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View Full Version : Trading down and still getting a pro ready QB



Pat-London
02-18-2012, 06:59 AM
So... we hang around at 8 or 9... if Blackmon falls, then take him. If he goes before we pick.. then trade down to middle of the 1st and an extra pick of a 2nd.. likely 3rd.

With the 1st - select Alshon Jeffries
With the 2nd - pick up Brandon Weedon

If it's an extra 2nd then go after Clemson TE - Allen. If it's a 3rd, then package one of our 3rd's and probably a 4th to move up into the 2nd and select Allen.

Thats a nice little trio right there - and 'should' be 3 starters from week 1.

In the event Blackmon falls to us at 8/9... then select him with our 1st.. Weedon with the 2nd and trade our 3rd/5th/6th to move up into the 2nd for Allen.

ticophin
02-18-2012, 10:23 AM
All depending on how we fix our pass rush hole in FA, but, say we only got Cliff Avril and Grubbs or Nicks...your scenario would complement it perfectly!!!

Kdawg954
02-18-2012, 10:33 AM
The only problem with your philosophy is Miami isn't in a position to "assume" a guy like Weeden will be there in round 2?

To be honest, I think Miami has to get aggressive in this draft if they plan on getting their QB out of it . . . which is why I kind of hope Flynn is the guy for Philbin . . . it makes it so much easier heading into the draft.

Keeno1
02-18-2012, 10:45 AM
If they want a WR that badly and trade down to take Alshon over Kendall Wright, I will vomit.

SF Dolphin Fan
02-18-2012, 12:11 PM
If they want a WR that badly and trade down to take Alshon over Kendall Wright, I will vomit.Agree. I'm not a big fan of Jeffries and I absolutely love what Kendall Wright would add to our offense.

ticophin
02-18-2012, 01:24 PM
Also, if we want Weeden, he will have to be taken with the first of those picks...We canŽt wait to adress our QB situation until the 2nd round (Manning, Flynn, Tanehill, Luck, RGIII, will have a team by then?), and he wonŽt be there anyway!!

SCOTTY
02-18-2012, 03:17 PM
So... we hang around at 8 or 9... if Blackmon falls, then take him. If he goes before we pick.. then trade down to middle of the 1st and an extra pick of a 2nd.. likely 3rd.

With the 1st - select Alshon Jeffries
With the 2nd - pick up Brandon Weedon

If it's an extra 2nd then go after Clemson TE - Allen. If it's a 3rd, then package one of our 3rd's and probably a 4th to move up into the 2nd and select Allen.

Thats a nice little trio right there - and 'should' be 3 starters from week 1.

In the event Blackmon falls to us at 8/9... then select him with our 1st.. Weedon with the 2nd and trade our 3rd/5th/6th to move up into the 2nd for Allen.

So move 8 or more spots for a third or maybe 2nd?? I'd rather not continue being the laughing stock of the nfl draft. Why would we move out of the top ten where you would get a BPA at a position and into the middle of the first for only an extra 3rd? And everyone needs to put down the WEEDon because he is not a starter from day one.

Gonzo
02-18-2012, 03:26 PM
The only problem with your philosophy is Miami isn't in a position to "assume" a guy like Weeden will be there in round 2?

To be honest, I think Miami has to get aggressive in this draft if they plan on getting their QB out of it . . . which is why I kind of hope Flynn is the guy for Philbin . . . it makes it so much easier heading into the draft.Another problem is that it requires a trade partner. If Blackmon doesn't fall, who will be there that other teams will be willing to trade up for? Upshaw...maybe? I just don't see it.

And Miami needs to get aggressive in both FA and the draft to get their QB. Enough of the hoping one falls in their laps and settling on whatever does nonsense. If Flynn is their guy, a good GM makes him a Dolphin. Same for every other potential QB outside of the unreachable Andrew Luck.

2413fanphins
02-18-2012, 03:39 PM
I agree. I'd just as soon take our qb with our first pick if we think he is our guy. A guy who you think will be your franchise qb certainly has to be worth the 8th or 9th overall pick.

I dont see blackmon falling to us. maybe to 5 or 6... but something would have to be really messed up or the stars just align perfectly to have him fall in our laps.

we will have a better idea of whats going to go down, once we sign flynn or let him go elsewhere...

Gonzo
02-18-2012, 03:53 PM
I agree. I'd just as soon take our qb with our first pick if we think he is our guy. A guy who you think will be your franchise qb certainly has to be worth the 8th or 9th overall pick.

I dont see blackmon falling to us. maybe to 5 or 6... but something would have to be really messed up or the stars just align perfectly to have him fall in our laps.

we will have a better idea of whats going to go down, once we sign flynn or let him go elsewhere...The nice thing is that 2 of our coaches have the best insight possible into two of the names mentioned. If they land Flynn, it's because Philbin thinks he can not just start, but be a franchise QB (since this would likely be the most expensive way of addressing the position). If it's Tannehill, the same could be said of Sherman's view, particularly with his experience with franchise QBs in the NFL. If they think Tannehill is the guy, get him at 8 or 9. Screw risking a trade down if he's your guy.

2413fanphins
02-18-2012, 04:24 PM
^^^^^^^ whole heartedly agree.

Roman529
02-18-2012, 05:23 PM
I think we could do a trade down with the Eagles...I think they have the 15th and 45th? pick....I would be ok trading down with them and then we would have the 15th, 42nd, and 45th overall picks....three potential starters.

2413fanphins
02-19-2012, 11:53 AM
this year, I'm all for an additional 2nd round pick. we could garner three starters if we could do this I think. I think we could grab an edge rusher at 15 if upshaws still around, a RT/RG in a guy like zietler or osemele with either 2nd round pick and a te.... I'd be delighted with something along those lines.

Finfan4lyfe91
02-19-2012, 12:36 PM
Another problem is that it requires a trade partner. If Blackmon doesn't fall, who will be there that other teams will be willing to trade up for? Upshaw...maybe? I just don't see it.

And Miami needs to get aggressive in both FA and the draft to get their QB. Enough of the hoping one falls in their laps and settling on whatever does nonsense. If Flynn is their guy, a good GM makes him a Dolphin. Same for every other potential QB outside of the unreachable Andrew Luck.

Do you think Cincinnati could be a trade partner at 17 and 21 if they want Richardson if he is still there when we pick? I think I would do that with them as long as Coples and Blackmon are gone by our pick.

jim1
02-19-2012, 01:25 PM
So move 8 or more spots for a third or maybe 2nd?? I'd rather not continue being the laughing stock of the nfl draft. Why would we move out of the top ten where you would get a BPA at a position and into the middle of the first for only an extra 3rd? And everyone needs to put down the WEEDon because he is not a starter from day one.

If Weeden didn't start from day one- there's no problem there. Personally I'd think he'll end up starting by his second year at the latest, and that would be fine. If that turned out to be the case he'd be 36 in his 7th year starting in the league, 8th year overall- personally, I'd take 6-8 years of Weeden starting at QB and playing quality foootball and consider it a rousing success.

jim1
02-19-2012, 01:35 PM
Do you think Cincinnati could be a trade partner at 17 and 21 if they want Richardson if he is still there when we pick? I think I would do that with them as long as Coples and Blackmon are gone by our pick.

I've been thinking that for some time- makes sense- at the same time I could see the Jets taking one of my 2 main guys at #16- DeCastro or Weeden.

I'd still probably do it- if the Jets want Weeden at #16 my plan is blown to smithereens anyway, and maybe you just risk losing out on DeCastro. DeCastro is a stud, bottom line. I'm not buying into the "but he's a Guard" line.


Draft I (no trade with Bengals)


1. DeCastro
2. Weeden
3. Joe Adams

Draft II (trade with Bengals)

1. (#17) DeCastro (you pray that he's still there because of the whole "but he's a guard" thing)

1. (#21) Weeden

2. Coby Fleener

3. Joe Adams

MiamiMuss
02-19-2012, 02:25 PM
Rex Ryan knows he needs a guard and wont pass on Decastro..I cant see us not taken a de/olb with our 1st pick.

Gonzo
02-19-2012, 02:52 PM
Do you think Cincinnati could be a trade partner at 17 and 21 if they want Richardson if he is still there when we pick? I think I would do that with them as long as Coples and Blackmon are gone by our pick.I don't know if any team is dumb enough to trade up for a RB.

jim1
02-19-2012, 02:56 PM
Rex Ryan knows he needs a guard and wont pass on Decastro..I cant see us not taken a de/olb with our 1st pick.

Personally I find the apparent lack of effort on the part of Coples to be disturbing. Is he a tremendous talent? Sure. But Mayock isn't the only guy questioning Coples' motor and work ethic iirc. But can this guy actually play OLB? And if he's a DE- we're doing ok there and we recently drafted Odrick and that guy has wheels. I'm more concerned with pass rushing OLB with Misi very dubious at this point.


When you consider the work ethic/motor concerns re: Coples and our need on the OL- and really, is there a safer pick than DeCastro? And I mean that in a good way. Dude looks every bit the part of a Pro Bowl and imo All- Pro Guard, and a leader who will help establish a work effort and winning mentality. Princeton could use a man like Joel, and Miami could use a man like DeCastro.

I read an interview given by Coples- he struck me as the kind of guy who wants to give the right anwers that would benefit him the most, and smelled if not reeked of incencerity imo. Maybe that's too harsh, but imo between a very talented DE and MAYBE OLB with reportedly so-so work habits and a so-so motor- betweeen that and a future all-pro Guard (imo) with no discernable weaknesses- personally I'm going for DeCastro over Coples. And maybe I look at a Jake Bequette as a 3rd down pass rushing DE in the 4th rd, or 5th if he lasts that long. I'd prefer RT in the 4th for OL depth, maybe a starter at RT if you're lucky. Maybe take a look at Phillip Blake, too.

jim1
02-19-2012, 02:58 PM
I don't know if any team is dumb enough to trade up for a RB.

Maybe, but the Saints trade up for Ingram last year and I think that most would agree that Richardson is a better prospect than Ingram was.

MiamiMuss
02-19-2012, 03:15 PM
Personally I find the apparent lack of effort on the part of Coples to be disturbing. Is he a tremendous talent? Sure. But Mayock isn't the only guy questioning Coples' motor and work ethic iirc. But can this guy actually play OLB? And if he's a DE- we're doing ok there and we recently drafted Odrick and that guy has wheels. I'm more concerned with pass rushing OLB with Misi very dubious at this point.


When you consider the work ethic/motor concerns re: Coples and our need on the OL- and really, is there a safer pick than DeCastro? And I mean that in a good way. Dude looks every bit the part of a Pro Bowl and imo All- Pro Guard, and a leader who will help establish a work effort and winning mentality. Princeton could use a man like Joel, and Miami could use a man like DeCastro.

I read an interview given by Coples- he struck me as the kind of guy who wants to give the right anwers that would benefit him the most, and smelled if not reeked of incencerity imo. Maybe that's too harsh, but imo between a very talented DE and MAYBE OLB with reportedly so-so work habits and a so-so motor- betweeen that and a future all-pro Guard (imo) with no discernable weaknesses- personally I'm going for DeCastro over Coples. And maybe I look at a Jake Bequette as a 3rd down pass rushing DE in the 4th rd, or 5th if he lasts that long. I'd prefer RT in the 4th for OL depth, maybe a starter at RT if you're lucky. Maybe take a look at Phillip Blake, too.

Not dissagreeing with this at all.Im not really talking Coples I want Upshaw.

Im all in favor of trading down but not to the point where we lose out on the guys we really need.

As from what ive seen of Decastro and that not alot im not overly impressed with him.

jim1
02-19-2012, 04:34 PM
Not dissagreeing with this at all.Im not really talking Coples I want Upshaw.

Im all in favor of trading down but not to the point where we lose out on the guys we really need.

As from what ive seen of Decastro and that not alot im not overly impressed with him.

Imo you should be. Also, it seems to me that Miami was premature in jettisoning Ninkovich, Quentin Moses and Charlie Anderson. What do we have now in reserve, the immortal Jason Trusnick?

Would have been nice if we had Ninkovich and Mark Anderson last year, me thinks.

Finfan4lyfe91
02-19-2012, 07:34 PM
Rex Ryan knows he needs a guard and wont pass on Decastro..I cant see us not taken a de/olb with our 1st pick.

And the fact that Sparano is now their OC, taking a lineman is GUARANTEED!! haha

The Confessor
02-19-2012, 07:41 PM
Maybe, but the Saints trade up for Ingram last year and I think that most would agree that Richardson is a better prospect than Ingram was.

Meh, he's better right now. This time last year, Ingram was going to be the best RB to come out since....the year before. Same story each and every year.

MiamiMuss
02-20-2012, 06:03 PM
Well you and alot of talent guys say the same thing..I saw him play 3 times this year and watched 2 of the games again and I didnt see what every1 else saw(then again im notta scout).Hes nimble on his feet but not very strong at the point of attack.

I have always been a firm believer in "it starts with a great o-line" and if hes next best thing then get him but i dont think he is.

finfan54
02-20-2012, 06:40 PM
if we get a WR it will be Brian Quick in a late round...if he is not gone by then. which he prob will be. raw but got the tools. just needs a coach.

decastro is more needed than anything IMO other than franchise QB or RT (Reiff has started to grow on me cus he is said to be able to go left and right).

We trade down, my bet is we get Tannehill. All that changes if we get Flynn in FA.

Vinny Curry intrigues me. 3rd round. Green TE in 4th.

MiamiDolphin618
02-20-2012, 06:50 PM
Personally I find the apparent lack of effort on the part of Coples to be disturbing. Is he a tremendous talent? Sure. But Mayock isn't the only guy questioning Coples' motor and work ethic iirc. But can this guy actually play OLB? And if he's a DE- we're doing ok there and we recently drafted Odrick and that guy has wheels. I'm more concerned with pass rushing OLB with Misi very dubious at this point.


When you consider the work ethic/motor concerns re: Coples and our need on the OL- and really, is there a safer pick than DeCastro? And I mean that in a good way. Dude looks every bit the part of a Pro Bowl and imo All- Pro Guard, and a leader who will help establish a work effort and winning mentality. Princeton could use a man like Joel, and Miami could use a man like DeCastro.

I read an interview given by Coples- he struck me as the kind of guy who wants to give the right anwers that would benefit him the most, and smelled if not reeked of incencerity imo. Maybe that's too harsh, but imo between a very talented DE and MAYBE OLB with reportedly so-so work habits and a so-so motor- betweeen that and a future all-pro Guard (imo) with no discernable weaknesses- personally I'm going for DeCastro over Coples. And maybe I look at a Jake Bequette as a 3rd down pass rushing DE in the 4th rd, or 5th if he lasts that long. I'd prefer RT in the 4th for OL depth, maybe a starter at RT if you're lucky. Maybe take a look at Phillip Blake, too.

I like DeCastro...and I think he will be good. However, I would take Coples or Upshaw over him. I like Upshaw a little bit more standing up...but I dont doubt Coples could make that transition. You can question Coples work ethic, but with the rookie wages in place its not like you are taking a huge risk. Coples absolutely dominated in the Sr Bowl and he knows he has to earn himself a big contract. Would I be mad if we end up with DeCastro..no, especially not in a trade down. But I would rather take the chance on Upshaw or Coples to try and help put this defense into elite territory.

MiamiDolphin618
02-20-2012, 06:54 PM
Also..since it seems we are staying in a hybrid 3-4 this doesnt really apply as much to us. But, in my opinion Kuechly is the safest impact player in the draft. The kid is going to be a cog in the middle of someone's defense for a long time.

ticophin
02-21-2012, 02:01 AM
YouŽd think, with our new staff, pretty good chance of either Tanehill or Flynn on a Fin uniform next year...