PDA

View Full Version : Bills Taking Hard Line On Peters



Brassmonki14120
08-19-2008, 12:22 PM
http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/08/19/bills-taking-hard-line-on-peters/#comments



Bills left tackle Jason Peters has been absent from everything this off-season — organized team activities, minicamp, training camp and now the start of the preesason.

It doesn’t appear that the Bills miss him enough to offer him the contract he wants.

Bills chief operating officer Russ Brandon has said there is nothing to talk about and will be nothing to talk about until Peters reports, and Tim Graham of ESPN (http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/08/19/bills-taking-hard-line-on-peters/#).com reports, citing an unnamed source, that the Bills are more committed than ever to their hard-line stance (http://myespn.go.com/blogs/nflnation/0-1-262/Bills-holdout-Peters-becoming-a-myth-.html) on Peters.

Per Graham, the Bills have liked the way their first-string offense has looked without Peters in the preseason. And the team seems to think that, having already given Peters a raise once since signing him as an undrafted free agent in 2004, there’s no need to give him a raise again.

The bottom line seems to be that the Bills aren’t budging, and that means that Peters is either going to report to play under his current contract or not report — and not get paid — at all.

ch19079
08-19-2008, 02:39 PM
The bills will have to pay him eventually. I do not like Peters replacement. Preseason is one thing, but the regular season is completly diffrent.

The bills just want to sign Evans first, then look to Peters. I think they are also looking ahead and trying to set an example for any other players who plan to hold out for more money.

Deep2Evans
08-19-2008, 03:18 PM
I wouldn't give him a thing until he shows up to camp. Who knows what kind of shape hes in, or what his health is or anything.

AdamDrizzy
08-19-2008, 03:18 PM
The bills will have to pay him eventually. I do not like Peters replacement. Preseason is one thing, but the regular season is completly diffrent.

The bills just want to sign Evans first, then look to Peters. I think they are also looking ahead and trying to set an example for any other players who plan to hold out for more money.

Langston is doing fine so far so I wouldn't worry too much at all

Our line looked great against the Steelers

Even Kirk looked good at RT

coalesce
08-20-2008, 12:38 PM
The Bills are 100% right in taking this stance. Peters had a raise two years ago and he should be grateful for everything he's gotten. Be a man, honor your entire contract and then earn a new contract.

Michael

feelthepain
08-20-2008, 12:42 PM
And there the Bills sit with one of the lowest cap numbers in the league and they have a player like Peters who may not have proven he can be the best in the league, but has made plenty of noise at his position. And they scratch their heads and wonder "why not us, why can't we win a SB"? Geeee, I wonder.

ch19079
08-20-2008, 12:49 PM
The Bills are 100% right in taking this stance. Peters had a raise two years ago and he should be grateful for everything he's gotten. Be a man, honor your entire contract and then earn a new contract.

Michael

2 years ago may as well be a former life in NFL terms. It seems players want new contracts/extentions every few years (especially those who think they are underpaid). They pocket a nice "signing bonus" check and keep on playing.

It was to be expected. He wont miss any regular season games. I dont think any NFL player will sit out a season (and miss out on game checks). He will just be pissed off and be a pain in the *** to resign later.

coalesce
08-20-2008, 02:51 PM
2 years ago may as well be a former life in NFL terms. It seems players want new contracts/extentions every few years (especially those who think they are underpaid). They pocket a nice "signing bonus" check and keep on playing.

It was to be expected. He wont miss any regular season games. I dont think any NFL player will sit out a season (and miss out on game checks). He will just be pissed off and be a pain in the *** to resign later.

Yes, two years is a lifetime in the NFL, but as Deep2Evans points out, what type of shape will he be in if he skips all of training camp? The offensive line has to be the most cohesive unit on the field at all times and his absence will affect timing, thereby limiting the entire team's overall effectiveness (the less the offense is on the field, the more the defense is, etc.) And what good would he be to the team is he's running out of gas in the middle of the 3rd quarter?

And off-topic, I have to say: I loved going to see the Dolphins play in Buffalo. I saw them there twice (one win and one loss) and the crowd was so much fun to be with and not once did anyone five me flak for wearing all my Dolphin gear. I hope the Bills stay in Buffalo and hope to go again in 2009.

Michael

SpaceMountain16
08-20-2008, 02:52 PM
Another sentence with "Bills" and "Taking Hard Peters" in it. What a surprise.

jp2lee783
08-20-2008, 03:11 PM
And there the Bills sit with one of the lowest cap numbers in the league and they have a player like Peters who may not have proven he can be the best in the league, but has made plenty of noise at his position. And they scratch their heads and wonder "why not us, why can't we win a SB"? Geeee, I wonder.

Would you want Miami handing out big money to a player that refuses to let team doctors examine him after coming off surgery? Didn't think so.

feelthepain
08-20-2008, 04:07 PM
Would you want Miami handing out big money to a player that refuses to let team doctors examine him after coming off surgery? Didn't think so.

Yeah, besides everyone knows how unselfish RW is. It's why the Bills get players like Stroud, they're cheap and past their prime. But Bill fans act like he's the player he was 4 years ago. It totally makes sense too when you consider Jacksonville wanted him so badly, that they'd give up such a huge talent for a 3rd round pick.

jp2lee783
08-20-2008, 05:41 PM
Yeah, besides everyone knows how unselfish RW is. It's why the Bills get players like Stroud, they're cheap and past their prime. But Bill fans act like he's the player he was 4 years ago. It totally makes sense too when you consider Jacksonville wanted him so badly, that they'd give up such a huge talent for a 3rd round pick.

Wow. Not even giving Stroud a chance to prove himself.

DaBills4life
08-20-2008, 09:26 PM
Yeah, besides everyone knows how unselfish RW is. It's why the Bills get players like Stroud, they're cheap and past their prime. But Bill fans act like he's the player he was 4 years ago. It totally makes sense too when you consider Jacksonville wanted him so badly, that they'd give up such a huge talent for a 3rd round pick.

Are you serious? Do you even read your board? When was the last time Ricky Williams did anything? 4 years ago.

Marcus Stroud was playing great last year to start, although he was suspended for roids after that. We will just have to wait and see, but dont be a hypocrite.

And also, the Bills are in the middle of negotiating contracts for Lee Evans and Angelo Crowell, are they supposed to drop everything and tell those players who did everything right they have to stop negotiations because Jason Peters is holding out?

Evans and Crowell by the way are team captains, so I doubt the Bills would do that to them.

And also, all the DT's went for the same price, a 3rd and a 5th. Rogers, Jenkins, and Stroud.

Deep2Evans
08-20-2008, 09:45 PM
Yeah, besides everyone knows how unselfish RW is. It's why the Bills get players like Stroud, they're cheap and past their prime. But Bill fans act like he's the player he was 4 years ago.


:sidelol::sidelol:


Says the guy with a Ricky freakin Williams sig. Unreal.

Deep2Evans
08-20-2008, 09:47 PM
And there the Bills sit with one of the lowest cap numbers in the league and they have a player like Peters who may not have proven he can be the best in the league, but has made plenty of noise at his position. And they scratch their heads and wonder "why not us, why can't we win a SB"? Geeee, I wonder.

And there sit the Fins, in last place in the AFC East, again, getting swept by the "lowly" Bills the last two season, and losing 5 of the last 6 meetings.

Then they wonder, after drafting 2nd Round QBs ever year, why their QBs suck, and why they had one of the most embarrassing seasons ever in the NFL.


Heres to 3 years in a row of us sweeping the Fish!

John from Hemet
08-22-2008, 02:14 AM
And there the Bills sit with one of the lowest cap numbers in the league and they have a player like Peters who may not have proven he can be the best in the league, but has made plenty of noise at his position. And they scratch their heads and wonder "why not us, why can't we win a SB"? Geeee, I wonder.

Why is it every time I see one of your posts you are putting your foot in your mouth......

Why are the bills doing such a idiotic thing? Maybe they realize that every other player and their agent are waiting to see if the bills fold and give him a new contract without reporting to camp? The bills will not be held hostage by a free agent former TE that they molded into a Pro Bowl LT. I just hope they dont waive his fines when he reports to camp.

John from Hemet
08-22-2008, 02:16 AM
Wow. Not even giving Stroud a chance to prove himself.

You expected something different from this poster?

Justasportsfan
08-22-2008, 10:11 AM
:sidelol::sidelol:


Says the guy with a Ricky freakin Williams sig. Unreal.

:sidelol: Ironic.

djfresh47
08-22-2008, 10:30 AM
Peters is underpaid. Though I think he could go about it in a different manner and get the results. Him getting a new contract a few years ago doesn't mean a thing. NFL contracts aren't guranteed and teams don't honor contracts so I have no problem when guys hold out. I do believe the Bills want to get other guys re-signed like Evans first. From the moves the Bills have made the past two offseasons it appears they're building from the offensive and defensive line than out. When they've got maybe the best LT in the NFL they've gotta get the deal done.

feelthepain
08-22-2008, 10:57 AM
And there sit the Fins, in last place in the AFC East, again, getting swept by the "lowly" Bills the last two season, and losing 5 of the last 6 meetings.

Then they wonder, after drafting 2nd Round QBs ever year, why their QBs suck, and why they had one of the most embarrassing seasons ever in the NFL.


Heres to 3 years in a row of us sweeping the Fish!

And there sit the Bills 60 years later still wanting to win something....anything!!!:rolleyes2:

Brassmonki14120
08-22-2008, 12:09 PM
And there the Bills sit with one of the lowest cap numbers in the league and they have a player like Peters who may not have proven he can be the best in the league, but has made plenty of noise at his position. And they scratch their heads and wonder "why not us, why can't we win a SB"? Geeee, I wonder.

No one is scratching their heads and if that's what you think then you really haven't been paying attention. The Bills are rebuilding the team and doing a very good job of it. I'm feeling pretty satisfied with the way things are shaping up.


Yeah, besides everyone knows how unselfish RW is. It's why the Bills get players like Stroud, they're cheap and past their prime. But Bill fans act like he's the player he was 4 years ago. It totally makes sense too when you consider Jacksonville wanted him so badly, that they'd give up such a huge talent for a 3rd round pick.Glad to hear that you think the Bills are cheap, hearing how we over paid Dockery and Walker was getting old.

And it's not like the Phins are have an open wallet and are bringing in great young talent. Jason Ferguson was going to retire last year after he got hurt. Could have had Brees but Daunte was cheaper. And probably for less money than the phins are paying Porter, who is also past his prime. There's no big mystery to why he keeps getting injured.


And there sit the Bills 60 years later still wanting to win something....anything!!!http://www.finheaven.com/clear.gifThe haven't even been around for 50 years. They also won 2 AFL Championships. And it's true that people might not know that they have the Championships because it happened oh so long ago but everyone remembers who the joke of the league was last year, even you.

feelthepain
08-22-2008, 07:50 PM
No one is scratching their heads and if that's what you think then you really haven't been paying attention. The Bills are rebuilding the team and doing a very good job of it. I'm feeling pretty satisfied with the way things are shaping up.

Right, Bill fans are talking playoffs every off season. This year is no different and I find it amusing that you say the Bills are rebuilding and 90% of the other Bill fans claim the Dolphins are rebuilding and the Bills are a playoff team, so which is it? Are the Bill rebuilding or are they a playoff team.


Glad to hear that you think the Bills are cheap, hearing how we over paid Dockery and Walker was getting old.

And it's not like the Phins are have an open wallet and are bringing in great young talent. Jason Ferguson was going to retire last year after he got hurt. Could have had Brees but Daunte was cheaper. And probably for less money than the phins are paying Porter, who is also past his prime. There's no big mystery to why he keeps getting injured.

The Bills are always...ALWAYS, the one of the teams with the lowest cap number. It would be nice if you wouldn't try and act like no one knows this.


The haven't even been around for 50 years. They also won 2 AFL Championships. And it's true that people might not know that they have the Championships because it happened oh so long ago but everyone remembers who the joke of the league was last year, even you.

50 years or 60 years it doesn't matter the only success the Bills have had since the two leagues became one was about 5 years in the 90's, beyond that the Bills have been pretty much worthless. You can cry about it, you can point fingers, you can focus on other teams issues, but you can't change what has been one of the worst NFL franchises in the history of the game. Deal with it or change teams.

Brassmonki14120
08-22-2008, 08:04 PM
Right, Bill fans are talking playoffs every off season. This year is no different and I find it amusing that you say the Bills are rebuilding and 90% of the other Bill fans claim the Dolphins are rebuilding and the Bills are a playoff team, so which is it? Are the Bill rebuilding or are they a playoff team.



The Bills are always...ALWAYS, the one of the teams with the lowest cap number. It would be nice if you wouldn't try and act like no one knows this.



50 years or 60 years it doesn't matter the only success the Bills have had since the two leagues became one was about 5 years in the 90's, beyond that the Bills have been pretty much worthless. You can cry about it, you can point fingers, you can focus on other teams issues, but you can't change what has been one of the worst NFL franchises in the history of the game. Deal with it or change teams .

Can ya guess who said this?


Please, they added a G from Washington that had far more talent across the board on the Oline for Dockery to play next to. Dockery has never made a probowl he was grossly overpaid yet he has suddenly made their Oline much better? I'd like to know how. Langston Walker was a turnstile in Oakland and he will make the Bills Oline better, from where the backu position?.

djfresh47
08-22-2008, 09:10 PM
Right, Bill fans are talking playoffs every off season. This year is no different and I find it amusing that you say the Bills are rebuilding and 90% of the other Bill fans claim the Dolphins are rebuilding and the Bills are a playoff team, so which is it? Are the Bill rebuilding or are they a playoff team.



The Bills are always...ALWAYS, the one of the teams with the lowest cap number. It would be nice if you wouldn't try and act like no one knows this.



50 years or 60 years it doesn't matter the only success the Bills have had since the two leagues became one was about 5 years in the 90's, beyond that the Bills have been pretty much worthless. You can cry about it, you can point fingers, you can focus on other teams issues, but you can't change what has been one of the worst NFL franchises in the history of the game. Deal with it or change teams.


Haven't both teams been pretty worthless for about a decade? I'm a Dolphins fan but isn't it sad that we've gotta bring up championship teams from over 30 years ago to dictate how great of a franchise they are? The Dolphins almost ran the table in reverse. The Bills and Dolphins both have been average at best since Marino and Kelly retired. It's hard to have bragging rights when neither team has been relevant in a long time.

feelthepain
08-22-2008, 09:46 PM
Can ya guess who said this?


All that says is he was overpaid, you can grossly over pay for third string WR it doesn't mean you spent a ton of money, it just means you paid more for him then he was worth. Besides every season the Bills give a good size contract to someone, maybe two . It doesn't meant they're not cheap. RW wants to sell tickets, he does jkust enough to keep the fans interested. Problem is Bill fans are happy with every single player signed, you'd think they sign probowlers with every signing to listen to Bill fans talk.

Look at your HC, know why it's DJ instead of a real good HC? Cause he was the only guy willing to take so little to coach the Bills. Why don't the Bills ever sign a TO or other top flight in their prime top 5% at their position type of players? Why is it everytime someone wants to get paid in Buffalo they end up leaving or holding out? The Bills are notoriously cheap and you're trting to say thry're not. Your owner is the biggest whiner when it ccomes to his money, heck how many games will be in Canada this year? He's trying to squeez every dime out of that team.

feelthepain
08-22-2008, 09:59 PM
Haven't both teams been pretty worthless for about a decade? I'm a Dolphins fan but isn't it sad that we've gotta bring up championship teams from over 30 years ago to dictate how great of a franchise they are? The Dolphins almost ran the table in reverse. The Bills and Dolphins both have been average at best since Marino and Kelly retired. It's hard to have bragging rights when neither team has been relevant in a long time.

No, Miami was 9-7 in 99, 11-5 in 00, 11-5 in 01, 9-7 in 02, 10-6 in 03, 9-7 in 05 we've had a few bad seasons the last decade, but we've still been a decent team.

Brassmonki14120
08-22-2008, 10:32 PM
No, Miami was 9-7 in 99, 11-5 in 00, 11-5 in 01, 9-7 in 02, 10-6 in 03, 9-7 in 05 we've had a few bad seasons the last decade, but we've still been a decent team.

A decent team doesn't go 1-15.

And as for this year:

The biggest addition to this team in the offseason was Bill Parcells;

Penny is a good QB but he's lacking arm strength. He tends to get banged up fairly easy during the season and despite Ricky's "best line" I don't think they will keep him upright enough keep him starting every game this season. After Penny there is a considerable drop off in talent and if Penny's not starting the fins will struggle to win games.

No recievers worth talking about. Ginn look pretty good last week but that's the only time he's ever looked good in the NFL.

If Ricky plays like Ricky used to he is a huge threat to any Defense and can take over a game all by himself. Ronnie can't see to play enough to break 1000 yards.

Back to the o-line, Ricky likes 'em. I can't think of any reasons why.

The Defense:

I'm stealing someone elses quote but only because we share the very similar opinions

The Dolphins have no hope defensively (I like the secondary this year though). The only player of any merit is OLB Joey Porter, and he's better served as trade bait for a young player. The team features neither capable veterans or emerging young talent.

How about you share why you think the fish deserve any respect this year. I hear allot about what you think about the Bills, How about your team.

djfresh47
08-22-2008, 11:12 PM
No, Miami was 9-7 in 99, 11-5 in 00, 11-5 in 01, 9-7 in 02, 10-6 in 03, 9-7 in 05 we've had a few bad seasons the last decade, but we've still been a decent team.


I disagree I don't think they've made the playoffs since '01. I guess we can be happy they got there. Even made it to the 2nd rd in two of those seasons. Though I think it was easier to make the playoffs because their were only 3 divisions. The 9-7 team really was very average but got in and got to play another very average team in the Seahawks. I tend to not want to remember the 62-7 thrashing that came after it. The Raiders game I really thought the Dolphins were going to play it close than Fiedler lofted a ball that Pennington would laugh at and it was returned for 6. The Ravens game never was close. I just don't think they've been a good team. Really they've been a major dissapointment in two of those seasons when they were atleast one of the favorites to make it to the SB. The Bills haven't had those expectations. Though I think the Bills team that lost to the Titans I believe in '99 was a better team than any of the mentioned Dolphins team. Even a few years back the Bills choked away a playoff game when an unknown Willie Parker tore them up. My point is I don't think we as Dolphins fans can criticize other teams for not being good. Bringing up all-time record or past success IMO is what fans do when their team isn't very good.

Vertical Limit
08-22-2008, 11:24 PM
:sidelol::sidelol:


Says the guy with a Ricky freakin Williams sig. Unreal.
Lol, as a Dolphins' fan, I'm on your side on this one. Pretty damn amazing how our fans still think we have Ricky of 2002-03.

feelthepain
08-22-2008, 11:28 PM
A decent team doesn't go 1-15.

And as for this year:

The biggest addition to this team in the offseason was Bill Parcells;

I also happen to think Jeff Ireland and Tony Sparano are big additions. But I don't expect much from the fan of a team that hasn't had a winning season in years yet somehow think his team is on some other level....:sidelol:



Penny is a good QB but he's lacking arm strength. He tends to get banged up fairly easy during the season and despite Ricky's "best line" I don't think they will keep him upright enough keep him starting every game this season. After Penny there is a considerable drop off in talent and if Penny's not starting the fins will struggle to win games.


His arm strength is way over stated. It really doesn't matter if you can throw it 70 yards in the air or 50 yards oin the air if you can mangae the game. Pennington can manage the game.



No recievers worth talking about. Ginn look pretty good last week but that's the only time he's ever looked good in the NFL.


Ginn looks good, Hagan looks good, Armstrong looks good Bess looks good. Miami's advantage is in the attitudes and conditioning. The new system is thick with BP winning attitude. You can dismiss anyone you wish, it doesn't maen you have a clue.



If Ricky plays like Ricky used to he is a huge threat to any Defense and can take over a game all by himself. Ronnie can't see to play enough to break 1000 yards.

He is and he will. Ronnie ran for more then a 1000 yards in 06, and less then 100 yards from a 1000 in 05 while splitting carries with Ricky.


Back to the o-line, Ricky likes 'em. I can't think of any reasons why.

That sentence doesn't even deserve a response, it's that dumb.

The Defense:

I'm stealing someone elses quote but only because we share the very similar opinions

Quote:
The Dolphins have no hope defensively (I like the secondary this year though). The only player of any merit is OLB Joey Porter, and he's better served as trade bait for a young player. The team features neither capable veterans or emerging young talent.
Really, well you just keep believing someone you don't respect enough to name. So far this offseason the Dolphins have given up less points then your precious Jills. I also love how a Bill fan has the nerve to knock anyone elses defense when your own can't seem to finish higher then 31st the last 2 years.



How about you share why you think the fish deserve any respect this year. I hear allot about what you think about the Bills, How about your team.

What do I think of the Dolphins? I think they're not worse then the Bills. Are they better, time will tell. Unlike Bill fans I don't call the Dolphins a playoff teams as soon as the last whistle blows of the previous season. Especially when my team was under 500. and had nearly the worst offense and defense in the league.....AGAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

feelthepain
08-22-2008, 11:31 PM
I disagree I don't think they've made the playoffs since '01. I guess we can be happy they got there. Even made it to the 2nd rd in two of those seasons. Though I think it was easier to make the playoffs because their were only 3 divisions. The 9-7 team really was very average but got in and got to play another very average team in the Seahawks. I tend to not want to remember the 62-7 thrashing that came after it. The Raiders game I really thought the Dolphins were going to play it close than Fiedler lofted a ball that Pennington would laugh at and it was returned for 6. The Ravens game never was close. I just don't think they've been a good team. Really they've been a major dissapointment in two of those seasons when they were atleast one of the favorites to make it to the SB. The Bills haven't had those expectations. Though I think the Bills team that lost to the Titans I believe in '99 was a better team than any of the mentioned Dolphins team. Even a few years back the Bills choked away a playoff game when an unknown Willie Parker tore them up. My point is I don't think we as Dolphins fans can criticize other teams for not being good. Bringing up all-time record or past success IMO is what fans do when their team isn't very good.

I didn't say we were a SB team, I said we've been a good team.

feelthepain
08-22-2008, 11:32 PM
Lol, as a Dolphins' fan, I'm on your side on this one. Pretty damn amazing how our fans still think we have Ricky of 2002-03.

Well that's fair, remind Bill fans Stroud hasn't been a probowler in the last 4 years, but they seem convinced he is now that he's a Bill.

djfresh47
08-23-2008, 12:20 AM
[quote=feelthepain;1062581357]I didn't say we were a SB team, I said we've been a good team.[/quote

I tend not too look to far into the past. Though like most what has happened recently sticks into my mind. Smack talk between Bills and Dolphins fans really is just strange to me. Neither has been very good. Now i'll go into the past and Kelly vs Marino was great. Eventhough the Bills seemed to win and they'd run a damn end-around for 40 yds everytime. If we want to get further into it the year Miami lost the AFC Championship game to the Bills in Miami was the year I thought the Phins were the best team in the AFC. Now we're arguing over whose been the better average team or really who has had more incompetetant GM's. For the record it's Donahoe but Jerry Butler tanked his last draft. Neither team has been very good and it's just pointless IMO, to say "well we won a SB 30 years ago so obviously we've got bragging rights."

ChambersWI
08-23-2008, 12:27 AM
Well that's fair, remind Bill fans Stroud hasn't been a probowler in the last 4 years, but they seem convinced he is now that he's a Bill.

hard to tell with Stroud as he's been injured and suspended the last couple years. Course, the Jags were willing to let Stroud go because he didn't fit their new system.

I think Stroud could be a good pickup for the Bills, I like it a lot more than Jenkins for the Jets (Guy whose had weight problems in recent years, 2 torn ACLs, and is not the run stuffer he once was is now expected to be a NT?)

feelthepain
08-23-2008, 08:46 AM
hard to tell with Stroud as he's been injured and suspended the last couple years. Course, the Jags were willing to let Stroud go because he didn't fit their new system.

I think Stroud could be a good pickup for the Bills, I like it a lot more than Jenkins for the Jets (Guy whose had weight problems in recent years, 2 torn ACLs, and is not the run stuffer he once was is now expected to be a NT?)


I like Ricky's chances a heck of a lot more then Strouds.

Brassmonki14120
08-23-2008, 01:51 PM
I like Ricky's chances a heck of a lot more then Strouds.

Still like Becks chances?

feelthepain
08-23-2008, 01:54 PM
Still like Becks chances?


To what, start, back up, make the team?

SpaceMountain16
08-23-2008, 02:10 PM
I like Ricky's chances a heck of a lot more then Strouds.

Why? Stroud's issues the last couple of years have been injuries and suspensions but at least he's been around the game. Ricky's been god knows where doing god knows what. He's 31 years old, while he doesn't have the wear and tear of other 31 year olds, i don't understand how people just assume he's going to step back in and be a pro-bowl player. Because of some pre-season runs? Give me a break.

Brassmonki14120
08-23-2008, 02:12 PM
To what, start, back up, make the team?

To make the team.

Brassmonki14120
08-23-2008, 02:16 PM
Why? Stroud's issues the last couple of years have been injuries and suspensions but at least he's been around the game. Ricky's been god knows where doing god knows what. He's 31 years old, while he doesn't have the wear and tear of other 31 year olds, i don't understand how people just assume he's going to step back in and be a pro-bowl player. Because of some pre-season runs? Give me a break.

I think Ricky can still play well enough to start for the fish but I think his probowl days are behind him.

We'll get to see them going head to head a few times this season.

feelthepain
08-23-2008, 02:47 PM
Why? Stroud's issues the last couple of years have been injuries and suspensions but at least he's been around the game. Ricky's been god knows where doing god knows what. He's 31 years old, while he doesn't have the wear and tear of other 31 year olds, i don't understand how people just assume he's going to step back in and be a pro-bowl player. Because of some pre-season runs? Give me a break.


Stroud was suspended for steroids he was using to help heal his injuries. He has missed games due to injury and he hasn't been a probowler in some years now. The Bills already have one of the worst defenses in the league, there's no way he is so good that he suddenly makes that legit. Not to mention the fact that the Jags gave him upo for a song. If the guy has anywhere near the value Bill fans are trying to convince everyone he has then there's no way the Jags let him go. Obviously the Jags felt he wasn't so good that they wouldn't let him go. I'll promise you had the Bills not stepped up and taken him for that third he was going to be released.

As for Ricky he may have missed the last couple of seasons, but he's still one of the most talented RB's to ever play the game. Ricky won't be used the same way DW used him, his carries will be more limited and he will be used more as a complement to either Ronnie or Patrick, not as the sole RB. If you watched any of the preseason games so far Ricky's running instincts are still there and his burst and power are still there. He likes the coaching staff and he wants to play. He will be a far bigger asset to us, then Stroud will be to the Bills.

feelthepain
08-23-2008, 02:53 PM
I think Ricky can still play well enough to start for the fish but I think his probowl days are behind him.

We'll get to see them going head to head a few times this season.

I'm sure you wish for that, but you have no proof his probowl days are behind him. He has so much god given talent that you don't simply lose it by not playing a couple of seasons. It's pretty clear the last thing a Bill fan wants to see is Ricky running all over them again, not so hard to imagine your opinion Ricky's best days are behind him comes with a huge amount of hope.

feelthepain
08-23-2008, 03:00 PM
To make the team.

Well he's still a Dolphin. I think Beck was caught up in the changes. He wasn't drafted by the current coaching staff. He would have to play lights out to start. Face it not many 1st or 2nd year QB's play lights out. JP Losman suffers this same problem. Even though I think JP has had more then enough of a chance to earn a starting spot, he's just an awful QB. Beck has had just 4 starts as a pro.

Henne has been terrific and Pennington was just signed, it's rather tough on Beck at this point. I don't think Pennington was signed cause the Dolphins have no faith in Beck, I think it was classic BP. He loves his veteran QB's and seeing as he drafted Pennington to start with, there's no chance he was gonna pass on the chance to sign him as a FA. I think Beck has all the tools, I just think it's a case of wrong place, wrong time for him.

djfresh47
08-23-2008, 05:16 PM
Stroud was suspended for steroids he was using to help heal his injuries. He has missed games due to injury and he hasn't been a probowler in some years now. The Bills already have one of the worst defenses in the league, there's no way he is so good that he suddenly makes that legit. Not to mention the fact that the Jags gave him upo for a song. If the guy has anywhere near the value Bill fans are trying to convince everyone he has then there's no way the Jags let him go. Obviously the Jags felt he wasn't so good that they wouldn't let him go. I'll promise you had the Bills not stepped up and taken him for that third he was going to be released.

As for Ricky he may have missed the last couple of seasons, but he's still one of the most talented RB's to ever play the game. Ricky won't be used the same way DW used him, his carries will be more limited and he will be used more as a complement to either Ronnie or Patrick, not as the sole RB. If you watched any of the preseason games so far Ricky's running instincts are still there and his burst and power are still there. He likes the coaching staff and he wants to play. He will be a far bigger asset to us, then Stroud will be to the Bills.

I don't think he was going to be released. That really doesn't matter but I think Bills fan would say that they were missing alot of guys last year on defense. They don't need Stroud to be a great player. They need him to be good and they need McCargo to improve. Thus using the old Gardner/Bowens thing which allows Posluszny who was hurt last year to roam around. This would also open up things for Kelsay who is grossly overpaid and Schobel whose a bit overrated. Last year the Bills were playing with a bunch of guys on defense who should be special teams guys.

I'm not going to put any blind faith into Ricky. Most Dolphins fans IMO, think he's the greatest thing ever. I think alot of us have a little ex-gf syndrome with him. He leaves us we hate him he comes back we love him and allow him to do anything. I don't fault Ricky for not wanting to play football. In all honestly if he had played and not quit been suspended than he'd be on the downside of his career. He can be pretty good but I don't think he'll be an elite player. Now Ronnie Brown on the otherhand....

DaBills4life
08-24-2008, 09:32 AM
Well that's fair, remind Bill fans Stroud hasn't been a probowler in the last 4 years, but they seem convinced he is now that he's a Bill.

Actually, since Stroud did go to the Pro Bowl in the 2005 season, Its only been 2006 and 2007 he didn't go.

So the only reason he didn't go was injuries. But, he has had a long time to get healthy this time, unlike 2007. He said he tried to get healthy the wrong way, this time he did it the right way, rest and rehab.

And lets not sugar coat it either, he wasn't just a pro bowler, he was an all-pro, that means he was the best DT in football.

Just like you hope Ricky can be a stud again, i hope Stroud can.

feelthepain
08-24-2008, 03:03 PM
Actually, since Stroud did go to the Pro Bowl in the 2005 season, Its only been 2006 and 2007 he didn't go.

So the only reason he didn't go was injuries. But, he has had a long time to get healthy this time, unlike 2007. He said he tried to get healthy the wrong way, this time he did it the right way, rest and rehab.

And lets not sugar coat it either, he wasn't just a pro bowler, he was an all-pro, that means he was the best DT in football.

Just like you hope Ricky can be a stud again, i hope Stroud can.

I think the bigger problem for the Bills is their coaching, it's not very good. Stroud may make a play or two this year, but he'll hardly be the force he was in Jacksonville. JMO.

djfresh47
08-24-2008, 03:49 PM
I think the bigger problem for the Bills is their coaching, it's not very good. Stroud may make a play or two this year, but he'll hardly be the force he was in Jacksonville. JMO.

Jauron's not a winner. He really doesn't get criticized because well the Bills haven't had any expectations. Plus he was hired by Levy who can do know wrong for Bills fan. They lost the game last year to Dallas because of horrible coaching. Though they got a gift from Washington from horrible coaching by Gibbs. Losing Fairchild to Colorado St was a blessing in disguise for the Bills. I thought he gameplanned horribly. The last few years when I watch the Bills it seems like they come out and look very good on their opening drive. Than it's a bunch of nothing. I think Wannstedt and Richie Kotite think that Jauron's coaching during the Dallas game last year was ridiculous.

jp2lee783
08-24-2008, 05:14 PM
Well in two weeks from right now we'll both be done with our home openers. Damn I can't wait.

SpaceMountain16
08-24-2008, 07:56 PM
I'd say Jauron might have exceeded expectations, but he's probably in trouble this year if the Bills dont win at least 9 games. They have certainly the talent to do so. I dont think he's a very good coach either.

Brassmonki14120
08-24-2008, 09:33 PM
I think the bigger problem for the Bills is their coaching, it's not very good. Stroud may make a play or two this year, but he'll hardly be the force he was in Jacksonville. JMO.

The coaching staff in Buffalo eclipses anything Miami has had in years and this year the fish are sporting a first time head coach.

I like your opinion on Stroud because they are usually wrong.

djfresh47
08-25-2008, 12:35 AM
The coaching staff in Buffalo eclipses anything Miami has had in years and this year the fish are sporting a first time head coach.

I like your opinion on Stroud because they are usually wrong.

I don't think the Bills nor the Dolphins fans can criticize coaching staffs. Bills fans laughed at the Dolphins when Mularkey was OC and running HB passes on 2-pt conversions. Though i'm laughing at the faith in Jauron. The Bills have allowed themselves to be a 2nd team in a city that loves them. Jauron is the smartest guy in the room 9/10 times but that doesn't make him a good coach. Even a Bills fan would have to admit IMO, that Jauron cost them the Dallas game and maybe even the Broncos game. The lack of a Qb has made both these teams bad IMO. Donahoe was an awful GM. I think Marv put down a foundation, which I hope Parcells is doing also. Having a new coach puts life into myself as A Dolphins fan. Though I wonder how Bills fans can put faith in Jauron. I thought Sherman was the best hire. I'm not going to compare the Bills to the Dolphins because i've got no base as them making better decisions that last few years. Though how many cities play 2nd fiddle to a hockey team?

SpaceMountain16
08-25-2008, 03:01 AM
The coaching staff in Buffalo eclipses anything Miami has had in years and this year the fish are sporting a first time head coach.

I like your opinion on Stroud because they are usually wrong.

That's something to be proud?

That's like a low-class family in the projects making fun of a homeless guy for being poor.

djfresh47
08-25-2008, 03:51 PM
That's something to be proud?

That's like a low-class family in the projects making fun of a homeless guy for being poor.

I think Saban could've been a good NFL coach. Though it's not like the stache and Cameron are examples of NFL greatness. Greg Williams and Mike Mularkey were awful. Bills fans laughed when Mularkey was hired as OC, rightfully so.

Jauron has had one winning season as a head coach. He's never won a playoff game. He was 35-45 with the Bears and 14-18 with the Bills thus far. I'll wipe the slate with the Lions because he was interim. Dave Wannstedt has a better resume than Jauron as a head coach.

feelthepain
08-25-2008, 04:11 PM
The coaching staff in Buffalo eclipses anything Miami has had in years and this year the fish are sporting a first time head coach.

I like your opinion on Stroud because they are usually wrong.

Dick Juron has a losing record as a HC in the NFL with both the Bears and Bills, he sucks! There's proof of it. Don't look at the Dolphins staff and proclaim anything cause you have nothing to base an opinion on. Many young HC have success their first year, it's not unheard of.

As for Stroud he just landed on the 31st ranked defense each of the last two years, you think he's just gonna suddely transform that Defense in the a good unit? You had a better defense in 06 then now and still managed just 31st in the league.

Brassmonki14120
08-25-2008, 04:54 PM
Dick Juron has a losing record as a HC in the NFL with both the Bears and Bills, he sucks! There's proof of it. Don't look at the Dolphins staff and proclaim anything cause you have nothing to base an opinion on. Many young HC have success their first year, it's not unheard of.

As for Stroud he just landed on the 31st ranked defense each of the last two years, you think he's just gonna suddely transform that Defense in the a good unit? You had a better defense in 06 then now and still managed just 31st in the league .

The fish have just brought in ANOTHER rookie head coach, the last two have been proclaimed the "saviors of the fish". Dick Jauron could be 0-100 and still have accomplished more than sparano as a head coach.

A healthy Defensive squad with great depth and skill on the D-Line, solid LBs with decent depth, Great speed and solid skill and depth at DB.

Bold prediction: Bills D will rank around 12th in the league and will rank top 5 in turnovers.

DaBills4life
08-25-2008, 04:55 PM
Dick Juron has a losing record as a HC in the NFL with both the Bears and Bills, he sucks! There's proof of it. Don't look at the Dolphins staff and proclaim anything cause you have nothing to base an opinion on. Many young HC have success their first year, it's not unheard of.

As for Stroud he just landed on the 31st ranked defense each of the last two years, you think he's just gonna suddely transform that Defense in the a good unit? You had a better defense in 06 then now and still managed just 31st in the league.

Its not exactly the same the defense as last year. And so far so good, the starting defense hasn't given up a point in the preseason.

As for DJ, like most coaches, it's all about the QB. He hasn't had one. Jim Miller, Cade McNown, and Shane Mathews, were his QB's in CHicago. I think he even had Kordell Stewart for a year?

Hopefully Trent Edwards is the guy. Belichek wasn't better than Juaron before Brady.

djfresh47
08-25-2008, 04:57 PM
Dick Juron has a losing record as a HC in the NFL with both the Bears and Bills, he sucks! There's proof of it. Don't look at the Dolphins staff and proclaim anything cause you have nothing to base an opinion on. Many young HC have success their first year, it's not unheard of.

As for Stroud he just landed on the 31st ranked defense each of the last two years, you think he's just gonna suddely transform that Defense in the a good unit? You had a better defense in 06 then now and still managed just 31st in the league.

They were 18th in points allowed. Though it's not just Stroud the Bills have. They get Poszluszny back and they also get Ko Simpson and added Kawika Mitchell. Over a third of the defense for the Bills has changed. They had guys who really shouldn't be in the NFL starting last year.

feelthepain
08-25-2008, 05:19 PM
They were 18th in points allowed. Though it's not just Stroud the Bills have. They get Poszluszny back and they also get Ko Simpson and added Kawika Mitchell. Over a third of the defense for the Bills has changed. They had guys who really shouldn't be in the NFL starting last year.


I said they had a better defense in 06 and still finished 31st.

Brassmonki14120
08-25-2008, 05:21 PM
I said they had a better defense in 06 and still finished 31st.

The fish had a better defense last year and went 1-15.

feelthepain
08-25-2008, 05:42 PM
The fish have just brought in ANOTHER rookie head coach, the last two have been proclaimed the "saviors of the fish". Dick Jauron could be 0-100 and still have accomplished more than sparano as a head coach.

TS has half the Cowboys coaches and Asst, a team that went 13-3 last year. Tony also has BP to answer any question and give his expert advise. I know you think the Bills are better then the Dolphins in every way, but they're not. TS has far more to draw from then Juron. Juron has a track record and it's been losing. TS has been a Oline coach for quite a few and has been working with BP. BP hand picked this coaching staff. He knows what to look for in successful candidates. Tony also has Ireland one of the brightest young minds n the game.


A healthy Defensive squad with great depth and skill on the D-Line, solid LBs with decent depth, Great speed and solid skill and depth at DB.

Every year it's something with Bill fans, last year it was JP Losman and the awsome Oline, howd that turn out? This year it Trent Edwards and the returning Defense...blah, blah, blah.

If the Bills had made significant strides, I could see the Bill fans thinking they're better. But they always end up sucking and the fans spew nonsense about how much better they will be.

Miami had a ton of injuries in 07 too and not just on one side of the ball, but Bill fans ignore this while telling us how our team is two years behind theirs. So we lose players due to injury and have a bad year and the Bills lose players and have a bad year. The Bills win 6 more games, but the Dolphin finish the season better ranked on both sides of the ball, but the Bills are 2 years ahead of the Dolphins.

Based on the fact that any team can go from worst to first and somone does every year. I find it a joke to hear Bill fans opinions on the two teams. Take into account the Bills have just 2 wins in the last 32 over teams with winning records and the fact that 4 of the Bills 7 wins last year came against the Jets and Dolphins and 2 other wins against the Bengals and Ravnes and the bills had 6 wins against teams that were a combined 21-47 hardly like the Bills beat the class of the NFL in 07. Bill fans opinions of their team is way, way wayyyyyy, overrated.

Brassmonki14120
08-25-2008, 06:53 PM
TS has half the Cowboys coaches and Asst, a team that went 13-3 last year. Tony also has BP to answer any question and give his expert advise. I know you think the Bills are better then the Dolphins in every way, but they're not. TS has far more to draw from then Juron. Juron has a track record and it's been losing. TS has been a Oline coach for quite a few and has been working with BP. BP hand picked this coaching staff. He knows what to look for in successful candidates. Tony also has Ireland one of the brightest young minds n the game.



Every year it's something with Bill fans, last year it was JP Losman and the awsome Oline, howd that turn out? This year it Trent Edwards and the returning Defense...blah, blah, blah.

If the Bills had made significant strides, I could see the Bill fans thinking they're better. But they always end up sucking and the fans spew nonsense about how much better they will be.

Miami had a ton of injuries in 07 too and not just on one side of the ball, but Bill fans ignore this while telling us how our team is two years behind theirs. So we lose players due to injury and have a bad year and the Bills lose players and have a bad year. The Bills win 6 more games, but the Dolphin finish the season better ranked on both sides of the ball, but the Bills are 2 years ahead of the Dolphins.

Based on the fact that any team can go from worst to first and somone does every year. I find it a joke to hear Bill fans opinions on the two teams. Take into account the Bills have just 2 wins in the last 32 over teams with winning records and the fact that 4 of the Bills 7 wins last year came against the Jets and Dolphins and 2 other wins against the Bengals and Ravnes and the bills had 6 wins against teams that were a combined 21-47 hardly like the Bills beat the class of the NFL in 07. Bill fans opinions of their team is way, way wayyyyyy, overrated .

First of all, I have ALWAYS been reallistic when it comes to the Bills and the fish. Take a second and go back and actually read what I've posted about both teams over since the Nictator came to miami. I ask you to show me where I've posted anything about our teams that wasn't realistic.

I don't post like some, "your team can't do well because it's your team" or "my team is going to the playoffs because they're my team".

I've been SO MUCH MORE honest then you have in what I've posted about every team or player that I've thrown my 2 cents in about.

So to be honest with you, right now the Bills are at least 3-4 years ahead of the fish when it comes to being a complete team. I'm not saying the Bills are a lock for the playoffs, I'm not saying they are the greatest team in the NFL or the division for that matter. They are, however, the better team between Them and the fish.

DaBills4life
08-25-2008, 07:32 PM
TS has half the Cowboys coaches and Asst, a team that went 13-3 last year. Tony also has BP to answer any question and give his expert advise. I know you think the Bills are better then the Dolphins in every way, but they're not. TS has far more to draw from then Juron. Juron has a track record and it's been losing. TS has been a Oline coach for quite a few and has been working with BP. BP hand picked this coaching staff. He knows what to look for in successful candidates. Tony also has Ireland one of the brightest young minds n the game.



Every year it's something with Bill fans, last year it was JP Losman and the awsome Oline, howd that turn out? This year it Trent Edwards and the returning Defense...blah, blah, blah.

If the Bills had made significant strides, I could see the Bill fans thinking they're better. But they always end up sucking and the fans spew nonsense about how much better they will be.

Miami had a ton of injuries in 07 too and not just on one side of the ball, but Bill fans ignore this while telling us how our team is two years behind theirs. So we lose players due to injury and have a bad year and the Bills lose players and have a bad year. The Bills win 6 more games, but the Dolphin finish the season better ranked on both sides of the ball, but the Bills are 2 years ahead of the Dolphins.

Based on the fact that any team can go from worst to first and somone does every year. I find it a joke to hear Bill fans opinions on the two teams. Take into account the Bills have just 2 wins in the last 32 over teams with winning records and the fact that 4 of the Bills 7 wins last year came against the Jets and Dolphins and 2 other wins against the Bengals and Ravnes and the bills had 6 wins against teams that were a combined 21-47 hardly like the Bills beat the class of the NFL in 07. Bill fans opinions of their team is way, way wayyyyyy, overrated.

lol, you obviously dont read your own board.

djfresh47
08-25-2008, 09:42 PM
I said they had a better defense in 06 and still finished 31st.

So wouldn't that basically say that state is meaningless? Clements and Fletcher were very good players. Now they're probably overpaid. They finished 7-9 both years. Last year the Eagles finished top 10 in offense and defense. The division is a factor but they weren't a playoff team. The great Bears defense was ranked 28th. Buffalo gave up a ton of yards as your stat shows but they didn't give up as many points a team should give up for giving up soo many yards.

I think the Bills in '06 had a bunch of guys who thought real highly of themselves like McGahee, Spikes and didn't really produce to that level. Nate Clements got a ton of money and while he's good it seems like all his picks came against Miami's rotation of bums playing Qb.

feelthepain
08-25-2008, 10:37 PM
I've been SO MUCH MORE honest then you have in what I've posted about every team or player that I've thrown my 2 cents in about.


The above quote, is contradictory the the below quote.




So to be honest with you, right now the Bills are at least 3-4 years ahead of the fish when it comes to being a complete team. I'm not saying the Bills are a lock for the playoffs, I'm not saying they are the greatest team in the NFL or the division for that matter. They are, however, the better team between Them and the fish.



I just love how you ignored all the facts about the Bills then tell me you're much more relaistic about the Bills then I am about the fins.

The Buffalo Bills:

A) The Bills have not had a winning season since MM was your HC,

B) Your current HC has a losing recoord with the Bills 4 games below 500., in just 32 games.

C) The Bills have maybe 1 probowler who isn't a kicker

D) The Bills have 2 wins against teams with winning records, (8-8) or better in their last 32 games.

E) The Bills have not made the playoffs since 99.

F) The Bills finished each of the last 2 seasons, with the 31st ranked Defense and the 30th ranked offense and in each of the last two season were 7-9.

Now you can ignore all the facts above on your way to creating this invisible seperation "YOU" seem to think exists between the Dolphins and Bills. But anyone who looks at the list above and knows everything I said about the Bills is true, there is no such seperation. The Bills have not been stedily imporving from one season to the next, they have not made strides. Their outcome from season to season has not gotten better.

They do not beat the good teams of the league, they are simply a bad team. Yes, I said it....winning 7 games makes you a bad team, having both nearly the worst offense and defense makes you a bad team, having a HC with a losing record makes you a bad team, not making the playoffs in nearly 10 years makes you a bad team. The Bills do not suffer from one or two of the problems in thast list at the mopment, they suffer from all those fact at the monment. Till the Bills change the things on that list they are a bad team and in no way have a 3 year seperation on any team in the division except the Pats, who are 3 years ahead of the Bills...at least.

You can now come back and tell me how much more realistic you are about the Bills and believe the words coming out of your mouth, but the facts above simply don't support your opinion.

Brassmonki14120
08-26-2008, 09:27 AM
The above quote, is contradictory the the below quote.





I just love how you ignored all the facts about the Bills then tell me you're much more relaistic about the Bills then I am about the fins.

The Buffalo Bills:

A) The Bills have not had a winning season since MM was your HC,

B) Your current HC has a losing recoord with the Bills 4 games below 500., in just 32 games.

C) The Bills have maybe 1 probowler who isn't a kicker

D) The Bills have 2 wins against teams with winning records, (8-8) or better in their last 32 games.

E) The Bills have not made the playoffs since 99.

F) The Bills finished each of the last 2 seasons, with the 31st ranked Defense and the 30th ranked offense and in each of the last two season were 7-9.

Now you can ignore all the facts above on your way to creating this invisible seperation "YOU" seem to think exists between the Dolphins and Bills. But anyone who looks at the list above and knows everything I said about the Bills is true, there is no such seperation. The Bills have not been stedily imporving from one season to the next, they have not made strides. Their outcome from season to season has not gotten better.

They do not beat the good teams of the league, they are simply a bad team. Yes, I said it....winning 7 games makes you a bad team, having both nearly the worst offense and defense makes you a bad team, having a HC with a losing record makes you a bad team, not making the playoffs in nearly 10 years makes you a bad team. The Bills do not suffer from one or two of the problems in thast list at the mopment, they suffer from all those fact at the monment. Till the Bills change the things on that list they are a bad team and in no way have a 3 year seperation on any team in the division except the Pats, who are 3 years ahead of the Bills...at least.

You can now come back and tell me how much more realistic you are about the Bills and believe the words coming out of your mouth, but the facts above simply don't support your opinion .

Can you please point out where I haven't been realistic?

The Bills are years ahead of the fish when it comes to being a complete team. The Bills have been in rebuilding mode (way too long in my opinion) for the better part of this decade. The losing seasons should be coming to an end as the rebuilding is coming to and end.

The Bills have allot of young talented players, quite a few with NFL experience after all the injuries last year. The past few seasons they have also added some solid talent on both sides of the ball.

The fish on the other hand have been playing QB and head coach shuffle every year for the last lord knows how long. The crappy drafts and horrible free agent moves have left the fish the bottom feeder of the entire NFL. This year the fish have made some ok moves, penny being the best. It still doesn't mean much because you need receivers, a TE, some O-line depth, Some D-line depth, some linebacker depth (porter is a $25 million walking injury), I do think the fish DBs are shaping up better than most are expecting them to.

I do agree the Pats have been and are light years ahead of the Bills because they field a completed and stacked team every year. The fish though have allot of catching up to do with the Bills and Jets both.

Since you keep pointing out how the Bills have had the 31st ranked defense the past two seasons and haven't bolstered them in any way shape or form we should make a wager.

If the fish defense ranks higher than the Bills Defense this season I wont post on finheaven until the start of training camp 2011.

If the Bills Defense ranks higher than the fish's defense you don't post on finheaven until the start of training camp 2011.

feelthepain
08-26-2008, 10:39 AM
Can you please point out where I haven't been realistic?

After everything I listed from A-F you still see a seperation from the Bills to the Dolphins is where you are not being realistic.

The Bills are NOT....NOT a good team!!!!! How many more ways can it be said. You look at the players on your team and you make up how talented they are. But when you look at the statistics, they don't support the talented group YOU think they are. So where is this seperation?? No probowlers, no all pros no one in a Bills uniform that stands out in any way shape or form. Marshawn Lynch would probably be the closeest thing to s star the Bills have and he's a RB, they are a dime a dozen in the NFL. The easiest position to get production from on the field, big deal.


The Bills are years ahead of the fish when it comes to being a complete team. The Bills have been in rebuilding mode (way too long in my opinion) for the better part of this decade. The losing seasons should be coming to an end as the rebuilding is coming to and end.

Seriously, you need to stop. You have this idea in your head that the Bills have accoplished soemthing...they've done nothing. No winning seasons, not all star list of players, no dominance in the division, no playoffs NOTHING!!! Yet you talk as if your team has reached this level of competence. Is being below 500. for like the last 3 years your idea of achievement?? Think about this, what do the Jets and Dolphins have to do to have a better season then the Bills did the last three years?

Become 8-8? That's what you think sets the Bills apart? You act as if reaching 500 is this impossible mountain that can't be reached from one season to the next. STOP IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


The Bills have allot of young talented players, quite a few with NFL experience after all the injuries last year. The past few seasons they have also added some solid talent on both sides of the ball.

The Dolphins have a lot of young talneted players, quite a few with NFL experience. The Dolphins have also added some solid talent to both sides of the ball the past few seasons. I'm not really sure how your paragraph above is relevant here, there's no difference in the two teams in this respect.


The fish on the other hand have been playing QB and head coach shuffle every year for the last lord knows how long.

And so have the Bills, JP Losman, Dick Juron Trent Edwards, Wade Phillips, Greg Williams. Seems to me you only see the negative in others, while ignoring the same problems within your own team...people in glass houses!!!!


The crappy drafts and horrible free agent moves have left the fish the bottom feeder of the entire NFL.

Unlike the Bills and their awsome acquisitions and draft picks that have helped them maintain a losing season and worst statistics in the diviision year after year.:rolleyes:



This year the fish have made some ok moves, penny being the best. It still doesn't mean much because you need receivers, a TE, some O-line depth, Some D-line


Miami is just fine at WR, the Bills have nothing special, your best WR has a grand total of 1 tousand yard season in his career and he's the best you have the same guy who disappeard last year. You have no room to talk about another teams WO's. TE??? Are you serious?? Robert Royal?? That's who the Bills have to depend on?? Miami went out and got Anthony Fassano this offseason he was a second round pick for the Cowboys just 2 years ago. I'd say that Miami's TE situation is better then the Bills.

Oline and D-line?? Depth may be a concern, but Rome wasn't built in a day, however again the Bills lines don't scare anyone....at all and your depth is no better. You have YET ANOTHER disgruntled player in Jason Peters who doesn't want to play for a team that cares more about their bottom line then winning. Again you are looking at others weakneses and ignoring your own. Typical Bill fan.



I do agree the Pats have been and are light years ahead of the Bills because they field a completed and stacked team every year. The fish though have allot of catching up to do with the Bills and Jets both.



For Miami,

The Pats: Yes

The Jets: Maybe

The Bills: No frikin way. The Bills are far and away our least worry in the division.



Since you keep pointing out how the Bills have had the 31st ranked defense the past two seasons and haven't bolstered them in any way shape or form we should make a wager.


Wagers prove nothing, there's your opinion and mine. You stick to your opinions and I'll stick to mine.



If the fish defense ranks higher than the Bills Defense this season I wont post on finheaven until the start of training camp 2011.


The Dolphins ranked higher then the Bills defensively each of the last three seasons, yet here you are telling us how bad we are and trying to make a wager that "proves" your team is better. Seriously that's frikin funny stuff!!


If the Bills Defense ranks higher than the fish's defense you don't post on finheaven until the start of training camp 2011.

Lest see you post in the AFC East forum...just to start trouble and that's maybe once in a while with just over 500 posts. I'm a mod and have over 7,000 posts here and you think the above bet would of equal value to each of us?? Good lord, does it get any funnier.

Brassmonki14120
08-26-2008, 11:03 AM
I can't believe you can go on and on and on and on telling me how the Bills are not... NOT a good team particularly on Defense and then you wont back up anything you post to me.

Well I don't want to make you do something you seem to have the better sense not... NOT to do.

If at anytime, before the start of the regular season, you begin to feel that your teams defense may have a chance to be better than the Bills defense please feel free to come back and make the wager.

And I don't post to start trouble, I share my opinion (which is strong enough for me to stand behind) and participate in discussions.

DaBills4life
08-26-2008, 11:23 AM
feelthepain, put your money where your mouth is. This should be easy money for you, since Miami is better than Buffalo. Bet the under 7.5 wins for Buffalo.

https://sportsbook.gamingsystem.net/sportsbook4/www.sportsbook.com/getodds.xgi?categoryId=510 (http://www.sportsbook.com/livesports/indexmember.php?sportsname=football)

Deep2Evans
08-26-2008, 11:25 AM
I bet he thinks Miami was better than Buffalo last year, or the year before too. Haha.

feelthepain
08-26-2008, 11:27 AM
I can't believe you can go on and on and on and on telling me how the Bills are not... NOT a good team particularly on Defense and then you wont back up anything you post to me.

I have given you example after example as to why your opinion of the Bills is way, way, WAAAAAAAY overrated and you simply refuse to accepet the ACTUAL FACTS. I can't help you accept the actual facts that are. If you refuse to see them and say to yourself..."Yes, we had the 31st ranked Defense and the 30th ranked Offense each of the last 2 seasons and if you refuse to say, Yes we've been under 500 since MM was the HC, and If you refuse to say yes we've not made the Playoffs since 99, then there's nothing left to say, you're in denial about who you really root for cause all those things are actual facts that make up the RECENT histroy of your favorite team. It is what it is.

As for the two defenses, I think the Dolphins are better. RIGHT NOW!! I don't need to make a wager to prove it. That's how I feel.

feelthepain
08-26-2008, 11:34 AM
feelthepain, put your money where your mouth is. This should be easy money for you, since Miami is better than Buffalo. Bet the under 7.5 wins for Buffalo.

https://sportsbook.gamingsystem.net/sportsbook4/www.sportsbook.com/getodds.xgi?categoryId=510

Why is it so hard for you to allow someone else to have their own opinion and leave it at that? I don't agree with Bill fans opinion of their team, plain and simple. In case you missed it, this is a forum put here to express ones opinion. Bill fans have expressed their opinions and I've expressed mine. Sometimes you use facts to epxress that opinion. It's a very simple concept. Making a bet is not going to make me believe you have any more faith in your opinion then you do. You believe what you believe, I believe what I believe. End of discussion.

djfresh47
08-26-2008, 11:35 AM
Jason Peters isn't in camp right now. Though I think he's an all-pro caliber player at LT. Really i'm hoping that Jake Long can turn into a Jason Peters like player.

Brassmonki14120
08-26-2008, 11:39 AM
I have given you example after example as to why your opinion of the Bills is way, way, WAAAAAAAY overrated and you simply refuse to accepet the ACTUAL FACTS. I can't help you accept the actual facts that are. If you refuse to see them and say to yourself..."Yes, we had the 31st ranked Defense and the 30th ranked Offense each of the last 2 seasons and if you refuse to say, Yes we've been under 500 since MM was the HC, and If you refuse to say yes we've not made the Playoffs since 99, then there's nothing left to say, you're in denial about who you really root for cause all those things are actual facts that make up the RECENT histroy of your favorite team. It is what it is.

As for the two defenses, I think the Dolphins are better. RIGHT NOW!! I don't need to make a wager to prove it. That's how I feel .

I know what the facts are and I know what the Defense has ranked. I also believe, because it's my opinion, that the Bills' Defense is better than the fish's. I feel that with the additions and returning healthy players on Defense for the Bills and the fish losing key players that the Bills will field the better Defense.

Buffalo has more depth and more skill on both sides of the ball. That's not an opinion, that's a fact.

Brassmonki14120
08-26-2008, 11:45 AM
Why is it so hard for you to allow someone else to have their own opinion and leave it at that? I don't agree with Bill fans opinion of their team, plain and simple. In case you missed it, this is a forum put here to express ones opinion. Bill fans have expressed their opinions and I've expressed mine. Sometimes you use facts to epxress that opinion. It's a very simple concept. Making a bet is not going to make me believe you have any more faith in your opinion then you do. You believe what you believe, I believe what I believe. End of discussion.

The way it's looking we just may share the same opinion after all.

feelthepain
08-26-2008, 11:49 AM
I know what the facts are and I know what the Defense has ranked. I also believe, because it's my opinion, that the Bills' Defense is better than the fish's. I feel that with the additions and returning healthy players on Defense for the Bills and the fish losing key players that the Bills will field the better Defense.

Buffalo has more depth and more skill on both sides of the ball. That's not an opinion, that's a fact.

Well there you go, you have an opinion.

Brassmonki14120
08-26-2008, 12:07 PM
Well there you go, you have an opinion.

And a very good one at that.

feelthepain
08-26-2008, 12:12 PM
And a very good one at that.

Another opinion, on a fan forum nonetheless.

Brassmonki14120
08-26-2008, 12:20 PM
Another opinion, on a fan forum nonetheless.

Everyone has an opinion.

Not everyone feels strongly enough to back it up.

feelthepain
08-26-2008, 12:26 PM
Everyone has an opinion.

Not everyone feels strongly enough to back it up.


And some do back it up with facts.

Brassmonki14120
08-26-2008, 12:30 PM
And some do back it up with facts.

Feel like backing your facts up with a wager?

feelthepain
08-26-2008, 12:32 PM
Feel like backing your facts up with a wager?

Vicious cycle!

Brassmonki14120
08-26-2008, 12:41 PM
Vicious cycle!

Seems as though my opinions are too realistic to bet against. I wont ask again.

feelthepain
08-26-2008, 01:08 PM
Seems as though my opinions are too realistic to bet against. I wont ask again.


It's NOTHING to do with your opinion. I don't bet on things I have no control over. In either case no team has control over injuries. So lets say I take your bet and the Dolphins lose three starters in the first two weeks, well then it's gone from being something I bet on to something I didn't bet on, but I'm stuck with the bet.

That's plain stupidity and it has nothing to do with my opinion of the defense the "was" healthy. Now I relize this could go the other way, and the Bills could have the injuries. It chnges things still cause then we are no longer looking at the same bet. Basiclly you're betteing on the small chance both teams stay 100% healthy and they remain that way through the entire season in order to prove who better at full strength.

That's a whole lot of "if's" and "could be's". You nor I have control over what will happen, so it's rather pointless to try to throw a dart through a tiny little window when in the end it's basically..."see, I told you so".

If on the other hand you want to bet and say well lets just bet regardless of injury, we could, but then it comes down the winner having more luck then the loser and then it's gone from proving a point, to who was luckier. So tell me, what does being luckier have to do with the original opinion? Nothing!

You keep your opinion and I'll keep mine, in the end I'll remind about how I was right and you can just agree.:up:

ZachThomas76
08-26-2008, 01:52 PM
It's NOTHING to do with your opinion. I don't bet on things I have no control over. In either case no team has control over injuries. So lets say I take your bet and the Dolphins lose three starters in the first two weeks, well then it's gone from being something I bet on to something I didn't bet on, but I'm stuck with the bet.

That's plain stupidity and it has nothing to do with my opinion of the defense the "was" healthy. Now I relize this could go the other way, and the Bills could have the injuries. It chnges things still cause then we are no longer looking at the same bet. Basiclly you're betteing on the small chance both teams stay 100% healthy and they remain that way through the entire season in order to prove who better at full strength.

That's a whole lot of "if's" and "could be's". You nor I have control over what will happen, so it's rather pointless to try to throw a dart through a tiny little window when in the end it's basically..."see, I told you so".

If on the other hand you want to bet and say well lets just bet regardless of injury, we could, but then it comes down the winner having more luck then the loser and then it's gone from proving a point, to who was luckier. So tell me, what does being luckier have to do with the original opinion? Nothing!

You keep your opinion and I'll keep mine, in the end I'll remind about how I was right and you can just agree.:up:

wow, just wow. lol. injuries? if a person wants to make a bet that their team is better, doesnt that include better depth that becomes a factor if injuries hit. just say you dont want to bet and move on. lol.

djfresh47
08-26-2008, 02:36 PM
Everybody think their team is a world beater before the season starts. Even last year people on this board would come up with a reason why the Dolphins would beat somebody who out-classed the team by a mile. I'm sure fans on Bills site do the same thing.

With all things considered i'd take 6-10 or 7-9 in a heartbeat for this current Dolphins team. Bills fans probably have to expect 9-7 or 10-6 or else they've gotta get rid of the coaching staff IMO, and start over.

Realistically I think the Jets are awful and regardless of the hype people feel is surronding the Bills. What's with the hype surronding the Jets? If Edwards turns out to be he Bills Qb than i'd say the Bills are a year or two ahead of Miami if Henne turns out to be the Dolphins Qb in the near future. On the other hand the Jets have Clemens who I don't believe would've beat out Pennington. I think the Jets are an 8-8 team. New England has to eventually comeback to the pack but still by far a better team than anybody else in the division.

The teams that I think will be going for the last WC spot all have flaws "on paper." Cleveland can't stop anybody yet made moves to help that, Vince Young reminds me of Rick Ankiel pitching, the Texans don't have a rb, Cincy can't stop anybody, Buffalo is missing their franchise player and are banking on a rookie wr, the Jets are hoping a Qb who was at best average 2/3 last seasons to learn a new playbook and be the MVP candidate of last season.

Dolphins fans have been burned by the hype with Culpepper and Ricky toking tree. Everybody has expectations in the preseason.

feelthepain
08-26-2008, 03:42 PM
wow, just wow. lol. injuries? if a person wants to make a bet that their team is better, doesnt that include better depth that becomes a factor if injuries hit. just say you dont want to bet and move on. lol.

No it doesn't, what if the injuries come to a part of the defense your depth is weakest, rather then strongest? I mean seriously there are so many other things that factor into the conclusion.

Lets be honest, when it comes to defense Miami clearly has the edge, so I'm not worried about the outcome. It's just stupid to bet on something you don't control, period.

and why does a bet have to be made at all? Whats the point? Betting is stupid and porves nothing except one person has just a little more luck then the other. Yet some people actually believe it proves you have faith in what you believe. I hate to disappoint you, I believe the Dolphins Defense is better and a bet won't change it.

djfresh47
08-26-2008, 03:56 PM
No it doesn't, what if the injuries come to a part of the defense your depth is weakest, rather then strongest? I mean seriously there are so many other things that factor into the conclusion.

Lets be honest, when it comes to defense Miami clearly has the edge, so I'm not worried about the outcome. It's just stupid to bet on something you don't control, period.

and why does a bet have to be made at all? Whats the point? Betting is stupid and porves nothing except one person has just a little more luck then the other. Yet some people actually believe it proves you have faith in what you believe. I hate to disappoint you, I believe the Dolphins Defense is better and a bet won't change it.

I don't bet but if a bookie or Vegas allowed me to put in qualifiers onto whether my bet would count I think they'd go broke. Somethings which like suicide pools, squares, fantasy are alright. I've got friends who bet on preseason which is quite sad.

Would anybody accept a bet if you stipulated that in order for your bet to be accepted for Miami finishing ahead of New England Brady would have to break his arm?

feelthepain
08-26-2008, 05:02 PM
I don't bet but if a bookie or Vegas allowed me to put in qualifiers onto whether my bet would count I think they'd go broke. Somethings which like suicide pools, squares, fantasy are alright. I've got friends who bet on preseason which is quite sad.

Would anybody accept a bet if you stipulated that in order for your bet to be accepted for Miami finishing ahead of New England Brady would have to break his arm?


I use stipulations to prove a point, nothing more. Bottom line for me, I don't bet...period.

DaBills4life
08-26-2008, 09:46 PM
It's NOTHING to do with your opinion. I don't bet on things I have no control over. In either case no team has control over injuries. So lets say I take your bet and the Dolphins lose three starters in the first two weeks, well then it's gone from being something I bet on to something I didn't bet on, but I'm stuck with the bet.

That's plain stupidity and it has nothing to do with my opinion of the defense the "was" healthy. Now I relize this could go the other way, and the Bills could have the injuries. It chnges things still cause then we are no longer looking at the same bet. Basiclly you're betteing on the small chance both teams stay 100% healthy and they remain that way through the entire season in order to prove who better at full strength.

That's a whole lot of "if's" and "could be's". You nor I have control over what will happen, so it's rather pointless to try to throw a dart through a tiny little window when in the end it's basically..."see, I told you so".

If on the other hand you want to bet and say well lets just bet regardless of injury, we could, but then it comes down the winner having more luck then the loser and then it's gone from proving a point, to who was luckier. So tell me, what does being luckier have to do with the original opinion? Nothing!

You keep your opinion and I'll keep mine, in the end I'll remind about how I was right and you can just agree.:up:

You sure you agree with opinion? I mean your trying to tell us that Miami, who has lost 4 straight to Buffalo, was actually better than Buffalo.

Average score?

22-8. Miami must be better.

Brassmonki14120
08-26-2008, 10:32 PM
It's NOTHING to do with your opinion. I don't bet on things I have no control over. In either case no team has control over injuries. So lets say I take your bet and the Dolphins lose three starters in the first two weeks, well then it's gone from being something I bet on to something I didn't bet on, but I'm stuck with the bet.

That's plain stupidity and it has nothing to do with my opinion of the defense the "was" healthy. Now I relize this could go the other way, and the Bills could have the injuries. It chnges things still cause then we are no longer looking at the same bet. Basiclly you're betteing on the small chance both teams stay 100% healthy and they remain that way through the entire season in order to prove who better at full strength.

That's a whole lot of "if's" and "could be's". You nor I have control over what will happen, so it's rather pointless to try to throw a dart through a tiny little window when in the end it's basically..."see, I told you so".

If on the other hand you want to bet and say well lets just bet regardless of injury, we could, but then it comes down the winner having more luck then the loser and then it's gone from proving a point, to who was luckier. So tell me, what does being luckier have to do with the original opinion? Nothing!

You keep your opinion and I'll keep mine, in the end I'll remind about how I was right and you can just agree .:up:

I agree to your stipulation, it's a bet.

feelthepain
08-26-2008, 10:37 PM
You sure you agree with opinion? I mean your trying to tell us that Miami, who has lost 4 straight to Buffalo, was actually better than Buffalo.

Average score?

22-8. Miami must be better.

The Bills haven't made the Playoffs in almost 10 years, it doesn't stop you from talking playoffs. Miami's loses to the Bills are no big deal, Of course for Bill fans who have so little to enjoy with their team, sweeping a division rival is their SB.

Lee evans83
08-26-2008, 11:07 PM
the bills defense may have been ranked 31st in yards but in points they were ranked 18th(22.1ppg) just ahead of the jets at 19 (22.1ppg) and ahead of the dolphins at 30th (27.3 ppg)...so really the bills defense wasnt all that bad last year considering they had players like john digorgio keith ellison larry tripplet and george wilson starting who are decent back ups but shouldnt be starting as many games as they did...so i can see why many bills fans including myself would think the bills will have a pretty formidable defense this year because they are upgrading all those positions while those players provide pretty good depth (except larry tripplet hes gone)..

as for the offensive side of the ball steve fairchild was a very very bad o coordinator every play was sooo predictable and he did not utilize the talents of many players nor did he ever switch things up at all. his replacement turk shoenert so far has been the opposite of fairchild (4wr sets etc..) also the offense finally has a red zone threat in james hardy this year and finally trent edwards has a year under his belt and added a solid 15 lbs of muscle.

this is why myself and many other bills fans believe they should contend for the playoffs and i dont think its very far fetched

djfresh47
08-26-2008, 11:44 PM
You sure you agree with opinion? I mean your trying to tell us that Miami, who has lost 4 straight to Buffalo, was actually better than Buffalo.

Average score?

22-8. Miami must be better.

I'm a Dolphins fan but try to think in the other teams shoe. I'm playing both sides of the arguement but I can't criticize the Bills because the Dolphins have been soo bad of late. I think Jauron is an awful head coach and having a 1st time guy in Sparano gives me hope.

Rather than go around other players both these teams depend on Henne and Edwards. The minute I heard Parcells was hired I told a friend "Henne is a Parcells guy." Personally I liked Brian Brohm, but I trust Parcells more than the guys who've been running or ruining the Dolphins for the last few years.

I think the Bills should be thinking playoff spot and Bills fan should be thinking playoff spot. As a Dolphin fan I think the team should be improved because I though Cameron was imcompetant.

DaBills4life
08-27-2008, 12:16 AM
The Bills haven't made the Playoffs in almost 10 years, it doesn't stop you from talking playoffs. Miami's loses to the Bills are no big deal, Of course for Bill fans who have so little to enjoy with their team, sweeping a division rival is their SB.

Do you even listen to yourself?

If sweeping a division rival is our Super Bowl, what is yours? Winning the coin toss?

feelthepain
08-27-2008, 12:24 PM
Do you even listen to yourself?

If sweeping a division rival is our Super Bowl, what is yours? Winning the coin toss?


Do you listen to what you say? The Bills swept a 1-15 team, not the defending SB champs. I could understand sweeping the Dolphins and then constantly telling us how big of a deal it was if we were 14-2 last year, but we weren't. You also act as if the only teams capable of getting better in just one off season, are teams in divisions that didn't have the worst records. Basically if you had the worst record in the division, you will be the worst team in the division again!! Seriously, what sport do you watch?

The Bills were 7-9 and 4 of their 7 wins came against the 1-15 Dolphins and the 4-12 Jets. Basically the Bills had just one win against a team that was above 500. The Redskins and they were just 9-7...not the 16-0 Pats. So why don't you spare us the attitude if some of us don't gush all over your 7-9, 30th ranked offense, 31st ranked defense, no play off berth haven't had a winning sieason since MM Bills, OK?

Bill fans kill me, they expect respect for a losing team. I respect the Pats, I respect the Chargers, Giants and Cowboys. I respect teams that are good because they're well coached and produce pro bowlers and top 5 defenses. I don't repsect teams that have better reocords then a 1-15 team, but worst statistics then that same 1-15 team and no playoffs. Get over your team they aren't that good.

Brassmonki14120
08-27-2008, 12:57 PM
Do you listen to what you say? The Bills swept a 1-15 team, not the defending SB champs. I could understand sweeping the Dolphins and then constantly telling us big of a deal it was if we were 14-2 last year, but we weren't. You also act as if the only teams capable of getting better in just one off season, are teams in divisions that didn't have the worst records. Basically if you had the worst record in the division, you will be the worst team in the division again!! Seriously, what sport do you watch?

The Bills were 7-9 and 4 of their 7 wins came against the 1-15 Dolphins and the 4-12 Jets. Basically the Bills had just one win against a team that was above 500. The Redskins and they were just 9-7...not the 16-0 Pats. So why don't you spare us the attitude if some of us don't gush all over your 7-9, 30th ranked offense, 31st ranked defense, no play off berth haven't had a winning sieason since MM Bills, OK?

Bill fans kill me, they expect respect for a losing team. I respect the Pats, I respect the Chargers, Giants and Cowboys. I respect teams they are good because they're well coached and produce pro bowlers and top 5 defenses. I don't repsect teams that have better reocords then a 1-15 team, but worst statistics then that same 1-15 team and no playoffs. Get over your team they aren't that good.

I believe that teams get better after 1 season but you dont seem to. The Bills are better team than they were last year and so are the fish. The fish were also the worst team in the league not just the division and didn't really add much more than BP and penny. The fish lost allot in JT and now Joey Porter looks like he's about done with his career. The fish D will suffer. That's not opinion, that's an intelligent observation after going over the facts.

I don't expect you to respect the Bills and I don't care you don't. Your opinion doesn't effect how the Bills play either way. I just hope you're paying attention this season because you sure didn't this past one.

Get over it? This is the best Bills team in a few years and I'm pretty excited out the prospect of having a winning season. This Bills team is looks like a very solid foundation to build a playoff team around. Another draft or two, some free agent pick ups and the Bills will be making annual playoff appearances once again.

You act like the Bills can't possibly get any better while the fish are getting ready for a playoff push. It's funny and sad at the same time.

As for Dick Jauron, he took a bunch of backups last year and still fielded a competitive team. That says allot. I love this guy as our head coach.

Say what you want, it wont change the reality of the upcoming season.

feelthepain
08-27-2008, 01:07 PM
I believe that teams get better after 1 season but you dont seem to. The Bills are better team than they were last year and so are the fish. The fish were also the worst team in the league not just the division and didn't really add much more than BP and penny. The fish lost allot in JT and now Joey Porter looks like he's about done with his career. The fish D will suffer. That's not opinion, that's an intelligent observation after going over the facts.

I don't expect you to respect the Bills and I don't care you don't. Your opinion doesn't effect how the Bills play either way. I just hope you're paying attention this season because you sure didn't this past one.

Get over it? This is the best Bills team in a few years and I'm pretty excited out the prospect of having a winning season. This Bills team is looks like a very solid foundation to build a playoff team around. Another draft or two, some free agent pick ups and the Bills will be making annual playoff appearances once again.

You act like the Bills can't possibly get any better while the fish are getting ready for a playoff push. It's funny and sad at the same time.

As for Dick Jauron, he took a bunch of backups last year and still fielded a competitive team. That says allot. I love this guy as our head coach.

Say what you want, it wont change the reality of the upcoming season.

All opinion, that's it, that's all. The Bills aren't the Pats, the Chargers the Cowboys. Everything you claim the Bills are has yet to be proven. As is with the Dolphins, you OPINION about the changes to this team have yet to be orven in any way other then pre season games. So until these two team take the field in 08 and finish the season, all we have is opinion. And opinions are just opinions, the end of the season we'll see where they stand.

Vertical Limit
08-27-2008, 01:18 PM
The Bills haven't made the Playoffs in almost 10 years, it doesn't stop you from talking playoffs. Miami's loses to the Bills are no big deal, Of course for Bill fans who have so little to enjoy with their team, sweeping a division rival is their SB.
It's not like it's unrealistic or anything just because of their recent history. Just see how quickly the Saints turned it around and how bad their talent was before Brees, before Reggie Bush and Marcus Colston.

As much as I don't like it, this is a very talented Bills' team and one of the best they have had in a long time. Watch some video/highlights on Trent Edwards and that guy is developing into a very solid quarterback; making pro throws and looking very comfortable, even without Peters, a pro bowl caliber LT.

Miami isn't the only team in the league improving, believe it or not. We still have about 4-5 floors of stairs to climb before we get to walk and talk; yet we have a thread of us finishing 12-4 this season on the main discussion forum. Hell, if it happens, then **** rofl, I'll be crazy happy. But with our lack of talent on defense and offense (although impressive in preseason but might be in for a rude awakening in the regular season when teams are using more gameplanning and much less experimenting situations), I find 12-4 or even 10-6 unrealistic. 8-8 and 7-9 sounds real good for us, 6-10 sounds realistic.

I think I mentioned in another thread where Witner (sp?) was predicting playoffs that I actually think the Bills have a real chance at making it this year; the wild card atleast. Patriots will have the division, again IMO.

Brassmonki14120
08-27-2008, 01:35 PM
All opinion, that's it, that's all. The Bills aren't the Pats, the Chargers the Cowboys. Everything you claim the Bills are has yet to be proven. As is with the Dolphins, you OPINION about the changes to this team have yet to be orven in any way other then pre season games. So until these two team take the field in 08 and finish the season, all we have is opinion. And opinions are just opinions, the end of the season we'll see where they stand.

I think you could actually call my opinions prophecy.

Search my posts,

Take Brees not pep, pep can't read defenses and has fumblitis.

Saban could coach in college but you cant scream at millionaire adults and get result, The nictator is a cancer.

Cam couldn't make it as a headcaoch in college and wont in the Pros.

Beck sucks nuggets and will be lucky to be on the team in two years. Lucky to be anywhere in the NFL in 5.

Joey porter is a waste of money. Over rated.

McMike is no good.

Last preseason said Miami will be luck yo win 3 games. One guy put my prediction in his sig.

Everyone bashed my opini.... prophecy. Now get ready to bash this.

Justin Smiley will have health issues from his diet and alcohol consumption.

Ferguson will play his last NFL game in the next season and a half.

Joey Porter will have a problem with pain killers and the law.

The fish defense will rank no better than 17th the Bills will rank 12th or higher.

The fish O-line will struggle throughout the season.

Penny will personally take a severe physical beating from his former team.

So Flingeth the Monki!

djfresh47
08-27-2008, 02:45 PM
I think you could actually call my opinions prophecy.

Search my posts,

Take Brees not pep, pep can't read defenses and has fumblitis.

Saban could coach in college but you cant scream at millionaire adults and get result, The nictator is a cancer.

Cam couldn't make it as a headcaoch in college and wont in the Pros.

Beck sucks nuggets and will be lucky to be on the team in two years. Lucky to be anywhere in the NFL in 5.

Joey porter is a waste of money. Over rated.

McMike is no good.

Last preseason said Miami will be luck yo win 3 games. One guy put my prediction in his sig.

Everyone bashed my opini.... prophecy. Now get ready to bash this.

Justin Smiley will have health issues from his diet and alcohol consumption.

Ferguson will play his last NFL game in the next season and a half.

Joey Porter will have a problem with pain killers and the law.

The fish defense will rank no better than 17th the Bills will rank 12th or higher.

The fish O-line will struggle throughout the season.

Penny will personally take a severe physical beating from his former team.

So Flingeth the Monki!

Personally I don't think Saban would've done a horrible job as a head coach. Saying an offensive lineman will have problems because of his diet isn't really some bold prediction. I mean guys weighing 300+ lbs are going to have diet issues. I think Chris Kelsay and Aaron Schobel were a waste of money. So what? Lee Evans is Chris Chambers but more inconsistent. I don't think bashing teams with your Ms. Cleo rant is the best way to sound reasonable. Honestly I don't think Edwards is very good but what does that mean? If he isn't i've got an "i told you so," thing to push in friends faces. If he is it won't really matter because I went out on a limb.

thejetssuck
08-29-2008, 05:41 PM
I hope this rumor is true simply for the fact that I have Marshawn Lynch on my FF team.

http://arkansas.scout.com/a.z?s=10&p=9&c=2&cid=784179&nid=3661937&fhn=1

SebasMiamiFan
09-01-2008, 10:04 PM
The Fins have 2 SB wins out of 3. Been to the playoffs countless times. Have the most winning percentage out of any team. Only team to be perfect. Had pretty good seasons from 2001-2007. Worst seasons were 2004 and 2007. 1-15 is all you have against us. We were bad because of bad coaching and injuries. 4 wins came out of us and the Jets. 3 wins is what you really got. As FTP has said, if you had beaten the Pats or the Colts, I would have respected you. I have respect for teams who win. Rubbing 1-15 into peoples' faces is immature because you know we're returning to the top of the AFC East. If your team is so good, why have you not been to the playoffs since 1999? The Fins haven't been there since '01 and the Jets '06. The Dolphins have only had 2 losing seasons this decade. Some of you guys make it like that the Fins have sucked since 1966 (The year they started in the NFL).

Deep2Evans
09-01-2008, 10:40 PM
The Fins have 2 SB wins out of 3. Been to the playoffs countless times. Have the most winning percentage out of any team. Only team to be perfect. Had pretty good seasons from 2001-2007. Worst seasons were 2004 and 2007. 1-15 is all you have against us. We were bad because of bad coaching and injuries. 4 wins came out of us and the Jets. 3 wins is what you really got. As FTP has said, if you had beaten the Pats or the Colts, I would have respected you. I have respect for teams who win. Rubbing 1-15 into peoples' faces is immature because you know we're returning to the top of the AFC East. If your team is so good, why have you not been to the playoffs since 1999? The Fins haven't been there since '01 and the Jets '06. The Dolphins have only had 2 losing seasons this decade. Some of you guys make it like that the Fins have sucked since 1966 (The year they started in the NFL).

Gotta love living in the past huh?

All that matters is this year.