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hooshoops
09-08-2012, 11:41 PM
well all i kept hearing was people wanted to see my own work and have my own analysis and not piggy back on other peoples threads...well i finally requested the platform to do so where people could get my takes and analysis and so throughout the college football season and postseason draft process ie the senior bowl the postseason all star games the nfl combine the pro days etc i'm gonna be posting my analysis and evals on nfl prospects and talent...i want to make it perfectly clear i am not a writer nor do i ever intend to be so what you are gonna get is pretty much a blog form from me...i'm a football guy always will be...i know nfl talent i know how to identify it and i know how to grade it and assess a value to it...i'm not afraid to be held accountable for my takes either...last thing to say before i start adding content is that i don't care what kiper or mcshay or any other talking head has to say about a player...these are my own evaluations and analysis off my own study...i hope that you'll find it helpful and worth your time...so let's get it on...

Wildbill3
09-08-2012, 11:46 PM
Lets get it on!

Gonzo
09-08-2012, 11:53 PM
Lookin' forward to it!

hooshoops
09-09-2012, 12:00 AM
we'll start with the best pure pass rush highest level upside prospect maybe in college football right now...barkevious mingo...who jumped off the screen at me last year in the alabama lsu game...if you haven't seen the tape i challenge you to do so...mingo was a one man wrecking crew...by far the best looking prospect on both sides of the los...i was floored...

long and lean mingo possesses explosive initial first step quickness off the ball and has rediculous athleticism and nice length and despite his relatively lean frame provides a pop on contact and understands leverage...i challenge you to find any guy with his hand in the dirt that gives more effort to the whistle...i haven't seen it...i can't help but think what a monster this kid could be if he added another 15 lbs to that frame he has the body that looks to me like he could carry that extra weight without losing much of anything...he rocks people on contact with his hands getting tackles off balance and then redirects back inside to the qb and shows off that 4.5 closing speed and rediculous quick acceleration...he runs down things from the backside he has no business getting to and covers ground like a gazelle...he has the ability to gain the edge and turn the corner with that explosive outside speed rush and then flatten out to the qb...his teammate sam montgomerys a solid looking player but this kids just another level...this is jpp type talent people...top 5 bpa all day long...i would jump on this kid like there's no tomorrow if he got in my wheelhouse if i'm miami

i also would challenge you to count how many offensive tackles he puts on their asses this year...this kid might need to add strength to be stouter at the poa against the run and i get that but for as lean as he is right now he puts guys on skates routinely...don't let all those damn double teams sure to come his way this year fool you...this kid is the goods...

ROADRUNNER
09-09-2012, 02:52 AM
http://www.finheaven.com/clear.gif


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biR1aJXTyiw&feature=player_detailpage


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=JNp3mHsU3kI

rob19
09-09-2012, 08:48 PM
How ya feeling about RG3 today hoops?

hooshoops
09-10-2012, 11:08 AM
How ya feeling about RG3 today hoops?

like i need to watch the skins opening game...that said it's only one

mnphinfan
09-12-2012, 03:31 PM
Hoops my main concerns for this team are WR and CB, plus DE if Vernon doesn't show some serious flashes.. Being that we for sure will have 5 picks in the top 96 and probably 6 picks in the top 110-115 who would you key on in these first 3 rounds for these 3 positions (besides Mingo). Having a 4 year old with another one on the way and being in the middle of a home renovating project I don't have much time for college football so a little help would be great as for which games to set the DVR for.

DKphin
09-13-2012, 05:34 PM
I am right there with on your take of Vontae for a second. I will give you a :bobdole: and raise you a :tantrum:

hooshoops
09-14-2012, 12:10 AM
Hoops my main concerns for this team are WR and CB, plus DE if Vernon doesn't show some serious flashes.. Being that we for sure will have 5 picks in the top 96 and probably 6 picks in the top 110-115 who would you key on in these first 3 rounds for these 3 positions (besides Mingo). Having a 4 year old with another one on the way and being in the middle of a home renovating project I don't have much time for college football so a little help would be great as for which games to set the DVR for.

not sure about individual players yet but i can tell you i'm not in love with the likely cb class...i would agree it's a major need...i tell ya one guy i'd use a 2nd rounder on even though he may be given his size a nickle cb in the pros and not a starting boundary one...the honey badger...dismissed from lsu sure but we need a real playmaker at cb...a guy with a nose for the ball...i'd burn a 2nd on that kid despite his less than ideal size in a heartbeat...

as for positions it's early and all but for what i have seen i say wr, cb, safety and mainly free safety and possibly pass rusher ie situational rusher or stud every down never leave the field de and shift odrick back inside to dt in the rotation...odricks a nice looking edge run defender but he's not thus far shown me much from a pass rush stand point on the outside...and frankly at 300 lbs i don't think he ever will...if i can get a bpa like mingo i jump on it...no matter what pick i have or what my needs are...he's that kind of difference making talent...a ballhawk at free safety would be nice we got just a guy like play from the position these days...barely know clemons is even there against the pass...

i will tell you that i think vernon has nice potential and upside and i expect him not to blow up this year but to show that he deserves another camp at least to show if he's the guy...again though if i can get mingo i don't hesitate...other than the qbs which trump all if that kid given his tools and upside and everyone and their mother looking for the next jpp gets out of the top 5 i'll be floored...the talents just sick

it's only been a week but as of right now i would say qb should be out of the equation...i see some really good things there...and i frankly don't think no matter what they'd give up on him in only a year...and right now frankly there's no reason even to consider it...he's shown better than expected...

this team could definitely use lb depth as in quality depth in case of an injury and some guards that fit the zbs...but we got bigger fish to fry early in the draft imo and positions that carry more weight draft value wise with those picks...

Phinatic8u
09-14-2012, 07:26 AM
Yes Mingo is a ****ing animal. If he's there at our pick we need him.

Nobody else comes close to his pass rushing talent.

TedSlimmJr
09-14-2012, 06:30 PM
Aint no way you'd get me to spend a 2nd rounder on the Sugar Possum. Other than being a liability in man coverage, this is a kid who has been given several chances by Coach Miles and LSU to clean up his act and couldn't do it. He's an instinctive little player, but he makes most of his plays blitzing out of the slot in nickel packages forcing fumbles, etc. because John Chavis knows he's a liability in man-coverage. He makes a lot of plays because he's put in position to make plays. However, his special teams ability both as a returner and on coverage units is outstanding. 4th round is the highest I could go. He's wasn't even the best cover corner on his own team... Tharold Simon is the truth in that regard with Claiborne gone.

I think the corner class is better than people think. Right now they just aren't getting the hype by talking heads and draftniks, and the one's that were getting all the hype by talking heads and draftniks as if they were elite corners (David Amerson for example) can't cover a biscuit with a paper plate.

j-off-her-doll
09-15-2012, 01:28 PM
I don't have a good feel as to how the WR group will shake out, but I think it's important for us to do some real damage in Rounds 2 and 3. The Packers have done the bulk of their heavy lifting at the position in those rounds, and I'd be disappointed if we didn't come away with two very promising WR's before RD 4. But I think Mingo and Werner are the two guys I'm focusing on in RD 1. I can see Woods as a guy who falls to the top of RD 2, and he'd be a great fit for our system.

hooshoops
09-16-2012, 09:08 AM
i won't disagree that the honey badger has some issues in man coverage to date but i think that's more about attitude than physical tools thus far...i think he has plus tools but could be coached up into a heck of a player...that said that's pretty much what we had in vontae regarding the want to and inconsistencies...anyways he looks to me like a pretty dependable tackler and i think he has solid instincts for the ball and has a nose for it...something outside of reshad jones and jimmy wilson i don't see much of in the current core...

MiamiDolphin618
09-16-2012, 11:21 AM
i won't disagree that the honey badger has some issues in man coverage to date but i think that's more about attitude than physical tools thus far...i think he has plus tools but could be coached up into a heck of a player...that said that's pretty much what we had in vontae regarding the want to and inconsistencies...anyways he looks to me like a pretty dependable tackler and i think he has solid instincts for the ball and has a nose for it...something outside of reshad jones and jimmy wilson i don't see much of in the current core...
I would like to see what he could bring to the table as a Safety. Undersized, but solid and willing tackler and doesn't play small. It would get him out of man coverage more often and allow him to use his instincts to find the ball...which he does very very well. That said, all isn't he wanting to play at LSU again next year if they let him back on?

rob19
09-17-2012, 06:00 PM
The fact that he's missing an entire year of college football for checking himself into a rehab clinic for "marijuana" is ****ing laughable. When this story first broke I thought for sure it had to be heroin or cocaine if he was going to miss a whole year. Given that cannabis isn't even physically addictive & has absolutely no physical withdrawal symptoms, I hope the real addicts in there give him ****. His publicist told him to do this to get sympathy & appear that he's "reformed", ala Lindsay Lohan.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEberTUvrsE

If you want to call it psychologically addictive, what the **** ever; chocolate, riding bikes, blowing farts, or basically anything else on the planet can be considered 'psychologically addictive'.

--
Anyway, I know this is way off-topic. I just had to say it.

hooshoops
09-18-2012, 01:08 AM
I would like to see what he could bring to the table as a Safety. Undersized, but solid and willing tackler and doesn't play small. It would get him out of man coverage more often and allow him to use his instincts to find the ball...which he does very very well. That said, all isn't he wanting to play at LSU again next year if they let him back on?

at safety i think he would follow a jimmy wilson path...

TedSlimmJr
09-18-2012, 03:50 PM
Sugar Possum already looks like Jimmy Wilson in man coverage....

http://www.finheaven.com/clear.gif

hooshoops
09-22-2012, 08:15 PM
watching lsu auburn the tigers play another de on some early downs in the rotation #89 edwards who's not a bad player in his own right by the way but mingo is just a different level from everyone else on the field...standing up or with a hand in the dirt this kids beautiful...i'm pounding the table for this kid...his pass rush talents and athleticism and length and the way he looks standing up and redirecting in space is phenomenal...might be the bpa in the draft period...he's like a more athletic looking aldon smith...more upside also

i don't care that the guy will be a liability against the run as a 43 de maybe while he gains weight...bruce irvin went #15 overall and he was light in the pants and not half the physical size specimen this kid is...but mingos gonna test as well if not better

this kids also gonna rock it in stand up lb drills at the combine which means imo 34 or 43 teams will covet him...i can't imagine what that guy would be with 15 lbs of good weight as a 43 end...scary stuff...just a freak as it is

hooshoops
09-22-2012, 08:32 PM
keyed marques wilson today...pretty much won on every route i saw...nice looking vertical player...not seeing much strength but he got off the los well...i see a lot of finesse in his game...possible poor mans aj green like pro...love the size...looks like he can separate against man and in and out of cuts which is key with big wrs...smooth fluid looking player

don't much like the level of competition...

hooshoops
09-22-2012, 09:06 PM
this isn't gonna matter for this upcoming draft but wr sammy watkins looks like he put on some good muscle weight this offseason...thicker but with the same explosion...nice looking damn player right there

TedSlimmJr
09-23-2012, 12:24 PM
watching lsu auburn the tigers play another de on some early downs in the rotation #89 edwards who's not a bad player in his own right by the way but mingo is just a different level from everyone else on the field...standing up or with a hand in the dirt this kids beautiful...i'm pounding the table for this kid...his pass rush talents and athleticism and length and the way he looks standing up and redirecting in space is phenomenal...might be the bpa in the draft period...he's like a more athletic looking aldon smith...more upside also

i don't care that the guy will be a liability against the run as a 43 de maybe while he gains weight...bruce irvin went #15 overall and he was light in the pants and not half the physical size specimen this kid is...but mingos gonna test as well if not better

this kids also gonna rock it in stand up lb drills at the combine which means imo 34 or 43 teams will covet him...i can't imagine what that guy would be with 15 lbs of good weight as a 43 end...scary stuff...just a freak as it is


Mingo would be Corey Lemonier with 15 pounds of good weight. I don't see how anybody could watch the LSU/Auburn and not see that there were two better defensive ends on the field in Lemonier and Montgomery.

I don't see how anybody could've watched any of LSU's games this year and not see that Sam Montgomery is a better player and it's not even up for debate.

Although I do understand your point about Bruce Irvin.... the difference with Irvin being you're talking about a kid who finished 2nd in the entire country with 14 sacks as a Junior despite playing only on 3rd downs. Mingo still doesn't have a sack through 4 games and has only been in on 1 tackle in the last 2 games. He hasn't sacked a quarterback since the Arkansas game last year.

Mingo has hit a wall in his development and it can only be due to a few reasons. He'll always be athletic.

hooshoops
09-26-2012, 03:34 PM
i can understand where someone would say that lemonier and montgomery are better de's than mingo at this point...they're definitely better all around players...montgomerys a little stiff to me but as a 43 de i don't see it as an issue...but what i will absolutely disagree on is that either of those guys have the same level explosion and burst abilities and pass rush upside and football upside period as barkevious mingo...i don't really care if anyone agrees with me on it either...i'll fly solo just fine...

anyways i'm trying to look at draft upgrades/fixes for our dolphins roster right now... most of my attention has been spent on it in looking at college players...and imo barkevious mingo makes a from the jump situational pass rush impact as a pro...a win pass rusher against nfl tackles imo...all the tools to be elite...a top physical talent well worth our 1st round pick wherever it falls...but very likely never to get to us after he blows the doors off the combine with that length that acceleration that long speed those hips and cod...and leaves nfl personnel with their jaws on the floor...

hooshoops
09-26-2012, 03:48 PM
took a look at justin hunter...left me a little underwhelmed...talent and physical abilities are undeniable...serious explosion there...but very raw...route running needs a lot of work...some ugly looking routes...doesn't mean the kid won't be a monster...but he needs someone to teach him how to run routes...comin off an acl last year also...

his teammate patterson is a body catcher...not a natural hands catcher...everything gets into the body...i bet he'll fight the ball with his hands...

datruth55
09-26-2012, 03:54 PM
took a look at justin hunter...left me a little underwhelmed...talent and physical abilities are undeniable...serious explosion there...but very raw...route running needs a lot of work...some ugly looking routes...doesn't mean the kid won't be a monster...but he needs someone to teach him how to run routes...

his teammate patterson is a body catcher...not a natural hands catcher...everything gets into the body...i bet he'll fight the ball with his hands...
Which game did you look at? I haven't been impressed with Hunter in the two games I saw but I was impressed with Patterson in the Florida game. He had an OK game against NCST.

hooshoops
09-26-2012, 04:09 PM
Which game did you look at? I haven't been impressed with Hunter in the two games I saw but I was impressed with Patterson in the Florida game. He had an OK game against NCST.

i've looked at both those games...i think they play georgia this week unless i'm mistaken...i'm gonna look at that one also...hunter is explosive but raw...doesn't press dbs before his cuts in his routes...doesn't sell things well but he's such a high end gifted explosion athlete in college at least he doesn't have to...i like his hands though...a couple drops i seen but that was more about not getting his head around quick enough imo...tyler bray i don't get all the hype there either...he throws more off his back foot than anyone i'd care to have playing under center...talented but also you can tell sometimes he's just throwing it up for grabs...and the kids a straight up punk...needs to have someone take him down a few notches...

patterson doesn't get much separation...but he's got pretty good ball awareness...and again i'm having a hard time seeing this kid hand catch anything...bread and butter seems to be slant routes but he'll catch in traffic...saw some back shoulder stuff to him that imo was all about bray and not much about the route being run...just perfectly placed back shoulder darts

hooshoops
09-26-2012, 04:23 PM
there was a te #11 for florida named reed who i thought was interesting...but he looked like he's probably undersized and that was my first exposure...anyways i thought he showed some things...

datruth55
09-26-2012, 04:41 PM
i've looked at both those games...i think they play georgia this week unless i'm mistaken...i'm gonna look at that one also...hunter is explosive but raw...doesn't press dbs before his cuts in his routes...doesn't sell things well but he's such a high end gifted explosion athlete in college at least he doesn't have to...i like his hands though...a couple drops i seen but that was more about not getting his head around quick enough imo...tyler bray i don't get all the hype there either...he throws more off his back foot than anyone i'd care to have playing under center...talented but also you can tell sometimes he's just throwing it up for grabs...and the kids a straight up punk...needs to have someone take him down a few notches...

patterson doesn't get much separation...but he's got pretty good ball awareness...and again i'm having a hard time seeing this kid hand catch anything...bread and butter seems to be slant routes but he'll catch in traffic...saw some back shoulder stuff to him that imo was all about bray and not much about the route being run...just perfectly placed back shoulder darts
Don't like Bray, never have. Think he's got a bad attitude...worse than Jay Cutler without as much talent. I was impressed with Patterson in the way he fought for the ball in traffic and won...not much separation, you're right there but with a guy in his pocket he was still strong enough to come up with the catch.

I would prefer to stay away from those high end, athletic WRs that can't run routes. More often than not they never seem to get it in the NFL and with an offense like ours where the routes are so important I'd rather go another direction. We don't need another Carl Pickens from Tennessee in the NFL...at least not in Miami.

MiamiDolphin618
09-27-2012, 11:34 AM
Don't like Bray, never have. Think he's got a bad attitude...worse than Jay Cutler without as much talent. I was impressed with Patterson in the way he fought for the ball in traffic and won...not much separation, you're right there but with a guy in his pocket he was still strong enough to come up with the catch.

I would prefer to stay away from those high end, athletic WRs that can't run routes. More often than not they never seem to get it in the NFL and with an offense like ours where the routes are so important I'd rather go another direction. We don't need another Carl Pickens from Tennessee in the NFL...at least not in Miami.
Especially in the first round or two. I see some really good things with Hunter, but I just don't see him in the same class as Allen, Wilson, or Woods. Physical talent wise he is better, but as a player right now he is not. If we are going to draft a WR early I want a polished player who is going to come in and make an impact immediately. We can't afford to wait

ChambersWI
09-27-2012, 11:45 AM
Don't like Bray, never have. Think he's got a bad attitude...worse than Jay Cutler without as much talent. I was impressed with Patterson in the way he fought for the ball in traffic and won...not much separation, you're right there but with a guy in his pocket he was still strong enough to come up with the catch.

I would prefer to stay away from those high end, athletic WRs that can't run routes. More often than not they never seem to get it in the NFL and with an offense like ours where the routes are so important I'd rather go another direction. We don't need another Carl Pickens from Tennessee in the NFL...at least not in Miami.

people either love Bray or hate him. I got a kick out of him during his freshmen year with his X celebration.

TedSlimmJr
09-27-2012, 12:47 PM
Tyler Bray's arm talent is terrific, the problem is, that's about the extent of the positives with him as far as I'm concerned. His delivery is elongated and he constantly double clutches the ball. Telegraphs his throws with his lower body by opening his hips directly to the target in order to make up some of the timing lost by his slow, elongated release.

His ball placement and accuracy is sporadic. I see significant YAC opportunities for his receivers left on the field due to inaccuracy. His poor ball placement doesn't stand out as much against SEC competition because his receivers are covered much tighter.... where it stands out the most is against lesser competition because his receivers get so wide open against this level of talent. I watched Justin Hunter literally have to drop to the ground to catch Bray's passes against Georgia St. when there wasn't a defender within 15 yards of him.... leaving significant run-after-catch yards on the field.

He also gets rattled easily. His decision making goes down the drain under pressure.

However, the most critical flaw that Bray has is in the intangible department. A lack of leadership and maturity.

The coaching staff was hoping he would become a leader and dedicate himself to film study in the offseason, but it didn't happen. He was busy throwing beer bottles off balconies and breaking car windshields rather than working on his craft...

http://www.govolsxtra.com/news/2012/jul/25/tyler-bray-roommate-accused-of-throwing-beer-off/



Not surprisingly, about two weeks later he was back in front of a judge for a jet skit incident....

http://www.govolsxtra.com/news/2012/aug/08/bray-to-be-back-in-court-on-boating-charge/



Personally, I don't see much that he has to offer me on or off the field that would make me want to burn a draft pick on him.

hooshoops
09-27-2012, 07:46 PM
Especially in the first round or two. I see some really good things with Hunter, but I just don't see him in the same class as Allen, Wilson, or Woods. Physical talent wise he is better, but as a player right now he is not. If we are going to draft a WR early I want a polished player who is going to come in and make an impact immediately. We can't afford to wait

bingo...i think if you take hunter you're gonna have to wait on him to develop before he really helps you...couldn't agree more with he lacks the polish of a wilson or allen or woods...very raw talent...i think i like wilson the most of the big wrs although the kid that got kicked out of tennessee may be the most talented of the bunch i have only seen him in bits and pieces but that guys got some serious your either born with it or your not abilities imo...i've seen a few things that i was left like "wow"...

i just wish wilson was playing against sec level comp so i could gauge him better...got oregon this week and i got the dvr set and thats better than colorado and such but it's still not the level i'd like to see how he fares against...that said i see pretty good polish with wilson...i think he helps someone immediately

woods i haven't seen the same player i saw as a freshman...i remember talking to slimm when that kid was a first year starter and stud and we were both like wow that kids filthy...he hasn't been the same since he hurt that ankle which he even had surgery with this last offseason...not the same explosion and burst player...if i could get the guy i saw on freshman tape i'd jump all over woods with a high round 1 pick but somethings a miss in his game...

i really like allen i'm just not sure i see a wr that i feel comfortable burning a high top 15 first round pick on in this group...might be wise to wait on receiver to round 2 and fill another need...one of them could drop to us high in round 2...

hooshoops
09-27-2012, 08:00 PM
Tyler Bray's arm talent is terrific, the problem is, that's about the extent of the positives with him as far as I'm concerned. His delivery is elongated and he constantly double clutches the ball. Telegraphs his throws with his lower body by opening his hips directly to the target in order to make up some of the timing lost by his slow, elongated release.

His ball placement and accuracy is sporadic. I see significant YAC opportunities for his receivers left on the field due to inaccuracy. His poor ball placement doesn't stand out as much against SEC competition because his receivers are covered much tighter.... where it stands out the most is against lesser competition because his receivers get so wide open against this level of talent. I watched Justin Hunter literally have to drop to the ground to catch Bray's passes against Georgia St. when there wasn't a defender within 15 yards of him.... leaving significant run-after-catch yards on the field.

He also gets rattled easily. His decision making goes down the drain under pressure.

However, the most critical flaw that Bray has is in the intangible department. A lack of leadership and maturity.

The coaching staff was hoping he would become a leader and dedicate himself to film study in the offseason, but it didn't happen. He was busy throwing beer bottles off balconies and breaking car windshields rather than working on his craft...

http://www.govolsxtra.com/news/2012/jul/25/tyler-bray-roommate-accused-of-throwing-beer-off/



Not surprisingly, about two weeks later he was back in front of a judge for a jet skit incident....

http://www.govolsxtra.com/news/2012/aug/08/bray-to-be-back-in-court-on-boating-charge/



Personally, I don't see much that he has to offer me on or off the field that would make me want to burn a draft pick on him.

that's a great point right there...

ChambersWI
09-27-2012, 08:04 PM
bingo...i think if you take hunter you're gonna have to wait on him to develop before he really helps you...couldn't agree more with he lacks the polish of a wilson or allen or woods...very raw talent...i think i like wilson the most of the big wrs although the kid that got kicked out of tennessee may be the most talented of the bunch i have only seen him in bits and pieces but that guys got some serious your either born with it or your not abilities imo...i've seen a few things that i was left like "wow"...

i just wish wilson was playing against sec level comp so i could gauge him better...got oregon this week and i got the dvr set and thats better than colorado and such but it's still not the level i'd like to see how he fares against...that said i see pretty good polish with wilson...i think he helps someone immediately

woods i haven't seen the same player i saw as a freshman...i remember talking to slimm when that kid was a first year starter and stud and we were both like wow that kids filthy...he hasn't been the same since he hurt that ankle which he even had surgery with this last offseason...not the same explosion and burst player...if i could get the guy i saw on freshman tape i'd jump all over woods with a high round 1 pick but somethings a miss in his game...

i really like allen i'm just not sure i see a wr that i feel comfortable burning a high top 15 first round pick on in this group...might be wise to wait on receiver to round 2 and fill another need...one of them could drop to us high in round 2...

I think Hunter/Allen/Woods if all are healthy are worth gambling on. The question becomes where we are drafting. If we're top 10 and we have a chance at Jarvis Jones or Barkevious Mingo do we pass on them for Robert Woods, Justin Hunter, or Keenan Allen?

hooshoops
09-27-2012, 08:08 PM
I think Hunter/Allen/Woods if all are healthy are worth gambling on. The question becomes where we are drafting. If we're top 10 and we have a chance at Jarvis Jones or Barkevious Mingo do we pass on them for Robert Woods, Justin Hunter, or Keenan Allen?

you already know my answer on that...although jones looks very much like a 34 olb to me...i guess we could use him like a von miller as a 43 lb...not sure i think it's the best fit though...anyways premium elite pass rush talents i would not pass up for anything else in this likely upcoming class...i still think when it's all said and done we are gonna win too many games though to get a truly elite pass rush talent...

not a marques wilson fan huh???

hooshoops
09-30-2012, 10:23 AM
trying to figure out wr terrence williams...he looks like more than just a big body to me...i think i see some suddenness to his game and some ability to separate at the next level...got more going for him than patrick turner did...hard to say if he can get off press yet given all these soft damn coverages and free releases he faces every week...terrence williams needs to come to the senior bowl week and show in one on ones he can get off press and separate in and out of his cuts...it's gonna be a big week for that kid and i'll be paying attention...for a big body i don't see a lot of stiffness in his hips...i think i see some long speed there also...right now i have him as a 3rd round grade with the ability senior bowl week to bump up into the top 50...

MiamiDolphin618
10-02-2012, 07:43 PM
Any top notch CBs coming out this year? I know Slimm was high on the OK St kid..high end tools. I haven't watched him play though. Seen some good things out of Rhodes from FL St as well. Also, any idea where some of these top safeties are going to come off the board. Reid, Whitley, Elam, etc (if they come out)

TedSlimmJr
10-02-2012, 08:12 PM
Any top notch CBs coming out this year? I know Slimm was high on the OK St kid..high end tools. I haven't watched him play though. Seen some good things out of Rhodes from FL St as well. Also, any idea where some of these top safeties are going to come off the board. Reid, Whitley, Elam, etc (if they come out)

It shouldn't necessarily be this way, but what's going to determine where some of these safeties come off the board is how well they run in workouts in a pair of shorts. It'll mean a round's worth of difference for some of these kids.

Johnathan Banks has the best ball skills on the defensive side of the ball in the entire country. It's not just the interceptions that he gets, it's HOW he gets 'em. He knows what to do with it when he does... his 3 career INT returns for TD's leads all active players in the country. Well, it's actually tied with his teammate Corey Broomfield, but Banks is the better player. Broomfield moved to safety because of another underrated CB on Miss St.'s roster by the name of Darius Slay. Broomfield is undersized at safety, but he does what's necessary for the team and plays great team defense.

I make it a point to watch 3 CB's from the FCS every week in B.W. Webb, Robert Alford, and Marcus Williams, and they never disappoint. Webb looks terrific even against BCS teams (Maryland, etc.)


I like Banks, Jordan Poyer, Desmond Trufant, Terry Hawthorne, Broderick Brown, Leon McFadden, D.J. Hayden, B.W.Webb, Marcus Williams, Darius Slay, Corey Broomfield, T'Sharvan Bell, Prentiss Waggner, and Johnny Adams in terms of Seniors.

As far as underclassman go, Justin Gilbert, Xavier Rhodes, Ricardo Allen, Dee Milliner, Tharold Simon, Andre Hal, Kyle Fuller, Carrington Byndom, and Darqueze Dennard are all good players in my estimation.

adrianbello360
10-02-2012, 08:24 PM
What different Wide Recievers are we looking at getting this years draft? What about TE's too? Fasano is in his contract year

MiamiDolphin618
10-02-2012, 09:20 PM
It shouldn't necessarily be this way, but what's going to determine where some of these safeties come off the board is how well they run in workouts in a pair of shorts. It'll mean a round's worth of difference for some of these kids.

Johnathan Banks has the best ball skills on the defensive side of the ball in the entire country. It's not just the interceptions that he gets, it's HOW he gets 'em. He knows what to do with it when he does... his 3 career INT returns for TD's leads all active players in the country. Well, it's actually tied with his teammate Corey Broomfield, but Banks is the better player. Broomfield moved to safety because of another underrated CB on Miss St.'s roster by the name of Darius Slay. Broomfield is undersized at safety, but he does what's necessary for the team and plays great team defense.

I make it a point to watch 3 CB's from the FCS every week in B.W. Webb, Robert Alford, and Marcus Williams, and they never disappoint. Webb looks terrific even against BCS teams (Maryland, etc.)


I like Banks, Jordan Poyer, Desmond Trufant, Terry Hawthorne, Broderick Brown, Leon McFadden, D.J. Hayden, B.W.Webb, Marcus Williams, Darius Slay, Corey Broomfield, T'Sharvan Bell, Prentiss Waggner, and Johnny Adams in terms of Seniors.

As far as underclassman go, Justin Gilbert, Xavier Rhodes, Ricardo Allen, Dee Milliner, Tharold Simon, Andre Hal, Kyle Fuller, Carrington Byndom, and Darqueze Dennard are all good players in my estimation.
I will have to see if I can see a few of these guys play this year. I have seen Banks play and liked what I saw out of him. Ive also seen Hawthorne and Adams...I liked Hawthorne more between those two. Tharold Simon is a solid prospect IMO. What do you see out of Milliner? I saw one game where he looked sloppy out there..then another where he looked like a 1st round prospect.

TedSlimmJr
10-02-2012, 10:16 PM
I will have to see if I can see a few of these guys play this year. I have seen Banks play and liked what I saw out of him. Ive also seen Hawthorne and Adams...I liked Hawthorne more between those two. Tharold Simon is a solid prospect IMO. What do you see out of Milliner? I saw one game where he looked sloppy out there..then another where he looked like a 1st round prospect.

I see the best cover corner in the country in Milliner. We can leave him on an island in any situation, let him play bump-and-run, press, or any variety of man techniques and feel comfortable that he's going to do the job. I can't imagine what game you saw where he looked sloppy.

MiamiDolphin618
10-02-2012, 11:39 PM
I see the best cover corner in the country in Milliner. We can leave him on an island in any situation, let him play bump-and-run, press, or any variety of man techniques and feel comfortable that he's going to do the job. I can't imagine what game you saw where he looked sloppy.
I want to say Arkansas but to be honest I am not sure. I didn't mean sloppy as in getting torched all over the field...just not what I have seen out of him in previous games. You watch a wholeeee lot more Bama than I do so Ill take your word for it. This Miami defense needs a corner they can leave on an island thats for sure..

TedSlimmJr
10-03-2012, 12:06 AM
Well, we dominated Arkansas in every phase of the game and shut 'em out. Milliner had a pick that he almost returned for a TD that was called back due to a penalty.

He's basically leading the country in passes defended and has really only played about 11 full quarters worth of football. We didn't play him at all against Western Kentucky and essentially only played the first half against Florida Atlantic and Arkansas.

If he declares early, I don't see why he wouldn't be the first CB selected. Milliner has improved his football IQ tremendously since he was a freshman and has no tackling deficiencies... strong tackler and always been a physical player and a big hitter.

I remember his freshman year when shed his block and proceeded to knock Denarius Moore cold as a door knob...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bcu6TCZ0HMM

datruth55
10-03-2012, 10:52 AM
Well, we dominated Arkansas in every phase of the game and shut 'em out.
Has anybody not dominated Arkansas this year?

hooshoops
10-04-2012, 01:54 PM
not really seeing a cb that i'd take with our high 1st round pick...no one that just jumps off the screen at me...jarvis jones against tennessee didn't look like a top 5 worthy pick to me either...but that was just one game...i doubt he's a legitimate 6 ft 2 and that medical with that severe neck injury he suffered may hurt him...gonna be some serious eyeballing of his neck xrays etc at the combine...whatever happens with him that kids a lb all the way...there's no possible 43 end there

at safety more importantly free safety i think the value falls in rounds 2-3...in that range is where i'd target one...probably where i'd target my corner also...

not really all that in love with a woerner or a montgomery with our high round 1 pick...not enough explosive edge burst pass rush upside with either imo to warrant it given our needs at the positon...which is almost all pass rush

leaning towards a wr high in round 1 the way things are looking...keenan allens size and tools are hard to find...might be the best route...not sure i think he warrants a top 10 pick or so but there's only a few guys i would take over him...not in love with the quality or depth of this draft...i guess high round 1 quality given we aren't looking for a qb i see as lacking...feels good though not to have to spend so much time looking at qbs...

of course if we go into free agency and lets say grab a greg jennings my thoughts would change with the high 1st rounder...

ChambersWI
10-04-2012, 09:37 PM
Star Lotulelei looking really good tonight. Of course, we don't need him.

MiamiDolphin618
10-10-2012, 03:08 PM
of course if we go into free agency and lets say grab a greg jennings my thoughts would change with the high 1st rounder...
This would be the ideal situation. Greg Jennings, Hartline, and Bess isn't too shabby. Then maybe you add a guy like Steadman Bailey in the 2nd or a Ryan Swope in the 3rd etc...and hope Rishard Mattews can develop.

We need a pass rusher in the worst way...I really like Lemonier out of Auburn...explosive and athletic. I also like James Gayle just not in the high first round right now.

I think TE is becoming an emerging need for us. Tannehill needs a reliable TE...and I like Fasano but he's basically a ghost in the passing game. Clay just isn't where I thought he'd be..and until Egnew gets himself on the active roster we have to assume he's not performing. Id be looking for the best pass catching TE available in the 2nd or 3rd round.

At safety...I really really like Whitley and Vaccaro. Both who I think could be options in the 2nd round.

Basically we have plenty of options to go...and I think this defense is a few pieces away from being elite..get them another edge rusher and another safety who can find the ball they will be just fine. However, this team is going to live and die with Tannehill. My priority is surrounding him with as many weapons as possible to continue his development. This team could be scary next year if everything falls into place.

Gonzo
10-10-2012, 04:03 PM
I can't tell you how nice it is to be reading about the draft and not having to discuss the QB position. About time.

Sent from my VS910 4G using Tapatalk 2

j-off-her-doll
10-13-2012, 09:30 AM
The pro Lemonier reminds me the most of is Cam Wake.

Kdawg954
10-13-2012, 11:00 AM
not really seeing a cb that i'd take with our high 1st round pick...no one that just jumps off the screen at me...jarvis jones against tennessee didn't look like a top 5 worthy pick to me either...but that was just one game...i doubt he's a legitimate 6 ft 2 and that medical with that severe neck injury he suffered may hurt him...gonna be some serious eyeballing of his neck xrays etc at the combine...whatever happens with him that kids a lb all the way...there's no possible 43 end there

at safety more importantly free safety i think the value falls in rounds 2-3...in that range is where i'd target one...probably where i'd target my corner also...

not really all that in love with a woerner or a montgomery with our high round 1 pick...not enough explosive edge burst pass rush upside with either imo to warrant it given our needs at the positon...which is almost all pass rush

leaning towards a wr high in round 1 the way things are looking...keenan allens size and tools are hard to find...might be the best route...not sure i think he warrants a top 10 pick or so but there's only a few guys i would take over him...not in love with the quality or depth of this draft...i guess high round 1 quality given we aren't looking for a qb i see as lacking...feels good though not to have to spend so much time looking at qbs...

of course if we go into free agency and lets say grab a greg jennings my thoughts would change with the high 1st rounder...

Miami needs to take the BPA that is not a QB . . . hopefully a DE (pass rusher), WR or DB, but I wouldn't exclude linebacker, oline or DT from the list either. Miami needs impact guys but they most certainly need better depth all over. I will say this is a GREAT year to have multiple 2nd and 3rd round picks as I agree that its starting to look like the "value" of the draft will be had on Day 2. I have seen threads talking about Miami trading away those picks and either getting a player or moving back into the 1st . . . . no, no no . . . if anything if Miami doesn't feel a guy they want is there at their selection in round 1, they need to trade back and pick up another 2nd day pick or 2 . . . . . build the depth of this team.

I still wanna see guys like Vernon, Miller, Matthews and hopefully Egnew develop further. It will also be interesting to see who we resign and who do we target in FA. This team could look extremely promising come next year after FA and the draft.

ckparrothead
10-15-2012, 04:47 PM
This defensive end class is too talented to ignore. Two more guys I was just looking at the other day that kind of blew me away were Quanterus Smith of Western Kentucky and Walter Stewart of Cincinnati. Incidentally, what the hell do they put in the water at Cincinnati. They keep producing these unusually explosive defensive linemen.

Stewart has sticks of dynamite in his ankles and Smith is just brutal and relentless with good use of hands as a pass rusher, and the ability to be an every down defensive end.

ckparrothead
10-15-2012, 04:52 PM
What I like about Terrance Williams is he's a true perimeter specialist. He's got the speed and RAC ability to do some damage from the slot, but he seems less comfortable there and it seems to me like a higher percentage of his drops come from his work there. But on the perimeter, what I like is that in that Art Briles system with his insanely wide WR splits, this compresses the space that Terrance Williams has to win on the outside. He's got a smaller highway between the coverage and the sideline, but he seems perfectly comfortable with using every inch of the field available to him and negotiating the sideline. He's got the size/speed to where you'd really better watch out if you're trying to single cover him deep on a streak. But he also gets open for comebacks and out breaking routes.

With the wide splits in Briles' offense I tend to think of the slot players as the ones that benefit a little more as the splits give them almost a CFL field to work with. Those are just my thoughts on the matter.

TedSlimmJr
10-16-2012, 12:01 AM
Quanterus Smith really is a terrific player. I've talked about him for a while going back to my underrated Seniors thread. I watched him beat us for 3 sacks in Bryant Denny because we couldn't block him. He's one of those players that I make it a point to go back and watch every week.

Willie Taggert is one of the most underrated coaches in college football, and I see within his players on both sides of the ball. Western Kentucky is the most fundamentally sound football team in the Sun-Belt conference, and one of the 10 best coached teams in the entire country week in and week out. Coach Taggert will get a big head coaching job when he wants it.

If I were an SEC team like Kentucky that needs a good, solid developer of talent and a good recruiter, Taggert would be at the top. Kentucky would play a competitive brand of SEC football under a guy like Taggert.

rob19
10-16-2012, 09:47 AM
Hoops is this a weak QB class? Not saying the Dolphins are in the market, I'm just asking about it's relative strength compared to previous classes.

To me it appears that way at the top, because I know a lot of you have your reservations about Geno Smith, & I think Matt Barkley has probably underwhelmed compared to most people's expectations. I'm also not sure how crazy you guy's are about Tyler Wilson & Tyler Bray.

rob19
10-16-2012, 09:58 AM
You could throw Logan Thomas & Landry Jones in there as well I guess.

hooshoops
10-20-2012, 02:39 PM
found me an offensive tackle that i really like in the event we let jake long walk after the season...jake matthews of texas a & m looks like a perfect fit for our offense and a plug and play right tackle...he's got plus feet good athleticism and movement skills can get to the 2nd level and make solid sustained contact...i see a very aware tackle when he combo blocks initially on the inside he has the awareness and feet to come off and pick up delayed edge rushers no problem...really good looking player...sits down well in pass pro...able to recover and anchor rarely off balance...i think people are sleeping on this kid...

1st round grade for me...someone i think is gonna rise come draft eval time...and someone i bet mike sherman is gonna vouge for if jake exits...i'd like to get him high round 2 but i don't know that you can wait off what i see...

his teammate joeckels a stud also but we're not sniffing that given where we are gonna finish...i see prototype left tackle stuff there...big fan of both these tackles

ROADRUNNER
10-20-2012, 02:44 PM
I will look out for him, im watching the game now.............

hooshoops
10-21-2012, 10:10 AM
The pro Lemonier reminds me the most of is Cam Wake.

i don't see the same level explosive edge rush qualities...people don't understand cam wake outside of some pretty stiff hips has rediculous edge rush tools...

hooshoops
10-21-2012, 10:18 AM
k states arthur brown is an undersized instinctual mike backer that i view as terrific depth and potential starter down the line should dansby exit...only a 43 fit due to his size might be 6 ft might be 230 lbs brown has the instincts first and foremost you look for...reads his keys very well looks like a student of the game to me his diagnosis and tracking of the ball abilities are high end...shoots gaps in run support a very dependable tackler and packs a punch can run and find work can sift through traffic and make plays on the ball good speed can cover down the seam and underneath and limits rac i don't quite have him as explosive a prospect as i did nebraskas lavonte david last year despite the similar size but i see arthur brown as a terrific selection with one of those 3rd round picks and a steal if his size dropped him any further...frankly only reason i think he gets to the 3rd round is size...most 34 teams will not have him on their board as a base lb as a result

arthur brown is a player i would pound the table for with a 3rd round pick as a 43 mike backer and depth player...make no mistake about it...this team needs better quality lb depth...

hooshoops
10-21-2012, 11:18 AM
miss st cb jonathon banks possesses fantastic length and rediculous vine like arms and the best ball skills in the entire draft class at the position...i see some serious awareness with this kid...man or zone he looks very comfortable...at times it looks like he's peeking in the backfield a little too much and relying on his acceleration and long stride to recover but the ball skills and the way he plays the man and the ball are undeniable...i see some pretty good feet and he looks like while tackling is not gonna be a real strength he's a willing tackler and has some nastiness to him...

this is the one cb for me that i'd have to think long and hard about with our top pick if he got to me...i'm gonna be watching this kid closely at the combine to see what kind of long speed he has and at that length how much stiffness there is in his hips...i'm not seeing much change of direction looks pretty good love the feet love the length absolutely love the awareness and ball skills...

his teammate at safety nickoe whitley is a stick of damn dynamite...enforcer right there...looks like though at times he'll just drop his head and look for the kill shot and miss in space though...but cannot deny that guys a physical force...hips look pretty fluid also to me

bama miss st is a must watch next week fellas...

Fin Thirteen
10-22-2012, 03:42 PM
miss st cb jonathon banks possesses fantastic length and rediculous vine like arms and the best ball skills in the entire draft class at the position...i see some serious awareness with this kid...man or zone he looks very comfortable...at times it looks like he's peeking in the backfield a little too much and relying on his acceleration and long stride to recover but the ball skills and the way he plays the man and the ball are undeniable...i see some pretty good feet and he looks like while tackling is not gonna be a real strength he's a willing tackler and has some nastiness to him...

this is the one cb for me that i'd have to think long and hard about with our top pick if he got to me...i'm gonna be watching this kid closely at the combine to see what kind of long speed he has and at that length how much stiffness there is in his hips...i'm not seeing much change of direction looks pretty good love the feet love the length absolutely love the awareness and ball skills...

his teammate at safety nickoe whitley is a stick of damn dynamite...enforcer right there...looks like though at times he'll just drop his head and look for the kill shot and miss in space though...but cannot deny that guys a physical force...hips look pretty fluid also to me

bama miss st is a must watch next week fellas...

Yes, yes, yes on Banks. He is a Coyle-type player, if you ask me.

hooshoops
11-04-2012, 09:48 AM
watched nickoe whitley miss a ton of tackles yesterday...i mean a ton...head down looking for kill shots or taking bad angles...

i like sean porter but i think he's an olb in a 43 scheme and not a win edge pass rusher against nfl tackles...more a blitz pass rusher at the next level...but kids explosive...more raw a pass rusher than chase thomas although i think they will both will bring the same thing pretty much as pros pass rush wise...although i think thomas has more strength in his hands...

dion jordan is long and lean and athletic and explosive and i like the way he gets off the ball but god is that kids pass rush raw...didn't see much arsenal just run around guys off the edge did most his damage when he was lined up across from a te one on one did see a nice dip move to gain the edge...but i think his rush tools are less refined than bruce irvins last year...

another game another a effort from the a & m tackles...jake matthews and joeckel never let a miss st end sniff the qb...that's mississippi states biggest problem on d not a win pass rusher on the field anywhere... matthews is a #1st round tackle fellas...all the way...perfect fit for a zbs

bamas ed lacy is a back that at the beginning of the year i called your run of the mill downhill big back...well i've changed my mind on that...he's got better feet and a more burst to him than i gave him credit for...and being that i think this team needs a better option in short yardage and goalline and to punish the defense with a big back in the 4th quarter etc i see him as a good fit...not sure how much i like that spin move in traffic however...

intrigued by oregon mike backer kiko alonzo although i have some reservations of how well he'll fit in a traditional base d...seems to me like a lot of those oregon defenders are tough projections...i like his instincts though and he was very fluid when asked to drop in pass d...

lsu mike backer donte mintner is a guy i like b/t the tackles...i question his speed on anything outside and down the field in coverage but with a mid round pick he's someone that interest me...might only be a two down backer at the next level...

other than arthur brown who i love i also like bamas cj moseley as a mike backer...insitinctual and with good speed only concern i have there is he looks like he's not very strong at the poa...

eric reid looked stiff in coverage to me yesterday kind of thing i've seen all year with him...he's got stiffness in his hips has a tough time making the transition from his pedal...looks more and more like a ss at the next level to me every day...

oklahomas tony jefferson is a safety i've had my eye on this year...i see a player that's very good at reading his run keys and attacking the los and a pretty sure tackler...if he sees it he attacks it if it's in front of him...looks like he has pretty good hips and quick acceleration also only question i have is is he more a strong safety or free at the next level...i lean free...anyways i have a solid 2nd round grade there...some questions about coverage i'd like to see answered

hooshoops
11-07-2012, 11:11 PM
a fluid list of miami targets in the top 3 rounds as i see it right now off my to date study...

wr
keenan allen
robert woods
terrence williams
steadman bailey
quinton patton
marquess wilson

slot wr
tavon austin
ryan swope

cb
jonathon banks
desmond trufant

safety
kenny vaccaro
tony jefferson

te
tyler eifert
zach ertz

ot
jake matthews
taylor lewan
oday aboushi

og
jonathon cooper
chance warmack

rt/og
barrett jones

de
alex okafor
dion jordan
tank carradine

dt
will sutton

43 mlb
arthur brown
cj moseley

ROADRUNNER
11-09-2012, 12:17 PM
Hoops you think we need to look at DT in this draft................

Fin Thirteen
11-09-2012, 01:41 PM
Hoops,

Been watching Kiko Alonso quite a bit and nobody's talking about this guy. I've mentioned him in a few threads. He has a bagful of character concerns from past years but nothing recent, seems to have turned a corner. I like him a lot and he's going to be there in the third. As you say, very fluid and a good reader of the game. Solid tackler, takes a direct line to the ball.

Agree with you that Reid is a SS in the NFL, but, unlike Jefferson, he is a ballhawk and a playmaker. Jefferson is ridiculously smart and decisive, but he won't bring you turnovers. I don't think Coyle will want another player in the secondary who doesn't come into the draft with a track record of takeaways, sacks and or forced fumbles. Reid is much more of a project than Jefferson, but the end product will be better IMO.

You already know how I feel about Chase Thomas. Dion Jordan is fascinating, he could be a really interesting hybrid player in the NFL who gives offences a certain look pre-snap but moves all over the place, sometimes on the slot, sometimes covering TEs, sometimes with his hand in the ground, sometimes on the blitz from the A gap.

ChambersWI
11-09-2012, 02:18 PM
glad to see you mention Little Trufant Hoops. Fairly underrated prospect IMO who has been on some pretty crappy defenses.

Austin Tatious
11-10-2012, 08:40 PM
This defensive end class is too talented to ignore. Two more guys I was just looking at the other day that kind of blew me away were Quanterus Smith of Western Kentucky and Walter Stewart of Cincinnati. Incidentally, what the hell do they put in the water at Cincinnati. They keep producing these unusually explosive defensive linemen.

Stewart has sticks of dynamite in his ankles and Smith is just brutal and relentless with good use of hands as a pass rusher, and the ability to be an every down defensive end.

With good depth at DE, maybe we can wait until the 3rd for a DE. Which leaves our first and second rounders on defensive backfield and receivers. If I walk out with Banks/Milliner in the first with a second round receiver like Stedman Bailey then I'd be ecstatic. Still a couple of day two picks for an end, linebacker, safety, or guard.

Austin Tatious
11-10-2012, 08:43 PM
Hoops you don't have Milliner at corner? I like him. He knows how to play. I think he projects well. You know his skills will translate. Saban's system doesn't hide you at corner. We would know what we are getting with the kid.

Since there seems to be more depth at receiver, I am coming to the conclusion I want to grab a corner in round one. Although a Justin Hunter style receiver with size and speed could work well too. Still a major need for speed and playmakers. Too many impact players still needed.

hooshoops
11-14-2012, 04:59 PM
Hoops you think we need to look at DT in this draft................

you lose starks and mcdaniel and dt is a need...but more than that will sutton is a freaking animal as an interior pass rusher...loses some steam when shifted outside to end but if there's a better interior pass rusher in college football i haven't seen him...cat quick into gaps plays with great leverage and strength and when he gets there he finishes...this is a guy no ones talking about cause he plays for arizona st but he just wrecks people...beat cal by himself...43 pentrating dt premium talent...only questions are how tall is he and what's he weigh??? i'm thinking comes in at 6 ft 2 290...

Fin Thirteen
11-14-2012, 05:13 PM
At TE, Ertz blows in my opinion. If I'm going all-rounder and Eifert is gone, it's Stoneburner, followed some distance behind by Gragg.

if its receiver-type TE with limited blocking assignments, it could be Fauria. I'd give Ertz about a 4th round grade.

hooshoops
11-14-2012, 05:20 PM
Hoops,

Been watching Kiko Alonso quite a bit and nobody's talking about this guy. I've mentioned him in a few threads. He has a bagful of character concerns from past years but nothing recent, seems to have turned a corner. I like him a lot and he's going to be there in the third. As you say, very fluid and a good reader of the game. Solid tackler, takes a direct line to the ball.

Agree with you that Reid is a SS in the NFL, but, unlike Jefferson, he is a ballhawk and a playmaker. Jefferson is ridiculously smart and decisive, but he won't bring you turnovers. I don't think Coyle will want another player in the secondary who doesn't come into the draft with a track record of takeaways, sacks and or forced fumbles. Reid is much more of a project than Jefferson, but the end product will be better IMO.

You already know how I feel about Chase Thomas. Dion Jordan is fascinating, he could be a really interesting hybrid player in the NFL who gives offences a certain look pre-snap but moves all over the place, sometimes on the slot, sometimes covering TEs, sometimes with his hand in the ground, sometimes on the blitz from the A gap.

interesting points about jefferson...ones that i'd be willing to go along with actually after watching his tape...might be a more average pro cause he doesn't make splash play turnovers...but hes instinctual and when it's in front of him and he sees it he's on it...as for reid i think his issue in the pros is gonna be coverage...i think he'll be exposed in coverage...not as fluid a player as mark barron was last year more difficulty coming out of his pedal etc...

adding a wr to my list of targets after reviewing marcus wheaten tape i like that...top 50 guy for me...his ability to separate in his routes really stands out...nice burst i like his body and the way he locates the ball...very quick...offers specials returns also...looks like a guy that philbin ould covet and i think he plays smart...so iding coverage and running routes off of it i think he can do...separation though impressive and it will translate to the next level...interested in seeing if he's over 5 ft 11 though...one thing that i question is what can he offer in the red and tight red...i don't see a win high point the ball guy or run fades with guy...but i'm a fan...and he's a target for me

hooshoops
11-14-2012, 05:25 PM
glad to see you mention Little Trufant Hoops. Fairly underrated prospect IMO who has been on some pretty crappy defenses.

trufants kind of hit and miss for me...some games i really like him like top 50 others i say 3rd round and wonder how tall is that kid...looks like he has long speed and he's a guy who gets his hands on you at the los and jams you and makes you work off of it...can reroute guys...by far for me though best in press man

down the road i like that redshirt freshman teammate cb of his an awful lot #21 i know that...love that size and he's got tools...plays more off coverage than trufant though

Fin Thirteen
11-14-2012, 05:27 PM
I've been on the Wheaton bandwagon. Very low risk of failure pick, IMO. Another guy in the same mould is Anthony Amos of MTSU. Smallish and not lightning quick but gets separation and is a deep ball vacuum cleaner. Catching ability off the charts.

hooshoops
11-14-2012, 05:41 PM
Hoops you don't have Milliner at corner? I like him. He knows how to play. I think he projects well. You know his skills will translate. Saban's system doesn't hide you at corner. We would know what we are getting with the kid.

Since there seems to be more depth at receiver, I am coming to the conclusion I want to grab a corner in round one. Although a Justin Hunter style receiver with size and speed could work well too. Still a major need for speed and playmakers. Too many impact players still needed.

i don't have milliner cause i don't think he gets to us...why i don't have a mingo etc either...i think milliner can show some issues in off man at times and he can miss some tackles one on one at times but i also think he's the best in run support cb in the class and i can't overlook that the tape this year overall has been very good...got beat saturday on a just perfect throw but he lost on the outward cut when he had to open his hips and transition laterally...still the ball was perfectly placed...he's got plus feet looks like his hips are pretty fluid he's got the size and body teams covet in the draft and i think he'll run well...add in he plays in the sec against the highest level comp and while i think he's a little overrated i don't see him getting out of the top 15...

i will say though that i don't think his upside is that of jonathon banks...so if it was me and i had the choice of the two i'd go with the ball skills and rediculous length of banks

hooshoops
11-18-2012, 09:05 PM
wow...just got done with 3 games of cb terry hawthorne tape...i would be stoked to get that in the 2nd round...i think i like him more than desmond trufant...he looks like a top 50 bpa off what i'm seeing...add him to the targets list ...

MadDog 88
11-23-2012, 01:20 PM
Hoops, I read an article on Keenan Allen being more of a possession WR then a true playmaker. Thoughts?

2413fanphins
11-24-2012, 02:13 PM
is this thread still live? I keep checking but it seems to have fizzled out?

hooshoops
11-25-2012, 11:53 AM
Hoops, I read an article on Keenan Allen being more of a possession WR then a true playmaker. Thoughts?

i disagree with that but it's important that he runs in the mid 4.5's i'd say...and i think he will...

hooshoops
11-25-2012, 12:09 PM
is this thread still live? I keep checking but it seems to have fizzled out?

patience grass hopper...got a lot of things on my plate these days...here's a little taste off what i saw yesterday and this week...also as we get closer to the draft my input in this thread will pick up significantly...senior bowl week combine etc i'll be adding heavy content...right now i'm just watching a lot of tape and forming opinions...

cb desmond trufant put together a nice game tape for nfl scouts against wash st friday...i knew the kid could play press man at a solid level but he was very good in off man as well...putting his foot in the ground and driving on the football in off coverages and getting hands on the ball in the red zone on quick in hitters etc had a tendency to squat at times on a few things and got called for some ticky tack pi calls but i liked the aggressiveness and ball awareness he brought to the table...showed off some solid tackling skills also for the position...i'm getting more and more comfortable with him as a top 2 round pick these days...

cb xavier rhodes ehhh...looks like a lot of hype to me...rarely rallied to the ball i didn't see plus feet for the boundary or quick twitch acceleration and explosion he looked like he didn't want anything to do with contact for much of the game against florida this is yet another game that i've looked at of his where i fail to see what the big deal is...other than the great size for the position i just don't see it...i'm passing with a high round pick

robert woods runs some damn good routes...i think he'd fit this o perfectly...he just comes across as a very smart football player and wr...and i think i saw a little more burst yesterday in the way he got off the ball and threatened dbs cushions down the field...he's gonna win a lot of one on one matchups against nfl dbs but will he give us the true playmaker this o needs and red zone win wr it covets??? i don't know...i just know whoever gets that guy is gonna be pretty happy if they don't look at him as the alpha dog...

tyler eiferts the cream at the te position as far as down the seam and flexed out and he's gonna be aday 1 contributor cause he's not terrible in line and can provide some kick out blocks etc...i like his ability to be flexed out and he's a true mismatch and would look great in miami...but again i bet he goes late round 1 and does miami really give up on clay who is coming on of late or egnew already??? i doubt it...but if it's te i'm going eifert if i got a choice

uva left tackle oday aboushi just continues to give me a good feeling about his pro upside...i think in a year or two once he works on that body and upper body strength he can play a very solid zbs left tackle...top 50-75 pick who needs some development and time but i like his future...good feet very smart and gets to the 2nd level and can pull and make solid sustained contact...lack of strength though shows at times

TedSlimmJr
11-25-2012, 08:38 PM
Johnthan Banks was roasted up and down the field again last night in the Egg Bowl. He's had some rough games lately.

tylerdolphin
11-25-2012, 09:14 PM
Whats you guys thoughts on DJ Swearinger? Love the guy. Plays hard. He gets some silly personal foul penalties, but I think thats part of why I like him so much :lol:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LEi_-C9IVo

tylerdolphin
11-25-2012, 09:40 PM
Apparently Swearinger ran up to Tajh Boyd during warmups before the game and knocked the ball out his hand and went back to SC's side :lol:

MadDog 88
11-26-2012, 02:31 PM
Apparently Swearinger ran up to Tajh Boyd during warmups before the game and knocked the ball out his hand and went back to SC's side :lol:If he did thats ****in' hilarious :lol:

tylerdolphin
11-26-2012, 02:45 PM
If he did thats ****in' hilarious :lol:

If you watched the video I posted, its very believeable. Dude got a personal foul on 3 consecutive plays but the last one was at the end of a pick 6. DJ Swearinger in a nutshell :lol:

tylerdolphin
11-26-2012, 02:55 PM
http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2012/11/MonsterHit_original-1.gif?1353813696

datruth55
11-26-2012, 03:09 PM
http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2012/11/MonsterHit_original-1.gif?1353813696
He got a stupid penalty for that taunt. He's talented but a major head case.

phinsheat
11-27-2012, 09:02 AM
He got a stupid penalty for that taunt. He's talented but a major head case.

Who cares!Who cares!

uk_dolfan
11-27-2012, 09:41 AM
This is a great thread hoops. What do you think of Matt Barkley? Is one rough year enough to write him off? He seems to be on a different place on every early draft board I see.

ChambersWI
11-27-2012, 09:50 AM
This is a great thread hoops. What do you think of Matt Barkley? Is one rough year enough to write him off? He seems to be on a different place on every early draft board I see.

he still had a great year, but his stock has taken a bit of a hit due to USC drastically underachieving. He's no longer seen as the lock number 1 pick in the draft (and in some cases not even the top QB), but I think he's still a lock to be a top 5 pick, and probably the number 1 pick. KC, Oakland, Arizona, Buffalo, and Jets all need a QB. As of right now there are 3 guys with first round grades; Matt Barkley, Geno Smith, and Tyler Wilson. Guys like Aaron Murray, Tyler Bray, Logan Thomas (due to potential), and Tajh Boyd could make things interesting.

TedSlimmJr
11-27-2012, 03:11 PM
Barkley has become somewhat of a victim to overexposure. It usually happens to a top QB prospect when they turn down the NFL and come back for another year.

In terms of being overrated and overhyped, there's a long line of folks on his USC squad that I'd place ahead of him.... including some coaches.

datruth55
11-27-2012, 03:54 PM
Who cares!Who cares!


As long as he's not a Dolphin I don't care.

Phinatic8u
11-27-2012, 04:21 PM
Tajh Boyd id not coming out this year.

tylerdolphin
11-27-2012, 04:56 PM
he still had a great year, but his stock has taken a bit of a hit due to USC drastically underachieving. He's no longer seen as the lock number 1 pick in the draft (and in some cases not even the top QB), but I think he's still a lock to be a top 5 pick, and probably the number 1 pick. KC, Oakland, Arizona, Buffalo, and Jets all need a QB. As of right now there are 3 guys with first round grades; Matt Barkley, Geno Smith, and Tyler Wilson. Guys like Aaron Murray, Tyler Bray, Logan Thomas (due to potential), and Tajh Boyd could make things interesting.

Ive seen enough of Logan Thomas to confidently say he completely blows and I wouldnt touch him in the draft. Some stupid team will fall in love with the awesome throws he sandwiches between 8 awful ones and draft him pretty high though.

The Florida State game was classic Thomas. On the last drive he made a spectacular throw that 99% of college QBs can only dream of to give VT life. He then promptly throws a ridiculously stupid INT. Game over.

hooshoops
11-27-2012, 06:19 PM
This is a great thread hoops. What do you think of Matt Barkley? Is one rough year enough to write him off? He seems to be on a different place on every early draft board I see.

there's not a qb that i'd take over him...that's not gonna change...i love me some matt barkley although his tape this years not on the level of last seasons...they've also had a lot of protection issues specifically quick inside pressure in his face

not gonna wow with the physical tools but he's got sweet feet in the pocket nice vertical accuracy and his intangibles are off the charts...if i got the top pick and need a qb i'm taking matt barkley

hooshoops
11-27-2012, 06:21 PM
logan thomas put a hurting on his draft stock this year the same way landry jones did on his last season...thomas put out some ugly tape...ugly

ChambersWI
11-27-2012, 08:50 PM
Ive seen enough of Logan Thomas to confidently say he completely blows and I wouldnt touch him in the draft. Some stupid team will fall in love with the awesome throws he sandwiches between 8 awful ones and draft him pretty high though.

The Florida State game was classic Thomas. On the last drive he made a spectacular throw that 99% of college QBs can only dream of to give VT life. He then promptly throws a ridiculously stupid INT. Game over.

I agree, but as you said, that athleticism is gonna keep him in the discussion for a first round pick. If he stays, the 2014 QB class could be based a BUNCH on potential and not production.

logan thomas put a hurting on his draft stock this year the same way landry jones did on his last season...thomas put out some ugly tape...ugly

Yeah Jones went from potential top 15 pick to probably 3rd rounder. I understand Broyles got hurt, but there's still too much talent on that offense to struggle that much last year

ChambersWI
11-29-2012, 12:30 PM
Tajh Boyd id not coming out this year.

he's filing his paperwork, but is undecided. He could be the 3rd QB off the board this year maybe higher.

datruth55
11-29-2012, 01:36 PM
he's filing his paperwork, but is undecided. He could be the 3rd QB off the board this year maybe higher.
Glad we have our QB already.

hooshoops
12-02-2012, 12:43 AM
nothing like an sec going to the national championship game without the best team in the sec even in it...i feel bad for whatever team not playing in a major bowl gets texas a & m...they better hope like hell that a & m decides not to show up...

anyways fs baccari rambo put out the best defensive tape for georgia today...really nice ball game from that kid...

jarvis jones is a big bag of hype....all this best defensive player in the country stuff is bunk...all this von miller like pro talk is hype also...he doesn't have anywhere near the explosion and burst and get off the ball that von miller had as a edge rusher...he lost at the poa ALL NIGHT LONG hell he got handled by te's even all night...waste a top 5 pick on that if you want to...he did show nice agility though and feet when guys tried to cut him to stay on his feet...not to mention the kids got medical with his neck...

ilb alec ogletree you can tell is new to playing lb...he's long and lean and when he's clean he'll find the ball and i like his burst and exposion more than a & m lb sean porter and he's a terrific athlete but he lacks strength at the poa doesn't get off blocks and tackles way too damn high...he's head high all the time on tackles and that's got to change...he needs to wrap up the hips and drive thru with his legs...very raw at lb that needs to work on technique...that said i like his upside...

barrett jones struggles against size and strength over his nose like a lot of guys but i see his value more in his versatility and i believe he can play a solid guard and right tackle if need be in a pinch...still i wonder about the upside might be a maxed out guy...love the versatility though and you can tell he's a smart football player...i believe his future lies at guard in the pros...

really like chance warmack at left guard i'd be stoked to have him or jonathon cooper there...warmack gets to the 2nd level well and moves very well on the inside...big fan

dee milliner with a really nice game...got his head around on vertical coverage sure tackler almost came up with the game clinching int off the deflection on what should have been pi for hitting the receiver early but i digress...

i like the bama nose jesse williams as a 2 down plugger type...not much pass rush upside there but he can fill and hold up blockers...i think he's a solid 2nd round selection...

jonathon hankins the georgia nose has some pass rush upside but he's not doing enough as a plugger against the run...

future top 10 pick freshmen on display for bama in rb tj yelton and wr amare cooper...they're both special

cj mosely ilb bama every time i watch him i see a guy that lacks strength at the poa...like alec ogletree he needs to be clean he has better instincts at lb than ogletree at this stage but he lacks ogletrees potential upside...might be a nickle backer in the pros though which means with a top 50 pick you may be wasting one...better form tackler than tree though...if i'm a 43 i'll take arthur brown over him as my mike

2413fanphins
12-02-2012, 10:25 AM
I liked most everything I saw from rambo last night except the time when he had a chance to lay some wood to eddy lacy and eased up. I don't know if it was because rambo thought lacy would take it OB, or what, but I would have liked to see him give it a go at planting lacy or at least make a sound tackle.

hooshoops
12-02-2012, 10:53 AM
lacys a 240 lb battering ram that was heading downhill with a better angle than rambo...i'm ok with what transpired on that tackle attempt...rambos plenty physical enough and a good enough tackler to man free safety in the pros...

2413fanphins
12-02-2012, 11:01 AM
agreed, it's not a habit I have seen from rambo... just a single isolated incident... and honestly, it wasn't really a life or death situation at the time.

lacy is a big dude.

is rambo a 3rd rounder in your eyes, or do we need to think about him with 2b?

I like cooper with our 2b at the moment... would you want cooper or rambo if it had to be done at 47ish???

hooshoops
12-02-2012, 11:20 AM
i don't think coopers getting that far...rambo i think is more a 3rd round guy...i've seen some ehhh tape from him this year also...yesterday was definitely one of the better games...some questions for me about coverage and maybe range

Phinatic8u
12-02-2012, 12:22 PM
i don't think coopers getting that far...rambo i think is more a 3rd round guy...i've seen some ehhh tape from him this year also...yesterday was definitely one of the better games...some questions for me about coverage and maybe range

Then he wouldn't solve our FS problems.

hooshoops
12-03-2012, 04:24 PM
Then he wouldn't solve our FS problems.

we need playmaking help at free safety but thru 12 weeks now it's not imo a critical need...we have bigger fish to fry imo...wr cb og specifically left guard a tackle for the right side or a swing guy depth at lb...all bigger needs to me right now

could use another pass rusher with serious tools but you're gonna have to get that in the top 20 if you want a legitimate one... depending on what happens with starks 3 down de may be a critical need as i suspect odrick would get kicked inside...if not dt becomes a high end need

and don't rule out a rb either cause bush needs to go and miller can't pick up the damn playbook and daniel thomas is gonna be a guy that misses games every year he does play due to his style...

NorFlaFin
12-09-2012, 12:24 AM
Whats the word on Spencer Ware? Wes Bunting compares him favorably to Marion Barber. Yeah hes got weight problem as well as a doobie problem but in the late rounds?


http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Is-Spencer-Ware-the-next-Marion-Barber.html

2413fanphins
12-09-2012, 10:50 AM
I'm not at all opposed to picking up another mid round running back.

there are a handful of guys that could come in and contribute right away.

2413fanphins
12-09-2012, 10:55 AM
speaking of running backs whats mike james' story???


i don't see him on any bigboards, and I don't see him mentioned in many mocks. I can't see why he wouldn't be worth a mid to late rounder, unless I'm missing something.

hooshoops
12-09-2012, 01:55 PM
just got done with kenny vaccaros texas k state game tape and i was very impressed...he was all over the place and flying to the ball...coverage abilities particularly the ability to man the slot a strength...fluid looking hips doesn't strike me as straight linish...i'm locking vaccaro into the top 50 bpa at free safety...i think he'd definitely be an upgrade for us if we decided to go that route...

2413fanphins
12-19-2012, 01:51 PM
You been watching any tape lately hoops?

hooshoops
12-19-2012, 06:12 PM
You been watching any tape lately hoops?

just watched the 2 bowl games that have been played...took a look at cb will davis of utah state didn't really see much...left me kinda ehhh...i have seen a lot of stuff that has him as a top 50 guy and i didn't see it off the bowl game...

i thought the returner/wr/rb reedy i think his name was from toledo was interesting return wise at the next level...late round guy i'd say...more quick than fast when he went sideways the lack of straight line speed was evident...but he was interesting...wasn't the most willing to catch the ball in traffic over the middle though...but as a returner i liked him

the rb fluellen that i wanted to see got hurt with an ankle at the start pretty much so that was a bummer and the utah state rb jefferson i think his name was did nothing for me...

looking forward to washington boise st and ucla baylor i think those games will be good watches...pay attention to the te for washington #88 ferris jenkins i think his name is i saw him last year as a freshman and quickly id'd him as a future top 50 pick te and he's a good one...good size willing blocker can run not a burner down the seam but he'll make plays downfield and surprise you...next year he's likely my top te available

the freshman wr #6 i think he is williams has very high end tools also and he'll be a high pick in 2 more years...i don't think they go to him enough but that kids got the pro look and talents

want to get a look at s philip thomas of fresno this week and i think cb leon mcfadden and the de ansah are on display also in the next few days...got the dvr ready

2413fanphins
12-19-2012, 09:53 PM
thanks bro. I am looking forward to your take on the western kentucky, central michigan game, as well as the Iowa state linebackers when they play tulsa.

hooshoops
12-20-2012, 11:19 PM
ansah the de for byu i'm a big no thanks for that with a top 50 pick given miamis needs...i see pretty average rush tools average get off hand use and how active his hands are is a plus but i don't see any real polish with his rush and i don't think that kids gonna win consistently against nfl tackles...he flows down the los pretty well vs the run and he finds the ball but there's just not enough to like there now or upside wise pass rush wise to get me interested...

he's not really stacking guys and shedding he's engaging backing off and then engaging again very raw but pretty effective vs the run b/t the tackles...he's also on the ground a bit too much for my liking...once his initial rush is neutralized he's got no counter he just backs off and waits for the action and goes to the ball...when he's doubled as a pass rusher he gets no push does nothing...

i know he's new to the game and so by no means a finished product but there's not enough burst and first step and get off the ball quickness and acceleration to have me put him on my targets list with a high round pick...i'll pass

JakeMcAwful
12-20-2012, 11:45 PM
What do you think of CB Leon McFadden hoops? He's having a decent game against BYU adding to his good season and could be taken with one of our third rounders pretty easily, I'd imagine. I like his route instincts, quickness and fluid hips.

EDIT It's hard not to be impressed with Van Noy's play too. Good versatility, seems to have a knack for rushing the passer from the LB position. Maybe a little undersized right now, but I'd guess he could add weight to that frame without too much detriment to speed.

hooshoops
12-21-2012, 12:05 AM
What do you think of CB Leon McFadden hoops? He's having a decent game against BYU adding to his good season and could be taken with one of our third rounders pretty easily, I'd imagine. I like his route instincts, quickness and fluid hips.

EDIT It's hard not to be impressed with Van Noy's play too. Good versatility, seems to have a knack for rushing the passer from the LB position. Maybe a little undersized right now, but I'd guess he could add weight to that frame without too much detriment to speed.

i would agree with both those sentiments...i'm gonna wait on mcfadden though til i see him in one on ones at the senior bowl...i see him playing an awful lot of zone in this one...kind of hard for me to gauge but i do think the hips are pretty fluid for what i see the route recognition shows to me also and the quickness looks pretty good...not sure i see great quick acceleration and i wonder a bit about long speed...but i'm interested in more looks

van noy looks thin framed to me seems like i see a thin torso and waist which means he may be a guy that can't carry much more weight well and right now he definitely strikes me as a little light in the pants...i think he should stay in school another year but he's interesting and he's got some gap shooting abilities and lateral quickness as a pass rusher on the inside...he's one to watch i'd say

Awsi Dooger
12-21-2012, 12:51 AM
Van Noy would be a liability in certain situations but extreme instincts like that normally pay off in the pros. Very, very rare. I always love how relaxed he is while doing it...calmly in charge. Note he turned both turnovers into points tonight. Not merely causing the game turning fumble, but falling on it in the end zone. Then on the interception he immediately turned his head back to check on the location of the intended receiver, the first guy who had a crack at him. You won't see a handful of players who know to do that. Once the receiver was out of contention, Van Noy calmly weaved to the end zone, like it was a formality. Too many players can start the play but not finish it. I call those cheap yards. You don't want to force your weak offense to line up again if you can pop it into the end zone for them.

Granted, I'm biased in Van Noy's favor partially because he's been good to me. BYU has been excellent against the spread during his two seasons, covering more than two-thirds of them. I won a halftime bet early last season when Van Noy made a huge play to almost single handedly reverse the outcome at Mississippi.

Yeah, he's light in the trunk. Looks more like a flexed tight end than a linebacker, if you merely watched his frame in warm ups. That BYU defense is so strong they rarely allow Van Noy to be exposed against the run. I thought he was not quite as relentless this season, coming off the shoulder issue. Seemed to pick his spots, looking for big plays. Not that you can blame him, considering how many he makes. Ed Reed or Von Miller-type instincts, not that I'm comparing his overall ability to theirs.

hooshoops
12-21-2012, 09:25 AM
van noy was making some tackles look silly last night also off the edge...he's got some edge rush talents there's no doubt about that...but i also wonder if it was more about the level guys he was facing they seemed to overcommit too much and get destroyed by his short area lateral agility and quickness...he sidestepped people all over the place after they dropped their heads or stopped moving their feet...same move he used on tackles he used on the fb in pass pro or shooting gaps up the middle vs the run...impressive quick short area lateral agility and feet...

silverfin
12-22-2012, 11:32 AM
Any tackles (left/right) your looking at incase Jake walks hoops?

hooshoops
12-22-2012, 12:34 PM
Any tackles (left/right) your looking at incase Jake walks hoops?

sure...luke joeckel jake matthews taylor lewan eric fisher oday aboushi all guys that i like to varying degrees and feel would fit our system...

matthews is a plug and play right tackle with plus feet good movement skills and awareness who's underrated imo and may have left tackle feet and fits this system to a t...joeckels probably the first left tackle off the board but another terrific fit and plus athlete...oday aboushi is the guy that may have to sit a year or so to work on that body and getting stronger but down the road i like him as a zbs left tackle...

fisher and lewan are two guys i need to see more of but what i have seen to date i have liked...

silverfin
12-22-2012, 01:15 PM
sure...luke joeckel jake matthews taylor lewan eric fisher oday aboushi all guys that i like to varying degrees and feel would fit our system...

matthews is a plug and play right tackle with plus feet good movement skills and awareness who's underrated imo and may have left tackle feet and fits this system to a t...joeckels probably the first left tackle off the board but another terrific fit and plus athlete...oday aboushi is the guy that may have to sit a year or so to work on that body and getting stronger but down the road i like him as a zbs left tackle...

fisher and lewan are two guys i need to see more of but what i have seen to date i have liked...

Joeckel is a first round lock, maybe even a top 5 pick. Taylor Lewan will likely be off the board in the first too as will Fisher IMO. I don't think Ireland can spend our first round pick on an OT especially since we drafted Martin who will likely slide to LT, so it'd be a first rounder on a guy whose gonna be playing RT. I just don't see it. If Jake was to walk then I'd say we'd probably need to use one of our second rounders to fill in the void.

Aboushi is a guy I definitely think can be had in the second. As you say he'd fit our system and has good athleticism although he may be a bit raw ... gets beat too often by speed rushes from what I've watched of him. He's got good versatility though since he has experience playing both tackle positions. If we are going to slide Martin over to LT then D.J. Fluker is a natural right tackle .... although I question whether he has the athleticism to fit our system. He looks more of a run blocker and a pure size guy to me. Kyle Long (Chris' brother from the Rams) from Oregon is another guy I'm interested in. That dude is some athlete, although I think he could be had in the second round because technique wise he still seems a bit raw to me. Good pass blocker too.

hooshoops
12-22-2012, 11:12 PM
Joeckel is a first round lock, maybe even a top 5 pick. Taylor Lewan will likely be off the board in the first too as will Fisher IMO. I don't think Ireland can spend our first round pick on an OT especially since we drafted Martin who will likely slide to LT, so it'd be a first rounder on a guy whose gonna be playing RT. I just don't see it. If Jake was to walk then I'd say we'd probably need to use one of our second rounders to fill in the void.

Aboushi is a guy I definitely think can be had in the second. As you say he'd fit our system and has good athleticism although he may be a bit raw ... gets beat too often by speed rushes from what I've watched of him. He's got good versatility though since he has experience playing both tackle positions. If we are going to slide Martin over to LT then D.J. Fluker is a natural right tackle .... although I question whether he has the athleticism to fit our system. He looks more of a run blocker and a pure size guy to me. Kyle Long (Chris' brother from the Rams) from Oregon is another guy I'm interested in. That dude is some athlete, although I think he could be had in the second round because technique wise he still seems a bit raw to me. Good pass blocker too.

no real arguments with any of that...although jake matthews should be a 1st round pick lock tackle...fluker fits a power scheme so i'd pass on that in a zbs...aboushi i have watched for 4 years i think he's underrated but again a guy you'd have to wait on probably...kyle long is interesting but i always get nervous when it comes to guys from those type of schemes...and oregon is not very pro like...

i think all 5 guys i mentioned go in the top 2 rounds aboushi the only one that gets there...not sure where i'd project long yet...

hooshoops
12-22-2012, 11:24 PM
as for todays action washington boise did not dissappoint...terrific game...although the qb price for washington was late all over the place and took bad sacks instead of getting rid of the ball...i had the # wrong for the wr williams but that kids a high round pick down the line wr he's a load to tackle and he's a murder run blocker down field...just about every one of those big runs by washington williams had sealed a man off at the second level...he just needs to get off the los with more burst and develop some polish to his game but that kid can play...

desmond trufant had one bad play all game long and i'm not even sure it was a bad play may have been more coverage dictated as in the coverage played too soft and with leverage that if the qb had time would give up the gain but it was a crucial conversion late in the game...although there was a blatant missed hold on the edge on the play with a guy turning the corner on the qb...

anyways trufant didn't get much action and it was for good reason...he had his responsibility locked down all game long...transitions out of his pedal very well fluid hips he had his head in the backfield while carrying guys down the sideline on the inside just feeling the wr down the field...didn't get beat over the top even when he squated he had the acceleration and burst necessary to still be even...played the throw back trick play extremely well...

gave up one other catch in the first half and i'm fairly certain that was coverage dictated and inside leverage on an outside breaking route...he also played a deep ball beautifully over the top of the wr and came back and high pointed the ball for an incompletion ball knock down

the te seferian jenkins remember that name in 2013...he's a top 50 te and maybe the #1 off the board next year...he sits down well vs zone and soft coverage and is solid in line and deceptive down the seam...not a burner and off the los at times he'll leave you kinda ehh but he understands coverages and leverage and if price wasn't so late all the time would be a 1000 yard te this year...as it is he still finished with 850 yards...

2230
12-25-2012, 10:44 AM
If we sign Mike Wallace or Greg Jennings in FA would make more sense to draft Tyler Eifort or Keenan Allen? I would prefer a dominant pass rusher too but that just isnt happening at pick 15 or so. Signing Wallace and drafting Eifort would really keep safeties occupied.

ChambersWI
12-25-2012, 02:14 PM
as for todays action washington boise did not dissappoint...terrific game...although the qb price for washington was late all over the place and took bad sacks instead of getting rid of the ball...i had the # wrong for the wr williams but that kids a high round pick down the line wr he's a load to tackle and he's a murder run blocker down field...just about every one of those big runs by washington williams had sealed a man off at the second level...he just needs to get off the los with more burst and develop some polish to his game but that kid can play...

desmond trufant had one bad play all game long and i'm not even sure it was a bad play may have been more coverage dictated as in the coverage played too soft and with leverage that if the qb had time would give up the gain but it was a crucial conversion late in the game...although there was a blatant missed hold on the edge on the play with a guy turning the corner on the qb...

anyways trufant didn't get much action and it was for good reason...he had his responsibility locked down all game long...transitions out of his pedal very well fluid hips he had his head in the backfield while carrying guys down the sideline on the inside just feeling the wr down the field...didn't get beat over the top even when he squated he had the acceleration and burst necessary to still be even...played the throw back trick play extremely well...

gave up one other catch in the first half and i'm fairly certain that was coverage dictated and inside leverage on an outside breaking route...he also played a deep ball beautifully over the top of the wr and came back and high pointed the ball for an incompletion ball knock down

the te seferian jenkins remember that name in 2013...he's a top 50 te and maybe the #1 off the board next year...he sits down well vs zone and soft coverage and is solid in line and deceptive down the seam...not a burner and off the los at times he'll leave you kinda ehh but he understands coverages and leverage and if price wasn't so late all the time would be a 1000 yard te this year...as it is he still finished with 850 yards...

So disappointed in Price this year. Had an amazing season last year where he looked like he could be a QB to watch in early rounds. Then he became a weakness this year

hooshoops
12-25-2012, 10:59 PM
So disappointed in Price this year. Had an amazing season last year where he looked like he could be a QB to watch in early rounds. Then he became a weakness this year

that washington team could do damage next year if they had a qb...they still probably can win 8 games though...some high end looking talenton that team...qb holding them back

hooshoops
12-25-2012, 11:49 PM
smus margus hunt holy moses that kids body beautiful...6 ft 8 280 lbs and gets off the ball extremely well off the edge...he's got an awful lot going for him i can tell ya that...i think his pass rush upside and explosion off what i'm seeing is better than that of bjoern werner...a little taller than i'd like but this kids got physical tools like jj watt level...man this kids impressive and he's another that's gonna destroy the combine...stacks well and when guys try to cut him or get in his legs he does a really nice job staying on his feet...very athletic...

only played football 4 years also...god dang...that kid looks sweet...i think he's a liability as far as at the poa vs the run at this stage seems to get moved off the los too much needs to get stouter and play with better leverage and he's another that looks like can get lazy pursuit wise...he's half assing it a lot when the plays away from him...i also see some stiffness in his hips but nothing that can't work with a 43 de...he's just kinda straight linish and doesn't have great cod...but this guys just scratching the surface...

one of the few 280 lbers who has the tools to win against nfl tackles off the edge...he's got serious tools...i think his quickness if shifted inside in the nickle would give guards serious issues...not a every down de to begin with which will hurt his stock but you can bet bottom dollar he's going in my top 50 bpa and someone that i view as a day 1 situational rusher and pass rush specialist who can shift inside...

if he goes to the senior bowl and looks the way i think he could as a pass rusher in one on ones etc he could seriously help his stock...i hope he gets an invite...

hooshoops
12-26-2012, 01:58 PM
updated includes all miami targets top 3 rounds if i was calling the shots off to date study...still a lot of guys to look at

wr
keenan allen top 20 bpa
robert woods
terrence williams
steadman bailey top 50 bpa
quinton patton
marquess wilson
marcus wheaton

slot wr
tavon austin
ryan swope 3rd round

cb
jonathon banks top 20 bpa
desmond trufant top 50 bpa
terry hawthorne top 75 bpa

safety
kenny vaccaro top 50 bpa
tony jefferson
philip thomas
baccari rambo

te
tyler eifert top 30 bpa
zach ertz 2nd round

ot
jake matthews top 20 bpa
taylor lewan
oday aboushi 2nd round
eric fisher
luke joeckel top 10 bpa

og
jonathon cooper top 40 bpa
chance warmack top 20 bpa

rt/og
barrett jones top 50 bpa

de
alex okafor top 50 bpa
margus hunt top 50 bpa
barkevious mingo top 5 bpa

dt
will sutton top 50 bpa

43 lb
arthur brown top 50 bpa
cj moseley

with de i'm pass rush first and foremost...mingo and hunt have rediculous get off and explosion that will give tackles fits...okafors not as explosive with the get off or burst off the edge but he's got something to him that i really like...you'll notice i don't have ansah on my list nor do i have olb dion jordan ansah does not have enough pass rush upside and explosion and jordans a stand up 34 olb all the way...

i wonder with s philip thomas if he has the top end speed to warrant a 1st round pick...i like his range and his coverage abilities and he's quite heady player but i have questions about long speed...need to see more

ot eric fishers grade still to come same for taylor lewan...

cj moseley may be more a weakside backer at the next level...i struggle with his strength at the poa...very instinctual however...

i may have terry hawthorne too low...that grade may be going up...

hooshoops
12-26-2012, 02:24 PM
If we sign Mike Wallace or Greg Jennings in FA would make more sense to draft Tyler Eifort or Keenan Allen? I would prefer a dominant pass rusher too but that just isnt happening at pick 15 or so. Signing Wallace and drafting Eifort would really keep safeties occupied.

i would go allen...if i can't get mingo i would get allen and then look de if hunt or okafor were there with that high 2nd rounder...if not them corner makes a lot of sense to me there...think premium pass rush upside at de...not plugger

silverfin
12-26-2012, 02:34 PM
if he goes to the senior bowl and looks the way i think he could as a pass rusher in one on ones etc he could seriously help his stock...i hope he gets an invite...

He has been invited (and accepted) to play the senior bowl already I believe.

hooshoops
12-26-2012, 02:48 PM
He has been invited (and accepted) to play the senior bowl already I believe.

nice...get ready for a freak on the edge...thing is people are gonna see him get moved off the ball in the run game and bang him for it...there's no doubt leverage wise that height is gonna play against him...i don't think as a result of being so tall he's ever gonna be a stout poa guy although he's still so raw you never know but that off the edge initial step quickness with his hand in the dirt and the way he gets off the ball and that size and speed...thats called serious edge rush tools to work with...his get off and burst makes another guy of similar size last year in quentin coples off the ball look like chump change...he's a freak...

no doubt in my mind that guys gonna flush a lot of qbs out of the pocket at least as a 3rd down rush specialist...at minimum...you teach that guy to get his hands up in passing lanes when he can't get to the qb and he's also gonna volleyball passes...

that's the most interesting edge rush 280 lb guy i've seen in a while i know that...he has burst and explosion of a guy 30 lbs lighter...if he learns a redirect back inside counter move when tackles are cheating to get into their first kick step to the outside look out...

ckparrothead
12-27-2012, 03:32 PM
I could see Jeff Ireland liking Margus Hunt and I could even see Kevin Coyle liking him too if he really does like Jared Odrick at end. But I still feel there's something missing.

Hunt had an extraordinary game in the Hawaii Bowl...against 6'4" and 290 lbs FRESHMAN Alex Fifita (recognize the name?). Fifita's not just a freshman, he's a small-ish freshman that wasn't even on many schools' radar as a recruit. MaxPreps had him as the 735th ranked recruit...in California.

Hunt's frame, athletic ability and strength give him the promise of dominating like a J.J. Watt dominates. You watch J.J. Watt look like a man among boys out there, how big and strong he is, what a great frame, etc...and then you watch Margus Hunt, and even if they weren't the same skin color you'd see resemblance in the frame and potential for physical dominance. But Watt has, and always did have, so much better flexibility, balance, pad level, awareness...all the things that make you not just Ivan Drago trying to play defensive end, but actually a great football player.

I get genuinely worried about Margus Hunt because he's not very good against the run. You get worried he's going to be some kind of contradiction as a player. With his size a Kevin Coyle (and just about every other defensive coordinator) is going to look at him and say OK, he's a closed end type that reduces to the inside on pass rush downs. But that means he's a run stopper for at least half the time. Being so big and strong that should be fine. But being so aggressive, off-balance, not wholly aware, inflexible and raw...maybe that's not fine after all because I don't really consider him good against the run even in college. And at the same time, what if that raw combo size/athleticism isn't enough to make him a compelling pass rusher against NFL left and right tackles as opposed to freshman 290 lbs no-star prospects like Alex Fifita? Your backup plan is to put him at defensive tackle. But oh wait, bad pad level, awareness, flexibility, bad run stopper...just a pure gap penetrating tackle prone to ending up on the carpet. What use is that?

In short, I get worried that at the NFL level you've got a rotational defensive lineman whose largest impact comes on special teams as a kick blocker.

datruth55
12-27-2012, 03:36 PM
Isn't Margus Hunt similar in size to Calais Campbell?

hooshoops
12-27-2012, 03:42 PM
Isn't Margus Hunt similar in size to Calais Campbell?

yes he is...but on the edge is where hunt imo will thrive in the pros...he's definitely not as fluid or cod gifted as jj watt and he's definitely one that the pad level an leverage is gonna be a problem with but you can't tell me that guy doesn't have edge rush tools that cant translate at the next level...heck just use him at odricks end spot in the nickle as the rusher opposite wake when you kick odrick inside...those pass rush tools are way better than any 280 lb guy off the edge i've seen...

why can't he be a situational edge rusher with the potential to kick inside in a nickle rotation as he molds his game??? i don't see why not...

when i said jj watt i meant mainly measurables he's not the same kind of player nor do i envision him being that way...but what he does have and i mean it pops off the screen is for that size rediculous get off and burst off the edge...i guess we'll see how he fares at the senior bowl...i think he'll give guys fits on the edge in one on ones and team pass rush reps

i'd be drafted that kid to get me off the field on 3rd down initially...same thing i'd be drafting mingo for...just at a much higher cost cause his gifts are rediculous cod and hips wise and he moves like a gazelle

ckparrothead
12-27-2012, 03:44 PM
Isn't Margus Hunt similar in size to Calais Campbell?

Calais was even bigger at 6'8" and 290 lbs. Margus is 6'7" and 270 lbs.

ckparrothead
12-27-2012, 03:55 PM
Jared Odrick doesn't play opposite Cam Wake in nickel packages very often if at all. He already kicks inside.

The Senior Bowl will be a big test for Margus Hunt. Going against good players has the potential to expose him a little bit. If you're a one-trick pony that trick ought to be really good else you never get on the field.

I remember watching him against real NFL caliber prospects in the SMU-Texas A&M game and coming away fairly unimpressed as a pass rusher. Looking like a totally dominating force against 290 lbs freshman no-star prospect Alex Fifita isn't going outweigh that. It figures into it some but doesn't outweigh it.

I just doubt that Hunt has the knee bend, balance or flexibility to consistently make an impact as a pass rusher from the outside.

hooshoops
12-27-2012, 03:59 PM
b/t i didn't pay much attention to who he was up against with fresno and i really don't care...i paid attention to how he got off the ball and what he did after the initial burst at that size...and it was next level impressive...now a part of me wonders how he'll fare against more athletic lts in the pros cause he's been wrecking right tackles and cam wake will get his choice of who to rush against but for my money despite that size he's got get off and initial burst that only mingo can match...

now if you want to see him wreck another tackle take a look at the pitt game...

ckparrothead
12-27-2012, 04:06 PM
This isn't the Texas A&M game that I was talking about (I was talking about the 2012 game) but this is still relevant as Margus was at this point a junior whereas Jake Matthews and Luke Joeckel were sophomores.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGBBKibXTrs

Margus Hunt has always been very physically impressive. It shows in all the blocked kicks he has under his belt. But in the NFL he'll run into guys that are physically impressive AND have good hand technique, awareness, pad level, knee bend, flexibility and balance. I'm not sure yet he's going to develop those things, especially the flexibility and balance. He can get and already has gotten better with his hands, more brutal, very strong and knocks people back a lot...but I don't know that he's got the flexibility or awareness to finish plays.

hooshoops
12-27-2012, 04:06 PM
i watched that a & m game also and yeah he did nothing...i think that was a yea ago also and i think he's a better football player now...imo his best footballs in front of him...and lets face it those a & m tackles are legit...he got moved out of the hole and off the ball all over the place...but hey mingo and montgomery looked bad against those a & m tackles this year also

as for the odrick thing i meant when he's kicked inside in the nickle i'd be inclined to give hunt those edge rush reps opposite wake...i just think edge wise he's got an awful lot going for him

hooshoops
12-27-2012, 04:12 PM
i can understand the flexibility and awareness argument...flexibility wise i've seen him be dead to rights closing on the qb and for whatever reason the slightest movement that makes him have to open his hips and change course and it seems like he's always reaching for guys and barely touching them etc and these aren't high end elusive athletes either...i think if he's got you in a confined space he'll finish if you however have ground to make moves he's in trouble...he'll flush you he may not finish though unless you're bottled up

i can see the concerns but you know if he doesn't pan out just like any other guy i'll cut him in a few years...not like the cap would kill me either way...i'm just betting on the edge rush abilities and i believe on 3rd down he can split some things on the inside if kicked in there and finish

ckparrothead
12-27-2012, 04:16 PM
The Senior Bowl will be a good test. He's so big and strong and brutal he's a guy you want to like, but as I said before...something missing.

ckparrothead
12-27-2012, 07:50 PM
Nice to get a final look at Travis Kelce, Connor Vernon and Sean Renfree tonight. Think Camerron Cheatham may be worth keeping an eye on although he appears to not be covering Vernon.

MP-Omnis
12-28-2012, 07:44 AM
Re: Margus

I think what's missing is just experience. When his job isn't to rush the passer, he kind of goes into a "crane up and observe" mode. He'll get really high and look at what's happening before taking an action instead of just flowing naturally, by instinct, to the play. Best case is he turns into the Estonian version of Jason Pierre-Paul-- a freakish, but totally raw athlete. Worst case is he replaces Tony McDaniel on the roster for depth while making solid ST contributions like Olivier Vernon did this season.

Hopefully teams will shy away from picking him after seeing the limitations of Dontari Poe's impact on the Chiefs. But, like Poe, I can see Hunt shooting up the boards and I'm afraid for our chances to pick him up since he'll probably have a similarly meteoric rise after he blows up the combine.

Margus has incredible explosion, length, and balance-- three things that translate well to the position. Though they canned the track team because of Title 9 rules, SMU had the best throwers in the country at the time. Don't underestimate him just because he comes from a track background. They're all freak athletes with speed, flexibility, and they were all bull strong to boot.

That said, I'm looking forward to the Senior Bowl. :)

ckparrothead
12-28-2012, 03:31 PM
If he is admittedly so far behind everyone else in the Draft...and he's 26 years old...how long does he realistically have to catch up?

MP-Omnis
12-29-2012, 01:01 AM
That's something to consider, yeah.

hooshoops
12-29-2012, 10:57 AM
vernon looks like a mid to late round guy to me that could surprise or could be out of the league or making his living on specials in a few...don't see anything high end there...ceiling to me as a prospect is a #3 wr type stuff...we got plenty of them...as such i pass...but i also won't put it past him making a pretty good living in the pros...just doesn't do enough for me for what miami needs....

didn't see much from renfree that pick he threw into coverage down the sideline was a ghastly decision...just can't throw that against that coverage...should have come off that given that safety leverage presnap...

margus huntsn age means instead of having to jump on that with your high 2nd rounder if he's a target you can probably get that a little later like late round 3 or maybe even round 4...if he was a target at that age though i wouldn't personally wait past that late 3rd rounder...i think about then is when the age won't matter anymore...if he blows the doors off the senior bowl in reps and looks like he does off the edge on college tape all bets are off

hooshoops
12-29-2012, 11:22 AM
central michigan ot eric fisher is a 1st round talent offensive tackle...i don't see terrific feet for the left side in pass pro...his kick slide looks a little labored to me at times...feet remind me of jake long in a lot of ways...he's murder in the run game showing off terrific upper body and hand strength he moves guys off the ball routinely...funny thing is while i don't see great feet i do see outstanding ability to pull and get to the 2nd level in a hurry and he'll make solid sustained contact...at times he can drop his head when asked to move block and as such get off balance and go to ground but he looks like a real athlete and moves very well down the field...in pass pro i see a tendency at times to let the defender dictate the contact and to wait on guys and that's fine provided he doesn't get so upright off the snap i see some tendency to get vertical in pass pro and as such guys get under his pad level but he shows off a nice ability to recover and anchor and sit down vs get pushed straight back into the qb...

i don't think i'd take him over jake matthews who i think is a terrific zbs fit and fisher might be a better fit for a power scheme but i do think he's a top 25 worthy selection in the upcoming draft...and a likely day 1 starting tackle...feet may though mean he's more a right tackle fit down the road...

ROADRUNNER
12-29-2012, 01:40 PM
Just a side note for Hoops CK and Slim..........thanks for all your input guy's keep up the great work.

JakeMcAwful
12-29-2012, 08:40 PM
I see a lot of posters talking about Bacarri Rambo as a must-have player from the draft to replace Clemons, and then they mock him to the third/fourth. I haven't seen anything on him, so I'm not sure which to believe. Is he a must-have/immediate starter over CC, or is he a mid-round prospect with some flaws?

Of course, I'm sure there are those that would argue that a mid-round prospect with flaws beats Clemons hands down... :deadhorse:

Valandui
12-29-2012, 11:08 PM
I see a lot of posters talking about Bacarri Rambo as a must-have player from the draft to replace Clemons, and then they mock him to the third/fourth. I haven't seen anything on him, so I'm not sure which to believe. Is he a must-have/immediate starter over CC, or is he a mid-round prospect with some flaws?

Of course, I'm sure there are those that would argue that a mid-round prospect with flaws beats Clemons hands down... :deadhorse:
Well, we are talking about Chris Clemmons.

hooshoops
12-29-2012, 11:40 PM
alex okafor showing well tonight as a pass rusher...helping me feel more and more confident about why i like him off the edge in the pros as a top 50 guy...doesn't wow you with anything tools wise but just something about him i think will make him a solid producer in the pros...can't even put my finger on it...not a great get off not great acceleration or burst after the initial step but just very effective...

that said in the run game i think he's a guy that gets moved out of the hole at the poa too much...not stout enough...maybe some of that is he's in such a hurry to get upfield he forgets about contain responsibilities vs the run but i see him giving huge lanes in the b gap for backs to just run right into too much...i'd say at least initially i'd use him sparingly in a rotation on early downs and get him on the field on 3rd down as a pass rush specialist...it's weird i'm usually all about pass rush physical tools when it comes to who i like and this kid doesn't have elite anything but he just keeps showing me something every time i watch texas play...

nando03
12-31-2012, 11:53 AM
Hey guys, I'm wondering what your take on Logan Ryan from Rutgers is. I've watched a few Rutgers games this year and he has me intruiged. I recently did a mock while bored at work and mocked us taking Jonathan Banks. However, I've watched some more film on Ryan and feel like he could be a solid pick in the early part of the 2nd round. From a Corner perspective, I feel like he's a better cover corner than guys like Xavier Rhodes and David Amerson, maybe even a better cover corner than Banks. Unless Milliner falls to the 12th spot, if Ryan is there for our 1st pick in the 2nd round I think that would be a great pick. Someone who can make an immediate impact to our secondary. 6' 190-195lbs. Runs around 4.44. KB maybe you could put him in your draft prospects thread.

datruth55
12-31-2012, 02:05 PM
Hey guys, I'm wondering what your take on Logan Ryan from Rutgers is. I've watched a few Rutgers games this year and he has me intruiged. I recently did a mock while bored at work and mocked us taking Jonathan Banks. However, I've watched some more film on Ryan and feel like he could be a solid pick in the early part of the 2nd round. From a Corner perspective, I feel like he's a better cover corner than guys like Xavier Rhodes and David Amerson, maybe even a better cover corner than Banks. Unless Milliner falls to the 12th spot, if Ryan is there for our 1st pick in the 2nd round I think that would be a great pick. Someone who can make an immediate impact to our secondary. 6' 190-195lbs. Runs around 4.44. KB maybe you could put him in your draft prospects thread.
David Amerson and cover corner do not belong in the same sentence.

hooshoops
12-31-2012, 02:36 PM
logan ryan is interesting...i'm in the process of looking at some of his stuff...

as for amerson he screams corner safety tweener to me...i stay the hell away

hooshoops
12-31-2012, 03:30 PM
watching some mich st rb leveon bell right now...if that kid had top end speed and acceleration he'd be a top 10 pick...that's the only thing he lacks is top end speed...runs to his size punishes people downhill style rb with sweet feet and he'll catch the ball like a 200 lb scat back...he leaves bodies on the ground at contact...runs under his feet well and with good pad level...

i'd love to have this guy as my change of pace short yardage and goalline back and unleash him when nursing leads late...top 50 bpa

nando03
12-31-2012, 05:54 PM
I'm with you guys on Amerson. That guy sounds like the second coming of Jason Allen. Thats not what we need. However I believe that Logan Ryan could be just what we are looking for in the 2nd round of the draft. A pure cover corner. He's got the speed needed at the position and skill set to make an impact at an area that is weak for us. Fluid hips, able to mirror receiver, and he's not afraid to come up and tackle. Reminds me of a taller Vontae Davis when Vontae is at his best and focused.

datruth55
12-31-2012, 06:03 PM
watching some mich st rb leveon bell right now...if that kid had top end speed and acceleration he'd be a top 10 pick...that's the only thing he lacks is top end speed...runs to his size punishes people downhill style rb with sweet feet and he'll catch the ball like a 200 lb scat back...he leaves bodies on the ground at contact...runs under his feet well and with good pad level...

i'd love to have this guy as my change of pace short yardage and goalline back and unleash him when nursing leads late...top 50 bpa
Alfred Morris ran 4.69 at the combine...he's not doing to bad for a kid with no top end speed. Darn good fit for the ZBS though.

2413fanphins
12-31-2012, 06:53 PM
watching some mich st rb leveon bell right now...if that kid had top end speed and acceleration he'd be a top 10 pick...that's the only thing he lacks is top end speed...runs to his size punishes people downhill style rb with sweet feet and he'll catch the ball like a 200 lb scat back...he leaves bodies on the ground at contact...runs under his feet well and with good pad level...

i'd love to have this guy as my change of pace short yardage and goalline back and unleash him when nursing leads late...top 50 bpa

take him over eddy lacy?

hooshoops
12-31-2012, 07:22 PM
Alfred Morris ran 4.69 at the combine...he's not doing to bad for a kid with no top end speed. Darn good fit for the ZBS though.

that might be around what bell runs also...i wouldn't in miamis case consider a rb before the 3rd round but bell would definitely be someone i'd think long and hard about if he got there...

as for eddy lacy he's another downhill big back i like...i don't know that his feet are better than bells but he's to me got better explosion and top end speed...don't know that i think lacys vision is better and i'm damn sure he's not the receiver bell shows to be...

miami would be wise probably not to even consider a back before the middle rounds...we don't need feature guy we need change of pace with size and plays to that size...

2413fanphins
12-31-2012, 10:16 PM
Well if folks werent listening to you before about mingo..... tonights game has certainly grabbed their attention i would think

silverfin
12-31-2012, 11:38 PM
Well if folks werent listening to you before about mingo..... tonights game has certainly grabbed their attention i would think

You called it early in the season hoops. Mingo is an absolute beast.

hooshoops
01-01-2013, 01:19 PM
miss st slot wr chad bumphus is a pro...he's another more quick than fast slot in the mold of a davon bess...and that's his big issue...he's just not very fast or explosive...still he'll make a nfl roster as a slot and be a late round pick...understands zone coverage and leverage sits down well when he has space...

i'm a fan of his game but he does nothing for miami with bess already here...as such he won't be on my draft board for miami...

datruth55
01-01-2013, 03:55 PM
that might be around what bell runs also...i wouldn't in miamis case consider a rb before the 3rd round but bell would definitely be someone i'd think long and hard about if he got there...

as for eddy lacy he's another downhill big back i like...i don't know that his feet are better than bells but he's to me got better explosion and top end speed...don't know that i think lacys vision is better and i'm damn sure he's not the receiver bell shows to be...

miami would be wise probably not to even consider a back before the middle rounds...we don't need feature guy we need change of pace with size and plays to that size...
We may already have that guy in Jonas Gray hoops. It would depend on how well he's coming back from his injury but he fits the mold.

ChambersWI
01-01-2013, 04:45 PM
Taylor Lewan has looked REALLY good going up against Clowney. I think he got beat once but Gardner scrambled for a first, and he got called for a holding. The negative with Lewan as he showed today is he will get a personal foul here and there.

datruth55
01-01-2013, 05:28 PM
Taylor Lewan has looked REALLY good going up against Clowney. I think he got beat once but Gardner scrambled for a first, and he got called for a holding. The negative with Lewan as he showed today is he will get a personal foul here and there.
He looks like a slightly more athletic version of Jake Long...before the injuries.

uk_dolfan
01-01-2013, 05:37 PM
Any thoughts on Jonathan Banks hoops? I would love us to take a big time cb round one.

ChambersWI
01-01-2013, 06:04 PM
He looks like a slightly more athletic version of Jake Long...before the injuries.

that's why most Michigan fans always knew him as Little Jake. A bit more athletic than a healthy Jake Long but more prone to stupid penalties

hooshoops
01-01-2013, 11:30 PM
Any thoughts on Jonathan Banks hoops? I would love us to take a big time cb round one.

i really do like him...terrific tools...looks like he can get a little bored at times and let his technique get away from him...i think sometimes he just feels like he can turn it on and off whenever he wants to and be fine...that will bite you in the rear in the pros

hooshoops
01-01-2013, 11:42 PM
i don't know who's watching this flo st nor illinois bowl game but i'can tell you it's a joke...way too much size and speed with flo st...hell even xavier rhodes plays physical against this level comp...only thing that will keep no ill in the game is trickeration and flo st turnovers...if you like ej manuel i wonder why cause for what i'm seeing he's got anythng he wants and should at minimum put up 400 yards and 4 tds today if he's worth a hoot...

running that no ill qb is not gonna do anything...nice story but this is a bs bcs matchup

hooshoops
01-01-2013, 11:57 PM
as for some observations off what i saw today...

found a guy who plays left tackle in college that i think i've seen some mid round or higher grades on that you couldn't pay me to draft for the left side in the wagner kid for wisconsin...you want to talk about stiff...guys will run by that kid on the edge like he's standing still at the next level...i'm not sure i see right tackle even...might be a guard or nothing...no thanks

miss st s nickoe whitley again dropping his head looking for kill shots and suspect in coverage...i'll pass on the enforcer...

monte ball i know one thing that guy doesn't care to waste time east and west he's downhill in a hurry...but what's that kid weigh??? 200 lbs maybe...i like his mindset he's north and south but he looks a little light to run b/t the tackles 15 timer per game in the pros...plus i'm betting there's a lot of mileage on those legs already...he's got a great mindset though and runs damn tough for his size...

taylor lewan i like his attitude and he competes...i don't think he's great on the move and he may be more a power scheme fit...his feet remind me of like eric fisher jake longs...not great feet for the left side...still i really like the top tackles in this class...joeckel mathews fisher and lewan are all worth top 25 picks to me...joeckel and mathews may be the best zone fits and move athletes...fisher and lewan strike me more as power players although i do think they are scheme diverse...unlike fluker who's power scheme all the way to me

Buddy
01-01-2013, 11:58 PM
i don't know who's watching this flo st nor illinois bowl game but i'can tell you it's a joke...way too much size and speed with flo st...hell even xavier rhodes plays physical against this level comp...only thing that will keep no ill in the game is trickeration and flo st turnovers...if you like ej manuel i wonder why cause for what i'm seeing he's got anythng he wants and should at minimum put up 400 yards and 4 tds today if he's worth a hoot...

running that no ill qb is not gonna do anything...nice story but this is a bs bcs matchup

I am an FSU alum and I hate this matchup. If FSU kills them, they were supposed to and if they lose or barely win, God forbid, they are a laughing stock. No recruiting boost for FSU here, that is for sure. With that being said, Werner is a pimp. Would love to have him but not going to happen. Carradine and/or Jenkins could be excellent value though.

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datruth55
01-01-2013, 11:58 PM
i don't know who's watching this flo st nor illinois bowl game but i'can tell you it's a joke...way too much size and speed with flo st...hell even xavier rhodes plays physical against this level comp...only thing that will keep no ill in the game is trickeration and flo st turnovers...if you like ej manuel i wonder why cause for what i'm seeing he's got anythng he wants and should at minimum put up 400 yards and 4 tds today if he's worth a hoot...

running that no ill qb is not gonna do anything...nice story but this is a bs bcs matchup
Yeah this game sucks and FSU is struggling too but that falls on E.J. Manual who I think is awful. He's missed a lot of open receivers.

hooshoops
01-02-2013, 12:01 AM
Yeah this game sucks and FSU is struggling too but that falls on E.J. Manual who I think is awful. He's missed a lot of open receivers.

manuel is a waste pick at qb if you ask me...

hooshoops
01-02-2013, 12:08 AM
by the way did you guys see zach ertz go up and get that ball down the seam??? that was impressive...i saw him used a lot more flexed out and even wide on the boundary today and looking damn good at it...i've got to put that kid as a top 50 bpa ...he may be more polished than eifert...although i'd still go with eifert as my top te...

both guys would really help us

Buddy
01-02-2013, 12:14 AM
Yeah this game sucks and FSU is struggling too but that falls on E.J. Manual who I think is awful. He's missed a lot of open receivers.

I don't care who the QB is next year for FSU, we will be better just because EJ is gone. He should throw for about 350 every game but he is dumb as a stump. He couldn't read a defense or sense pressure if his soul depended on it.

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Buddy
01-02-2013, 12:17 AM
Let's not forget that Jimbo is a horrible coach albeit a very good recruiter.

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datruth55
01-02-2013, 12:20 AM
by the way did you guys see zach ertz go up and get that ball down the seam??? that was impressive...i saw him used a lot more flexed out and even wide on the boundary today and looking damn good at it...i've got to put that kid as a top 50 bpa ...he may be more polished than eifert...although i'd still go with eifert as my top te...

both guys would really help us
They flex him out a lot...and Tuilolo (or however you spell his name). Ertz is a nice player and #2 on my TE list behind Eifert and followed by Kelce.

---------- Post added at 11:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:19 PM ----------


Let's not forget that Jimbo is a horrible coach albeit a very good recruiter.

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Same thing Les Miles has been forever.

hooshoops
01-02-2013, 12:25 AM
I don't care who the QB is next year for FSU, we will be better just because EJ is gone. He should throw for about 350 every game but he is dumb as a stump. He couldn't read a defense or sense pressure if his soul depended on it.

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he's awfully physically gifted but he's a bust waiting to happen...and what's with those cornelius bennett things on his arms??? i have nightmares of the 90's buffalo bills and those damn panty hose or whatever on his arms lmao

Buddy
01-02-2013, 12:28 AM
he's awfully physically gifted but he's a bust waiting to happen...and what's with those cornelius bennett things on his arms??? i have nightmares of the 90's buffalo bills and those damn panty hose or whatever on his arms lmao

I have no idea what the arm things are but he needs some ginko biloba or something. He is an insane athlete and has a prototype body...JaMarcus Russell like...however, he is just not football smart and has no instincts unless he is running.

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Buddy
01-02-2013, 12:31 AM
They flex him out a lot...and Tuilolo (or however you spell his name). Ertz is a nice player and #2 on my TE list behind Eifert and followed by Kelce.

---------- Post added at 11:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:19 PM ----------


Same thing Les Miles has been forever.

10-4, same staff, same types of coaches. I was not happy when FSU hired him. I would probably take the NIU coach over him right now.

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hooshoops
01-02-2013, 12:35 AM
by the way i bet someone pulls the trigger on that kicker hopkins by the end of the 4th round...wouldn't surprise me if it was in the 3rd...that kids a really good looking kicker for the next level...i'd trade carp and his mullet for him right now

Buddy
01-02-2013, 12:42 AM
by the way i bet someone pulls the trigger on that kicker hopkins by the end of the 4th round...wouldn't surprise me if it was in the 3rd...that kids a really good looking kicker for the next level...i'd trade carp and his mullet for him right now

I wouldn't mind having him either but he has had a bad habit of missing kicks that come back to bite FSU. Not necessarily with the game on the line but in close games where every point counts...like the frigging Orange Bowl tonight.

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Buddy
01-02-2013, 12:56 AM
I wouldn't mind taking X. Rhodes in the first if we can get a big time WR in FA. I would be especially happy if we could trade back and take him at about 18-20.

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hooshoops
01-02-2013, 01:10 AM
no illinois tonight against flo st reminds me of davon bess...i'll let you guys figure it out...

datruth55
01-02-2013, 09:52 AM
I was waiting to see Bjorn Werner dominate an inferior team...never happened. That was disappointing.

hooshoops
01-02-2013, 10:19 AM
I was waiting to see Bjorn Werner dominate an inferior team...never happened. That was disappointing.

no doubt...i don't even think he sniffed the qb as a pass rusher...might have been saving himself though...

Buddy
01-02-2013, 11:52 AM
no doubt...i don't even think he sniffed the qb as a pass rusher...might have been saving himself though...

He was in the backfield a lot but not in pursuit...not like him at all. Seemed to be focused on containing Lynch and funneling everything to the LBs. Didn't provide for a great stat line but was very effective. His presence was felt, I believe, because Lynch will kill over pursuit and he didn't do **** last night.

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ckparrothead
01-02-2013, 04:04 PM
If you were expecting Bjoern Werner to have a big pass rushing day against an option offense with the most productive rushing quarterback in FBS football, then I think the problem lay not with Werner but with your expectations.

Werner was spilling and spying the entire game, and that was when he wasn't being straight up pulled out to play coverage linebacker.

There were very few real pass rush opportunities in the game, but when they did happen, Werner got his licks in.

hooshoops
01-02-2013, 05:50 PM
yeah i get that he was being asked to do different things yesterday than just fire off the edge as a pass rusher...so it really didn't effect anything too much for me with him...feel the same i always have...some reservations about his pass rush at the next level...

but nothing like the reservations i have about sam montgomery as a pass rusher

anyways hoping tonight is a better game...but i kinda wonder if it will be one that is within double digits at the start of the 4th...definitely shouldn't be as blatant as last nights game was...no ill had the 120th rated schedule in 1aa this year...i mean that's a joke we had to watch that

ckparrothead
01-02-2013, 10:24 PM
Florida State are such chokers on offense that game should have been put away way earlier than it was.

This Louisville-Florida game is nuts. Teddy Bridgewater is tearing Florida to pieces.

ckparrothead
01-02-2013, 10:28 PM
Sam Montgomery's name appearing on that list from the LSU strength coach as one of the guys that he won't answer questions about to scouts because they are all selfish men that miss workouts and always have excuses...I wonder if that moves the needle for NFL teams or if the scouts consider it a meanngless motivation tool used by the strength coach.

finsfanjay13
01-02-2013, 10:32 PM
Sam Montgomery's name appearing on that list from the LSU strength coach as one of the guys that he won't answer questions about to scouts because they are all selfish men that miss workouts and always have excuses...I wonder if that moves the needle for NFL teams or if the scouts consider it a meanngless motivation tool used by the strength coach.

Didn't he pop on Twitter later to say that it was because they missed one class and he'd vouch for every one of them? Probably just damage control, granted...

Buddy
01-02-2013, 10:41 PM
Florida State are such chokers on offense that game should have been put away way earlier than it was.

You can't imagine how frustrating it is to bleed garnet & gold. FSU almost always plays down to the level of their competition and always has. EJ Manuel accounts for a lot of the problems but it certainly want his fault last night. They moved the ball a ton but miss too many opportunities with stupid mistakes. Jimbo is not a great coach...he is a great recruiter but not a great coach.


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ChambersWI
01-02-2013, 10:45 PM
I know a lot of teams that are gonna be pissed Teddy Bridgewater ain't draft eligibile

hooshoops
01-02-2013, 11:31 PM
too much soft and zone coverage being played by the gators in this one...a lot of zone and they're getting owned in it...plus when louisville has had a mismatch they have exploited it

matt elam will strike you that's for dang sure...not sure i like what i see in coverage but again a lot of zone

datruth55
01-02-2013, 11:44 PM
too much soft and zone coverage being played by the gators in this one...a lot of zone and they're getting owned in it...plus when louisville has had a mismatch they have exploited it

matt elam will strike you that's for dang sure...not sure i like what i see in coverage but again a lot of zone
Typical of a Gator safety. Will hit you like a ton of bricks, good in run support...not so good in pass coverage.

hooshoops
01-02-2013, 11:49 PM
i don't think elams anywhere near as good as vaccaro is in coverage...when elams in the slot manned up those guys look open to me...that kids a fire hydrant though and the hips look pretty good...

datruth55
01-02-2013, 11:53 PM
Has Sharrif Floyd announced yet? I expect him to if he hasn't. Kid is blowing up Louisville's O-line.

hooshoops
01-02-2013, 11:56 PM
has not announced that i'm aware of...but from the looks of these kids i think it won't be long on him and elam...they look to me like they are done going to school...ha ha

finsfanjay13
01-03-2013, 12:08 AM
Floyd has no reason to go back to Florida. May not get into the first, but he's definitely a solid second rounder in the 4-3.

hooshoops
01-03-2013, 12:11 AM
i would agree with the solid 2nd rounder with floyd stuff...middle to latter half of round two...although he's not anything that interest me for miami...

hooshoops
01-03-2013, 12:24 AM
i don't see anything that's remotely even interesting with the gator wrs...it's like watching our core try to get off coverage but worse...only thing on o that's interesting is the rb gillislee and he's been a lot of hit and miss tonight and the te reed who's a pro...

other than that...yikes

hooshoops
01-03-2013, 12:31 AM
man i don't think i want chip kelly in our division...cause with the way these teams are going with all these bs offenses in pro football and having success in em i'd hate to deal with that 2 times a year

datruth55
01-03-2013, 12:32 AM
I see Jordan Reed as an H-back...Charles Clay maybe Aaron Hernandez type player at the NFL level.

hooshoops
01-03-2013, 12:35 AM
I see Jordan Reed as an H-back...Charles Clay maybe Aaron Hernandez type player at the NFL level.

yep...i agree with that...looks like an h back...be careful what you ask him to do in line...don't know if he's as sudden as aaron hernandez though...but that kid will play on sundays...if he wasn't an h back looking pro i'd have him in my top 5 te's for miami but i don't think we need his skillset...overall though i like him

hooshoops
01-03-2013, 12:52 AM
fellas there's a sophomore corner for oregon on display tomorrow night that i really like in the 2014 draft class ekpre olomu...make sure you check him out...high round pick next year...

and of course check out my guy for k state lb arthur brown who i think is a terrific 43 fit backer...oregons o and scheme may limit his impact but i love me some arthur brown...the k state wr harper who is headed to the senior bowl isn't worth a draft pick...remember that when you see him get locked up all that week

COphinphan89
01-03-2013, 01:29 AM
i don't see anything that's remotely even interesting with the gator wrs...it's like watching our core try to get off coverage but worse...only thing on o that's interesting is the rb gillislee and he's been a lot of hit and miss tonight and the te reed who's a pro...

other than that...yikes
We've had a serious hole in our WR recruiting for the last couple years and on top of that Aubrey Hill the WRs coach quit right before the season. Our WRs have been MIA all season.

Also, about Jordan Reed, he's a good athlete, but don't expect him to block anyone.

LouPhinFan
01-03-2013, 11:49 AM
i don't see anything that's remotely even interesting with the gator wrs...it's like watching our core try to get off coverage but worse...only thing on o that's interesting is the rb gillislee and he's been a lot of hit and miss tonight and the te reed who's a pro...

other than that...yikes

Did you happen to take a notice of any of Louisville's WRs? I know none of them are draft eligible yet other than Andrell Smith and Damien Copeland, but just wondering if you had any thoughts on DeVante Parker or Eli Rogers.

ChambersWI
01-03-2013, 01:19 PM
Did you happen to take a notice of any of Louisville's WRs? I know none of them are draft eligible yet other than Andrell Smith and Damien Copeland, but just wondering if you had any thoughts on DeVante Parker or Eli Rogers.

For being a guy that was only offered to get Teddy Bridgewater, Eli Rogers is developing into a nice little prospect. Parker didn't do much in the bowl, but he works the sideline well

And the debate for the next year? Whose the number 1 pick in 2014: Teddy Bridgewater or Jadaveon Clowney

ckparrothead
01-03-2013, 01:52 PM
Didn't he pop on Twitter later to say that it was because they missed one class and he'd vouch for every one of them? Probably just damage control, granted...

Exactly. When the cat got out of the bag on that, LSU had to scramble to do some damage control because that's the sort of thing that will genuinely, genuinely hurt them in recruiting. If all their recruits heard about it (and you can rest assured competing recruiters will inform them), I wouldn't be surprised if LSU lost recruits because of it. No player likes the thought that he's going to be put on blast like that publicly because he had to miss a workout with a valid excuse.

LouPhinFan
01-03-2013, 02:48 PM
For being a guy that was only offered to get Teddy Bridgewater, Eli Rogers is developing into a nice little prospect. Parker didn't do much in the bowl, but he works the sideline well

And the debate for the next year? Whose the number 1 pick in 2014: Teddy Bridgewater or Jadaveon Clowney

If its out there in the internet somewhere try and see if there's video of Parker's catch and run toward the end of the Cincinnati game. It will knock your socks off.

Eli has been a pleasant surprise for sure.

What know what's even crazier? Next season we only lose Andrel Smith to graduation but get 2 Florida transfers (1 TE, 1 slot WR) and a big 6'5" WR transfer from Tennessee active. If James Quick commits then Louisville will have more weapons that Teddy will know what to do with. Some good prospects may get lost in the shuffle.

datruth55
01-03-2013, 09:33 PM
Somebody please tell me that's not Ron Cherry referring the Oregon/KSU game.

hooshoops
01-03-2013, 11:56 PM
it is cherry...ha ha...that dudes a clown

i know one thing you got to be real careful if you decide you want to use a high round pick on anything in this oregon offense...there is so much buyer beware product of the system concerns with guys at the next level there it's not funny...only one that wouldn't concern me is deanthony thomas cause that speed and burst will translate anywhere...

dion jordan i haven't seen on the field in a while...showed off some nice edge rush explosion standing up which i already knew about played the run to a stalemate i'd say against a te which he needs to win outright as a 34 olb at the next level and would concern me but i also saw him trying to play a lot of contain so ehhh...

my corner if he was draft eligible for oregon i would take with a top 50 pick right now...serious burst and explosion to the football when he puts his foot in the ground and comes forward...very fluid hips and feet transitions out of his pedal very well...for my money he's one of the top 3 worst case players on the field...separated a shoulder sat out a series they put a harness on it he came right back in...love it...a little shorter than i like but if he's a legit 5 ft 10 with those tools i can get down with it...

the wr harper made one nice catch and run against tight coverage from my corner but my guy matched his feet with ease on the play just didn't locate the football...other than that he's made plays crossing the field against soft man coverage and shown no burst...waste a pick on that if you want...if we draft him i'll have him in the same category i had patrick turner and michael egnew...BUST

hooshoops
01-04-2013, 12:59 AM
watching kiko alonzo i think you could talk me into a 4th round pick on that kid without much of a problem...he's very fluid when asked to drop and he's got instincts vs the run and flying to the football...putting out a really good tape today...

maybe even a late 3rd rounder...although that oregon system scares me a little bit

ckparrothead
01-04-2013, 12:34 PM
the wr harper made one nice catch and run against tight coverage from my corner but my guy matched his feet with ease on the play just didn't locate the football...other than that he's made plays crossing the field against soft man coverage and shown no burst...waste a pick on that if you want...if we draft him i'll have him in the same category i had patrick turner and michael egnew...BUST

You mean this guy?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFUKCHDZYfY

hooshoops
01-04-2013, 08:42 PM
he does nothing for me...big body but that's pretty much the extent of what i see...and that was probably the most impressive play i saw last night and i mentioned it also...i'd take that corner over him any day

anyways i think tonight might be another blow out bcs game...for my money the best team in the country is playing tonight...oklahoma better hope a & m no shows...safety tony jefferson on display tonight also...i like him...and maybe the two best tackles in the country for a & m and dmontre moore...should be interesting

uk_dolfan
01-04-2013, 08:43 PM
A few thoughts on how Swope does tonight would be appreciated Hoops.

That A&M team is impressive. Sherman clearly has an eye for talent, hopefully he is heavily invooved in our draft preperation.

Twitches Brew
01-04-2013, 10:41 PM
yep...i agree with that...looks like an h back...be careful what you ask him to do in line...don't know if he's as sudden as aaron hernandez though...but that kid will play on sundays...if he wasn't an h back looking pro i'd have him in my top 5 te's for miami but i don't think we need his skillset...overall though i like him
Not entirely related, but...Hernandez actually went out and pushed Florida to recruit Reed - They're similar players (size, skills, position), and they're both from CT (about an hour apart).

hooshoops
01-05-2013, 12:32 AM
the best looking pro prospect on the field is ot jake matthews...god dang is that kid beautiful...it's effortless he's so bored and his feet are so good he's just mirroring and punching guys at times 5 seconds into his pass pro...

got to bump that guy as a top 10 bpa...joeckels nice also but mathews...damn...20 yards downfield leading the qb manziel up the middle or to the perimter of the field from the right tackle position??? you kidding me...

best tackle in the class

hooshoops
01-05-2013, 12:42 AM
A few thoughts on how Swope does tonight would be appreciated Hoops.

That A&M team is impressive. Sherman clearly has an eye for talent, hopefully he is heavily invooved in our draft preperation.

no prob...i'm a big swope fan...he's one of my draft targets...thing is swope has a lot of the same skills that davon bess does...but before people say well bess doesn't offer much big play potential so why do we want that talk the difference is swope has better top end speed than bess...and let me tell you guys if bess had better wheels and acceleration he'd be a nasty sob to deal with...

swope i wouldn't say has rediculous quick acceleration to top speed but he does have what i would gauge as early 4.6 speed and in the slot that's not half bad...he may run a late 4.5 early 4.6 imo and thats about over a tenth and a half faster than bess and that matters folks...matters a lot

as far as what swope has like bess and will translate in the pros is he possesses high end short area quickness and fluidity of hips and he can separate in and out of his cuts...when he crosses a dbs face in the slot with a 2 way go he gets the separation you covet...he also runs terrific routes and sells his routes well with pressing the db in his stem down the field and uses his head even to sell things to dbs before gearing down opening his hips and making quick cuts...

add in that he understands coverage and db leverage and runs routes off of them well and he's very smart to boot and what you have is a solid 3rd round slot selection that would fit this miami o and scheme to a t...

uk_dolfan
01-05-2013, 10:49 AM
Cheers hoops nice write up. Another thong I really like about Swope is that he is a tough kid. He can take a hit and is a pretty good blocker. This is a feature I always like in recievers.

I really think he is going to be a third round bargain for someone. Despite having bess on the roster I wouldnt mind having a second slot reciever. I just think he would be a really nice efficient reciever for us who we could depend on. If we got Jennings and kept Hartline Swope and maybe one more young reciever from round 2 would give us an offense I would be estatic about.

2413fanphins
01-05-2013, 11:43 AM
Cheers hoops nice write up. Another thong I really like about Swope is that he is a tough kid. He can take a hit and is a pretty good blocker. This is a feature I always like in recievers.

I really think he is going to be a third round bargain for someone. Despite having bess on the roster I wouldnt mind having a second slot reciever. I just think he would be a really nice efficient reciever for us who we could depend on. If we got Jennings and kept Hartline Swope and maybe one more young reciever from round 2 would give us an offense I would be estatic about.


agree wholeheartedly... never too early to start thinking about future starters/replacements for when guys leave... we need to have foresight for this type of thing, not wait until our hand is forced where we HAVE to burn a pick on somebody to fill a hole... tough with our current situation, but it's something we need to start doing IMO

ChambersWI
01-05-2013, 11:45 AM
the best looking pro prospect on the field is ot jake matthews...god dang is that kid beautiful...it's effortless he's so bored and his feet are so good he's just mirroring and punching guys at times 5 seconds into his pass pro...

got to bump that guy as a top 10 bpa...joeckels nice also but mathews...damn...20 yards downfield leading the qb manziel up the middle or to the perimter of the field from the right tackle position??? you kidding me...

best tackle in the class

too bad for you Hoops, sounds like he is staying in school

hooshoops
01-05-2013, 01:37 PM
too bad for you Hoops, sounds like he is staying in school

so i hear...maybe he's wanting to move to the left side next year if joeckel is coming out...i don't see any reason he can't play at a high level on the left side off what i see...man that kid looks good...

ckparrothead
01-05-2013, 02:13 PM
he does nothing for me...big body but that's pretty much the extent of what i see...and that was probably the most impressive play i saw last night and i mentioned it also...i'd take that corner over him any day

anyways i think tonight might be another blow out bcs game...for my money the best team in the country is playing tonight...oklahoma better hope a & m no shows...safety tony jefferson on display tonight also...i like him...and maybe the two best tackles in the country for a & m and dmontre moore...should be interesting

Going to have to refer to your boy as IEO in the future because there's no way I'm going to be able to successfully type the name Ifo Ekpre-Olomu a bunch of times.

I think I like Harper more than you do. He's more than just a big body to me. And that wasn't the only time he got the better of IEO that night. He also got him for a 7 yard catch. Was a pretty interesting play though. I've seen hitch and go before. This was hitch, go and hitch again. He was open on the hitch but Colin Klein pumped it instead of throwing it for whatever reason. So Harper tagged his route upward and IEO reacted pretty nicely. But Harper extended his arm to maintain separation with IEO and then hitched underneath again, creating the separation needed for another hitch and this time he caught it. Whereas last time Harper caught the ball on IEO and made him eat the dirt, this time IEO got him down and limited the catch to a 7-8 yard gain.

There was a third play, but it wasn't really on IEO. Or at least the catch wasn't. Harper caught the ball and ran to the inside and IEO came down from his coverage to support tackle, but then Harper made a cut back to the outside that had IEO tripping on himself and jamming his gears. There were a bunch of other duck defenders in the area though so they got him down for I think a 9 yard gain.

IEO did battle back nicely on one play though. Harper ran a vertical against him and when Klein scrambled outside the pocket Harper turned it into a comeback along the sidelines. Klein was late on the throw and IEO closed on the ball and knocked it away.

IEO looks like a good player, but overall Harper won the matchup when they faced one another, which was not often.

ckparrothead
01-07-2013, 04:23 AM
The more I view Sheldon Richardson the more I like him for Miami but conversely the less likely I think it becomes that Miami has a shot at him at #12 overall. I think Sheldon Richardson, Star Lotulelei, Luke Joeckel, Manti Te'o and Bjoern Werner will all be off the board by the time Miami selects at #12 overall. Seven other players will also be off the board too, which is frustrating.

I think Dee Milliner, Johnthan Banks, Cordarrelle Patterson, Tyler Eifert, Lane Johnson, Taylor Lewan, Zeke Ansah and MAYBE Alex Okafor could be on the short list come draft day.

Right now I think Lane Johnson is more likely to fit the scheme than Eric Fisher or Taylor Lewan, but Lewan comes in a close second place there. Luke Joeckel would be an obvious fit but he will be gone, IMO.

Folks thinking Jeff Ireland will take a guard at #12, I think Jonathan Cooper is a better guess than Chance Warmack. Personal opinion.

The light-bodied pass rushers like Jarvis Jones, KeKe Mingo, Dion Jordan or Damontre Moore, I do not see Miami going after any one of those guys. I don't think it's something they prefer in their scheme, nor do I see it being part of their priorities. There are certain things they want to make sure they're getting out of any 1st rounder they take that I do not think lend themselves to taking one of the above.

On the other hand Zeke Ansah fits more what they could be looking for. As does Sam Montgomery and MAYBE Alex Okafor.

When all is said and done I think Cordarrelle Patterson ends up going above Keenan Allen. Not necessarily saying I agree but that's my objective prediction for how the NFL will come out. I haven't really 'settled' on anything as far as position rankings and whatnot, but I only finally got around to sitting down and watching 5 more games of Cordarrelle's...and personally, I'm sorry I ever doubted him. Jim Harbaugh used a term to describe Cam Newton in 2011. He said "plutonium-grade raw material". That's the term I'd use to describe Cordarrelle Patterson. You hear this tossed around about Tavon Austin that if he were 6 inches taller he'd be a top 10 pick. Cordarrelle Patterson is Tavon Austin except 6 inches taller.

Kdawg954
01-07-2013, 09:50 AM
The more I view Sheldon Richardson the more I like him for Miami but conversely the less likely I think it becomes that Miami has a shot at him at #12 overall. I think Sheldon Richardson, Star Lotulelei, Luke Joeckel, Manti Te'o and Bjoern Werner will all be off the board by the time Miami selects at #12 overall. Seven other players will also be off the board too, which is frustrating.

I think Dee Milliner, Johnthan Banks, Cordarrelle Patterson, Tyler Eifert, Lane Johnson, Taylor Lewan, Zeke Ansah and MAYBE Alex Okafor could be on the short list come draft day.

Right now I think Lane Johnson is more likely to fit the scheme than Eric Fisher or Taylor Lewan, but Lewan comes in a close second place there. Luke Joeckel would be an obvious fit but he will be gone, IMO.

Folks thinking Jeff Ireland will take a guard at #12, I think Jonathan Cooper is a better guess than Chance Warmack. Personal opinion.

The light-bodied pass rushers like Jarvis Jones, KeKe Mingo, Dion Jordan or Damontre Moore, I do not see Miami going after any one of those guys. I don't think it's something they prefer in their scheme, nor do I see it being part of their priorities. There are certain things they want to make sure they're getting out of any 1st rounder they take that I do not think lend themselves to taking one of the above.

On the other hand Zeke Ansah fits more what they could be looking for. As does Sam Montgomery and MAYBE Alex Okafor.

When all is said and done I think Cordarrelle Patterson ends up going above Keenan Allen. Not necessarily saying I agree but that's my objective prediction for how the NFL will come out. I haven't really 'settled' on anything as far as position rankings and whatnot, but I only finally got around to sitting down and watching 5 more games of Cordarrelle's...and personally, I'm sorry I ever doubted him. Jim Harbaugh used a term to describe Cam Newton in 2011. He said "plutonium-grade raw material". That's the term I'd use to describe Cordarrelle Patterson. You hear this tossed around about Tavon Austin that if he were 6 inches taller he'd be a top 10 pick. Cordarrelle Patterson is Tavon Austin except 6 inches taller.

I refuse to mock Cordarrelle in the 2nd round because I think he'll be a top 20 guy when it's all said and done . . . but I can't wrap my head around Joe Philbin/Jeff Ireland taking this type of raw WR when you have a better fitting Robert Woods and Keenan Allen that could be had either in round 2 or in a trade up back into round 1.

Either way I'm gonna stick to my guns that there will be a player that Miami covets that will slip to the 12 pick due to QB's being such a need early in the draft. I think that guy could be Werner.

1. Werner
2A. Woods
2B. Trufant

I'm good with that.

j-off-her-doll
01-07-2013, 10:10 AM
The more I view Sheldon Richardson the more I like him for Miami but conversely the less likely I think it becomes that Miami has a shot at him at #12 overall. I think Sheldon Richardson, Star Lotulelei, Luke Joeckel, Manti Te'o and Bjoern Werner will all be off the board by the time Miami selects at #12 overall. Seven other players will also be off the board too, which is frustrating.

I think Dee Milliner, Johnthan Banks, Cordarrelle Patterson, Tyler Eifert, Lane Johnson, Taylor Lewan, Zeke Ansah and MAYBE Alex Okafor could be on the short list come draft day.

Right now I think Lane Johnson is more likely to fit the scheme than Eric Fisher or Taylor Lewan, but Lewan comes in a close second place there. Luke Joeckel would be an obvious fit but he will be gone, IMO.

Folks thinking Jeff Ireland will take a guard at #12, I think Jonathan Cooper is a better guess than Chance Warmack. Personal opinion.

The light-bodied pass rushers like Jarvis Jones, KeKe Mingo, Dion Jordan or Damontre Moore, I do not see Miami going after any one of those guys. I don't think it's something they prefer in their scheme, nor do I see it being part of their priorities. There are certain things they want to make sure they're getting out of any 1st rounder they take that I do not think lend themselves to taking one of the above.

On the other hand Zeke Ansah fits more what they could be looking for. As does Sam Montgomery and MAYBE Alex Okafor.

When all is said and done I think Cordarrelle Patterson ends up going above Keenan Allen. Not necessarily saying I agree but that's my objective prediction for how the NFL will come out. I haven't really 'settled' on anything as far as position rankings and whatnot, but I only finally got around to sitting down and watching 5 more games of Cordarrelle's...and personally, I'm sorry I ever doubted him. Jim Harbaugh used a term to describe Cam Newton in 2011. He said "plutonium-grade raw material". That's the term I'd use to describe Cordarrelle Patterson. You hear this tossed around about Tavon Austin that if he were 6 inches taller he'd be a top 10 pick. Cordarrelle Patterson is Tavon Austin except 6 inches taller.

If I had to guess Miami's #12 pick today, it'd be a tossup between Patterson and Cooper. The WR class is so rich, I could see them putting it off for the 2nd and 3rd Rounds and drafting a guy who would give Miami the most athletic LC/C combo in the league. If it were me, I wouldn't get too cute. WR is our biggest need, and I think Patterson is well worth the 12th overall pick. This is assuming Patterson is available. Your closing comment about Patterson and Austin works well for me.

Kdawg954
01-07-2013, 10:46 AM
I also agree after workouts I don't expect Richardson to be there when we pick . . . and thank goodness for that as I think Ireland probably couldn't pass that guy up. I don't consider it a great investment if we are drafting a DT in the top 15 when one of your GM's few strong points is finding DT talent, whether in round 1 or undrafted. This first round pick needs to be a pass rusher, a wide receiver or a CB. Cooper and Eifert at 12 is too rich for me . . . and I couldn't pass up Patterson or Allen at 12 for them.

Depending how things fall, I would not be opposed to a trade down at all, especially with the meat of this draft being on day 2. If I could trade down and nab Cooper/Eifert/Patterson/Allen and potentially have 3 2nd round picks . . . sign me up right now.

ChambersWI
01-07-2013, 12:17 PM
the problem with Richardson is he's got a low IQ and a poor work ethic off of the field. He failed out of Mizzou for skipping classes and was suspended this year.

MiamiDolphin618
01-07-2013, 01:04 PM
I wouldn't be mad at all with Patterson at 12...or Allen for that matter. Allen is more polished but as stated Patterson has a ridiculous ceiling and really brings something special with those RAC skills. Another name to toss out there is Phillip Thomas. Might be a little bit rich at 12...but he is the best safety in this class IMO.

ChambersWI
01-07-2013, 01:31 PM
sounds like both Zack Ertz and Levine Troilolo are declaring

hooshoops
01-07-2013, 01:49 PM
i watched robert woods bowl game and if not for that qb looking like straight *** he would have went off...i'd be stoked to get him at #42...whatever that guy is in the pros i like it

Fin Thirteen
01-07-2013, 02:03 PM
sounds like both Zack Ertz and Levine Troilolo are declaring

Toilolo would be very nice. I'll pass on Ertz tho.

hooshoops
01-07-2013, 02:06 PM
i'll pass on toilet lolo...

JakeMcAwful
01-07-2013, 03:34 PM
@TonyPauline: "As we've been reporting since start of October, Gavin Escobar/TE/SDSU officially in draft."

If the tight end position is ignored in the first couple of rounds, he could be an pretty good pickup in the third perhaps?

ckparrothead
01-07-2013, 05:36 PM
I remain very interested in Levine Toilolo. I don't know how a man that tall manages to play with that kind of pad level, but I find it very intriguing.

ChambersWI
01-07-2013, 09:19 PM
so far LSU is losing the following players to the draft
Barkevious Mingo
Kevin Minter
Brad Wing
Spencer Ware
Tharold Simon
Eric Reid
Michael Ford
Sam Montgomery
Bennie Logan

Still gonna have talent, but that is a lot to replace. Only 2 fairly easy will be Ford and Ware and that's because they have Hill and Blue

uk_dolfan
01-07-2013, 10:39 PM
How do you college experts feel about Eddie Lacy in the pros? Now he is my kind of back! He is dominating today but I wonder is it the o line setting him up?

ChambersWI
01-08-2013, 10:49 AM
Lacy is a nice prospect in his own right, but he's not on the level of a Trent Richardson or even Mark Ingram.

j-off-her-doll
01-08-2013, 12:19 PM
i watched robert woods bowl game and if not for that qb looking like straight *** he would have went off...i'd be stoked to get him at #42...whatever that guy is in the pros i like it

Where do you have Woods in relation to the other WR's in the class?

I also like him pretty well at #42, but I go back and forth as to how I like him compared to Bailey and Patton.

hooshoops
01-09-2013, 12:53 PM
Where do you have Woods in relation to the other WR's in the class?

I also like him pretty well at #42, but I go back and forth as to how I like him compared to Bailey and Patton.

somewhere in the top 5...haven't ranked em yet...will wait for the postseason stuff...

ChambersWI
01-10-2013, 10:34 AM
The OT class isn't as strong as originally thought. Lewan is staying at Michigan. Means Eric Fisher, Lane Johnson, and Brennan Williams are gonna make a lot of money.

datruth55
01-10-2013, 01:01 PM
The OT class isn't as strong as originally thought. Lewan is staying at Michigan. Means Eric Fisher, Lane Johnson, and Brennan Williams are gonna make a lot of money.
Luke Joeckel at least made it official. He's coming out. Might be some people trading up to get him since he's head and shoulders better than the other guys coming out this year.

hooshoops
01-10-2013, 01:05 PM
huh...lewan staying...i saw something that said jake matthews was still deciding...i think it bumps up aboushi also somewhat

datruth55
01-10-2013, 02:24 PM
huh...lewan staying...i saw something that said jake matthews was still deciding...i think it bumps up aboushi also somewhat
Jake Matthews is staying.

http://gamedayr.com/gamedayr/texas-am-jake-matthews-to-return-for-senior-season/

Edit: Sorry that was the wrong article. This is the one where he announced today he was staying.

http://blog.chron.com/aggies/2013/01/aggies-jake-matthews-will-return-for-senior-season/

ckparrothead
01-11-2013, 04:08 PM
I like Lane Johnson somewhat.

MadDog 88
01-13-2013, 03:54 PM
Obviously, I am ecstatic Lewan is staying. :D

ChambersWI
01-13-2013, 04:25 PM
Obviously, I am ecstatic Lewan is staying. :D

makes Michigan's OL look a lot less of an issue as they'll have 3 new starters instead of 4 (though I think some of the guys who were RS this year will be better than the guys we started this year... all due respect to Omameh,Barnum, and Mealer)

hooshoops
01-16-2013, 09:44 AM
hoops offensive senior bowl attendees prospects of interest as of 1/15...

qb tyler wilson arkansas...when it's all said and done i'm betting wilson goes top 10 pick in the 2013 draft

wr aaron dobson marshall...can this kid separate in and out of his cuts??? does he take false or extra steps when gearing down??? does he get off press and physically win at the los??? does he possess long speed or is he a possession guy only??? does he use his hands well??? kind of things i want answers on and will be looking for

wr terrance williams baylor...i know he has long speed for his size and get vertical but will he win at the los against press and will he separate in and out of cuts??? if the answers are yes i think he's a round 1 pick...if the answers are no he will nose dive for me

wr quinton patton la tech...i expect him to show very well and for a small school guy to by the end of the week be getting a lot of top 50 consideration...looking forward to seeing him against some better competition

wr ryan swope texas a & m...will his short area quicks and lateral agility show as well as they do on tape for me??? when he crosses a cbs face will get continue to get quick separation and will he show any long speed??? no matter what he does i've seen enough on tape to lock him in as a top 3 round guy for me...i think he's a terrific slot option at the next level who plays very intelligent and runs great routes...understands db leverage and where soft spots are in zone also and can get off the los...

wr markus wheaton oregon st...i think he's one to watch next week...i expect to see that burst and acceleration to separate show up and very good fluidity of hips and cod...should be a guy that wins a lot in one on one drills...this kid can separate in and out of cuts and down the field

te's travice kelce and ryan otten...the only 2 te's that really interest me going in...maybe mike williams as a late round guy

ol kyle long oregon...i think he may show well athletically as a left guard zbs fit...needs to get stronger i see a lot of finesse in his game but i think i see the movement skills and athleticism that a zbs would covet...not sure where to grade him though...looking for next week to help clear some things up for me in that regard...

ot oday aboushi uva and eric fisher central michigan...i expect to see aboushi have some issues with strength early in the week but as the week goes on for him to get better...kid needs to get stronger but i like his future as a starting nfl lt down the road...can solidify a 2nd round pick grade and value with a solid showing...as for fisher likely a top 20 pick especially with lewan and jake matthews staying in school but will he dominate the competition and just road grade people off the ball like he does on college tape and will his issues with standing up too high in pass pro and letting guys get under his pad level show up??? are his feet better than i think??? i see a lot of jake long like feet with this kid...watch him on the move though when he gets moving that kid can motor down the field in a hurry...

ol larry warford lane johnson and dallas thomas...limited to date exposure with all three but will i see something that has me scouring for tape on any of em??? i think i might

k dustin hopkins...dollars to donuts he's a top 4 round pick and maybe goes in round 3...good looking kicker there

Fin Thirteen
01-16-2013, 10:26 AM
Kelce and Otten, Hoops? Wow. Surprised there, I have to say. Otten is primarily an in-line blocking TE from what I've seen. Not much about him to suggest he's a pass-catching threat. Look out Jeron Mastrud - there's competition in town!

And I have serious doubts about Kelce, based mainly on his body shape. He has a very high center of gravity and goes down if a linebacker exhales on him. Looks physically maxed out on top and very light on the bottom half. Me no likey!

So you like big blocking tight ends and you hate Toilolo? What's your thinking there? Genuinely interested...