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dolfan87
01-11-2004, 03:32 PM
Jay Fiedler, Brian Griese, James McKnight, Derrius Thompson, Tim Ruddy, and Sam Madison are cut?

Does that bring us under the cap? If it saves us more money to release guys after 6/1, then use that figure.

87

dolfan87
01-14-2004, 08:51 PM
Hello????? Anyone out there know any thing? lol

dolphan39
01-14-2004, 11:30 PM
Originally posted by dolfan87
Jay Fiedler, Brian Griese, James McKnight, Derrius Thompson, Tim Ruddy, and Sam Madison are cut?

Does that bring us under the cap? If it saves us more money to release guys after 6/1, then use that figure.

87 if u read this thread - http://www.finheaven.com/boardvb2/showthread.php?s=&threadid=29724 - there is some info though nothing on Jay.

Madison w/kill us in 2004 for the cap, so if at all he w/have to be cut after 6/1

dolphan39
01-14-2004, 11:31 PM
but this page tells you all the detail you need http://www.finheaven.com/seasonal/salaries.php :D

Clumpy
01-15-2004, 12:33 AM
I will break this down later


:foundout:

SMadison29
01-15-2004, 01:31 AM
Hate to refer to another site but according to this:
http://www.thefinforum.com/SiteContent/Content/SalaryCap2.htm

We only have to cut Griese, Fiedler, & Ruddy to be slightly less than a million over the cap. Restructuring Zach & Madison's contracts should save us about $5M this year plus we have the option of cutting McKnight or Thompson, Perry, & David Bowens. Our cap situation looks good.

Clumpy
01-15-2004, 01:40 AM
With the Top 51 filled, RW's salary increase of $1.1 million, and an approx. $1.25 million "cap adjustment", I have the Fins over by approx. $13 million. (This is different from the cap page because some of the bonuses listed do not count vs cap until exercised.....I will be correcting it this weekend).

You asked what the status was if the following players were released"

Fielder: saves approx. $1.8 million (the $2 million option does not presently count vs cap until exercised)

Griese: saves approx. $6.2 million

McKnight: saves approx. $1.2 million

Thompson: saves approx. $800,000

Ruddy: saves approx. $1.97 million

Madison: saves approx. $1.8 million

All above have been adjusted for top 51 rule

That totals $13.8 million and would result in about breaking even....however, you have no starting QB, no viable #2 WR, still need cap space to tender RFAs and EFAs, and for FA.

I will be finishing up my article about yer cap situation this weekend and I will explain in detail what some possible solutions are for the Fins. Hey, if Dan Marino can do it, why not me :lol:

Clumpy
01-15-2004, 01:42 AM
Originally posted by SMadison29
Hate to refer to another site but according to this:
http://www.thefinforum.com/SiteContent/Content/SalaryCap2.htm

We only have to cut Griese, Fiedler, & Ruddy to be slightly less than a million over the cap. Restructuring Zach & Madison's contracts should save us about $5M this year plus we have the option of cutting McKnight or Thompson, Perry, & David Bowens. Our cap situation looks good.


The Bills, Ravens, Cards, etc......those teams that DO NOT need to release players, restructure, ask players for pay cuts AGAIN, have good cap situations. Miami does not have a good cap situation

Merman
01-15-2004, 04:33 AM
Originally posted by clumpedplatelet

Fielder: saves approx. $1.8 million (the $2 million option does not presently count vs cap until exercised)



Care to explain that???

P4E
01-15-2004, 04:40 AM
Looking forward to your analysis, Mr. Clump.:)

Merman
01-15-2004, 04:48 AM
Originally posted by clumpedplatelet
With the Top 51 filled,

Ruddy: saves approx. $1.97 million

Madison: saves approx. $1.8 million

All above have been adjusted for top 51 rule


Until just recently we didn't have 51 players signed. I just changed for that but the numbers are not up yet.

There are two differences. I have Ruddy getting a roster bonus of $500k. Madison we have discussed before and disagree on his prorated bonus amount. As for Fiedler I would like to hear why you think his option bonus is not part of team salary until it is exercised.

SMadison29
01-15-2004, 05:00 PM
You have to account for the roster bonuses now because they count against our cap in 04 unless we release them.

Clumpy
01-16-2004, 09:14 AM
That may not be entirely true. I have learned recently that some roster bonuses do not count unless exercised while others do, like Zach Thomas' in 2004. It's a new revelation that I've learned while exploring on how Drew Bledsoe's $7 million November bonus count vs Bills cap in 2004. BTW: His option bonus does not count vs cap at this time

Clumpy
01-16-2004, 09:17 AM
Originally posted by SMadison29
You have to account for the roster bonuses now because they count against our cap in 04 unless we release them.


I do have all bonuses on the cap page counting. I'm reviewing whether a few of them count (Fielder, T. Bowens)

dolfan87
01-16-2004, 10:55 AM
Damn...ok.

Clumpy
01-16-2004, 11:02 AM
I know, I know......bonuses are where all of us "cyber-capologists" have problems :(

Phinzone
01-16-2004, 02:36 PM
Originally posted by clumpedplatelet
I know, I know......bonuses are where all of us "cyber-capologists" have problems :(

I'm still struggeling through this learning process. You were right, this will take awhile, but I think i have a good start.

The problem that I get, is how do we know how much someone is going to make? When I look at the cap page and see ______ signed for 4 millino over 4 years, where can I look to see how much he gets in year 1 as opposed to year 4? (that was just an example)

Also, on the salary page, are those the figured of the REMAINING contract? Like if Thomas was to get 7 mil over 7 years, would that page show that we owe him 3 million (granted he was getting 1 mil a year for 7 years), OR would it show 7 mil signed through 2007 even though we would have paid him 4 mil from that salary?

Clumpy
01-16-2004, 02:55 PM
4yrs-$4 million

You can go to

http://www.nflpa.org/Members/main.asp?subPage=Active+Player+Search

Change team to Miami and then type in name of player and it will give you the salary for 1 yr.....click on player's name and it then gives you that player's salary history. Add up the salaries for the yrs the deal covers. The remaining portion will be the bonuses. Signing, roster, etc.....signing bonus is amortized over the length of the deal.

It will take some time......keep at it though

I hope this isn't too basic.

Clumpy
01-16-2004, 02:56 PM
Those figures are the numbers associated with the release or trade of a player. I will answer this in more detail later.......I gotta hit the road :(

Merman
01-16-2004, 03:50 PM
Originally posted by clumpedplatelet
That may not be entirely true. I have learned recently that some roster bonuses do not count unless exercised while others do, like Zach Thomas' in 2004. It's a new revelation that I've learned while exploring on how Drew Bledsoe's $7 million November bonus count vs Bills cap in 2004. BTW: His option bonus does not count vs cap at this time

What is Bledsoe's option ??? Does he have any control of the outcome to void future years ???

Merman
01-16-2004, 07:00 PM
I just read the Beldsoe contract explanation from the offical Patriots' web site from the your Bills' link.


The overall numbers, 10 years, (2001-2010) $103 million, are for show and essentially meaningless. And according to Patriots Senior Vice President and Chief Operating Officer Andy Wasynczuk, the deal falls short of the actual value of Brett Favre's recently agreed upon contract meaning Bledsoe is not the league's highest paid quarterback.

In fact, the only part of the contract that Bledsoe is basically guaranteed is a four-year portion worth just more than $30 million, a deal similar to that of Favre, who reportedly received $10 million up front.

Bledsoe will receive $8 million up front on an option that gives the team the quarterback's rights for four years. Bledsoe also has $6 million in guaranteed injury insurance over the first three years of the contract that are included in his base pay, which climbs from $3.5 million to $8 million in the first four years.

The team has several options throughout the life of the contract. After year one of the deal, the team could pick up an option for the entire 10 years by paying Bledsoe an additional $7.2 million bonus. That bonus amount also is prorated through 2006 (the year the current collective bargaining agreement expires) and factored in to his current cap number, but it is unlikely that the team would pick up that option for the full 10 years after one season.

The next option decision for the team comes on Nov. 1 2004. That is when the team must decide to pick up the option on years 5-7 at which time it would pay Bledsoe another $7 million bonus. But note that if the CBA is extended before that time, the proration of that bonus could conceivably be spread beyond 2006.

If the team picked up that option, Bledsoe's cap number would climb into double figures during year four of the deal and then climb to upwards of $12 million. At that point, the two sides could restructuure the deal, something Dunn indicated was common after even three years of a franchise quarterback's contract. He also pointed out the unusual circumstances around the pact Bledsoe signed in 1995 because it actually got through six years before a renegotiation was agreed upon.

Under the actual terms of the deal just signed, the team also holds an option in year seven in which it can buy years 8-10 with an $8 million bonus. That decision will never have to be made because the contract will never reach that point. Bledsoe will either be gone by then or will have restructured the contract. The team also has the option to secure the entire 10 years of the deal at any of the designated option decision times.

http://flash.patriots.com/news/FullArticle.sps?id=10000&type=general

The $7 million option to extend the contract on Nov 1, 2004 to year 5-7 or the full 10 years, 2005 - 2010, does seem like the option referred to in *Side Letter 10/21/96: Sec. 4. What source indicates that the option should not be included in the 2004 cap until it's renounced???