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FinAtic8480
04-12-2010, 10:18 PM
Fueled by an aggressive effort from his agent to get the word out regarding his pre-draft visits, Oklahoma State receiver Dez Bryant is closing strong. Though the Browns aren't interested (unless they're simply trying to hide their interest), plenty of teams are.

And there's a legitimate belief that Bryant deserves the benefit of the doubt. Despite his decision to lie to the NCAA and the possibility that he has an issue with showing up on time and an inability to acknowledge it, plenty of guys making plenty of money playing football have done far worse.

"People who know me know I'm not a bad guy," Bryant told Peter King of SI.com. "I made a mistake. I learned from it. I think it matured me. What I want these teams to know is I never committed a crime. I've never been in trouble with the police. Don't smoke weed. Don't drink. Whoever drafts me is going to get a dedicated, hard-working player.''

And so the question will be whether a team is willing to bank on the fact that Bryant knows right from wrong and, when given the choice, consistently will choose to do the right thing.

www.profootballtalk.com

lbmclean_sj
04-12-2010, 10:36 PM
hopefully this will improve our chances to trade down if we don't pick him

TXFinFan
04-12-2010, 10:37 PM
I'm actually pretty worried that he won't be there at #12.

Chubby
04-12-2010, 10:51 PM
I think it comes down to this:


Is Dez bigger upgrade to what we have at WR.
or
Is Brandon Graham a bigger upgrade to who we have starting at SOLB
or
Is Earl Thomas a bigger upgrade to who we have starting at FS

Answer that and that should be who you should root for to be drafted.

The bigger question whom do the fins feel is the bigger upgrade.

Imo, Graham would be the bigger upgrade since we have absolutely squat starting at SOLB if the season started today. Then it would be Earl then Dez.
Chubbs

TrinidadDolfan
04-12-2010, 11:49 PM
I think it comes down to this:


Is Dez bigger upgrade to what we have at WR.
or
Is Brandon Graham a bigger upgrade to who we have starting at SOLB
or
Is Earl Thomas a bigger upgrade to who we have starting at FS

Answer that and that should be who you should root for to be drafted.

The bigger question whom do the fins feel is the bigger upgrade.

Imo, Graham would be the bigger upgrade since we have absolutely squat starting at SOLB if the season started today. Then it would be Earl then Dez.
Chubbs

I like your thinking but I really think that you missed one important point:

What you have to factor in is not only the "upgrade" factor the VALUE of the position.

i.e

What is the bigger upgrade to our team?

a) A stud wide receiver
b) A stud OLB
c) A stud FS

You combine the answer to that with your "position" upgrade, and you have your answer as to who to pick when 12 rolls around.

For example, if we had the League's worst QB, FS and corner......and we were able to get one 15-year Pro Bowler at any one of thos positions, then we would all choose the QB because it more valuable an upgrade.

datruth55
04-12-2010, 11:50 PM
I think it comes down to this:


Is Dez bigger upgrade to what we have at WR.
or
Is Brandon Graham a bigger upgrade to who we have starting at SOLB
or
Is Earl Thomas a bigger upgrade to who we have starting at FS

Answer that and that should be who you should root for to be drafted.

The bigger question whom do the fins feel is the bigger upgrade.

Imo, Graham would be the bigger upgrade since we have absolutely squat starting at SOLB if the season started today. Then it would be Earl then Dez.
Chubbs
And if the answer is yes to all three?

PhinsTD
04-12-2010, 11:56 PM
The biggest problem to which is the biggest upgrade is that we have more than one draft pick.

If you want to use the same logic, the question should be, "Is the team better off with ----- or ------?"

For me, Dez, Sapp/Worilds, Major Wright/Reshad Jones is better than Graham, Taylor Price, Major Wright/Reshad Jones OR Earl Thomas, Jason Worilds/Ricky Sapp, Mike Williams.

That is really what the FO must decide. The draft is deep at 3-4 OLB, WR, S, and NT. All positions the Phins need. If it went Bryant, Sapp/Worilds, Cam Thomas, Reshad Jones I'd be pretty thrilled, though I'm on record as not being a Cam Thomas fan.

TrinidadDolfan
04-13-2010, 12:00 AM
I'm actually pretty worried that he won't be there at #12.

So am I.

I keep getting this vision of Dez running all over teams for the next 10 years......and saying "yeah, did you know that the Fins could have had him?"

The fact is, we CAN have him, IF we really want him.

I mean really, do we have a SINGLE "explosion-waiting-to-happen" person on our offense?

ckparrothead
04-13-2010, 12:10 AM
Here's the reality and this is something I don't think a lot of people pay enough attention to in the draft process.

Draft boards were mostly set back in February. There's some changing, but it's relatively minor.

When there's a headline out there that says something like "Dez Bryant makes a late push back up the draft boards"...I just have to laugh. It implies that these scout boards go up and down, up and down, up and down like roller coaster. They don't do that.

This is an entertainment business and movement is entertaining. It's "As the Draft Turns". Ooh, a guy is falling! Ooh! This guy is rising!

The only thing rising or falling is public opinion, and the only thing changing is what the scouts choose to talk about with their media toilet bowls that are on the lucky receiving end of their overactive poop chutes.

So did Dez Bryant really go tumbling down the draft boards only to make a recent comeback that sees him going in the top 12? Or was Dez Bryant pretty much just always in the top 12 and the media played the situation like a violin to keep the public hanging on every word, clicking on articles, typing massive comments and posts like this one, etc?

I'm goin with the latter.

hooshoops
04-13-2010, 12:15 AM
yep...media driven

JT-forpresident
04-13-2010, 12:16 AM
Here's the reality and this is something I don't think a lot of people pay enough attention to in the draft process.

Draft boards were mostly set back in February. There's some changing, but it's relatively minor.

When there's a headline out there that says something like "Dez Bryant makes a late push back up the draft boards"...I just have to laugh. It implies that these scout boards go up and down, up and down, up and down like roller coaster. They don't do that.

This is an entertainment business and movement is entertaining. It's "As the Draft Turns". Ooh, a guy is falling! Ooh! This guy is rising!

The only thing rising or falling is public opinion, and the only thing changing is what the scouts choose to talk about with their media toilet bowls that are on the lucky receiving end of their overactive poop chutes.

So did Dez Bryant really go tumbling down the draft boards only to make a recent comeback that sees him going in the top 12? Or was Dez Bryant pretty much just always in the top 12 and the media played the situation like a violin to keep the public hanging on every word, clicking on articles, typing massive comments and posts like this one, etc?

I'm goin with the latter.


I couldn't agree more...

and the worst part ? it works, and now the NHL is paying close attention, trying to mediatize their own draft, with some crap of their own like " Tyler or Taylor for first overrall ? " with analysts at TSN, ESPN, NHL.com constantly changing their opinion, while everyone (well, knowledgable hockey fans :lol: ) knows what a team will get with Tyler , and with Taylor...


It's all about the $$$ :rolleyes:

#1dolphinsfan
04-13-2010, 12:17 AM
I wish dez was first on our draft board

JT-forpresident
04-13-2010, 12:19 AM
I'm telling ya, the years go by, and I read less and less crap during the draft season... i used to read a lot, watch a lot of mocks, but really, there's probably 1 guy for every 1000 ones that are clueless about the draft ... and I include myself in the latter category :lol:

and then, amongst those 1000, about 900 of them don't know **** about playing and/or coaching and/or managing, a football team

phintim
04-13-2010, 12:20 AM
The last 2 drafts have been going with the safest pick to fill the largest hole not the sexy high cieling pick. We missed out on the QB that Atlanta picked up 2 years ago and possibly a a higher rated player than Vonte Davis las year. This year it really looks like OLB is staring us in the face so you kinda got to expect that is the position pick this year like a Graham, Morgan or Kindle. We really so need another pick with all of our needs in the 1st 4 rounds. 2 OLB, NT, FS and TE/WR. If Morgan is there I say they pounce than if not a possible trade back about 5-7 spots is an option where a Kindle or Graham might be available.

JT-forpresident
04-13-2010, 12:29 AM
The last 2 drafts have been going with the safest pick to fill the largest hole not the sexy high cieling pick. We missed out on the QB that Atlanta picked up 2 years ago and possibly a a higher rated player than Vonte Davis las year. This year it really looks like OLB is staring us in the face so you kinda got to expect that is the position pick this year like a Graham, Morgan or Kindle. We really so need another pick with all of our needs in the 1st 4 rounds. 2 OLB, NT, FS and TE/WR. If Morgan is there I say they pounce than if not a possible trade back about 5-7 spots is an option where a Kindle or Graham might be available.

I'm sorry but drafting brandon graham is not a safe pick... and you're talking to a big graham fan ... he's essentially played LB in a 4-3 in highschool, and played DE and some 5 technique at michigan. While i think he'd fit in well at SOLB, and many others think the same, it's not a safe assumption.

much like saying dez bryant's off-field scandals mean nothing and he'll become a #1 receiver, or saying that earl thomas' size is not an issue and he's a safe pick ...

:rolleyes:

At this point, i don't think it's about picking the safest player, we're looking at skill position players and IMO there's no bigger place where the Boom or Bust pick occur.

The phins have to cautiously gamble at #12 IMO ...

ckparrothead
04-13-2010, 12:31 AM
I couldn't agree more...

and the worst part ? it works, and now the NHL is paying close attention, trying to mediatize their own draft, with some crap of their own like " Tyler or Taylor for first overrall ? " with analysts at TSN, ESPN, NHL.com constantly changing their opinion, while everyone (well, knowledgable hockey fans :lol: ) knows what a team will get with Tyler , and with Taylor...


It's all about the $$$ :rolleyes:

Oh it's fantastic business. The NFL has turned into a year-round sport because of this and they are raking it in. The draft itself is now some three-day draftapalooza and the media coverage of it gets more unwatchably commercial every year. What else would the NFL Network, the NFL's in-house cash cow, have to produce and play from February to May if not for a steady stream of "Path to the Draft" shows, Senior Bowl practices, Combine coverage, constant draft talk on NFL Total Access?

And people don't think there's a little wagging the dog going on with all of this public interest and commercialization?

It's fine, I buy into it, I watch the Senior Bowl and Combine coverage, I watch Path to the Draft every now and then. I read draft articles. I run a draft website for crying out loud. But I retain a healthy distaste for the more obvious aspects of the process' commercialization.

lbmclean_sj
04-13-2010, 12:31 AM
Here's the reality and this is something I don't think a lot of people pay enough attention to in the draft process.

Draft boards were mostly set back in February. There's some changing, but it's relatively minor.

When there's a headline out there that says something like "Dez Bryant makes a late push back up the draft boards"...I just have to laugh. It implies that these scout boards go up and down, up and down, up and down like roller coaster. They don't do that.

This is an entertainment business and movement is entertaining. It's "As the Draft Turns". Ooh, a guy is falling! Ooh! This guy is rising!

The only thing rising or falling is public opinion, and the only thing changing is what the scouts choose to talk about with their media toilet bowls that are on the lucky receiving end of their overactive poop chutes.

So did Dez Bryant really go tumbling down the draft boards only to make a recent comeback that sees him going in the top 12? Or was Dez Bryant pretty much just always in the top 12 and the media played the situation like a violin to keep the public hanging on every word, clicking on articles, typing massive comments and posts like this one, etc?

I'm goin with the latter.

it so complicated because(or it seems to be):

- there are guys who don't know ****
- there are guys who are actually plugged into good sources
- there is so much misinformation being put out there

perhaps his stock is perception to a huge degree, but the stuff he is putting out publically has been quite disconcerting

ckparrothead
04-13-2010, 12:35 AM
I'm sorry but drafting brandon graham is not a safe pick... and you're talking to a big graham fan ... he's essentially played LB in a 4-3 in highschool, and played DE and some 5 technique at michigan. While i think he'd fit in well at SOLB, and many others think the same, it's not a safe assumption.

much like saying dez bryant's off-field scandals mean nothing and he'll become a #1 receiver, or saying that earl thomas' size is not an issue and he's a safe pick ...

:rolleyes:

At this point, i don't think it's about picking the safest player, we're looking at skill position players and IMO there's no bigger place where the Boom or Bust pick occur.

The phins have to cautiously gamble at #12 IMO ...

I think you hit on something there. That's the one thing that could never lead me to placing Graham above Bryant on my board. It's still a projection. Bryant will play the same position he's always played. Graham wouldn't.

Besides I have Graham going #10 to the Jaguars and unless I hear something real solid I don't imagine that changing by draft day. Makes too much sense for them. I have to believe a little bit in my own player ratings rather than that free-floating 'consensus' out there that keeps saying he's a guy that shouldn't go higher than 15...but the Jags run some ******* hybrid one gap 4-3/3-4 scheme with guys putting their hand in the dirt or keeping it off the dirt, all this overshifting, etc...and I happen to think that Graham would really be in his element there because his versatility could allow him to be all over the place like Adalius Thomas once was in Baltimore.

hooshoops
04-13-2010, 02:29 AM
evidently dez bryant told peter king that of the teams he's visited already since his workout 3 teams have either told him he's their pick if he makes it to them or insinuated that they were going to take him...

also said that the meeting with new england and belichick went very well...

i know dez said that he left miami thinking that we were VERY interested...

cleveland evidently cancelled their in person meeting with dez and a scout for the team told peter king that bryant is no longer in consideration for them at #7...

something tells me if he makes it to pick #10 the jags or pick #11 the broncos that the patriots will come offering #22 a 2nd round pick and a later pick to come up...belichick even though the pats need pass rush some kind of bad hasn't taken many olbs in the first round in the past...

BillParFan
04-13-2010, 02:30 AM
Besides I have Graham going #10 to the Jaguars and unless I hear something real solid I don't imagine that changing by draft day. Makes too much sense for them. I have to believe a little bit in my own player ratings rather than that free-floating 'consensus' out there that keeps saying he's a guy that shouldn't go higher than 15...but the Jags run some ******* hybrid one gap 4-3/3-4 scheme with guys putting their hand in the dirt or keeping it off the dirt, all this overshifting, etc...and I happen to think that Graham would really be in his element there because his versatility could allow him to be all over the place like Adalius Thomas once was in Baltimore.

Which of your mocks has Graham to the Jags???
CKs Mock Draft (v2.0) (http://www.universaldraft.com/2010-mock-draft/cks-mock-draft-v2-0/)

10). Dez Bryant WR Oklahoma State (Previous: WR Dez Bryant)

ckparrothead
04-13-2010, 03:17 AM
Version 3.0 which is not out yet. That one will be the final mock that is submitted at The Huddle Report.

finfan54
04-13-2010, 03:22 AM
I think it comes down to this:


Is Dez bigger upgrade to what we have at WR.
or
Is Brandon Graham a bigger upgrade to who we have starting at SOLB
or
Is Earl Thomas a bigger upgrade to who we have starting at FS

Answer that and that should be who you should root for to be drafted.

The bigger question whom do the fins feel is the bigger upgrade.

Imo, Graham would be the bigger upgrade since we have absolutely squat starting at SOLB if the season started today. Then it would be Earl then Dez.
Chubbs

Beyond that, how deep is the draft at these positions? Its fairly deep for all considering all the DE's that translate to 3-4.

72champagne
04-13-2010, 04:04 AM
we're going to take someone that can get to the quarterback first round. bank on it.

Mr. Magoo
04-13-2010, 08:11 AM
evidently dez bryant told peter king that of the teams he's visited already since his workout 3 teams have either told him he's their pick if he makes it to them or insinuated that they were going to take him...

also said that the meeting with new england and belichick went very well...

i know dez said that he left miami thinking that we were VERY interested...

cleveland evidently cancelled their in person meeting with dez and a scout for the team told peter king that bryant is no longer in consideration for them at #7...

something tells me if he makes it to pick #10 the jags or pick #11 the broncos that the patriots will come offering #22 a 2nd round pick and a later pick to come up...belichick even though the pats need pass rush some kind of bad hasn't taken many olbs in the first round in the past...

Yeah, after reading MMQB this was my thought also. Or maybe it's my nightmare, New England leaping one or two picks in front of us to grab Bryant.

When you look at his meeting schedule, though, it seems clear some teams down the board think it's possible he falls.

Thur., April 1: Dallas (Irving, Texas)
Fri., April 2: Miami (Davie, Fla.)
Sun-Mon., April 4-5: Cincinnati
Tue-Wed., April 6-7: Pittsburgh
Thur., April 8: New England (Foxboro, Mass.)
Fri.-Sat., April 9-10: Baltimore (Owings Mills, Md.)
Sun., April 11: Tampa Bay
Mon., Today: San Francisco (Santa Clara, Calif.)
Tue., April 13: St. Louis (Earth City, Mo.)
*Wed., April 14: Denver (Englewood, Colo.)

All of those teams except Denver pick after us (I'm counting Tampa and St. Louis as their second round pick), and most of them are bundled in that teens to mid twenties range, which is as far as even the most strident anti-Bryant people think he falls.

My sense of it is that these teams are sort of shocked by the talk that Bryant might fall and are scrambling to get meetings with him at the last minute in case he does. It's been clear for months, after all, that Bryant was the top receiver on the board. So clear that these teams didn't want to waste one of their 30 visits on a guy who would be long gone by their pick.

But now he might not be long gone, and they need to do their due diligence toward figuring what might be making the teams in front of them pass on him. This is something that CK pointed out that I think bears repeating -- in terms of talent evaluation, no amateur draftnik can really compare to the resources a team can throw at a player, especially when it comes to their character/background -- but teams really don't have that much more information than you and me on what other teams are thinking.

In fact, they're really a lot like all of us in this regard, on the outside looking in, scouting another team's needs, tracking Gil Brandt's indispensable pro day page, and calling in favors with college coaches and spies on who's been seen around campus (ok, so amateurs can't always do that last part).

Remember, the value of prospects isn't absolute. In a way it's like the stock market in that the perception of value itself creates value. Teams don't change their opinions of prospects at this stage of the game, but they're very conscious of not drafting a guy in the 2nd if they think they can get him in the 4th.

It's why Jeff Ireland spends the 4 or 5 days before the draft going over all of this personally, and it's why so many teams jump through so many comical hoops trying to hide their interest in certain prospects.

This very well might be why the Dolphins didn't go to Brandon Graham's pro day. They know enough people at Michigan, have scheduled a secret workout with him and want to throw off the scent. If the Dolphins draft Major Wright in the 3rd, the history of Reshad Jones and Earl Thomas' visits to Davie might well be written as one's of misdirection and subterfuge.

Frankly, the Patriots worry me. They have the ammo to do whatever they want. If the Jags are sold on Pierre Paul or Derrick Morgan it's less likely they move down, but the Broncos' #1 need is center and they could be eyeing that #22 pick to grab Pouncey.

Anyhow, I just hope the Pats realize they have some major holes on their roster, stay put, and grab Jerry Hughes.

hooshoops
04-13-2010, 07:26 PM
Yeah, after reading MMQB this was my thought also. Or maybe it's my nightmare, New England leaping one or two picks in front of us to grab Bryant.

When you look at his meeting schedule, though, it seems clear some teams down the board think it's possible he falls.

Thur., April 1: Dallas (Irving, Texas)
Fri., April 2: Miami (Davie, Fla.)
Sun-Mon., April 4-5: Cincinnati
Tue-Wed., April 6-7: Pittsburgh
Thur., April 8: New England (Foxboro, Mass.)
Fri.-Sat., April 9-10: Baltimore (Owings Mills, Md.)
Sun., April 11: Tampa Bay
Mon., Today: San Francisco (Santa Clara, Calif.)
Tue., April 13: St. Louis (Earth City, Mo.)
*Wed., April 14: Denver (Englewood, Colo.)

All of those teams except Denver pick after us (I'm counting Tampa and St. Louis as their second round pick), and most of them are bundled in that teens to mid twenties range, which is as far as even the most strident anti-Bryant people think he falls.

My sense of it is that these teams are sort of shocked by the talk that Bryant might fall and are scrambling to get meetings with him at the last minute in case he does. It's been clear for months, after all, that Bryant was the top receiver on the board. So clear that these teams didn't want to waste one of their 30 visits on a guy who would be long gone by their pick.

But now he might not be long gone, and they need to do their due diligence toward figuring what might be making the teams in front of them pass on him. This is something that CK pointed out that I think bears repeating -- in terms of talent evaluation, no amateur draftnik can really compare to the resources a team can throw at a player, especially when it comes to their character/background -- but teams really don't have that much more information than you and me on what other teams are thinking.

In fact, they're really a lot like all of us in this regard, on the outside looking in, scouting another team's needs, tracking Gil Brandt's indispensable pro day page, and calling in favors with college coaches and spies on who's been seen around campus (ok, so amateurs can't always do that last part).

Remember, the value of prospects isn't absolute. In a way it's like the stock market in that the perception of value itself creates value. Teams don't change their opinions of prospects at this stage of the game, but they're very conscious of not drafting a guy in the 2nd if they think they can get him in the 4th.

It's why Jeff Ireland spends the 4 or 5 days before the draft going over all of this personally, and it's why so many teams jump through so many comical hoops trying to hide their interest in certain prospects.

This very well might be why the Dolphins didn't go to Brandon Graham's pro day. They know enough people at Michigan, have scheduled a secret workout with him and want to throw off the scent. If the Dolphins draft Major Wright in the 3rd, the history of Reshad Jones and Earl Thomas' visits to Davie might well be written as one's of misdirection and subterfuge.

Frankly, the Patriots worry me. They have the ammo to do whatever they want. If the Jags are sold on Pierre Paul or Derrick Morgan it's less likely they move down, but the Bronco's #1 need is center and they could be eyeing that #22 pick to grab Pouncey.

Anyhow, I just hope the Pats realize they have some major holes on their roster, stay put, and grab Jerry Hughes.

good post...

i have to say though that i consider the odds that we had brandon graham for a private secret workout at michigan pretty slim...i think that's the kind of thing that would leak...look at it from the player and agent standpoint...wouldn't it behoove them to let the media etc know if they worked out for a top 12 pick team??? i think it would...i mean getting that out there could tell other teams who have interest in maybe coming up to get graham that they likely may have to consider moving into the top 10 to get him and also tells teams who haven't met with him that maybe they missed something on tape with this kid that other teams may have picked up...plus it gets the agents client buzz that he's in consideration for a top 12 pick...whether it's true or not...and buzz is exactly what the agents want for their clients...and lots of it

anyways...if new england does stay put at #22 i'd MUCH rather they take sergio kindle than a jerry hughes...much more polished pass rusher in hughes...of course will the pats take a 6 ft 1 olb like hughes???

hmmm...

Mr. Magoo
04-13-2010, 07:49 PM
good post...

i have to say though that i consider the odds that we had brandon graham for a private secret workout at michigan pretty slim...i think that's the kind of thing that would leak...look at it from the player and agent standpoint...wouldn't it behoove them to let the media etc know if they worked out for a top 12 pick team??? i think it would...i mean getting that out there could tell other teams who have interest in maybe coming up to get graham that they likely may have to consider moving into the top 10 to get him and also tells teams who haven't met with him that maybe they missed something on tape with this kid that other teams may have picked up...plus it gets the agents client buzz that he's in consideration for a top 12 pick...whether it's true or not...and buzz is exactly what the agents want for their clients...and lots of it

anyways...if new england does stay put at #22 i'd MUCH rather they take sergio kindle than a jerry hughes...much more polished pass rusher in hughes...of course will the pats take a 6 ft 1 olb like hughes???

hmmm...

Maybe it would. But we didn't see the report that Mike Nolan was privately working out Major Wright leak from Wright. A fan saw them. Last year, they privately worked out Hartline with Henne throwing him passes. That didn't come out until after the draft in a Henne interview (at least, I think that's how it got out).

My sense (not that I know personally, this is just my guess) is that the teams go to the player and say something to the effect that "we like you, we're going to come up and work you out, but if it leaks at any point that we did we'll immediately take you off our board for refusing to follow orders. We can't have people on our team like that."

That probably does the trick most of the time. I mean, why would you leak information to drive up your stock when it guarantees one team you know for a fact likes you won't take you? When this information does come out, I think you're forced to question the motives. For instance, there's a report today that a large Patriots contingent is going to Ole Miss next week to privately work out McCluster.

Is that information leaked with an eye toward us, since it's been fairly plain now for a while that we're high on McCluster and are probably considering him with our 2nd round pick? Maybe. There's a theory they did this to us last year with Pat White (they certainly did it to us a few years ago with Vernon Carey).

It's hard sometimes to tell the difference between stuff that leaks on purpose and the stuff that gets out there accidentally. The McCluster thing absolutely sounds like it's on purpose.

As for some private secret workout with Graham, to be honest I've got to admit I feel a little like I've got an aluminum foil hat on my head pushing that theory. But my point is not that it's definitely happened or is even going to happen. Only that these kinds of things do happen all the time, so let's not read too much into the fact that the Dolphins didn't go to his workout.

And let's keep in mind there's also a reasonable chance he's off the board either for reasons I've been talking a lot about (too short), or that they think he's a 4-3 or 3-4 DE. Who knows? All I know is I'd love to have him on the team assuming Berry or Bryant is gone. Get him to lose 10-15 pounds and I think you'll see quite a show out there. The guy's a freak from a speed/strength standpoint.

hooshoops
04-13-2010, 08:00 PM
i can't imagine graham is viewed as a 3-4 end...


i just don't think you can tell a guy that you're high on so high on that you're considering him at #12 "if you tell anyone about our secret/private workout we're taking you off our board"...i mean the kid if he is that high on the board is that high cause of his talent and upside etc...

i guess i can see a team saying that but i don't think that when a team gets on the clock and it gets down to brass tax that the gm is gonna say "we can't take him...he leaked our secret workout" and they just move on to another player with maybe not quite the same inhouse rating...

Mr. Magoo
04-13-2010, 08:10 PM
i can't imagine graham is viewed as a 3-4 end...


i just don't think you can tell a guy that you're high on so high on that you're considering him at #12 "if you tell anyone about our private workout we're taking you off our board"...i mean the kid if he is that high on the board is that high cause of his talent and upside etc...

i guess i can see a team saying that but i don't think that when a team gets on the clock and it gets down to brass tax that the gm is gonna say "we can't take him...he leaked our private workout" and they just move on to another player with maybe not quite the same inhouse rating...

Yeah, you might be right. I have nothing but instinct to go on there. But I just think that if you're a GM and you're talking about potentially investing millions on a guy, the fact he can't keep a secret you've explicitly asked him to keep would be a major red flag.

As for Graham, his lack of length would probably be a detriment to him being a 3-4 end but he did show up at Michigan at like 310 pounds and played for them in the 280 pound range early in his career. Glenn Dorsey, after all, is now a 3-4 end and he's only 6'2 and with 33 inch arms. I agree it isn't his best destiny but some teams could see him that way.

hooshoops
04-13-2010, 08:16 PM
glenn dorsey should be playing 4-3 dt...he's playing out of position imo...and i think graham as a 3-4 end would be also

BillParFan
04-13-2010, 08:54 PM
This very well might be why the Dolphins didn't go to Brandon Graham's pro day. They know enough people at Michigan, have scheduled a secret workout with him and want to throw off the scent. If the Dolphins draft Major Wright in the 3rd, the history of Reshad Jones and Earl Thomas' visits to Davie might well be written as one's of misdirection and subterfuge.


No need to see Grahams pro day!:crazy:

They saw him at the Senior Bowl!

finfan54
04-14-2010, 03:15 AM
Here's the reality and this is something I don't think a lot of people pay enough attention to in the draft process.

Draft boards were mostly set back in February. There's some changing, but it's relatively minor.

When there's a headline out there that says something like "Dez Bryant makes a late push back up the draft boards"...I just have to laugh. It implies that these scout boards go up and down, up and down, up and down like roller coaster. They don't do that.

This is an entertainment business and movement is entertaining. It's "As the Draft Turns". Ooh, a guy is falling! Ooh! This guy is rising!

The only thing rising or falling is public opinion, and the only thing changing is what the scouts choose to talk about with their media toilet bowls that are on the lucky receiving end of their overactive poop chutes.

So did Dez Bryant really go tumbling down the draft boards only to make a recent comeback that sees him going in the top 12? Or was Dez Bryant pretty much just always in the top 12 and the media played the situation like a violin to keep the public hanging on every word, clicking on articles, typing massive comments and posts like this one, etc?

I'm goin with the latter.

I generally agree with this CK, but teams do (rarely) change their minds about a player and go after them up high where they might not have (for instance, Seattle changes it mind on Dez and takes him). Where the real movement is is in the 2nd/3rd round for guys who were supposedly way back. And nobody knows who that is mostly and we all sit at home with a confused look at the TV screen.