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jared81
05-30-2012, 02:19 PM
Sean Penn and Danny Glover will be real upset over this news.



This reporter has been told that Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has metastatic rhabdomyosarcoma, an aggressive cancer that has "entered the end stage". The information and the quote come from a highly respected source close to Chavez and who is in a position to know his medical condition and history. This source says the prognosis is dire and that Chavez is now not expected to live "more than a couple of months at most." Chavez is running for re-elec tion in Venezuela but several sources--including the one who revealed the exact kind of cancer-- have told me that they believe it is doubtful the dictator will live to see the results.






http://news.yahoo.com/report--chavez-s-cancer-has--entered-the-end-stage-.html (http://news.yahoo.com/report--chavez-s-cancer-has--entered-the-end-stage-.html)

Locke
05-30-2012, 02:29 PM
First Kim Jong and now Hugo Chavez? I guess nature is taking care of all of our problems for us...

CedarPhin
05-30-2012, 02:47 PM
I think he's an asshat.

Still, no person should deserve to die a death like that, unless it's someone like Bin Laden or something. He really didn't do anything to us except sell us his nationalized oil, so I'm not going to go celebrating him going to the great beyond, cause it really doesn't affect me one way or the other whether or not he lives or dies. Venezuela was there before him, Venezuela will go on without him.

LANGER72
05-30-2012, 03:18 PM
He has claimed that the US somehow gave him the disease. I am sure that their won't be a lot of tears for him when he is gone.

CedarPhin
05-30-2012, 03:31 PM
It wouldn't shock me if we did.

LANGER72
05-30-2012, 03:40 PM
A Heather Graham look-alike must have left the transponder in place (ala fat bastard)..lol

Tetragrammaton
05-30-2012, 03:53 PM
First Kim Jong and now Hugo Chavez? I guess nature is taking care of all of our problems for us...

How was Hugo Chavez "our" problem?

LANGER72
05-30-2012, 04:15 PM
How was Hugo Chavez "our" problem?

If I may Locke..
He was a tyrant to his people, and a general menace to the stability in South America.

Locke
05-30-2012, 06:54 PM
How was Hugo Chavez "our" problem?

I think his villainization has been overdramatized and while he is an issue in some respects, I'd say it's the equivalent of an itchy bug bite. That's not to say I like the guy; the man hasn't been good to his people and has put his welfare ahead of everyone else's in his country. It was an attempt at humor, and a poor one it looks like...

Tetragrammaton
05-30-2012, 07:55 PM
If I may Locke..
He was a tyrant to his people, and a general menace to the stability in South America.

The stability of South America? As in, having governments that we can control?

cdz12250
05-30-2012, 08:49 PM
I think his villainization has been overdramatized and while he is an issue in some respects, I'd say it's the equivalent of an itchy bug bite. That's not to say I like the guy; the man hasn't been good to his people and has put his welfare ahead of everyone else's in his country. It was an attempt at humor, and a poor one it looks like...

If you think that a guy with a deep pocket funding our enemies is a bug bite, you might want to take another look. The misconception that we're invulnerable died on 9/11.

Locke
05-30-2012, 09:17 PM
If you think that a guy with a deep pocket funding our enemies is a bug bite, you might want to take another look. The misconception that we're invulnerable died on 9/11.

There will always be someone with deep pockets funding our enemies. What has his funding done? Do we even know for sure that's what he has been doing? Everyone knew for sure that Iraq had WMDs. Turns out we were wrong. Just because we're told something, doesn't make it true. We always need a bad guy, preferably more than one, to keep the population all-too-willing to give up liberties. If you think the president of a third world country is anything more than a passing concern, then I don't know what to tell you...

LouPhinFan
05-30-2012, 09:19 PM
Meh. He basically liked poking us with a stick. He wasn't any real threat to the US, just an annoying little bugger. At least his own people won't have to deal with him anymore.

Dolphins9954
05-30-2012, 09:23 PM
Looks like Venezuelan TV is about to have a ton of extra air time.

---------- Post added at 09:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:23 PM ----------


If you think that a guy with a deep pocket funding our enemies is a bug bite, you might want to take another look. The misconception that we're invulnerable died on 9/11.

You talking about the Saudis?

LANGER72
05-30-2012, 09:28 PM
The stability of South America? As in, having governments that we can control?

OK...so you think the USA is the bogeyman...got it.

I have many friends from Mexico, Cuba, Panama, Colombia, Honduras, Venezuela, Peru, Ecuador, and other SA nations. They moved here(Florida) for a better life. I think their consensus would be that more American influence would be a good thing and would enhance the stability.
I am no expert on the matter. Just stating my opinions.

jared81
05-30-2012, 09:56 PM
The stability of South America? As in, having governments that we can control?

Stop with your typical bs bro. You live in Florida, there are plenty of people who have fled venezuela for Florida because the seizure of private property and taking away of free speech. Don't act like Chavez is innocent of his human rights violations. Just because he is cool with the young d bag population in north America doesn't mean you can be oblivious.

Valandui
05-30-2012, 10:53 PM
Now we have to install a new Castro figure to scare everyone here.

cdz12250
05-30-2012, 10:57 PM
Looks like Venezuelan TV is about to have a ton of extra air time.

---------- Post added at 09:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:23 PM ----------



You talking about the Saudis?

Iranians. Great buddy of theirs, Hugo.

Tetragrammaton
05-30-2012, 11:04 PM
OK...so you think the USA is the bogeyman...got it.

I have many friends from Mexico, Cuba, Panama, Colombia, Honduras, Venezuela, Peru, Ecuador, and other SA nations. They moved here(Florida) for a better life. I think their consensus would be that more American influence would be a good thing and would enhance the stability.
I am no expert on the matter. Just stating my opinions.

I didn't state any opinion on the United States. I am asking how Hugo Chavez was any less a stable government than so many other South American despots, both those who developed independently and those we propped up.

---------- Post added at 11:04 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:03 PM ----------


Stop with your typical bs bro. You live in Florida, there are plenty of people who have fled venezuela for Florida because the seizure of private property and taking away of free speech. Don't act like Chavez is innocent of his human rights violations. Just because he is cool with the young d bag population in north America doesn't mean you can be oblivious.

What does his human rights violations have to do with what I was talking about? What does your misinterpretation of what I said have anything to do with what I actually said?

Locke
05-30-2012, 11:05 PM
Iranians. Great buddy of theirs, Hugo.

You honestly think Venezuela is funding Iran? What kind of extra resources does Venezuela have that it can afford to just give away? They have their oil, but that's barely enough to pay for the expenses they currently have. They have no notable export outside of their oil, and they are not a service economy like the U.S. has become. They don't have anything extra to just give away...

LANGER72
05-31-2012, 09:49 AM
You honestly think Venezuela is funding Iran? What kind of extra resources does Venezuela have that it can afford to just give away? They have their oil, but that's barely enough to pay for the expenses they currently have. They have no notable export outside of their oil, and they are not a service economy like the U.S. has become. They don't have anything extra to just give away...

What Venezuela offers Iran is another ally at the US doorstep. A port to refuel it's navy and a place to send in terrorists if it wanted to. It increases Iran sphere of influence.

LANGER72
05-31-2012, 09:55 AM
I didn't state any opinion on the United States. I am asking how Hugo Chavez was any less a stable government than so many other South American despots, both those who developed independently and those we propped up.

---------- Post added at 11:04 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:03 PM ----------



What does his human rights violations have to do with what I was talking about? What does your misinterpretation of what I said have anything to do with what I actually said?



You responded with a vague "we" ...I am sure most here assume you live in the USA...my guess would be California. By the way, is that you in your avatar picture with the martini glass?

Locke
05-31-2012, 11:08 AM
What Venezuela offers Iran is another ally at the US doorstep. A port to refuel it's navy and a place to send in terrorists if it wanted to. It increases Iran sphere of influence.

I don't recall any Iranian terrorists in recent history. However, if that's your concern, then you should be scared sh*tless of Mexico. Do they even have the ability to watch their own borders at this point in time? The cartels own most of that country now, and they'd love nothing more than to have us focusing on another threat, making it easier for them to get their drugs across our borders.

Again, Iran is another country where the threat is highly exaggerated. Just another boogeyman to keep the people willing to give up their personal freedoms...

Dolphins9954
05-31-2012, 11:31 AM
I don't recall any Iranian terrorists in recent history. However, if that's your concern, then you should be scared sh*tless of Mexico. Do they even have the ability to watch their own borders at this point in time? The cartels own most of that country now, and they'd love nothing more than to have us focusing on another threat, making it easier for them to get their drugs across our borders.

Again, Iran is another country where the threat is highly exaggerated. Just another boogeyman to keep the people willing to give up their personal freedoms...

While justifying unfundable, bloated military budgets and keeping the MIC rich.

Tetragrammaton
05-31-2012, 11:35 AM
You responded with a vague "we" ...I am sure most here assume you live in the USA...my guess would be California. By the way, is that you in your avatar picture with the martini glass?

We dislike Hugo Chavez because we can't control him. People can try to deflect with talk of his record in his country, but we have no problem supporting regimes in Saudi Arabia or Pakistan, and have interfered in propping up dictatorships in South America that were friendly to American interests. That still does not make Venezuala a threat to the United States, which is what this was all originally about.

phins_4_ever
05-31-2012, 12:01 PM
If you think that a guy with a deep pocket funding our enemies is a bug bite, you might want to take another look. The misconception that we're invulnerable died on 9/11.

Yeah, deep pocket funding.

I am getting really sick of all the 'true' Americans talking about other meanie countries who are out to get us, not realizing that these TRUE Americans are essentially financing these leaders.

Wanna save a dollar? Let's by crap which is made in big bad China (including 90% of US Flags flown on July 4).
Let's run to Walmart to save a dollar on crap which was made in sweat shops throughout the world trampling human rights 24/7/365.
One SUV is not enough. We need two or 3 per household and ...support Saudi Arabia with our gas dollars.

Oh and Hugo Chavez? Heard of Citgo? Owned by Venezuela....

We fill everybody's pocket daily because it is so American to save a dime here and there.

If any of them want to hurt us seriously they pull the plug and we are being thrown into the stone ages within a couple weeks.

The reason why Hugo Chavez is so hated here is not because he is such a bad boy but because he has one of the largest oil resources and is one of the biggest suppliers of oil to the US and we have no control over him.

I really don't know why we didn't connect Chavez to 9/11. His country is much closer to us than Iraq.

phins_4_ever
05-31-2012, 12:39 PM
What Venezuela offers Iran is another ally at the US doorstep. A port to refuel it's navy and a place to send in terrorists if it wanted to. It increases Iran sphere of influence.

Where do you get this crap from? The Iranian navy is coming to attack us? Do you even realize what you are writing there?
Just because Chavez and Ahmadinejad pad each others back and throw some phrases around they are now planning an invasion?

If you think about it, it is us who is marching into other countries, justified or not, sending unmanned drones and throw bombs and shoot people, justified or not, around the globe.

It is us who preps up people like Castro, Hussein, Bin Laden and yes, even our influence in Iran has created the breeding ground of needless hate. It is ironic that until we messed with Mosaddegh in the 1950s we had pretty good relationship with Iran. But our CIA had to orchestrate with the British intelligence a coup which brought to power the Shah just to dump him as well in 1979. What you don't like as a government in Iran is a result of our direct influence.

And you are buying into the media frenzy again. Nothing learned from the past (Gulf of Tonkan, Iraq's weapons of mass destruction etc).

And Chavez was elected by the people and re-elected by the people. He is an elected leader of a sovereign country we have no business to make a scapegoat of our own shortcomings or to feed our 'small penis ego' by showing big weapons.
And for terrorists to enter this country there are plenty of other, easier ways than through Venezuela.

CedarPhin
05-31-2012, 05:22 PM
When Venezuela and Iran go Snoop Dogg and Dr. Dre on the rest of the Western Hemisphere, will there be a Bin Laden hologram dropping verses accompanying them?

LANGER72
05-31-2012, 07:41 PM
Where do you get this crap from? The Iranian navy is coming to attack us? Do you even realize what you are writing there?
Just because Chavez and Ahmadinejad pad each others back and throw some phrases around they are now planning an invasion?

If you think about it, it is us who is marching into other countries, justified or not, sending unmanned drones and throw bombs and shoot people, justified or not, around the globe.

It is us who preps up people like Castro, Hussein, Bin Laden and yes, even our influence in Iran has created the breeding ground of needless hate. It is ironic that until we messed with Mosaddegh in the 1950s we had pretty good relationship with Iran. But our CIA had to orchestrate with the British intelligence a coup which brought to power the Shah just to dump him as well in 1979. What you don't like as a government in Iran is a result of our direct influence.

And you are buying into the media frenzy again. Nothing learned from the past (Gulf of Tonkan, Iraq's weapons of mass destruction etc).

And Chavez was elected by the people and re-elected by the people. He is an elected leader of a sovereign country we have no business to make a scapegoat of our own shortcomings or to feed our 'small penis ego' by showing big weapons.
And for terrorists to enter this country there are plenty of other, easier ways than through Venezuela.

Where did I say they(Iran) were going to attack us.? Invasion? LOL. Talk about jumping to conclusions and taking statements out of context.
Since you bring it up...
If attacked by Israel and the US, there is a possibility that Iran could load a nuke onto a submarine as a counter strike and detonate it near or in a US coastal port. Iran doesn't have a deep water navy. Their ships and subs need to frequently refuel. Chavez's Venezuela could provide that capability. That is the concern.

Each Chavez election was a sham. Once he got into power he changed their nations constitution to allow for his perpetual "re-election".
It was a military operation and a carefully crafted political campaign with a promise of fairness..especially of the poor. He did not deliver. It was just a ruse. He has been consolidating and silencing ever since. The death of a despot..and new hope for a beautiful and important country in SA. I am sure millions will be pissing on his grave.

The breeding ground of hatred was created long before the events of the last 30 years.

LANGER72
05-31-2012, 07:47 PM
When Venezuela and Iran go Snoop Dogg and Dr. Dre on the rest of the Western Hemisphere, will there be a Bin Laden hologram dropping verses accompanying them?

Trace Adkins and Wayne McMurtry will snap them like twigs...

Locke
05-31-2012, 08:03 PM
Where did I say they(Iran) were going to attack us.? Invasion? LOL. Talk about jumping to conclusions and taking statements out of context.
Since you bring it up...
If attacked by Israel and the US, there is a possibility that Iran could load a nuke onto a submarine as a counter strike and detonate it near or in a US coastal port. Iran doesn't have a deep water navy. Their ships and subs need to frequently refuel. Chavez's Venezuela could provide that capability. That is the concern.

Each Chavez election was a sham. Once he got into power he changed their nations constitution to allow for his perpetual "re-election".
It was a military operation and a carefully crafted political campaign with a promise of fairness..especially of the poor. He did not deliver. It was just a ruse. He has been consolidating and silencing ever since. The death of a despot..and new hope for a beautiful and important country in SA. I am sure millions will be pissing on his grave.

The breeding ground of hatred was created long before the events of the last 30 years.

Do you really think any enemy ship would get within 500 miles of any major U.S. port without getting lit up like Denzel in Training Day? Forget major port, they couldn't even get near any of our coasts.

However, assuming that this was theoretically possible, your next point is that Iran doesn't have a deep water navy. So then, how would they get from Venezuela to the U.S.? That's still an ocean. Would they follow the South and Central American coast? Right past the U.S.-patroled panama canal? Do you see the problems with this theory...?

phins_4_ever
06-01-2012, 12:04 AM
Where did I say they(Iran) were going to attack us.? Invasion? LOL. Talk about jumping to conclusions and taking statements out of context.
Since you bring it up...
Oh really? I brought it up and I jump to conclusions?

What Venezuela offers Iran is another ally at the US doorstep. A port to refuel it's navy and a place to send in terrorists if it wanted to. It increases Iran sphere of influence.
So the Iranian Navy makes it all the way across the ocean to refuel its navy to do what? Take a Western Caribbean cruise? Your suggestion alone implicates the thought of an attack on us.



If attacked by Israel and the US, there is a possibility that Iran could load a nuke onto a submarine as a counter strike and detonate it near or in a US coastal port. Iran doesn't have a deep water navy. Their ships and subs need to frequently refuel. Chavez's Venezuela could provide that capability. That is the concern.
Excellent. Then we are safe. According to you Iranians navy needs frequent refueling. I guess they will not even cross the deep Atlantic Ocean or any other deep ocean with their no-deep-water navy. So what's all the fuzz about.
Of course Iran needs a nuke first to actually detonate anything much less get close enough to shore to do any damage with that nuke (you said 'a nuke').
Concern? Laughable.



Each Chavez election was a sham. Once he got into power he changed their nations constitution to allow for his perpetual "re-election".
It was a military operation and a carefully crafted political campaign with a promise of fairness..especially of the poor. He did not deliver. It was just a ruse. He has been consolidating and silencing ever since. The death of a despot..and new hope for a beautiful and important country in SA. I am sure millions will be pissing on his grave.

You may want to re-read history and don't repeat Fox News History (which is hardly fact based).

The elections were no sham. Just because our war mongers don't like someone does not mean that person was elected and re-elected through a sham. A military operation???? Come on...
Further more, he did not just change the constitution. He actually used a political and democratic process for that. First it was a referendum which was voted by nearly 90% of the voters. One could argue one way or another if that was a good thing to create a national assembly with a lot of power. Chavez and his supporters say it is to weed out corruption others say it would hurt the opposition but it is still a democratic elected assembly. Further more, same assembly made changes to the constitution through a referendum and election by the people (also democratic). The changes included but were not limited to:

"increased protections for indigenous peoples and women, and established the rights of the public to education, housing, healthcare and food. It added new environmental protections, and increased requirements for government transparency. It increased the presidential term from five to six years, allowed people to recall (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recall_election) presidents by referendum, and added a new presidential two-term limit."
Sorry but these are all basic human rights which not even this country has anymore or has severely eroded versions of it.

I go a step further and say that under your premise of a dangerous government to its own people and others, supporting countries which violate human rights and your reasoning for bombing such countries you should have bombed the US no later than 2002 when a man named GW Bush implemented a much bigger apparatus of human rights violations than Chavez would ever dream off.



The breeding ground of hatred was created long before the events of the last 30 years.
Did not.

Valandui
06-01-2012, 01:20 AM
Where do you get this crap from? The Iranian navy is coming to attack us? Do you even realize what you are writing there?
Just because Chavez and Ahmadinejad pad each others back and throw some phrases around they are now planning an invasion?

If you think about it, it is us who is marching into other countries, justified or not, sending unmanned drones and throw bombs and shoot people, justified or not, around the globe.

It is us who preps up people like Castro, Hussein, Bin Laden and yes, even our influence in Iran has created the breeding ground of needless hate. It is ironic that until we messed with Mosaddegh in the 1950s we had pretty good relationship with Iran. But our CIA had to orchestrate with the British intelligence a coup which brought to power the Shah just to dump him as well in 1979. What you don't like as a government in Iran is a result of our direct influence.

And you are buying into the media frenzy again. Nothing learned from the past (Gulf of Tonkan, Iraq's weapons of mass destruction etc).

And Chavez was elected by the people and re-elected by the people. He is an elected leader of a sovereign country we have no business to make a scapegoat of our own shortcomings or to feed our 'small penis ego' by showing big weapons.
And for terrorists to enter this country there are plenty of other, easier ways than through Venezuela.
I agree with most of this, but the people of Venezuela actually tried to take Chavez out of power. When they had a recall election, he put many of his political opponents in jail and may or may not have rigged that election. Jimmy Carter came down to certify it and basically showed up, said it was legit, then left so he could be back in the US for his wife's birthday.

jared81
06-01-2012, 12:02 PM
Oh really? I brought it up and I jump to conclusions?

So the Iranian Navy makes it all the way across the ocean to refuel its navy to do what? Take a Western Caribbean cruise? Your suggestion alone implicates the thought of an attack on us.


Excellent. Then we are safe. According to you Iranians navy needs frequent refueling. I guess they will not even cross the deep Atlantic Ocean or any other deep ocean with their no-deep-water navy. So what's all the fuzz about.
Of course Iran needs a nuke first to actually detonate anything much less get close enough to shore to do any damage with that nuke (you said 'a nuke').
Concern? Laughable.



You may want to re-read history and don't repeat Fox News History (which is hardly fact based).

The elections were no sham. Just because our war mongers don't like someone does not mean that person was elected and re-elected through a sham. A military operation???? Come on...
Further more, he did not just change the constitution. He actually used a political and democratic process for that. First it was a referendum which was voted by nearly 90% of the voters. One could argue one way or another if that was a good thing to create a national assembly with a lot of power. Chavez and his supporters say it is to weed out corruption others say it would hurt the opposition but it is still a democratic elected assembly. Further more, same assembly made changes to the constitution through a referendum and election by the people (also democratic). The changes included but were not limited to:

Sorry but these are all basic human rights which not even this country has anymore or has severely eroded versions of it.

I go a step further and say that under your premise of a dangerous government to its own people and others, supporting countries which violate human rights and your reasoning for bombing such countries you should have bombed the US no later than 2002 when a man named GW Bush implemented a much bigger apparatus of human rights violations than Chavez would ever dream off.


Did not.

You make it sound like Chavez is a man of his people. If he is so loved why have people fled there? My wife is Venezuelan and she personally has family members who moved to s. Florida yo get away from his oppression.

phins_4_ever
06-02-2012, 03:17 PM
You make it sound like Chavez is a man of his people. If he is so loved why have people fled there? My wife is Venezuelan and she personally has family members who moved to s. Florida yo get away from his oppression.

No I don't. What government is really a government of the people? It never really existed. I just make a case that Chavez is simply not bad enough to make him our enemy. Is there some form of oppression. Sure. But I have yet to see women being arrested for driving a car in Venezuela as it is being done in some countries we call allies and friends. Not to long ago the entire Eastern Block was opressed, a dozen and more countries. We never put a finger on them but let them free themselves. I don't see mass murdering in Venezuela either like it is on the daily agenda in some countries in Africa (yes Sarah, Africa has countries and is not one).
We never made a move when Tienanmen Square happened and essentially validated China's political system and today despite severe human right violations it is our preferred way of capitalism importing cheap crap from China while dumping jobs here.

What we do is we prey on the weak and vulnerable to make us feel better and to argue how great we are. We play for oil because we as a country can not adapt and adjust and have lost our adventurous artery. We look for a weakling to keep a picture of an enemy because otherwise we can't function and exist and it makes our military happy.

What I was attempting was nothing but putting Chavez in perspective. The problems in Venezuela are domestic problems. The people in Venezuela (as well as in Cuba) have the same power as people had in East Germany, Poland, (former) CSSR, (former) USSR, Bulgaria, Romania etc.

Chavez is not our enemy nor anybody elses but Venezuela's. No need to elevate him to enemy status because it is convenient for our war mongers.

LANGER72
06-02-2012, 03:25 PM
No I don't. What government is really a government of the people? It never really existed. I just make a case that Chavez is simply not bad enough to make him our enemy. Is there some form of oppression. Sure. But I have yet to see women being arrested for driving a car in Venezuela as it is being done in some countries we call allies and friends. Not to long ago the entire Eastern Block was opressed, a dozen and more countries. We never put a finger on them but let them free themselves. I don't see mass murdering in Venezuela either like it is on the daily agenda in some countries in Africa (yes Sarah, Africa has countries and is not one).
We never made a move when Tienanmen Square happened and essentially validated China's political system and today despite severe human right violations it is our preferred way of capitalism importing cheap crap from China while dumping jobs here.

What we do is we prey on the weak and vulnerable to make us feel better and to argue how great we are. We play for oil because we as a country can not adapt and adjust and have lost our adventurous artery. We look for a weakling to keep a picture of an enemy because otherwise we can't function and exist and it makes our military happy.

What I was attempting was nothing but putting Chavez in perspective. The problems in Venezuela are domestic problems. The people in Venezuela (as well as in Cuba) have the same power as people had in East Germany, Poland, (former) CSSR, (former) USSR, Bulgaria, Romania etc.

Chavez is not our enemy nor anybody elses but Venezuela's. No need to elevate him to enemy status because it is convenient for our war mongers.



Not any more.
War mongers...lol
Tree huggers...LOL

LANGER72
06-02-2012, 03:28 PM
No I don't. What government is really a government of the people? It never really existed. I just make a case that Chavez is simply not bad enough to make him our enemy. Is there some form of oppression. Sure. But I have yet to see women being arrested for driving a car in Venezuela as it is being done in some countries we call allies and friends. Not to long ago the entire Eastern Block was opressed, a dozen and more countries. We never put a finger on them but let them free themselves. I don't see mass murdering in Venezuela either like it is on the daily agenda in some countries in Africa (yes Sarah, Africa has countries and is not one).
We never made a move when Tienanmen Square happened and essentially validated China's political system and today despite severe human right violations it is our preferred way of capitalism importing cheap crap from China while dumping jobs here.

What we do is we prey on the weak and vulnerable to make us feel better and to argue how great we are. We play for oil because we as a country can not adapt and adjust and have lost our adventurous artery. We look for a weakling to keep a picture of an enemy because otherwise we can't function and exist and it makes our military happy.

What I was attempting was nothing but putting Chavez in perspective. The problems in Venezuela are domestic problems. The people in Venezuela (as well as in Cuba) have the same power as people had in East Germany, Poland, (former) CSSR, (former) USSR, Bulgaria, Romania etc.

Chavez is not our enemy nor anybody elses but Venezuela's. No need to elevate him to enemy status because it is convenient for our war mongers.


The biggest pile of horse **** I have ever read.

phins_4_ever
06-02-2012, 04:00 PM
The biggest pile of horse **** I have ever read.

The truth hurts.

LANGER72
06-03-2012, 12:15 PM
The truth hurts.


It is your truth.

The USA is a bully..Delusional much?

Baaawaaa...the USA kicked sand into my face...I am telling my mommy...

NY8123
06-03-2012, 06:53 PM
No I don't. What government is really a government of the people? It never really existed. I just make a case that Chavez is simply not bad enough to make him our enemy. Is there some form of oppression. Sure. But I have yet to see women being arrested for driving a car in Venezuela as it is being done in some countries we call allies and friends. Not to long ago the entire Eastern Block was opressed, a dozen and more countries. We never put a finger on them but let them free themselves. I don't see mass murdering in Venezuela either like it is on the daily agenda in some countries in Africa (yes Sarah, Africa has countries and is not one).
We never made a move when Tienanmen Square happened and essentially validated China's political system and today despite severe human right violations it is our preferred way of capitalism importing cheap crap from China while dumping jobs here.

What we do is we prey on the weak and vulnerable to make us feel better and to argue how great we are. We play for oil because we as a country can not adapt and adjust and have lost our adventurous artery. We look for a weakling to keep a picture of an enemy because otherwise we can't function and exist and it makes our military happy.

What I was attempting was nothing but putting Chavez in perspective. The problems in Venezuela are domestic problems. The people in Venezuela (as well as in Cuba) have the same power as people had in East Germany, Poland, (former) CSSR, (former) USSR, Bulgaria, Romania etc.

Chavez is not our enemy nor anybody else's but Venezuela's. No need to elevate him to enemy status because it is convenient for our war mongers.

We play for oil because in my opinion there is a strategy to run the rest of the world out of it. If you think about it, it's a sound strategy, run the oil producing countries out of oil and you reconfirm your global domination for centuries to come.

There is more US reserve oil then anyone will ever know.

LANGER72
06-03-2012, 08:18 PM
We play for oil because in my opinion there is a strategy to run the rest of the world out of it. If you think about it, it's a sound strategy, run the oil producing countries out of oil and you reconfirm your global domination for centuries to come.

There is more US reserve oil then anyone will ever know.

Thank you.

phins_4_ever
06-04-2012, 12:26 AM
We play for oil because in my opinion there is a strategy to run the rest of the world out of it. If you think about it, it's a sound strategy, run the oil producing countries out of oil and you reconfirm your global domination for centuries to come.

There is more US reserve oil then anyone will ever know.

:lol:
This can not be for real.

I got news for you: if that is really a strategy it is a pretty pathetic one. By the time the 'rest of the world' runs out of oil most of the civilized world (except us) will not rely on oil anymore. But good to know that we have that huge secret oil reserve nobody knows about.
:lol:

LANGER72
06-04-2012, 10:16 AM
:lol:
This can not be for real.

I got news for you: if that is really a strategy it is a pretty pathetic one. By the time the 'rest of the world' runs out of oil most of the civilized world (except us) will not rely on oil anymore. But good to know that we have that huge secret oil reserve nobody knows about.
:lol:

The world will depend on oil..there is no alternative that provides the power as cheaply. You need to change the channel from the star trek channel to the reality channel. What is your theory on the type of power we will be using since we will not rely on oil? Love to hear that one.
What do you mean "rest of the civilized world"? Who are you calling civilized/uncivilized?
The point was that oil as a commodity will steadiliy increase in value as it becomes more scarce in the middle east and when other less developed nations start developing..and they will be using oil based energy supplies....why? Because it is cheaper to build and operate.
We have the resources under federal lands and the technology. I would not be surprised to see the nationalization of the oil/gas industry in the US at some point in the near future. Yes...I said that.
It is wise to deplete another countries commodity at the current prices, while saving our own resources for down the road. It is also a national security issue. Oil will be a tremendous political lever.
Russia is in the cat bird seat. They have a tremendous amount of oil underground, and technology, plus most of the access to the arctic reserves..which may contain much more than previously thought. With the melting going on, more area will be accessible to be drilled. Canada and the US also have access.

Russia, Canada, and the US will be the major suppliers in the oil industry in 30 years.
Just my .02

NY8123
06-04-2012, 11:32 AM
:lol:
This can not be for real.

I got news for you: if that is really a strategy it is a pretty pathetic one. By the time the 'rest of the world' runs out of oil most of the civilized world (except us) will not rely on oil anymore. But good to know that we have that huge secret oil reserve nobody knows about.
:lol:

Don't be naive and believe what you read. Oil is more than gas and cars, it is in everything, Plastic, rubber, shampoo etc... here is a partial list of petroleum products

http://www.ranken-energy.com/Products%20from%20Petroleum.htm

This isn't a product that is replaceable in the next two centuries let alone our life time.

phins_4_ever
06-04-2012, 09:48 PM
Don't be naive and believe what you read. Oil is more than gas and cars, it is in everything, Plastic, rubber, shampoo etc... here is a partial list of petroleum products

http://www.ranken-energy.com/Products%20from%20Petroleum.htm

This isn't a product that is replaceable in the next two centuries let alone our life time.

Nobody says oil is easily replaceable. I didn't say that did I?
I was just laughing at your wet dream that we will be running the world because of oil. There is a funny thing which is called technology and with that comes research and development. To have research and development you need money and a vision. And we as a country have lost our vision (and the money too).
The dream of us ruling or, as you say, running the world because of oil is nothing but a pipe dream. Currently our oil reserves are listed somewhere between 10 and 20 years. Venezuela's: 350 years; Saudi Arabia: 80 years; even Canada and Iraq are listed at 150 plus years. That of course is based on current production and consumption but regardless of that making a bold prediction that the US will run the world based on its own supply of oil is truly laughable. Actually thinking like that makes one close minded and not open to new ideas.

Everything is replaceable. Some things faster, others slower. It also doesn't matter how many things contain petroleum. It was the choice of ingredient at that time and served as well. But as time goes on it too will be replaced, one way or another. You favor the status quo on oil and obviously have access to classified information on all of our secret not yet discovered oil reserves.

One does not need to subscribe to the startrek channel (@Langner) [didn't even know that there is such a channel] because I didn't not promote wharp drives, teleporters, artificial gravity, phaser guns etc. I was just laughing at the idea that we will be running the world because of our own oil supply. Because, no matter when it will happen, before other nations run out of useable oil the prices will sky rocket and put us to a halt, throw us back into the stone age before we even refine one ounce of our still secret, gigantic oil reserves.
Other countries in the mean time will have developed and rely much less on oil.

Europe's goal is to have 20% of its energy consumption be renewable energy by 2020. That is in less than 7 years. Even if they fall short. It is a huge step forward. Most new buildings have to conform to renewable energy and have some sort of solar panels installed. That is vision. There are countries who already exceed that goal: Germany 20% plus; Portugal 50%, Spain 33%, Finnland above 40%. Most of the renewable energy is wind and photo voltic. And the US? Stood last year at 11% with most of the renewable energy coming from hydroelectric which is hardly used in Europe because of its environmental impact. Countries like Germany go even further and will have phased out all their nuclear reactors by 2020 and replaced by renewable energy. By 2050, nearly 75% of the EU will have renewable energy. That cuts oil dependency and dependency on natural resources dramatically.

Who will really rule or run the world in a few decades? The countries who are the least dependent on oil and the ones who don't necessarily desire to run the world but rather look for domestic solutions first and have no 'little penis' ego.

The enemy of the USA is hardly outside our borders. We, with our tunnel vision and closed minds and our ability to be perfect sheeps, are our greatest enemies. But what do I expect from a country where a good portion thinks that the earth is only 6000 years old. A vision for the future? Hardly.

NY8123
06-05-2012, 01:42 PM
Nobody says oil is easily replaceable. I didn't say that did I?
I was just laughing at your wet dream that we will be running the world because of oil. There is a funny thing which is called technology and with that comes research and development. To have research and development you need money and a vision. And we as a country have lost our vision (and the money too).
The dream of us ruling or, as you say, running the world because of oil is nothing but a pipe dream. Currently our oil reserves are listed somewhere between 10 and 20 years. Venezuela's: 350 years; Saudi Arabia: 80 years; even Canada and Iraq are listed at 150 plus years. That of course is based on current production and consumption but regardless of that making a bold prediction that the US will run the world based on its own supply of oil is truly laughable. Actually thinking like that makes one close minded and not open to new ideas.

Everything is replaceable. Some things faster, others slower. It also doesn't matter how many things contain petroleum. It was the choice of ingredient at that time and served as well. But as time goes on it too will be replaced, one way or another. You favor the status quo on oil and obviously have access to classified information on all of our secret not yet discovered oil reserves.

One does not need to subscribe to the startrek channel (@Langner) [didn't even know that there is such a channel] because I didn't not promote wharp drives, teleporters, artificial gravity, phaser guns etc. I was just laughing at the idea that we will be running the world because of our own oil supply. Because, no matter when it will happen, before other nations run out of useable oil the prices will sky rocket and put us to a halt, throw us back into the stone age before we even refine one ounce of our still secret, gigantic oil reserves.
Other countries in the mean time will have developed and rely much less on oil.

Europe's goal is to have 20% of its energy consumption be renewable energy by 2020. That is in less than 7 years. Even if they fall short. It is a huge step forward. Most new buildings have to conform to renewable energy and have some sort of solar panels installed. That is vision. There are countries who already exceed that goal: Germany 20% plus; Portugal 50%, Spain 33%, Finnland above 40%. Most of the renewable energy is wind and photo voltic. And the US? Stood last year at 11% with most of the renewable energy coming from hydroelectric which is hardly used in Europe because of its environmental impact. Countries like Germany go even further and will have phased out all their nuclear reactors by 2020 and replaced by renewable energy. By 2050, nearly 75% of the EU will have renewable energy. That cuts oil dependency and dependency on natural resources dramatically.

Who will really rule or run the world in a few decades? The countries who are the least dependent on oil and the ones who don't necessarily desire to run the world but rather look for domestic solutions first and have no 'little penis' ego.

The enemy of the USA is hardly outside our borders. We, with our tunnel vision and closed minds and our ability to be perfect sheeps, are our greatest enemies. But what do I expect from a country where a good portion thinks that the earth is only 6000 years old. A vision for the future? Hardly.

I don't think there could have been a post with more inaccuracies then this, my wet dream is Jessica Biel I could give a **** if the US is a global giant or collapsing under the weight of its debt. I'll be fine, trust me. I can live without money, I have the knowledge and means to do such, all I need is land and some natural resources available to anyone who has knowledge of basic woodsmenship. The greatest enemy of the United States of America is the unwillingness of its people to sacrifice now to move forward later. At some point there will be no option to the people, the government will no longer be able to fix the onslaught of problems that the American people continue to pass along. Local government has relied on Federal funding to the point that they can no longer open schools without it. Cutting sports because there is no budget, there is no budget because spending was cut, cuts where made because spending limits where imposed, spending limits were imposed because the allocation of funds in certain key areas, Defense, Banking, Government needs to remain the same.

That my friend is the biggest US enemy.

As for the oil and the reserves, the number is as reported and that is what is public. The oil has been 50 years worldwide from running out since I was in grade school but alas 30 years later we are now 80 years plus depending on the country. There is a one whole continent that is untapped, Antarctica. Once a lush and flourishing swap with semi tropical vegetation and life. Cold and baron, left alone for centuries to sit untapped and the potential for WWIII to break out over what is thought to have at minimum the third largest oil reserve on the planet is a real one. The countries that are non OPEC dependent, Brazil, Venezuela etc...didn't know 50 years ago what they even had for oil reserve. Look at Russia, they went from being OPEC dependent to recognized as a substantial threat to OPEC's rule over oil distribution. OPEC was forced to work with Russia do to the sheer quantity of reserve in Russia.

The US is fully aware of this and if you think for one single second that the US is just sitting here and chugging oil like a drunken sailor at a tap house without a succession plan you are grossly misinformed. The US is prepared to protect its sovereignty and global position by any means necessary, Canada has not much choice if a conflict arises but to side with the US, that bottles up the continent save Mexico but that is easily changeable.

I'm not saying the US position is one of wanting global conflict over oil but plan d or e addresses this, I am sure of it and to think anything else is naive and shortsighted. Alternative energy at this point buys the world time, time to lengthen out the use of its oil, but it doesn't address the problem oil in general and those who control it one way or another moving forward. The US will attempt to control oil with any means necessary once the world production dictates that it is a necessary evil. Going green with renewable energies doesn't fix anything:


The conservation and efficient use of energy can only go so far. The population in the year 2000 of an estimated 8 billion will create tremendous demands on energy producers. Pacific Rim countries are expected to use more energy than the United States , and disruption of oil imports to the U.S. could cause the economy to come to a standstill in 90 days. Uncontrolled population growth generates a serious impediment to any program trying to conserve world energy. There are 100 million more people on Earth each year. Regardless of the level of conservation implemented, if the world population keeps growing indefinitely, there is no way to keep up with energy demand. An increasing population demands greater amounts of energy, forcing technology to find a way to develop more mineral and energy supplies. In Hal Fox's words, "The basis of the national energy policy should include offshore oil development, new methods of oil recovery, and new energy sources. We must continue to support energy efficiency. We cannot reduce the quality of life in the U.S. We have the best life style in the world's history. Our energy policy should encourage incentives, not just in dollars but also in education. Other nations look to the U.S. for leadership and they need our help in building clean, efficient energy sources. We must draw a line in the sand and say 50% of our oil and no more will be imported. Encourage other means of energy production." Whether you believe in his idea that the luxurious lifestyle in the U.S. should not be altered, we are still going to have to make some changes. At some point, unless the population stabilizes, technology will not be able to produce more non-renewable resources to keep up with additional population's needs. It is imperative that we realize on a global scale that conservation is not a solution; it only buys a little bit of time until the resources are gone.

http://www.altenergy.org/transition/conservation.html


The real enemy of America and the world is oil and the lifestyle the population as created around it, paper money is useless without resources to back it, you can print all you want but the wood used to print it would be more valuable than the money itself without resources to back it, the US has the largest consumer nation in the world and without it the rest of the world will suffer as well.

The world is tied in a constant battle with population verse quality of life and the common commodity that controls that quality, like it or not is Oil. I'm ready to make my sacrifices if the time comes, are you?