PDA

View Full Version : The Ron Brace Dilemma.



skipp2myloo13
01-20-2009, 03:10 PM
As we all know NT is going to be a real concern in the next few years, and it would be smart to invest in one in the draft, as soon as possible. the draft class shows two legitimate NT candidates-B.J. Raji and Ron Brace. They both are from BC. Raji is a better prospect and is most likely a top 20 pick and there is no way he gets past Hotlanna.
Brace is listed as 6'4 345 by BC. he is considered by some to be a better run stopping NT than Raji. if we miss out on Raji it is imperative that we get Brace.
the question is when and where do we use a pick to get him he isnt worht 25 we know that. 2a is also early but becasue of lack of NT depth it wouldnt be terrible to pick him that early if we think he wont make it to a later pick. 2b would be right around where he is slotted to go any later and we are really risking it. where do you think we should pick him? 2b is mine

Valandui
01-20-2009, 03:17 PM
I'm not sure they don't think Soliai is the answer. Parcells doesn't use high round picks on NTs. Jason Ferguson and Jay Ratliff were both sixth or seventh rounders. He drafts them late and lets them develop for a few years behind a vet. Soliai has definitely shown some promise this year and Tuna didn't even have to use a pick on him.

lbmclean_sj
01-20-2009, 03:20 PM
if we miss out on Raji it is imperative that we get Brace.

true to some degree, but Rome wasn't built in a day

if we have to wait until the 2010 draft then so be it.

we have many needs and the chips may not fall our way, so we take the BPA and see what happens with FA and UDFA's

Are there any big DT's in the CFL:d-day:

PhinsPhan122
01-20-2009, 03:31 PM
Trust the organization. Remember Kendall Langford in the early third round? I remember myself saying, "Wow, too early to take him, and why draft another DE?" But of course, that was a great pick looking back on it. I believe the organization, if they believe in Ron Brace, will draft him at the right spot, if we are unable to get BJ Raji.

Canadi-Phin
01-20-2009, 03:32 PM
I agree, Brace seems like he could be the answer and we may want/need to take him with 2a, with the worry he too would be gone. I guess it totally depends on what they think of Solai. Would they feel comfortable with him if he had to start for 16 games because Ferg got hurt? I did like his growth near the end of the year but if they don't think so BRace is ideal for what we want him to do and that's clog the middle and command double teams.

3rdandinches
01-20-2009, 03:37 PM
No "has" to get picked by us, you end up selecting him way to high missing out on BPA. Then what happens when he's no better then Solai, I know that can happen with anyone player but you don't reach to get him. Last year all these big NT's ended up going 4th round or later (I'm not talking Raji here), just as the 1st round graded WR's went in the 2nd and later. Let's just see what falls into our laps and let the draft unfold without going crazy.

lbmclean_sj
01-20-2009, 03:41 PM
No "has" to get picked by us, you end up selecting him way to high missing out on BPA. Then what happens when he's no better then Solai, I know that can happen with anyone player but you don't reach to get him. Last year all these big NT's ended up going 4th round or later (I'm not talking Raji here), just as the 1st round graded WR's went in the 2nd and later. Let's just see what falls into our laps and let the draft unfold without going crazy.

my thoughts exactly

its not a dilemma for Ireland, cuz he won't be reaching

whomever reaches for Brace(because of the supply/demand for good NT's), good luck to them

ckparrothead
01-20-2009, 04:45 PM
I can't see Ron Brace going to us in round one. Maybe round two.

But I think ya'll should be prepared for them to do next to nothing with the NT position. They have a lot of loyalty to Jason Ferguson and they're actually paying him a pretty decent sum of money...and Paul Soliai has definitely flashed some real genuine potential this year, when he wasn't getting suspended.

In the first round I think it'll be about linebackers and offensive tackles.

skipp2myloo13
01-20-2009, 05:25 PM
I can't see Ron Brace going to us in round one. Maybe round two.

But I think ya'll should be prepared for them to do next to nothing with the NT position. They have a lot of loyalty to Jason Ferguson and they're actually paying him a pretty decent sum of money...and Paul Soliai has definitely flashed some real genuine potential this year, when he wasn't getting suspended.

In the first round I think it'll be about linebackers and offensive tackles.

OT, really? in the first? are you under the impression that carey wont be back. becuase if he is, then you dont draft line depth with ur first pick when you have as many needs as we have.

SR 7
01-20-2009, 05:40 PM
I can't see Ron Brace going to us in round one. Maybe round two.

But I think ya'll should be prepared for them to do next to nothing with the NT position. They have a lot of loyalty to Jason Ferguson and they're actually paying him a pretty decent sum of money...and Paul Soliai has definitely flashed some real genuine potential this year, when he wasn't getting suspended.

In the first round I think it'll be about linebackers and offensive tackles.

if we resign carey i dont see RT being number 1 but OLB for sure and maybe just maybe S or CB.

NT i can see miami going for one in the later rounds like BP always has if they do believe Solai has potential.

skinstill
01-20-2009, 10:14 PM
It would be awsome if Raja somehow falls to 25, not likely i know, I think our 3rd round pick would be a good value for Brace, i like Fergie but hes not overly powereful and hes getting older.

There a couple of other big NT's to be had in the 4th round or so too, i hope we go BPA no matter what.

Resigning Carey, Bell and Goodman will be huge for us, we could get along ok without Hill or Crowder pretty well i think, as long as we address those positions in the draft or FA.

The addition of Cameron Worrel will be big for us the guy is a good fooball player just give him some time to acclimate to the NFL, so OLB may not be that big of a deal anymore.

Considering recent events i think these are our needs in order priority....

NT
C
FS
WR
ILB
CB
OLB

Kdawg954
01-20-2009, 10:21 PM
It would be awsome if Raja somehow falls to 25, not likely i know, I think our 3rd round pick would be a good value for Brace, i like Fergie but hes not overly powereful and hes getting older.

There a couple of other big NT's to be had in the 4th round or so too, i hope we go BPA no matter what.

Resigning Carey, Bell and Goodman will be huge for us, we could get along ok without Hill or Crowder pretty well i think, as long as we address those positions in the draft or FA.

The addition of Cameron Worrel will be big for us the guy is a good fooball player just give him some time to acclimate to the NFL, so OLB may not be that big of a deal anymore.



Considering recent events i think these are our needs in order priority....

NT
C
FS
WR
ILB
CB
OLB

I really hope u mean Cameron Wake lol.

And a team that really lacked a consistent pass rush with a Front office that LOVES its linebackers is not giving up at the OLB positoin for a CFL player who is getting 1 million dollars a year and failed in the NFL previously. Wake has gotta be a potential based signing . . . but I still maintain I can see them drafting atleast 3 linebackers in this draft.

If Wake comes in and wrecks shop in camp . . . GREAT, but we aren't depending on him.

We definitely need a FS. Hell safety depth in general.

skinstill
01-20-2009, 10:30 PM
Yeah heh, i meant Wake the OLB, not Worrel the S, Worrel used to be one of our backup safetys.

I still think OLB is a need just not as much of a glaring need as it was, but thats just me.

Kdawg954
01-21-2009, 06:09 AM
Yeah heh, i meant Wake the OLB, not Worrel the S, Worrel used to be one of our backup safetys.

I still think OLB is a need just not as much of a glaring need as it was, but thats just me.

I think the BEST case scenario for Wake is that he is Joey Porter's replacement. But I don't expect him to start this season, but he will make the team . . . him and Charlie Anderson will go at it for JP's primary backup.

I expect atleast ONE 3-4 OLB to be drafted in the first 3 rounds. We need a guy who is versatile, and Clint Sintim is pretty much a do it all type of OLB . . . can rush the passer and drop in coverage and wouldn't require much transistioning because he already plays 3-4 OLB.

U add Clint Sintim and Wake, then your OLB's are Porter, Anderson and Wake on the weakside and Sintim and Roth on the strongside. No telling if this Front office is going to keep Roth after next season (FA) so they may decide to get his replacement in this draft also. If they luck out with 2 solid OLB choices . . . when JP retires or his contract runs up, then maybe Sintim can move to the weak side and become our primary pass rusher if Wake/Anderson doesn't work out. . . who knows, but we need more talent and people at OLB, because we just don't have enough options. Quentin Moses if I had to guess is on his way out.

3rdandinches
01-21-2009, 09:55 AM
There are other decent options if Brace gets selected early like

A.Dixon Miami 6'3 330 6th-7th round
N.Abdallah Ohio St. 6'5 310 (4.96 40) 5th-6th round
C.Baker Hampton 6'2 310 4th-5th round
T.Taylor Michigan 6'0 317 4th-5th round
D.Scott Clemson 6'4 315 3rd-4th round

ArmyFin7
01-21-2009, 11:15 AM
One thing I've been trying to figure out about Wake....the Giants brought him in and cut him. The Giants run a 4-3....we want him as a 3-4 OLB and he's now about 20lbs heavier. His role is a lot different Im guessing than what the Giants were asking him to do. I think this kid could turn out to be a beast. But I don't expect BP to pass on any LB's in the draft just because we signed him. BP loves him some LB's!

SR 7
01-21-2009, 02:11 PM
Ireland said they got wake b/c he can rush the passer and that this D is built on pressure and that they can't have enough of pass rushers. thats why raji a NT and a pass rusher is osmeone they may move up to get, and more OLB will be targeted i can promis eu guys that.

SR 7
01-21-2009, 02:13 PM
I think the BEST case scenario for Wake is that he is Joey Porter's replacement. But I don't expect him to start this season, but he will make the team . . . him and Charlie Anderson will go at it for JP's primary backup.

I expect atleast ONE 3-4 OLB to be drafted in the first 3 rounds. We need a guy who is versatile, and Clint Sintim is pretty much a do it all type of OLB . . . can rush the passer and drop in coverage and wouldn't require much transistioning because he already plays 3-4 OLB.

U add Clint Sintim and Wake, then your OLB's are Porter, Anderson and Wake on the weakside and Sintim and Roth on the strongside. No telling if this Front office is going to keep Roth after next season (FA) so they may decide to get his replacement in this draft also. If they luck out with 2 solid OLB choices . . . when JP retires or his contract runs up, then maybe Sintim can move to the weak side and become our primary pass rusher if Wake/Anderson doesn't work out. . . who knows, but we need more talent and people at OLB, because we just don't have enough options. Quentin Moses if I had to guess is on his way out.

they said wake is suppose to be porters eventual replacement and will play WOLB.

also sintim has been doing very bad in the SR bowl practices so far. looks stiff and has issues. my fav has been English and hes someone id like to take. veyr quick explosive burst and has many diff moves to get to the QB.

Kdawg954
01-21-2009, 11:28 PM
they said wake is suppose to be porters eventual replacement and will play WOLB.

also sintim has been doing very bad in the SR bowl practices so far. looks stiff and has issues. my fav has been English and hes someone id like to take. veyr quick explosive burst and has many diff moves to get to the QB.

They also said that the 4-3 defense is something that Sintim is just not used to and he was struggling a bit with it. Physically he has impressed.

And I also like English, but I prefer Sintim as the transistion to our defense should be simple, while we still gotta convert English.

OLB in the 3-4 is quite different from OLB in the 4-3 . . . the only thing this senior bowl is doing is ensuring that Clint goes to a team that runs the 3-4.

I am Bane
01-22-2009, 12:40 AM
i agree with this, but i am pondering still if Sintim can become an ILB at all too.... that could help us out more there!!!




They also said that the 4-3 defense is something that Sintim is just not used to and he was struggling a bit with it. Physically he has impressed.

And I also like English, but I prefer Sintim as the transistion to our defense should be simple, while we still gotta convert English.

OLB in the 3-4 is quite different from OLB in the 4-3 . . . the only thing this senior bowl is doing is ensuring that Clint goes to a team that runs the 3-4.

Kdawg954
01-22-2009, 12:45 AM
i agree with this, but i am pondering still if Sintim can become an ILB at all too.... that could help us out more there!!!

He probably could . . . but why would we do that? He already fits perfectly into our defense in a position that needs upgrading.

If Crowder gets resigned, ILB becomes less of a priority . . . if he doesn't, then we got to replace him in FA or early in the draft. Brinkley is HUGE, Parcells has gotta be licking his lips at the idea of adding that monster. I wonder how the Trifecta feels about Torbor . . . I know we are sour on him from the KC game . . . . is the coaching staff sour on him?

MrEd
01-22-2009, 07:16 AM
As we all know NT is going to be a real concern in the next few years, and it would be smart to invest in one in the draft, as soon as possible. the draft class shows two legitimate NT candidates-B.J. Raji and Ron Brace. They both are from BC. Raji is a better prospect and is most likely a top 20 pick and there is no way he gets past Hotlanna.
Brace is listed as 6'4 345 by BC. he is considered by some to be a better run stopping NT than Raji. if we miss out on Raji it is imperative that we get Brace.
the question is when and where do we use a pick to get him he isnt worht 25 we know that. 2a is also early but becasue of lack of NT depth it wouldnt be terrible to pick him that early if we think he wont make it to a later pick. 2b would be right around where he is slotted to go any later and we are really risking it. where do you think we should pick him? 2b is mine

Though, I like Paul Soliai, I believe in depth and we need "two" NTs to hold the forte down once Ferguson retires. If we only carry Soliai, then when Ferguson goes down, who backs Soliai up? You see?

So, we do need to carry two NTs and a project. Right now we have two, but one is old. So we actually need two to groom.

So I'm on board with keeping Soliai, who actually looked good this season...but I'm with drafting ROn Brace as well.

So, I'm actually of the 2"A" theory. I wouldn't risk him not being there at 2B. If there was a 3rd NT prospect in the draft that was as good as them, then maybe....but not when Brace is the only consolation prize for Raji not being there.

No, I say you "have" to take Brace at pick #44.

MrEd
01-22-2009, 07:20 AM
He probably could . . . but why would we do that? He already fits perfectly into our defense in a position that needs upgrading.

If Crowder gets resigned, ILB becomes less of a priority . . . if he doesn't, then we got to replace him in FA or early in the draft. Brinkley is HUGE, Parcells has gotta be licking his lips at the idea of adding that monster. I wonder how the Trifecta feels about Torbor . . . I know we are sour on him from the KC game . . . . is the coaching staff sour on him?

Which is why I'm for franchise tagging Crowder if he doesn't sign. The fact that Ireland has made him an offer, albeit low...means that they "are" interested and willing to keep him.

So I would keep Crowder at least with a one year franchise tag. This would allow us to go BPA at pick #25, instead of being "forced" to go LB because we have none there.

Having one there on a one year franchise tag allows us to go LB "if its the BPA" and pass on one and go WR, NT, S, CB....if it is the BPA. :up: