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View Full Version : Eric Berry v. Taylor Mays



JCane
10-28-2009, 09:28 PM
Someone provide me with the argument for Taylor Mays over Eric Berry.

It ain't happening.

Cloudy
10-28-2009, 10:09 PM
Sounds like you are just looking for an argument =P

Phinatic8u
10-28-2009, 10:10 PM
Berry is a rare player. Mays is just another S IMO

TedSlimmJr
10-29-2009, 12:04 AM
I've been trying to do this for 3 years.....and it can't be done...

Mays has the prototype triangle numbers.....but he doesn't play to those specs.....ever...

Eric Berry plays closer to Mays specs than Taylor Mays does...Berry plays like the 6-3, 230 pound freak...

I noticed many of what I would consider flaws in Mays game last year. His tackling technique can get downright bad...and he's not comfortable playing the football in the air and attacking it like a true "ballhawking" safety does....takes the wrong angle at times....etc..

These are areas where Berry is one of the best to ever strap it on in D-1 college football history...

Now don't get me wrong....Eric Berry hasn't played every single snap of his collegiate career to absolute perfection....sometimes he tends to "hit" hard rather than wrap up....see the Ben Tate run versus Auburn....etc...

But I've always noticed Mays isn't comfortable playing the ball in the air.....and he never will be....that eliminates him as a potential to intercept a lot of passes IMO....

The thing that Taylor Mays does well is he covers a LOT of ground....to the extent that very few safeties I've ever seen could....but not a lot happens when he gets there....when the moment of truth arrives, he's more hype than substance...

Goldent Tate owned him in ND's matchup with USC.....but Jimmy Clausen isn't the typical quarterback USC faces in the Pac-10 every week either....he can fit the ball into spaces that very few can....and do it repeatedly...he gave Tate a chance to catch the ball and make a "football move" afterwards...

The reason why you have never seen USC's defense get beaten deep the last 3 years is because USC can play a lot of Cover-1 and let Mays patrol the deep middle....it's been virtually impossible to get a deep pass by him because he covers so much ground....teams finally just stopped trying...allowing USC's athletes in the front 7 dominate opponents and always be at or near the top in scoring defense the past 3 years...but he doesn't have the corner help this year like he has the past few years....which is why you see that defense struggle more this year than in the past....It was like USC didn't even have a defense on the field against Oregon St. they racked up so many yards and moved the ball so easily.....just like last year's matchup when OSU won....

The fact that USC's defense is lacking the quality and experience at CB this year compared to previous years is why Mays seems to be exposed more easily now....but he cost USC a long touchdown against Ohio St. this year because he was caught out of position...something you just don't see out of Eric Berry...

When you get right down to it....the comparison really isn't even close to being as valid as it seems just because they're the two "big name" safeties that everyone talks about....

But if you watch enough college football, there's another safety or two that most people don't even know exists that compare more favorably to Eric Berry if you choose to make him the standard you judge other college safeties by...

ChadHenne
10-29-2009, 04:10 PM
Everybody knows Berry is a once in a decade kind of safety. Really hasn't been a player to come out of college like him since Ed Reed came out of the U. Sucks he's going to be forced playing for the LOLBrowns.

JCane
10-29-2009, 05:10 PM
Teddy Slimm NAILED it. Mays often finds himself out of position. He lays some big hits but that's only because he doesn't get there in time to break up passes like Berry does because again, Mays often finds himself out of position. Berry v. Mays is really no different than last season when the debate of Brian Cushing and Rey Maualuga came up. Everyone wanted Maualuga and couldn't understand why Cushing was being drafted higher. Now you see why. Cushing was a much better player in college. Cushing always blew up plays before they developed. Maualuga was fast and hit hard. That's it. Maualuga did his damage after plays had developed. Take a look at their respective NFL seasons this year. Cushing is probably the NFL Defensive Player of the Year.

Eric Berry alllllll day.

Miamifin23
10-29-2009, 09:24 PM
Ed Reed in college wasn't anything like Berry.... Berry by far is a better prospect going into the draft, I think Reed fell to like #30 or something like that. Berry will be gone top 3. I would say he's more like a Sean Taylor type prospect. Mays is like a Vernon Gholston/Vernon Davis... will have an amazing combine but won't quite live up to the numbers (although davis looks to be coming around).

JCane
10-29-2009, 09:34 PM
Ed Reed and Sean Taylor were the two best Safties I've ever seen. Berry is of the same mold. Ed Reed lit in up in college. Believe that.

SRM
10-29-2009, 11:07 PM
Ed Reed and Sean Taylor were the two best Safties I've ever seen. Berry is of the same mold. Ed Reed lit in up in college. Believe that.

Will always be my favorite player.

Namor
10-29-2009, 11:09 PM
The question is ..If when we chose and Rolando McClain and Eric Berry are both
there,who do we chose?

SRM
10-29-2009, 11:14 PM
The question is ..If when we chose and Rolando McClain and Eric Berry are both
there,who do we chose?

Tough call! Personally, I would go with Berry though.

JCane
10-29-2009, 11:22 PM
The bigger need is McClain. But if it's me...you know who I'm taking lol.

phinfan33
10-30-2009, 01:05 AM
i definitely wouldn't mind us getting Eric Berry,but the chances of that happening are slim to none,and slim just left the building....

3rdandinches
10-30-2009, 02:08 AM
The bigger need is McClain. But if it's me...you know who I'm taking lol.

How do you figure that, we have one of the best run defenses in the league. But our weakness on defense is pass coverage down the deep middle. FS is the biggest need on our team, an upgrade at ILB would help too but Berry at FS makes us 10 times better on defense.

JCane
10-30-2009, 02:09 AM
How do you figure that, we have one of the best run defenses in the league. But our weakness on defense is pass coverage down the deep middle. FS is the biggest need on our team, an upgrade at ILB would help too but Berry at FS makes us 10 times better on defense.

Meet Channing Crowder.

http://www.finheaven.com/clear.gif

Valandui
10-30-2009, 02:10 AM
The bigger need is McClain. But if it's me...you know who I'm taking lol.
I agree, McClain is probably a bigger need, but if Berry is still sitting there somehow by our pick we should jump on him.

JCane
10-30-2009, 02:22 AM
Eric Berry is hands down the best player in this draft.

phinfan33
10-30-2009, 02:39 AM
as much as i'd love for us to get Berry...i'll say this..whoever does get him,their secondary will be instantly better,because i don't think Eric Berry will have any problems adjusting to the NFL and the defensive scheme of whatever team he goes to...jmo

TedSlimmJr
10-30-2009, 03:56 AM
The question is ..If when we chose and Rolando McClain and Eric Berry are both
there,who do we chose?


That's a tough question.....

But I think you avoid this "dilemma" all together by outsmarting the league and the draft process by turning in a card with the name of some 140 pound kick returner from the Big-10 and convince the fanbase that he's going to be a #1 WR in 3 years....

Seriously.....I think it would work on half of Finheaven again....:lol:

Problem solved...

cafinfan408
10-30-2009, 05:25 AM
We have already won to many game to have the ability to draft him

JCane
10-30-2009, 05:28 AM
We have already won to many game to have the ability to draft him

Two?! I know there are some bad teams in the league but I gotta believe those bad teams will win at least two.

Namor
10-31-2009, 12:02 AM
Okay who do you think Parcells would take? A linebacker that grades out at a 95 or a safety that grades out at a 97?
Remember what the 3-4 defense is built around.

FinsFanatic777
10-31-2009, 12:05 AM
The Dolphins won't be able to draft him. We are aiming to try to make it back to the playoffs, not lose to get the highest draft pick. Remember, Al Davis is almost certain to select Mays or Berry if either is there, and the Raiders will pick before us no doubt. However, I think the Raiders select Mays because he has better "combine" numbers, but Berry is obviously the better talent. But since when has Davis drafted on talent?

Even if the Raiders select Mays, Berry will be a top 3 pick. He could have been a top 10 pick if he declared last year. And if he's there, we HAVE to taken him. I really want Dez Bryant, but Eric Berry is too much to pass up on. Our greatest weakness is our pass offense and defense. Berry will instantly improve that pass defense. Since Bryant will be drafted later than Berry, hopefully we can trade back into the first round to get him.

Pinkboy
10-31-2009, 09:30 PM
Easily Eric Berry.. Berry is a million times smarter, more instinctive, and better in pass coverage.

Mays is worse than what we already have at safety.. He would be a god awful pick for us.

http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2010tmays.php


Weaknesses:
Takes false steps in coverage and poor angles
Lacks instincts
Zero ball skills
Not much of a playmaker
Poor tackling technique; throws body around without using arms/hands to wrap up
Hasn't improved his weaknesses going back to sophomore season
Occasionally not in position
Plays out of control
More of an athlete than a football player

Summary: Mays isn't a free safety at the next level; no chance he pans out there because he is horrible in coverage and has zero ball skills. Mays idea of playing football is running and throwing his body around, which is why I am giving him the nickname “The Trojan Torpedo.” I think Mays can start at strong safety for some team, but he will be pretty average.

Mays is the Vernon Gholston of safety prospects. Sure he has great measurables, but so did Gholston. I personally wouldn't draft Mays in the top 40 picks, but his draft range is all over the board. He could go top five to a team like Oakland or he could fall to the lower part of the first round.

Player Comparison: Roy L. Williams. It's like someone cloned Roy Williams; Mays and Williams are the EXACT same player. Mays will struggle greatly in coverage at the next level, but he hits hard and is good in run support. Buyer beware.

MP-Omnis
10-31-2009, 11:44 PM
Mays wasn't looking so hot today. The Ducks took a **** on their defense.

Ozfin77
11-01-2009, 01:40 AM
If Mays wasnt there today the Ducks would have scored 2 or 3 more Touchdowns if not more...He was the last line of D many times, and made the stop each time.

TedSlimmJr
11-01-2009, 10:28 PM
Comparing Taylor Mays to Roy Williams is overdoing it a little bit.....

Roy Williams led the Sooner's in TFL's....which tells you how much he was used to play near the line of scrimmage and as an extra "linebacker" when they bring the 8th defender in the box....this guy was doomed in coverage as an NFL safety from the start IMO....

Mays plays a lot more center field in USC's defense and covers a lot more ground....he is the Trojan's last line of defense....

TedSlimmJr
11-03-2009, 04:47 AM
BTW....if anybody wonders who one of those safeties are that compares more favorably to Eric Berry that I referred to earlier in this thread.....it's Earl Thomas....

He's only a redshirt sophomore.....but this kid is great.....he's a stud...

He lines up all over the place....covers receivers in the slot....has the hips and change of direction skills of an elite cornerback.....and his range in the deep secondary is awesome....

He has no weaknesses in his game that really stick out......if you watch Texas play....there's no way this kid's burst and closing speed can't literally jump off the screen at you.....he's a 1st round pick if I've ever seen one....

Only thing is he's 5'11" about 198....basically an Eric Berry clone....but he still has plenty of time to add a few pounds to that frame...

Muschamp's defense gets players ready for the NFL early....and this guy is fabulous....and versatile...

STUDDDD!!!

NRA
11-03-2009, 10:45 AM
BERRY is the ONLY defensive player i would be happy with.

miami MUST fix this offense and you do that by bringing in
OFFENSIVE PLAYMAKERS!!!!

if berrry isnt there, who ever the BEST offensive player is on
the board. hopefully wr, but rb is almost as big of need.

when the wildcat is not running, neither is ronnie brown. once
again he is showing at he CAN NOT consistantly run out of
standard run formations.

wr, te, then rb. but, if a blue chip guy is there at ANY of those positions,
then the order doesnt matter.

and unless this guzzillion dollar o-line learns how to pass block, TE will mean
nothing as they have had to stay put and help our tackles pass block.

OFFENSE PEOPLE, OFFENSE!!!!!

NRA
11-03-2009, 10:50 AM
EARL THOMAS!!!!!! YEAH BABY!!!!

that kid is the shiat for sure. i love watching that guy play.

he wont be in this draft, and if he comes out next year, HOPEFULLY
we wont be selecting early enough to have a shot.

utahphinsfan
11-09-2009, 12:23 PM
I'm surprised some of you aren't gunshy... seen as how the last Safety from UT turned out to be such a success.

All things being equal, I'd take Chad Jones From LSU and hopefully will work out like Polamalu has for the Steelers. I may be biased but would take Robert Johnson from the U (here in SLC) over Mays.

Awsi Dooger
11-17-2009, 10:26 PM
Taylor Mays was celebrating a stopped two point conversion with a body builder pose. USC trailed Stanford 48-21 at the time.

I think the comparisons to Roy Williams are unfair to Roy Williams.

And BTW, I can't believe anyone downplayed how great Ed Reed was as a Cane. He's the most instinctive college defender I've ever seen. To quote the late Joel Buchsbaum of Pro Football Weekly, "Reed makes big plays and bigger plays."

It never made any sense that he fell so far in the draft.