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hooshoops
12-31-2009, 10:30 PM
that's the best motor i've seen at 330 lbs...i don't know what they're pumping him full of at tennessee but his effort is off the charts for that size...

he's playing every down and unlike cody he's not tiring and i mean even 3rd down...wow he pursues the ball down the los takes on double teams pushes the pocket...quite a player

the hokies are doing their damage wide in the run game...what a player dan williams is...

SR 7
12-31-2009, 10:39 PM
a lot of places say we go with him with our 1st pick.

hooshoops
12-31-2009, 10:41 PM
i'll tell you right now i didn't think he was worth a top 15 pick going into today...he is to me now


i've seen footage of his motor on tape and been impressed but watching it live that's so damn rare for a guy that size i can't overstate it...

dan williams is top 15 for me now he's been doubled all game and not giving up ground...

Dogbone34
12-31-2009, 11:13 PM
dan williams does look good. add him with starks, langford and look out.

Ricky4Life
12-31-2009, 11:49 PM
I actually really like this guy. This draft we will find out if Tuna is still pulling the strings really hard or if he has handed the reigns over to TS and JF. Because Tuna always takes project NT's.

j-off-her-doll
12-31-2009, 11:56 PM
Would you take him over Dez Bryant?

Hint: If you would, you're crazy.

I'd love to get him in the 2nd, but that's probably not going to happen. If you draft a NT that high, he better be the Reggie White of NT's.

hooshoops
01-01-2010, 12:19 AM
Would you take him over Dez Bryant?

Hint: If you would, you're crazy.

I'd love to get him in the 2nd, but that's probably not going to happen. If you draft a NT that high, he better be the Reggie White of NT's.

no i wouldn't take him over dez bryant...never said i would

but i'd take him right after mcclain...absolutely

2nd round is dreaming imo

when did reggie white play the nose???

Ozfin77
01-01-2010, 12:27 AM
no i wouldn't take him over dez bryant...never said i would

but i'd take him right after mcclain...absolutely

2nd round is dreaming imo

when did reggie white play the nose???

I think he meant a dominant NT like Reggie was on the end...or somethin...lol.

I dont mind this guy, but I wouldnt go nuts for him.

Personally, I'd be doing everything we can do get Rolando McClain (send Ginn our 1st and a 3rd or 4th to Cleveland for their pick around 5 or 6).

Some might think this is crazy and they're entitled to their opinion, but after missing out on Pat Willis, this is one guy we cannot miss.

Ricky4Life
01-01-2010, 03:23 AM
I think he meant a dominant NT like Reggie was on the end...or somethin...lol.

I dont mind this guy, but I wouldnt go nuts for him.

Personally, I'd be doing everything we can do get Rolando McClain (send Ginn our 1st and a 3rd or 4th to Cleveland for their pick around 5 or 6).

Some might think this is crazy and they're entitled to their opinion, but after missing out on Pat Willis, this is one guy we cannot miss.

If we can sign Karlos Dansby that would take care of that need.

tcolli17
01-01-2010, 04:19 AM
If McClain or Bryant aren't there when we pick, I wouldn''t mind getting him.

MP-Omnis
01-01-2010, 04:30 AM
Dan Williams threw a guard with just his arm in the 1st quarter. Dude was beastin and has sick power moves vs. the 1-on-1.

Phinatic8u
01-01-2010, 05:08 AM
Only way is if McClain & Bryant are gone. But thats it. Cause IMO Solai isn't that bad at all.

WelcomeBack
01-01-2010, 05:38 AM
Bryant is still my number one guy, with McClain right behind him. Bur after that it's gotta be Dan Williams based off of what I have seen of him. He's absolutely explosive.

hooshoops
01-01-2010, 09:49 AM
Bryant is still my number one guy, with McClain right behind him. Bur after that it's gotta be Dan Williams based off of what I have seen of him. He's absolutely explosive.

i'm right there with you...

bryant
mcclain
williams

hooshoops
01-01-2010, 09:51 AM
Dan Williams threw a guard with just his arm in the 1st quarter. Dude was beastin and has sick power moves vs. the 1-on-1.

that was similar to haloti ngata tossing one of our guards in the playoff game a few years ago like he was a fly with 1 arm...

OrlandoFin
01-01-2010, 11:18 AM
that was similar to haloti ngata tossing one of our guards in the playoff game a few years ago like he was a fly with 1 arm...

Williams reminds me a lot of Ngata. Very athletic for a guy that big and as you already mentioned he's got a great motor. I think he is the #1 NT in the draft. I have Shu and McCoy rated higher as DTs but I like Williams a lot. I don't see Miami taking him because BP usually likes to take those guys late in the draft, but if Miami was picking 15 or lower I wouldn't be upset at all grabbing Williams.

hooshoops
01-01-2010, 11:22 AM
yeah suh and mccoy absolutely the top 2 dts in the draft...

dan williams imo by far the best nose prospect

what were peoples thoughts of jason worlds??? he was all over the place looks like a rush lb at the next level

OrlandoFin
01-01-2010, 11:44 AM
what were peoples thoughts of jason worlds??? he was all over the place looks like a rush lb at the next level

I like him. If he comes out this year I don't think he'd be better than a mid round pick. He had a very good 2008 but hurt his shoulder in the Orange Bowl and hasn't had the production this year that he did last. I think he stays another year and possibly a second round or higher pick in 2011.

I do think he can play with his hand up and Va Tech already has him drop back in coverage on zone blitzes and he does well. Very solid tackler and I see him chase a lot of plays down from behind. I see him as a SOLB in a 3-4 in the NFL.

hooshoops
01-01-2010, 11:49 AM
i see more weakside but i like your breakdown of his game...

the only thing i worry about is is he really that good of a prospect or is he more a product of that bud foster system...

va tech gets everything out of their talent at the college level but seems to not put out a lot of nfl impact players on defense...

and i wonder what the long term prognosis on that shoulder of his is...

LouPhinFan
01-01-2010, 01:58 PM
I guess you have to call me crazy then because I would take Williams over Bryant as of right now. I haven't seen Bryant play in a year, have you guys? Now if he shows up and wows at the combine then you've got to think about taking Bryant but you've still got to think about it.

Finding a starting caliber NT is paramount in this draft. Screw trying to find a dominant WR. Henne still throws for 300 yards with the WRs we have now. Soliai is a backup, plain and simple. He doesn't demand double teams like a NT should. If Ngata was worth where he was picked (#12 in 2006), then Williams is worth a #14 or #15. You would see our defense take a light-year jump if we have a dominant NT to plug in the middle.

McClain is an excellent choice too, but he will be gone by the time we pick and an ILB is not worth moving up for. We need to keep our draft picks.

Just my 2 cents worth.

baseballcb95
01-01-2010, 02:07 PM
Hopefully brandon spikes has a horrid bowl game today and an average combine and falls like malaluga.. we get the 11th pick and go Dez Bryant Brandon Spikes and Ricky Sapp in the early 3rd.. we would have to get really lucky with that scenario though..

Sapp, Spikes, Crowder, and Wake would be a pretty good group of LB's and you would give Henne a great playmaker in the process. maybe even add antonio Bryant to take pressure of Dez and turn our offense into a powerhouse..

Lord Of Miami
01-01-2010, 02:20 PM
Williams made his plays in this game but he was also owned for most of it as well.

Let's not for forget he was part of a DL that gave up over 220 yards rushing to the Hokies.He will make plays that make him look like a top 20 pick then he'll be blocked and run on most the game.

If you rewatch the game, all the big Hokies run plays came because Williams was busy looking like a 4th round pick getting pushed around.

He's very inconsistent just ask KC Joyner http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft10/insider/news/story?id=4778474&action=upsell&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl%2fdraft10%2finsider%2fnews%2fstory%3fid%3d4778474

OrlandoFin
01-01-2010, 02:47 PM
I guess you have to call me crazy then because I would take Williams over Bryant as of right now. I haven't seen Bryant play in a year, have you guys? Now if he shows up and wows at the combine then you've got to think about taking Bryant but you've still got to think about it.

Finding a starting caliber NT is paramount in this draft. Screw trying to find a dominant WR. Henne still throws for 300 yards with the WRs we have now. Soliai is a backup, plain and simple. He doesn't demand double teams like a NT should. If Ngata was worth where he was picked (#12 in 2006), then Williams is worth a #14 or #15. You would see our defense take a light-year jump if we have a dominant NT to plug in the middle.

McClain is an excellent choice too, but he will be gone by the time we pick and an ILB is not worth moving up for. We need to keep our draft picks.

Just my 2 cents worth.

When was the last time Williams played NT? Don't get me wrong, I think he's the best NT in the draft, but he has had consistency issue in the past. BP normally doesn't take NTs early and I am not sure he will this year either. NT is a tough position to learn and adjust to, and Miami has to get an impact player with that first pick.

Bryant is the best WR in the draft, but there are also some good WRs that will be available in round 2 and later. I think the pick will be a LB or possibly Spiller with Miami's first pick. Thos positions will give the most impact right away.

j-off-her-doll
01-01-2010, 03:31 PM
Suh, Berry, and Bryant are the only players in the draft that I see as being head-n'-shoulders above the next players at their respective positions. Williams is the best NT, but the gap isn't huge. I'm not even convinced McClain is better than Spikes. I wouldn't break my hand on the wall if we got McClain - unless we passed on Bryant to get him - but I wouldn't be thrilled either.

Lord Of Miami
01-01-2010, 03:45 PM
When was the last time Williams played NT? Don't get me wrong, I think he's the best NT in the draft, but he has had consistency issue in the past. BP normally doesn't take NTs early and I am not sure he will this year either. NT is a tough position to learn and adjust to, and Miami has to get an impact player with that first pick.

Bryant is the best WR in the draft, but there are also some good WRs that will be available in round 2 and later. I think the pick will be a LB or possibly Spiller with Miami's first pick. Thos positions will give the most impact right away.

Great Post!!!

Bill has never drafted a DT in 1st round, and if he was going to it wouldn't be on a inconsistent one like Williams.

I like Williams a'lot, but people here are just looking at the good things about him....when their is also a'lot of ugly as well.

Most 3-4 draft a NT then make him sit a year, cuzzz like you said it's a tough position to learn.

baseballcb95
01-01-2010, 03:50 PM
Mcclain will be gone. Denver is guaranteed to pick ahead of us and im 95% sure they will take him. I dont see anyone in front of us with the luxary of taking Dez Bryant, hell if we pick 11 i bet one of (Spikes, Cody, Gresham, Morgan Burnett, Reshard Jones, Chad Jones, Sergio Kindle and possibly we get rediculously lucky and Earl Thomas. If we loose and get the 11th pick, we have a good chance of getting 2 franchise players, and 2 solid starters, my Dream mocks are:

1st- Dez Bryant, WR
2nd- Terrance Cody
3rd- Micah Johnson, ILB
4th- Jimmy Graham/Dennis Pitta, TE

or

1st- Dez Bryant, WR
2nd- Brandon Spikes, ILB
3rd- Ricky Sapp/George Selvie, OLB
4th- Jimmy Graham/Dennis Pitta, TE

OR

1st- Dez Bryant, WR
2nd- Best FS avalible
3rd- Best LB avalible (inside or outside)
4th- Jimmy Graham/Dennis Pitta, TE

hooshoops
01-01-2010, 05:26 PM
Williams made his plays in this game but he was also owned for most of it as well.

Let's not for forget he was part of a DL that gave up over 220 yards rushing to the Hokies.He will make plays that make him look like a top 20 pick then he'll be blocked and run on most the game.

If you rewatch the game, all the big Hokies run plays came because Williams was busy looking like a 4th round pick getting pushed around.

He's very inconsistent just ask KC Joyner http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft10/insider/news/story?id=4778474&action=upsell&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl%2fdraft10%2finsider%2fnews%2fstory%3fid%3d4778474


what damn game were you watching??? lol...and i don't give a damn what kc joyner thinks

4th round pick??? :foundout:

the hokies did all their damage running away from dan williams on purpose...check out the rest of the nose prospects to see who has a motor like that and pursues the ball with the same effort down after down

baseballcb95
01-01-2010, 05:38 PM
what damn game were you watching??? lol...and i don't give a damn what kc joyner thinks

4th round pick??? :foundout:

the hokies did all their damage running away from dan williams on purpose...check out the rest of the nose prospects to see who has a motor like that and pursues the ball with the same effort down after down

I didnt get a chance to watch the game but he is saying half the time the guy looks like a stud NT 1st round guy and other times he gets manhandled and is irrelevant looking like a 4th rounder for periods of time.. You cant get an inconsitent guy (if he actually is) in the 1st. you need an absolute stud franchise player especially if we are picking number 11.

3rdandinches
01-01-2010, 05:47 PM
Get ready to be dissappointed, E.Thomas could easily be our first pick even with Dez still sitting there. How many young WR`s do you guys think were gonna have on this team?

I can easily see E.Thomas or J.Hughes being our first pick and with our struggles in the secondary I can`t see why we should pick anyone outside of E.Thomas. He would make an impact right away where we suck the most.

People may not like our receivers but they have been productive unlike our secondary. This team needs a veteran NT, help at ILB and major help at FS, then we could use a WR, TE and maybe RB depending on Browns future. The defense needs to be upgraded all the way down the middle or next year we`ll have the same disappointing losses even¸though the offense is doing better.

Fix the defense through FA and the draft, help the receivers through FA we have enough young guys still trying to become NFL players.

baseballcb95
01-01-2010, 05:57 PM
Earl thomas could easily fall to the early 2nd. maybe to pick 11?

other safties in the early rounds to look at:

Eric Berry (need to trade up)
Earl Thomas (possibility)
Taylor Mayes (too raw, more of an athlete than a football player, AVOID!)
Chad Jones
Morgan Burnett
Deandre Mcdaniel
Deunta Williams
Reshad Jones
Darrell Stuckey

I love Earl Thomas, great ballhawk but i dont know about a first rounder..

EDIT- Dont get me wrong, he is a 1st round prospect, i just dont know if he gives our team the most value...

Thatd be pretty sick though

Vontae Davis
Sean Smith
Earl Thomas
Wilson/Bell/Clemons/Culver

LouPhinFan
01-01-2010, 06:17 PM
When was the last time Williams played NT? Don't get me wrong, I think he's the best NT in the draft, but he has had consistency issue in the past. BP normally doesn't take NTs early and I am not sure he will this year either. NT is a tough position to learn and adjust to, and Miami has to get an impact player with that first pick.

Bryant is the best WR in the draft, but there are also some good WRs that will be available in round 2 and later. I think the pick will be a LB or possibly Spiller with Miami's first pick. Thos positions will give the most impact right away.

Well, we haven't seen Bryant play in a year but then if he comes to the Combine and blows it up he probably won't be there for our pick anyway.

MP-Omnis
01-01-2010, 06:21 PM
Yeah, I noticed Dan Williams's inconsistency as well. That's why I said he's sick vs. the 1-on-1. Seems like once he gets double-teamed he doesn't do much. At least Soliai can push his double-team back a step or two.

Lord Of Miami
01-01-2010, 06:24 PM
Get ready to be dissappointed, E.Thomas could easily be our first pick even with Dez still sitting there. How many young WR`s do you guys think were gonna have on this team?

I can easily see E.Thomas or J.Hughes being our first pick and with our struggles in the secondary I can`t see why we should pick anyone outside of E.Thomas. He would make an impact right away where we suck the most.

People may not like our receivers but they have been productive unlike our secondary. This team needs a veteran NT, help at ILB and major help at FS, then we could use a WR, TE and maybe RB depending on Browns future. The defense needs to be upgraded all the way down the middle or next year we`ll have the same disappointing losses even¸though the offense is doing better.

Fix the defense through FA and the draft, help the receivers through FA we have enough young guys still trying to become NFL players.

Who would be upset with Thomas or J.Hughes.................Not me.

Our 1# need to me is FS and we also need a young OLB or 2 or 3.

rev kev
01-01-2010, 07:35 PM
I guess you have to call me crazy then because I would take Williams over Bryant as of right now. I haven't seen Bryant play in a year, have you guys? Now if he shows up and wows at the combine then you've got to think about taking Bryant but you've still got to think about it.

Finding a starting caliber NT is paramount in this draft. Screw trying to find a dominant WR. Henne still throws for 300 yards with the WRs we have now. Soliai is a backup, plain and simple. He doesn't demand double teams like a NT should. If Ngata was worth where he was picked (#12 in 2006), then Williams is worth a #14 or #15. You would see our defense take a light-year jump if we have a dominant NT to plug in the middle.

McClain is an excellent choice too, but he will be gone by the time we pick and an ILB is not worth moving up for. We need to keep our draft picks.

Just my 2 cents worth.

100% this is not the year to reach for a WR..., our core down the middle D is soft slow and unathletic... Fergie is done... too bad he gave it his all

VT Dolphan
01-01-2010, 08:01 PM
You're all talking about the wrong Williams. Ryan Williams will be an absolute stud in the NFL...three years from now.

I wasn't really impressed by Dan Williams last night. Granted, New Years Eve isn't exactly the greatest time time to be scouting...:drink:, but I tried to keep an eye on him and really didn't see a whole lot of standout plays.

When VT played Nebraska earlier in the year, I was able to notice Suh consistently making plays, even from all the way up in the nosebleed section of Lane Stadium. Now I'm not saying Williams is anywhere near Suh's level, but I'd be worried about spending a mid-first rounder on him.

newlownorder
01-01-2010, 10:54 PM
If Dan Williams was more consistent, he would be a top 10 pick. The reason he won't be is because teams will look at the season and see that he can be very inconsistent.

ckparrothead
01-01-2010, 11:45 PM
I agree that Dan Williams is inconsistent.

But I'm glad someone mentioned KC Joyner's stuff.

His study of Marvin Austin confirms what I believe, which I believe is a belief shared by Jeff Ireland, that Austin could play NT in the NFL.

Over 5 games of Joyner's study, Austin played 75.7% of the plays...so obviously Austin has endurance and durability. He played 110 snaps as 0 or 1 technique, 131 times as 2 or 3 technique, and some other snaps elsewhere on the DL.

He was double teamed on 41% of running plays, and tripled teamed on 35% of the running plays. In other words, he deals with more than one blocker on 76% of plays. Across the 5 game sample, being doubled or tripled on most run plays, he won on 21.6% of runs, which would be very good for the NFL.

IMO this is a guy that can take up and defeat multiple blockers at the next level, and he's still getting better.

Which sucks, because I don't think he's going to come out this year, so it's all moot anyway.

OrlandoFin
01-02-2010, 08:51 AM
Which sucks, because I don't think he's going to come out this year, so it's all moot anyway.

I get to see a lot of this guy living here in the Triangle area. He is a beast and will probably be a top 10 pick in 2011. He said on his Twitter page he will be a Heel in 2010.

http://twitter.com/lifeofma

if u were wondering.......I will be a tarheel for 2010!!!!!!!

Its officially..official..hahahahaha...yea I could go get paid but in some things it aint all about the money...I love carolina point blank!

hooshoops
01-02-2010, 11:53 AM
hmmm...i don't know about this inconsistency you guys speak of but i'm gonna rewatch the game today and i was loaded up on spirits by the time the game started...

ckparrothead
01-02-2010, 01:32 PM
I get to see a lot of this guy living here in the Triangle area. He is a beast and will probably be a top 10 pick in 2011. He said on his Twitter page he will be a Heel in 2010.

http://twitter.com/lifeofma

if u were wondering.......I will be a tarheel for 2010!!!!!!!

Its officially..official..hahahahaha...yea I could go get paid but in some things it aint all about the money...I love carolina point blank!

Thanks for the heads up. What I heard is that a ton of the other UNC prospects have decided to stay instead of going pro...and knowing Austin's personality, I knew that he would go along with his teammates. This is a kid that could have gone to much more reputable football programs, but chose UNC because he liked the academics and the atmosphere better. He was the top recruited defensive player in the country at the time.

ckparrothead
01-02-2010, 01:33 PM
hmmm...i don't know about this inconsistency you guys speak of but i'm gonna rewatch the game today and i was loaded up on spirits by the time the game started...

It's game to game as much as anything. For instance I didn't really think he had a particularly good game against UCLA when I cut up that tape.

DaytonaDolFan13
01-02-2010, 01:53 PM
I wasn't blown away by Dan Williams. I've watched him a bit. I rather we resign old JASON FERGUSON and go with Soli (who has shown some development) and work on another need area like ILB OLB FS WR TE

hooshoops
01-02-2010, 04:42 PM
It's game to game as much as anything. For instance I didn't really think he had a particularly good game against UCLA when I cut up that tape.

that pretty much mirrors what slimm told me in pm...he said he seems to show up more in big games and not be as much a factor against weaker competition...i haven't seen all his games but the ones i have he's shown up

i watched the replay of the game this morning...i still think he's the best nose prospect available

some people aren't realizing that this guy is playing every snap he's not part of a rotation like cam thomas at unc or other nt prospects... the stamina he displays for a guy that size that goes that hard is unmatched in the college game imo...330 lb plus guys

couple things i noticed...he seemed to be content sometimes to just stay with the blocker in 1 on 1 situations and not try to get off blocks...like maybe he was taking a rest which imo i can surely understand given that he never leaves the field

i'd like to see him use his hands a bit more to shed blockers...

i love the way he flows down the los and pursues the ball though...very impressive

i thought he may be a 3 down player in the nfl and while i still think in time he may be a guy you could shift out on pass rush downs occasionally he was most effective inside...on 3rd and long they would set him wide and he didn't really rush the passer seemed content to engage back off and stay at the los and wait for the ball and then pursue

i'm leaning now more towards 2 down player but more than just a run stuffing plugger and i kind of have this rule that a team with needs like we have doesn't use a 1st round pick (especially a top 15 one) on anything but an every down guy...

i think as slimm also pointed out to me that williams would be a heck of a player in a rotation along with solai...

regarding his run d in this game i only saw 1 play where williams was doubled and moved out of the hole and the rb popped one in that vacant area for a 20 plus yard gain...otherwise they pretty much ran away from him and when they did run inside weren't very effective

an awful lot to like there imo

ckparrothead
01-02-2010, 05:40 PM
I'm well aware he plays every snap and doesn't seem to tire. That's a big plus for him.

And I'm not sure it's so much a thing where he drifts off against lesser opponents, because probably the most dominant performance I've seen from him came against the Ohio Bobcats, when you would genuinely expect him to dominate.

I think he just drifts off...period. Not necessarily a rhyme or reason to it. But, you know, B.J. Raji did that too.

I'm not trying to knock the guy AT ALL. Just being honest. I do consider him very highly as you do. In fact I'm pretty sure I like him over Brian Price which says a lot when you consider how many plays Price has made in his career.

I don't necessarily like him over Marvin Austin because of Marvin's potential, but that point is moot as he's returning to school.

I would still take Ndamukong Suh and probably Gerald McCoy over Dan Williams. But, does that really qualify as criticism?

I think that I would probably take Derrick Morgan over Dan Williams. Again, that's not a knock on Williams. It's just that of the players at that position, Derrick Morgan is the only guy that has put the entire package together over a stretch of multiple games starting around middle of the season and running right through the end of the season.

He's got everything, power and explosiveness off the snap, the ability to break down, read the ball carrier and then accelerate quickly into him. He uses his hands very fluidly, sweeping blockers aside to reach the ball on stretch plays. He seals the edge, destroys the Tight End when necessary, can bend the arc on a speed rush with great first and second step quickness, protects his legs, makes himself small until his length is needed, has the athleticism to drop back. He's a heads up player, he's got his head up and his eyes on the ball at the snap instead of just focusing on his opposition.

Morgan didn't always show all of that, though. Just like Dan Williams. But to me, Morgan's one of the few guys that has shown full package potential for a position the Dolphins would want on their defense.

I think a really fun mock draft would involve taking Derrick Morgan in the first round and Demaryius "Bebe" Thomas in the second round.

But, I also consider the chances to be slim of both players making it to our pick in both rounds.

baseballcb95
01-02-2010, 05:45 PM
isnt morgan a DE? a 4-3 DE at that?

greasyObnoxious
01-02-2010, 05:49 PM
isnt morgan a DE? a 4-3 DE at that?

yeah, but most players who are converted to 3-4 OLB are

ckparrothead
01-02-2010, 05:50 PM
isnt morgan a DE? a 4-3 DE at that?

You say that like he's got a permanently etched name plate around his neck which describes the only position he's licensed to play...

hooshoops
01-02-2010, 05:55 PM
I'm well aware he plays every snap and doesn't seem to tire. That's a big plus for him.

And I'm not sure it's so much a thing where he drifts off against lesser opponents, because probably the most dominant performance I've seen from him came against the Ohio Bobcats, when you would genuinely expect him to dominate.

I think he just drifts off...period. Not necessarily a rhyme or reason to it. But, you know, B.J. Raji did that too.

I'm not trying to knock the guy AT ALL. Just being honest. I do consider him very highly as you do. In fact I'm pretty sure I like him over Brian Price which says a lot when you consider how many plays Price has made in his career.

I don't necessarily like him over Marvin Austin because of Marvin's potential, but that point is moot as he's returning to school.

I would still take Ndamukong Suh and probably Gerald McCoy over Dan Williams. But, does that really qualify as criticism?

I think that I would probably take Derrick Morgan over Dan Williams. Again, that's not a knock on Williams. It's just that of the players at that position, Derrick Morgan is the only guy that has put the entire package together over a stretch of multiple games starting around middle of the season and running right through the end of the season.

He's got everything, power and explosiveness off the snap, the ability to break down, read the ball carrier and then accelerate quickly into him. He uses his hands very fluidly, sweeping blockers aside to reach the ball on stretch plays. He seals the edge, destroys the Tight End when necessary, can bend the arc on a speed rush with great first and second step quickness, protects his legs, makes himself small until his length is needed, has the athleticism to drop back. He's a heads up player, he's got his head up and his eyes on the ball at the snap instead of just focusing on his opposition.

Morgan didn't always show all of that, though. Just like Dan Williams. But to me, Morgan's one of the few guys that has shown full package potential for a position the Dolphins would want on their defense.

I think a really fun mock draft would involve taking Derrick Morgan in the first round and Demaryius "Bebe" Thomas in the second round.

But, I also consider the chances to be slim of both players making it to our pick in both rounds.

even though i quoted you on my response everything i said wasn't really meant towards you...just some responses to observations on this particular thread people have made regarding williams...

and yes i think your criticisms and where you have dan williams relative to suh and mccoy are valid as dts...in fact i agree with them.

regarding derrick morgan slimm carries the same very very high opinion of him and i can understand why you guys do absolutely...

however i see morgan as a solb in our system and i don't necessarily think that position carries a top 12 pick value...but i agree that derrick morgan is every bit a worthy top 12 player on talent skillset and production

Lord Of Miami
01-02-2010, 05:59 PM
You say that like he's got a permanently etched name plate around his neck which describes the only position he's licensed to play...

Sure he could put on more pounds to play as a 3-4 DE but he was running a 4.9 when he went to college and has since put on like 12 pounds.

Hope you don't see him as a OLB in a 3-4 because he just to slow.Think Matt Roth after saying up for 36 hours slow........Anyways that's just my take.

But Bill and Jeff don't draft guys that slow to play OLB and that's just a fact.

baseballcb95
01-02-2010, 06:03 PM
Thats like using a first on Taylor mayes to make him a LB imo. wayy to much risk. i want Dez Bryant or CJ spiller honestly..

hooshoops
01-02-2010, 06:06 PM
this bill and jeff don't draft certain guys i think is going a bit overboard...

just last year i heard bill will never take an underclassmen in the first round...he wants 4 year guys with consistent production...well we went out and took an underclassmen cb with some character questions in vontae davis

same thing with pat white...bill will never take a 6 ft 190 lb qb from a non pro style offense...

i understand the "bill won't do this and won't do that" to an extent but i'm thinking that ireland now has his hand a lot more than people think in on who we draft especially early

that's just my thoughts

Lord Of Miami
01-02-2010, 06:15 PM
this bill and jeff don't draft certain guys i think is going a bit overboard...

just last year i heard bill will never take an underclassmen in the first round...he wants 4 year guys with consistent production...well we went out and took an underclassmen cb with some character questions in vontae davis

same thing with pat white...bill will never take a 6 ft 190 lb qb from a non pro style offense...

i understand the "bill won't do this and won't do that" to an extent but i'm thinking that ireland now has his hand a lot more than people think in on who we draft especially early

that's just my thoughts

All the OLB's drafted in Dallas were over 6'3 around 240 and all ran a 4.6

Kendall Langford is a 4.95 guy only a lil bit slower then the guy were talking about, do you think he could be a 3-4 OLB as well?

anyway Kendall couldn't because he's to slow. Just like............

It really doesn't matter if Bill pick's the guy or Jeff does because they are picking players that fit their system, and Morgan does, but only as a DE.

hooshoops
01-02-2010, 06:18 PM
All the OLB's drafted in Dallas were over 6'3 around 240 and all ran a 4.6.

Kendall Langford is a 4.95 guy only a lil bit slower then the guy were talking about, do you think he could be a 3-4 OLB as well?

anyway Kendall couldn't because he's to slow just like............

i understand the lb statement sure...i do believe that derrick morgan however could play solb and be a dominant player

i think morgan may run in the early 4.7's

we'll see and we'll see what he looks like in lb drills at the combine cause i can promise you people are gonna ask him to partake in those drills to see what kind of feet and change of direction etc he has

i personally like him more right now as a 4-3 end but i think he could transition to solb and be a very good player...we'll see

ckparrothead
01-02-2010, 06:54 PM
All the OLB's drafted in Dallas were over 6'3 around 240 and all ran a 4.6

Kendall Langford is a 4.95 guy only a lil bit slower then the guy were talking about, do you think he could be a 3-4 OLB as well?

anyway Kendall couldn't because he's to slow. Just like............

It really doesn't matter if Bill pick's the guy or Jeff does because they are picking players that fit their system, and Morgan does, but only as a DE.

If Derrick Morgan can't run faster than a 4.9 then I doubt Miami will take him to play SOLB.

But I seriously doubt that Derrick Morgan will run a 4.9 or 5.0 as you think he will.

I think he'll run in the 4.7 range.

baseballcb95
01-02-2010, 08:17 PM
CK, idk if youve posted it but do you have a cutup or cutout (w.e. it is) on Earl Thomas, good and bad?

ckparrothead
01-03-2010, 12:06 AM
Not yet. Haven't gotten to Texas much yet. Very impressive though.

Elliott 1
01-03-2010, 03:19 AM
I think he meant a dominant NT like Reggie was on the end...or somethin...lol.

I dont mind this guy, but I wouldnt go nuts for him.

Personally, I'd be doing everything we can do get Rolando McClain (send Ginn our 1st and a 3rd or 4th to Cleveland for their pick around 5 or 6).

Some might think this is crazy and they're entitled to their opinion, but after missing out on Pat Willis, this is one guy we cannot miss.

If it's another Patrick Willis you want, you will have to draft Travis Lewis who hasn't decided yet if he will declare.

McClain is a different animal from Willis.

Lewis and Willis are almost the same size and speed and play a similar syle. Lewis is 238 and runs a 4.40, Willis is 240 and ran a 4.4 something.

McClain is a big bruiser and leader type like Brian Urlacher.