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iceblizzard69
11-16-2003, 10:28 AM
Next Sunday's MLS Cup will feature the Chicago Fire going up against the San Jose Earthquakes. Luckily the Fins play on Sunday night next week so I will be able to watch the game! Landon Donovan got the Quakes into the final by scoring a golden goal in extra time to defeat the Kansas City Wizards. Chris Armas did the same for the Fire, scoring for them in extra time to beat the New England Revolution.

Prime Time
11-16-2003, 06:47 PM
I do not really care about this nor do I really care about MLS...but I will probably watch to see who scores. I'll go for SJ...who you going for Ice?

iceblizzard69
11-16-2003, 07:44 PM
Chicago will probably win. They have two pretty good strikers (in MLS standards) in Damani Ralph and Ante Razov. Ralph is a rookie and he was recently capped by Jamaica. He has a lot of talent. The Fire also have some pretty good midfielders in Beasley, Armas, etc. They also have the man, Carlos Bocanegra, in defense. :) I think they are just a better team than San Jose. The Fire won't be as good next year since Bocanegra's contract is up and he will definitely get a contract in Europe and Beasley may get signed as well (I think Beasley's contract is up at the end of next year but a bunch of teams in the past year or so have had interest), so in a way this is the Fire's last chance to win for a while.

I don't really care who wins, but I think Chicago will win. They are just simply the better team.

Prime Time
11-17-2003, 12:46 AM
Bocanegra is the man, but still not better than Pope, Sanneh, Mastroeni...and my boy Frankie Hejduk :D

Dolfan02
11-17-2003, 12:30 PM
When is the final, day and time?

I also heard on Pardon the Interruption that the MLS is planning on extending bids for expansion. That must be a good sign for the MLS, hopefully. Dude, I HOPE Miami gets a team, but this time M-I-A-M-I, and not north FT. Lauderdale but lets call it Miami Fusion, that was real stupid. Miami has a strong soccer base with all the Hispanics here. I wish they could play in the Orange bowl or Pro-player once the Marlins get their own stadium.

iceblizzard69
11-17-2003, 05:10 PM
Miami is NOT getting an MLS team. The owner of Chivas (Mexican club) is getting an expansion team, and they will play in either San Diego or Houston (most likely San Diego). MLS is also planning on having a second expansion team, and Rochester is the leading candidate. Their A-League team gets 10,000 people a game and they are very close to starting the construction of a soccer specific stadium.

Miami will not have an MLS for a long time. There are other cities (Houston, San Diego, Rochester, Cleveland, Seattle, etc.) that are more likely to get MLS teams.

iceblizzard69
11-17-2003, 05:11 PM
Originally posted by Prime Time
Bocanegra is the man, but still not better than Pope, Sanneh, Mastroeni...and my boy Frankie Hejduk :D

Ummmmmm......no.

Sanneh may never play again. He is still injured. Frankie Hejduk isn't even that good in MLS. Mastroeni and Pope are both good but no one in Europe is planning on getting either of them, while Bocanegra will play in Europe next year.

Dolfan02
11-17-2003, 07:47 PM
Originally posted by iceblizzard69
Miami is NOT getting an MLS team. The owner of Chivas (Mexican club) is getting an expansion team, and they will play in either San Diego or Houston (most likely San Diego). MLS is also planning on having a second expansion team, and Rochester is the leading candidate. Their A-League team gets 10,000 people a game and they are very close to starting the construction of a soccer specific stadium.

Miami will not have an MLS for a long time. There are other cities (Houston, San Diego, Rochester, Cleveland, Seattle, etc.) that are more likely to get MLS teams.

Gee thanks for totally squashing my hopes of getting an MLS team in my hometown. :cry: But seriously, Miami-Dade got so ripped off with the Miami Fusion, I live in a Miami suburb and I probably had to drive like 2+ hours if I wanted to see the Fusion play in north of Ft. Lauderdale, and then the audacity to call that team 'Miami Fusion'. It should have been called 'Middle of Nowhere Fusion'. And then they eliminate the team because of poor attendance. Well if they would have played in MIAMI then maybe people would have gone. Anyways I wish the best of luck to any city in the States getting a new team, I think it would great for the sport. BTW, whats the A-league? And whatever happened to Tampa Bay Mutiny?

iceblizzard69
11-17-2003, 10:29 PM
Originally posted by Dolfan02


Gee thanks for totally squashing my hopes of getting an MLS team in my hometown. :cry: But seriously, Miami-Dade got so ripped off with the Miami Fusion, I live in a Miami suburb and I probably had to drive like 2+ hours if I wanted to see the Fusion play in north of Ft. Lauderdale, and then the audacity to call that team 'Miami Fusion'. It should have been called 'Middle of Nowhere Fusion'. And then they eliminate the team because of poor attendance. Well if they would have played in MIAMI then maybe people would have gone. Anyways I wish the best of luck to any city in the States getting a new team, I think it would great for the sport. BTW, whats the A-league? And whatever happened to Tampa Bay Mutiny?

A-League is the second best league in the country behind MLS.

The problem with the Fusion is that they couldn't play in Miami. If they were able to use a stadium in Miami, then they may have not have had that problem. Instead, they didn't play in Miami, and no one showed up, so the MLS pulled the plug. The MLS was not going to keep a team around that couldn't get a stadium in Miami to play in and had no fan support. Tampa Bay got contracted at the same time Miami did.

Prime Time
11-18-2003, 12:54 AM
Sanneh is still hurt? When is he due back? Mastroeni could go to Europe...COULD! Pope is on the older side so your right about him and Hejduk has played damn good for the squad and has played in Europe...and at least he was at the WC.

iceblizzard69
11-18-2003, 02:49 PM
Originally posted by Prime Time
Sanneh is still hurt? When is he due back? Mastroeni could go to Europe...COULD! Pope is on the older side so your right about him and Hejduk has played damn good for the squad and has played in Europe...and at least he was at the WC.

No one knows when/if Sanneh will come back. I think Mastroeni has an Italian passport (which would make it a lot easier for him to play in Europe) but no one has shown interest). Hejduk was a bench warmer in Europe and he used to be decent, but now he isn't even that good in MLS. I'll take Bocanegra, one of the best players in MLS, over Hejduk. Bocanegra will definitely play in the next World Cup.

Prime Time
11-19-2003, 12:57 AM
Yes he will. Hejduk plays awesomely in all the friendlies and in all the national games. Quit hating on my boi! (I sound like Tony Kornheisser but it's fun sounding like him and Wilbon so that's why I always sya it.)

Dolfan02
12-04-2003, 04:34 AM
Originally posted by iceblizzard69
Miami is NOT getting an MLS team. The owner of Chivas (Mexican club) is getting an expansion team, and they will play in either San Diego or Houston (most likely San Diego). MLS is also planning on having a second expansion team, and Rochester is the leading candidate. Their A-League team gets 10,000 people a game and they are very close to starting the construction of a soccer specific stadium.

Miami will not have an MLS for a long time. There are other cities (Houston, San Diego, Rochester, Cleveland, Seattle, etc.) that are more likely to get MLS teams.

I've been reading up on this and found some interesting facts and also as they relate to what you said before.

The owner of Mexico's club Chivas as of right now has still not decided on the location of expansion for his new team. My guess is San Diego or San Antonio. And again, another stupid move by the MLS and its blinded ignorance. I have nothing against Hispanics since I am part Hispanic, but American soccer fans will not want to see an all-Latin team playing as their team in their city. And this is the intent of the Mexican investor as he stated. Thus, this will lead to another collaspe of an MLS team due to a lack of strong fan support in the long run.

Cleveland is the 2nd city that will be getting an expansion team for MLS. A Cleveland-based investor has shown interest and the MLS is on his tail because he owns a variety of successful investment and project management companies. The investor said he is in the works to build a soccer-specifc stadium in the Cleveland area. IMO, its a dumb move to expand to Cleveland since its very close to Columbus Crew's market, nonetheless Clevelanders are very dedicated to American football. Remember the ChampionsWorld League Tour last summer in the United States? Cleveland hosted a match between Celtic and Boca Juniors: 2 legendary international clubs. Cleveland didn't care, there was hardly anyone there. That was very bizzare compared to the large crowds in every other American host city.

Rochester is a speculation just like 10 other cities including New York City, Seattle, Sacremento, Philadelphia, Charlotte, Atlanta. By the way 10,000 average attendance is nothing. Miami Fusion's all-time attendance average was 9,400... and they were last.

Prime Time
12-04-2003, 03:41 PM
Miami needs to get a team. I did not go to any Fusion games because I did not care about MLS nor about going to games. Now I would go to the games, since I am older and really enjoy soccer.

iceblizzard69
12-04-2003, 05:12 PM
Originally posted by Dolfan02


I've been reading up on this and found some interesting facts and also as they relate to what you said before.

The owner of Mexico's club Chivas as of right now has still not decided on the location of expansion for his new team. My guess is San Diego or San Antonio. And again, another stupid move by the MLS and its blinded ignorance. I have nothing against Hispanics since I am part Hispanic, but American soccer fans will not want to see an all-Latin team playing as their team in their city. And this is the intent of the Mexican investor as he stated. Thus, this will lead to another collaspe of an MLS team due to a lack of strong fan support in the long run.

Cleveland is the 2nd city that will be getting an expansion team for MLS. A Cleveland-based investor has shown interest and the MLS is on his tail because he owns a variety of successful investment and project management companies. The investor said he is in the works to build a soccer-specifc stadium in the Cleveland area. IMO, its a dumb move to expand to Cleveland since its very close to Columbus Crew's market, nonetheless Clevelanders are very dedicated to American football. Remember the ChampionsWorld League Tour last summer in the United States? Cleveland hosted a match between Celtic and Boca Juniors: 2 legendary international clubs. Cleveland didn't care, there was hardly anyone there. That was very bizzare compared to the large crowds in every other American host city.

Rochester is a speculation just like 10 other cities including New York City, Seattle, Sacremento, Philadelphia, Charlotte, Atlanta. By the way 10,000 average attendance is nothing. Miami Fusion's all-time attendance average was 9,400... and they were last.

1. Chivas' team in the USA will NOT be all-Mexican like some people think. MLS has restrictions on internationals (each team can have 3) and an all-Mexican team is discriminatory and would be illegal under the equal employment act. You can't not hire someone due to their race. Chivas will either be in San Diego or Houston.

2. I think giving Cleveland an MLS team is dumb but they will get one because they will build a soccer specific stadium. Their excuse for not getting a lot of people for the Boca/Celtic game was that AC Milan was scheduled to play but then backed out, which is true. I don't think they should get a team because it is so close to Columbus.

3. Rochester WILL eventually get a MLS team, it just depends on when. They have already received permission and the state has decided to give money to build a stadium, but they haven't started to build it yet. I heard they have to do some archiological dig or something like that before they can build the stadium. It is wierd, but a stadium will be built, and Rochester will get an MLS team. Rochester's A-League team gets a league best 10,000 fans a game, so just imagine how many they could get for MLS. I think Rochester deserves a team more than Cleveland, but I think both cities will eventually have one.

Besides these 3, if Houston doesn't get the Chivas club, they will get a club. Bob McNair (Houston Texans owner) has shown interest in getting a MLS team and a soccer game between the USA and Mexico at Reliant Stadium sold out last May. I think Houston deserves a team. There is a strong Hispanic population and Reliant Stadium is very nice and they could play there.

Oklahoma City is also trying to get a MLS team and there is supposedly a location for a stadium. I would say Oklahoma City, Seattle, and Philadelphia are the main contenders for a MLS team after the cities I already mentioned.


Miami blew it big time with the Fusion. The MLS sees no reason to return to Miami. The Fusion had the worst attendance in the league (with the lowest ticket prices BTW) and didn't have a stadium. Miami isn't even on the radar screen in terms of getting a MLS team. Miami had potential to be a good soccer city but they blew it in every way. Partly it isn't the fans fault because of the stadium situation, but if a team can't put fans in seats, it has no reason to stick around.

Prime Time
12-04-2003, 05:32 PM
Don't forget it was located in one of the poorer, ghettoer cities. People do not have the money to go watch soccer, and If they did they would spend it on somethign else. But for the people who could go on a regular basis...it was too far of a drive to be sitting watching from an uncomfortable seat. I think we should have a new Miami team but have them play in the Orange Bowl. I think that could work. BTW, that is a stupid rule that you can only have 3 players from different nationalities on a team, you should be able to have as many as you want...not discriminate by having all one race but being able to have few players from diffrent countires because they contain talent. BTW, that rule is trying to prevent discrimination when all it is doing is create more discrimination against blacks, hispanics and other poeple not from US by not giving them a chance to play in the MLS because each team can only take 3 players from different countries, decreasing the chances of others waiting.

Dolfan02
12-04-2003, 07:16 PM
Ice... Alright well you're misinformed about some of your comments.

Let me start with Miami: There IS a chance an MLS Club will return to South Florida, I'm not saying when but most likely later than sooner. MLS Commissioner Don Garber has stated that Miami Fusion owner-operator, Horowitz, will have the rights to the next MLS team based in South Florida if it does occur. He is a multi-millionaire Miami-native who responded by saying "My kids play soccer, they love it, and it will be their dream and my goal to bring professional soccer back to S. Florida if the opportunity is there." Remember, he spent #20-million to start the Fusion, and another $5 million for renovations to Lockhart Stadium in Ft. Lauderdale. But thats the key right there. MLS and Horowitz knows that if a team returns to SoFlo, it would have to be in MIAMI, and not anywhere else including Ft. Lauderdale. Miami has one of the biggest markets in the country, and with a HUGE amount of Hispanics here in Mami, I'm sure it would be a success. Point is, they have a committed owner, but need an opportunity to play somewhere in Miami, since the fans are here. Tampa Bay NEVER had someone willing to buy out the team! From 1996-2001, no investor was interested, the MLS was always running that team, so they know thats not the best market, it was costing too much money to support that team.

Now about Chivas-USA: Jorge Vergara (Chivas-Mex owner) said he DOES want to have an all-Mexican team. He feels that his "Chivas brand" is naturally Mexican and that it could dominate the league if he brought talent from his country. But yes, the MLS has rules and restrictions on international players, but knowing the MLS, they'll tweak it for this monster. This is terrible!! Vergara is only interested in his product and not the MLS' product. This could have a devastating blow to the MLS. BTW, both sides are leaning to San Diego and to play in Qualcomm stadium as a temporary stadium solution. On the side, Mexico's America club owner wants to invest in MLS but with a "current team with a strong fan base and a soccer-specific stadium"

Oklahoma: Yes, Oklahoma looks like they will be next but not for the 2005 expansion of 2 teams. The University of Central Oklahoma, located in a suburb of Oklahoma City says it plans on building a 30,000-seat soccerr-specific stadium around their campus.

iceblizzard69
12-04-2003, 07:49 PM
Originally posted by Prime Time
Don't forget it was located in one of the poorer, ghettoer cities. People do not have the money to go watch soccer, and If they did they would spend it on somethign else. But for the people who could go on a regular basis...it was too far of a drive to be sitting watching from an uncomfortable seat. I think we should have a new Miami team but have them play in the Orange Bowl. I think that could work. BTW, that is a stupid rule that you can only have 3 players from different nationalities on a team, you should be able to have as many as you want...not discriminate by having all one race but being able to have few players from diffrent countires because they contain talent. BTW, that rule is trying to prevent discrimination when all it is doing is create more discrimination against blacks, hispanics and other poeple not from US by not giving them a chance to play in the MLS because each team can only take 3 players from different countries, decreasing the chances of others waiting.

Almost every league in the world has a rule that limits the amount of international players a team can have. La Liga, for example, only allows a team to have 4 players from non-EU nations.

BTW, this has nothing to do with blacks or hispanics as long as they are American. It has nothing to do with race, it has to do with where you have citizenship (i.e. Freddy Adu was born in Ghana but since he is an American citizen he counts as an American)

Discrimination is what Chivas does. What MLS is doing is trying to have Americans in the league. We don't say no to players for other countries, but as an American league they are trying to give Americans a chance to play in their league.

iceblizzard69
12-04-2003, 07:55 PM
Originally posted by Dolfan02
Ice... Alright well you're misinformed about some of your comments.

Let me start with Miami: There IS a chance an MLS Club will return to South Florida, I'm not saying when but most likely later than sooner. MLS Commissioner Don Garber has stated that Miami Fusion owner-operator, Horowitz, will have the rights to the next MLS team based in South Florida if it does occur. He is a multi-millionaire Miami-native who responded by saying "My kids play soccer, they love it, and it will be their dream and my goal to bring professional soccer back to S. Florida if the opportunity is there." Remember, he spent #20-million to start the Fusion, and another $5 million for renovations to Lockhart Stadium in Ft. Lauderdale. But thats the key right there. MLS and Horowitz knows that if a team returns to SoFlo, it would have to be in MIAMI, and not anywhere else including Ft. Lauderdale. Miami has one of the biggest markets in the country, and with a HUGE amount of Hispanics here in Mami, I'm sure it would be a success. Point is, they have a committed owner, but need an opportunity to play somewhere in Miami, since the fans are here. Tampa Bay NEVER had someone willing to buy out the team! From 1996-2001, no investor was interested, the MLS was always running that team, so they know thats not the best market, it was costing too much money to support that team.

Now about Chivas-USA: Jorge Vergara (Chivas-Mex owner) said he DOES want to have an all-Mexican team. He feels that his "Chivas brand" is naturally Mexican and that it could dominate the league if he brought talent from his country. But yes, the MLS has rules and restrictions on international players, but knowing the MLS, they'll tweak it for this monster. This is terrible!! Vergara is only interested in his product and not the MLS' product. This could have a devastating blow to the MLS. BTW, both sides are leaning to San Diego and to play in Qualcomm stadium as a temporary stadium solution. On the side, Mexico's America club owner wants to invest in MLS but with a "current team with a strong fan base and a soccer-specific stadium"

Oklahoma: Yes, Oklahoma looks like they will be next but not for the 2005 expansion of 2 teams. The University of Central Oklahoma, located in a suburb of Oklahoma City says it plans on building a 30,000-seat soccerr-specific stadium around their campus.

I read a lot about MLS expansion and have never once heard Miami's name come up as a potential candidate. The Fusion was a disaster, and the MLS has no reason to go to a city that didn't support MLS. The team could have been a success, but it wasn't.

The MLS bent the rules for Freddy Adu by giving him more than the maximum salary. We know the league will bend rules, but it won't allow a Mexican-only club. Besides, it violates the Equal Opportunity Act. This Vergara idiot can say whatever he wants, but when it comes down to it he will have to have some gringos :lol: on his team. If the MLS allows Vergara to do what he wants, they will lose a lot of loyal supporters.

Club America has shown interest in buying a club. They don't have xenophobic policies like Chivas so I don't have a problem with them. Both clubs will bring lots of fans to the league so it will be good for the league, but if Chivas becomes all-Mexican they will lose a lot of fans and get their asses sued for discriminatory practices.

Dolfan02
12-04-2003, 11:14 PM
Check this out:

http://www.bayarea.com/mld/mercurynews/sports/7252011.htm

Prime Time
12-05-2003, 12:34 AM
Originally posted by iceblizzard69


Almost every league in the world has a rule that limits the amount of international players a team can have. La Liga, for example, only allows a team to have 4 players from non-EU nations.

BTW, this has nothing to do with blacks or hispanics as long as they are American. It has nothing to do with race, it has to do with where you have citizenship (i.e. Freddy Adu was born in Ghana but since he is an American citizen he counts as an American)

Discrimination is what Chivas does. What MLS is doing is trying to have Americans in the league. We don't say no to players for other countries, but as an American league they are trying to give Americans a chance to play in their league.

Oh okay, thanks for clearing that up.

Prime Time
12-05-2003, 12:37 AM
Originally posted by iceblizzard69


I read a lot about MLS expansion and have never once heard Miami's name come up as a potential candidate. The Fusion was a disaster, and the MLS has no reason to go to a city that didn't support MLS. The team could have been a success, but it wasn't.

The MLS bent the rules for Freddy Adu by giving him more than the maximum salary. We know the league will bend rules, but it won't allow a Mexican-only club. Besides, it violates the Equal Opportunity Act. This Vergara idiot can say whatever he wants, but when it comes down to it he will have to have some gringos :lol: on his team. If the MLS allows Vergara to do what he wants, they will lose a lot of loyal supporters.

Club America has shown interest in buying a club. They don't have xenophobic policies like Chivas so I don't have a problem with them. Both clubs will bring lots of fans to the league so it will be good for the league, but if Chivas becomes all-Mexican they will lose a lot of fans and get their asses sued for discriminatory practices.

Yes, I think so too. I think he would discriminate against the Gringons which would cause problems. I don't want this man owning a team. I never did. When I first heard the news about this on a Morning Spanish Show called "Despierta America"...I was like WTF? No way, this will cause many problems and the possible downfall of MLS.

t_scrible
12-07-2003, 02:42 PM
I wanted the Revs to be in it for the second year in a row. Oh well, there is always next year.

Prime Time
12-08-2003, 12:51 AM
It owuld make sense...New England Revolution and your a Pats fan. :lol:

iceblizzard69
12-08-2003, 05:09 PM
Originally posted by Prime Time
It owuld make sense...New England Revolution and your a Pats fan. :lol:

The Revolution and Pats are also owned by the same person, Robert Kraft.

t_scrible
12-09-2003, 06:59 PM
yep he led 2 teams to a championship game