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dolphan39
01-29-2002, 11:59 AM
Dolphins: Negotiating with Fiedler (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news/fanball/20020129/fanball-dolphinsnegotiatingw.html)


Fiedler is expected to make between $3 and $5 million per year

but my concern is also signing bonus since that counts ag. the cap 4ever (for the most part).

FFiB
01-29-2002, 01:07 PM
Originally posted by dolphan39
Dolphins: Negotiating with Fiedler (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news/fanball/20020129/fanball-dolphinsnegotiatingw.html)



but my concern is also signing bonus since that counts ag. the cap 4ever (for the most part).

Good...with his signing we can focus on the real needs at this time...

Running game and stopping the run....

I believe the the Fins will do the smart thing and calculate signing bonuses well....so far we haven't been hit over the last 3 years ....

Being over the cap is just a mere result of some contracts becoming accelerated this year which will be re-negotiated...

Last time we were hit in the cap for years was in 1995 (the great Don Shula)....our hits were:

1996: 17 million
1997: 13 million
1998: 8 million

all dead money (guaranteed) to players who already were playing somewhere else....

I.e. we paid Cox in 1996 and 1997 while he was already playing for another team....

This won't happen again.....

dolphan39
01-29-2002, 04:15 PM
from http://www.gopbi.com/sports/football/dolphins/01/29.html



The biggest hurdle appears to be guaranteed money, including the size of the signing bonus. The Dolphins would like assurances that if something were to happen to Fiedler they would not take such a big salary-cap hit.

The recent signing of Chad Hutchinson by the Dallas Cowboys could affect Fiedler's deal. Hutchinson, who has not played in the NFL, received a $3.1 million signing bonus and $5 million guaranteed.

dolfan87
01-29-2002, 04:41 PM
I wouldn't worry about it. Jay knows what the team can do money wise, and my bet is that he signs a fair deal.

Canuck
01-29-2002, 04:49 PM
I don't see Fiedler signing elesewhere or holding out for more money to the point where we wouldn't match it. He's too smart not to resign with the team that gave him his 1st real shot of starting. A team that has an improved WR corps (look out for Chambers next year) and a running game that'll be priority one this offseason.

1st round: OT-Levi Jones
3rd round: RB-Jonathon Wells

I'd be happy with Fiedler, Chambers, Jones and Wells heading into next season playing the 4 most critical positions on offense under Norv's tutledge.

iceblizzard69
01-29-2002, 07:01 PM
Originally posted by dolfan87
I wouldn't worry about it. Jay knows what the team can do money wise, and my bet is that he signs a fair deal.

Jay thinks he is worth 5 million a year, but he is WRONG! He is worth 2.5 at best. We would get more out of McNown and for less money. Fiedler is a below average starter.

Dolfan984
01-29-2002, 08:06 PM
He is worth about 3.5 mil a year. I hope he signs for 3 million.

Jay Fiedler is an above average starting quarterback.

dolfan87
01-29-2002, 08:12 PM
Ice, why the anger towards Jay? :D

Dolfan984
01-29-2002, 08:13 PM
He isn't Dan Marino. Above average isn't good enough for him.

phinsphan4ever
01-29-2002, 08:27 PM
Originally posted by dolfan87
Ice, why the anger towards Jay? :D



I think the anger that Ice has is for Jay's inconsistency throughout the entire year! I'll say it again. Jay is a backup quarterback at best. I will almost guarantee you that if the offensive line is healthy and if we are able to address our running game in the offseason, that Jay will still be INCONSISTENT(i.e. making stupid decisions/throws into double and triple coverages)!:fire:

miadphan13
01-29-2002, 08:31 PM
Originally posted by aqua&orange54
I think the anger that Ice has is for Jay's inconsistency throughout the entire year! I'll say it again. Jay is a backup quarterback at best. I will almost guarantee you that if the offensive line is healthy and if we are able to address our running game in the offseason, that Jay will still be INCONSISTENT(i.e. making stupid decisions/throws into double and triple coverages)!:fire:

I would have to agree. :(

Dolfan984
01-29-2002, 08:33 PM
Jay even admitted that he wasn't allowing things to play through in the beginning of the year (why there wasn't many sacks) and then he started not throwing the picks when he let the play go through, but the paper line crumbled and he was sacked a lot. We need an O-line.

iceblizzard69
01-29-2002, 08:45 PM
Originally posted by dolfan87
Ice, why the anger towards Jay? :D

Aqua already answered for me, it is the inconsistency. He isn't good against good teams, which is a huge problem. We won't go to the Super Bowl (or past the first round) if we can't beat the best. The only really good team we beat this year was the Raiders, a game where Jay was great, but then sucked against the Rams. I was pumped and thought we were going to the bowl after we beat the Titans in Tennesee (only the second team to beat them at their new place, but a lot of teams added their names to that list this year) and Oakland, but then we got killed against St. Louis on offense and defense. Jay was good in games against teams like Buffalo, Indy, etc., but not against the best. Oh yeah, and he did well against the Patriots, but an unknown fact is that they were in the bottom third in defense this year.

dolfan06
01-29-2002, 08:58 PM
for the amount of money we need to be spending, if he still wants 5 mil, let him walk and try to bring up cade. at least let lucas start if cade is not ready. i think jay only had 3 games without an INT this year and most of the ones he did have were multiple INT's. thats not saying they were all his fault, i'm just saying it happened!:rolleyes:

dolfan87
01-29-2002, 09:27 PM
Well I understand if your worried about his inconsistency. However a starting QB isn't easy to find, and Cade I dunno man, he was EXTREMELY inconsistent at Chicago.

I also want to point out, that no one played well against the high caliber teams. Not the defense, not the running game, no one. It is very hard to carry a whole team, especially when your only a second year starter. Marino he is not, and even the great Dan couldn't carry this team by himself.

Jay played with alot more brains towards the second half of the season, and I hope with another off season to grow as a starting QB, he will only play smarter next season.

Either way, you can pretty much forget about getting rid of Jay. They are going to sign him up, and we are going to be watching him lead the Dolphins next year.

Gonna have to accept it, and hope, pray, beg, whatever for a decent O line and a running game.

phinsphan4ever
01-29-2002, 09:33 PM
Originally posted by dolfan87
Well I understand if your worried about his inconsistency. However a starting QB isn't easy to find, and Cade I dunno man, he was EXTREMELY inconsistent at Chicago.

I also want to point out, that no one played well against the high caliber teams. Not the defense, not the running game, no one. It is very hard to carry a whole team, especially when your only a second year starter. Marino he is not, and even the great Dan couldn't carry this team by himself.

Jay played with alot more brains towards the second half of the season, and I hope with another off season to grow as a starting QB, he will only play smarter next season.

Either way, you can pretty much forget about getting rid of Jay. They are going to sign him up, and we are going to be watching him lead the Dolphins next year.

Gonna have to accept it, and hope, pray, beg, whatever for a decent O line and a running game.



The reason Jay's coming back is because Dave doesn't have any balls! :yell: Overall, I like Dave and think he's done a fairly decent job in his tenure so far, but when it comes to making a tough decision, I've noticed that Dave tends to shy away from those.:fire:


:monkey: On Dave's cowering away from making a tough decision for the betterment of the 'phins.

dolfan87
01-29-2002, 09:41 PM
Well now A&O, maybe it isn't a case of Dave not having the balls to do it, maybe he really thinks Jay is the guy for us.

Tell me one thing, who would you bring in to replace Fiedler?

phinsphan4ever
01-29-2002, 09:46 PM
Originally posted by dolfan87
Well now A&O, maybe it isn't a case of Dave not having the balls to do it, maybe he really thinks Jay is the guy for us.

Tell me one thing, who would you bring in to replace Fiedler?


You've got a legitimate point there. There's one quarterback that is being shopped out there that noone is talking about pursuing. I think he'd be great with our offensive scheme, but there has been no mention of the 'phins pursuing him. He's only 29 yrs old and has at least 4-5 good quality years left in him. He's mobile, with a fairly decent arm, and has a nice touch on the ball. His name is Mark Brunell. What do you think 87? That's who I'd bring in. The Jags are reportedly shopping him around. I don't think that Dave realizes that our window of opportunity is closing, and closing fast. He needs to take a risk for once before our window is fully closed.:(

Slaine
01-30-2002, 10:03 AM
The most popular guy in town is always the backup quarterback... ;)

I sat back a bit and trusted the coaches when it came to Kordell last offseason and it all came together (except against the Patriots :cry: ) pretty well. My thinking was that if they are constantly around the guy, know how he reacts and know exactly what he's capable of, then you'd hope that they'd be able to make a more informed decision than me listening to games on the Internet in England.

Fiedler will be fine - you'd be mad not to re-sign him.

ohall
01-30-2002, 07:30 PM
Originally posted by iceblizzard69


Jay thinks he is worth 5 million a year, but he is WRONG! He is worth 2.5 at best. We would get more out of McNown and for less money. Fiedler is a below average starter.

... what McNown can or cannot do in this team? As far as what he has produced at the NFL level to this point he is not worth the RISK without having a plan A or possibly plan B.

We have a QB in Jay Fiedler that appears to play well when he is actually permitted to throw the ball. After saying all that there are limits to this. It is never wise to over pay for FA talent. I feel 3.5 million a year would be over paying for Jay, but just slightly.

The perfect # for me would be 2.5-3 million per year with incentives. Contrary to what a lot of feel here I feel Jay is very very close to playing at a HIGH level in the NFL. He could easily be the next Gannon or Garcia. I would truly hate to see him do this on another team.

Oliver...

ohall
01-30-2002, 07:49 PM
Originally posted by aqua&orange54




I think the anger that Ice has is for Jay's inconsistency throughout the entire year! I'll say it again. Jay is a backup quarterback at best. I will almost guarantee you that if the offensive line is healthy and if we are able to address our running game in the offseason, that Jay will still be INCONSISTENT(i.e. making stupid decisions/throws into double and triple coverages)!:fire:

... all QB's throw into double and triple coverage and at least to me Jay appeared to do this well. For example the Colts Monday Night game. The pass that he threw to Minor was into triple coverage.

Jay makes STUPID mistake, no doubt. Even Warner makes STUPID mistakes. It is common knowledge that Warner will GIVE opposing D's at least 3 balls per game they can INT.

I'm not attempting to compare Fiedler to Warner I am simply making it clear if you want to be a GOOD QB you must take risks.

Jay does this and more often than not it has been a positive play for the Dolphins, not negative as you are attempting to imply.

Jay had a GOOD year and simply improved at the end of the season. He and Chambers were the Dolphins O at the end of the season.

Let's not forget if McKnight catches that beautiful pass from Fiedler in the Ravens play-off game more than likely the Dolphin pull another come from behind victory lead by none other than Jay Fiedler.

Of course he would still not get any props from some ppl. Which is fine, every1 is entitled to their opinion.

Oliver...

iceblizzard69
01-30-2002, 08:24 PM
Originally posted by Oliver


... all QB's throw into double and triple coverage and at least to me Jay appeared to do this well. For example the Colts Monday Night game. The pass that he threw to Minor was into triple coverage.

Jay makes STUPID mistake, no doubt. Even Warner makes STUPID mistakes. It is common knowledge that Warner will GIVE opposing D's at least 3 balls per game they can INT.

I'm not attempting to compare Fiedler to Warner I am simply making it clear if you want to be a GOOD QB you must take risks.

Jay does this and more often than not it has been a positive play for the Dolphins, not negative as you are attempting to imply.

Jay had a GOOD year and simply improved at the end of the season. He and Chambers were the Dolphins O at the end of the season.

Let's not forget if McKnight catches that beautiful pass from Fiedler in the Ravens play-off game more than likely the Dolphin pull another come from behind victory lead by none other than Jay Fiedler.

Of course he would still not get any props from some ppl. Which is fine, every1 is entitled to their opinion.

Oliver...


Jay makes LOTS of stupid mistakes and only gets it done against bad teams (except for Oakland.) If McNown doesn't work, which I wouldn't expect since he knows our system and has worked hard all year, we would still have ay Lucas, who performed very well in a starting role a few years back when Testeverde was injured.

Dolfan984
01-30-2002, 08:48 PM
If Fiedler leaves, our offense will turn to ****.

dolfan06
01-30-2002, 08:54 PM
Originally posted by Dolfan984
If Fiedler leaves, our offense will turn to ****. but if they don't bolster the O-line, then they better hand out rolls of toilet paper when they take tickets!:(

Dolfan984
01-30-2002, 09:06 PM
Exactly 06.

ohall
01-30-2002, 09:57 PM
Originally posted by dolfan06
but if they don't bolster the O-line, then they better hand out rolls of toilet paper when they take tickets!:(

... and I don't agree. Before the Jets game in NY the Dolphins had the #4 rushing attack in the entire NFL. After Lamar Smith (LS) fumbled 2 times in that game he was no longer the RB we all knew and that's is when everything went WRONG with the Dolphins rushing attack.

They didn't lose Dixon until 5 weeks after the Jets game in NY. So the injury excuse does not apply.

It's my opinion what went wrong with the rushing attack last year was #1 LS totally losing his confidence after the Jets game in NY #2 the play calling on Gailey's part and then #3 the injries to the OL.

The OL was banged up when they started the '01 season and some how some way they were having success until the Jets game in NY.

To me this proves that at the very least we have a GOOD core group of OL. Yes it can use some improvement, but IMO there are other pressing needs. Like A FOR REAL RB and for the Dolphins to settle their DT situation.

Then if we get those things in order I say go for it, improve the OL, but not before that IMO.

Oliver...

dolphan39
01-30-2002, 10:23 PM
I gotta basically agree w/you there Oliver. Lamar's collapse after the Jets makes it hard to pin your hopes on him to return to his 2000 season form. Unlike Jay who improved greatly in the 2nd half of the season. Lamar only had a handful of decent games the whole year. And while, lots of that is Gailey's fault (06 ;) ) and it was somewhat due to OL injuries, he rarely showed that explosiveness thru tacklers that he did in say the Colts playoff game. Looking at the draft, I hope we improve our OL via reasonable FAs and draft a RB or stud DLmen in round 1.

dofnsman4303
01-30-2002, 10:29 PM
i would love for te dolphins to address the line problems

just imagine having two above average lines then the rest will take care of itself, the worst thing about the dolphins is they get owned by every team in the physical category and there is nothing more i would like to see then 85% of our offseason transactions to be the linemen

iceblizzard69
01-30-2002, 10:42 PM
The offense will be better with Jay gone than it is now. At least his inconsistency will be gone.:)

ohall
01-30-2002, 11:02 PM
Originally posted by iceblizzard69
The offense will be better with Jay gone than it is now. At least his inconsistency will be gone.:)

... I haven't read all your posts and I am new to this MBoard, but why would want to get rid of a QB who I believe is 21-10 as our starter for unproven backups who have not been able to beat Fiedler out all season long?

Honestly I want to understand where you are coming from, but I'm not sure this wanting to replace Fiedler is based on logic or his actual on the field play.

If I'm wrong, in advance let me say, "SORRY".

Oliver...

dolphan39
01-30-2002, 11:08 PM
Oliver - you are joining what seems to be hopeless battle. :rolleyes:

fact is that is highly likely the Jay will be our starter for a year or more since that is what our head coach wants and he is the man the sees his play every day in practice and games. Jay may not be worth 5 mil a year, but he is lucky that there are few decent QB's, if any, that are UFA this year; unlike last year. So the market is somewhat determining his salary, not his TD/INT ratio.

iceblizzard69
01-30-2002, 11:12 PM
Originally posted by Oliver


... I haven't read all your posts and I am new to this MBoard, but why would want to get rid of a QB who I believe is 21-10 as our starter for unproven backups who have not been able to beat Fiedler out all season long?

Honestly I want to understand where you are coming from, but I'm not sure this wanting to replace Fiedler is based on logic or his actual on the field play.

If I'm wrong, in advance let me say, "SORRY".

Oliver...

I have a problem with the fact that he can't beat a winning team not named Oakland, and he couldn't even beat them in the playoffs. It may be the SI jinx, I thought he would be good in the beginning of the year when he was amazing, but then he went on the cover of SI and showed he was just inconsistent and can only beat bad teams. He did good toward the end because we played teams like Buffalo (who he was great against on the road) and Indy. He sucked in games against good teams like San Francisco. He was good against New England's subpar defense but we still lost.

dolphan39
01-30-2002, 11:19 PM
Originally posted by iceblizzard69
I have a problem with the fact that he can't beat a winning team not named Oakland Jay did not lose to anyone, the :evil: Fins did :yell:

dolfan87
01-30-2002, 11:38 PM
Jay Fiedler sucks. I say we bring back Craig Ericson. That boy could throw...well not really, but he was smart...errr...well he tried to be smart. Ok never mind, I say we see if the Pats are willing to trade Damon Huard back to us. I mean he is a qb on a Super Bowl team!! He has a great winning percentage, and I bet his salary cap hit would be less then Jay's. PLUS he doesn't throw many INT's.

Wait...is Scott Mitchel available?

Ok no..Ray Lucas, he is the answer. He knows the system, NO...wait...Cade McKnown!!!! This guy is special! He is so special that the Bears fans made a special website dedicated just to Cade. Gosh what was the name of that again? OH yea, tradecade.com. I wonder if it is any coincidence that the Bears traded Cade to Miami, and then proceeded to win the NFC Central? NAW.

OK, so it will be Cade, because he has had a year under our system and...WHAT...NEW SYSTEM? Oh crap, you mean we trained him in Chan Gailey's system for a whole year, and now he has to start all over again?

Geeez, well Jay Fiedler went 11-5 in a new system, maybe we could use him? Yea let's sign Jay, cause he has already won 23 games in two years, and seems to be the most proven guy on the roster.

Wait, what was this about?

ohall
01-30-2002, 11:40 PM
Originally posted by iceblizzard69


I have a problem with the fact that he can't beat a winning team not named Oakland, and he couldn't even beat them in the playoffs. It may be the SI jinx, I thought he would be good in the beginning of the year when he was amazing, but then he went on the cover of SI and showed he was just inconsistent and can only beat bad teams. He did good toward the end because we played teams like Buffalo (who he was great against on the road) and Indy. He sucked in games against good teams like San Francisco. He was good against New England's subpar defense but we still lost.

... it is a concern that the Dolphins have trouble beating the ELITE teams in the NFL with regularity. But this is why the Dolphins are not an ELITE team. This does not mean you should get rid of your QB because of this.

There were LARGER reasons as to why the Dolphins have troubles beating ELITE teams more so than the play of the QB.

I would say a lack of a consistent AVG running game and our DT situation which IMO lead to a piss poor run D at the end of the year.

I can understand why you feel the QB is to blame. After all we had Dan Marino here for 17-years. Fiedler is no Dan Marino!

Oliver...

dolphan39
01-30-2002, 11:46 PM
if you want to beat elite teams, you have to beat them up front in the trenches on both sides of the ball.

dolfan06
01-31-2002, 12:48 AM
i would like to see cade get most of the snaps in preseason. i think his biggest problem is he doesn't know the receivers or the system!:D

FinaticalOne
01-31-2002, 10:20 AM
Jay is staying. I don't see any teams willing to give him more than what we will offer him. Plus he has established himself here with the coaching staff as a starter. He'll be back, I just hope we don't sell the farm to keep him.

I think all of our QB's will get a fair look this year with a new offensive coordinator at the helm. The QB's will start on level ground and they will go from there. I just hope the learning curve isn't too steep for them where it will take half the season for our offense to start clicking. But Jay is a very smart guy and I think the transition will run smoothly with him.

Flyin11
01-31-2002, 11:13 AM
the starting spot IS NOT secure yet...It will be just like last year in training camp and in preseason...If Jay thinks he can just walk into the starting job again he might as well pack his bags and head for Washington...Bring it on Jay :evil:..cause you will have some tuff competition coming at ya...These guys want a piece of Fiedler and I'm all for it! :D :evil: :evil:

dolphan39
01-31-2002, 01:47 PM
Jay is the starter - have you not been paying attention :fire: - the only way Jay is not the starter is if we do not re-sign him. And that is Wanne's opinion, not mine.

badfoot
01-31-2002, 02:20 PM
I'm not posting much but heres how i see it....when the fins play good teams they are usually dominated at the line on both sides of the ball.We either get the lines straightened out or forget all this talk about running backs and recievers ! The o line has undergone MAJOR change the last two years ....and it shows.Same with the d line ....look at the gardner situation< we are paying BIG BUCKS for a guy who has had big time back problems , the dolphins got next to nothing for the investment and to be honest next year is no more promising.We have not addressed this situation andf it showed ...very little pressure on the better teams .I say cut gardner and get smart now he is never going to recover .and please sign some mean road grating o line men either through the draft or free agency,THIS IS A MUST

Flyin11
01-31-2002, 03:29 PM
Originally posted by dolphan39
Jay is the starter - have you not been paying attention :fire: - the only way Jay is not the starter is if we do not re-sign him. And that is Wanne's opinion, not mine.

Jay is not the starter yet.....Dave Wannstedt after the playoff game said that the position as always would be up for grabs during the offseason and that they will be closely watching Mcknown and Lucas to determine who would be the better choice. He said that Jay will have to go out there and win it if he wants it. That's what I heard...so nothing is final until week 1 ;)

miadphan13
01-31-2002, 04:14 PM
Originally posted by dolfan87
Jay Fiedler sucks. I say we bring back Craig Ericson. That boy could throw...well not really, but he was smart...errr...well he tried to be smart. Ok never mind, I say we see if the Pats are willing to trade Damon Huard back to us. I mean he is a qb on a Super Bowl team!! He has a great winning percentage, and I bet his salary cap hit would be less then Jay's. PLUS he doesn't throw many INT's. Wait...is Scott Mitchel available? Ok no..Ray Lucas, he is the answer. He knows the system, NO...wait...Cade McKnown!!!! This guy is special! He is so special that the Bears fans made a special website dedicated just to Cade. Gosh what was the name of that again? OH yea, tradecade.com. I wonder if it is any coincidence that the Bears traded Cade to Miami, and then proceeded to win the NFC Central? NAW. OK, so it will be Cade, because he has had a year under our system and...WHAT...NEW SYSTEM? Oh crap, you mean we trained him in Chan Gailey's system for a whole year, and now he has to start all over again? Geeez, well Jay Fiedler went 11-5 in a new system, maybe we could use him? Yea let's sign Jay, cause he has already won 23 games in two years, and seems to be the most proven guy on the roster. Wait, what was this about?

:lol: :lol: Very entertaining 87! :D

Your point is well taken.........

I still stand by my opinion that Fiedler makes me nervous. I have no confidence in his abilities. I went into most of our games last year with a huge amount of doubt for a victory, but was pleasantly SHOCKED when we won. I am NOT used to viewing the Dolphins in this manner and I would like that uneasiness to disappear in the next season. I don't know what the answer is, but I know what I would like the outcome to be. Just no "heartattack" team next season. :rolleyes:

dolfan87
01-31-2002, 04:35 PM
Well Miad, Jay, while not perfect (no one was) played strong against the Ravens. He was really trying out there, but the O line, Defense, RB's and WR's let him down.

We had a shot at getting back into that game right into the fourth quarter. His only INT was McKNights lame ass bobble.

My point in saying that is, he played smart, and made some good throws against a top notch defense. His team failed him, and while I understand where your coming from, what are we to think when he improved dramatically in the second half of the season?

I mean we can write him off, and say "well he is inconsistent" so that explains his improved play towards the end of the season. But what if Jay was finally getting it together? What if we blew him off, and he went to Washington, and proceeded to make the Pro Bowl, or became a top notch QB? That would be two years invested in a QB ony to prepare him for another team.

Also as I have stated before he had no support. How many QB's in this league are successful with no O line, or Running game?

I can only think of one...Jay Fiedler. He played on a team with no O line, and no running game, and went 11-5.

Peyton Manning couldn't do that, and he HAD a RB who averaged like 4.7 YPC.

Brian Griese couldn't do it either. Brad Johnson with his world class Defense, and TWO stud RB's along with a stout O line couldn't do it.

I am sorry this is so long, but I am just trying to explain why I feel the way I do as best as possible.

87

Jay Fiedler
01-31-2002, 06:27 PM
Coach wants me to stay and I want to, especially if Norv comes to coordinate. I think my performance is worth my asking price, and so does the Dolphins staff. If I somehow lose my starting position next year, so be it. But I would like to finish my career as a Miami Dolphin.:)

dolphan39
01-31-2002, 06:29 PM
hope you get a decent offensive line in front of you this year ;)

Dolfan984
01-31-2002, 07:43 PM
Originally posted by dolfan87
Well Miad, Jay, while not perfect (no one was) played strong against the Ravens. He was really trying out there, but the O line, Defense, RB's and WR's let him down.

We had a shot at getting back into that game right into the fourth quarter. His only INT was McKNights lame ass bobble.

My point in saying that is, he played smart, and made some good throws against a top notch defense. His team failed him, and while I understand where your coming from, what are we to think when he improved dramatically in the second half of the season?

I mean we can write him off, and say "well he is inconsistent" so that explains his improved play towards the end of the season. But what if Jay was finally getting it together? What if we blew him off, and he went to Washington, and proceeded to make the Pro Bowl, or became a top notch QB? That would be two years invested in a QB ony to prepare him for another team.

Also as I have stated before he had no support. How many QB's in this league are successful with no O line, or Running game?

I can only think of one...Jay Fiedler. He played on a team with no O line, and no running game, and went 11-5.

Peyton Manning couldn't do that, and he HAD a RB who averaged like 4.7 YPC.

Brian Griese couldn't do it either. Brad Johnson with his world class Defense, and TWO stud RB's along with a stout O line couldn't do it.

I am sorry this is so long, but I am just trying to explain why I feel the way I do as best as possible.

87


GREAT POST 87. Totally correct.

miadphan13
01-31-2002, 07:55 PM
87, I understand your point as well. :) We watched these games together and bitched together all season long.....well, I came along in Week 4. :) Anyway, my point is, I ate ALOT of crow last year because of this team and many times I dared not boast because I wasn't confident of the outcome. I want to have confidence that we can win the big games or at least not get blown out in them. The Jets game was personally a nightmare for me. :mad: The 49ers were even pumped to play us because they felt they would beat us and they did. :( If Jay stays, all I ask is that he thinks a little better before he throws a pass and he doesn't f**k up so bad that he embarrasses us fans. Sometimes he just looked like he was perhaps color blind. BTW, I am still not buying a Fiedler jersey. :p

Jay Fiedler
01-31-2002, 08:03 PM
[i]If Jay stays, all I ask is that he thinks a little better before he throws a pass and he doesn't f**k up so bad that he embarrasses us fans. Sometimes he just looked like he was perhaps color blind. BTW, I am still not buying a Fiedler jersey. :p [/B] Nobody's more embarrassed than me when I throw those turnovers. I wouldn't buy my jerseys either sometimes but because I'm on the team, I get them for free.:rolleyes: I promise I'll do better next year if my contract extension works out.

Dolfan984
01-31-2002, 08:22 PM
If Jay gets an extension for 3+ years, I'll buy a Fiedler jersey.

I've bet a few people some money already that Jay makes the pro bowl next year. (If he is a Dolphin)

iceblizzard69
01-31-2002, 08:35 PM
Originally posted by Dolfan984
If Jay gets an extension for 3+ years, I'll buy a Fiedler jersey.

I've bet a few people some money already that Jay makes the pro bowl next year. (If he is a Dolphin)

Your going to be the first one to buy a Fiedler jersey?

Dolfan984
01-31-2002, 08:40 PM
Of course Ice.

I always buy the Jerseys of our pro bowl players.

Jay is next on that list.

dofnsman4303
01-31-2002, 08:45 PM
Hey i know where you are coming from with the asking price because i would want all the money i could get to but just think you got an ivy league education to fall back on so why not free up some of the cap money that we are under. i mean if we get better linemen i really beleive that you can lead this team to the super bowl (hey if the pats can get there with tom brady we can get there).

dolfan06
01-31-2002, 09:01 PM
don't have anymore room anyway!:D

iceblizzard69
01-31-2002, 11:00 PM
Originally posted by Dolfan984
Of course Ice.

I always buy the Jerseys of our pro bowl players.

Jay is next on that list.

Pro Bowl? If the unfortunate happens and he does re-sign, I would hope that would be true, but he is average = NO pro bowl. This year Stewart made it because he could run and has 2 good WR and the truth is that he has talent.

badfoot
02-01-2002, 10:26 AM
people crack me up.....ssaying that they have no confidence in jay!I felt the same way when dan was here!Oh sure i thought we might win,but it always seemed like we were on the edge of losing and counting on dan was getting very old.Its time to realize that offensive and defensive lines are what wins championships and we are never going any where untill we get that straightened out.!!!!!Stop blaming Jay!!!!!Stop blaming dan!!!!!!!This team cant run consistantly or stop the run up front !!!!!1Open your eyes people !!!The only good moves last year were drafting chambers and minor!!!!We need a much more aggresive defensive scheme!!!Look at pitts burg and baltimore and what they do with the speed they have.I thought we had all kinds of speed on defense? USE it!!!Are you all blind?

Dolfan984
02-01-2002, 09:01 PM
Jay has average talents, but so do Rich "I can't throw past 2 yards" Gannon and Kordell "I threw what 6 TDs this year?" Stewart and they made the probowl.

Dolfan984
02-01-2002, 09:03 PM
Not to mention the fact that Tom Brady is more overrated than Chan Gailey.

dolfan06
02-01-2002, 09:11 PM
Originally posted by Dolfan984
Not to mention the fact that Tom Brady is more overrated than Chan Gailey. i heard so much good crap about gailey, and come to find out that man sucks. i wonder how much he actually wanted to win that playoff game. i know he's a pro, but it seems if GT offered him so much money it would have benefitted him more to lose. he couldn't recruit as long as he was under contract with the fins!:yell:

Dajesus
02-01-2002, 09:30 PM
Originally posted by badfoot
people crack me up.....ssaying that they have no confidence in jay!I felt the same way when dan was here!Oh sure i thought we might win,but it always seemed like we were on the edge of losing and counting on dan was getting very old.Its time to realize that offensive and defensive lines are what wins championships and we are never going any where untill we get that straightened out.!!!!!Stop blaming Jay!!!!!Stop blaming dan!!!!!!!This team cant run consistantly or stop the run up front !!!!!1Open your eyes people !!!The only good moves last year were drafting chambers and minor!!!!We need a much more aggresive defensive scheme!!!Look at pitts burg and baltimore and what they do with the speed they have.I thought we had all kinds of speed on defense? USE it!!!Are you all blind?

You crack me up! You say just the lines matter when it comes to winning superbowls, well how do you explain our loss to Oakland 2 years ago? We had a great o-line and d-line, but we still got ousted from the playoffs. A team+good coaching+good luck when it comes to injuries wins super bowls.

Jaydog57
02-01-2002, 09:33 PM
Originally posted by badfoot
Are you all blind? :cool: :cool: Actually I am, and listen to the games on the radio.:cool: :cool: Hey! who's messin with the volume knob dammit?:cool: :cool:

Dolfan984
02-01-2002, 09:39 PM
True, but he was the only person I could think of.

iceblizzard69
02-01-2002, 11:42 PM
Originally posted by Dolfan984
Not to mention the fact that Tom Brady is more overrated than Chan Gailey.

Rich Gannon can't throw far, but he doesn't throw interceptions at all. Stewart can run and his throwing improved a lot. Brady is overrated and can't throw further then 5 yards, but the way that team was going with him, it makes sense that he got selected. I don't see Brady or Stewart to make a pro bowl ever again. As for AFC QBs, Manning and Griese are both way better then your boy Jay Fiedler. Fiedler will never make the pro bowl unless he is really really lucky.

Dolfan984
02-02-2002, 12:02 AM
I agree, Manning and Griese are better than Jay.

But the rest of the AFC QBs (Maybe Brees one day) aren't much better.

Fiedler can make the probowl with Norv running the offense.

iceblizzard69
02-02-2002, 12:24 AM
Originally posted by Dolfan984
I agree, Manning and Griese are better than Jay.

But the rest of the AFC QBs (Maybe Brees one day) aren't much better.

Fiedler can make the probowl with Norv running the offense.

Here is the list of AFC QBs better then Fiedler:

Gannon
Griese
Stewart
Couch
Flutie or Brees (whoever starts next year)
Manning
Brunell
McNair
Brady or Bledsoe (whoever is starting)

Dolfan984
02-02-2002, 12:28 AM
Gannon (I'd take Jay)
Griese (I'd take Griese)
Stewart (I'd take Jay)
Couch (Couch will be better)
Flutie or Brees (whoever starts next year) (For now I'd take Jay over both)
Manning (Manninf for sure)
Brunell (I'd take Brunell)
McNair (I'd take Steve, but not by a hell of a lot)
Brady or Bledsoe (whoever is starting) (I'd take Bledsoe over Jay, but Jay over Brady. Jay is better for our offense)

Jay Fiedler
02-02-2002, 12:42 AM
You know, I get the feeling that you all don't think it's really me. I'm going around looking for fan feedback, to help with my decision to stay next year, so let me have it!:)

dolfan87
02-02-2002, 12:42 AM
Boy I almost couldn't decide which "Jay Fiedler" thread to put this in, but here you go.

Dolphins | More On Fiedler - posted at KFFL (http://nfl.kffl.com)
17:48 PT: Updating an ongoing storyline, ESPN.com's Len Pasquarelli reports the Miami Dolphins and agent Brian Levy are discussing a contract which would keep QB Jay Fiedler with the team. There is a price beyond which the Dolphins won't go to keep Fiedler, and that "drop-dead point" might not approach the $5 million per year Fiedler and Levy are said to be seeking. Some reports have Redskins coach Steve Spurrier interested in Fiedler, if he does not re-sign with Miami.


Looks like he might go to Washington after all?

iceblizzard69
02-02-2002, 12:51 AM
Originally posted by dolfan87
Boy I almost couldn't decide which "Jay Fiedler" thread to put this in, but here you go.

Dolphins | More On Fiedler - posted at KFFL (http://nfl.kffl.com)
17:48 PT: Updating an ongoing storyline, ESPN.com's Len Pasquarelli reports the Miami Dolphins and agent Brian Levy are discussing a contract which would keep QB Jay Fiedler with the team. There is a price beyond which the Dolphins won't go to keep Fiedler, and that "drop-dead point" might not approach the $5 million per year Fiedler and Levy are said to be seeking. Some reports have Redskins coach Steve Spurrier interested in Fiedler, if he does not re-sign with Miami.


Looks like he might go to Washington after all?

Hopefully he goes to Washington.

984- How can you say 19 INT Fiedler is better then Gannon who had less than 10. Gannon also had more TDs, yards, and a better QB rating. Gannon is just straight up way better then Fiedler.

Stewart was awesome this year, and unlike Fiedler, he plays well against good defenses (except for New England.)

Flutie struggled this year, but Brees is awesome. I guess you didn't see Brees play yet.

McNair almost made the pro bowl this year, and was one of the few bright spots on Tennesee. At least you admitted he is better than Jay, but he is a lot better.

Couch is better than Jay now and has a worse WR corps.

Jay Fiedler
02-02-2002, 12:51 AM
No, no, no, I don't wanna go to Washington. It's cold there! I think if we had one year with Norv Turner you guys would think different.:rolleyes:

dolfan87
02-02-2002, 12:52 AM
Well Jay, if it really is you, here is your feedback from me. I am the Senior Writer, and Editor, and my opinion is this:

If you are truly the leader of this Dolphin offense, then you have to know that the team is in a bit of a salary cap situation. You and I both know that the O line, RB and DT needs attention.

Now who am I to tell a guy not to make as much money as possible, but give yourself a chance to win the Super Bowl. Sign a FAIR contract, you know, one that pays you 2.5-3.5 mill a year, and maybe a bit more with incentives.

You need to prove to everyone, even your supporters(which I am) that you can put together a consistent season before you start demanding 5 mill a year.

Save some money for a guy to block for you, another to run the ball for you, and a guy who can plug up the middle for Zach. You can always make more money, but your real shot at getting a ring lies with your TEAM, not your 5 mill a year.

87

Jay Fiedler
02-02-2002, 01:03 AM
Thanks for the constructive criticism. Hopefully we'll ALL be better off this time next year. Lots of areas to improve on and we're working on it.:)

Jaydog57
02-02-2002, 01:19 AM
Originally posted by Jay Fiedler
Thanks for the constructive criticism. Hopefully we'll ALL be better off this time next year. Lots of areas to improve on and we're working on it.:) Well, if you don't get it together this year, we're gonna TRADE your big-earred ass to Washington. If you don't like the cold, quit leaving us fans out in it!:evil:

dolfan87
02-02-2002, 01:27 AM
LMAO Jaydog, too funny. Actually we have been contacted by a Dolphin player (not Fiedler) so you never know, this could be Jay...it's not probable, but it is possible. :D

Jaydog57
02-02-2002, 01:32 AM
Well, if it is really Fiedler I hope he gets it together. Can't take another disappointing "so close, yet so far away" kinda year, ya know?:cool:

dolfan06
02-02-2002, 01:42 AM
Originally posted by Jay Fiedler
You know, I get the feeling that you all don't think it's really me. I'm going around looking for fan feedback, to help with my decision to stay next year, so let me have it!:) the best part of you and lucas is your numbers, 6-9. you give those digits a complete new meaning!:D

Jaydog57
02-02-2002, 01:49 AM
Originally posted by dolfan06
the best part of you and lucas is your numbers, 6-9. you give those digits a complete new meaning!:D Come on man, don't associate those numbers with GUYS.:lol: I love those digits!:D

dolfan06
02-02-2002, 01:56 AM
Originally posted by Jaydog57
Come on man, don't associate those numbers with GUYS.:lol: I love those digits!:D :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

dolfan06
02-02-2002, 01:58 AM
i think it needs to go to the lounge too! if not deleted altogether!:D

Dolfan984
02-02-2002, 01:59 AM
What has been your favorite play as a Dolphin ;)

Jaydog57
02-02-2002, 02:01 AM
Send it on over, I have the night shift at the Lounge tonight.:cool:

Jay Fiedler
02-02-2002, 02:05 AM
Originally posted by Dolfan984
What has been your favorite play as a Dolphin ;)
I would have to say beating the Raiders in the final seconds earlier this season. That was great! I was even on Sports Illustrated for that one. My greatest moment. More still to come I hope.:)

Dolfan984
02-02-2002, 02:16 AM
Hey Jay. I'm looking to play some QB in College. What would you say would be the most helpful excersise to improve my arm strength?

iceblizzard69
02-02-2002, 11:12 AM
This shouldn't of been moved to the lounge. And Jay, what was Dartmouth like? You say you don't like cold weather but it certainly is cold there.

dolphan39
02-02-2002, 11:16 AM
Originally posted by iceblizzard69
This shouldn't of been moved to the lounge. And Jay, what was Dartmouth like? You say you don't like cold weather but it certainly is cold there. Yeah Jay - what town in Vermont is Dartmouth in again ? ;)

P.S. I didn't move it here...

dolfan06
02-02-2002, 12:12 PM
i moved it, it had just as much about football as my congratulating 13 for the raiders loss! if i'm not mistaken, the raiders and the pats are still in the NFL!:rolleyes:

dolphan39
02-02-2002, 02:51 PM
Originally posted by dolfan06
i moved it, it had just as much about football as my congratulating 13 for the raiders loss! if i'm not mistaken, the raiders and the pats are still in the NFL!:rolleyes: I said I'm sorry :cry: :goof:

Jay Fiedler
02-02-2002, 11:06 PM
Originally posted by dolphan39
Yeah Jay - what town in Vermont is Dartmouth in again ? ;)

Actually, Dartmouth is located in Hanover, New Hampshire, established in 1769.:)

Jay Fiedler
02-02-2002, 11:08 PM
Originally posted by iceblizzard69
And Jay, what was Dartmouth like? You say you don't like cold weather but it certainly is cold there. Yes it's VERY cold in New Hampshire in the winter. Not really one for the cold which is why I don't live up there now, and another reason I don't want to go to Washington.:)

Jay Fiedler
02-02-2002, 11:12 PM
Originally posted by Dolfan984
Hey Jay. I'm looking to play some QB in College. What would you say would be the most helpful excersise to improve my arm strength? I think this link will help you tremendously, I use some of these techniques myself.http://www.trickeyqbcamps.com/newSpring2000.htm

good luck!
:)

iceblizzard69
02-02-2002, 11:29 PM
Originally posted by Jay Fiedler
Yes it's VERY cold in New Hampshire in the winter. Not really one for the cold which is why I don't live up there now, and another reason I don't want to go to Washington.:)

And you liked the cold back then? Good research on Dartmouth's history FYI.