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View Full Version : Political Board Wars or Not... Just be wise



Dolfan02
02-03-2004, 12:45 AM
As I take a another quick skim through the political forum, I notice the tensions rising between some of us with our nation's political issues, and I presume its due to our upcoming presidential elections or re-election.

So, I just wanted to give some personal advice to those who do decide to vote in November for our nation's president... Make sure you vote for someone who you believe shares the right values for a better future, not only for yourself but also for the future of humanity. Vote for someone who you believe will allow you to raise children in a righteous and suitable environment. And vote for someone who you believe will delegate with wisdom and truth, for peace and goodness, and for a purity of our common and natural law. That may sound cliche or corny, but its the truth when it comes down to it.

If you care to know which way I'm going, I will be voting for Bush. Yes I am Republican, but if you ask me do I believe the Republican party is in some way superior to the Democratic party? Absolutely not. In fact, I believe the vote is a matter of picking the lesser of two evils (to some degree). I say that because my personal values are not fully represented in neither of the two major parties. And going Independent is as meaningless as claiming to be a person, but not a man or a woman. I'm not trying to offend anyone with that comment, so I apologize in advance if I did. So I write this post, in no way trying to sway your vote for one candidate or another. But yet to fully understand or investigate the values of the candidate you plan on voting for.

I hope not to expect that person who will choose to respond with a ridicule, or an attack, since I never stated a political motive. Just understand the message.

DolphinDevil28
02-03-2004, 01:34 PM
That's a good message, but I think even more important than that is to just vote, period. It's better to be a extreme left wing liberal than to not care at all (barely).
Apathy is killing this country. People, especially young ones, just don't care anymore.

CirclingWagons
02-03-2004, 01:43 PM
Originally posted by DolphinDevil28
That's a good message, but I think even more important than that is to just vote, period. It's better to be a extreme left wing liberal than to not care at all (barely).
Apathy is killing this country. People, especially young ones, just don't care anymore. Not apathy DD28, just lack of selection...it's like a grab bag full of ****, therefore, I could care less. But I respect others beliefs/votes.

PhinPhan1227
02-03-2004, 05:11 PM
Originally posted by Dolfan02
. And going Independent is as meaningless as claiming to be a person, but not a man or a woman.


I have to diagree with that comment. Where the economy and foreign policy are concerned I align with the Republicans. But where "moral" issues are concerned I align with the Dems. Would you really call somone who believes in gun control, recognition of gay marriage, and decriminalization of marijuana a Republican? On the other hand, if you've read my other posts would you call me a Democrate? I think your analogy was poor. With a few rare exceptions, everyone is clearly either male or female. Politically however, most people fall into different areas on different issues. What's more, those views change over time for many people. There's an old saying....


"If you're under 30 and a Republican you have no soul. If you're over 30 and a Democrat however you have no brain".

Dolfan02
02-03-2004, 07:32 PM
Originally posted by PhinPhan1227



I have to diagree with that comment. Where the economy and foreign policy are concerned I align with the Republicans. But where "moral" issues are concerned I align with the Dems. Would you really call somone who believes in gun control, recognition of gay marriage, and decriminalization of marijuana a Republican? On the other hand, if you've read my other posts would you call me a Democrate? I think your analogy was poor. With a few rare exceptions, everyone is clearly either male or female. Politically however, most people fall into different areas on different issues. What's more, those views change over time for many people. There's an old saying....


"If you're under 30 and a Republican you have no soul. If you're over 30 and a Democrat however you have no brain".

If you'd like to know what I meant, I'll tell you. First, the independence party throughtout the nation has no agreement on almost every single issue at hand when it comes to politics. If you note the platform from Independents in California, they are different than the ideas of Independents in Minnesota or in the Northeast. The scale is so completely varied that you would be confused of what is their main principles if you were to travel from Tennessee to Illinios. There's also so many different party sects, for example the American Independent Party and then the Independent American Party which are completely different! I understand you might argue "well an Independent has no set belief in a large group but rather an individual himself with changing ideas if be". But if thats the case, it makes the matter worse, because one Independent would not fully know his fellow mate. With no rock foundation, it would be almost impossible for the party as a WHOLE to make an impact. I was also suggesting that if you are a registered Independent and decide to vote Independence down the line on the ballot sheet (if the option is there), you would be throwing away your vote because there is no viable chance for an Independent to take office in the current day. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely 100% agree with several principles of some Independents, but lets be honest, I would be throwing away my vote, and to a group that has yet to demonstrate some consistency in its fundamentals and thoughts.

PhinPhan1227
02-03-2004, 08:52 PM
Um...registering "Independant" does not mean that you're a member of the "Independance Party". Registering Independant means that you aren't registering for ANY party. Of COURSE different Independants have different opinions. That's why they're Independants. And as for "throwing away your vote", or "not having an impact", if the only purpose of your vote is to try and back a winner, than why don't you root for whoever is the current SuperBowl champ? Miami lost, so why root for them? Your first priority should be following your conscience. That's why I think the Anybody But Bush people are so pathetic. If you draw inspiration from the prospect of defeating one candidate more than the prospect of following another, than at that point I'd say DON'T vote. Just because everyone can vote, doesn't mean everyone should. If people want to be sheep, they should be quiet sheep.

Dolfan02
02-03-2004, 10:12 PM
Originally posted by PhinPhan1227
Um...registering "Independant" does not mean that you're a member of the "Independance Party". Registering Independant means that you aren't registering for ANY party. Of COURSE different Independants have different opinions. That's why they're Independants. And as for "throwing away your vote", or "not having an impact", if the only purpose of your vote is to try and back a winner, than why don't you root for whoever is the current SuperBowl champ? Miami lost, so why root for them? Your first priority should be following your conscience. That's why I think the Anybody But Bush people are so pathetic. If you draw inspiration from the prospect of defeating one candidate more than the prospect of following another, than at that point I'd say DON'T vote. Just because everyone can vote, doesn't mean everyone should. If people want to be sheep, they should be quiet sheep.

Dude... c'mon are you serious? Ok. Let me make it clearer to you. In my both of my posts in this thread, I AM referring to the Independent Party. You misinterpreted my speech for those "independents" I see, well for the sake of arguement, let us make it clear:

Independent (upper-case i) = a member of the Independent Party
independent (lower-case i) = a person without pertaining to a party

Now, speaking of a candidate, what does an independent believe in? Who will believe him? Who will support him financially? Who will ensure his principles are carried out? And more importantly, who will know him? It sounds great on paper, "I'm not this or that, but an independent." Sounds great, but what do we really know? Nothing. Would you like an example: the almighty Jesse Ventura, former governor of Minnesota. He was nothing, an independent. Even the almighty independent had to join a party (Reform Party) because nobody knew him nor helped him finanically. Do you blame them? Why would you give lots of money to someone whom you don't know what they ultimately stand for? Now with that being said... who will an independent voter vote for? Either a Dem, Rep, Green, Reform, Independent, Labor, etc. What good is that?

Do you get the cycle now? Let me make it clearer: most members of the Independent Party were independents before they joined. Even the "singles" had to form a Party to be recognized, to address that lack of a solid foundation. So if you ask me... an "independent" is nothing but a future member of an existing Party or a new Party yet to be created.

As for the cute comparison that I should root for another NFL team, and not the "sure-loss" Miami Dolphins...

Please. Bite me.

I hope this post will make you understand the difference between a group and an independent. And since the Dolphins are a group, with lots of support (because we know who they are and I can relate), it would have made more sense for you to say I should stop rooting for Maurice Clarett or Keyshaun Johnson to win the Superbowl, and those independents without affiliation. And by the way, if you would like to know how far I go to voting for the sure-bet, I'd vote for Pat Buchanan in a heartbeat if he was running, I don't exactly consider him a likely-win, do you?

If people want to be a lion, they should grow as a cub first before becoming a lion.

PhinPhan1227
02-04-2004, 01:14 AM
Well, all I can go on is what I read, and " going Independent " does not state "Independance Party". In point of fact, there IS no "Independant Party" outside the state of California. There are individual state Independance Party's, but no national Independance party that I can find. So when you refer to THE Independant Party, what Independant PArty are you referring to? Now, the VAST majority of registered Independants are not registered for the Independant OR Independance Party's of their state, they've just registered as Independant, thus, no party affiliation. Also, registering Independant does NOT mean that you can't vote for a Dem or a Rep. You can vote in every general elelction, just not the Primaries(and in some states you can vote in the Primaries as well). And who's going to hear about a candidate that isn't a Dem or a Rep? How about Ross Perot who took 20% of the vote? That's 1 in 5. Personally, I tend to vote for Republicans on the Federal level, and Dems on the local level. Since local Dems have no impact on foreign policy, their ideology there isn't an issue. And they can only screw things up so much fiscally. On the national level, there are several planks of the GOP platform that I HATE!!! But I also think that they will keep the nation strongest both financially and militarily. Honestly, if the GOP would just follow it's fiscal policy of "mininimal interferance" when it comes to "moral" issues, I'd be able to support them whole heartedly. But it seems that while the GOP is willing to shout "stay out of our pockets" when it comes to taxes, they are more than willing to jump into peoples bedroom windows. It makes them hypocrites, but also the lesser of two evils on the Federal level.

Section126
02-04-2004, 05:44 PM
PhinPhan1227, the quote is a Churchill quote and on eof my favorites, it goes like this:

"If you are conservative and under 30, you have no heart, but if you are over 30 and are liberal, you have no brain."

PhinPhan1227
02-04-2004, 07:07 PM
Thanks...it was a rough paraphrase, but I'm glad to see I didn't butcher it completely.

themole
02-04-2004, 09:57 PM
Originally posted by PhinPhan1227
Thanks...it was a rough paraphrase, but I'm glad to see I didn't butcher it completely.

Looks like preaching to the chior to me.:D

I got this out for another purpose tonight but I'll leave it here on this forum for those who have eyes to ponder.

The Cycle of the body politic

The history of nations shows thst the cycle of the body politic slowly undergoes change.

It progresses-

From bondage to spiritual faith
From spiritual faith to courage
From courage to freedom
From freedom to abundance
From abundance to selfishness
from selfishness to complaceny
From complaceny to apathy
From apathy to fear
From fear to dependency
From dependency to bondage

This is indeed the cycle that history has proven to be true.

An uninformed populace that exercises its right to vote... is more dangerous than an informed populace that doesn't vote.

Or is it?

themole
02-04-2004, 10:20 PM
Originally posted by CirclingWagons
Not apathy DD28, just lack of selection...it's like a grab bag full of ****, therefore, I could care less. But I respect others beliefs/votes.

Wow Cw...pretty perceptive to be only 21 years old.

I'm afraid you are correct...but if you cherish your liberty or your progeny's liberty, get involved and vote for whomever it is that is "Standing Fast" by our Constitution.

Never forget that "Government makes a faithful servant...BUT...A fiery master". Thomas Jefferson quoted that...I'm not sure if it is exact but close enough.