PDA

View Full Version : Draft Scenario



3rdandinches
11-26-2009, 05:34 PM
Assuming we will pick anywhere from 25 - 18, let's say Bryant, Cody, McClain are all gone.

Would you take B.Spikes ILB or E.Thomas FS or J.Hughes OLB

Spikes has a world of potential to help Crowder out inside but Thomas would solidify the secondary and Hughes is a monster pass rusher that we need aswell.

I really want McClain but I don't think we will have a shot at him, the other three I think will be available where we will end up picking. I'm really torn between Spikes and Thomas, I believe the drop off after Spikes is large and we do have Clemons. I also think there's some pretty solid depth at OLB in this draft and we can get a real good one in the second.


What do you guys think?

greasyObnoxious
11-26-2009, 05:45 PM
Hughes. a good pass-rush can mask a lot of concerns.

MadDog 88
11-26-2009, 07:12 PM
Brandon Lafell. Book it!

3rdandinches
11-26-2009, 07:29 PM
Brandon Lafell. Book it!

I have a tough time thinking our first round pick would be a WR. I bet they'd be more willing to trade back then pick a WR, you never know but I just highly doubt it.

ChadHenne
11-26-2009, 11:01 PM
Lafell is a 2nd round value who will probably go first round because of the weak nature of this years WR class early on imo (at least I feel it is).

As for the original decision, gotta be Spikes. Bigger need, higher upside.

DearbornDolfan
11-27-2009, 04:23 AM
Lafell is a 2nd round value who will probably go first round because of the weak nature of this years WR class early on imo (at least I feel it is).

No offense, but I want what you're smoking. There's so much potential in this WR class that I get a woody just thinking about it.

Clipse
11-27-2009, 05:48 AM
Brandon Lafell. Book it!
2nd round? Maybe. 1st round? Not a chance. Of the choices given, I'd go with Hughes. Porter and JT aren't getting any younger. A combo of Wake and Hughes would instantly make our secondary better with their pass rushing skills. I think Jermaine Gresham should be in the discussion as well as Arrelious Benn. I like Spikes, but I'd honestly rather sign a D'Qwell Jackson or Demeco Ryans in FA. mcClain will be a stud, Spikes I see as just another decent player. The FA Linebacker class is a good one, with lots of good options. Mostly young LB's as well.

Ozfin77
11-27-2009, 08:29 AM
I'd shop the pick and see what I could get.

Please "Tunaman", sir...No LaFell in the first...Please....lol

emeraldfin
11-27-2009, 09:02 AM
The secondary and NT are our main concerns IMO, so if I had to pick one of those three I would go with Thomas.

phinfan33
11-27-2009, 09:09 AM
The secondary and NT are our main concerns IMO, so if I had to pick one of those three I would go with Thomas.our LB corp is a concern also...besides Wake,we don't have any young studs...Crowder to me is a clown,so it'd be a toss up between Spikes to man one of our ILB positions,or Hughes,and pair him up with Wake to give us some serious pass rush...

emeraldfin
11-27-2009, 09:17 AM
our LB corp is a concern also...besides Wake,we don't have any young studs...Crowder to me is a clown,so it'd be a toss up between Spikes to man one of our ILB positions,or Hughes,and pair him up with Wake to give us some serious pass rush...

I agree our LB's are in need of an upgrade. But I dont think they are as bad as what we have at Free Safety and NT.

TedSlimmJr
11-27-2009, 09:34 AM
I'd go with Jerry Hughes in this scenario and not even have to think really hard about it...

Don't get me wrong.....I've been very high on Earl Thomas all season...and to me he compares more favorably to Eric Berry in terms of ball skills, range, etc...(minus the physicality)....than any safety in the country......but he's right on the verge of being too one dimensional at this point in his career to pass on an incredible pass rusher like Hughes....

Thomas needs one more season at Texas IMO to develope a little more physically and add a few more pounds...but he's a great, great player.....besides...at this point he's too close to being the same type player as Chris Clemons...except Clemons is a MUCH better tackler...

I'm not (and never have been) convinced that Spikes is even the most deserving of being the next best ILB prospect behind McClain.....an elite pass rusher that can project standing up in a 3-4 ALWAYS takes precedent over an ILB like Spikes IMO....

Personally, I like Micah Johnson as a nice fit inside, and his upside as much as Spikes....and Johnson could probably be snagged a little later....

If you ask the question....."Who is Miami's potential starting (OLB's, S's, ILB's) in 2011-2012".....

You're a lot closer to already having the answers on the roster at S and ILB than you are at OLB.....that's the way I look at it...

hooshoops
11-27-2009, 10:38 AM
lets roll this scenario into it...

jerry hughes jermaine gresham arrelius benn

who's the pick???

RealDriscoll
11-27-2009, 10:44 AM
I'd look at trading down to acquire more picks. If I couldn't I would look at the following...

*Brandon Spikes-ILB-Florida
*Jerry Hughes-OLB-TCU
*Sean Weatherspoon-ILB-Missouri
*Morgan Burnett-S-Georgia Tech
*Arrelious Benn-WR-Illinois

TedSlimmJr
11-27-2009, 11:09 AM
lets roll this scenario into it...

jerry hughes jermaine gresham arrelius benn

who's the pick???


I really like Gresham....and I'm of the thought process at the moment that if Miami misses out on Bryant.....I'd be ready to invest in a TE like Gresham over a WR at that point...

I'm curious to see how Gresham does in post season workouts and how he looks after his injury.....because I also think Miami can sneak one in the middle rounds and grab a TE with maybe even more athletic ability and upside with Jimmy Graham....although he'd obviously be raw and inexperienced.....

Hughes is a proven, experienced, elite pass rusher that would provide an immediate impact on defense and likely be a starter at OLB for the next decade....

That's tough.....but I'd probably go Hughes>Gresham>Benn..but it's a fluid situation...

Did I mention how much it would suck to miss on McClain and Bryant?

hooshoops
11-27-2009, 11:17 AM
yeah it's gonna suck and it's gonna happen...

dez bryant is way too nfl ready right now and mcclain is the kind of guy if teams haven't fallen in love with him off tape and his leadership and making all the calls on the bama defense who once he gets in the interview rooms and they start to get to know what kind of football mind and all around good person he is who's gonna fly up boards...he's gonna nail the interviews and rocket up boards

ChadHenne
11-27-2009, 12:38 PM
No offense, but I want what you're smoking. There's so much potential in this WR class that I get a woody just thinking about it.

There is depth of #3-4 future NFL WR's, but there is only 1 guy that I feel has the chance to be a very good or great NFL WR, and that is Dez Bryant. Depth does not make for a good WR class, there has to be a stock of very good top heavy WR's. Last year we had that top heavy great WR class. This year we have 1 or 2 very good WR's, and a bunch of guys who do not project to be anything other than a slot receiver at best in the NFL.

DearbornDolfan
11-27-2009, 03:19 PM
This year we have 1 or 2 very good WR's, and a bunch of guys who do not project to be anything other than a slot receiver at best in the NFL.

You're thinking about the various WR positions all wrong.

A Slot isn't a guy who's the team's third best WR, after all nobody can argue that Wes Welker is anything other than the Patriots' best receiver; he's the guy who is more quick than fast, runs razor sharp routes, and has great hands even when going over the middle and getting smashed between an ILB and safety. There are plenty of potential stars for this position; Dezmon Briscoe, Golden Tate, and Mardy Gilyard come to mind as potential first day picks.

Your Split End is the guy you line up outside the Slot and is typically characterized by some type of super-prototypical gift, typically height, speed, or freakish jump ability. Their whole Raison d'Ítre is to make the defense choose between doubling up on the Slot or Split and leaving the other guy in one-on-one coverage for the QB to hit on a big play. A good Slot/Split combination is as valuable as a true #1. Arrelious Benn, Damian Williams, Jordan Shipley, and Brandon LaFell are potential first day material.

Your Flanker is what is commonly referred to as a #1 receiver. He has it all; height, speed, hands, jumping, route running, etc. On his own he is such a specimen that he commands a double team or risks going to the house on every passing play, even against real shutdown corners like Nnamdi Asomugha. Dez Bryant is the only guy that out of the box is going to be this guy (which isn't surprising considering there's usually only one such guy per draft), but Demaryius Thomas and Kerry Meier could be there with a little work.

BobDole
11-27-2009, 06:31 PM
i'd be happy with all 3 of those guys to be honest - although spikes would be at the top of that list b/c of need and upside. slimm - spikes is an elite pass rusher that gets thrown in at DE every once in a while on 3 and longs and projects to stand up in a 3-4. i have no idea what you were thinking with that comment. mcclain and spikes are basically carbon copies of each other - there's no real difference b/n the 2. i know you like to knock him a lot - i just wonder why b/c you never elaborate on it. wouldn't mind a little explanation on that one - b/c i know you love to do that kind of thing.

thomas is the second best FS in a deep class this year - but i think we might have something in clemons so i don't know if that's the smartest direction to take.

hughes is great. him and wake would make a nice pair on the edges for a long time - so i wouldn't be opposed to that pick - but i feel the need on the inside is more important.

Roman529
11-27-2009, 09:43 PM
I don't want Mount Cody....he is going to eat himself out of the NFL. I hope we can take McClain but he likely will be gone when we pick. I would go with Hughes of TCU or Dez Bryant, if McClain is gone.

Dr. Phin
11-27-2009, 10:01 PM
Spikes. But not to play with Crowder, but to replace him flat out.

Kdawg954
11-27-2009, 10:23 PM
I don't want to TOUCH a WR in this draft. Please get a veteran.

I'm all for Spikes or McClain

Or Hughes . . . or a solid NT (Cody has potential . . . obviously weight and ethic a concern)

Or Gresham

Not a WR, don't care if its Bryant, Benn or whoever . . . we have 5 WR's on this team with 3 years or less experience . . . that is enough youth. We should have got Torry Holt this past year.

Pinkboy
11-28-2009, 05:33 AM
From what I've seen, McClain looks like the better player (it could be the system doing that), but Spikes looks more physical from watching them over the past 2 years.

And we all know how the trifecta seriously puts physicality at the top of their list when picking guys in the 1st round.. Look at Jake Long and Vontae Davis. Long is an extremely physical lineman. And Vontae, to me, looks like the most physical corner to come out in years - not since Antoine Winfield.

When you think of who they might draft, look first at size and physicality.. Long, we all know how big, strong and physical he is.. And Vontae, we see how fast, strong and physical he is - I mean the guy is built of solid muscle like a strong safety.

But most importantly, they use it to play extremely physical football. That's what this regime loves.

So look for those things when the Dolphins pick in the 1st round next year when you're scouting college players. They also hate one-year wonders because it raises too many red-flags for them, so forget about those guys. They want guys who are leaders on their respective teams (or units) and have been very productive for 2 or more years in college (and who are not injury prone).

When it comes to their 1st round choices, those are things they look for first and foremost..

Clipse
11-28-2009, 10:22 AM
The secondary and NT are our main concerns IMO, so if I had to pick one of those three I would go with Thomas.
Most of our secondary problems come from having a very inconsistent pass rush. Add Jerry Hughes and our secondary instantly becomes better than it would be to draft a safety in the 1st (unless it's Eric Berry that is). Wilson and Bell have started to gel and have looked good as of late. Davis and Smith have looked good, but have made their fair share of rookie mistakes. We need a more consistent pass rush to help our secondary out.

I love Earl Thomas. He's a ballhawk. But pass rush is the key to a great secondary.

hooshoops
11-28-2009, 10:26 AM
From what I've seen, McClain looks like the better player (it could be the system doing that), but Spikes looks more physical from watching them over the past 2 years.

And we all know how the trifecta seriously puts physicality at the top of their list when picking guys in the 1st round.. Look at Jake Long and Vontae Davis. Long is an extremely physical lineman. And Vontae, to me, looks like the most physical corner to come out in years - not since Antoine Winfield.

When you think of who they might draft, look first at size and physicality.. Long, we all know how big, strong and physical he is.. And Vontae, we see how fast, strong and physical he is - I mean the guy is built of solid muscle like a strong safety.

But most importantly, they use it to play extremely physical football. That's what this regime loves.

So look for those things when the Dolphins pick in the 1st round next year when you're scouting college players. They also hate one-year wonders because it raises too many red-flags for them, so forget about those guys. They want guys who are leaders on their respective teams (or units) and have been very productive for 2 or more years in college (and who are not injury prone).

When it comes to their 1st round choices, those are things they look for first and foremost..

i don't necessarily agree that spikes is more physical...but i do agree with your philosophy of how parcells and company draft high picks

Clipse
11-28-2009, 10:26 AM
lets roll this scenario into it...

jerry hughes jermaine gresham arrelius benn

who's the pick???
Very tough. Very, very tough. I think my answer would be "I'd have to see what we do in FA first".

Clipse
11-28-2009, 10:41 AM
i'd be happy with all 3 of those guys to be honest - although spikes would be at the top of that list b/c of need and upside. slimm - spikes is an elite pass rusher that gets thrown in at DE every once in a while on 3 and longs and projects to stand up in a 3-4. i have no idea what you were thinking with that comment. mcclain and spikes are basically carbon copies of each other - there's no real difference b/n the 2. i know you like to knock him a lot - i just wonder why b/c you never elaborate on it. wouldn't mind a little explanation on that one - b/c i know you love to do that kind of thing.

thomas is the second best FS in a deep class this year - but i think we might have something in clemons so i don't know if that's the smartest direction to take.

hughes is great. him and wake would make a nice pair on the edges for a long time - so i wouldn't be opposed to that pick - but i feel the need on the inside is more important.
And because you're a Gators homer :chuckle: Spikes an elite pass rusher? Spikes on the same level as McClain. I have to wonder about you sometimes :err:

The only thing I can agree with you on is ILB would be a bigger need than OLB. But I'm not taking Spikes over Hughes that's for sure. And there's a nice FA class of LB's as well. I'd rather have D'Qwell Jackson and Demeco Ryans over Spikes as well. McClain is going to be a stud, Spikes will be just another good player.

FinaticalOne
11-28-2009, 02:27 PM
The secondary and NT are our main concerns IMO, so if I had to pick one of those three I would go with Thomas.

Is Thomas even coming out this year? He's only a sophomore.

Pat-London
11-28-2009, 03:16 PM
A few points from across the pond.

1. I think our 2 rookie CB's could play a part in your argument. If they progress into potentially very good cover corners, then OLB could be the pick with J Hughes. As Coach said, you can never have enough pass rushers.

2. I actually dont like McClain, he doesnt hustle anywhere near what I would expect from such a high level talent, which leads me to think he is a lazy player. An outstanding talent dont get me wrong, but I just see in his play he doesnt chase near enough as he should.

3. Do like Eric Norwood, yes he is an OLB at South Carolina but with his range, speed and playmaking ability (hmm we need that from an inside backer), holds a few sack records, and at 6'1" 252lbs could handle physically the inside role in the 34... he could be a mid/low 2nd

4. I do see/hope Crowder being a draft day trade... probable 3rd possibly a high 2nd along with a lower pick.

5. the other element of an existing player that impacts your question is Chris Clemons - should he progress this could reduce the need for a high pick on a safety and allow it to go to a NT/OG

6. it was mentioned earlier about Gresham.. would love that, but would also love Aurelious Benn or Golden Tate.

all exciting stuff..

Quadfather
11-28-2009, 06:09 PM
I really think we should draft Jermaine Gresham. A big pass catching tight end would open up our offense.

NRA
11-28-2009, 06:25 PM
earl thomas.

you can find pass rushers easier than you can BIG TALENT
safety's. and earl is all that.

bell is a good hitter but has NO range and stiff hips. and lets not
talk about the injury concerns on him. he CAN be replaced and he
should be.

you cant have enough talent in your secondary. pass rush doesnt alwys get there
so you better have guys who can cover longer than 3 seconds if need be.

hooshoops
11-28-2009, 07:00 PM
A few points from across the pond.

1. I think our 2 rookie CB's could play a part in your argument. If they progress into potentially very good cover corners, then OLB could be the pick with J Hughes. As Coach said, you can never have enough pass rushers.

2. I actually dont like McClain, he doesnt hustle anywhere near what I would expect from such a high level talent, which leads me to think he is a lazy player. An outstanding talent dont get me wrong, but I just see in his play he doesnt chase near enough as he should.

3. Do like Eric Norwood, yes he is an OLB at South Carolina but with his range, speed and playmaking ability (hmm we need that from an inside backer), holds a few sack records, and at 6'1" 252lbs could handle physically the inside role in the 34... he could be a mid/low 2nd

4. I do see/hope Crowder being a draft day trade... probable 3rd possibly a high 2nd along with a lower pick.

5. the other element of an existing player that impacts your question is Chris Clemons - should he progress this could reduce the need for a high pick on a safety and allow it to go to a NT/OG

6. it was mentioned earlier about Gresham.. would love that, but would also love Aurelious Benn or Golden Tate.

all exciting stuff..

i think it would be a mistake to move eric norwood inside...guys too good a pass rusher

BobDole
11-29-2009, 05:47 AM
And because you're a Gators homer :chuckle: Spikes an elite pass rusher? Spikes on the same level as McClain. I have to wonder about you sometimes :err:

The only thing I can agree with you on is ILB would be a bigger need than OLB. But I'm not taking Spikes over Hughes that's for sure. And there's a nice FA class of LB's as well. I'd rather have D'Qwell Jackson and Demeco Ryans over Spikes as well. McClain is going to be a stud, Spikes will be just another good player.

i've watched both guys in every single game they've played in college and i do not see a difference. spikes bullies and throws guys back when he blitzes from the MLB position and he has a nice finesse edge move when he blitzes from the DE spot. the only reason he doesn't have more sacks is b/c they hardly send the guy - he usually just patrols the middle. i've been a 'gator homer' for a long time and i've never had one in my mock - i will this year and for very good reason.

the guy is physical as hell - loves to start out a game by rocking somebody to dictate tempo - could not be more disciplined and almost never gets caught out of position - he is exactly what parcells looks for. to the 't'.

i wouldn't mind hughes - but with wake coming on like he has and possibly having taylor and porter for another year - OLB drops in priority IMO. i like d'qwell fine - and i think ryans' best place is in a 4-3 - but i like spikes much more. there's a long drop to penn and johnson after mcclain and spikes go - 6'4" 260 lb MLB's with that kind of talent and athleticism don't come around every day. when you run a 3-4 that needs some help in the middle - you get them when the opportunity presents itself.

i don't know how anyone that watches both of them play say one is going to be great and the other will be 'average'. i think they will both have fantastic NFL careers.

TedSlimmJr
11-29-2009, 09:40 AM
i'd be happy with all 3 of those guys to be honest - although spikes would be at the top of that list b/c of need and upside. slimm - spikes is an elite pass rusher that gets thrown in at DE every once in a while on 3 and longs and projects to stand up in a 3-4. i have no idea what you were thinking with that comment. mcclain and spikes are basically carbon copies of each other - there's no real difference b/n the 2. i know you like to knock him a lot - i just wonder why b/c you never elaborate on it. wouldn't mind a little explanation on that one - b/c i know you love to do that kind of thing.

thomas is the second best FS in a deep class this year - but i think we might have something in clemons so i don't know if that's the smartest direction to take.

hughes is great. him and wake would make a nice pair on the edges for a long time - so i wouldn't be opposed to that pick - but i feel the need on the inside is more important.


I don't think they're carbon copies of each other.....they're similar in ways....but they're not indentical....not in my opinion...

I don't "like" to knock Spikes....I think Spikes is a good player...I just don't think he's special...I think McClain is special...

McClain gets off blocks MUCH better than Spikes....McClain plays sideline to sideline better than Spikes....which is rather rare for an ILB that big in a 3-4 defense...

I think McClain is faster (and even slightly bigger)..and a better overall athlete....I like McClain's instincts better...

Both are good blitzers...both are the leaders on their respective defenses....but I think McClain has more upside than Spikes....I believe Spikes peaked as a player as a sophomore/junior...

McClain is the headiest player in the draft IMO...and has experience playing the MIKE in a 3-4 defense....making the calls/audibles/checks and for all intents and purposes...calls his own game defensively....

I don't necessarily think you can go WRONG with either player...and whoever gets Spikes is probably going to like him....and the "eye gouge" incident was blown out of proportion to an extent...but perhaps it proves that you can get to Spikes and frustrate him....cause him to lose his focus/cool....I don't think you can do that to McClain...

It's all personal preference...but I've liked McClain better even before this season...go back and look at some of the very first "Draft Brandon Spikes" threads going back to last year when everyone was on the Spikes bandwagon and hardly even knew much about McClain...my first response was..."I'd rather have McClain"....and this was when he was still a sophomore....

Basically, time has only re-enforced that sentiment for me....

BTW...when I referred to an elite pass rusher who can also project standing up in a 3-4 taking precedent over an ILB like Spikes....I was referring to Jerry Hughes....since he was the name mentioned in the mock....but I'd also add Derrick Morgan as well....I think he's worth a top 10 pick if he declares...

Hope that helped...

BobDole
11-29-2009, 06:37 PM
I don't think they're carbon copies of each other.....they're similar in ways....but they're not indentical....not in my opinion...

I don't "like" to knock Spikes....I think Spikes is a good player...I just don't think he's special...I think McClain is special...

McClain gets off blocks MUCH better than Spikes....McClain plays sideline to sideline better than Spikes....which is rather rare for an ILB that big in a 3-4 defense...

I think McClain is faster (and even slightly bigger)..and a better overall athlete....I like McClain's instincts better...

Both are good blitzers...both are the leaders on their respective defenses....but I think McClain has more upside than Spikes....I believe Spikes peaked as a player as a sophomore/junior...

McClain is the headiest player in the draft IMO...and has experience playing the MIKE in a 3-4 defense....making the calls/audibles/checks and for all intents and purposes...calls his own game defensively....

I don't necessarily think you can go WRONG with either player...and whoever gets Spikes is probably going to like him....and the "eye gouge" incident was blown out of proportion to an extent...but perhaps it proves that you can get to Spikes and frustrate him....cause him to lose his focus/cool....I don't think you can do that to McClain...

It's all personal preference...but I've liked McClain better even before this season...go back and look at some of the very first "Draft Brandon Spikes" threads going back to last year when everyone was on the Spikes bandwagon and hardly even knew much about McClain...my first response was..."I'd rather have McClain"....and this was when he was still a sophomore....

Basically, time has only re-enforced that sentiment for me....

BTW...when I referred to an elite pass rusher who can also project standing up in a 3-4 taking precedent over an ILB like Spikes....I was referring to Jerry Hughes....since he was the name mentioned in the mock....but I'd also add Derrick Morgan as well....I think he's worth a top 10 pick if he declares...

Hope that helped...

i hear ya. one thing you have to take into account is the gators play a 3-3-5 on defense - so the middle is his domain. i could even make the argument that the job he's done has been even more impressive being that there are less guys in front of and beside him - and teams still haven't been able to run the ball on us - but not a huge deal.

spikes doesn't have the sideline-to-sideline responsibility in his defense - but when it's given to him he excels - as was shown in that pick 6 on the 'sideline' against FIU a few weeks ago. but typically, since it is a 3-3-5, they want him to clog the middle and force guys outside if need be.

but it is really a personal preference thing - mine is i want the more dominant 'force' b/n the 2 in the middle for us. i want someone who will make teams fear running up the middle - and will punish them when they do. i know spikes has the edge in that department.

i'd be just fine with either one of them. both are perfect fits for the 3-4 and they can both actually cover - which is a MUST for us. can't wait to see them go head-to-head this saturday.

thanks for the reply man.