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View Full Version : I'm getting sick of Chad Henne playing Byron Leftwich



Sirspud
12-20-2009, 04:01 PM
Holds the ball too long in the pocket and rockets the ball everywhere he throws. Henne now has more interceptions than TD's on the season and there is a reason why. If he is ever going to be a franchise passer, he needs to make the plays that require more than a strong arm.

DolfanDuBbZ~
12-20-2009, 04:09 PM
I'm sorry but how many starts does Henne have compared to Leftwich?

I guess you can hate on Henne, which you have done off and on since Penny went down. But Henne is still learning. If he wasn't cutting it, MIA wouldn't be in the position of still being playoff eligible going into today.

I'd take a look at the separation the WR's are getting at the LOS....its not there.

If MIA loses today, some of the blame goes on Henne. The rest will go on the FO and CS for making the personnel decisions for this team going into the season. No improvements at the WR position and another poor FA acquisition in Wilson along w/ the extension given to Chowder.

Sirspud
12-20-2009, 04:29 PM
The learning on the job thing will only last for so long. He has thrown two picks today deep in the other team's territory and this is following his spotty performance in the second half which should have lead to a loss against Jacksonville.

The assumption with a young quarterback who comes in and keeps his head above water is that he will develop with every snap he takes. When Byron Leftwich started for Jacksonville and lead them to wins early in his career, most people thought that his amazing arm would lead him to being a star in the league once he got some experience and developed. But he never did. I worry the same thing is going to happen to Henne who seems to rely more on his arm and take worse care of the football the longer he plays.

JRoX85
12-20-2009, 04:30 PM
Holds the ball too long in the pocket and rockets the ball everywhere he throws. Henne now has more interceptions than TD's on the season and there is a reason why. If he is ever going to be a franchise passer, he needs to make the plays that require more than a strong arm.

I am sry you feel that way for a qb who is 7-3 well 7-4 after today as a starter, with no WR's that can get open or make plays and fumbolitis going around. Man He is a first year qb and shows signs of real promise he already has 4 comeback wins thats more than leftwich has in his whole career. get off his back an let the man do his thing he will be fine.

The_Phish
12-20-2009, 04:39 PM
I am getting sick of everyone chewing out Henne. A 2nd year QB that has shown nothing put great promise for the future of this franchise! All you fans that think this is the year are in for a rude awakening. Like it or not we are re-building and either accept it or deal with it. Have you watched this game? It's been tough but all Dan Fouts has said all day long is "another great throw by Henne". Give the kid a break he is after all the best thing we have had in the last 10 years! Go Phins!

DolfanDuBbZ~
12-20-2009, 04:45 PM
The learning on the job thing will only last for so long. He has thrown two picks today deep in the other team's territory and this is following his spotty performance in the second half which should have lead to a loss against Jacksonville.

The assumption with a young quarterback who comes in and keeps his head above water is that he will develop with every snap he takes. When Byron Leftwich started for Jacksonville and lead them to wins early in his career, most people thought that his amazing arm would lead him to being a star in the league once he got some experience and developed. But he never did. I worry the same thing is going to happen to Henne who seems to rely more on his arm and take worse care of the football the longer he plays.

You may have a point at this point next year if he's doing the same thing. But the guy hasn't even been a starter for a FULL ****ING YEAR! The guy has upside and promise, and is learning. He will make mistakes...maybe go study the history of P. Manning and his rookie year. Go look at those mind numbing INTs he threw.

bluehaze
12-20-2009, 04:53 PM
LOL at anyone criticizing Henne... For a first year starting QB he is doing incredibly well. The guy already broke Marino's record for most consecutive completions and we really have some scrub recievers compared to what Marino had. The guy is going to be a great QB.

sinPHIN
12-20-2009, 04:54 PM
Im Getting Tired Of Dumb Threads

Imperium
12-20-2009, 05:11 PM
It's funny how the perception of a player can change with just one play. If that Hartline pass gets intercepted, Henne would've been criticized for throwing 3 int. and rightly so. But a lucky break and it's overtime. If Henne leads a game winning drive, he'll be a`hero and the 2nd coming.

Sirspud
12-20-2009, 05:17 PM
LOL at anyone criticizing Henne... For a first year starting QB he is doing incredibly well. The guy already broke Marino's record for most consecutive completions and we really have some scrub recievers compared to what Marino had. The guy is going to be a great QB.

This is everything that is wrong with you guys who blindly support Henne. That record was Chad Pennington's.

The_Phish
12-20-2009, 05:19 PM
It's funny how the perception of a player can change with just one play. If that Hartline pass gets intercepted, Henne would've been criticized for throwing 3 int. and rightly so. But a lucky break and it's overtime. If Henne leads a game winning drive, he'll be a`hero and the 2nd coming.

He did throw a third Int that cost us the game. Either way I know this team is going to be something in a year or two and Henne will be our starting QB.

Akronfinfan36
12-20-2009, 05:20 PM
Stupid thread. He brought us all the way back and made a bad throw at the end. It looked like the ball sailed on him.

No question he is solid and we will alot of games with him.

DannyX18
12-20-2009, 05:22 PM
lol when henne wins games he's marino, peyton, montana. when he loses he gets compared to leftwitch and leaf.

Adam First
12-20-2009, 05:23 PM
I'm not too happy with him right now, that's for sure. That duck to Michael Griffin is still resonating in my head.

SpaceMountain16
12-20-2009, 05:26 PM
It's definitely something to think about.

I'm not turning on Chad Henne, he's done great things. But after a game like today where he consistently missed open people with over throws, made some horrible throws from the pocket (on his interceptions especially), and took inexcusable sacks you have to wonder about the guy. Game after game he's shown he doesn't know how to be an NFL QB. I'm beginning to wonder if it's inexperience or inability.....

bobw999
12-20-2009, 05:26 PM
Chad Henne is a choke job. I'm done making excuses for this kid. I've supported him all season and he pulls this bs.

Tiko377
12-20-2009, 05:28 PM
man henne is the reason we came back! with his throws in tight coverage! our wr's are our weakness they get like no separation at all. Henne is still a young player only 1 year older then sanchez.

shula_guy
12-20-2009, 05:28 PM
Look I am not throwing the towel in on Henne yet but let's be honest. He sucked today. He consistently struggles to put the ball in the right place with the right touch when it comes to deep passes. This is not a new problem with him but it is a nagging one.


with that said I have a couple of questions

1. Where the hell was Ginn today?
2. Who paid off the refs?

Im not one to typically cry about bad calls and noncalls because all games have them but they were pretty lopsided today. Even frigging Fouts (whom I hate) was commenting on it.

Jehuty13
12-20-2009, 05:29 PM
Henne reminds me of Jay Cutler. Now whether that's good or bad is a matter of opinion. He can score. . . but its almost guranteed he'll throw 1-2 INT's a game. These INT's seem to always come at big moments too.

I know he's a 2nd year guy, but he's been making these mistakes all year. Jay Cutler has a few years under his belt, and he too makes huge mistakes on key plays. I don't know that I want a Jay cutler on my team. ****ing ****.

This was our ****ing game.

Tiko377
12-20-2009, 05:30 PM
Chad Henne is a choke job. I'm done making excuses for this kid. I've supported him all season and he pulls this bs.

a choke job? he won the 1st jets game, bucs game, pats game

go watch football

-=DolfanDave=-
12-20-2009, 05:30 PM
is Chad Henne allowed to have a bad game or two having less than one year as a starting QB? guess not.

****ing moronic threads.

FINS4LIFE16
12-20-2009, 05:30 PM
Look I am not throwing the towel in on Henne yet but let's be honest. He sucked today. He consistently struggles to put the ball in the right place with the right touch when it comes to deep passes. This is not a new problem with him but it is a nagging one.


with that said I have a couple of questions

1. Where the hell was Ginn today?
2. Who paid off the refs?

Im not one to typically cry about bad calls and noncalls because all games have them but they were pretty lopsided today. Even frigging Fouts (whom I hate) was commenting on it.
what did you expect from ginn?? and I'm 100 percent with you on the refs

Phantom
12-20-2009, 05:32 PM
I like Henne and hope he gets better, but face it, he was bailed out by Hartline on another terrible throw or the game was over in regulation. He shows promise, i sure hope we get a #1 reciever and that helps, but he needs to get better. Lets pray he does.

DolfanDuBbZ~
12-20-2009, 05:32 PM
What was the Colts record w/ Manning his rookie year?
And how many INTS did Manning throw his rookie year?

People expect alot from a guy with 11 starts under his belt.

DolfanDuBbZ~
12-20-2009, 05:34 PM
This is everything that is wrong with you guys who blindly support Henne. That record was Chad Pennington's.

How many INTs did Penny throw in the Balt. game?

While you blindly supported Penny at the start of the season and have itched your way to bash Henne at any chance possible, I'm not surprised you started this thread.

shula_guy
12-20-2009, 05:34 PM
what did you expect from ginn?? and I'm 100 percent with you on the refs



I expected to see Ginn more in the game. His returns were mediocre and I really dont recall him catching anything. I mean I dont remember him even be targeted by Henne. Just curious why he did not have more of a pressence in the game today. I'm not bashing him I just dont know why he was MIA today.

-=DolfanDave=-
12-20-2009, 05:35 PM
I like Henne and hope he gets better, but face it, he was bailed out by Hartline on another terrible throw or the game was over in regulation. He shows promise, i sure hope we get a #1 reciever and that helps, but he needs to get better. Lets pray he does.

True, but the Titans got bailed out by the refs on several occasions.

I'll agree that Henne had a very bad game today but overall I think he has what it takes to be a very good QB in this league. This WR core and the sprinkling in of the dud-cat would make even the most elite QB's look mediocre

SpaceMountain16
12-20-2009, 05:37 PM
It's not just interceptions and over throws. How about burning timeouts? How about getting to the line late with the play clock down to zero, forcing a rushed play with a lower probability of success. Taking sacks instead of chucking it up, throwing it away instead of taking a sack. He's a first year starter, but he started FOUR Years at Michigan and has been in the NFL for almost two. He has to no these basic rules for playing Quarterback.

morrism35
12-20-2009, 05:39 PM
People wanted to bench Troy Aikemen for Steve Walsh Troy's rookie year. How did that turn out. Mcnabbs accuracy was worst than Henne. How did that turn out. Marino had a superbowl caliber team his rookie year. Qb is the hardest and has the steepest learning curve.

carjackistan
12-20-2009, 05:45 PM
Henne has made significant progress this season. Had this been one of his first starts, we'd be praising him for the comeback even with the interceptions. His accuracy needs some work, yes. It looks worse at times due to his receivers running poor routes and/or not positioning themselves properly. Even outside of the interceptions, there were a few important incompletions that could've been completed with a better throw, or better technique from a receiver.

Is he a future franchise QB? Maybe, if he works his *** off and gets good coaching. Is he going to be a bust? I doubt it, but it's not impossible. My guess is he develops into a guy that can take a very good/great team to the Super Bowl. Outside of the best 5 QBs in the NFL, that is as good as you can hope for.

This guy needs some HELP, though. It should not be on the shoulders of a guy starting for the first time this year to carry the offense. He doesn't have a go-to receiver. His most reliable WR is a rookie. Fasano was dropping everything the first half of the season, and while Haynos tries hard the guy is a scrub. Cobbs was our only good receiving back and he's out. We have an o-line built for the run, and a running back that has turned the ball over in consecutive games.

Bonedoc7777
12-20-2009, 05:47 PM
how could anybody critize this kid at all, check out how well sanchez did today, and vince young was horrible in the second half with the game on the line, chad with no deep threats brought them back, leave the guy be, we are locked in at QB

ArmyFin7
12-20-2009, 05:52 PM
I don't think you can seriously make a judgement either way. Our passing game is only effective when Henne gets 4-5 seconds in the pocket....thats bc we have crap at reciever. Until you get Henne a decent downfield threat, you have no idea what he could really do.

He has the cannon to force the ball into tight windows, but still needs to learn when to take some off it. Needs to work on the deep ball as well.....

Kinda unfair to make any determination after only 11 starts....

Stafford and Sanchize have both thrown more picks than Henne....and both have a real recieving threat.....their respective teams and fans seem to be happy with them...so whats wrong with you guys???? Just plain inpatient?

flynryan15
12-20-2009, 06:14 PM
I am still holding out judgement until after the season on Henne. I will say this though on most of the interceptions his head is fixated on that side of the field. Some of that is because of terrible play design, but others are on him. That was one of his big negatives coming out of college.

I won't make any excuses for him because being a QB through college, I was always coached and believed if you make a pass that ends up in the defenders hands you did something wrong. Right now my biggest concern for Henne's development or any future Dolphin QB is our very vanilla offense that allows defenses to attack and stack the box. Defenses are blowing up the 2Te, 1 WR formation we run the majority of the game. When we spread it out with multiple WR our guys do get open.

I ride Ginn constantly, but lately he has actually been catching the ball. He was thrown to once today across the middle and caught it. The fact that we don't stretch the field with Ginn, but chose to throw deep to Hartline or Bess is almost criminal! I counted 7 times today Ginn was lined up with single man coverage and no safety help, not once did we run him on the fly route!

bobw999
12-20-2009, 06:26 PM
a choke job? he won the 1st jets game, bucs game, pats game

go watch football

I did.

Henne throws an int when we have the lead against the Bucs. Thanks to Bess, a defensive PI, and Ricky Williams, we are able to score a field goal for a 2 point victory.

He has 3 int against the Bills in the final quarter, an interception in the Jags game when we had the leave, and now this BS. Maybe some of them are our WR but he has choked in some games this year.

It happens. Doesn't make him a bad QB but it doesn't make him a great one.

rushfinfan85
12-20-2009, 06:28 PM
only certain people should be able to make threads because here we are again another stupid thread

X-Pacolypse
12-20-2009, 06:31 PM
This thread sucks. It sucks!

Dr. Phin
12-20-2009, 06:32 PM
He is 7-4 for basically a rookie QB and almost brought us back from an 18 point defecit.

You know what...he isn't going anywhere anytime soon either...so you better suck it up and get used to him.

bobw999
12-20-2009, 06:38 PM
Jeezus people. Henne has some obvious faults and the OP is pointing them out. I see nothing in the OP that says Henne sucks.

JAcK o D1AmonDs
12-20-2009, 06:39 PM
I'm sorry since when was Chad Henne supposed to instantly turn into Dan Marino? Cut the guy some slack, sure he played poorly today, but he fought through his mistakes brought the team back from 24-6 down and gave it up in OT, it happens to a 1st year starter who loses his starting running back, forced into starting maybe earlier than expected of him and having no great receivers as well as a defensive secondary that doesn't help him by giving up huge plays. 7-4 in your first 11 starts is not too shabby IMO. Would you rather be the Lions at this point? Perhaps the Browns, sure this team needs holes filled and maybe some new coaching work outs but, as of right now, I'm damn proud to be a fan of this team no matter what happens, i was ecstatic when we beat the Ravens in 07 to win our only game and I'm really happy now that we are showing a lot of promise for years to come.

DolfanDuBbZ~
12-20-2009, 06:39 PM
I did.

Henne throws an int when we have the lead against the Bucs. Thanks to Bess, a defensive PI, and Ricky Williams, we are able to score a field goal for a 2 point victory.

He has 3 int against the Bills in the final quarter, an interception in the Jags game when we had the leave, and now this BS. Maybe some of them are our WR but he has choked in some games this year.

It happens. Doesn't make him a bad QB but it doesn't make him a great one.

Please point to those who have called Henne 'great'. The guy is a 11 game starter who sat down his rookie season. Patience and growing pains are on tap for the kid. IF you don't like it, tough. The guy is your MIA Dolphins starter through the rest of this season. And the heads on favorite for next year.

Enjoy

finnns2000
12-20-2009, 06:43 PM
I've said all along that Henne is continuing his mediocrity at Michigan. Bust. Tired of his poor throws and lack of awareness.

JAcK o D1AmonDs
12-20-2009, 06:50 PM
I've said all along that Henne is continuing his mediocrity at Michigan. Bust. Tired of his poor throws and lack of awareness.

In his first year starting? You sir are an idiot. I have no patience for some of these moronic fans anymore, it's really sad. People want this guy again im beating the dead horse but, HE IS NOT MARINO.

To all the haters, should we spend another 2nd rounder on a QB that needs to develop or LET PAT WHITE START? How about trading for Kevin Kolb another young eagles QB with some success but no real look?

phreak
12-20-2009, 06:53 PM
most people here seem to think that every QB should start the way Marino did... Henne has some obvious flaws, but those flaws can be overcome... the flaws Henne displays are easier to fix in the offseason rather than on the fly during the season... also, with a recieving threat or two Henne's flaws are even easier to overcome... i have seen many games where Dan Marino threw multiple interceptions and never heard people calling for his head the way they have for every QB since... show the guy some support and see how he developes... if he turns out to be garbage and is unable to improve next season, then you can legitimately jump on his a** and ask for his hide... doing so prematurely just makes you look like a fool... it is just like going for it on fourth down, if you are right then you are a genius, but if you are wrong then you are a moron

flynryan15
12-20-2009, 06:58 PM
He is 7-4 for basically a rookie QB and almost brought us back from an 18 point defecit.

You know what...he isn't going anywhere anytime soon either...so you better suck it up and get used to him.

You have to be careful using a 7-4 record as a starter as your barometer for Henne's success. In the NFL a QB is often defined by what he does in a loss more then a victory. Looking back at today's loss and the Buffalo loss, gives us a clear cut path to what Henne needs to do to make it to the next level as a QB. Remember Jay Fiedler had a winning record and lead the Dolphins to a lot of last minute victories, but it was his mistakes in key loses that made him just above average. What we need to see in the final 2 games this year and in the 2010 preseason is Henne moving his head around more. His fixation is creating a lot of interceptions, tipped/batted balls, and broken up passes.

Vaark
12-20-2009, 07:03 PM
I'm sure on the SD and GB forums over the last year or more, prior to this season, both Rivers and Rodgers were on the receiving end of the same kind of over-the-top flack, especially on their losing weeks. I shudder to think of the shrapnel flying all over if forums had existed back when Aikman, Staubach and Manning were in their first starting seasons. It comes with the territory, especially when there's a "but Pennington's better" side agenda. It's hard for some fans to understand that the making of a franchise QB is a process, not a magical instant-gratification formula like instant potatoes. It's regrettable, but just Human nature nonetheless.

Personally, this was a real setback, and shouldn't have been.. but based on the good stuff I also saw, it does nothing to diminish my enthusiasm for the future of this team with Henne under center.

PHANTASTIC 13
12-20-2009, 09:22 PM
Chad Henne will continue to get better and he will be one of the best in the league...look at Drew Brees, he is just now coming into his own and so will Henne...get a clue.

As far as Ted Ginn goes...he made plays when they threw him the ball, why the coaches didn't use him more I can't even fathom.

The real reason we lost the game was because of the bad calls late in the game...the refs were like Larry, Curly and Moe out there today.

phreak
12-20-2009, 09:30 PM
Chad Henne will continue to get better and he will be one of the best in the league...look at Drew Brees, he is just now coming into his own and so will Henne...get a clue.

As far as Ted Ginn goes...he made plays when they threw him the ball, why the coaches didn't use him more I can't even fathom.

The real reason we lost the game was because of the bad calls late in the game...the refs were like Larry, Curly and Moe out there today.
the reason we lost today is because we let the titans go up 24-6... had that not happened the officials would not have been such a deciding factor... it starts with big plays and ends with turnovers period... blaming the officials is worthless, because it accomplishes NOTHING! the league will never change, if you aren't good enough to overcome bad officiating then you are not good enough to WIN!

Canadianfishfan
12-20-2009, 09:35 PM
I've said this in another thread.. Your QB will win you some games and lose you a few games. Henne was hardly spectacular, but at least we came back to at least force overtime.

We has some seriously stupid penalties. Receivers not knowing where they were on the field. Poor playcalling. We can see many reasons why we lost, and will continue to lose.

Henne, is simply ONE factor of many.

BGtoKNfor6
12-20-2009, 09:38 PM
Ok seriously, can you bust Henne's balls more. Are you going to start ball busting threads in the offseason too? We get it, you dislike Henne. You start a new thread every chance you can get to bust his balls. I didn't get to watch the game but something tells me other guys missed plays too. It is a TEAM game.

That being said, didn't Manning throw 26 picks his rookie year or similar? Manning never really came into his own until they drafted Reggie Wayne. Give Henne a fricken chance. Miami is NOT a playoff worthy team with so many questions are key positions on BOTH sides of the ball.

If there is ANY consolation to the Henne saga it is the fact that Henne pretty much has faced the BEST the nfl has to offer in his first year as a starter (sans the first 3 games). He, for the most part, has performed admirably and made mistakes ANY rookie qb, regardless if they had the smarts and ability of any top NFL qb. As alluded to earlier, Manning is probably the most cerebral qb in the game and he didn't have that ability the first year. I remember in his rookie year, Zach Thomas picked him off and brought it to the house. That obviously foreshadowed his career as being the next ryan leaf.

Get over yourself with all the of these Henne threads. The guy has performed for the most part with no top tier offensive guys and the thing that was helping him mature in the wildcat offense was put to rest because RB went down. If by the end of next year, he is still making these mistakes, then we can wonder.

Peace.

PerfectFinz72
12-20-2009, 09:41 PM
I'm not gonna read thru 4 pages. I'm just gonna say this is a moronic thread and move on. Obviously this is driven by someone who dislikes Henne...end of story.

PHANTASTIC 13
12-20-2009, 09:43 PM
the reason we lost today is because we let the titans go up 24-6... had that not happened the officials would not have been such a deciding factor... it starts with big plays and ends with turnovers period... blaming the officials is worthless, because it accomplishes NOTHING! the league will never change, if you aren't good enough to overcome bad officiating then you are not good enough to WIN!That is about the stupidest comment I have heard. The refs can control the game and they did so again, bad calls are like turnovers when you give a team a first down when on third and long and your defense stops them. Holding call on Saioli ring a bell, roughing on Camarillo when all he did was touch the guy before he got up and ran after the INT, the non fumble on Chris Johnson when he was still fighting for yardage didn't have an impact on the outcome? What game were you watching?

lcsonka39
12-20-2009, 09:50 PM
I thought Henne played okay/good today. Turning the ball over is always bad - which we did fumbling and also due to picks. he's throwing to a slew of 2nd and 3rd WR... and still passed for 350 yards.

I'm worried with the TD/Int ratio but i honestly think those stats are skewed because we have been primarily a running team inside the 10 (ronnie and ricky i think have 19TDs between both of them) and i think the picks will come down once he gets someone to throw to (if that ever happens).

phreak
12-20-2009, 10:05 PM
That is about the stupidest comment I have heard. The refs can control the game and they did so again, bad calls are like turnovers when you give a team a first down when on third and long and your defense stops them. Holding call on Saioli ring a bell, roughing on Camarillo when all he did was touch the guy before he got up and ran after the INT, the non fumble on Chris Johnson when he was still fighting for yardage didn't have an impact on the outcome? What game were you watching?
it is real simple, i will break it down for you... score TOUCHDOWNS NOT FIELD GOALS and the officiating becomes an annoyance instead of a game changer

Hellweed
12-20-2009, 10:32 PM
Yes, Henne made some mistakes today. He got an ear full from the coaches each time. It didn't help much this game, but hopefully he'll learn and be better next year.

X-Pacolypse
12-20-2009, 10:36 PM
This thread sucks.

Batroc
12-20-2009, 11:06 PM
Truth be told- Henne had a sh*tty game. He's a first year starter and he's going to have some bad games along with the good. Sanchez is going through the same thing in the apple right now. It's funny to watch some of the same folks that were on his bandwagon after the New England game throw him to the wolves now. By the way blame and accountability is a funny thing- Henne sucked a$$ so that makes Ricky Williams fumbling deep in Titan territory or Vontae Davis being burnt like toast for most of the first half any less significant? Win as a team, lose as a team. BTW I love Ricky and Vontae as well- they ALL had bad games.

BGtoKNfor6
12-20-2009, 11:13 PM
Truth be told- Henne had a sh*tty game. He's a first year starter and he's going to have some bad games along with the good. Sanchez is going through the same thing in the apple right now. It's funny to watch some of the same folks that were on his bandwagon after the New England game throw him to the wolves now. By the way blame and accountability is a funny thing- Henne sucked a$$ so that makes Ricky Williams fumbling deep in Titan territory or Vontae Davis being burnt like toast for most of the first half any less significant? Win as a team, lose as a team. BTW I love Ricky and Vontae as well- they ALL had bad games.

I try not to fight the mentality for many people on this site. There are what appears to be so many uneducated (meaning what appears to be lack of fundamental football knowledge) posters on here, that you get all kinds of dumb posts.

If a guy on another team has a good game or two and is a backup, people are screaming for the phins to sign him. If a player has a good few games on the dolphins, he is a HOF'er and when he plays bad, they say he is the next ryan leaf.

There just appears to be a large portion of inexperienced (appears to not having watched much football over the years) posting at times. I dunno.

What Henne has done with the talent around him, the BRUTAL schedule, loss of Brown, etc has been nothing of almost special. Most teams would fold with our schedule and having a young inexperienced backup come in. You want him to learn and manage the game. He has exceed my expectations fairly well. He is struggling on accuracy which happens to young qb's. He will hone his craft and we can make better judgments next year around the mid point of the season IMO. Until then, let the kid play and learn. It isn't like we had much in terms of qb in the past decade anyway short of one year of pennington. How quick we forget.

phreak
12-20-2009, 11:25 PM
I try not to fight the mentality for many people on this site. There are what appears to be so many uneducated (meaning what appears to be lack of fundamental football knowledge) posters on here, that you get all kinds of dumb posts.

If a guy on another team has a good game or two and is a backup, people are screaming for the phins to sign him. If a player has a good few games on the dolphins, he is a HOF'er and when he plays bad, they say he is the next ryan leaf.

There just appears to be a large portion of inexperienced (appears to not having watched much football over the years) posting at times. I dunno.

What Henne has done with the talent around him, the BRUTAL schedule, loss of Brown, etc has been nothing of almost special. Most teams would fold with our schedule and having a young inexperienced backup come in. You want him to learn and manage the game. He has exceed my expectations fairly well. He is struggling on accuracy which happens to young qb's. He will hone his craft and we can make better judgments next year around the mid point of the season IMO. Until then, let the kid play and learn. It isn't like we had much in terms of qb in the past decade anyway short of one year of pennington. How quick we forget.
a lot of the problem stems from the fact that everyone got used to seeing Marino dominate and can't accept the fact that Henne is NOT Dan... for those who just jumped on the bandwagon thinking that overcomming a 1-15 season to take the division would mean Super Bowl this season this is a disapointment as well, because they have to figure out what bandwagon to jump on next... for those who are simply true "new" fans i say: Welcome to the world of Dolphins football, try not to have a heart attack... dissappointment is expected here, but winning is treasured

MP-Omnis
12-20-2009, 11:35 PM
Henne might have more TDs than INTs if his receivers got a little more separation.

Sirspud
12-20-2009, 11:48 PM
Let me say one thing here. Everyone who says that Henne doesn't deserve to be criticized for today because he brought us back is wrong. Henne was one of the main reasons why we were dug in a hole in the first place. He didn't allow the defense to give up touchdowns, but what he did do was throw two picks to end promising drives, which happened to be twice as many turnovers as Ricky caused with his fumble.

Most in this thread are saying "Henne just needs time", "only 11th start" and other similar statements, yet in other threads these same people are blaming Chad Pennnington and the coaching staff's obvious idiocy for the 0-3 start, nevermind that Henne actually was one of the main reasons we lost in the Chargers game. And lest we forget that most people here were demoniziing Pennington for his lack of arm strength and indicating that they believed Henne could play better from day one just because his superior arm would allow him to do so.

Henne has shown some serious potential, that fact is undeniable. He is capable of making every throw on the field. But he seems to only be truly effective in a couple of situations:

a)the opening drives on the game
b)when playing far enough behind that the offense has to play in comeback mode
c) leading a go-ahead drive late in the game

In these circumstances, Henne has usually played admirably. But these are the situations where his objectives are clearly defined. Once Henne has achieved these objectives, he doesn't know how to just go out and play football. Instead of smelling blood, Henne starts playing extraordinarily tentative, starts making poor decisions, and instead of commanding the pocket he loses his composure and makes bad reads, throws poor passes off his back foot, or takes bad sacks. He has shown these tendencies as far back as the Saints game, and they've also popped up in games like the Bills, Bucs, Patriots, Jacksonville, and of course today. In some of these, we were able to overcome Henne's struggles at certain times in order to get a win. In other games, his failure to sustain a consistent performance has been a key factor (altough most certainly not the only one) in us getting a win.

I liked Chad Pennington a lot. But the truth is I like Henne a lot as well. But I'm obviously frustrated by his inability to consistently use his talent. Yet whats more frustrating than that is the fact that for any thread or comment criticizing anything that Henne does out there, ten people jump in criticism of the poster/post regardless of whether or not the facts are valid. When Henne goes out there and throws three picks in a loss, there are valid reasons to complain. Yet some of us have been pointing out the reasons why Henne is going to go out there and lose games like this before they even have actually happened, only to a chant of negative comments.

Most people here want a franchise passer so bad that they had thrown an MVP-runner up QB under the bus and cast him as the scapegoat for all that ailed the team before the season even started. I too want Henne to be a franchise QB, but don't demonize me for pointing out what's holding him back from being that and may continue to do so in the future.

BGtoKNfor6
12-20-2009, 11:55 PM
Let me say one thing here. Everyone who says that Henne doesn't deserve to be criticized for today because he brought us back is wrong. Henne was one of the main reasons why we were dug in a hole in the first place. He didn't allow the defense to give up touchdowns, but what he did do was throw two picks to end promising drives, which happened to be twice as many turnovers as Ricky caused with his fumble.

Most in this thread are saying "Henne just needs time", "only 11th start" and other similar statements, yet in other threads these same people are blaming Chad Pennnington and the coaching staff's obvious idiocy for the 0-3 start, nevermind that Henne actually was one of the main reasons we lost in the Chargers game. And lest we forget that most people here were demoniziing Pennington for his lack of arm strength and indicating that they believed Henne could play better from day one just because his superior arm would allow him to do so.

Henne has shown some serious potential, that fact is undeniable. He is capable of making every throw on the field. But he seems to only be truly effective in a couple of situations:

a)the opening drives on the game
b)when playing far enough behind that the offense has to play in comeback mode
c) leading a go-ahead drive late in the game

In these circumstances, Henne has usually played admirably. But these are the situations where his objectives are clearly defined. Once Henne has achieved these objectives, he doesn't know how to just go out and play football. Instead of smelling blood, Henne starts playing extraordinarily tentative, starts making poor decisions, and instead of commanding the pocket he loses his composure and makes bad reads, throws poor passes off his back foot, or takes bad sacks. He has shown these tendencies as far back as the Saints game, and they've also popped up in games like the Bills, Bucs, Patriots, Jacksonville, and of course today. In some of these, we were able to overcome Henne's struggles at certain times in order to get a win. In other games, his failure to sustain a consistent performance has been a key factor (altough most certainly not the only one) in us getting a win.

I liked Chad Pennington a lot. But the truth is I like Henne a lot as well. But I'm obviously frustrated by his inability to consistently use his talent. Yet whats more frustrating than that is the fact that for any thread or comment criticizing anything that Henne does out there, ten people jump in criticism of the poster/post regardless of whether or not the facts are valid. When Henne goes out there and throws three picks in a loss, there are valid reasons to complain. Yet some of us have been pointing out the reasons why Henne is going to go out there and lose games like this before they even have actually happened, only to a chant of negative comments.

Most people here want a franchise passer so bad that they had thrown an MVP-runner up QB under the bus and cast him as the scapegoat for all that ailed the team before the season even started. I too want Henne to be a franchise QB, but don't demonize me for pointing out what's holding him back from being that and may continue to do so in the future.

Um that is great and all and kudos for taking the time to post that, but most of the long time football fans acknowledge that fact that what you have posted, in a long verbose way, is nothing different than any other qb in the nfl, when it comes to the exponential learning curve that a young, inexperienced player has to undertake before becoming a successful qb in the NFL. Whew that was verbose too.

Bottom line. He is young. He will throw pics and cost us games. What young qb hasn't? How is this any different?

Next year if this is happening mid season with no progression in terms of his touch passing and decision making, then we may have a problem. He could throw 4-5 more pics in the next two games and I will still give him a pass on the fact that he is inexperienced and hasn't had enough game time yet to read coverages and hone his skills.

Awsi Dooger
12-20-2009, 11:56 PM
I think there will always be 5-6 plays per game in which Henne's long delivery will get him in trouble. The downfield landscape won't be the same at release as the point he made the decision.

The key is to avoid disaster on those plays.

Anyone who plays golf understand the dynamic. It's hardly a mere matter of more experience and repetitions, as some posters have suggested. If your swing is too long and complicated it lends itself to erratic results. Same thing at QB. We'll continue to see plays like a few weeks ago when Henne's mechanics tensed up and he wildly overthrew a wide open receiver down the right sideline. It was somewhat similar today when we had a chance for a 3rd down TD pass and Henne threw it wide left, beyond the side of the end zone.

Henne's touch will improve. It's already vastly superior to the San Diego game. The field presence and Leftwich/Harrington mechanics are another matter. I'm not sure we should even try to fix it. Last year it flopped when John Beck supposedly spent the entire offseason normalizing his low delivery.

Bumpus
12-20-2009, 11:56 PM
I'm far from ready to bash Henne, but today's performance certainly raised some question marks.

j-off-her-doll
12-20-2009, 11:57 PM
Henne is now being asked to win games with his arm. No other QB in the league is being asked to do as much with the little he has to work with. Some posters have noted that our WR's struggle to get separation, and they're absolutely right. I can think of only one play where a WR beyond 5 yards had any separation, and on the play he hit Hartline in stride. He threw for over 300 yards, and if you look at the completions, they were all in tight coverage - where he had to, more or less, make perfect throws. He did make mistakes, but if he's being forced to constantly throw into tight coverage. It shouldn't be surprising that he turns the ball over here and there. Also, the TD to INT ratio is a bit deceiving. Some of his interceptions are the result of WR's not hanging on to the ball (Ginn against the Saints comes to mind), and on many of the drives where he moves us, we finish with TD runs.

Considering what he has to work with, I think he's playing very well. Give him a couple of legitimate deep-ball threats, and you'll really see him blossom.

X-Pacolypse
12-21-2009, 12:00 AM
Ginn sucks.

BGtoKNfor6
12-21-2009, 12:01 AM
I think there will always be 5-6 plays per game in which Henne's long delivery will get him in trouble. The downfield landscape won't be the same at release as the point he made the decision.

The key is to avoid disaster on those plays.

Anyone who plays golf understand the dynamic. It's hardly a mere matter of more experience and repetitions, as some posters have suggested. If your swing is too long and complicated it lends itself to erratic results. Same thing at QB. We'll continue to see plays like a few weeks ago when Henne's mechanics tensed up and he wildly overthrew a wide open receiver down the right sideline. It was somewhat similar today when we had a chance for a 3rd down TD pass and Henne threw it wide left, beyond the side of the end zone.

Henne's touch will improve. It's already vastly superior to the San Diego game. The field presence and Leftwich/Harrington mechanics are another matter. I'm not sure we should even try to fix it. Last year it flopped when John Beck supposedly spent the entire offseason normalizing his low delivery.

Again, experience and the reason they have competent qb coaches in the NFL. What gives me hope about Henne is, not so much the passes he HASN'T completed, but rather the ones he HAS completed that made me raise an eyebrow and go damn.

I dislike the golf analogy for the simple reason that Henne is NOT playing against himself and has to rely on the wideouts to PROPERLY run their routes as well as break when they are supposed to, get body position, etc. It isn't clear on TV whether or not a pic is the result of the qb throwing the ball erratically or because he was throwing it where his teammate was supposed to be but for some reason 'zigged instead of 'zagged. We just don't know by watching the game feed all of the time. I remember a certain someone that had a "bad" delivery in the name of bernie kosar that went on to be a pretty decent qb in the NFL.

It is up to Henne on what kind of qb he wants to be. If he puts in the time and dedication this offseason to improve, he could very well be the guy in miami and for a LONG time. If I were Henne, I would be reaching out to the steve youngs of the NFL who seem to like to mentor players.

phreak
12-21-2009, 12:11 AM
Let me say one thing here. Everyone who says that Henne doesn't deserve to be criticized for today because he brought us back is wrong. Henne was one of the main reasons why we were dug in a hole in the first place. He didn't allow the defense to give up touchdowns, but what he did do was throw two picks to end promising drives, which happened to be twice as many turnovers as Ricky caused with his fumble.

Most in this thread are saying "Henne just needs time", "only 11th start" and other similar statements, yet in other threads these same people are blaming Chad Pennnington and the coaching staff's obvious idiocy for the 0-3 start, nevermind that Henne actually was one of the main reasons we lost in the Chargers game. And lest we forget that most people here were demoniziing Pennington for his lack of arm strength and indicating that they believed Henne could play better from day one just because his superior arm would allow him to do so.

Henne has shown some serious potential, that fact is undeniable. He is capable of making every throw on the field. But he seems to only be truly effective in a couple of situations:

a)the opening drives on the game
b)when playing far enough behind that the offense has to play in comeback mode
c) leading a go-ahead drive late in the game

In these circumstances, Henne has usually played admirably. But these are the situations where his objectives are clearly defined. Once Henne has achieved these objectives, he doesn't know how to just go out and play football. Instead of smelling blood, Henne starts playing extraordinarily tentative, starts making poor decisions, and instead of commanding the pocket he loses his composure and makes bad reads, throws poor passes off his back foot, or takes bad sacks. He has shown these tendencies as far back as the Saints game, and they've also popped up in games like the Bills, Bucs, Patriots, Jacksonville, and of course today. In some of these, we were able to overcome Henne's struggles at certain times in order to get a win. In other games, his failure to sustain a consistent performance has been a key factor (altough most certainly not the only one) in us getting a win.

I liked Chad Pennington a lot. But the truth is I like Henne a lot as well. But I'm obviously frustrated by his inability to consistently use his talent. Yet whats more frustrating than that is the fact that for any thread or comment criticizing anything that Henne does out there, ten people jump in criticism of the poster/post regardless of whether or not the facts are valid. When Henne goes out there and throws three picks in a loss, there are valid reasons to complain. Yet some of us have been pointing out the reasons why Henne is going to go out there and lose games like this before they even have actually happened, only to a chant of negative comments.

Most people here want a franchise passer so bad that they had thrown an MVP-runner up QB under the bus and cast him as the scapegoat for all that ailed the team before the season even started. I too want Henne to be a franchise QB, but don't demonize me for pointing out what's holding him back from being that and may continue to do so in the future.
most of henne's problems can be overcome... i don't expect him to do it during the season, but rather in the offseason when there is no pressure to win with what he has... i can't stand people who think these things can be fixed in a game or two... i have said from day one that henne needs to start developing a dan marino type attitude, because he will never develope the skill (nobody has or ever will)... attitude will overcome a lot of issues... you mention that henne plays better in comeback mode, and i believe he needs that compettitive drive dan had simply because dan played like the team was down even when leading by 20 or 30 points... if henne can develope that drive and intensity, no defense in the league will be able to stop him... he needs to learn to bust heads the way dan did when a reciever dropped the ball... yell at a few people and let people know this is HIS TEAM... i like pennington and hope we keep him somehow, in any capacity (even a QB coach)... if he is dumped off like he was in N.Y. then it will be an injustice

Sirspud
12-21-2009, 12:21 AM
You gentlemen are making good points but the one thing coming up that I don't agree with is blaming the wide receivers too much on a day like today where the wide receiver play was pretty darn solid. We all know the strengths and weaknesses of our corps, but I can't fault them for any of Henne's picks today because they were all just simply bad passes. And you can't disregard the fact that Hartline turned an interception into the biggest play of the day. And there were some occasions where the receivers did get separation, although it wasn't every play.

I'm not trying to make a greater/worse statement here, but Pennington had absolutely no problems sustaining an incredibly high rate of completions with these same receivers. In fact, I'd say the addition of Hartline has actually improved our corps much more to Henne's benefit. Pennington didn't have the strength to fire lasers but he found a way to get the ball to where it needed to be. And Henne can get the ball to where it needs to be as well, of this I have no doubt that he could be almost as good as Pennington because when he is on he does it. His problems with accuracy and picks are a problem from a mental standpoint, as he lets his techniques sag, he lets himself get tentative, and he'll throw the ball when not set up properly and it just won't go where it needs to. That doesn't have anything to do with the receivers getting separation, because he sometimes does this with even wide open receivers and most of his picks are ones that are just uncharacteristically way off-line because of the poor setup.

Sirspud
12-21-2009, 12:46 AM
Do we really need to explain why, even if Ginn was wide open, there are very good reasons not to throw it to him? I swear, we shouldn't even be putting him out of the field because there is a 1/3 chance that any pass thrown to him, even if it is perfect, will be dropped or played poorly by Ginn. Having a catch or two doesn't change that, especially since he showed his poor hands by completely dropping a punt.

When Ginn is on the field he is on it merely as a decoy, although if he were open 7 or 8 times clearly he is one that isn't working. We simply can't have Ginn play a key roll in our offense because he has shown such terrible reliability in bringing in well thrown balls that it's not worth wasting a down and the effort of the players on the field by throwing it to him when there is a chance that other receivers (who have shown that they actually want to catch passes at the NFL level) are or will be open.

I just don't know how many times one guy can fail before people get the message. Ginn hasn't dropped many passes recently, but only because he hasn't been thrown many.

Fritz27
12-21-2009, 12:53 AM
I watched a decent amount of his Michigan career and this is the QB you get with Henne. Shows some flashes, shows some pure idiocy, and shows a lot of mediocre/average play. I was never in love with him. I think at best he's a Jake Delhomme in his prime type of player.

MP-Omnis
12-21-2009, 12:58 AM
When you are at the game you can see the whole field, and i can tell you ginn was wide open at least 7 times, but Henne only looked his way once, and the one time he looked ginns way was a completion. He is not looking Ginns way much, is why he is not getting 7 and 8 catches a game. He seems to only look at one side of the field. At today's game he seemed to only look Bess and Cams way, and when he went deep to hartline ginn was wide open on the other side, and lucky when Henne threw the ball to Hartlines side he made a great play to keep us in the game. Anyone who was at this game can tell you he only looked ginns way once and that is not going to get us the big plays we are looking for. I noticed he still stares down the receiver he's throwing to. He has regressed from what is see. But lets just hope this was just one bad game and not a thing to come with Henne. Go Fins.

Did you watch the Steelers-Packers game? Those teams' receivers put on a show... and that's the kind of play that we sorely lack right now. Why do you think Henning is running all of those 1 WR sets? Our WRs are good, but to get the job done Henne needs to be great. We haven't been consistently seeing the kinds of performances that give QBs a break. The WRs are not beating coverage by physical skill or performance, but rather by design of whichever play. Of course, there are exceptions like Ginn v. Jets and Hartline a couple times this season too including today, but we still lack that consistent application of talent that most of the other teams seem to have.

Sirspud
12-21-2009, 01:08 AM
I watched a decent amount of his Michigan career and this is the QB you get with Henne. Shows some flashes, shows some pure idiocy, and shows a lot of mediocre/average play. I was never in love with him. I think at best he's a Jake Delhomme in his prime type of player.

In a way, he's already better than Jake Delhomme, but I kind of agree with you. I didn't watch him closely at Michigan, but I knew that there were some circles that considered him a disappointment and there were question marks surrounding him. Seeing him struggle the way he does mentally doesn't encourage me, knowing that those who experienced his 4-year college career were left disappointed. And the fact remains that most NFL teams agreed with me because despite his obvious first round caliber arm, he was a late second round pick. That's why I'm not as encouraged as some that his mistakes will ease themselves with experience.

Ginn & Juice
12-21-2009, 01:17 AM
Atleast he's not a Harrington, Culpepper, Feely,

Sirspud
12-21-2009, 01:30 AM
Atleast he's not a Harrington, Culpepper, Feely,

Yeah, but if we spend ten years with this guy at the helm and all he does is take the team to the brink of success and then blow it, I'd rather have the guy who makes it obvious that he isn't gonna be the one to lead you to the promised land so you can dump him and move on.

phreak
12-21-2009, 06:45 AM
When you are at the game you can see the whole field, and i can tell you ginn was wide open at least 7 times, but Henne only looked his way once, and the one time he looked ginns way was a completion. He is not looking Ginns way much, is why he is not getting 7 and 8 catches a game. He seems to only look at one side of the field. At today's game he seemed to only look Bess and Cams way, and when he went deep to hartline ginn was wide open on the other side, and lucky when Henne threw the ball to Hartlines side he made a great play to keep us in the game. Anyone who was at this game can tell you he only looked ginns way once and that is not going to get us the big plays we are looking for. I noticed he still stares down the receiver he's throwing to. He has regressed from what is see. But lets just hope this was just one bad game and not a thing to come with Henne. Go Fins.
twice actually... at least... i say that because ginn managed to catch two balls in that game

phreak
12-21-2009, 06:47 AM
Yeah, but if we spend ten years with this guy at the helm and all he does is take the team to the brink of success and then blow it, I'd rather have the guy who makes it obvious that he isn't gonna be the one to lead you to the promised land so you can dump him and move on.
so what you are saying is that you wish marino had been dumped? after all he took us to the brink and we didn't see a championship during his tenure

finjim
12-21-2009, 09:07 AM
A gang of children just made my ignore list. What a worthless thread!

finjim
12-21-2009, 09:21 AM
In his first year starting? You sir are an idiot. I have no patience for some of these moronic fans anymore, it's really sad. People want this guy again im beating the dead horse but, HE IS NOT MARINO.

To all the haters, should we spend another 2nd rounder on a QB that needs to develop or LET PAT WHITE START? How about trading for Kevin Kolb another young eagles QB with some success but no real look?

I just add the idiots to my ignore list, it's a nice feature!

GeauxFinns3705
12-21-2009, 09:22 AM
Holds the ball too long in the pocket and rockets the ball everywhere he throws. Henne now has more interceptions than TD's on the season and there is a reason why. If he is ever going to be a franchise passer, he needs to make the plays that require more than a strong arm.

I agree. I don't think Henne is (will be) very good. Hes avg and hes boneheaded.

GeauxFinns3705
12-21-2009, 09:26 AM
I am getting sick of everyone chewing out Henne. A 2nd year QB that has shown nothing put great promise for the future of this franchise! All you fans that think this is the year are in for a rude awakening. Like it or not we are re-building and either accept it or deal with it. Have you watched this game? It's been tough but all Dan Fouts has said all day long is "another great throw by Henne". Give the kid a break he is after all the best thing we have had in the last 10 years! Go Phins!

This is non-sense. He has shown "NOTHING but Great promise". First of all, let me just say, Fouts is a tool, not about Henne but about everything.

Second, Henne has shown far more than just great promise. Like, not so great decision making. Not so great throws to other teams players. Not so great pocket presence. Not so great ability to throw the ball away.

To say hes been nothing but great is nothing but absurd.

GeauxFinns3705
12-21-2009, 09:32 AM
This is everything that is wrong with you guys who blindly support Henne. That record was Chad Pennington's.

ROFL. Good call.

GeauxFinns3705
12-21-2009, 09:34 AM
He did throw a third Int that cost us the game. Either way I know this team is going to be something in a year or two and Henne will be our starting QB.

You cannot possibly "know" this. You hope it. We are right now a 50/50 team (just like our record says) and we could go in either direction.

GeauxFinns3705
12-21-2009, 09:35 AM
It's definitely something to think about.

I'm not turning on Chad Henne, he's done great things. But after a game like today where he consistently missed open people with over throws, made some horrible throws from the pocket (on his interceptions especially), and took inexcusable sacks you have to wonder about the guy. Game after game he's shown he doesn't know how to be an NFL QB. I'm beginning to wonder if it's inexperience or inability.....

I think its intelligence. Hes lacking it seems.

Vaark
12-21-2009, 09:41 AM
I agree. I don't think Henne is (will be) very good. Hes avg and hes boneheaded.

*sigh*

Adam Shefter, ESPN and formerly Fox Insider (as in has entree to NFL coaches, players and management) said this morning on Mike & Mike that Henne's the real deal and Miami now has its franchise QB.

Mike Ditka (I think you know who he is and what he's done) on the same program just opined:

"Chad Henne is really a good football player. As he proceeds to play the game, it'll continue to become a lot clearer to him."

But granted, their perspectives and resulting opinions pale by comparison to the insights and pronouncement you've developed while faithfully sitting on the LazyBoy in front of the boob tube.

GeauxFinns3705
12-21-2009, 09:43 AM
how could anybody critize this kid at all, check out how well sanchez did today, and vince young was horrible in the second half with the game on the line, chad with no deep threats brought them back, leave the guy be, we are locked in at QB

We are not locked in and I wont leave him alone. Every time he makes a bonehead play I am going to bash the hell out of him. Not to worry though...he will have 100 more pimps (just like Fiedler had). It wasn't until JF was gone that you same people started hating him.

And its not just QBs. You same people were the same ones saying, "We must give Cam more time"....LOL. I know you guys like the back of my hand and the propensity that you guys have to embrace mediocrity and like it...blows me away.

GeauxFinns3705
12-21-2009, 09:46 AM
He is 7-4 for basically a rookie QB and almost brought us back from an 18 point defecit.

You know what...he isn't going anywhere anytime soon either...so you better suck it up and get used to him.

And the pimps better suck it up and get used to him getting bashed unmercifully when he throws 3 ints.

Dolphins11
12-21-2009, 09:50 AM
Holds the ball too long in the pocket and rockets the ball everywhere he throws. Henne now has more interceptions than TD's on the season and there is a reason why. If he is ever going to be a franchise passer, he needs to make the plays that require more than a strong arm.

Lame.

phreak
12-21-2009, 09:58 AM
And the pimps better suck it up and get used to him getting bashed unmercifully when he throws 3 ints.
and no other qbs in dolphins history have thrown ints before :rolleyes2:

BigFin
12-21-2009, 10:40 AM
Holds the ball too long in the pocket and rockets the ball everywhere he throws. Henne now has more interceptions than TD's on the season and there is a reason why. If he is ever going to be a franchise passer, he needs to make the plays that require more than a strong arm.


Ok...Can you tell me who has the separation to throw the ball to?

wikidj
12-21-2009, 10:53 AM
Ok...Can you tell me who has the separation to throw the ball to?

apparently the opposing teams secondary.

dolphans1
12-21-2009, 11:49 AM
Well who's to blame for our wide receiver problem, we knew we had issues last year, and did we address them....?

Every year there will always be something new, the team that can adapt the best will win and make no excuses when they lose.

There was enough blame to go around for this loss and others, its just not 1 thing, its a bunch of little things.

d-1

Sirspud
12-22-2009, 12:25 AM
so what you are saying is that you wish marino had been dumped? after all he took us to the brink and we didn't see a championship during his tenure

Marino set an NFL record for touchdown passes in his second year as a starter and threw twenty TD passes in 11 games, 9 started his rookie year. It is clear that whatever the problems with those teams were, QB was not one of them

Henne has flashed signs of greatness mixed in with signs of mediocrity. He has thrown roughly a TD pass per game and has lost a couple games this year pretty much entirely through interceptions. That doesn't condemn him to being a bad starter for his career but illustrates that he is a question mark and as I have talked about a couple times this thread, he struggles to play complete games (except for maybe the Jets game) even though he has some very nice drives and moments here and there. Pennington was limited because of his arm. Henne will be unless he overcomes his mental block at playing with a lead/tie.

There is no comparison between a QB who was the most dominant of his era and a guy who is dominant in one quarter and mediocre in another.

phreak
12-22-2009, 03:18 AM
Marino set an NFL record for touchdown passes in his second year as a starter and threw twenty TD passes in 11 games, 9 started his rookie year. It is clear that whatever the problems with those teams were, QB was not one of them

Henne has flashed signs of greatness mixed in with signs of mediocrity. He has thrown roughly a TD pass per game and has lost a couple games this year pretty much entirely through interceptions. That doesn't condemn him to being a bad starter for his career but illustrates that he is a question mark and as I have talked about a couple times this thread, he struggles to play complete games (except for maybe the Jets game) even though he has some very nice drives and moments here and there. Pennington was limited because of his arm. Henne will be unless he overcomes his mental block at playing with a lead/tie.

There is no comparison between a QB who was the most dominant of his era and a guy who is dominant in one quarter and mediocre in another.
this response is nonsensical at best... in one post you advicate dumping qbs who don't finish with a super bowl the next you make an exception for one, because he was great (even though we didn't win championships with him)... you can't have it both ways... dan himself sees greatness in this kid, so i for one am willing to give him the benefit of a doubt

PerfectFinz72
12-22-2009, 10:40 AM
Marino set an NFL record for touchdown passes in his second year as a starter and threw twenty TD passes in 11 games, 9 started his rookie year. It is clear that whatever the problems with those teams were, QB was not one of them

Henne has flashed signs of greatness mixed in with signs of mediocrity. He has thrown roughly a TD pass per game and has lost a couple games this year pretty much entirely through interceptions. That doesn't condemn him to being a bad starter for his career but illustrates that he is a question mark and as I have talked about a couple times this thread, he struggles to play complete games (except for maybe the Jets game) even though he has some very nice drives and moments here and there. Pennington was limited because of his arm. Henne will be unless he overcomes his mental block at playing with a lead/tie.

There is no comparison between a QB who was the most dominant of his era and a guy who is dominant in one quarter and mediocre in another.

Who is comparing Henne to Marino? I've seen very, VERY few fans here making that comparison because most know thats silly. And you well know those comparing the two are clueless...lets be honest. Henne can still be a great QB without being Dan Marino. Its so annoying when people always throw back the "don't compare him to this guy" argument. Who cares....everyone knows he won't be what Dan was.

Sirspud
12-22-2009, 11:41 AM
this response is nonsensical at best... in one post you advicate dumping qbs who don't finish with a super bowl the next you make an exception for one, because he was great (even though we didn't win championships with him)... you can't have it both ways... dan himself sees greatness in this kid, so i for one am willing to give him the benefit of a doubt

I didn't equate anything with a Super Bowl victory. Certainly my statement was left open for interpretation that way but that wasn't what I said.

I talked about QB's who can bring you to the brink of success. This is exemplified in guys like Fiedler, who had a tremendous competitive spirit and was a great leader but wasn't the type of QB who you could count on against the big boys, so we won couple playoff births but always bowed out. Or a QB like Gus Frerotte, who had a good feel for the game but didn't have a good feel for accuracy, and was just good enough to have a winning record but not good enough for the playoffs (9-7). Or, in the minds of the criticis here, a QB like Pennington whose weak arm is capable of doing phenonenal things but maybe not capable of beating the best safeties in the league. On sunday, it was a Chad Henne who was good enough to dig us out of the hole he was partially responsible for, then he pretty much lost the game for us all over again.

In all of these, I'm more talking about true QB performance and ability and less about whether or not that translates to a Super Bowl victory because there are other phases of the game involved. Right now, Chad Henne's QB rating is a below average 73.8 and he has only 2 multi-TD games where he threw 2 TD's. In judging his QB performance, he has been good enough to have us be on top of 7 games but there were others that were very winnable that he didn't win by stepping up his play. Good enough to get us in the playoff hunt, but not good enough to get us there right now.

Sirspud
12-22-2009, 11:45 AM
Who is comparing Henne to Marino? I've seen very, VERY few fans here making that comparison because most know thats silly. And you well know those comparing the two are clueless...lets be honest. Henne can still be a great QB without being Dan Marino. Its so annoying when people always throw back the "don't compare him to this guy" argument. Who cares....everyone knows he won't be what Dan was.

I'm not asking him to be Dan Marino or anything close to what he was. I'm asking him to be closer to what Chad Pennington was, a QB who doesn't make crippling mistakes because those are what LOSE games in the NFL no matter how strong your arm is. Considering that Henne has infinitely greater tools and a WR corps that has at least marginally improved by having Hartline out there, it doesn't seem like too much to ask.

BGtoKNfor6
12-23-2009, 02:01 AM
I'm not asking him to be Dan Marino or anything close to what he was. I'm asking him to be closer to what Chad Pennington was, a QB who doesn't make crippling mistakes because those are what LOSE games in the NFL no matter how strong your arm is. Considering that Henne has infinitely greater tools and a WR corps that has at least marginally improved by having Hartline out there, it doesn't seem like too much to ask.

So what did you say after chad pretty much lost the game for us against the Ravens last year in the playoffs? Yet, he doesn't lose games for us?

So what you want is a qb that is perfect all of the time and doesn't throw pics? Join the club.

Again his youth and inexperience is what is hurting him. No different than any other qb in the league.

I just hope you are around in 2-3 years when Henne is a solid starter in the league so you can eat your crow.

Captain Lou
12-23-2009, 11:48 AM
Holds the ball too long in the pocket and rockets the ball everywhere he throws. Henne now has more interceptions than TD's on the season and there is a reason why. If he is ever going to be a franchise passer, he needs to make the plays that require more than a strong arm.


No offense but you have no idea what you are talking about. How qb's come in and light it up instantly. Only one and his name was Marino!

ArmyFin7
12-23-2009, 11:50 AM
Stafford and the Sanchize have more picks than TD's....should their teams scrap them as well?

Vaark
12-23-2009, 11:53 AM
I'm not asking him to be Dan Marino or anything close to what he was. I'm asking him to be closer to what Chad Pennington was, a QB who doesn't make crippling mistakes because those are what LOSE games in the NFL no matter how strong your arm is. Considering that Henne has infinitely greater tools and a WR corps that has at least marginally improved by having Hartline out there, it doesn't seem like too much to ask.

Penny over his last 4 games: 0-4, 2TDs, 4 Ints, including a typically substandard performance against a top 10 scoring D.

Henne: 7-4, 10TDs, 12Ints, including 2 wins and another prolific showing against elite Ds with 2 of the 3 RBs Penny had now on the shelf.

Thanks but no thanks in terms of wanting him being close to a Penny. Fortunately Henne's already eclipsed him as a first year starter.

PerfectFinz72
12-23-2009, 01:05 PM
I'm not asking him to be Dan Marino or anything close to what he was. I'm asking him to be closer to what Chad Pennington was, a QB who doesn't make crippling mistakes because those are what LOSE games in the NFL no matter how strong your arm is. Considering that Henne has infinitely greater tools and a WR corps that has at least marginally improved by having Hartline out there, it doesn't seem like too much to ask.

I actually think it is too much to ask and I'll explain why I think that. The reason Penny didn't turn the ball over last year was because he didn't take chances....mainly because of his physical limitations (i.e throwing the ball deep or trying to fit the ball into a tight window). Those are things Henne can do and naturally he will turn the ball over. Peyton Manning (again, not comparing just pointing out an example) has thrown 15 INTs this year. So even the BEST of the best are going to turn the ball over. Obviously we don't want Henne to be throwing 20+ picks in any given season, but he's still probably gonna throw somewhere between 10-15 or so on average anyway.

And that STILL doesn't mean Henne won't be a better QB than Pennington in the end. Because I think we will be because of his physical skills.