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JCane
03-29-2012, 12:39 AM
THIS is what I've been waiting for...

Eff a 40 time. Who cares about that useless measurement.

I wanna see what Mr. Trent Richardson can bench.

This kid, as everyone of you know, is a BEAST in the weight room.

Trent says he's breaking the record. The record for a full-back is 37. Record for a running back is 32. And the overall record is 51.

Alabama Pro Day WILL BE televised on ESPN3 at 11:00AM.

Mark Barron and Courtney Upshaw will also be present.

DudeleBroski
03-29-2012, 03:20 PM
I'd love to work out with that guy

TedSlimmJr
03-29-2012, 03:24 PM
Trent put the Browns' RB coach on his back....

http://deadspin.com/5897520/

JCane
03-29-2012, 03:45 PM
EXTREMELY disappointed.

25 reps @ 225

:bobdole:

DKphin
03-29-2012, 03:49 PM
EXTREMELY disappointed.

25 reps @ 225

:bobdole:You are you nuts. 25 reps at a body weight between 225-230 is phenomenal.

ckparrothead
03-29-2012, 04:00 PM
Pedestrian numbers for Courtney Upshaw. The 4.81 in the 40 doesn't bother me but the 27.5 inch vertical does. Reports of his shuttle and cone times were bad as well.

I think he's overweight, aiming to be a 4-3 DE.

j-off-her-doll
03-29-2012, 04:06 PM
Pedestrian numbers for Courtney Upshaw. The 4.81 in the 40 doesn't bother me but the 27.5 inch vertical does. Reports of his shuttle and cone times were bad as well.

I think he's overweight, aiming to be a 4-3 DE.

Ouch. Hello 2nd Round?

ckparrothead
03-29-2012, 04:07 PM
Ouch. Hello 2nd Round?

WHAT a steal that would be at #42 overall.

Kdawg954
03-29-2012, 04:09 PM
Ouch. Hello 2nd Round?

I'd think there are some 3-4 teams at the end of the first round who would love taking Upshaw if he were to drop that far.

Kdawg954
03-29-2012, 04:11 PM
WHAT a steal that would be at #42 overall.

I wonder at what point do you consider trading up for him if you take Tannehill at 8.

I'd think you wanna get a little aggressive with Upshaw if he starts sliding like that.

TedSlimmJr
03-29-2012, 04:12 PM
Courtney looks like a JAG in drills in shorts... you have to put the pads on him. Best place for Upshaw is probably somewhere in the late teens.

He's just not the caliber of athlete a kid like Melvin Ingram is... few are.

j-off-her-doll
03-29-2012, 04:16 PM
Yeah, I'm just saying that things are kind of muddled in that 25-50 area, and when he puts up numbers like that, don't guys like Perry (who someone already had rated higher), Ingram (again some had rated higher), and Curry (Slimm is the only person I've seen rate Curry higher than Upshaw) look a lot better? I mean, unless you can explain away his performance today, it's hard to say, "**** it. I know he's the man."

In this bull**** mock my fantasy league is doing, someone drafted him to the Chargers at #18. Perry and Curry were still on the board. I don't think he'd go that high after today.

I don't think he falls to #42, because he is a player. But holy ****, what a disappointment.

j-off-her-doll
03-29-2012, 04:18 PM
Courtney looks like a JAG in drills in shorts... you have to put the pads on him. Best place for Upshaw is probably somewhere in the late teens.

He's just not the caliber of athlete a kid like Melvin Ingram is... few are.

Slimm, in your rankings, you mentioned that Upshaw and Ingram could also be 3-4 OLB's. I noticed you didn't say the same for Perry. Any particular reason? I'm just thinking that Perry is the superior athlete and could probably learn to be a better player in space.

TedSlimmJr
03-29-2012, 04:31 PM
Upshaw plays his best football from the waist up. He plays the game with his eyes up, you don't see that a lot with college defensive linemen.

Dominates with extremely powerful hands, technique, and understandings of leverage and contain. His best fit isn't going to be in a scheme that uses more of a 'spill' philosophy up front. In other words, a philosophy where you have tighter run fits in order to force the play outside. He doesn't have the speed or acceleration to consistently chase these plays to the outside. The run fits in your base defense are what's going to determine the best scenarios for most of these defensive ends first and foremost.

If I've said it once I've said it a thousand times... it's going to take a creative defensive coach with a plan to utilize some of these kids to the best of their ability. The way their coaches in college did.

There's always been a serious lack of innovation and creativity in the NFL. The few that have it brought it with them from college.

TedSlimmJr
03-29-2012, 04:45 PM
Slimm, in your rankings, you mentioned that Upshaw and Ingram could also be 3-4 OLB's. I noticed you didn't say the same for Perry. Any particular reason? I'm just thinking that Perry is the superior athlete and could probably learn to be a better player in space.


Nick Perry plays his best football from the waist down. He wins off the edge with incredible lower body explosion and some ankle flexion in order to sink his hips and run the arc... a lot like Brian Orakpo did at Texas. The problem with Perry is that he doesn't use his hands well enough yet to win if a tackle gets in position during his vertical pass sets, and is in position to sit and punch. Perry wins by exploding upfield and getting his hips even with the offensive tackle's hips... once that happens the tackle is forced to "open up", or open his hips and shoulders rather than keeping them almost parallel to the line of scrimmage.

Perry has to develope a counter move or two and learn to use his hands better. He has the lower body explosion to set up a tackle and work him over with counters once he developes one of two of them.

It's the stiffness in his hips that prevents me from viewing him as a potential 3-4 outside linebacker. He doesn't have experience dropping into coverage at USC.

Rather than say that a kid can't do something, I prefer to evaluate him off what I think his best fit is. Perry's best fit is at RDE in a 4 man front in my opinion.

j-off-her-doll
03-29-2012, 04:49 PM
Outstanding clarification. Thanks, Slimm.

hooshoops
03-29-2012, 05:31 PM
what did rich run and did barron work out...barrons a top 20 bpa all the way...rumors that the jets are eyeing him hard at pick #16 i think it is...

i don't see how upshaw gets to #42 or out of round 1 even...i'd take him all day over vinny curry...but i'm not a vinny curry guy

ckparrothead
03-29-2012, 05:39 PM
Upshaw basically has the same physical characteristics as Pernell McPhee, and I think they have some of the same on field characteristics as well, although Upshaw is more of a heads up player than McPhee was. The Ravens took McPhee in the 5th round and just had him rush the passer all day from a DT position similar to what you see with Wallace Gilberry in Kansas City who also played in Upshaw's position in Saban's defense if I'm not mistaken. McPhee didn't play in Saban's defense obviously but he played an up/down position in Manny Diaz' defense.

Upshaw would be perfect in a defense like Baltimore's as he's a versatile player. You could have him playing like a Jarret Johnson on early downs and like a Pernell McPhee on nickel downs.

Fin Thirteen
03-29-2012, 05:54 PM
I'm a big fan of Upshaw's. My favourite pass rusher and the most heads-up, cerebral player this year.

But if he was a bit of a stretch at 8 before his Combine and pro day, he's a big stretch there now. His game is not stats-based, it's about hunger, technique, high motor and anticipation, stuff doesn't come out in 3-cone drills. But there's no doubt he's failed to answer the worry that he's not quite explosive enough at the next level. I still think whoever gets him will have the best rusher of the bunch, but the margin is smaller now.

Mercilus intrigues me. I think he's destined for big things and has the character and work ethic to deliver in the pros. Haven't seen enough of Perry to have any opinion of him.

DKphin
03-29-2012, 06:27 PM
what did rich run and did barron work out...barrons a top 20 bpa all the way...rumors that the jets are eyeing him hard at pick #16 i think it is...

i don't see how upshaw gets to #42 or out of round 1 even...i'd take him all day over vinny curry...but i'm not a vinny curry guy

Barron still is recovering from postseason double hernia surgery and said he is 80 to 90 percent healthy. Upshaw had been plagued by tendinitis in a knee.

Richardson unofficially was timed in the 40-yard dash in the 4.47- to 4.52-second range at 227 pounds. Barron's times reportedly were in the 4.50- to 4.57-second range. Upshaw was timed in the 4.73- to 4.76-second range.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/story/18142277/richardson-among-alabama-prospects-to-work-out-for-nfl-heavyweights

JCane
03-29-2012, 07:35 PM
You are you nuts. 25 reps at a body weight between 225-230 is phenomenal.

These are weak numbers for a guy like Trent who is capable of benching 500+.

This is one of the most physical backs to enter the draft in years. Trent was pounding his chest about how he was going to break the record, etc.

We all expected him to do it.

hooshoops
03-29-2012, 10:16 PM
dang...barron ran very well...he locked up a top 20 pick today...looked fluid in the video i saw of drills with his drop etc...someones gonna get a hell of a player...the browns contingent left the bama po day after t rich was done working out...go ahead and put me in stone for cleveland taking him at #4...i think this puppys over and all that tannehill stuff there is just hype...upshaw looked heavy to me in the video i saw...someones told that kid to put on weight and he looked sluggish...stock down...i think he's goes no earlier than the 20's and maybe the latter half of that...tannehill in the drills i saw some balls guys were waiting on the ball to arrive or slightly behind on a few...just about everyone on path to the draft said the kids not a top 10 pick but he's getting elevated cause of need...dicey stuff...i agree with the sentiment that he doesn't validate that high a pick on tape...but like billick said need is a scary thing...

interesting that both lombardi and casserly said weeden cause of that advanced age gets into round 3...

MiamiDolphin618
03-29-2012, 10:33 PM
dang...barron ran very well...he locked up a top 20 pick today...looked fluid in the video i saw of drills with his drop etc...someones gonna get a hell of a player...the browns contingent left the bama po day after t rich was done working out...go ahead and put me in stone for cleveland taking him at #4...i think this puppys over and all that tannehill stuff there is just hype...upshaw looked heavy to me in the video i saw...someones told that kid to put on weight and he looked sluggish...stock down...i think he's goes no earlier than the 20's and maybe the latter half of that...tannehill in the drills i saw some balls guys were waiting on the ball to arrive or slightly behind on a few...just about everyone on path to the draft said the kids not a top 10 pick but he's getting elevated cause of need...dicey stuff...i agree with the sentiment that he doesn't validate that high a pick on tape...but like billick said need is a scary thing...

interesting that both lombardi and casserly said weeden cause of that advanced age gets into round 3...
Barron is going to be a really nice pick-up for someone. I think he could go as soon as Dallas, if not teams like the Jets would be lining up I think. Tannehill for me is a guy I can get down with. He is raw, and not quite ready yet. But anticipation comes with experience, and he will improve. Hes got the tools you look for, and his feet in the pocket are pretty darn impressive. I usually want to go BPA, and he wont be at 8 (at least not right now), but given his position he could have the biggest impact.

hooshoops
03-29-2012, 10:39 PM
Barron is going to be a really nice pick-up for someone. I think he could go as soon as Dallas, if not teams like the Jets would be lining up I think. Tannehill for me is a guy I can get down with. He is raw, and not quite ready yet. But anticipation comes with experience, and he will improve. Hes got the tools you look for, and his feet in the pocket are pretty darn impressive. I usually want to go BPA, and he wont be at 8 (at least not right now), but given his position he could have the biggest impact.

cowboys jets with barron...agreed...shocked if he gets by the jets...no contest b/t him and this harrison smith guy who imo is more a 3rd round value...barrons legit

as for tannehill this feels like tossing a dart at a dart board for me...i don't have a conviction but i have a lot of anxiety about him i know that...in the top 10 a lot of anxiety...can i really wait for a year while matt moore and david garrards corpse blow chunks at the position to see any return on the pick...when i could just look to 2013 with barkley and tyler wilson aaron murray and maybe the va tech qb at the top of round 1??? ehhh....worse still could i pass that class up next year cause i'm just then turning over the starting job to tannehill and not know what i have there??? my chest hurts...

MiamiDolphin618
03-29-2012, 10:44 PM
as for tannehill this feels like tossing a dart at a dart board for me...i don't have a conviction but i have a lot of anxiety about him i know that...in the top 10 a lot of anxiety
I hear yah. He is no sure thing, but Im just ready to take a leap of faith. There are some guys I def wouldnt be mad if we chose, such as Kuechly. But for me, if we take a Reiff at 8 over Tannehill I will be throwing things and ripping shots until I black out.

TheWalrus
03-29-2012, 10:48 PM
I don't see the Jets taking Barron. I mean, I see the need. But I think they're taking Reiff in the 1st. The right side of their offensive line is terrible and they just hired Sparano.

hooshoops
03-29-2012, 10:50 PM
the thing that helps me with tannehill though is that once t rich and blackmon and claiborne come off and they will in front of us other than decastro and kuechly i don't think there's anything i'd rather take the chance on...if that makes sense...and i don't think as much as i love decastro that i can stomach him with the 8th pick when i could take a qb for the future with 1st round physical abilities and terrific athleticism and upside...but kuechly...thats just tough cause thats zach thomas with better size...terrific pro player on the way

agreed though they take reiff and i will put my tv in the rack luger style...

hooshoops
03-29-2012, 10:52 PM
I don't see the Jets taking Barron. I mean, I see the need. But I think they're taking Reiff in the 1st. The right side of their offensive line is terrible and they just hired Sparano.

rex ryan was looking at him like he was a steak today...if they take a right tackle well thank you very damn much...i'd much rather face reiff than have barron earholing reggie bush and blowing up our midget wrs...

MiamiDolphin618
03-29-2012, 10:57 PM
rex ryan was looking at him like he was a steak today...if they take a right tackle well thank you very damn much...i'd much rather face reiff than have barron earholing reggie bush and blowing up our midget wrs...
Rex Ryan was probably just hungry...

MiamiDolphin618
03-29-2012, 10:58 PM
Hoops any chance you think Kendal Wright falls into late 1st/early 2nd where we could package a 3rd and move up to get him?

hooshoops
03-29-2012, 11:04 PM
Hoops any chance you think Kendal Wright falls into late 1st/early 2nd where we could package a 3rd and move up to get him?

late 1st maybe...but i think houstons in play there for him...i don't think a 3rd from #42 is enough to get you up there to #25...it might get you to #35 range...keep in mind the 1st round is all the first day teams have a chance to go back and look at their boards and assess where they have him and should he get to round 2 to offer up their 2nd and a 1st even in 2013 to come up and get that coveted first pick of day 2 #33 pick if someone slides they love...for that kid or for a coby fleener i could see it very much happening...and 3rd round compensation plus your 2nd at #42 won't sniff it

MiamiDolphin618
03-29-2012, 11:07 PM
late 1st maybe...but i think houstons in play there for him...i don't think a 3rd from #42 is enough to get you up there to #25...it might get you to #35 range...keep in mind the 1st round is all the first day teams have a chance to go back and look at their boards and assess where they have him and should he get to round 2 to offer up a 1st even in 2013 to come up and get that coveted first pick of day 2 #33 pick if someone slides they love...for that kid or for a coby fleener i could see it very much happening...and 3rd round compensation plus your 2nd at #42 won't sniff it
Thats true. For a team like us who very well may be picking early again next year I wouldnt trade that 1st next year period. Man, I love me some Wright though. I think he would fit this offense perfectly

hooshoops
03-29-2012, 11:12 PM
Thats true. For a team like us who very well may be picking early again next year I wouldnt trade that 1st next year period. Man, I love me some Wright though. I think he would fit this offense perfectly

i think he's perfect also...and if he gets past #33 i'd be trying to go get him...there's some scuttlebutt that if fleener gets to #33 and the colts they will take him and pair him with luck...which makes a lot of sense need and comfort wise for luck...but i guarantee you that phone will be ringing all day prior to the start of day 2...all day

MiamiDolphin618
03-29-2012, 11:17 PM
i think he's perfect also...and if he gets past #33 i'd be trying to go get him...there's some scuttlebutt that if fleener gets to #33 and the colts they will take him and pair him with luck...which makes a lot of sense need and comfort wise for luck...but i guarantee you that phone will be ringing all day prior to the start of day 2...all day
If Fleener makes it to 33 I think the Colts would def take him unless they are blown away. I think Fleener gets scooped up in the late first though..he is just too talented. I wouldnt mind moving up to get Wright, but I just dont see them giving up a future 1st or 2nd round pick. Philibin wants to build us through the draft, no way we are trading away high picks if thats the case. Now if we trade down in the 1st and pick up another 2nd, then that changes things a bit.

hooshoops
03-29-2012, 11:22 PM
If Fleener makes it to 33 I think the Colts would def take him unless they are blown away. I think Fleener gets scooped up in the late first though..he is just too talented. I wouldnt mind moving up to get Wright, but I just dont see them giving up a future 1st or 2nd round pick. Philibin wants to build us through the draft, no way we are trading away high picks if thats the case. Now if we trade down in the 1st and pick up another 2nd, then that changes things a bit.

i don't see trading down in play for us unless tannehill is gone in front of us and i don't see that either although kc has scheduled a private workout and i'm sure jax would be receptive with dropping from #7 to #11...so if we did trade back and tannehill was the target for us which i wholeheartedly believe he is then we have a dicey situation at #11 with kc when they come on the board...frankly if tannehills there i don't think we trade anything...i think he's taken at #8...anyways i don't see a shot in hell of us trading a future #1 or even a likely high 2nd rounder to move up in this draft...and i don't want em to either given how i think this year is gonna go for us...

i agree with you on fleener...i don't see how he ever gets by the giants at #32 if he gets there...to me adding that piece down the seam takes that giants o to a whole nother level

MiamiDolphin618
03-29-2012, 11:28 PM
i agree with you on fleener...i don't see how he ever gets by the giants at #32 if he gets there...to me adding that piece down the seam takes that giants o to a whole nother level
Yeah Giants would be a good fit for him. I think Pitt will take a long hard look. Hell I wouldnt put it past NE to swoop him up if he is BPA on their board...they have that luxury.

hooshoops
03-29-2012, 11:30 PM
Yeah Giants would be a good fit for him. I think Pitt will take a long hard look. Hell I wouldnt put it past NE to swoop him up if he is BPA on their board...they have that luxury.

agreed...on all fronts...although the pats need edge pass rushers bad...but they'll find something under a rock and get by i'm sure...and that secondary needs a lot of help

TheWalrus
03-29-2012, 11:33 PM
the thing that helps me with tannehill though is that once t rich and blackmon and claiborne come off and they will in front of us other than decastro and kuechly i don't think there's anything i'd rather take the chance on...if that makes sense...and i don't think as much as i love decastro that i can stomach him with the 8th pick when i could take a qb for the future with 1st round physical abilities and terrific athleticism and upside...but kuechly...thats just tough cause thats zach thomas with better size...terrific pro player on the way

agreed though they take reiff and i will put my tv in the rack luger style...

Not being able to take Keuchly is the price you pay for not having addressed the quarterback position satisfactorily before now. That's how I look at it.

I agree. Terrific player. I'd love having him. But all he's going to do is make your team better and therefore make it harder to acquire a franchise quarterback.

MiamiDolphin618
03-29-2012, 11:36 PM
agreed...on all fronts...although the pats need edge pass rushers bad...but they'll find something under a rock and get by i'm sure...and that secondary needs a lot of help
True but because they have Brady they usually take BPA. Plus as usual they have a ton of picks. It makes me cringe thinking about some of the ridiculous ways they use Gronk, Fleener, and Hernandez haha. I do think they will find an edge rusher early on though...they have to

hooshoops
03-29-2012, 11:38 PM
Not being able to take Keuchly is the price you pay for not having addressed the quarterback position satisfactorily before now. That's how I look at it.

I agree. Terrific player. I'd love having him. But all he's going to do is make your team better and therefore make it harder to acquire a franchise quarterback.

there's only so much better kuechly can make us with matt moore and david garrard at qb...i still think with them under center this teams a 6 game winner...but is tannehill a better pro prospect than matt barkley??? nope...better than tyler wilson??? not in my eyes...better than aaron murray??? not to me...better than the kid with poor mans cam newton physical tools at va tech??? again...i say on that upside wise is a no

TheWalrus
03-29-2012, 11:49 PM
there's only so much better kuechly can make us with matt moore and david garrard at qb...i still think with them under center this teams a 6 game winner...but is tannehill a better pro prospect than matt barkley??? nope...better than tyler wilson??? not in my eyes...better than aaron murray??? not to me...better than the kid with poor mans cam newton physical tools at va tech??? again...i say on that upside wise is a no

There's always a quarterback you can point to who might be available next year and say, "well, are they really better than that guy?"

Not a good way to look at the draft, in my opinion, for a few reasons.

1.) You haven't made a full evaluation on the other guy. Your first impression might be good, but you haven't dug in and seen the negatives on the other guy the way you have on this guy. Uneven evaluations are valueless.

2.) Next year isn't guaranteed. We're picking 8th, yet there was a point during the season we thought Dolphins had a shot at the #1 overall pick. You can't predict during the season how the season's going to end and you think you can predict what's going to happen next year? Pffft. Look at Burfict, going from a 1st round pick to undraftable in a year. Look at Cam Newton, from small school transfer to #1 overall. A year changes everything. There's always the (very small) possibility we could have a great year with mediocre QB play like the 49ers did and not have a chance to take a top QB until two years from now at the earliest. Kicking the can down the road sucks, and long term leads to sucking.

3.) Not all drafts are created equal. One year's top 10 pick is next year's late first rounder, and not because of "reaching." You only get to choose from the players available. This is sort of tied into #2.

4.) My basic advice is: figure out what you think of Tannehill. Yes or no. If it's yes, then take him. Don't head**** yourself with "value." Don't try to trade down. If it's no, then just don't take him. End of story.

PJack
03-29-2012, 11:49 PM
cowboys jets with barron...agreed...shocked if he gets by the jets...no contest b/t him and this harrison smith guy who imo is more a 3rd round value...barrons legit

as for tannehill this feels like tossing a dart at a dart board for me...i don't have a conviction but i have a lot of anxiety about him i know that...in the top 10 a lot of anxiety...can i really wait for a year while matt moore and david garrards corpse blow chunks at the position to see any return on the pick...when i could just look to 2013 with barkley and tyler wilson aaron murray and maybe the va tech qb at the top of round 1??? ehhh....worse still could i pass that class up next year cause i'm just then turning over the starting job to tannehill and not know what i have there??? my chest hurts...

It's like you are living in my mind there. I'm desperate for a QB but Tannehill is just so raw. Since we are very unlikely to be a meaningful contender this year, I think I'd prefer Keuchly (Claiborne or Blackmon if they fell) before reaching and then take our chances in what appears to be a very strong QB draft class next year. Keuchly, IMO is the most natural and instinctual MLB since Patrick Willis. It still hurts me to this day every freakin time the 49ers take the field. I've heard Coples mentioned too but I take Keuchly 100 times out of a 100 over Coples who didn't seem to play hard consistently from I lot of the things I've read.

hooshoops
03-29-2012, 11:55 PM
There's always a quarterback you can point to who might be available next year and say, "well, are they really better than that guy?"

Not a good way to look at the draft, in my opinion, for a few reasons.

1.) You haven't made a full evaluation on the other guy. Your first impression is good, but you haven't dug in and seen the negatives on the other guy the way you have on this guy. Uneven evaluations are valueless.

2.) Next year isn't guaranteed. We're picking 8th, yet there was a point we thought Dolphins had a shot at the #1. And this was a prediction made during the season. Trying to predict what's going to happen a year from now when **** like Tebow getting traded to the Jets is unthinkable until it happens a week later is folly. Not to mention, a year changes everything. Players get injured, have bad years, have great years. Look at Burfict, going from a 1st round pick to undraftable in a year. Also, there's the variability in the Dolphins. There's always the possibility we could have a great year with mediocre QB play like the 49ers did and not have a chance to take a top QB until two years from now at the earliest. Kicking the can down the road sucks, and long term leads to sucking.

3.) This is related to #2. Basically, figure out what you think of Tannehill. Yes or no. If it's yes, then take him. If it's not, then don't make it about the price. Don't try to trade down. Just don't take him. End of story.

100 percent totally agree and its what i'm trying to get away from but the football junkie in me and what my eyes tell me say we're reaching here...bottom line...says this is a reach...a dire need pick trumping what my eyes tell me...i didn't watch ryan tannehill in 2011 and say to myself i can't wait til this kids in the draft to use a top 10 pick on him...hell when they played okla st i pretty much paid all my attention on weeden...if this kid was popping off the screen i would have picked up on it...only thing i kept saying about him was he's a terrifc athlete who throws damn well on the run...i'm trying to talk myself into this...

hooshoops
03-30-2012, 12:00 AM
It's like you are living in my mind there. I'm desperate for a QB but Tannehill is just so raw. Since we are very unlikely to be a meaningful contender this year, I think I'd prefer Keuchly (Claiborne or Blackmon if they fell) before reaching and then take our chances in what appears to be a very strong QB draft class next year. Keuchly, IMO is the most natural and instinctual MLB since Patrick Willis. It still hurts me to this day every freakin time the 49ers take the field. I've heard Coples mentioned too but I take Keuchly 100 times out of a 100 over Coples who didn't seem to play hard consistently from I lot of the things I've read.

kuechlys the safe very high end pick...the problem i see for us though if this things gonna be a lot of 43 we don't have an every down 43 de...and coples is the prototype despite the risks...then again though we don't have a high end 43 mike...so

Canadi-Phin
03-30-2012, 02:20 AM
My questions with a MLB in the top 10 is it worth it? Is it good value? MLB are not QB disrupters. Not down playing MLB but there would be great tacklers in the 2nd rd who could play ten years for us making tackles. If he's not the next Ray Lewis I still have a problem with the pick. If we don't take Tannehill I think we need to go either Coples or Floyd. Both have questions marks but also have insane talent.

j-off-her-doll
03-30-2012, 01:28 PM
there's only so much better kuechly can make us with matt moore and david garrard at qb...i still think with them under center this teams a 6 game winner...but is tannehill a better pro prospect than matt barkley??? nope...better than tyler wilson??? not in my eyes...better than aaron murray??? not to me...better than the kid with poor mans cam newton physical tools at va tech??? again...i say on that upside wise is a no

I agree with all of this except for the VTech QB. Not seeing it yet with him.

But I think here's the catch. As an athlete and physical talent, and as a guy with intangibles, Tannehill matches up very well with all of those guys. I love Barkley - like him as much as I do Luck. Think he's a better pure passer than Luck. But when the Miami coaching staff (it should ultimately fall on Philbin and Co to pick their QB) looks at Tannehill vs. the guys they'd wait for next season, they have to say, 'With a year of coaching, and his talent, do we project him to be further along than any of the guys we can realistically expect to get?' And more, 'Is his upside as high, if not higher, than the potential 2013 QB's?' Given the way that this staff develops QB's. I think they'd love to get their hands on a kid with Tannehill's talent. They love grooming players; they actually know how to do it (as opposed to our previous staffs). If don't get a QB this year, I won't cry, 'The sky is falling,' Like I said, I love Barkley, really like Murray and Wilson. But I don't think you pass on Tannehill to wait on them. I'd pass on Weeden to wait on them.

Kdawg954
03-30-2012, 01:35 PM
I agree with all of this except for the VTech QB. Not seeing it yet with him.

But I think here's the catch. As an athlete and physical talent, and as a guy with intangibles, Tannehill matches up very well with all of those guys. I love Barkley - like him as much as I do Luck. Think he's a better pure passer than Luck. But when the Miami coaching staff (it should ultimately fall on Philbin and Co to pick their QB) looks at Tannehill vs. the guys they'd wait for next season, they have to say, 'With a year of coaching, and his talent, do we project him to be further along than any of the guys we can realistically expect to get?' And more, 'Is his upside as high, if not higher, than the potential 2013 QB's?' Given the way that this staff develops QB's. I think they'd love to get their hands on a kid with Tannehill's talent. They love grooming players; they actually know how to do it (as opposed to our previous staffs). If don't get a QB this year, I won't cry, 'The sky is falling,' Like I said, I love Barkley, really like Murray and Wilson. But I don't think you pass on Tannehill to wait on them. I'd pass on Weeden to wait on them.

I agree with this thought process. If Tannehill is there at 8 and you like him, you take him . . . I just don't trust anything being spit right now, hell I'm not even sure if we "love" him like many think we do. We may, but I'll feel more confidence when we are on the clock, Tannehill is still on the board and we make him our pick.

Kdawg954
03-30-2012, 01:39 PM
My questions with a MLB in the top 10 is it worth it? Is it good value? MLB are not QB disrupters. Not down playing MLB but there would be great tacklers in the 2nd rd who could play ten years for us making tackles. If he's not the next Ray Lewis I still have a problem with the pick. If we don't take Tannehill I think we need to go either Coples or Floyd. Both have questions marks but also have insane talent.

Not really, not when you have a void at playmaker on both sides of the ball and a position like MLB much easier to fill. To take him at 8, anything less than a consistent pro bowler would be a disappointment. Solid MLB's can be had later, I think taking one at 8 is preaching the same philosophy that the Parcells regime tends to preach.

This isn't a knock on him at all, but pass rusher, WR, DB and QB all make more sense to me.

j-off-her-doll
03-30-2012, 02:09 PM
I agree with this thought process. If Tannehill is there at 8 and you like him, you take him . . . I just don't trust anything being spit right now, hell I'm not even sure if we "love" him like many think we do. We may, but I'll feel more confidence when we are on the clock, Tannehill is still on the board and we make him our pick.

I can appreciate that. I remember being certain that they were WITH ME and that we'd be drafting Earl Thomas, and if not him, Jerry Hughes would make a nice consolation prize. Who knows, right? I still think they like Tannehill. But I def don't claim to know.

SF Dolphin Fan
03-31-2012, 11:16 AM
i don't see trading down in play for us unless tannehill is gone in front of us and i don't see that either although kc has scheduled a private workout and i'm sure jax would be receptive with dropping from #7 to #11...so if we did trade back and tannehill was the target for us which i wholeheartedly believe he is then we have a dicey situation at #11 with kc when they come on the board...frankly if tannehills there i don't think we trade anything...i think he's taken at #8...anyways i don't see a shot in hell of us trading a future #1 or even a likely high 2nd rounder to move up in this draft...and i don't want em to either given how i think this year is gonna go for us...

i agree with you on fleener...i don't see how he ever gets by the giants at #32 if he gets there...to me adding that piece down the seam takes that giants o to a whole nother levelIn a trade down scenario, do you see Barron in play for Miami? I expect Fleener to go much higher than people expect maybe even top 20. I mean after Blackmon and Floyd he may have the most impact in an NFL passing attack.

SF Dolphin Fan
03-31-2012, 11:20 AM
There's always a quarterback you can point to who might be available next year and say, "well, are they really better than that guy?"

Not a good way to look at the draft, in my opinion, for a few reasons.

1.) You haven't made a full evaluation on the other guy. Your first impression might be good, but you haven't dug in and seen the negatives on the other guy the way you have on this guy. Uneven evaluations are valueless.

2.) Next year isn't guaranteed. We're picking 8th, yet there was a point during the season we thought Dolphins had a shot at the #1 overall pick. You can't predict during the season how the season's going to end and you think you can predict what's going to happen next year? Pffft. Look at Burfict, going from a 1st round pick to undraftable in a year. Look at Cam Newton, from small school transfer to #1 overall. A year changes everything. There's always the (very small) possibility we could have a great year with mediocre QB play like the 49ers did and not have a chance to take a top QB until two years from now at the earliest. Kicking the can down the road sucks, and long term leads to sucking.

3.) Not all drafts are created equal. One year's top 10 pick is next year's late first rounder, and not because of "reaching." You only get to choose from the players available. This is sort of tied into #2.

4.) My basic advice is: figure out what you think of Tannehill. Yes or no. If it's yes, then take him. Don't head**** yourself with "value." Don't try to trade down. If it's no, then just don't take him. End of story.Agree. I just think there's too much upside with Tannehill to pass on him. But the evaluation also has to include how much of a drop off the team sees from Tannehill to say Cousins, who I think would be their next target. At some point, though, you've got to get the qb. Wait until next year has been the mantra for way too long.

SF Dolphin Fan
03-31-2012, 11:25 AM
I can appreciate that. I remember being certain that they were WITH ME and that we'd be drafting Earl Thomas, and if not him, Jerry Hughes would make a nice consolation prize. Who knows, right? I still think they like Tannehill. But I def don't claim to know.Oh man did I hate that we passed on Earl Thomas.

hooshoops
04-01-2012, 01:02 AM
In a trade down scenario, do you see Barron in play for Miami? I expect Fleener to go much higher than people expect maybe even top 20. I mean after Blackmon and Floyd he may have the most impact in an NFL passing attack.

trade down to where??? #15-20...cause thats where i see barron coming off the board...after richardson i wouldn't be surprised if he was the next bama player off the board...i watched multiple bama games this year and came away thinking mark barrons the best player on that defense...as for miami and barron i doubt it...just don't think ireland will consider it that big a need over some other positions