at what the goverment has done with its investigation with MLB. You'd have to be blind to not see whats coming here. Hang on to that one team in the cross hair theory if it makes you feel better.

Let's take this puppy whereever it leads. Most of us suspect it will start and end in Foxboro, but if it doesn't, so be it. As a Bills fan, I can pretty much guarantee you that Marv Levy won't get implicated, nor will, I strongly suspect, Dick Jauron or Wade Phillips. Gregg Williams and Mularkey perhaps, but even them I doubt. No, I suspect that who will get tarred here will be Belichick and his staff,with perhaps a nod to the man that taught him, who happens to reside somewhere round these parts.

What's really funny about your post is the Pats* fan's tried and true way to get through this mess as they cry themselves to sleep at night--everyone else does it. Well, we'll see about that, won't we, but as of right now, it looks like it's your team that's the only one royally screwed.....

MR NFLFAN
02-19-2008, 11:08 PM
This puppy will lead to a broadcast agreement between the league and the cable companies. It all politics son

adamprez2003
02-20-2008, 03:06 AM
This puppy will lead to a broadcast agreement between the league and the cable companies. It all politics son

The big question is whether Kraft's personal puppy, Goodell, can continue the coverup.

MR NFLFAN
02-20-2008, 03:23 PM
The big question is whether Kraft's personal puppy, Goodell, can continue the coverup.

Have you not seen any of the Roger Clemens saga? He said/he said all the testimony thats been given yet the commision still has no physical proof. We've spent millions of tax payers dollars to prove nothing 100% conclusive, What makes you think anything would be any different if this was the NFL? Call Goodell a personal puppy all you want but what he did he did to protect the enitre cash cow and all of its share holders. I believe Goodell is banking on the huge waste of Tax dollars spent investigating MLB and still no positive proof of who is lying as a deterant to the senate judical committee from repeating the same useless waste of our tax dollars. This walsh guy certainly has a questionable character and even if he has a socalled walk thru tape he has no way to prove that Belichick orded him to make it or that he ever saw it. Back to the he said he said all over again. Senator Specter is first an attorney and you have got to believe he's smart enought to know this so why is he even heading down this dead end road? He's not after truth or honesty in the NFL he's after an agreement on broadcast rights for one of his biggest contributors.....comcast. Its all a big power play with one goal in mind $$$$$$$.

nephinsfan
02-22-2008, 07:30 AM
Have you not seen any of the Roger Clemens saga? He said/he said all the testimony thats been given yet the commision still has no physical proof. We've spent millions of tax payers dollars to prove nothing 100% conclusive, What makes you think anything would be any different if this was the NFL? Call Goodell a personal puppy all you want but what he did he did to protect the enitre cash cow and all of its share holders. I believe Goodell is banking on the huge waste of Tax dollars spent investigating MLB and still no positive proof of who is lying as a deterant to the senate judical committee from repeating the same useless waste of our tax dollars. This walsh guy certainly has a questionable character and even if he has a socalled walk thru tape he has no way to prove that Belichick orded him to make it or that he ever saw it. Back to the he said he said all over again. Senator Specter is first an attorney and you have got to believe he's smart enought to know this so why is he even heading down this dead end road? He's not after truth or honesty in the NFL he's after an agreement on broadcast rights for one of his biggest contributors.....comcast. Its all a big power play with one goal in mind $$$$$$$.


Or in other words: "Please lord, do not let this man talk, please just let this go away, this has already been the biggest let down of a season for me, it is like getting the hottest girl in school and the right before the pants come off, WHAM....the big let down. I can't handle knowing that my favorite team since 2001 has been tainted".

MattM
02-22-2008, 07:50 AM
Have you not seen any of the Roger Clemens saga? He said/he said all the testimony thats been given yet the commision still has no physical proof. We've spent millions of tax payers dollars to prove nothing 100% conclusive, What makes you think anything would be any different if this was the NFL? Call Goodell a personal puppy all you want but what he did he did to protect the enitre cash cow and all of its share holders. I believe Goodell is banking on the huge waste of Tax dollars spent investigating MLB and still no positive proof of who is lying as a deterant to the senate judical committee from repeating the same useless waste of our tax dollars. This walsh guy certainly has a questionable character and even if he has a socalled walk thru tape he has no way to prove that Belichick orded him to make it or that he ever saw it. Back to the he said he said all over again. Senator Specter is first an attorney and you have got to believe he's smart enought to know this so why is he even heading down this dead end road? He's not after truth or honesty in the NFL he's after an agreement on broadcast rights for one of his biggest contributors.....comcast. Its all a big power play with one goal in mind $$$$$$$.

The big difference between this and Clemens is that if there's any case at all here there will be physical proof of the Pats* cheating in the form of videotapes. If they have videotapes of the Rams SB walkthrough (which, from reading between the lines, it sounds like there are--check PFT yesterday for an interesting read on that from Florio and a potential slip in an AP article recently where the reporter attributed to Walsh the fact that he was the one doing that taping), the Pats* and BB are done. The League can spin that any way it wants until Sunday, but folks aren't dumb enough to believe (a) Walsh did that on his own and/or (b) it couldn't affect the outcome of the game.....

MR NFLFAN
02-22-2008, 01:38 PM
The big difference between this and Clemens is that if there's any case at all here there will be physical proof of the Pats* cheating in the form of videotapes. If they have videotapes of the Rams SB walkthrough (which, from reading between the lines, it sounds like there are--check PFT yesterday for an interesting read on that from Florio and a potential slip in an AP article recently where the reporter attributed to Walsh the fact that he was the one doing that taping), the Pats* and BB are done. The League can spin that any way it wants until Sunday, but folks aren't dumb enough to believe (a) Walsh did that on his own and/or (b) it couldn't affect the outcome of the game.....

What walsh has isn't physical proof the Pats did anything. I know you don't believe it but the facts are he could have very well done this on his own. It is possible just as stealing these so called tapes was possible, just as secretly taping the pats GM Pioli was possible.
The trainer in the Clemens hearing had used gaze and needles but what did that prove, nothing. It doesn't matter what Walsh shows up with on its own it doesn't prove a thing on the part of Belichick. Just as the sryinges and gauze doesn't not physically put a needle full of roids or hgh into clemens anus the so called tape doesn't provide physical evidence that Belichick even knew about it.
You know this week we heard Belichick deny anything from ordering it to ever having seen one even before he was a head coach. We heard Pioli state Walsh was fired for secretly taping his conversations with Walsh. Pioli even stated he had been told of this by 2 video dept co-workers (insert witnesses) of walsh. Walshs attorney denied that allegation but did you notice that he didn't offer up a reason why walsh was fired, and he was fired by the Pats. There are some serious questions Walsh needs to answer about himself here before he expects the public to just take him on his word because in the end thats what this will all come down to. He said / he said

MattM
02-22-2008, 09:05 PM
What walsh has isn't physical proof the Pats did anything. I know you don't believe it but the facts are he could have very well done this on his own. It is possible just as stealing these so called tapes was possible, just as secretly taping the pats GM Pioli was possible.
The trainer in the Clemens hearing had used gaze and needles but what did that prove, nothing. It doesn't matter what Walsh shows up with on its own it doesn't prove a thing on the part of Belichick. Just as the sryinges and gauze doesn't not physically put a needle full of roids or hgh into clemens anus the so called tape doesn't provide physical evidence that Belichick even knew about it.
You know this week we heard Belichick deny anything from ordering it to ever having seen one even before he was a head coach. We heard Pioli state Walsh was fired for secretly taping his conversations with Walsh. Pioli even stated he had been told of this by 2 video dept co-workers (insert witnesses) of walsh. Walshs attorney denied that allegation but did you notice that he didn't offer up a reason why walsh was fired, and he was fired by the Pats. There are some serious questions Walsh needs to answer about himself here before he expects the public to just take him on his word because in the end thats what this will all come down to. He said / he said

Yeah, right, dream on. Now who sounds like a crazy conspiracy theorist? Pats* fans are the only people on the planet who will believe that Walsh did this on his own and that BB and the Pats* are innocent in such a case. There's been plenty of smoke in and around that team and this will only provide the "fire" we've all long suspected is there. Personally, I'm holding out for them getting folks to flip all the way up to admitting they've bribed refs, as the video evidence also seems to suggest.....

adamprez2003
02-22-2008, 10:12 PM
What walsh has isn't physical proof the Pats did anything. I know you don't believe it but the facts are he could have very well done this on his own. It is possible just as stealing these so called tapes was possible, just as secretly taping the pats GM Pioli was possible.
The trainer in the Clemens hearing had used gaze and needles but what did that prove, nothing. It doesn't matter what Walsh shows up with on its own it doesn't prove a thing on the part of Belichick. Just as the sryinges and gauze doesn't not physically put a needle full of roids or hgh into clemens anus the so called tape doesn't provide physical evidence that Belichick even knew about it.
You know this week we heard Belichick deny anything from ordering it to ever having seen one even before he was a head coach. We heard Pioli state Walsh was fired for secretly taping his conversations with Walsh. Pioli even stated he had been told of this by 2 video dept co-workers (insert witnesses) of walsh. Walshs attorney denied that allegation but did you notice that he didn't offer up a reason why walsh was fired, and he was fired by the Pats. There are some serious questions Walsh needs to answer about himself here before he expects the public to just take him on his word because in the end thats what this will all come down to. He said / he said

This isnt a court of law. This is an internal league matter. Proof of taping the Rams is enough to sway public opinion in demanding that the Patriots are punished further. They dont need to prove the ridiculous notion that Walsh did this on his own. Its a PR thing and the Patriots will be stripped of their SB win because the public outside of New England will demand it. Its not law its business

MR NFLFAN
02-22-2008, 10:19 PM
Yeah, right, dream on. Now who sounds like a crazy conspiracy theorist? Pats* fans are the only people on the planet who will believe that Walsh did this on his own and that BB and the Pats* are innocent in such a case. There's been plenty of smoke in and around that team and this will only provide the "fire" we've all long suspected is there. Personally, I'm holding out for them getting folks to flip all the way up to admitting they've bribed refs, as the video evidence also seems to suggest.....

Well I believe O.J. Simpson cut his ex wifes throat too but he walked away a free man. What you believe doesn't mean a thing. The NFL has an ex FBI agent investigating Walsh why do you suppose that is? Oh yeah thats right because everyone believes him.

The star witness is full of character issues and creditability questions

Did he steal these tapes or did he make them himself...either a thief or a liar?
If he stole them what did he steal them for...Blackmail or extortion?
What was he doing contacting espn...see above
Why didn't he come forward at the get go...see above
What is the real reason he was fired as his lawyer denied Piolis reason ..
....thief or liar or extortionist and blackmailer????
If he's done nothing wrong then why does he need a kitchen sink indemnity?

Those questions need to be answered before I'd believe him or offer him indemnity. Did this guy have an ax to grind because of being fired? Because if he does he certainly had the opportunity and the means to fabricate these so called tapes.
But wait we should all just believe him because theres smoke in and around the team. Yeah right

TomBradyWoot
02-23-2008, 12:26 AM
Yeah, right, dream on. Now who sounds like a crazy conspiracy theorist? Pats* fans are the only people on the planet who will believe that Walsh did this on his own and that BB and the Pats* are innocent in such a case. There's been plenty of smoke in and around that team and this will only provide the "fire" we've all long suspected is there. Personally, I'm holding out for them getting folks to flip all the way up to admitting they've bribed refs, as the video evidence also seems to suggest.....


Dude seriously, your sig says "buffalos going to the super bowl". You have zero credibility.

brandon1986
02-23-2008, 12:49 AM
just like your team, no credibility you are the last one tombradywoot to talk about credibility
now you have a former patriot saying this has been done, just more confirmation

and now some in the media are giving credit to ted johnson who said he used to get signals on a sheet a week before the game on sunday

walsh to me is just icing on the cake
the patriots should either be stripped of the titles or have a huge * in the books also a huge * placed on the trophies
they should lose there entire draft and bb and co should be fired on spot

MR NFLFAN
02-23-2008, 02:39 AM
This isnt a court of law. This is an internal league matter. Proof of taping the Rams is enough to sway public opinion in demanding that the Patriots are punished further. They dont need to prove the ridiculous notion that Walsh did this on his own. Its a PR thing and the Patriots will be stripped of their SB win because the public outside of New England will demand it. Its not law its business

Correct its not a court of law and in fact nobody has broken any laws. The NFL doesn't have to please you, me or even Senator Specters opinion and to tell you the truth I don't think they really will do any more than has already been done. Seeing its a business and not law we're really dealing with, the league will do whats best for business, and that is close the door on all this nonsense here and now. Haven't you been reading or listening because the league has been sending a message loud and clear.

Words from the competition committee:

Its a league matter...
We feel the league's investigation was through
and are satisfied with the findings...
we need to move on
The steelers owner stating the video tape had no effect of the outcome of the NE vs Steelers games
Andy Reid stating he doesn't believe the eagles lost because of any stolen signals
The commisioner himself saying teams know their signals are stolen so they change them up.
Both The Patriots and the Jets decline request from the Senator wacko Specter to be questioned. Yeah imagine that even the jets won't talk.
Why?

The league is getting its house in order and putting forth a united front and Specter is being locked out in the back yard. Cheating of the past has been handled internally and this is how this will be taken care of now. We'll most likely never see what Walsh has as the league doesn't care they just want to move on. If they did care we'd have already heard what he has say and seen those spy tapes. but the fact is it doesn't matter what Walsh has to say or show its not good for business and thats whats most important to the entire league.....the bottom line $$$$

The senator has a personal agenda against the league and is trying to use the patriots and camera gate to get to the league but make no mistake about it, it has nothing to do with honest games.

So the facade of honest and fair games will continue to be just that merely a facade.
So tell me adamprez what are you going to do when you finally figure this all out? Stop going to or watching dolphins games? Perhaps no more dolphins hats or shirts in your closet? Maybe stand on your street corner with picket signs?
Yeah that ought to teach the NFL a lesson.

adamprez2003
02-23-2008, 02:51 AM
Correct its not a court of law and in fact nobody has broken any laws. The NFL doesn't have to please you, me or even Senator Specters opinion and to tell you the truth I don't think they really will do any more than has already been done. Seeing its a business and not law we're really dealing with, the league will do whats best for business, and that is close the door on all this nonsense here and now. Haven't you been reading or listening because the league has been sending a message loud and clear.

Words from the competition committee:

Its a league matter...
We feel the league's investigation was through
and are satisfied with the findings...
we need to move on
The steelers owner stating the video tape had no effect of the outcome of the NE vs Steelers games
Andy Reid stating he doesn't believe the eagles lost because of any stolen signals
The commisioner himself saying teams know their signals are stolen so they change them up.
Both The Patriots and the Jets decline request from the Senator wacko Specter to be questioned. Yeah imagine that even the jets won't talk.
Why?

The league is getting its house in order and putting forth a united front and Specter is being locked out in the back yard. Cheating of the past has been handled internally and this is how this will be taken care of now. We'll most likely never see what Walsh has as the league doesn't care they just want to move on. If they did care we'd have already heard what he has say and seen those spy tapes. but the fact is it doesn't matter what Walsh has to say or show its not good for business and thats whats most important to the entire league.....the bottom line $$$$

The senator has a personal agenda against the league and is trying to use the patriots and camera gate to get to the league but make no mistake about it, it has nothing to do with honest games.

So the facade of honest and fair games will continue to be just that merely a facade.
So tell me adamprez what are you going to do when you finally figure this all out? Stop going to or watching dolphins games? Perhaps no more dolphins hats or shirts in your closet? Maybe stand on your street corner with picket signs?
Yeah that ought to teach the NFL a lesson.

You mistake the power of the NFL. In the end they are at the whim of advertisers and fans.Now as I have stated, the entire NFL fanbase minus the Patriots fans wants to see the Pats hit hard on this. Granted pickets or letter writing campaigns arent going to do it but what will get the NFL to act is the media. The NFL needs the media and the media is circling around this story like sharks smelling blood. In the end, Goodell will have to take his good buddy, Kraft, down. And with it at least one SuperBowl will be sacrificed. Then the media Gods will be satisfied

MR NFLFAN
02-23-2008, 03:40 AM
You mistake the power of the NFL. In the end they are at the whim of advertisers and fans.Now as I have stated, the entire NFL fanbase minus the Patriots fans wants to see the Pats hit hard on this. Granted pickets or letter writing campaigns arent going to do it but what will get the NFL to act is the media. The NFL needs the media and the media is circling around this story like sharks smelling blood. In the end, Goodell will have to take his good buddy, Kraft, down. And with it at least one SuperBowl will be sacrificed. Then the media Gods will be satisfied


Really? So let me see If i can get this straight. I mistake the power of the NFL? LOL
So the entire fan base minus us pats fans wants to see the pats hit hard on this? Well they have already been hit hard but lets forget that for a moment.
So this "entire fan base" is going to do what to the NFL to get their way? Next season on opening day are they going to boycott there favorite teams games? So the jets fans won't what buy tickets to say a jet/bills game? Or perhaps the Colts fans won't buy a ticket to see the colts play the jags? Or do you suppose none of these fans won't tune in on tv? We both know they will and those advertisers will be bellying up to buy time just as they've done in the past. So how exactly are these fans going to force Goodell to take down his good buddy as you say? Opening day there will be what 15 games played and 14 of them will not be the patriots so what do you expect those fans to blow off there own teams to get to goodell? It isn't going to happen, And the great and powerful media wizard will do what exactly? The media wants to sell papers and thats all they care about. When this dies out those media sharks will be on to the next piece of fresh meat to again sell papers. If the the NFL just closes the door on this what are they going to do just re-release old stories? The senator is really powerless as we've already determind nobody broke the law and goodell didn't burn CIA tapes. The senate would be quite foolish to allow Specter to indemnify walsh to aquire evidence for something thats not even against the law. Hell he can't even get anyone with in the league to talk to him anymore.
The fact is the Pats and the Kraft have made more money for the league this season than any other NFL team and I can tell you as a business man Goodell loves that. Time to face facts the NFL holds all the cards and their looking to play a winning hand not fold their cards. To commisioner Goodell the best thing he can do from a business stand point for the league and its owners is end this and move on and thats what I expect him to do.

adamprez2003
02-23-2008, 03:54 AM
Really? So let me see If i can get this straight. I mistake the power of the NFL? LOL
So the entire fan base minus us pats fans wants to see the pats hit hard on this? Well they have already been hit hard but lets forget that for a moment.
So this "entire fan base" is going to do what to the NFL to get their way? Next season on opening day are they going to boycott there favorite teams games? So the jets fans won't what buy tickets to say a jet/bills game? Or perhaps the Colts fans won't buy a ticket to see the colts play the jags? Or do you suppose none of these fans won't tune in on tv? We both know they will and those advertisers will be bellying up to buy time just as they've done in the past. So how exactly are these fans going to force Goodell to take down his good buddy as you say? Opening day there will be what 15 games played and 14 of them will not be the patriots so what do you expect those fans to blow off there own teams to get to goodell? It isn't going to happen, And the great and powerful media wizard will do what exactly? The media wants to sell papers and thats all they care about. When this dies out those media sharks will be on to the next piece of fresh meat to again sell papers. If the the NFL just closes the door on this what are they going to do just re-release old stories? The senator is really powerless as we've already determind nobody broke the law and goodell didn't burn CIA tapes. The senate would be quite foolish to allow Specter to indemnify walsh to aquire evidence for something thats not even against the law. Hell he can't even get anyone with in the league to talk to him anymore.
The fact is the Pats and the Kraft have made more money for the league this season than any other NFL team and I can tell you as a business man Goodell loves that. Time to face facts the NFL holds all the cards and their looking to play a winning hand not fold their cards. To commisioner Goodell the best thing he can do from a business stand point for the league and its owners is end this and move on and thats what I expect him to do.

As I said in my post the fans have nothing to do here. Its all the media. And this is one of those times where the fans and the media interests are on the same page.

Dont discount Specter either. Football enjoys some extra legal privileges that could be stripped if they come off as arrogant in this. The league will not stand up to the media. In the end the Patriots will be served up on a dish like a pig with an apple in its mouth

MR NFLFAN
02-23-2008, 01:10 PM
As I said in my post the fans have nothing to do here. Its all the media. And this is one of those times where the fans and the media interests are on the same page.

Dont discount Specter either. Football enjoys some extra legal privileges that could be stripped if they come off as arrogant in this. The league will not stand up to the media. In the end the Patriots will be served up on a dish like a pig with an apple in its mouth

The media is nothing more than a bunch of talking heads. ESPN was the network approached 1st approached by Walsh did you see them stand up and offer to indemnify him? So much for the media.
I think your give specter way too much credit in all of this and last I knew there was no law against arrogance. Without some further evidence this is going to be put to rest and the NFL isn't going to kitchen sink indemnify a guy to cut their own throats even Specter has reached that conclusion.

satz
02-23-2008, 01:36 PM
I might have missed the point anyway explain this

PATRIOTS SAY THEY HAVE NO PRIVACY AGREEMENT WITH WALSH YET HE WANTS PROTECTIONS FROM PATRIOTS FOR NOT SUEING HIM?.I DO NOT GET THIS CAN SOMEONE EXPLAIN THIS UNLESS OFCOURSE WHAT HE HAS IS STOLEN PROPERTY.

satz
04-24-2008, 08:19 AM
Got to dig up this old thread of mine due to this statement in the deal between walsh and NFL.


The agreement specifically provides indemnity for Walsh with respect to “any alleged audiotaping by Walsh of any of his superiors while employed by the Club.” And that’s surely a reference to the contention from Patriots V.P. of player personnel Scott Pioli that Walsh was fired for secretly recording conversations between the two of them.

At the time, Walsh’s lawyer called the allegation a “complete fabrication.” So if it’s a complete fabrication, why would the indemnity agreement specifically include such activities? If it’s a “complete fabrication,” there’s no need to seek idemnity, is there?

Ol' Saint Nick
04-24-2008, 10:47 AM
18-1

satz
04-24-2008, 11:39 AM
1-15

Van Greco
04-24-2008, 07:17 PM
1-15 > 18-1*

Ol' Saint Nick
04-24-2008, 09:01 PM
*

MattM
04-24-2008, 09:26 PM
Got to dig up this old thread of mine due to this statement in the deal between walsh and NFL.


The agreement specifically provides indemnity for Walsh with respect to “any alleged audiotaping by Walsh of any of his superiors while employed by the Club.” And that’s surely a reference to the contention from Patriots V.P. of player personnel Scott Pioli that Walsh was fired for secretly recording conversations between the two of them.

At the time, Walsh’s lawyer called the allegation a “complete fabrication.” So if it’s a complete fabrication, why would the indemnity agreement specifically include such activities? If it’s a “complete fabrication,” there’s no need to seek idemnity, is there?

And the Agt. also clearly contemplates situations where the Pats may want to argue Walsh was acting on his own--does that then mean he has the SB 36 tape by your logic (or Florio's logic, I should say)?

satz
04-25-2008, 08:17 AM
1-15 > 18-1*

that was funny ... :sidelol:

satz
04-25-2008, 08:21 AM
And the Agt. also clearly contemplates situations where the Pats may want to argue Walsh was acting on his own--does that then mean he has the SB 36 tape by your logic (or Florio's logic, I should say)?

The biggest problem is its been 104 days since walsh said "nothing" and we are still arguring and i am curious to see what the heck this guy has.Also , if you read the print the NFL will cover the charges if he is seued.say he brings this audio tapes out and being a resident of MA he will be sued automatically by the DA for this. this is even more complicated that if senator arlen wants to check these out and go public as this will be one more slavo against the patriots act [not the team but the republican taping law /w magistrate approval] . As a republican he will not touch it even after all the this talk :sidelol:.

Phin-o-rama
04-25-2008, 08:35 AM
that was funny ... :sidelol:

and true:woot:

satz
04-25-2008, 09:48 AM
and true:woot:

Good luck this season though, I mean we all watch sports for fun and it would depressing to constantly lose. I was bummbed after SB which amazing as i never felt so bad when they lost before and realized that the media makes it more important then it is which is just a game.

Phin-o-rama
04-25-2008, 03:14 PM
Good luck this season though, I mean we all watch sports for fun and it would depressing to constantly lose. I was bummbed after SB which amazing as i never felt so bad when they lost before and realized that the media makes it more important then it is which is just a game.

no no, if anything the media didn't make a big enough deal out of that loss...

that was a loss of EPIC proportions, perhaps the biggest loss in NFL history.

to be so close to being immortal, a feat that is nearly impossible, and then to let it slip through the grasps? there is a football God son, and he spoke...pats are not worthy.

:up:

Itsdahumidity
04-25-2008, 03:32 PM
no no, if anything the media didn't make a big enough deal out of that loss...

that was a loss of EPIC proportions, perhaps the biggest loss in NFL history.

to be so close to being immortal, a feat that is nearly impossible, and then to let it slip through the grasps? there is a football God son, and he spoke...pats are not worthy.

:up:

can I get an amen!?

satz
04-26-2008, 07:54 AM
no no, if anything the media didn't make a big enough deal out of that loss...

that was a loss of EPIC proportions, perhaps the biggest loss in NFL history.

to be so close to being immortal, a feat that is nearly impossible, and then to let it slip through the grasps? there is a football God son, and he spoke...pats are not worthy.

:up:
some one needs a life ?:sidelol:.honestly that was funny.

jetsman
05-05-2008, 12:02 AM
You know what always seems to get lost in this whole "Spygate" thing is how Mangini totally ****ed over his old coach!

I wonder if he knew the **** was gonna hit the fan like this when he blew the whistle on Bellicheat...
It wasn't Mangini who caught the Patsies* and turned them in,it was Steve Yarnell,the Jets head of security.He caught them filming and pointed it out to NFL security who then confiscated the evidence.This happened while Mangini was ON THE FIELD coaching the Jets.He found out after halftime about the cheaters tactics.
Yarnell used to work for the FBI and is very good at his job.He caught the Patsies* last season and the league swept it under the rug and said if they didn't have a smoking gun they wouldn't do anything about it.That's why Yarnell was so focused on them this time around.He was determined to catch them red-handed with the goods and he did(and how spankie)!!
Here's your smoking gun commissioner.............................:sidelol::sidelol:

TomBradyWoot
05-07-2008, 10:13 PM
And Matt Walsh has nothing.

Shocker.

FinsNCanes
05-09-2008, 01:43 AM
And Matt Walsh has nothing.

Shocker.

Except more than a handful of video tapes proving you all cheated. I guess that's nothing though. The NFL may try and sweep this under the rug but the fans all know what the Pats did and it does nothing but tarnish your "legacy" now.