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View Full Version : Who would be too good to pass up?



Bahama Fin Fan
02-04-2010, 04:00 PM
I know the Fins have a plan that they will stick to, but if there is one player that drops that would throw them off their plan, who would it be? Who is the one player that would be too good to pass up and derail their plans?

ckparrothead
02-04-2010, 04:25 PM
First off, the "game plan" does entail a draft board, period. And a draft board isn't just one player, it's a bunch of players. They don't know who they'll be taking at #12. Always knowing who you will be taking means always getting an overvalued draft pick, by definition...because the only way that you could *know* the guy is going to be available would be if you *know* that the rest of the NFL is undervaluing the guy by a fair amount. And then that means you're consistently betting against the rest of the NFL knowing what they're doing, and that's a bad bet. There are lots of smart people out there that work just as hard as everyone else, have just as much a feel for this business as everyone else, and have needs at the same positions as you. You can't make your way on a claim that you can consistently identify, a month in advance, the guy that will slip through the cracks and yet be an excellent football player. That's way too hard a question, you can try and say you can consistently answer that question but it's just needlessly overconfident.

Otherwise, imagine this situation where every year you identify two months in advance the guy that you're going to go with in the draft. You gear toward him, research the heck out of him, but you're not the only guy that recognizes how good he is and he's taken 5 picks ahead of you. Well, sh-t! Now what? That's why you can't operate like that. No draft prospect is 'yours'. Everything is about a draft grade and from there you take a look at the guys available that have maybe the same grade (or very, very close) and you decide on position needs and fit for your team.

That said, at the end of the day when you see your draft grades stacked up, the laws of practicality dictate that you can see a guy or two that are a little higher on your board than you expect they are on other peoples' and so you might say there's a pretty good chance everyone above this guy will be gone but that this guy will be available when we pick, so this guy has a high percentage shot of ending up be the guy. If I were a GM and I saw that, first off I'd re-check and make sure he's worthy of the high grade. If so, then you do start to have a feel that there's a good chance this guy will end up with your club...but only in an after-the-fact, bottom-up way.

And even then you are prepared for and very expectant of the unexpected happening. That's where this question comes into play. But if you've done your job right, EVERY player is too good to pass up...depending on who else is available.

In this case I would say that Dez Bryant, C.J. Spiller and Eric Berry are three players that are too good to pass up, guys I grade higher than #12 and yet who conceivably could get to #12 in some weird scenarios.

hooshoops
02-04-2010, 04:40 PM
simple question...would you take bryant over spiller??? i would

but i'd take berry over them both

RyanWallace321
02-04-2010, 04:42 PM
were going defense

Quadfather
02-04-2010, 04:48 PM
i think derrick morgan is too good to pass up too

skipp2myloo13
02-04-2010, 05:16 PM
McClain, Berry, Spiller, Dez all fit that bill for me.

ColonelJ
02-04-2010, 05:19 PM
There are only two players I would not pass on: Gerald McCoy and Ndamukong Suh.

There are four players I could pass on but with painfull reluctance: C.J Spiller, Brandon Graham, Sean Weatherspoon, Brandon LaFell.

NRA
02-04-2010, 05:21 PM
i think BERRY would be that pic tyhey wouldnt pass up.

i am sure he is high on there draft board but like most,
they feel he will be long gone. but if he did fall....




Otherwise, imagine this situation where every year you identify two months in advance the guy that you're going to go with in the draft. You gear toward him, research the heck out of him, but you're not the only guy that recognizes how good he is and he's taken 5 picks ahead of you. Well, sh-t! Now what? That's why you can't operate like that. No draft prospect is 'yours'. Everything is about a draft grade and from there you take a look at the guys available that have maybe the same grade (or very, very close) and you decide on position needs and fit for your team.




NOW THERE YA GO CK!! theres some "guru-ish" insight.

you are corrrect. and i have been trying hard to get some of
these guys to get with that mind set. so many lock on to
ONE GUY [this year its mcclain, before it was glenn dorsey].

and they are just sick when it doesnt happen and they curse
the draft and the team brass and become withdrawn.

they lose all focus seeing only one guy as ANY possible pic.

when you have a team like the dolphins who need mcclain as
bad as 15 other players in this draft, with so many holes, it
doesnt make sense.

good thing MOST nfl teams and gm's dont set there whole draft
on one player. [see mike ditka with the saints and ricky williams]

you have to have a plan. its a MAJOR crap shoot that a clubs player
of want will be there and you have to have SEVERAL in mind. and
drafts are never so bad that there is ONLY one option [unless you
nick saban and you reach on ronnie brown believing there is NO
other talent worth the #2 over all].

i just used a lot of what you wrote in context to how so many
fans set themselves up for huge let downs falling into these
"cult like" worshipping and tunnel vision on ANY one particular
player. nfl clubs can fall into the same trap and that is the WORST
thing they could ever do!

if a person is REALLY into the draft and TRUELLY knows there
teams needs and weeknesses, you never end up with that
sort of single minded hope. there are SEVERAL players that
the finz need and are EVERY BIT WORTHY of the #12 spot
besides ROLONDO MCCLAIN.

and, if the players are gone that the club deems worthy of
the #12, the 12 spot is a real prime position to be in for
trade downs.

a draft NEVER begins or ends with one player if those following
or making the decisions are knowledgable.

skipp2myloo13
02-04-2010, 05:22 PM
There are only two players I would not pass on: Gerald McCoy and Ndamukong Suh.

There are four players I could pass on but with painfull reluctance: C.J Spiller, Brandon Graham, Sean Weatherspoon, Brandon LaFell.

As soon as you said Lafell you lost all credibility. Have you ever seen him play. He is not a number 1 or 2 IMO, doesnt have the build to play slot so i guess that makes him an NFL 4. No thanks. And no Eric Berry???

skipp2myloo13
02-04-2010, 05:24 PM
i think BERRY would be that pic tyhey wouldnt pass up.

i am sure he is high on there draft board but like most,
they feel he will be long gone. but if he did fall....





NOW THERE YA GO CK!! theres some "guru-ish" insight.

you are corrrect. and i have been trying hard to get some of
these guys to get with that mind set. so many lock on to
ONE GUY [this year its mcclain, before it was glenn dorsey].

and they are just sick when it doesnt happen and they curse
the draft and the team brass and become withdrawn.

they lose all focus seeing only one guy as ANY possible pic.

when you have a team like the dolphins who need mcclain as
bad as 15 other players in this draft, with so many holes, it
doesnt make sense.

good thing MOST nfl teams and gm's dont set there whole draft
on one player. [see mike ditka with the saints and ricky williams]

you have to have a plan. its a MAJOR crap shoot that a clubs player
of want will be there and you have to have SEVERAL in mind. and
drafts are never so bad that there is ONLY one option [unless you
nick saban and you reach on ronnie brown believing there is NO
other talent worth the #2 over all].

i just used a lot of what you wrote in context to how so many
fans set themselves up for huge let downs falling into these
"cult like" worshipping and tunnel vision on ANY one particular
player. nfl clubs can fall into the same trap and that is the WORST
thing they could ever do!

if a person is REALLY into the draft and TRUELLY knows there
teams needs and weeknesses, you never end up with that
sort of single minded hope. there are SEVERAL players that
the finz need and are EVERY BIT WORTHY of the #12 spot
besides ROLONDO MCCLAIN.

and, if the players are gone that the club deems worthy of
the #12, the 12 spot is a real prime position to be in for
trade downs.

a draft NEVER begins or ends with one player if those following
or making the decisions are knowledgable.

Who?

ColonelJ
02-04-2010, 05:40 PM
As soon as you said Lafell you lost all credibility. Have you ever seen him play. He is not a number 1 or 2 IMO, doesnt have the build to play slot so i guess that makes him an NFL 4. No thanks. And no Eric Berry???

Wow. Well, let me use your logic: "IMO" Berry is not a FS or SS, and he does not have the built to be a CB or LB or DL. Therefore, Berry can not play defense in the NFL.

Back to reality. I like Berry a lot. Add him to the list.

Morey161
02-04-2010, 05:51 PM
Berry

ckparrothead
02-04-2010, 06:00 PM
i think BERRY would be that pic tyhey wouldnt pass up.

i am sure he is high on there draft board but like most,
they feel he will be long gone. but if he did fall....





NOW THERE YA GO CK!! theres some "guru-ish" insight.

you are corrrect. and i have been trying hard to get some of
these guys to get with that mind set. so many lock on to
ONE GUY [this year its mcclain, before it was glenn dorsey].

and they are just sick when it doesnt happen and they curse
the draft and the team brass and become withdrawn.

they lose all focus seeing only one guy as ANY possible pic.

when you have a team like the dolphins who need mcclain as
bad as 15 other players in this draft, with so many holes, it
doesnt make sense.

good thing MOST nfl teams and gm's dont set there whole draft
on one player. [see mike ditka with the saints and ricky williams]

you have to have a plan. its a MAJOR crap shoot that a clubs player
of want will be there and you have to have SEVERAL in mind. and
drafts are never so bad that there is ONLY one option [unless you
nick saban and you reach on ronnie brown believing there is NO
other talent worth the #2 over all].

i just used a lot of what you wrote in context to how so many
fans set themselves up for huge let downs falling into these
"cult like" worshipping and tunnel vision on ANY one particular
player. nfl clubs can fall into the same trap and that is the WORST
thing they could ever do!

if a person is REALLY into the draft and TRUELLY knows there
teams needs and weeknesses, you never end up with that
sort of single minded hope. there are SEVERAL players that
the finz need and are EVERY BIT WORTHY of the #12 spot
besides ROLONDO MCCLAIN.

and, if the players are gone that the club deems worthy of
the #12, the 12 spot is a real prime position to be in for
trade downs.

a draft NEVER begins or ends with one player if those following
or making the decisions are knowledgable.

Well you're definitely right about how you can't have tunnel vision at #12 or #21.

However I will go ahead and disagree with you about one thing, as it relates to examples you're bringing up from 2008. That year we had the #1 overall pick. That is, quite literally, the only scenario in which you can make your decision for which guy you're getting WELL in advance.

There was nothing wrong with the idea of honing in on Glenn Dorsey way in advance...

...except that he wasn't as good as Jake Long.

And if you're yet another person that wants to come out and use the benefit of hindsight to talk about how misguided some folks (self included) were for liking Dorsey over Long so much...take a number.

hooshoops
02-04-2010, 06:08 PM
hey nra, just because guys would like to see a specific player in aqua and orange doesn't mean we've got tunnel vision...

i'd LOVE to get dez bryant but i'm fully aware that chances aren't the best he gets to #12...and he other than berry for us is who i have the highest grade for not named suh and mccoy who are better 4-3 dt fits anyways...

and i've got a specific group of guys that i think all carry higher than or top #12 grades for me...and yes rolando mcclain is one of them...

and i know even before the combine and workouts off the game tape (and to me the tape carries by far the most weight...not some week long all star event where a guy who is very inconsistent on tape looks great) exactly where the cutoff should be to trade down once certain names come off...

i'd like to think many of these other guys who are reviewing these players and not just jumping on the hot thing have a "plan b" also...at least the ones who's opinions i value i would think do...

now give me dez bryant or bust... :lol:

hooshoops
02-04-2010, 06:10 PM
b/t i thought dorsey was the goods...easily my #1 choice had we run a 4-3 as a dt

he just dominated the national championship game...and now he's being misused as an end in a 3-4 in kc...waste

Clipse
02-04-2010, 06:30 PM
Realistically? Derrick Morgan. Very slight chance but hey.

skipp2myloo13
02-04-2010, 06:32 PM
Wow. Well, let me use your logic: "IMO" Berry is not a FS or SS, and he does not have the built to be a CB or LB or DL. Therefore, Berry can not play defense in the NFL.

Back to reality. I like Berry a lot. Add him to the list.

Not for us he couldnt.

ckparrothead
02-04-2010, 06:37 PM
b/t i thought dorsey was the goods...easily my #1 choice had we run a 4-3 as a dt

he just dominated the national championship game...and now he's being misused as an end in a 3-4 in kc...waste

Actually my opinion is he's been pretty good as an End over in KC's 3-4 system, and that spot is resurrecting his stock quite a bit. An End and OLB in a 3-4 have to work pretty well off each other and it's pretty clear that on that right side, Tamba Hali and Glenn Dorsey are working pretty well together.

It's pretty insane how bad Tyson Jackson's been, though. Not convinced that Ron Edwards can hold the nose, and Corey Mays shouldn't be on the field. For that matter, not sure Demorrio Williams was meant for a 3-4.

Big mess over there all the way around. Just saying that Tamba Hali and Glenn Dorsey have been two of the few bright spots.

Ozfin77
02-04-2010, 06:44 PM
Actually my opinion is he's been pretty good as an End over in KC's 3-4 system, and that spot is resurrecting his stock quite a bit. An End and OLB in a 3-4 have to work pretty well off each other and it's pretty clear that on that right side, Tamba Hali and Glenn Dorsey are working pretty well together.

It's pretty insane how bad Tyson Jackson's been, though. Not convinced that Ron Edwards can hold the nose, and Corey Mays shouldn't be on the field. For that matter, not sure Demorrio Williams was meant for a 3-4.

Big mess over there all the way around. Just saying that Tamba Hali and Glenn Dorsey have been two of the few bright spots.

I have KC in this mock draft game that goin' on now...It's reassuring for me that I'm thinking on the same lines! :lol:

TedSlimmJr
02-04-2010, 06:50 PM
I really liked Dorsey...a lot....but not as an end in a 3-4.....I still think his best fit is inside in a 4-3 defense...

As for Jackson...never liked him all that much....in fact...I had Jarron Gilbert and Ziggy Hood above him on my board as 3-4 ends..

hooshoops
02-04-2010, 06:52 PM
Actually my opinion is he's been pretty good as an End over in KC's 3-4 system, and that spot is resurrecting his stock quite a bit. An End and OLB in a 3-4 have to work pretty well off each other and it's pretty clear that on that right side, Tamba Hali and Glenn Dorsey are working pretty well together.

It's pretty insane how bad Tyson Jackson's been, though. Not convinced that Ron Edwards can hold the nose, and Corey Mays shouldn't be on the field. For that matter, not sure Demorrio Williams was meant for a 3-4.

Big mess over there all the way around. Just saying that Tamba Hali and Glenn Dorsey have been two of the few bright spots.

i think dorsey would be more effective as a 4-3 dt...that tyson jackson pick at #3 was a joke...

i thought he was a first rounder bottom third of round 1...not top 5...

Xeticus
02-04-2010, 06:55 PM
CK if somehow Spiller, Dez Bryant, Rolando McClain and Eric Berry are all available at 12. Who would you pick and why?

finatic33
02-04-2010, 07:10 PM
I know the Fins have a plan that they will stick to, but if there is one player that drops that would throw them off their plan, who would it be? Who is the one player that would be too good to pass up and derail their plans?

maybe i'm wrong but i feel other replys here have possibly missed the point u are asking...correct me if this isn't right btw!!...say for instance we are knee deep in pro bowlers at the WR position(yip i'm having a laugh!!) Now with the no.12 pick in the draft the bpa is a wideout who is rated on our board much higher than anyone else.....do u take him bearing in mind the next bpa is in a position of need?

Bahama Fin Fan
02-04-2010, 07:39 PM
maybe i'm wrong but i feel other replys here have possibly missed the point u are asking...correct me if this isn't right btw!!...say for instance we are knee deep in pro bowlers at the WR position(yip i'm having a laugh!!) Now with the no.12 pick in the draft the bpa is a wideout who is rated on our board much higher than anyone else.....do u take him bearing in mind the next bpa is in a position of need?

That's exactly what I mean. Not zeroing in on one player. But which player, if dropped would be worth you changing your whole strategy?

dr.jake
02-04-2010, 07:41 PM
i can imagine a scenario where berry and mcclain are off the board at 12 and okong is still there.our line is pretty good but this dude is as good if not better than jake long.
if nobody enticed me with a major trade up i'd draft him in a second and move carey back to right guard.

miami71
02-04-2010, 08:30 PM
Anybody that passes on Spiller will soon regret it!

TheFloridaDude
02-04-2010, 08:56 PM
Well....there are my two guys.

If Dez Bryant is on the board at 12, we have to take him. He is for real and will be a superstar in the NFL...and we need him so bad.

BUT if he dosen't fall to 12....and this guy some how falls....forget logic and what we need THIS year, and draft

C.J. Spiller

dude is electric, and would really add a beautiful piece to our young offense.

X-Pacolypse
02-04-2010, 09:22 PM
Eric Berry.

Astrosback
02-04-2010, 09:44 PM
Eric Berry is the obvious guy but...

If he's gone and Rolando and Dez and Spiller are also gone, it would be hard to pass on...

Joe Haden if he's there.

Astrosback
02-04-2010, 09:48 PM
Well....there are my two guys.

If Dez Bryant is on the board at 12, we have to take him. He is for real and will be a superstar in the NFL...and we need him so bad.

BUT if he dosen't fall to 12....and this guy some how falls....forget logic and what we need THIS year, and draft

C.J. Spiller

dude is electric, and would really add a beautiful piece to our young offense.

I agree about Dez. I almost wish we could jump ahead of DEN to make sure we get him. But I don't see Tuna trading up for a WR. Then again, I didn't see Tuna taking Pat White in round 2 either.:crazy:

TheBow305
02-04-2010, 10:02 PM
Suh, McCoy and Berry obviously. But I think Dez and Rolando McClain are right there behind them. If any of these guys are available at #12 for some reason, we HAVE to take them.

Astrosback
02-04-2010, 10:10 PM
If by some miracle Dez and Rolando are BOTH on the board, then who would you take?

I'd go Dez and hope we get some ILBs in FA and later rounds.

That seems better than getting Rolando at 1.12 but then having to sign an Antonio Bryant and/or hope for some late round rookie.

But it's a tough call and FA would have to factor in.

Basically...

1. Dez Bryant
2. Sean Weatherspoon/Brandon Spikes

or

1. Rolando McClain
2. Demaryius Thomas/Mardy Gilyard

Astrosback
02-04-2010, 10:14 PM
Speaking of too good to pass up....

Is anyone so good we should TRADE UP?

Would anyone trade Ronnie Brown plus pick 1.12 to...

...Tampa Bay for 1.03 to draft Eric Berry.


Not sure that would be enough to move up to #3 overall but maybe if we threw in Ginn and Porter too.:thanks: Bucs!

DaytonaDolFan13
02-04-2010, 10:18 PM
BERRY-I'd

X-Pacolypse
02-04-2010, 10:20 PM
If by some miracle Dez and Rolando are BOTH on the board, then who would you take?

I'd go Dez and hope we get some ILBs in FA and later rounds.

That seems better than getting Rolando at 1.12 but then having to sign an Antonio Bryant and/or hope for some late round rookie.

But it's a tough call and FA would have to factor in.

Basically...

1. Dez Bryant
2. Sean Weatherspoon/Brandon Spikes

or

1. Rolando McClain
2. Demaryius Thomas/Mardy Gilyard

Rolando McClain. Without a moment's hesitation. I know the WR position needs a #1, but I really can't go through another season of seeing the team of Ayodele and Crowder. Especially Ayodele, he sucks.

#1dolphinsfan
02-04-2010, 10:21 PM
Berry or Bryant would be the two hardest to pass up if either one are they and we pass on one of them I would be pissed

Astrosback
02-04-2010, 10:24 PM
Rolando McClain. Without a moment's hesitation. I know the WR position needs a #1, but I really can't go through another season of seeing the team of Ayodele and Crowder. Especially Ayodele, he sucks.

Ayodele and Crowder suck but at least they don't run out of bounds to hide from contact. Seeing Ginn as WR1 for another year would be even worse than seeing Crowder/Ayodele out there again. IMO.

Astrosback
02-04-2010, 10:26 PM
Berry or Bryant would be the two hardest to pass up if either one are they and we pass on one of them I would be pissed

Realistically, I wouldn't worry about that.

What do you think about trading up for Berry? Do you think he's that special?

NorFlaFin
02-04-2010, 10:29 PM
Other then Suh ............nobody

j-off-her-doll
02-05-2010, 12:08 AM
In order:

Berry
Spiller
Bryant

It's also a little strange to me that people don't feel the need to even consider addressing the RB situation: we don't know how Brown will return, and we do know that if he doesn't return at full strength, Ricky won't do us much good. I think there's something like a 3% chance that Berry falls to us. I think there's a 75% Spiller does.

HurriPhin
02-05-2010, 12:18 AM
Would anyone trade Ronnie Brown plus pick 1.12 to...

...Tampa Bay for 1.03 to draft Eric Berry.

Holy **** that's ****in' brilliant! And then for next years draft we could trade up again but this time using Eric Berry cause we don't have a RB. :crazy:

newlownorder
02-05-2010, 01:54 AM
simple question...would you take bryant over spiller??? i would

but i'd take berry over them both


I would rank them:

1) Berry
2) Spiller
3) Bryant

newlownorder
02-05-2010, 02:28 AM
Ayodele and Crowder suck but at least they don't run out of bounds to hide from contact. Seeing Ginn as WR1 for another year would be even worse than seeing Crowder/Ayodele out there again. IMO.


That's a very good point. Here is the big dilemma this year (assuming we dont sign a RFA and give up picks) the ILB and WR UFA corps this year is VERY slim. For example, if we try and go after Dansby, do you think we are going to be the only team going after Dansby? Simpily put no. It's looking like there will be no cap this year, teams who want players and have the money can break the bank for them without worrying about cap limits (hint hint Dan Synder).

You also have to figure in the aging OLB corp we have of the unhappy Porter and the UFA Taylor, neither of which are guarteed to be playing for the phins in 2010.

Then you have to figure out the FS problem, which was a huge problem with the dolphins because many big plays occured because of Mr. Wilson.

So we may have to address FS, WR and both ILB and OLB's this offseason. Now, if we decide to not seriously address the FS position and leave Wilson there, we can expect to give up the big plays and missed tackles. If you decide to not seriously address the ILB position you are left with a medicore crew and we will be. If you decide to not seriously address the OLB position then you have to either a leave a disgrunteled Porter on the team and/or re-sign the aged Jason Taylor. Or, you could lose one or both and put in Wake and hope he learns how to play the run and cover. If you decide to not seriously address the WR position, we simply will not score many points in games and will have to rely on the defense.

But, there is good news, a position I did not address before, NT, can be a bright light. FA and the draft has good very good pospects. In UFA, we have Wilfork, Hampton, Pickett, and Franklin to name a few. If one of these teams decides to not slap the franchise tag on their player, we HAVE to jump at the oppurtunity. NT is a huge cog for the 3-4, Fergy is not getting any younger (and is a FA). If you want to upgrade that position, FA could be a great opportunity to do it.

Now, looking at UFA, there is a wayyyyy better chance to get an UFA OLB than ILB, if you look at UFA ILB, there is basically no players as of right now. So, if you want to cut ties with Porter, which seems likely, you can find a quality OLB to replace him or at least for quality depth. The WR market looks the same as the ILB market. I don't believe the dolphins will go after someone who is not a true #1 WR because we already have a young core of non-#1 WR's on this team. But really, that leaves Antonio Bryant or *gulp* TO (who I don't think is a #1 WR anymore). FS is again alot like WR or ILB, not alot of quaility to be seen. There are players who are "playable" and would be slighty better than Wilson.

We will find out more what Miami will do in the draft better when FA rolls around and we have signed some players and let some players go.

#1dolphinsfan
02-05-2010, 02:51 AM
Realistically, I wouldn't worry about that.

What do you think about trading up for Berry? Do you think he's that special?
he is special but i dont want to trade up for him

MrEd
02-05-2010, 03:54 AM
I know the Fins have a plan that they will stick to, but if there is one player that drops that would throw them off their plan, who would it be? Who is the one player that would be too good to pass up and derail their plans?

Cam Thomas at #43.

BARF
02-05-2010, 05:25 AM
the shape our team is, we cannot afford to pass up any game changer

NRA
02-05-2010, 11:01 AM
hey nra, just because guys would like to see a specific player in aqua and orange doesn't mean we've got tunnel vision...




HOOSHOOPS:

ok. show me ALL the mocks on this board and other finz boards and tell
me the ratio between how many start off with.......ROLONDO MCCLAIN
and how many dont. MASSIVLY disproportionate!

every year, many, many fans just get locked onto ONE player. its a fact.

as i said, look at the mocks. hell, theres even some that have us moving
DOWN and miraculously, once again, guess whos there for us to swoop
down on................

ROLONDO MCCLAIN!! [he's everywhere, he's everywhere!!]


CK: i thought about dropping in the line about "unless a team has
the number 1 pic", but, after thought, i dont think thats the case
anymore.

look at the finz with long. they had 3 players they had for the #1 pic.

jake and matt ryan were there top two with a 3rd as a parachute in case
the others failed AND they couldnt trade down [chris long].

the finz went to long and ryan with contract peramiters and hold out feelers.

long passed with flying colors, not hesitation like ryan had. the rest is history.

most teams with the #1 DO have more than one pic they are interetsed in at the
#1 and use the contract situation to make there decision. this is also why we
have seen players at #1 overall sign before the draft. i think teams just
prefer this now when picking #1 over all.

i think the only time a team might have absolute tunnel vision is if they have
an EXTREME need, like qb and one of the best prospects at qb just happens
to be in that draft, well, turn on the lights as there is a tunnel aproaching!!

other than that, i dont see it anymore.

and thats why i omitted the #1 overall exception in my post.

ckparrothead
02-05-2010, 11:16 AM
CK if somehow Spiller, Dez Bryant, Rolando McClain and Eric Berry are all available at 12. Who would you pick and why?

That's a tough one. First let me make myself clear that I don't believe McClain belongs in category with the other three. I know, I get lots of guff for that but that's what I feel.

Secondly, I think I'd have to go with Berry. He's a special player at a position of need, a position that has the potential to make a difference for this team, and when you really look at it a lot of great defenses have that guy in the safety position who can be a difference maker...and we haven't really had that in Miami in a long time.

ckparrothead
02-05-2010, 11:36 AM
HOOSHOOPS:

ok. show me ALL the mocks on this board and other finz boards and tell
me the ratio between how many start off with.......ROLONDO MCCLAIN
and how many dont. MASSIVLY disproportionate!

every year, many, many fans just get locked onto ONE player. its a fact.

as i said, look at the mocks. hell, theres even some that have us moving
DOWN and miraculously, once again, guess whos there for us to swoop
down on................

ROLONDO MCCLAIN!! [he's everywhere, he's everywhere!!]

I kind of agree with you there. Rolondo McClain has absolutely been the focus of the fanbase. Not the coaches/personnel guys, they don't fall into that trap, but the fans do. I cringe thinking what this place would be like if McClain was on the board and they passed on him. That said, for a while, Dez Bryant seemed to be almost as popular...I think that idea has waned a little with the popularization of the notion that you don't ever use a high pick on a receiver.



CK: i thought about dropping in the line about "unless a team has
the number 1 pic", but, after thought, i dont think thats the case
anymore.

look at the finz with long. they had 3 players they had for the #1 pic.

jake and matt ryan were there top two with a 3rd as a parachute in case
the others failed AND they couldnt trade down [chris long].

That's not really what happened. Firstly, they only held contract negotiations with Jake Long, they never made it to actual contract negotiations with anyone else. Secondly, the mandate from Bill Parcells was that if they did not get Jake's contract done within a few days of the draft, they would switch gears to Chris Long. Matt Ryan wasn't really part of it. And Chris Long was more Parcells' own brand of scare tactic forcing both Ireland AND Jake Long's people to get the deal done with urgency. Neither Miami nor Jake got a sweetheart deal out of it, the end result of the Chris Long scare tactic was just to get the thing done quickly.

hooshoops
02-05-2010, 01:12 PM
I think that idea has waned a little with the popularization of the notion that you don't ever use a high pick on a receiver.

and why not??? cause the bust rate at wr in the first round is high??? that's bs to me...if a wr is higher rated than other players at different positions on your board and you need a wr like we currently do you take him...

that wr has just as much chance to be a bust as that olb, ilb, nt, s etc when you just look at that player on an individual basis...and the longer dumb gms keep taking guys like heyward-bey in the top 10 the more afraid of taking a top rated guy at wr people on these boards will become...and the higher the bust rate at the position will continue to be...

you just gotta be sure on your evaluation of what you're getting...and for my evaluations dez bryant is well worth the pick...

ckparrothead
02-05-2010, 01:15 PM
It's just the way it is. There are a lot of people that don't believe in it.

hooshoops
02-05-2010, 01:17 PM
It's just the way it is. There are a lot of people that don't believe in it.

maybe there is but it sounds like a chicken **** way to look at things if you ask me...

phinfan33
02-07-2010, 06:22 PM
That's a tough one. First let me make myself clear that I don't believe McClain belongs in category with the other three. I know, I get lots of guff for that but that's what I feel.

Secondly, I think I'd have to go with Berry. He's a special player at a position of need, a position that has the potential to make a difference for this team, and when you really look at it a lot of great defenses have that guy in the safety position who can be a difference maker...and we haven't really had that in Miami in a long time.i agree with you on Berry CK...you just absolutely DO NOT pass up on the next Ed Reed if he's still on the board for whatever reason at #12...because if you do,you'll be kicking yourself in the *** later on down the road...if we can get Dansby in FA and an extra 2nd rd pick,then you can use those 2 2nds to get a WR like Demaryius Thomas,which will give Henne that big physical wideout he wants,as well as grab that rush OLB we badly need...and use the rest of our draft picks to get more 'backers and any other positions we wish to address...

dougfinsfan72
02-09-2010, 10:41 PM
I know the Fins have a plan that they will stick to, but if there is one player that drops that would throw them off their plan, who would it be? Who is the one player that would be too good to pass up and derail their plans?

Brandon Marshall.

No criminal charges pending and no pending NFL sanctions.

Who in the draft or possibly available in the NFL (trade, cut, or free-agency) can be as good as Marshall.

Noone not even 30 year old injury prone Boldin. I say give up the second round pick if thats all it will take.

But you know what, talent deprived Dolphins will pass and New England will make the move and he'll help take them to the Super Bowl.

Dolphins see no problem in spending a second round pick on an unproven quarterback with lots of questions about his ability to succeed in the NFL but are afraid to use a second round pick on an ALL PRO NFL WR who has proven himself.

Its this type of thinking that will keep the Dolphins from reaching the Super Bowl and make them a 1 and out playoff team.

bert
02-09-2010, 11:49 PM
That's a very good point. Here is the big dilemma this year (assuming we dont sign a RFA and give up picks) the ILB and WR UFA corps this year is VERY slim. For example, if we try and go after Dansby, do you think we are going to be the only team going after Dansby? Simpily put no. It's looking like there will be no cap this year, teams who want players and have the money can break the bank for them without worrying about cap limits (hint hint Dan Synder).

You also have to figure in the aging OLB corp we have of the unhappy Porter and the UFA Taylor, neither of which are guarteed to be playing for the phins in 2010.

Then you have to figure out the FS problem, which was a huge problem with the dolphins because many big plays occured because of Mr. Wilson.

So we may have to address FS, WR and both ILB and OLB's this offseason. Now, if we decide to not seriously address the FS position and leave Wilson there, we can expect to give up the big plays and missed tackles. If you decide to not seriously address the ILB position you are left with a medicore crew and we will be. If you decide to not seriously address the OLB position then you have to either a leave a disgrunteled Porter on the team and/or re-sign the aged Jason Taylor. Or, you could lose one or both and put in Wake and hope he learns how to play the run and cover. If you decide to not seriously address the WR position, we simply will not score many points in games and will have to rely on the defense.

But, there is good news, a position I did not address before, NT, can be a bright light. FA and the draft has good very good pospects. In UFA, we have Wilfork, Hampton, Pickett, and Franklin to name a few. If one of these teams decides to not slap the franchise tag on their player, we HAVE to jump at the oppurtunity. NT is a huge cog for the 3-4, Fergy is not getting any younger (and is a FA). If you want to upgrade that position, FA could be a great opportunity to do it.

Now, looking at UFA, there is a wayyyyy better chance to get an UFA OLB than ILB, if you look at UFA ILB, there is basically no players as of right now. So, if you want to cut ties with Porter, which seems likely, you can find a quality OLB to replace him or at least for quality depth. The WR market looks the same as the ILB market. I don't believe the dolphins will go after someone who is not a true #1 WR because we already have a young core of non-#1 WR's on this team. But really, that leaves Antonio Bryant or *gulp* TO (who I don't think is a #1 WR anymore). FS is again alot like WR or ILB, not alot of quaility to be seen. There are players who are "playable" and would be slighty better than Wilson.

We will find out more what Miami will do in the draft better when FA rolls around and we have signed some players and let some players go.
a very fair,and well written post.people need to read this again.we have more than one need .this labor crap will hold us back some this year.great post:thanks: