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Nublar7
01-13-2013, 01:41 PM
https://twitter.com/JayGlazer/status/290508624395124736


While I think Jets will hire some1 quickly for GM job, they have been getting rebuffed a lot and gone back to some asking them to reconsider

https://twitter.com/JayGlazer/status/290510750261334016


Rex isn't what GM candidates are concerned with - their cap situation, personnel, QB and the circus turned a lot of candidates off


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1D5Sa2Yq-2g

WVDolphan
01-13-2013, 01:46 PM
:lol: I saw Glazer talking about this on the FOX pregame earlier. :lol:

Even the studio host said he would pass on the job and followed by saying only because I love it here so much while winking. :lol:

There are only 32 of these jobs in the world. They are well paying jobs and everyone in the field aspires to be a GM one day. Yet the Jests cant give the position away. :rotfl1:

J. David Wannyheimer
01-13-2013, 02:04 PM
Looks like Jay Glazer is just a casual, uneducated fan.

MadDog 88
01-13-2013, 02:23 PM
Whiny media and average fans don't realize that the Jets are giving careful consideration and being thorough in there search. :rolleyes2:

You can't make this stuff up. The Jets have outdone Al Davis in his final years of the Raiders. Seriously, I don't remember ever seeing any professional franchise this bad. Jets fans should be humiliated their owner is putting them through this. What's pathetic is a few of their fans actually believe the **** Woody is shoveling to them. Morons :lol:

PhinzN703
01-13-2013, 02:55 PM
I trust my eyes and all the potential GMs turning the Jets down are all bums anyway

ChambersWI
01-13-2013, 03:37 PM
My theory is this...

1. While Rex may not be the reason candidates are turning down the Jets, I have no doubt he's a problem. Remember when we were looking for a GM way back in the day, Wayne Huizenga told all candidates that they would not be allowed to fire Wanny. Pretty much every candidate withdrew their name.

2. The cap situation is just difficult. With how the contracts are set up, unless they can get teams willing to make a trade, they cannot get rid of contracts. If they cut players, they'll have dead space.

J. David Wannyheimer
01-13-2013, 03:48 PM
My theory is this...

1. While Rex may not be the reason candidates are turning down the Jets, I have no doubt he's a problem. Remember when we were looking for a GM way back in the day, Wayne Huizenga told all candidates that they would not be allowed to fire Wanny. Pretty much every candidate withdrew their name.

2. The cap situation is just difficult. With how the contracts are set up, unless they can get teams willing to make a trade, they cannot get rid of contracts. If they cut players, they'll have dead space.

Rex is the ringmaster, of course he is part of the reason people are turning down the Jets.

Jay Glazer and Rex Ryan are good friends. Rex lets Jay Glazer bring his son into Jets training camp, the only reporter who gets that privilege. Enough said.

teemu7
01-13-2013, 03:50 PM
Cap problems? They are just going to cut some guys and voila, problem solved. They have no cap problems, a winner for a qb, ,tons of weapons who are really awesome but just got hurt and an awesome coach.

The jets are not a circus, you're just jealous of all their successes as an elite team over the past decade.


Hahahah

Fin_Frenzy_84
01-13-2013, 03:57 PM
Offer me the job!!! I will be sure to make Sanchez the highest paid QB and Tebow the second highest paid QB!

jared81
01-13-2013, 06:21 PM
Who would want to go there?

-a d coordinator who can't shut his mouth for a head coach
-the worst starting qb in the league, being paid waaay too much
-a brutal press
-one of the worst cap/talent situations in the league

tht only thing I could see that would entice someone is if woody gave the gm a guaranteed 5 years and the ability to fire Ryan. Woody has shown he is willing to spend.

Daytona Fin
01-13-2013, 09:29 PM
Here is a rotoworld post. LOL, where can I find the an application for the job?



Jet's can't even give the GM job away

Appearing on FOX NFL Sunday, Jay Glazer said the Jets "can't give the position away" when talking about their general manager vacancy.
"They're calling back candidates who already turned them down," added Glazer. "Their cap situation, personnel, QB and the circus turned a lot of candidates off." One of those candidates could be 49ers director of player personnel Tom Gamble, who was once considered the odds-on-favorite for the job but may have spurned the Jets. ESPN's Adam Schefter mentioned earlier on Sunday that ex-Bears GM Jerry Angelo is a "name to watch."
http://www.rotoworld.com/headlines/nfl/254028/glazer-jets-cant-even-give-the-gm-job-away?rw=1

Nublar7
01-13-2013, 11:35 PM
I think Scott Cohen will eventually get the Jets GM job.

WVDolphan
01-13-2013, 11:59 PM
They should just give it to NYJunc and get it over with.

Vertical Limit
01-14-2013, 12:47 AM
They're in cap hell because of their previous GM that they just fired. This one guy posted this disturbing fact:



Originally Posted by Don http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/01/viewpost-1.gif (http://forums.theganggreen.com/showthread.php?p=2699941#post2699941)

Ok, one more time..this is why the Jets have a problem...can they get under the cap, of course but at what expense?

The Jets are currently 20 million over the cap..they have 20 free agents who do not count one penny towards that 140 million dollar number (that's why they are free agents)..here's the list:

Yeremiah Bell
Mike DeVito
Braylon Edwards
Nick Folk
Shonn Greene
Lex Hilliard
Dustin Keller
Laron Landry
Brandon Moore
Chaz Schilens
Matt Slauson
Bryan Thomas
Jeff Cumberland
Austin Howard
Joshua Mauga
Tanner Purdum
Dedrick Epps
Isaiah Trufant
Darrin Walls
Jordan White

At least 9 of them started last year..they can cut Tebow, Pace, Scott and both Smiths and get to where they are about 12 million under the cap but now they have to sign 25 new players (20+5) to field a team..and what kind of team will that be when they do?

If you don't think the Jets are in cap hell you are crazy..surprisingly enough several GM candidates do..I wonder why...


Boy am I glad this is not our situation. Jets are serious contenders for first pick overall if this is true.

finomenal
01-14-2013, 01:39 AM
:lol: I saw Glazer talking about this on the FOX pregame earlier. :lol:

Even the studio host said he would pass on the job and followed by saying only because I love it here so much while winking. :lol:

There are only 32 of these jobs in the world. They are well paying jobs and everyone in the field aspires to be a GM one day. Yet the Jests cant give the position away. :rotfl1:

They need nyjunc to sell the job. 2 AFC championship appearances. :lol:

finomenal
01-14-2013, 01:42 AM
Cap problems? They are just going to cut some guys and voila, problem solved. They have no cap problems, a winner for a qb, ,tons of weapons who are really awesome but just got hurt and an awesome coach.

The jets are not a circus, you're just jealous of all their successes as an elite team over the past decade.


Hahahah

I won't even address the "elite team" comment...

Moving on, just cutting guys doesn't necessarily solve the problem. I haven't looked at the contracts and don't really care to, but if you cut players with big signing bonuses, all that proration gets accelerated into one year. Cap hits are why you don't see teams pulling a Marlins like coup.

finomenal
01-14-2013, 01:46 AM
They should just give it to NYJunc and get it over with.

I'm sure Dave Wannstache would love to take a shot at being a GM again.

trojanma
01-14-2013, 01:55 AM
If they are stupid enough to hire Angelo.
Look out moire lean years coming.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

Thumper1016
01-14-2013, 02:39 AM
If they are stupid enough to hire Angelo.
Look out moire lean years coming.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

Well lets hope they hire this man.

Ben Had
01-14-2013, 07:44 AM
They should just give it to NYJunc and get it over with.

This would work great for the Jets cause "super Fan" doest belive they have a cap issue:lol2: Like he said...they only need to cut a few dead wood and there right back in the SB hunt:lol:

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 09:53 AM
we've been turned down by 1 candidtate who used us to get more money/power from jax.

this job isn't for everyone. To be in the spotlight and to alreayd have a HC in place it's not an ideal place for someone who has options.

WVDolphan
01-14-2013, 09:59 AM
we've been turned down by 1 candidtate who used us to get more money/power from jax.

this job isn't for everyone. To be in the spotlight and to alreayd have a HC in place it's not an ideal place for someone who has options.

That bolded statement says it all. Most would argue that Jacksonville is the worst franchise in the league. But, given recent developements and the fact that the Jaguars have come out and said there is no way they are taking Tebow whereas the Jests did, Id say a new contender has emerged for that title. :lol:

PhinzN703
01-14-2013, 10:43 AM
we've been turned down by 1 candidtate who used us to get more money/power from jax.

this job isn't for everyone. To be in the spotlight and to alreayd have a HC in place it's not an ideal place for someone who has options.

So Glazer saying they've been rebuffed a lot is actually only by just 1 potential GM? Makes sense.

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 12:00 PM
That bolded statement says it all. Most would argue that Jacksonville is the worst franchise in the league. But, given recent developements and the fact that the Jaguars have come out and said there is no way they are taking Tebow whereas the Jests did, Id say a new contender has emerged for that title. :lol:

There's no pressure in jax, he doesn't have Tom Brady to deal with and he could pick his own coach. See the difference?

WVDolphan
01-14-2013, 12:09 PM
There's no pressure in jax, he doesn't have Tom Brady to deal with and he could pick his own coach. See the difference?

Much like the Jests, your posts get funnier everyday.

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 12:10 PM
Mike McCartney@MikeMcCartney7


I've spoken with too many personnel guys who would relish the #Jets GM job. I'm not buying recent reports nobody wants it.

Vaark
01-14-2013, 12:16 PM
There's no pressure in jax, he doesn't have Tom Brady to deal with and he could pick his own coach. See the difference?

Taking that a step further, he also knew that he wasn't saddled with the kind of judgment of an HC who hired The Meatball, more or less calling him "just like me," the ridiculous hellish cap implications including having to keep the worst starting QB in the league since JaMarcus nor sight unseen, any worse of a Tebow-foisting, headline pandering meddlesome owner who tampers with front office decisions. See the difference?.

PhinzN703
01-14-2013, 12:29 PM
Mike McCartney@MikeMcCartney7


I've spoken with too many personnel guys who would relish the #Jets GM job. I'm not buying recent reports nobody wants it.

So let's ignore Jay Glazer's report but accept Mike McCartney's b/c why?

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 12:53 PM
So let's ignore Jay Glazer's report but accept Mike McCartney's b/c why?

No but I think sometimes things get overexaggerated especially w/ the Jets this year.

Ben Had
01-14-2013, 12:56 PM
No but I think sometimes things get overexaggerated especially w/ the Jets this year.

Why dont we here any overexaggerated comments about the Giants? Your both from NY and share the same field?

WVDolphan
01-14-2013, 12:57 PM
No but I think sometimes things get overexaggerated especially w/ the Jets this year.

Yea like Rex saying how Tebow was going to be used, how they were going to be physically dominant on offense, how Sanchez was going to be a solid QB, how the offense in general was going to be imposing to the opposition, how teams were going to hate playing the Jets, and how good the defense was when they held teams with no offensive ability at all to low yardage production.

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 01:11 PM
Yea like Rex saying how Tebow was going to be used, how they were going to be physically dominant on offense, how Sanchez was going to be a solid QB, how the offense in general was going to be imposing to the opposition, how teams were going to hate playing the Jets, and how good the defense was when they held teams with no offensive ability at all to low yardage production.

Things change when yor top 2 options in the pass game are out. when you play the majority of a season w/ Kelrey, Schilens, Gates, Cumberland, reuland as your top weapons in the pass game that's not good.

WVDolphan
01-14-2013, 01:15 PM
Things change when yor top 2 options in the pass game are out. when you play the majority of a season w/ Kelrey, Schilens, Gates, Cumberland, reuland as your top weapons in the pass game that's not good.

Oh yea. I forgot how physically dominant Santonio Holmes is in the running game. He is a regular Hines Ward. I can see how his absence ruined all of Rex's plans for them to be phyisically imposing to the point other teams hated playing the Jets.

Vaark
01-14-2013, 01:17 PM
Actually things become clearer when the best coach on the staff, present from the get go this season, admits there were were really never any preseason secret packages or sets for Teblow (regardless of who else lined up alongside him). Anyone who doesn't think that The Beancounter was set up as the fall guy for the meddling, attention-whoring, trust fund, tax-cheating owner is either a blind homer or failed Logic101. Not that the Beancounter didn't deserve the heave-ho for the Ponzi Scheme-like cap hell he created, or the caliber of players he either drafted, signed or resigned over the last several years - however, here in the No Spin Zone, we all know who foisted Teblow on the team.

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 01:29 PM
Oh yea. I forgot how physically dominant Santonio Holmes is in the running game. He is a regular Hines Ward. I can see how his absence ruined all of Rex's plans for them to be phyisically imposing to the point other teams hated playing the Jets.

we actually ran it ok for about half the year(the 2nd half) but w/ no threat in the pass game it made life difficult for the QB. Did you see what the backup did when Mark was out? We had few healthy weapons on O.

cbreeden
01-14-2013, 01:32 PM
we've been turned down by 1 candidtate who used us to get more money/power from jax.

this job isn't for everyone. To be in the spotlight and to alreayd have a HC in place it's not an ideal place for someone who has options.

One?!? How about several. Glazer had it right...they can't give the job away.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/jets_gm_search_nears_end_nrSv2HaSQ88FKGZGSuQXvN


The Jets also had interest in Tom Telesco and John Dorsey, but neither interviewed. Telesco took the Chargers GM job and Dorsey was hired by the Chiefs as their new GM


It appears the Jets are unsure of what they exactly want in their new GM

MadDog 88
01-14-2013, 01:37 PM
Caldwell used the Jets for a money grab from Jacksonville? :lol: Trouble with that theory is that the Jets offered a 1mil housing allowance and the Jags didn't.

Caldwell went to Jacksonville where there are no cap issues, he can pick his coach, has no meddling owner and the QB situation, though horrible, is not as bad.

Comparing Mike McCartney to Jay Glazer. :crazy:

cbreeden
01-14-2013, 01:40 PM
we actually ran it ok for about half the year(the 2nd half) but w/ no threat in the pass game it made life difficult for the QB. Did you see what the backup did when Mark was out? We had few healthy weapons on O.

Considering he was the third option on the team at the beginning of the year and had absolutely no practice time with the 1st string...he did pretty good. 19 completions; 1 TD / 1 Int with a passer rating avg of 91.5 PLUS: NO BUTT FUMBLES!

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 01:47 PM
Caldwell used the Jets for a money grab from Jacksonville? :lol: Trouble with that theory is that the Jets offered a 1mil housing allowance and the Jags didn't.

Caldwell went to Jacksonville where there are no cap issues, he can pick his coach, has no meddling owner and the QB situation, though horrible, is not as bad.

Comparing Mike McCartney to Jay Glazer. :crazy:

I'm sure he got more money than when he first interviewed which is the point. he wanted the jax job, nothing wrong with that. Not everyone can handle being in the spotlight.

PhinzN703
01-14-2013, 01:47 PM
One?!? How about several. Glazer had it right...they can't give the job away.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/jets_gm_search_nears_end_nrSv2HaSQ88FKGZGSuQXvN

All lies

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 01:49 PM
One?!? How about several. Glazer had it right...they can't give the job away.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/jets_gm_search_nears_end_nrSv2HaSQ88FKGZGSuQXvN

the Jets targeted Caldwell, that's who they wanted. They had to scramble to try to interview those other guys who were alreayd far along in their process. This isn't like Peyton and all the coaches turning down Miami.

MadDog 88
01-14-2013, 02:09 PM
the Jets targeted Caldwell, that's who they wanted. They had to scramble to try to interview those other guys who were alreayd far along in their process. This isn't like Peyton and all the coaches turning down Miami.No doubt Manning and Fisher turned us down. So what? Some of us dont have trouble recognizing issues that make our team look bad. Not true with you who goes to great extents and makes himself look like an idiot defending his team.

Mike13
01-14-2013, 02:12 PM
Things change when yor top 2 options in the pass game are out. when you play the majority of a season w/ Kelrey, Schilens, Gates, Cumberland, reuland as your top weapons in the pass game that's not good.

Tannehill had zero weapons outside of Reggie Bush, learned and progressed with a crappy supporting cast.
All the while looking better than Sanchez ever did.



the Jets targeted Caldwell, that's who they wanted. They had to scramble to try to interview those other guys who were alreayd far along in their process. This isn't like Peyton and all the coaches turning down Miami.

And yet the reality is we are in much better shape than your team going forward, well at least when it comes to the coach and QB.

Vaark
01-14-2013, 02:27 PM
The jest wouldn't be so tied to sadsack Sanchez's contract if Peyton wasn't so disdainful of the jest overtures that he wouldn't even bother to return Woody's calls. That's the ultimate rejection, insult, repudiation and resulting booby prize since Belicheat told them "take this promotion to HC and shove it" and Al Groh (although granted that was a different set of clowns but nevertheless still "SOJ.")

http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/03/atp6yb-1.jpg

PhinzN703
01-14-2013, 02:32 PM
the Jets targeted Caldwell, that's who they wanted. They had to scramble to try to interview those other guys who were alreayd far along in their process. This isn't like Peyton and all the coaches turning down Miami.

And there's the knock. Everyone turned down the Dolphins while it's just one guy who turned down the Jets but it wasn't b/c of them, it was money. As if money or control was a non-factor with Manning, Fisher, Alex Smith, Matt Flynn, etc.

**** us. The Jets rule.

Still the same.

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 02:52 PM
Tannehill had zero weapons outside of Reggie Bush, learned and progressed with a crappy supporting cast.
All the while looking better than Sanchez ever did.




And yet the reality is we are in much better shape than your team going forward, well at least when it comes to the coach and QB.

and Tannehill won the same amount of games as mark Sanchez(remember he was hurt when you beat us).

maybe you are, that remains to be seen. Our HC and QB have had success in this league in their current roles, yours have not.


And there's the knock. Everyone turned down the Dolphins while it's just one guy who turned down the Jets but it wasn't b/c of them, it was money. As if money or control was a non-factor with Manning, Fisher, Alex Smith, Matt Flynn, etc.

**** us. The Jets rule.

Still the same.

I could have sworn I mentioned our opening is not an attractive one based the high pressure and not being able to pick your own HC but maybe I'm mistaken?

PhinzN703
01-14-2013, 03:26 PM
I could have sworn I mentioned our opening is not an attractive one based the high pressure and not being able to pick your own HC but maybe I'm mistaken?

There's pressure for every team and GM to win. Why do you think the ****tier teams have revolving doors at HC like KC, Cleveland, JAX, etc?

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 03:29 PM
There's pressure for every team and GM to win. Why do you think the ****tier teams have revolving doors at HC like KC, Cleveland, JAX, etc?

you really think the pressure and scrutiny is the same w/ the Jets as it is in Cle, KC, Jax or even Miami?

NY8123
01-14-2013, 03:37 PM
you really think the pressure and scrutiny is the same w/ the Jets as it is in Cle, KC, Jax or even Miami?

You are teetering on the EXACT same situation that Miami got itself into after Jimmy and Dan left. One more disaster of a season will have everyone talking about the circus that no one wants to come to town and most certianly is not tops on the list to be the ring master of.

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 04:13 PM
You are teetering on the EXACT same situation that Miami got itself into after Jimmy and Dan left. One more disaster of a season will have everyone talking about the circus that no one wants to come to town and most certianly is not tops on the list to be the ring master of.

it's a little different b/c the last 2 JJ/Marinoteams lost by a combined 162-10 in their last 2 playof losses in the div rd so they didn't have the same success. If Rex has a year like 2012 he will likely be gone, it's up to him to be closer to 2010 than 2012.

Daytona Fin
01-14-2013, 04:36 PM
and Tannehill won the same amount of games as mark Sanchez(remember he was hurt when you beat us).



And sanchez was benched vs ARZ , for 3rd stringer mcelroy who came in and won the game so sanchez don't get credit for that win.

Ben Had
01-14-2013, 04:41 PM
I often feel like everyone's arguing with Sanchez's mom:crazy:

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 04:49 PM
And sanchez was benched vs ARZ , for 3rd stringer mcelroy who came in and won the game so sanchez don't get credit for that win.

Sanchez missed a qtr of that game and left trailing by 3, tannehill missed 98% of the game.

Daytona Fin
01-14-2013, 04:57 PM
Sanchez missed a qtr of that game and left trailing by 3, tannehill missed 98% of the game.

Oh that's how it works. So sanchez won the game because he was benched for being shut out at home and trailing in the 3rd quarter but tannehill don't get credit for being injured while leading the game. Makes sense.

PhinzN703
01-14-2013, 05:04 PM
you really think the pressure and scrutiny is the same w/ the Jets as it is in Cle, KC, Jax or even Miami?

Teams exist to win. Their goal is to win. If they don't, they're ****ed. Yes there are cities that have more scrutiny b/c of their fan base, or their local media, or the moves the make. But pressure is there for everyone.

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 05:11 PM
Teams exist to win. Their goal is to win. If they don't, they're ****ed. Yes there are cities that have more scrutiny b/c of their fan base, or their local media, or the moves the make. But pressure is there for everyone.

so are you saying the scrutiny in jacksonville is the same as in NY?

Ben Had
01-14-2013, 05:16 PM
so are you saying the scrutiny in jacksonville is the same as in NY?

So your thoughts are its easer to win in Jax because there is less pressure from the media?

And if Sanchez played for Jax he would be better?

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 05:26 PM
So your thoughts are its easer to win in Jax because there is less pressure from the media?

And if Sanchez played for Jax he would be better?

Sanchez has thrived here in big games and under pressure.

Rex Ryan led us to 2 title games, from 1969-2008 the jets franchise made 2 title games, yet his job was in jeoprady and many wanted him fired. Jack Del Rio was in jax for 9 years and won 1 playoff game- a WC gane.

Ben Had
01-14-2013, 05:46 PM
Sanchez has thrived here in big games and under pressure.

Rex Ryan led us to 2 title games, from 1969-2008 the jets franchise made 2 title games, yet his job was in jeoprady and many wanted him fired. Jack Del Rio was in jax for 9 years and won 1 playoff game- a WC gane.

Thrived in big games and under pressure...do you understand he has 50+turnovers in just the last 2 years? Lead the league in 2011 in pick6's!

You really have issues understanding the game of football.

nyjunc
01-14-2013, 06:34 PM
Thrived in big games and under pressure...do you understand he has 50+turnovers in just the last 2 years? Lead the league in 2011 in pick6's!

You really have issues understanding the game of football.

he was bad this year, he was ok in 2011, he was very good in 2010 and in '09 & '10 he was very good in postseason- in the biggest games he's ever played. In the same round that Matt Schaub was terrible yesterday Sanchez was great 2 years ago against a better NE team.

teemu7
01-14-2013, 07:15 PM
So that means mark Sanchez is better then Matt Schaub?


Who is a better qb mark Sanchez or Matt Schaub?

PhinzN703
01-14-2013, 08:28 PM
Sanchez has thrived here in big games and under pressure.

Rex Ryan led us to 2 title games, from 1969-2008 the jets franchise made 2 title games, yet his job was in jeoprady and many wanted him fired. Jack Del Rio was in jax for 9 years and won 1 playoff game- a WC gane.

Did Jack Del Rio run his mouth about the playoffs and getting to/winning the Super Bowl? Is Del Rio the son a former hothead coach?

---------- Post added at 07:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:26 PM ----------


Thrived in big games and under pressure...do you understand he has 50+turnovers in just the last 2 years? Lead the league in 2011 in pick6's!

You really have issues understanding the game of football.

Well Sanchez won a few playoff games a few years ago and that means he can do no wrong. There's only a few other elite QBs better than him.

Vaark
01-14-2013, 09:38 PM
Oh that's how it works. So sanchez won the game because he was benched for being shut out at home and trailing in the 3rd quarter but tannehill don't get credit for being injured while leading the game. Makes sense.

Please don't be misled by "fantasy logic" Unfortunately most average fans fall into the trap of understanding Reality as an independent, incontrovertible truth rather than properly viewing it in context - that's context to what presents the jest in the best light. But naturally if you were a knowledgable fan you'd have been aware of this.

jared81
01-14-2013, 10:23 PM
he was bad this year, he was ok in 2011, he was very good in 2010 and in '09 & '10 he was very good in postseason- in the biggest games he's ever played. In the same round that Matt Schaub was terrible yesterday Sanchez was great 2 years ago against a better NE team.

You are the only person in the world who thinks Sanchez is better than schaub. I think Ryan would trade Sanchez for him straight up if he could.

The New Guy
01-14-2013, 10:26 PM
I'm sure he got more money than when he first interviewed which is the point. he wanted the jax job, nothing wrong with that. Not everyone can handle being in the spotlight.


the Jets targeted Caldwell, that's who they wanted. They had to scramble to try to interview those other guys who were alreayd far along in their process. This isn't like Peyton and all the coaches turning down Miami.

Actually, it is a lot like that. You don't think there were valid reasons why Manning chose Denver over Miami? Manning signed with Den because they had a lot more cap space, and because they are in a weak division. He got paid, and it was the best place for him to have a shot at the Super Bowl. Harbaugh chose SF because his family wanted to stay in California. Fisher chose St. Louis because he was offered more control and they had the #2 overall pick in the draft. Nothing wrong with all of that right? Yet, you had no problems bashing Miami last offseason. Now that it is the Jets, you are singing a different tune. :lol:

Caldwell apparently had no interest in the Jets, and only met with them to use them. You can speculate on the reasons why he didn't want to come to the Jets, but it is quite the spin job to blame it solely on pressure and less money. I think the Jets buffoonery the last 2 years might have a little something to do with it.

WVDolphan
01-15-2013, 09:50 AM
8:50 AM. Almost time for Junc's arrival. I wonder what nonsense he will spew today.

nyjunc
01-15-2013, 10:33 AM
So that means mark Sanchez is better then Matt Schaub?


Who is a better qb mark Sanchez or Matt Schaub?

2010 mark is better than Schaub, current mark isn't better than anyone.


You are the only person in the world who thinks Sanchez is better than schaub. I think Ryan would trade Sanchez for him straight up if he could.

if we have schaub in '09/'10 I bet we don't make a single title game. better #s doesn't make better QB, some guys are just #s guys.

cbreeden
01-15-2013, 10:52 AM
Did Jack Del Rio run his mouth about the playoffs and getting to/winning the Super Bowl? Is Del Rio the son a former hothead coach?

---------- Post added at 07:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:26 PM ----------



Well Sanchez won a few playoff games a few years ago and that means he can do no wrong. There's only a few other elite QBs better than him.

Actually, there are 19 backup QBs better than him.

PhinzN703
01-15-2013, 11:00 AM
he was bad this year, he was ok in 2011, he was very good in 2010 and in '09 & '10 he was very good in postseason- in the biggest games he's ever played. In the same round that Matt Schaub was terrible yesterday Sanchez was great 2 years ago against a better NE team.

I heard over the weekend that this NE team is the best group of offensive players they've ever had. It might have been on the pregame show but I don't remember. But since the Jets weren't playing this year's team, it was the team back then that was better.

---------- Post added at 10:00 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:58 AM ----------


if we have schaub in '09/'10 I bet we don't make a single title game. better #s doesn't make better QB, some guys are just #s guys

You say this b/c Sanchez's numbers are ****. It's so funny to dismiss numbers as if they are made up and aren't a sum of a player's season.

Vaark
01-15-2013, 11:10 AM
In 09, Schaub beat NE, the Bengals (before they flatlined) and 2 8-8 teams: SF and TN for a legitimate 9-7 record in a division in a tougher division that season. It's hard to persuasively argue that this same QB couldn't have at least brought the Jest to 7-7 before the flagrant, embarrassing charity kicked in, let alone in the SD playoff game, not at the least stood aside watching Kaedig miss what were for him 2 chip shots while still doing better than completing less than half of his passes, throwing 1TD and 1Int, with a 60QBR and 101 yards. Very hard to believe indeed. Hell I have difficulty believing that game that Henne couldn't have done all of that and more.

nyjunc
01-15-2013, 11:27 AM
I heard over the weekend that this NE team is the best group of offensive players they've ever had. It might have been on the pregame show but I don't remember. But since the Jets weren't playing this year's team, it was the team back then that was better.

---------- Post added at 10:00 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:58 AM ----------



You say this b/c Sanchez's numbers are ****. It's so funny to dismiss numbers as if they are made up and aren't a sum of a player's season.

Interesting b/c they were w/o their best offensive weapon in gronk and they won 2 more games despite playing in a tougher division.

Their D allowed less pts in 2010 and scored more. They were better in 2010 w/o a doubt.


In 09, Schaub beat NE, the Bengals (before they flatlined) and 2 8-8 teams: SF and TN for a legitimate 9-7 record in a division in a tougher division that season. It's hard to persuasively argue that this same QB couldn't have at least brought the Jest to 7-7 before the flagrant, embarrassing charity kicked in, let alone in the SD playoff game, not at the least stood aside watching Kaedig miss what were for him 2 chip shots while still doing better than completing less than half of his passes, throwing 1TD and 1Int, with a 60QBR and 101 yards. Very hard to believe indeed. Hell I have difficulty believing that game that Henne couldn't have done all of that and more.

So it only counts if Jets opponents rest starters? you do know NE rested starters, right? Brian Hoyer came in during the 2nd qtr not midway through the 3rd like Indy did w/ their backups.

Schaub led his O to ZERO pts against us in 2009, sanchez led his team to 24 pts AT Houston. If they beat us week 1 they don't miss the playoffs.

have someone explain football to yuo so you don't keep posting such nonsense about the 2009 div rd game(and everything else).

PhinzN703
01-15-2013, 12:10 PM
Interesting b/c they were w/o their best offensive weapon in gronk and they won 2 more games despite playing in a tougher division.

Their D allowed less pts in 2010 and scored more. They were better in 2010 w/o a doubt.

Without Gronk in the playoff game?

nyjunc
01-15-2013, 12:17 PM
Without Gronk in the playoff game?

yeah, we compared them as far as the 2012 div rd team vs. the 2010 div rd team, right?

PhinzN703
01-15-2013, 01:00 PM
yeah, we compared them as far as the 2012 div rd team vs. the 2010 div rd team, right?

But Gronkowski got hurt during the game so what does his injury have to do with a pregame opinion that this is NE's best offensive team?

PhinzN703
01-15-2013, 01:05 PM
Interesting b/c they were w/o their best offensive weapon in gronk and they won 2 more games despite playing in a tougher division.

Their D allowed less pts in 2010 and scored more. They were better in 2010 w/o a doubt.

NE scored 557 points this year. They had 513 in 2011, 518 in 2010, and 427 in 2009. Their defense gave up 18 more points this year than in 2010 (not counting special teams/offensive TOs for TDs if there were any).

They also had a point differential of +226 this year and scored the most pts in the league which was 76 more than Denver who finished second.

nyjunc
01-15-2013, 01:28 PM
NE scored 557 points this year. They had 513 in 2011, 518 in 2010, and 427 in 2009. Their defense gave up 18 more points this year than in 2010 (not counting special teams/offensive TOs for TDs if there were any).

They also had a point differential of +226 this year and scored the most pts in the league which was 76 more than Denver who finished second.

so O and D were close but they had no challenger in the division where they had one in 2010 and the AFC was much stronger in 2010. They also had a better record by 2 games, they went 6-1 against playoff bound teams in 2010 vs. 3-3 this year

Vaark
01-15-2013, 02:44 PM
Interesting b/c they were w/o their best offensive weapon in gronk and they won 2 more games despite playing in a tougher division.

Their D allowed less pts in 2010 and scored more. They were better in 2010 w/o a doubt.


http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/01/atu0ax-1.jpg

So it only counts if Jets opponents rest starters? you do know NE rested starters, right? Brian Hoyer came in during the 2nd qtr not midway through the 3rd like Indy did w/ their backups.

Schaub led his O to ZERO pts against us in 2009, sanchez led his team to 24 pts AT Houston. If they beat us week 1 they don't miss the playoffs.

have someone explain football to yuo so you don't keep posting such nonsense about the 2009 div rd game(and everything else).


You're actually complaining that a team putting in a a back up QB and replacement players is misleading and shouldn't be afforded credibility??? . LOLOLOL

And oh, as to your "Fantasy Minutes" played, when the starters leave with a lead and play the subsequent game where they humiliate you 24-zero in the final 31 minutes, it doesn't matter when they left vs Hoyer - as the predictable outcome was cast for anyone not a homer.

Hello games 15 and 16 09 with a special shoutout to Jim Irsay's BFF Curtis "QBR16" Painter.

nyjunc
01-15-2013, 03:17 PM
You have an excuse for everything and I love how every writer is an idiot that doesn't subscribe to your homer ways.

teemu7
01-15-2013, 03:27 PM
You tell people they deflect, but can't answer a question, a very simple one...


Who is a better qb overall, mark Sanchez or Matt schaub. Mind you, you already told us Sanchez is better then tony romo..

Just one word answer, better qb, Sanchez or schaub

nyjunc
01-15-2013, 03:29 PM
You tell people they deflect, but can't answer a question, a very simple one...


Who is a better qb overall, mark Sanchez or Matt schaub. Mind you, you already told us Sanchez is better then tony romo..

Just one word answer, better qb, Sanchez or schaub

I answered it. Right now obviously it is Schaub but mark at his best in 2010 is better than Schaub at his peak, Scaub has gagged down the stretch every season and was pretty bad this postseason.

Vaark
01-15-2013, 04:04 PM
You have an excuse for everything and I love how every writer is an idiot that doesn't subscribe to your homer ways.

No just you for living in what's now a lonely parallel mirror image universe, even on TGG and for being so clueless to accuse others of exactly what your shtick has predictably become. Laughingstock on 2 boards :up: That takes a concerted effort

nyjunc
01-15-2013, 04:14 PM
http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/01/funny_stalker_hatp148661351559844074enxq-1.jpg

Vaark
01-15-2013, 04:33 PM
http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/05/dg2nev-1.jpg

teemu7
01-15-2013, 04:37 PM
What did Sanchez do down the stretch with the playoffs on the line? He was benched.

All your Sanchez is good in big games is total bs, I would say the titans game on Monday night was a big game for you, loss knocks you out of the playoffs, he stunk then too. New England on thanksgiving on national tv? Big game? He butt fumbled


It takes a serious homer to have the opinions you do

nyjunc
01-15-2013, 04:52 PM
What did Sanchez do down the stretch with the playoffs on the line? He was benched.

All your Sanchez is good in big games is total bs, I would say the titans game on Monday night was a big game for you, loss knocks you out of the playoffs, he stunk then too. New England on thanksgiving on national tv? Big game? He butt fumbled


It takes a serious homer to have the opinions you do

he was terrible this year and he was terrible to end 2011.



I told you vaark, quit while you are actually funny. Your stalker post si equivalent to saying "I know you are but what am I". You are the one that follows me to various baords and follows me in all threads. I don't follow you, I don't care about you.

Vaark
01-15-2013, 05:58 PM
he was terrible this year and he was terrible to end 2011.



I told you vaark, quit while you are actually funny. Your stalker post si equivalent to saying "I know you are but what am I". You are the one that follows me to various baords and follows me in all threads. I don't follow you, I don't care about you.

I told you I read 3 jest boards and a bills board regularly. Anytime there's something negative, you're there with your OCD lastworditis doing your Baghdad Bob impression so I can't help but stumble onto you on TGG. (and shake my head in confirmation on how consistently ridiculous and delusional you are in your drooling Pavlovian dog grade defense of anything and anyone connected to the jest). You have become a source of derision now on 2 boards.

On the other hand about 2 months ago or so where our kicker gift wrapped the game to you , you flitted around here like a whirling dervish from forum to forum, obsessively/compulsively trying to cover up every critical jest post or positive fins post with the spin that takes place from the voices in your head. I estimated about 185 posts on FH in less than 24 hours. And that doesn't count all your concurrent posts on TGG.

Likewise, whenever I make an objective observation regarding the jest, or one in the satirical manner they've brought upon themselves in the main forum on non jest related threads, you're there lurking/stalking me and making snide comments. So really Little Chrissy poo, who's the stalker and who's the obsessed homer fan who cares too much about what the fans from a historically superior and legendary franchise think about the jest?

Your pathology is beyond the pale of normalcy. You really need to come to grips with your dysfunctionality - a few folks who know I like to swat you around cat and mouse style you have commented to me that you are totally out of control, into full tilt troll mode and have abandoned any pretense of objectivity or casual interest. Ain't just me; you're making a spectacle of yourself now on 2 boards. But of course everyone else but you is wrong.

Oh and I took that Restraining Order out on you well over 2 years ago, long before you came up with the "stalker"shtick in response to the way you jumped on any fins-centric post when I negatively mentioned the jest. But carry on since "imitation is the sincerest form of flattery."

nyjunc
01-15-2013, 06:14 PM
An objective post from YOU?:lol2::lol2::lol2::lol2:

Your next objective post will be your first.

Vaark
01-15-2013, 06:19 PM
An objective post from YOU?:lol2::lol2::lol2::lol2:

Your next objective post will be your first.

http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/01/33thw7p-1.jpg

http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/01/evccva-1.jpg

J. David Wannyheimer
01-16-2013, 12:33 AM
The list of candidates for the New York Jets general manager job has apparently shrunk by one.


According to Brian Costello of the New York Post, New York Giants director of college scouting Marc Ross has pulled his name out of contention (https://twitter.com/BrianCoz/status/291369575004651520) for the job.


Ross reportedly interviewed for the job last week before deciding he didnít want to pursue the job further. Ross was one of nine candidates to have been linked to the job.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/01/15/marc-ross-withdraws-from-jets-g-m-contention/


lmao they can't even give the job away.

MadDog 88
01-16-2013, 12:55 AM
The list of candidates for the New York Jets general manager job has apparently shrunk by one.


According to Brian Costello of the New York Post, New York Giants director of college scouting Marc Ross has pulled his name out of contention (https://twitter.com/BrianCoz/status/291369575004651520) for the job.


Ross reportedly interviewed for the job last week before deciding he didnít want to pursue the job further. Ross was one of nine candidates to have been linked to the job.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/01/15/marc-ross-withdraws-from-jets-g-m-contention/


lmao they can't even give the job away.What is interesting here is that Ross wouldn't need to uproot his family to take the job.

Ben Had
01-16-2013, 08:24 AM
I told you I read 3 jest boards and a bills board regularly. Anytime there's something negative, you're there with your OCD lastworditis doing your Baghdad Bob impression so I can't help but stumble onto you on TGG. (and shake my head in confirmation on how consistently ridiculous and delusional you are in your drooling Pavlovian dog grade defense of anything and anyone connected to the jest). You have become a source of derision now on 2 boards.

On the other hand about 2 months ago or so where our kicker gift wrapped the game to you , you flitted around here like a whirling dervish from forum to forum, obsessively/compulsively trying to cover up every critical jest post or positive fins post with the spin that takes place from the voices in your head. I estimated about 185 posts on FH in less than 24 hours. And that doesn't count all your concurrent posts on TGG.

Likewise, whenever I make an objective observation regarding the jest, or one in the satirical manner they've brought upon themselves in the main forum on non jest related threads, you're there lurking/stalking me and making snide comments. So really Little Chrissy poo, who's the stalker and who's the obsessed homer fan who cares too much about what the fans from a historically superior and legendary franchise think about the jest?

Your pathology is beyond the pale of normalcy. You really need to come to grips with your dysfunctionality - a few folks who know I like to swat you around cat and mouse style you have commented to me that you are totally out of control, into full tilt troll mode and have abandoned any pretense of objectivity or casual interest. Ain't just me; you're making a spectacle of yourself now on 2 boards. But of course everyone else but you is wrong.

Oh and I took that Restraining Order out on you well over 2 years ago, long before you came up with the "stalker"shtick in response to the way you jumped on any fins-centric post when I negatively mentioned the jest. But carry on since "imitation is the sincerest form of flattery."



You are right...I like to look at the TGG daily also. nyjunc is and has been getting his azz handed to him there daily. He's now babbling and rambling when put on the spot. I kinda feel sorry for him over there...but in his mind he's the only one with a clue and every one else is just a whinny jet fan.

flynryan15
01-16-2013, 09:02 AM
http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/05/dg2nev-1.jpg

I find the plaintiffs petition of merit as the respondent is clearly of mental defect and hereby grant the order of protection

nyjunc
01-16-2013, 10:27 AM
You are right...I like to look at the TGG daily also. nyjunc is and has been getting his azz handed to him there daily. He's now babbling and rambling when put on the spot. I kinda feel sorry for him over there...but in his mind he's the only one with a clue and every one else is just a whinny jet fan.

It's posters like you and vaark, the GG version. Guys getting roasted in arguments while I get countered w/ stats w/o context. read and absorbe the info, you will be much better off if you do that.


The list of candidates for the New York Jets general manager job has apparently shrunk by one.


According to Brian Costello of the New York Post, New York Giants director of college scouting Marc Ross has pulled his name out of contention (https://twitter.com/BrianCoz/status/291369575004651520) for the job.


Ross reportedly interviewed for the job last week before deciding he didnít want to pursue the job further. Ross was one of nine candidates to have been linked to the job.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/01/15/marc-ross-withdraws-from-jets-g-m-contention/


lmao they can't even give the job away.

Hoew long have you guys been following sports? That's a PR move for Ross who wasn't getting the job. So for a week and a half he wants it but the Jets never offer and now he removes himself b/c he knows he's not getting the job to save some face. I realize it's the Jets and you guys cannot be objective but at least try.

Vaark
01-16-2013, 11:10 AM
It's posters like you and vaark, the GG version. Guys getting roasted in arguments while I get countered w/ stats w/o context. read and absorbe the info, you will be much better off if you do that.

http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/09/1z4lw5h-1.jpg

Hoew long have you guys been following sports? That's a PR move for Ross who wasn't getting the job. So for a week and a half he wants it but the Jets never offer and now he removes himself b/c he knows he's not getting the job to save some face. I realize it's the Jets and you guys cannot be objective but at least try.

The reality to anybody with even an ounce of objectivity left is that Ross realized what a mess his little brother is, didn't want to be saddled with an embedded (like the shingles virus), imploded, clueless, over-his-head HC whose record (including 2 playoff wins) since week 13 in 2010 is 18-22 and CAPtive to a starting QB who has been compared to JaMarcus Russell. Oh did I mention an owner more concerned with grabbing backpage headlines and meddling with the football guys by making them burn a 4th rounder for nothing more than an attention grabber?

What wasn't mentioned there is that the Korn Ferry headhunter, now suffering through a rude awakening after thinking he had a license to print money, is getting snippy and rude with the candidates he's contacting who are bluntly declaring "thanks but no thanks."

http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/03/mwpop2-1.jpg

nyjunc
01-16-2013, 11:13 AM
the funny thing is I bet you look like Captain jet

PhinzN703
01-16-2013, 11:20 AM
You are right...I like to look at the TGG daily also. nyjunc is and has been getting his azz handed to him there daily. He's now babbling and rambling when put on the spot. I kinda feel sorry for him over there...but in his mind he's the only one with a clue and every one else is just a whinny jet fan.

All amateurs. They don't trust their eyes nor do they know anything about football.

nyjunc
01-16-2013, 12:09 PM
All amateurs. They don't trust their eyes nor do they know anything about football.

nah, I'm an idiot. All regular fans who do nothing but post stats and rankings clearly have crushed my weak arguments. Did you know Peyton Manning had a great game in the div rd of '05 vs. Pitt? The stat sheet says that so it must be true!

PhinzN703
01-16-2013, 12:25 PM
nah, I'm an idiot. All regular fans who do nothing but post stats and rankings clearly have crushed my weak arguments. Did you know Peyton Manning had a great game in the div rd of '05 vs. Pitt? The stat sheet says that so it must be true!

Not an idiot. Just almightier than anyone else apparently.

nyjunc
01-16-2013, 12:55 PM
Not an idiot. Just almightier than anyone else apparently.

It's not hard to be when you se the people I debate with.

PhinzN703
01-16-2013, 01:18 PM
It's not hard to be when you se the people I debate with.

But on both sites, here and TGG.com? We have some intelligent people here. I can't speak for the other site.

tylerdolphin
01-16-2013, 01:59 PM
By "stats without context" I assume you mean any and all stats that suggest Sanchez is terrible.

Look, QB rating isnt an end all, be all stat, but you can get a rough idea of where a QB stands in relation to other QBs. QBs that hover in the lower third in QB rating throughout their careers just arent very good. Im guessing QB rating is a fanasy stat though.

MadDog 88
01-16-2013, 02:35 PM
By "stats without context" I assume you mean any and all stats that suggest Sanchez is terrible.

Look, QB rating isnt an end all, be all stat, but you can get a rough idea of where a QB stands in relation to other QBs. QBs that hover in the lower third in QB rating throughout their careers just arent very good. Im guessing QB rating is a fanasy stat though.If Sanchez' QBR was top 10 we would hear about it repeatedly don't ya know.

nyjunc
01-16-2013, 03:01 PM
By "stats without context" I assume you mean any and all stats that suggest Sanchez is terrible.

Look, QB rating isnt an end all, be all stat, but you can get a rough idea of where a QB stands in relation to other QBs. QBs that hover in the lower third in QB rating throughout their careers just arent very good. Im guessing QB rating is a fanasy stat though.

Where am I saying mark was anything other than terrible this year? please find it.

Stats w/o context means calling our run game a top run game in 2010 or saying our D was GREAT, sayinf peyton was great against pitt 2005. Smarter fans can dig through the raw #s.


If Sanchez' QBR was top 10 we would hear about it repeatedly don't ya know.

he has a top 10 all time postseason QBR, do you see me crowing about that repeatedly? have I ever brought that up?


But on both sites, here and TGG.com? We have some intelligent people here. I can't speak for the other site.

On all sites. Most boards are filled w/ average fans who evaluate based strictly on stats/rankings. One thing I have learned is fans are the same on every board, the only difference is the team we root for. The excuses are the same.

teemu7
01-16-2013, 04:14 PM
A director of college scouting took himself out of contention for a gm job bc of a pr move?

You cannot seriously believe this.

PhinzN703
01-16-2013, 04:25 PM
On all sites. Most boards are filled w/ average fans who evaluate based strictly on stats/rankings. One thing I have learned is fans are the same on every board, the only difference is the team we root for. The excuses are the same.

While this site has a lot of people here you usually see the ones argue with you be the same day in and day out. Everyone in this thread for instance and of course the 30 others daily that involve the Jets. I don't think any of us are dimwit tools when it comes to football.

nyjunc
01-16-2013, 05:08 PM
While this site has a lot of people here you usually see the ones argue with you be the same day in and day out. Everyone in this thread for instance and of course the 30 others daily that involve the Jets. I don't think any of us are dimwit tools when it comes to football.

Not all of you, there are some that know their stuff and just post silly things for fun but there are others who have no idea what this game is about.

DisturbedShifty
01-16-2013, 05:25 PM
Not all of you, there are some that know their stuff and just post silly things for fun but there are others who have no idea what this game is about.

Opinions. They're like *******s. Everyone has one. Some are just more full of **** than others.

Forgive my spelling. This was sent from my phone.

Ben Had
01-17-2013, 07:24 AM
Not all of you, there are some that know their stuff and just post silly things for fun but there are others who have no idea what this game is about.

You'll always be the Rich Kotite of Finheaven to me:lol2:

nyjunc
01-17-2013, 09:36 AM
You'll always be the Rich Kotite of Finheaven to me:lol2:

Can I at least be Bruce Coslet?

Nublar7
01-17-2013, 11:14 AM
The Jets reportedly are supposed to make their hire by today. Lets see if they can get a taker for the job in the deadline they set.

Vaark
01-17-2013, 11:22 AM
The Jets reportedly are supposed to make their hire by today. Lets see if they can get a taker for the job in the deadline they set.

Ya mean someone actually placed a bid on Ebay before the the closing time ???

Daytona Fin
01-18-2013, 10:50 AM
John idzik emerges as favorite to win jets gm job



Seahawks cap guru John Idzik has emerged as the favorite for the Jets' general manager job.
Per ESPN's Adam Schefter, Idzik has overtaken in-house candidate Scott Cohen and Pittsburgh's Omar Khan as the "clear frontrunner" to replace Mike Tannenbaum in New York. Schefter reports Idzik could be offered the job "as early as tonight." Idzik's title with Seattle is "VP of Football Administration." He has little to no background as an evaluator of personnel and talent.
http://www.rotoworld.com/headlines/nfl/254276/john-idzik-emerges-as-favorite-to-be-jets-gm

PhinzN703
01-18-2013, 11:40 AM
Cap guru huh? Tannenbaum was just that according to Junc so the Jets will be elite again very soon.

nyjunc
01-18-2013, 12:15 PM
Cap guru huh? Tannenbaum was just that according to Junc so the Jets will be elite again very soon.

He's been involved w/ personnel too. I hope we are elite again soon, 2-3 years is not long enough for me.

The New Guy
01-18-2013, 01:01 PM
He's been involved w/ personnel too. I hope we are elite again soon, 2-3 years is not long enough for me.

With the little experience Idzick has, I wonder how much say Rex and Woody will have.


Not that I think the Jets were ever elite, but why do you keep including the 3rd year? I know they still had more playoffs wins than x amount of teams, but who cares when you go 8-8 and miss the playoffs?

PhinzN703
01-18-2013, 01:15 PM
He's been involved w/ personnel too. I hope we are elite again soon, 2-3 years is not long enough for me.

It shouldn't be enough for you unless they win it all. That's how it should be for all of us.

nyjunc
01-18-2013, 02:09 PM
With the little experience Idzick has, I wonder how much say Rex and Woody will have.


Not that I think the Jets were ever elite, but why do you keep including the 3rd year? I know they still had more playoffs wins than x amount of teams, but who cares when you go 8-8 and miss the playoffs?

2 elite seasons but elite overall throuhg 3 seasons under rex.

I don't think Woody has any involvement in personnel. Rex will be involved.

tylerdolphin
01-18-2013, 02:19 PM
2 elite seasons but elite overall throuhg 3 seasons under rex.

lol wut?

13ktownguy
01-18-2013, 02:31 PM
It's posters like you and vaark, the GG version. Guys getting roasted in arguments while I get countered w/ stats w/o context. read and absorbe the info, you will be much better off if you do that.



Hoew long have you guys been following sports? That's a PR move for Ross who wasn't getting the job. So for a week and a half he wants it but the Jets never offer and now he removes himself b/c he knows he's not getting the job to save some face. I realize it's the Jets and you guys cannot be objective but at least try.
:cat: l

13ktownguy
01-18-2013, 02:33 PM
:cat: Let me out of this nuthouse!!!

PhinzN703
01-18-2013, 02:45 PM
2 elite seasons but elite overall throuhg 3 seasons under rex.

I don't think Woody has any involvement in personnel. Rex will be involved.

Why would they be elite at 8-8?

tylerdolphin
01-18-2013, 02:47 PM
Why would they be elite at 8-8?

Well its good to know that we were a missed FG in OT from being an elite team this year. Looks like we are much closer than I thought.

nyjunc
01-18-2013, 02:50 PM
Why would they be elite at 8-8?

Overall from 2009-2011, they were elite 2 of the 3 seasons but overall in those 3 season still considered elite. This year w/ a 2nd down season making it 2 of 4 years as elite we fall from the overall though we still lead in title game apps and are among the leaders in playoff wins.

Nublar7
01-18-2013, 04:21 PM
Jets said they were going to make a GM hire by Thursday. Friday afternoon and they still haven't hired anyone. :lol: Typical Jets.

Though I do see that the frontrunner is this guy from the Seahawks, John Itchy? John Idiot? Whatever, apparently he is a guy who has no real personnel background. :up:

The New Guy
01-18-2013, 04:41 PM
Overall from 2009-2011, they were elite 2 of the 3 seasons but overall in those 3 season still considered elite. This year w/ a 2nd down season making it 2 of 4 years as elite we fall from the overall though we still lead in title game apps and are among the leaders in playoff wins.

NE and Bal also have 2 title game apps in the last 4 years. Bal has 3 title game apps in the last 5 years. NE and Bal also have 6 divisions titles between them and have made the playoffs 4 straight years while the Jets have only made it 2 out of 4.

Overall? How can you retain an elite title when you go 8-8 and miss the playoffs? I get that a great team can have a down year, but the Jets have gone 3 out of 4 seasons struggling to win 9 games. These past 2 seasons show that they were never elite to begin with.


Jets said they were going to make a GM hire by Thursday. Friday afternoon and they still haven't hired anyone. :lol: Typical Jets.

Though I do see that the frontrunner is this guy from the Seahawks, John Itchy? John Idiot? Whatever, apparently he is a guy who has no real personnel background. :up:

I think it is pronounced Idget. :chuckle:

nyjunc
01-18-2013, 04:42 PM
Jets said they were going to make a GM hire by Thursday. Friday afternoon and they still haven't hired anyone. :lol: Typical Jets.

Though I do see that the frontrunner is this guy from the Seahawks, John Itchy? John Idiot? Whatever, apparently he is a guy who has no real personnel background. :up:

The Jets never announced they were making a hire by Thursday, those were rumors. There's nothing wrong w/ being thorough is there? this was always going to be a darwn out search as well as the OC search.

It doesn't matter who we hire, Jet fans will say it's a good move and opposing fans will bash it. The truth is none of us will know until the new GM has a chance to prove himself.

nyjunc
01-18-2013, 04:45 PM
NE and Bal also have 2 title game apps in the last 4 years. Bal has 3 title game apps in the last 5 years. NE and Bal also have 6 divisions titles between them and have made the playoffs 4 straight years while the Jets have only made it 2 out of 4.

Overall? How can you retain an elite title when you go 8-8 and miss the playoffs? I get that a great team can have a down year, but the Jets have gone 3 out of 4 seasons struggling to win 9 games. These past 2 seasons show that they were never elite to begin with.



I think it is pronounced Idget. :chuckle:

yep, the Jets are tied for the lead in title game apps.

Bal plays in a division w/o NE in it, it's a little easier tow in than the AFC East despite the rest of the division stinking(the 2 teams that are always bad).

through 3 years they had the most title game apps, most playoff wins in AFC, tied for most in NFL. That's elite overall through 3 though the actuall elite years were '09 & '10.

The New Guy
01-18-2013, 04:53 PM
yep, the Jets are tied for the lead in title game apps.

Bal plays in a division w/o NE in it, it's a little easier tow in than the AFC East despite the rest of the division stinking(the 2 teams that are always bad).

through 3 years they had the most title game apps, most playoff wins in AFC, tied for most in NFL. That's elite overall through 3 though the actuall elite years were '09 & '10.

Bal plays in a division with Pitt in it. You know, the team that has 2 Super Bowl apps and a Super Bowl win in the last 5 years. The team that has gone 12-4 three out of 5 seasons. Bal won their division by winning 12 games. The Jets wouldn't have any division titles in the AFC North either.

nyjunc
01-18-2013, 04:58 PM
Bal plays in a division with Pitt in it. You know, the team that has 2 Super Bowl apps and a Super Bowl win in the last 5 years. The team that has gone 12-4 three out of 5 seasons. Bal won their division by winning 12 games. The Jets wouldn't have any division titles in the AFC North either.

Yep, a team that has missed the playofs 2 of the last 4 years- just like the Jets.

NE has averaged 12 wins per season the last 4 years
Pitt has averaged 10

Bal won the division w/ 10 wins this year, 10 wins wouldn't have been good enouhg to beat out NE any of the 4 years. we may have won in 2009, we did whip the North champs on the road inthe playoffs that year.

The New Guy
01-18-2013, 06:45 PM
Yep, a team that has missed the playofs 2 of the last 4 years- just like the Jets.

NE has averaged 12 wins per season the last 4 years
Pitt has averaged 10

Bal won the division w/ 10 wins this year, 10 wins wouldn't have been good enouhg to beat out NE any of the 4 years. we may have won in 2009, we did whip the North champs on the road inthe playoffs that year.

The Steelers missed the playoffs at 9-7 in 09, and then made it to the Super Bow with 12 wins the next year. They went 12-4 again the year after that, and then missed the playoffs this year at 8-8. Not quite like the Jets.

Bal has won at least 11 games three out of the last 5 seasons. The Jets won 11 games just once. The Ravens won 12 games in 2010 and 2011. The Jets have won 12 games in a season just once in franchise history. NE went 10-6 in 2009 and 12-4 this year. The Ravens won their 2 division titles with 10 and 12 wins. I am not saying it isn't tough to win the division with NE in it, but it isn't easy to win a division with Pitt in it either.

Nublar7
01-18-2013, 06:50 PM
Jets finally hired Itchy. Scratchy wasn't available for comment.

The Jets also hired Marty Mornhinweg as their offensive coordinator.What do you think of that junc?

PhinzN703
01-18-2013, 07:24 PM
Overall from 2009-2011, they were elite 2 of the 3 seasons but overall in those 3 season still considered elite. This year w/ a 2nd down season making it 2 of 4 years as elite we fall from the overall though we still lead in title game apps and are among the leaders in playoff wins.

Well no, they aren't elite but let's not go into that realm again. Yes you lead in title game apps, great. Why would an elite team go 8-8 after 2 straight years of being elite?

PhinzN703
01-18-2013, 07:29 PM
The Steelers missed the playoffs at 9-7 in 09, and then made it to the Super Bow with 12 wins the next year. They went 12-4 again the year after that, and then missed the playoffs this year at 8-8. Not quite like the Jets.

Bal has won at least 11 games three out of the last 5 seasons. The Jets won 11 games just once. The Ravens won 12 games in 2010 and 2011. The Jets have won 12 games in a season just once in franchise history. NE went 10-6 in 2009 and 12-4 this year. The Ravens won their 2 division titles with 10 and 12 wins. I am not saying it isn't tough to win the division with NE in it, but it isn't easy to win a division with Pitt in it either.

Those teams aren't elite. The Jets are elite. My eyes told me so.

Ben Had
01-18-2013, 07:57 PM
Jets finally hired Itchy. Scratchy wasn't available for comment.

The Jets also hired Marty Mornhinweg as their offensive coordinator.What do you think of that junc?

Probably meens Vic or McNab...but Nacho ran the WCO in college:lol:

The New Guy
01-18-2013, 08:05 PM
Jets finally hired Itchy. Scratchy wasn't available for comment.

The Jets also hired Marty Mornhinweg as their offensive coordinator.What do you think of that junc?

I don't know much about Idget, but I don't think that Mornhinweg is a bad move. As an offensive coordinator he has had top 10 offenses in passing yards, points and yards per attempt.

If I were a Jets fan, my concerns would be:

Sanchez running a West Coast offense ------- Cue the Vick to the Jets rumors
Mornhinweg O's have had a lot of turnovers
How much of Mornhinweg's success in Philly was because of Andy Reid
Did I mention Sanchez running a West Coast offense? :lol:

Vaark
01-18-2013, 08:09 PM
09-11 Jets
Homeristic Delusion = "Elite"
Reality: a Sh*t Samwich with 54 weeks of edible meat in the middle.

http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/05/dfw12h-1.jpg

PhinzN703
01-18-2013, 08:20 PM
If the Dolphins went to the AFC Title Game in 2009 and 2010 I wouldn't call them elite. I don't even think the 1984 team was elite. The only elite Dolphins team ever was the one in 1972 and 1973.

I don't even give a **** about winning divisions. As long as a team makes the playoffs and wins the Super Bowl, they have a chance at being elite.

Obviously Junc continues to insist the Jets are elite, or were elite, b/c that's the only thing he has to cling to. Hell it'd be the same if all of us here claimed the Dolphins were elite in a 4 year span the same as him. Imagine the tables being turned?

DisturbedShifty
01-18-2013, 08:53 PM
If the Dolphins went to the AFC Title Game in 2009 and 2010 I wouldn't call them elite. I don't even think the 1984 team was elite. The only elite Dolphins team ever was the one in 1972 and 1973.

I don't even give a **** about winning divisions. As long as a team makes the playoffs and wins the Super Bowl, they have a chance at being elite.

Obviously Junc continues to insist the Jets are elite, or were elite, b/c that's the only thing he has to cling to. Hell it'd be the same if all of us here claimed the Dolphins were elite in a 4 year span the same as him. Imagine the tables being turned?

****. If the tables were turned and we had someone saying we were elite for that same time frame he would be arguing how the Jets allowed us to get into those games and that we aren't elite.

Forgive my spelling. This was sent from my phone.

MadDog 88
01-19-2013, 02:53 AM
So the Jets hire a guy who's experience is geared more toward cap management then personnel evaluation and hire a WCO OC under a head coach who has the philosophy and personnel for a ground and pound scheme. Brilliance at its best.

Vaark
01-19-2013, 07:20 AM
As LMAO-worthy the Jest Junkie's conveniently parsed definition is of "elite," even more rib-tickling is his definition that whatever residual aura existed from a mediocre team being gifted into the playoffs, (then beating a dead team walking over its last 7 games and doing enough to lose to most any team other than one having a choking kicker before ultimately being humiliated in the final half by the team whose decision was justified letting them in) negated the stench of the 2010 team's mediocrity.

Well I guess considering that the 08 Fins orchestrated the greatest one-time turnaround in the history of the league, actually resulting in hardware, and that through week 14 we also were a .500 team (unfortunately not facing teams that took knees afterwards cause they considered us meaningless games too), then maybe we should at least consider the possibility, as ridiculous and homeristic as it seems, that the 09-11 jest were "elite" if the Superfan admits that by his own definition, the 08-09 Miami Dolphins were "EPIC." Cuz certainly there was more "epic" legitimacy to us than "elite" to the jest by his definition!

Vaark
01-19-2013, 07:29 AM
So the Jets hire a guy who's experience is geared more toward cap management then personnel evaluation and hire a WCO OC under a head coach who has the philosophy and personnel for a ground and pound scheme. Brilliance at its best.

I dunno, considering that the most attractive potential candidates wanted no part of a under-performing, clubhouse explosion-impervious, loose cannon of a HC they were stuck with, a cap hell or a meddlesome, headling-whoring owner, (especially seeing his GM predecessor being skapegoated for all that shizzle), of those more desperate for the job, Idzik sounds like he might work out - but surely it's a leap of faith on the Tebow-loving Woody's part.

The immediate question I asked myself, (which appears to be overlooked on the jests boards) is "if Morningwood is so promising as an OC, why didn't Andy Reed, the guy who knew him best bring in along to KC instead of hiring unproven Doug Pederson?" Inquiring Minds Need 2Know!

Ben Had
01-19-2013, 07:56 AM
Getting a morningwood in KC is'nt as easy as Philly:lol:

nyjunc
01-21-2013, 09:32 AM
The Steelers missed the playoffs at 9-7 in 09, and then made it to the Super Bow with 12 wins the next year. They went 12-4 again the year after that, and then missed the playoffs this year at 8-8. Not quite like the Jets.

Bal has won at least 11 games three out of the last 5 seasons. The Jets won 11 games just once. The Ravens won 12 games in 2010 and 2011. The Jets have won 12 games in a season just once in franchise history. NE went 10-6 in 2009 and 12-4 this year. The Ravens won their 2 division titles with 10 and 12 wins. I am not saying it isn't tough to win the division with NE in it, but it isn't easy to win a division with Pitt in it either.

they missed the playoffs though, right? that's the key word.

They made 2 of the last 4 postseasons and won 2 playoff games, the Jets made 2 of the last 4 postseasons and won 4 playoff games.

Bal has moved to another level w/ the win yesterday, I think they are now THE elite team in the AFC since 2008 but they would have been elite win or lose yesterday.


Jets finally hired Itchy. Scratchy wasn't available for comment.

The Jets also hired Marty Mornhinweg as their offensive coordinator.What do you think of that junc?

I am happy w/ both, it took a little convincing, research on Mornhinweg but he ahs cosnistently had top 10 Os so I am on board,


I don't know much about Idget, but I don't think that Mornhinweg is a bad move. As an offensive coordinator he has had top 10 offenses in passing yards, points and yards per attempt.

If I were a Jets fan, my concerns would be:

Sanchez running a West Coast offense ------- Cue the Vick to the Jets rumors
Mornhinweg O's have had a lot of turnovers
How much of Mornhinweg's success in Philly was because of Andy Reid
Did I mention Sanchez running a West Coast offense? :lol:

You guys know how I feel about Mark and I think this move makes it more difficult for him but we'll see.

I don't think we'll see Vick.

Andy reid gave up playcalling a few years ago then philly made a run to the title game but he did take it back in the last couple of years.


****. If the tables were turned and we had someone saying we were elite for that same time frame he would be arguing how the Jets allowed us to get into those games and that we aren't elite.

Forgive my spelling. This was sent from my phone.

I guess that's why I called Miami elite from '90-'95 despite fewer conf title games apps and fewer playoff wins.

I love when you guys make stuff up.


So the Jets hire a guy who's experience is geared more toward cap management then personnel evaluation and hire a WCO OC under a head coach who has the philosophy and personnel for a ground and pound scheme. Brilliance at its best.

Did you not see or read about the PC last week where rex said they were going away from ground and pound long before they hired a new OC?

MadDog 88
01-21-2013, 10:29 AM
they missed the playoffs though, right? that's the key word.



Did you not see or read about the PC last week where rex said they were going away from ground and pound long before they hired a new OC?
Obviously I missed it because I would have had a good laugh last week about it.

NY8123
01-21-2013, 10:32 AM
I hear Jerry Sandusky is looking for a job, maybe he'd make a fine GM for the Jets.

Daytona Fin
01-21-2013, 10:41 AM
I am happy w/ both, it took a little convincing, research on Mornhinweg but he ahs cosnistently had top 10 Os so I am on board,


Hey, you're happy with the hires and so are finfans, it's all good.

I am more concerned with who the jets are going to hire for their gm and coach in 2014.

nyjunc
01-21-2013, 10:59 AM
I hear Jerry Sandusky is looking for a job, maybe he'd make a fine GM for the Jets.

says the fan of the team w/ a GM that asked a player if his mother was a prostitute. How soon we forget, one "great" season at 7-9 and you guys act like you are a model franchise.

---------- Post added at 09:59 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:58 AM ----------


Hey, you're happy with the hires and so are finfans, it's all good.

I am more concerned with who the jets are going to hire for their gm and coach in 2014.

you will be in the market next season so you should worry about yourselves.

I don't know how good or bad our new GM will be, it's his first GM job. We'll see but I do know he was a valuable member of some successful franchises in the last 15+ years so that's a good start.

MadDog 88
01-21-2013, 11:03 AM
Junc your act has grown old. No one gives a **** about your opinion any more. You dont debate football you just come in here and try and talk down to everyone. Pathetic since your a GUEST here. Do us all a favor and go away.

nyjunc
01-21-2013, 11:07 AM
Junc your act has grown old. No one gives a **** about your opinion any more. You dont debate football you just come in here and try and talk down to everyone. Pathetic since your a GUEST here. Do us all a favor and go away.

I am not a guest here, I am a regular and it'c omical how you complain about me but all I do is get crap from folks like you who know very littel ablout this game but that's ok. Pipe down and don't get involved in my discussions if it bothers you.

MadDog 88
01-21-2013, 11:12 AM
I am not a guest here, I am a regular and it'c omical how you complain about me but all I do is get crap from folks like you who know very littel ablout this game but that's ok. Pipe down and don't get involved in my discussions if it bothers you.
I know very little? I know more about your team and the predicament they are in then the great super fan you think you are and no, you are a guest. Members are those who actually contribute intelligent opinions something you come up short on.

nyjunc
01-21-2013, 11:24 AM
I know very little? I know more about your team and the predicament they are in then the great super fan you think you are and no, you are a guest. Members are those who actually contribute intelligent opinions something you come up short on.

You don't know anything, you didn't even know about our OC and the direction the O is moving. You are reading about our cap and have theories.

I get it, it's time for you to hurl insults to distract from your lack of knowledge. I have seen this tactic used a million times. It will rally the Jet haters and those that don't know the game that "hate" me and you'll be a hero on here. good job!

MadDog 88
01-21-2013, 11:33 AM
You don't know anything, you didn't even know about our OC and the direction the O is moving. You are reading about our cap and have theories.

I get it, it's time for you to hurl insults to distract from your lack of knowledge. I have seen this tactic used a million times. It will rally the Jet haters and those that don't know the game that "hate" me and you'll be a hero on here. good job!
Yet you cant explain nor provide a plan the Jets should follow to get out of the cap hell they are in. Almost forgot. Rex Ryan doesnt even know the direction the Jets are going.

NY8123
01-21-2013, 11:38 AM
OMG! Stop it. lol. Did you just compare what Jeff Ireland did to what Jerry Sandusky did? That level of spin is even off the charts for you junc.

Dez's mom was a prostitute and must not be a very good one either or she would have had a sense of pride in her work. Kinda like the movie Pretty Woman, except she was but ugly and a crack whore but that doesn't matter, she still should have a sense of pride in her work.

Sandusky on the other hand has a good football back ground and is currently unemployed, with todayís technology they could beam into the facility to do his job. He would be dedicated and willing to contribute long hours to the task at hand. He likes little boys which would make him understand Rex Ryan mentality completely and Sanchez looks a lot younger than he actually is so thatís a plus for the Dusky as well.

Itís a win win all around for the Jets.

nyjunc
01-21-2013, 11:38 AM
Yet you cant explain nor provide a plan the Jets should follow to get out of the cap hell they are in. Almost forgot. Rex Ryan doesnt even know the direction the Jets are going.

I don't have all the cap info to give an educated answer on that. I can speculate like you but all I kjow is every 2-3 yars I hear about us being in cap hell and how the franchise will suck for years and it never happens.

MadDog 88
01-21-2013, 11:48 AM
I don't have all the cap info to give an educated answer on that. I can speculate like you but all I kjow is every 2-3 yars I hear about us being in cap hell and how the franchise will suck for years and it never happens.
If you actually researched it you'd have the info but then you still wouldn't be able to convey a plan.

Ben Had
01-21-2013, 11:49 AM
I don't have all the cap info to give an educated answer on that. I can speculate like you but all I kjow is every 2-3 yars I hear about us being in cap hell and how the franchise will suck for years and it never happens.

This is what seperates you from the average Jet fan...you dont have the education to understad the NFL cap of follow the jets cap! To you it's always been "oh... our GM will figure it out!".

nyjunc
01-21-2013, 12:12 PM
I don't worry about the cap, I don't have the inside info on all the contracts and the language in all the contracts. Sorry if that bothers you. I'm not the average fant hat says to fire the coach every time the team is doen, trade/cut this guy or that guy then sign every FA known to man. You have me confused w/ someone else.

MadDog 88
01-21-2013, 12:17 PM
I don't worry about the cap, I don't have the inside info on all the contracts and the language in all the contracts. Sorry if that bothers you. I'm not the average fant hat says to fire the coach every time the team is doen, trade/cut this guy or that guy then sign every FA known to man. You have me confused w/ someone else.
Trust me when I say, no one is confused about who you are.

nyjunc
01-21-2013, 02:41 PM
Trust me when I say, no one is confused about who you are.

I don't worry about folks like you, the ones who understand the game don't have issues w/ me.

MadDog 88
01-21-2013, 02:47 PM
I don't worry about folks like you, the ones who understand the game don't have issues w/ me.
If you say so :lol:

nyjunc
01-21-2013, 03:12 PM
If you say so :lol:

why is it that you cannot just try to counter my arguments? I know nothing so it must be easy to do, instead you attack me to deflect from something.

DisturbedShifty
01-21-2013, 11:15 PM
I don't worry about folks like you, the ones who understand the game don't have issues w/ me.

That's a bald faced lie. If you didn't worry about him, you wouldn't respond. Now would you?

Forgive my spelling. This was sent from my phone.

nyjunc
01-22-2013, 09:33 AM
That's a bald faced lie. If you didn't worry about him, you wouldn't respond. Now would you?

Forgive my spelling. This was sent from my phone.

You got me, I am up all night just thinkiong about you guys. I can't gte you out of my head.:lol:

13ktownguy
01-22-2013, 11:31 AM
You got me, I am up all night just thinkiong about you guys. I can't gte you out of my head.:lol:
Thats fairly apparent...23000 posts, if I live another 200 years I wouldn't have that many posts! Do ever sleep?

DisturbedShifty
01-22-2013, 12:35 PM
You got me, I am up all night just thinkiong about you guys. I can't gte you out of my head.:lol:

At least you finally admit it.

Forgive my spelling. This was sent from my phone.

The New Guy
01-22-2013, 01:25 PM
they missed the playoffs though, right? that's the key word.

They made 2 of the last 4 postseasons and won 2 playoff games, the Jets made 2 of the last 4 postseasons and won 4 playoff games.

Bal has moved to another level w/ the win yesterday, I think they are now THE elite team in the AFC since 2008 but they would have been elite win or lose yesterday.


No, I don't think it is. You have to keep in mind that Pitt won the Super Bow just the year before they missed the playoffs in 09. They had the same amount of wins (9) as the Jets did in their 09 season. They followed up that non playoff season in 09 with a 12-4 season and another trip to the Super Bowl. They went 12-4 again in 11 and lost in the WC to Den before missing the playoffs this year at 8-8. That is a lot different than having a 9-7 season with 2 playoff wins, and an 11-5 season with 2 playoff wins followed by 8-8 and 6-10 seasons.

Pitt has proven over the years that they are consistently one of the best teams. They have been to 3 Super Bowls (2 wins) in the last 7 seasons. They have been to 2 Super Bowls (1 win) in the last 5 seasons. Trying to compare them to the Jets based on playoff apps and wins in the last 4 years is just silly.

Vaark
01-22-2013, 01:57 PM
In 09, Pittsburgh got their 9 wins the old fashioned way - they earned them; not having them gift wrapped because their opponents considered playing them to be "meaningless games." A strong argument can be advance there's a huge difference there - especially when you consider that in game 14 at home, vs Atlanta, already counted out, the jest lost that game 10-7 where Buttchez typically rose to the occasion by throwing 1TD and 3 Ints. Sorry, those 2 seasonal experiences were nowhere near comparable :idk:

nyjunc
01-22-2013, 02:05 PM
No, I don't think it is. You have to keep in mind that Pitt won the Super Bow just the year before they missed the playoffs in 09. They had the same amount of wins (9) as the Jets did in their 09 season. They followed up that non playoff season in 09 with a 12-4 season and another trip to the Super Bowl. They went 12-4 again in 11 and lost in the WC to Den before missing the playoffs this year at 8-8. That is a lot different than having a 9-7 season with 2 playoff wins, and an 11-5 season with 2 playoff wins followed by 8-8 and 6-10 seasons.

Pitt has proven over the years that they are consistently one of the best teams. They have been to 3 Super Bowls (2 wins) in the last 7 seasons. They have been to 2 Super Bowls (1 win) in the last 5 seasons. Trying to compare them to the Jets based on playoff apps and wins in the last 4 years is just silly.

If you include 2008 they are ahead but in the last 4 years we both have 2 playoff apps but we have twice as many playoff wins. They also lost to an 8-8 team in the WC rd in 2010.

expanding it to 08 or 05? yeah they are ahead of us but just the last 4? nope.

Only Baltimore has more playoff wins since 2009.

The New Guy
01-22-2013, 03:01 PM
If you include 2008 they are ahead but in the last 4 years we both have 2 playoff apps but we have twice as many playoff wins. They also lost to an 8-8 team in the WC rd in 2010.

expanding it to 08 or 05? yeah they are ahead of us but just the last 4? nope.

Only Baltimore has more playoff wins since 2009.

I'm not talking about playoff wins or apps alone. You always talk about stats not telling the full story, until it is a story that you want to tell. Pitt may not have more playoff wins in the last 4 years, but Pitt has been a much better team. The Jets 2 year window with 4 playoff wins means little when they didn't win anything meaningful and followed up those 2 years with 8-8 and 6-10 seasons. Pitt proved they were the better team with their 12-4 season in 2010 when they beat the Jets in the AFCC game and actually made it to another Super Bowl. They also proved it with another 12-4 record in 2011. You can make fun of the loss to 8-8 Denver, but the Jets didn't make the playoffs that year and lost to Den in the regular season. Pitt has had a down year here and there (9-7 in 2009 and 8-8 in 2012), but the Jets have had down years 3 out of 4 seasons. (9-7 in 2009, 8-8 in 2011, and 6-10 in 2012)

You can't seriously think that the Jets were better than Pitt in the last 4 years.

nyjunc
01-22-2013, 03:18 PM
I'm not talking about playoff wins or apps alone. You always talk about stats not telling the full story, until it is a story that you want to tell. Pitt may not have more playoff wins in the last 4 years, but Pitt has been a much better team. The Jets 2 year window with 4 playoff wins means little when they didn't win anything meaningful and followed up those 2 years with 8-8 and 6-10 seasons. Pitt proved they were the better team with their 12-4 season in 2010 when they beat the Jets in the AFCC game and actually made it to another Super Bowl. They also proved it with another 12-4 record in 2011. You can make fun of the loss to 8-8 Denver, but the Jets didn't make the playoffs that year and lost to Den in the regular season. Pitt has had a down year here and there (9-7 in 2009 and 8-8 in 2012), but the Jets have had down years 3 out of 4 seasons. (9-7 in 2009, 8-8 in 2011, and 6-10 in 2012)

You can't seriously think that the Jets were better than Pitt in the last 4 years.

Our 2 year run we won 4 playoff games, their 2 year run they won 2. They don't have to deal w/ NE in their division or they would have been a WC team both years too.

The New Guy
01-22-2013, 05:19 PM
Our 2 year run we won 4 playoff games, their 2 year run they won 2. They don't have to deal w/ NE in their division or they would have been a WC team both years too.

You can use playoff wins all you want, but Pitt had a bye week in 2010 and that counts for something. The Jets were a WC team both years (9-7 and 11-5 compared to Pitt 12-4 times 2) and played in 6 playoff games with no Super Bowl app. The Jets 2 year run ended with nothing. Pitt played in 4 playoff games including the Super Bowl. This is what I find funny, you talk up the Jets AFCC game losses and try to argue that the Jets are better because of 2 more playoff wins. The Steelers actually won an AFCC game and played in a Super Bowl in the last 4 years. You always talk down NE's division titles in 2009 and 2010 saying what would they prefer a division title or the Jets playoff wins. Pitt has better regular season records and a trip to the Super Bowl. Which would you prefer? 2 more meaningless playoff wins, or playing in the Super Bowl?

Pitt is NE of the AFC North. They have to deal with Bal, which is a lot tougher than what NE has to deal with in the AFCE.

nyjunc
01-23-2013, 09:59 AM
Pitt had a bye week b/c they don't have NE in their division, if they did they would be a WC team.

Vaark
01-23-2013, 10:40 AM
Woulda's and Coulda's but only when convenient.

Fact: as proven in the game the Colts starters were actually trying to win:

If the Colts played their starters in game 15, the jest would have been home in front of the big screens watching the postseason.

No one in the ACFE comes close to the caliber of rivalry between the Ravens and Steelers. You can maybe make a case that NE is a notch above either, and maybe not if you consider the 3 teams they feast off, but of those 3, none come close to either Pittsburgh or Baltimore so the level of competition and success is elevated over the AFC East.

PhinzN703
01-23-2013, 11:49 AM
Pitt had a bye week b/c they don't have NE in their division, if they did they would be a WC team.

How can it be that the elite Jets can't finish ahead of New England in the division?

nyjunc
01-23-2013, 11:55 AM
How can it be that the elite Jets can't finish ahead of New England in the division?

NE is too good over 16 games, we are the only annaul playoff contender that has to play for the WC every year b/c of it.

PhinzN703
01-23-2013, 01:48 PM
NE is too good over 16 games, we are the only annaul playoff contender that has to play for the WC every year b/c of it.

But you're elite. Elite doesn't mean being incapable of overcoming NE. You aren't annually contending anything. You're 14-18 the last two years.

The New Guy
01-23-2013, 01:49 PM
Pitt had a bye week b/c they don't have NE in their division, if they did they would be a WC team.

Pitt had a bye week because they did something the Jets have only done once in franchise history. Win 12 games. NE only won 10 games in 2009, and 12 games in 2012. If the Jets were better than Pitt, they would have been able to win the division in either of those seasons. Pitt won 12 games in 2010 and 2011. Bal also won 12 games in 2010 and 2011.

Ravens in 4 seasons = 43-21 ----- 2 AFCC games and 1 Super Bowl app
Steelers in 4 seasons = 41-23 ----- 1 AFCC game and 1 Super Bowl app
Jets in 4 seasons = 34 -30 -----2 AFCC games and no Super Bowl app

nyjunc
01-23-2013, 01:57 PM
Pitt had a bye week because they did something the Jets have only done once in franchise history. Win 12 games. NE only won 10 games in 2009, and 12 games in 2012. If the Jets were better than Pitt, they would have been able to win the division in either of those seasons. Pitt won 12 games in 2010 and 2011. Bal also won 12 games in 2010 and 2011.

Ravens in 4 seasons = 43-21 ----- 2 AFCC games and 1 Super Bowl app
Steelers in 4 seasons = 41-23 ----- 1 AFCC game and 1 Super Bowl app
Jets in 4 seasons = 34 -30 -----2 AFCC games and no Super Bowl app

they had a bye week b/c they don't have to deal with the Pats. if Ne was in their division they wouldn't have won 12 games and wouldn't have won a div title.

all 3 are elite.

PhinzN703
01-23-2013, 06:17 PM
they had a bye week b/c they don't have to deal with the Pats. if Ne was in their division they wouldn't have won 12 games and wouldn't have won a div title.

all 3 are elite.

Yet the elite Jets can't beat the elite Ravens or the elite Pats. Weird.

The New Guy
01-23-2013, 09:53 PM
they had a bye week b/c they don't have to deal with the Pats. if Ne was in their division they wouldn't have won 12 games and wouldn't have won a div title.

all 3 are elite.

They have to deal with Bal. 1 team in the division has very little to do with earning a bye. You know division opponents only play each other 2 times a season right? The reason Pitt got a bye was because they won 12 games. They won 12 games in a season where the other division opponent (Ravens) won 12 games as well. They split with the Ravens and still won 12 games. The Ravens swept the Steelers in 2011 and Pitt still won 12 games. The Jets split with NE and only won 9 games in 2009. The Jets spit with NE and only won 11 games in 2010. The Jets are not a good enough team to win 12 games in a season. If they were, they would challenge NE for the division title and have a good shot at a bye.

nyjunc
01-24-2013, 09:24 AM
They have to deal with Bal. 1 team in the division has very little to do with earning a bye. You know division opponents only play each other 2 times a season right? The reason Pitt got a bye was because they won 12 games. They won 12 games in a season where the other division opponent (Ravens) won 12 games as well. They split with the Ravens and still won 12 games. The Ravens swept the Steelers in 2011 and Pitt still won 12 games. The Jets split with NE and only won 9 games in 2009. The Jets spit with NE and only won 11 games in 2010. The Jets are not a good enough team to win 12 games in a season. If they were, they would challenge NE for the division title and have a good shot at a bye.

Baltimore is not NE, Bal does not win 12-13-14 games every year. NE has everything to do w/ not earning a bye, you know you are fighting for 2nd place w/ NE. They can be beat one game whether in the reg or postseason but over 16 games no team is better than NE.

teemu7
01-24-2013, 09:54 AM
Dude is missing chromosomes. There is no doubt it.

The New Guy
01-24-2013, 11:52 AM
Baltimore is not NE, Bal does not win 12-13-14 games every year. NE has everything to do w/ not earning a bye, you know you are fighting for 2nd place w/ NE. They can be beat one game whether in the reg or postseason but over 16 games no team is better than NE.

That has only been the case in 2 out of the last 4 seasons. Indy was the #1 seed in 2009 and Denver was the #1 seed this past year. The Jets have not challenged NE for the division because they don't have respectable regular season records. They won 11 games once in 4 seasons. That is not good enough to compete with NE. Bal and Pitt both won 12 games in 2010 and 2011. That would have been enough to compete with NE for a division title in 2009 and 2012. If the Jets were winning 12 games each year and NE was still winning 13 / 14, then you would have a point. But the Jets have been winning 9, 11 8, and 6 games a year. Maybe if the Jets were in the AFC West prior to Peyton coming to town, that might have been good enough for a division title.

nyjunc
01-24-2013, 12:37 PM
That has only been the case in 2 out of the last 4 seasons. Indy was the #1 seed in 2009 and Denver was the #1 seed this past year. The Jets have not challenged NE for the division because they don't have respectable regular season records. They won 11 games once in 4 seasons. That is not good enough to compete with NE. Bal and Pitt both won 12 games in 2010 and 2011. That would have been enough to compete with NE for a division title in 2009 and 2012. If the Jets were winning 12 games each year and NE was still winning 13 / 14, then you would have a point. But the Jets have been winning 9, 11 8, and 6 games a year. Maybe if the Jets were in the AFC West prior to Peyton coming to town, that might have been good enough for a division title.

NE would win any division, they are a great reg season team. That is an issue other teams don't have to deal w/(Buf and Miami would if they ever competed for postseason).

CalDolFan1014
01-24-2013, 02:18 PM
NE would win any division, they are a great reg season team. That is an issue other teams don't have to deal w/(Buf and Miami would if they ever competed for postseason).

They'd probably get whooped by San Fran in the NFC West. There are some impressive defenses in that division...which, oh by the way, New England had a 1-3 record against this regular season.

PhinzN703
01-24-2013, 02:33 PM
Baltimore is not NE, Bal does not win 12-13-14 games every year. NE has everything to do w/ not earning a bye, you know you are fighting for 2nd place w/ NE. They can be beat one game whether in the reg or postseason but over 16 games no team is better than NE.

11, 9, 12, 12, and 10 is nothing to sneeze at. Again, if the Jets are elite, they should be able to win the AFC East.

nyjunc
01-24-2013, 02:42 PM
They'd probably get whooped by San Fran in the NFC West. There are some impressive defenses in that division...which, oh by the way, New England had a 1-3 record against this regular season.

it's a different midset when you are actually in the division. They lost very close games in all 3 of those games.

The New Guy
01-24-2013, 03:04 PM
NE would win any division, they are a great reg season team. That is an issue other teams don't have to deal w/(Buf and Miami would if they ever competed for postseason).

Again, NE won just 10 games in 2009 and 12 games this year. They win around 5 games every year just from the poor AFCE competition. If NE had to play 6 games against Bal, Pitt and Cincy, you think they could still win 5 out of 6? I think not. If the Jets were of the caliber that Pitt or Bal was, NE wouldn't be winning the AFCE every year.

nyjunc
01-24-2013, 03:27 PM
Again, NE won just 10 games in 2009 and 12 games this year. They win around 5 games every year just from the poor AFCE competition. If NE had to play 6 games against Bal, Pitt and Cincy, you think they could still win 5 out of 6? I think not. If the Jets were of the caliber that Pitt or Bal was, NE wouldn't be winning the AFCE every year.

they had nothing to play for in week 17 in 2009, if they did they win 11 games.

NE would win at least 4 of 6 against Pit, Bal and Cincy- at least. The jets were the caliber of Bal and itt in 2009 & 2010 and we split w/ NE.

The New Guy
01-24-2013, 03:46 PM
they had nothing to play for in week 17 in 2009, if they did they win 11 games.

NE would win at least 4 of 6 against Pit, Bal and Cincy- at least. The jets were the caliber of Bal and itt in 2009 & 2010 and we split w/ NE.

Bal had nothing to play for in week 17 this year, or else they would have won 11 games. Bal and Pitt having down years at 9-7 in 2009 doesn't mean the Jets are in their league. Bal and Pitt went 12-4 the next two years after that while the Jets won 11 and 8 games. I'm not sure why you can't understand that the reason NE wins the AFCE is because there is no one else in the division to compete with them. If the Jets could win 12 games like the Raven and Steelers, they would be competing for division titles just like the Ravens and Steelers compete with each other.

Bal should have beaten NE (in NE) in the AFCC game last year, and they beat them this year twice. That is 1-2 record against Bal in the last 3 games. NE is 1-1 against Pitt the last 4 years. That makes NE a total of 2-3 in the last 5 games against Pitt and Bal.

nyjunc
01-24-2013, 04:06 PM
Bal had nothing to play for in week 17 this year, or else they would have won 11 games. Bal and Pitt having down years at 9-7 in 2009 doesn't mean the Jets are in their league. Bal and Pitt went 12-4 the next two years after that while the Jets won 11 and 8 games. I'm not sure why you can't understand that the reason NE wins the AFCE is because there is no one else in the division to compete with them. If the Jets could win 12 games like the Raven and Steelers, they would be competing for division titles just like the Ravens and Steelers compete with each other.

Bal should have beaten NE (in NE) in the AFCC game last year, and they beat them this year twice. That is 1-2 record against Bal in the last 3 games. NE is 1-1 against Pitt the last 4 years. That makes NE a total of 2-3 in the last 5 games against Pitt and Bal.

maybe, maybe not. Cincy was playing much better later in the year and they could have beaten baltimore if both were trying.

The Jets were 11-5 in 2010 and beat Pitt in the reg season while losing to Bal by a single point, we then lost a close game in the championship game on the road. Obviously we were in their league.

Bal won a squeaker this year vs. NE in their fist EVER regular season win vs. NE. In the reg season since 2009 NE is 3-1 against Baltimore and 1-1 against Pitt. In the Big ben era in the reg season NE w/ Brady is 4-2 against Pitt.

The New Guy
01-24-2013, 04:50 PM
maybe, maybe not. Cincy was playing much better later in the year and they could have beaten baltimore if both were trying.

So Bal can beat NE in NE, but they might not have beaten Cincy (the team they beat 44-17 earlier) in week 17 if both teams were trying?




The Jets were 11-5 in 2010 and beat Pitt in the reg season while losing to Bal by a single point, we then lost a close game in the championship game on the road. Obviously we were in their league.

The Jets won 11 games once in 4 seasons. That is not in the league of Bal and Pitt.



Bal won a squeaker this year vs. NE in their fist EVER regular season win vs. NE. In the reg season since 2009 NE is 3-1 against Baltimore and 1-1 against Pitt. In the Big ben era in the reg season NE w/ Brady is 4-2 against Pitt.

NE is 2-1 against Bal in the regular season since 2009, not 3-1. NE won 2 close games themselves against Bal. They won by 6 points in 2009 before getting humiliated by Bal in the playoffs 33-14. NE won by 3 in 2010, and won the AFCC game by 3 in 2011. Bal won a close one in the regular season but beat NE up in the AFCC game. Including the playoff games NE and Bal are 3-3 since 2009. Since 2004, NE is 4-3 against Pitt.

In the Big Ben era, Pitt has 2 Super Bowl wins. NE has one in Ben's rookie year. Doesn't that make them better according to you? Or is it just more playoff wins that result in nothing that count? :lol:

nyjunc
01-25-2013, 09:34 AM
So Bal can beat NE in NE, but they might not have beaten Cincy (the team they beat 44-17 earlier) in week 17 if both teams were trying?




The Jets won 11 games once in 4 seasons. That is not in the league of Bal and Pitt.



NE is 2-1 against Bal in the regular season since 2009, not 3-1. NE won 2 close games themselves against Bal. They won by 6 points in 2009 before getting humiliated by Bal in the playoffs 33-14. NE won by 3 in 2010, and won the AFCC game by 3 in 2011. Bal won a close one in the regular season but beat NE up in the AFCC game. Including the playoff games NE and Bal are 3-3 since 2009. Since 2004, NE is 4-3 against Pitt.

In the Big Ben era, Pitt has 2 Super Bowl wins. NE has one in Ben's rookie year. Doesn't that make them better according to you? Or is it just more playoff wins that result in nothing that count? :lol:

where did I say they couldn't beat Cincy? I said it wasn't a sure thing. They started playing well the week before w/ the thrashing of the Giants so they likely continue and beat Cincy but we don't know.

They have twice as many playoff wins as Pitt, more than NE and are 2nd behind Baltimore. In that 2 year stretch they had as many as Bal & Pitt combined so yes we were in the league of Bal & Pitt, now just in the league w/ Pitt and playoff-less teams.

Sorry, I confused the playoff game so they are 2-1- that's 67%, right?

we were talking about Pitt vs. NE head to head, right? the point was about winning in the reg season. Nice try though.

Vaark
01-25-2013, 10:32 AM
The fact of the matter is that since 09, the jest are 1-3 combined vs Baltimore and Pittsburgh. Say what you want about neither team being as successful if playing in the same division as NE, an even stronger case can be made that the Jest if playing in the AFC North, competing against those 2 teams instead of MIA and Buff, would never have sniffed the WC, either legitimately or even as gift-wrapped charity! Those 2 teams with Cinci occasionally playing well is a much more formidable division than the AFCE, even if Brady never went down and spent a season on shaky, gunshy sea legs winning less games than he did the year before or the next 2 years after.

http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/04/34iphr4-1.jpg

nyjunc
01-25-2013, 10:41 AM
shhhh, this is a discussion btw 2 people who know the game. please stay out.

Vaark
01-25-2013, 11:09 AM
Really? You seem to have had no reservations about jumping in. (I know, reality bites, especially when you can make these specious "this would have happened" claims but hate when even more plausible ones are used against you). Fact: in the AFCN, the Jets would be perenially competing with Cleveland for the cellar.

Oh and the day an unwelcome, disrespected embedded enemy cockroach tells me when to or not to post on MY board is the day Michelle Ryan stops ****ing well-hung strangers while her bi curious hubby jerks off while fondling his feet. :idk:
http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/04/34iphr4-1.jpg

nyjunc
01-25-2013, 11:15 AM
This is MY board vaark, you are the board's unfunny court jester. Post a few bad photoshops but leave the football discussions for the big boys and girls.

Vaark
01-25-2013, 11:24 AM
you need to stop living in the parallel universe - you're only here and tolerated because of your clownage.. poking at the low-hanging pinata makes everyone feel better. Don't mistake being a "useful idiot" that stirs the pot with being respected... cause I know for a FACT which is which. Maybe we can have a poll on which one of us should pack up and leave, or would you punk out on that one too? LOLOLOL Incidentally, there might be an outside way to determine exactly what you hypocritically said discrediting our trips to the SB not ending in a wn, circa 06-08. It's gonna cost me some money and wouldn't be worth it unless the bet is for at least $150. Are we on?

nyjunc
01-25-2013, 11:31 AM
show me the proof, not some asinine, childish poll. You are good w/ polls, you love polls, polls make you feel special but they are as meaningless as your posts about football.

Vaark
01-25-2013, 11:38 AM
Yeah, any and every post here and on TGG that makes you look like a fool is worthless (and lord knows there's been a barrage of them in both places lately). If I can find evidence that posts by you in general from FH exist, would you be willing to bet $150 or $200 that I'm right about you discrediting our SB appearances not ending in wins - until 09 when losing twice in Conference Championships have new-found relevency??? Or can you not afford it? We can both make a paypal deposit to FH for that amount and have one of the Admins credit the account of the one who's right ($300 or $400 depending on the bet), if I can unearth that era posts, regardless of whether I can find yours or not. Deal or no deal? That's literally putting your money where your mouth is. And as far as polls are concerned, you don't like them, either here or on TGG cause they reflect the informed consensus decisively repudiating the lonely voices in your delusional head. Understandable why you're scared of them :up:

http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/05/2m4yk3k-1.jpg

nyjunc
01-25-2013, 01:12 PM
post the links. You can't do it.

Vaark
01-25-2013, 01:28 PM
show me the money and I'll do a little out of pocket investment spending to determine whether the dusty archive that no longer exists on google or in FH exists elsewhere. Nothing wrong with spending money to make money! If you can't afford it say so cause times are hard for some

.. otherwise we'll both pony up to demonstrate the courage of our convictions to determine who's version or convenient revisionist verson is correct. What could be fairer than putting your money where your mouth is?

nyjunc
01-25-2013, 01:36 PM
I don't need your money, this is about you being a liar as always. Post the proof.

Stop deflecting.

The New Guy
01-25-2013, 02:15 PM
where did I say they couldn't beat Cincy? I said it wasn't a sure thing. They started playing well the week before w/ the thrashing of the Giants so they likely continue and beat Cincy but we don't know.

I was just asking a question. I said they beat NE in NE, but you think they might not have beaten Cincy? Anything is possible, but the odds are against it.



They have twice as many playoff wins as Pitt, more than NE and are 2nd behind Baltimore. In that 2 year stretch they had as many as Bal & Pitt combined so yes we were in the league of Bal & Pitt, now just in the league w/ Pitt and playoff-less teams.

4 playoff wins in 2 seasons doesn't make a team better, or in the same league as teams that have consistently won more games in the regular season and have actually gotten to Super Bowls.




Sorry, I confused the playoff game so they are 2-1- that's 67%, right?

That is only counting the regular season. They are 1-2 in their last 3 games, and 3-3 overall.



we were talking about Pitt vs. NE head to head, right? the point was about winning in the reg season. Nice try though.

We were talking about Pitt head to head in the last 4 years. (1-1 against NE) You took it back another 5 years prior to that. You didn't answer the question though.

Vaark
01-25-2013, 02:33 PM
Clearly reading comprehension is one of your myriad of "life challenges."

I have been patient with you on this, more so than even most of your fellow TGG'ers when it comes to putting up with your OCD defenses of everything jest.

For the 5th time, it appears that old 06-09 pre server transitions and crash FH posts are no longer available either on the FH search function or through google. But I think you're aware of that.

I trust my memory, especially when every time the Fins impressive legacy came up you did whatever you could to discount, demean and belittle it saying that all those conference championships and SB appearances don't count - that SB wins did and we were up 2-1 only. (of course 2-0 in the competitive 3 or more post season game Post-Merger era).

Short of providing unavailable links, I offered to conduct a poll restricted to member who've been here at least since 07, to determine whether my memory or now your convenient one where 2 no longer so recent failures in the Conference title game is relevant to how successful a team is. You have belittled "polls" as you always do since they reflect the informed consensus that contradicts those lonely voices in your head.

Next, I did some more research and found out that for a non-refundable fee I could have someone (actually an acquaintance of an acquaintance) probe those dusty corners to determine whether those FH files can be somehow salvaged. I was willing to do that if you were willing to put up a nominal amount of $ on a bet on whose memory was more accurate if you truly possessed the courage of your convictions. First I proposed we both pay FH $200 each thru PP that they'd hold for safe keeping, Then because times are hard for some, I proposed $150. But you still either can't afford it or lack the courage of your convictions to put your money where your mouth is. If it's the former, let's do $50, which won't cover what I'd have to pay the guy, but it's the principle of it.

Either show me the money, or provide any link to any of your FH posts circa 07 to confirm they exist and are accessible, not your posts about FH on TGG at that time which I even found easily on google. Otherwise, you will continue to be branded as a blind, history revisionist homer - which is only fair cause that's exactly who you are... which includes being a liar.

nyjunc
01-25-2013, 02:41 PM
I was just asking a question. I said they beat NE in NE, but you think they might not have beaten Cincy? Anything is possible, but the odds are against it.



4 playoff wins in 2 seasons doesn't make a team better, or in the same league as teams that have consistently won more games in the regular season and have actually gotten to Super Bowls.





That is only counting the regular season. They are 1-2 in their last 3 games, and 3-3 overall.



We were talking about Pitt head to head in the last 4 years. (1-1 against NE) You took it back another 5 years prior to that. You didn't answer the question though.

NYJ & Pitt have made 2 of the loast 4 postseasons, NY is 4-2 in postseason, Pitt is 2-2.


but we are discussing NE in the reg season, they are a great reg season team and make it near impossible for any team to win the division besides them. Only 1 team has won the AFC east besides NE in a year Brady was the primary starter and we did that in 2002.

I took it back b/c they have barely played in the reg season the last 4 years, Brady has pretty much dominated Pitt.


Clearly reading comprehension is one of your myriad of "life challenges."

I have been patient with you on this, more so than even most of your fellow TGG'ers when it comes to putting up with your OCD defenses of everything jest.

For the 5th time, it appears that old 06-09 pre server transitions and crash FH posts are no longer available either on the FH search function or through google. But I think you're aware of that.

I trust my memory, especially when every time the Fins impressive legacy came up you did whatever you could to discount, demean and belittle it saying that all those conference championships and SB appearances don't count - that SB wins did and we were up 2-1 only. (of course 2-0 in the competitive 3 or more post season game Post-Merger era).

Short of providing unavailable links, I offered to conduct a poll restricted to member who've been here at least since 07, to determine whether my memory or now your convenient one where 2 no longer so recent failures in the Conference title game is relevant to how successful a team is. You have belittled "polls" as you always do since they reflect the informed consensus that contradicts those lonely voices in your head.

Next, I did some more research and found out that for a non-refundable fee I could have someone (actually an acquaintance of an acquaintance) probe those dusty corners to determine whether those FH files can be somehow salvaged. I was willing to do that if you were willing to put up a nominal amount of $ on a bet on whose memory was more accurate if you truly possessed the courage of your convictions. First I proposed we both pay FH $200 each thru PP that they'd hold for safe keeping, Then because times are hard for some, I proposed $150. But you still either can't afford it or lack the courage of your convictions to put your money where your mouth is. If it's the former, let's do $50, which won't cover what I'd have to pay the guy, but it's the principle of it.

Either show me the money, or provide any link to any of your FH posts circa 07 to confirm they exist and are accessible, not your posts about FH on TGG at that time which I even found easily on google. Otherwise, you will continue to be branded as a blind, history revisionist homer - which is only fair cause that's exactly who you are... which includes being a liar.

You shouldn't trust your memory b/c it's not very good.

Nope, I don't need verification. I know you won't find anything b/c it doesn't exist. I already told you what I wrote. if you want to put up money go ahead, qwhen I win you can donate it to the site. I don't want or need your money.

You should thank me b/c I am saving you money.

Vaark
01-25-2013, 02:51 PM
LMAO....believe me, i need your money less than you need mine.. it's the principle of who's the liar.....so either you furnish an actual link to an existing junc post on FH in 06-08 to repudiate my claim they are unavailable and put the burden on me,, or take me up for a lousy 50 bucks if I can ascertain they are salvagable from elsewhere,,, or trust a poll of the memories of those members who've been here through those shenanigans of yours. 2 Conference fails, not even so recently anymore are not even in the same zip code, let alone state as 5 conference championships and 5-0 in post merger min 3 game postseason SB appearances.

nyjunc
01-25-2013, 03:03 PM
I'm not the one who is lying, you are. You need to prove you aren't. it's not about money, it's about what is right. As usualy you can't bakc up your claims just like when you try to debate football. You are a sad, bitter, little man.

Vaark
01-25-2013, 03:27 PM
it's easy, show me any post you made on FH from 06-08 to prove that they all still exist... otherwise you're not so clever as you think by playing a card when you know the proof no longer exists, except in the memories of members who were around to read your BS at that time. Too bad I showed you the screen captures of you saying you wouldnt trade Suckchez for 2 first rounders or else you'd be denying that idiocy too.

Not to worry, I'm gonna see if I can get you some of these badges cuz I know that "Liar" won't make it thru (although maybe "history revisionist" would since everyone right up and down the line is hip to your shenanigans.

http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/03/1252e0l-1.jpg

nyjunc
01-25-2013, 03:36 PM
I don't need to prove anything, I know what happened. YOU need to prove your lies. You know you can't do it and start this deflection campaign.

Give me any badge you want, it won't change who YOU are and who I am. You can deflect all you want to try to make yourslef look and feel better but you know the truth about yourself.

Vaark
01-25-2013, 03:46 PM
whatever you say Corky.. not at all true as the collective memories of long standing members would confirm if you had the balls to submit to the results of a poll, but if it makes the lonely voices in your head keep from smoking, think (and i use that term loosely) whatever you want. How's that "I wouldnt trade Suckchez for 2 first round picks, Flacco or Ryan, etc" claim doing? Or did I "lie" about that too?? LOLOLOLOL

However, this hasn't changed the fact that U R my favorite Pinata around here xoxoxo

http://www.finheaven.com/images/imported/2013/01/987251565_22ea2338dd-1.jpg

nyjunc
01-25-2013, 04:04 PM
more of that vaark class.

I really feel bad for you and those around you though to be fair I'm pretty sure you live alone and have no one in your life.

Vaark
01-25-2013, 04:17 PM
Ironic, cause Ive long held the suspicion that you are heavily medicated living in a group home with no weekend Internet privileges and any illusion of a "wife' involves an outcall service and a charge to your prepaid debit card occasionally recharged by a munificent elderly parent.

nyjunc
01-25-2013, 04:32 PM
do you realize that most of your jokes are of the "I know you are but what am I" variety? That's one of the reasons you aren't funny even though you desperately try to be.

Vaark
01-25-2013, 04:43 PM
Sadly, a constantly demonstrated aspect of your pathology is that you're likely the only one around here with no clue that when it comes to dull, blunt utensils in theflatware drawer, a butter knife's got nothing on you?

The New Guy
01-25-2013, 06:53 PM
NYJ & Pitt have made 2 of the loast 4 postseasons, NY is 4-2 in postseason, Pitt is 2-2.

What is the point of comparing playoff wins? Isn't the point about advancing further? No one cares about playoff wins that result in nothing. In the last 4 years the Jets are tied with NO, NYG, and are only 1 game behind GB with playoff wins. Who cares? You know what all those teams have that the Jets don't?

Take it one step down and it is the same thing with Pitt. Pitt has an AFC title, the Jets don't.



but we are discussing NE in the reg season, they are a great reg season team and make it near impossible for any team to win the division besides them. Only 1 team has won the AFC east besides NE in a year Brady was the primary starter and we did that in 2002.

We are discussing how NE would fare if Pitt and Bal were in their division instead of the average Bills, Jets or Dolphins. We can't include playoff games? It has been near impossible for anyone else to win the AFCE because the rest of the AFCE has been average / bad for a decade. Since Brady took over, NE has won the division 12 out of 14 years. That is ridiculous! I agree that it would be difficult for most teams to compete for a division title if the division winner wins more than 12 games during the season.

NE won the division with a higher total of 12 wins 5 times in 14 seasons. 2011 (13 wins) 2010 (14 wins) 2007 (16 wins), 2004 (14 wins) 2003 (14 wins). I agree that it would be tough for any team to compete for a division title during those seasons. However, we still have 7 other season when NE won 12 or less games. (9) (11) (10) (12) (11) (10) (12). The Jets won it in 02 winning 9 games, and the Dolphins won it in 2008 winning 11 games. There is no excuse during those other 5 seasons when NE won it winning 12 or less games other than the other teams in the AFCE were just not good enough.

The AFC North winner won the division winning 12 or more games 6 times in the last 12 seasons. NE would still have their share of division titles, but I believe Pitt would have won it a few years and Bal would have won it a few years if they were in the AFCE instead of Buff, Mia, or the Jets. There is no excuse for the Jets (who you claim elite) to not have a single division title the last 4 years under Rex, especially when NE only won 10 games in 2009, and 12 this past year. Any elite team would have been able to compete for a title in either of those years.



I took it back b/c they have barely played in the reg season the last 4 years, Brady has pretty much dominated Pitt.


We were talking about the last 4 years because that is the time frame that you claim the Jets have been elite, yet they have 0 division titles while Bal and Pitt have 2 each. NE is 1-1 versus Pitt in the last 4 years, and if you want to go all the way back to 2004, they are still only 3-3 in the regular season. I don't consider a 3-3 record domination. Even if you want to include NE's playoff win and take away the Pitt in in 2008 (No Brady), the record is 4-2.

It is hilarious when you consider that domination, but when it is the Dolphins who have a 4-2 record against the Jets (in their elite years), it is marginalized and just a 1 game difference. :lol2: Classic Junc! :D


Pitt and Bal both won 12 games 2 out of the last 4 seasons and they would have been able to compete against NE for division title. The Jets can not because they can't win 12 games during a season. They have only done it once in franchise history. :lol:

nyjunc
01-28-2013, 09:39 AM
What is the point of comparing playoff wins? Isn't the point about advancing further? No one cares about playoff wins that result in nothing. In the last 4 years the Jets are tied with NO, NYG, and are only 1 game behind GB with playoff wins. Who cares? You know what all those teams have that the Jets don't?

Take it one step down and it is the same thing with Pitt. Pitt has an AFC title, the Jets don't.



We are discussing how NE would fare if Pitt and Bal were in their division instead of the average Bills, Jets or Dolphins. We can't include playoff games? It has been near impossible for anyone else to win the AFCE because the rest of the AFCE has been average / bad for a decade. Since Brady took over, NE has won the division 12 out of 14 years. That is ridiculous! I agree that it would be difficult for most teams to compete for a division title if the division winner wins more than 12 games during the season.

NE won the division with a higher total of 12 wins 5 times in 14 seasons. 2011 (13 wins) 2010 (14 wins) 2007 (16 wins), 2004 (14 wins) 2003 (14 wins). I agree that it would be tough for any team to compete for a division title during those seasons. However, we still have 7 other season when NE won 12 or less games. (9) (11) (10) (12) (11) (10) (12). The Jets won it in 02 winning 9 games, and the Dolphins won it in 2008 winning 11 games. There is no excuse during those other 5 seasons when NE won it winning 12 or less games other than the other teams in the AFCE were just not good enough.

The AFC North winner won the division winning 12 or more games 6 times in the last 12 seasons. NE would still have their share of division titles, but I believe Pitt would have won it a few years and Bal would have won it a few years if they were in the AFCE instead of Buff, Mia, or the Jets. There is no excuse for the Jets (who you claim elite) to not have a single division title the last 4 years under Rex, especially when NE only won 10 games in 2009, and 12 this past year. Any elite team would have been able to compete for a title in either of those years.



We were talking about the last 4 years because that is the time frame that you claim the Jets have been elite, yet they have 0 division titles while Bal and Pitt have 2 each. NE is 1-1 versus Pitt in the last 4 years, and if you want to go all the way back to 2004, they are still only 3-3 in the regular season. I don't consider a 3-3 record domination. Even if you want to include NE's playoff win and take away the Pitt in in 2008 (No Brady), the record is 4-2.

It is hilarious when you consider that domination, but when it is the Dolphins who have a 4-2 record against the Jets (in their elite years), it is marginalized and just a 1 game difference. :lol2: Classic Junc! :D


Pitt and Bal both won 12 games 2 out of the last 4 seasons and they would have been able to compete against NE for division title. The Jets can not because they can't win 12 games during a season. They have only done it once in franchise history. :lol:

what is the point? the goal is to win in january, right? who cares if you can win Sept-Dec if you can't win in january.

Pitt does have an AFC title which is a check mark in their favor but they alos didn't win a playoff game the other 3 years and missed twice.


how they would fare winning div titles meaning reg season wins. if they were in the North they'd be winning div titles, if they were in any other div they'd still be winning div titles. They are a great reg season team.


3-3 including losing a game when Matt Cassell started. one one their other 2 wins came early in 2004 then NE smoked them at Pitt in the title game. NE has clearly been better than Pitt.


Tom Brady against Pitt as a stater is 6-2 including playoffs, that's pretty much domination.

Pitt, bal and the jets were all on a similar level in 2009 & 2010. pitt and Bal would not have won a div title in either year and the Jets could have won the AFC North in either year.

The New Guy
01-28-2013, 12:53 PM
what is the point? the goal is to win in january, right? who cares if you can win Sept-Dec if you can't win in january.

Who cares if you win in January if you are not playing in February?



Pitt does have an AFC title which is a check mark in their favor but they alos didn't win a playoff game the other 3 years and missed twice.

Pitt missed at 9-7 and 8-8 in between a Super Bowl app. The Jets made it at 9-7, and missed at 6-10 and 8-8 with no Super Bowl app. Pitt has been the better team over the last 4 years.




how they would fare winning div titles meaning reg season wins. if they were in the North they'd be winning div titles, if they were in any other div they'd still be winning div titles. They are a great reg season team.

NE would still have plenty of division titles, but Bal and Pitt would have a few of their own unlike the Jets, Dolphins or Bills.

Didn't you just tell say "Who cares if you can win Sept-Dec if you can't win in january"? We are talking about how they would fair in the North playing Bal and Pitt head to head two times a year instead of the Jets, Mia, or the Bills. You want to take away 2 Bal wins over NE because they came in the playoffs? Division games are more important than regular season conference games. Playoff games are more important than both. If NE was in the AFC North, their division matchups would be more like those playoff matchups than the regular season conference games they played against each other.



3-3 including losing a game when Matt Cassell started. one one their other 2 wins came early in 2004 then NE smoked them at Pitt in the title game. NE has clearly been better than Pitt.

So now you want to include playoff games when NE beat Pitt (by 14 points) in Ben's rookie year, but you don't want to include playoff games when the Ravens beat NE (by 19 points) in 2009 and beat them in 2012 (by 15 points). :lol:

The record is exactly what I said. NE is 1-1 versus Pitt in the last 4 years, and if you want to go all the way back to 2004, they are still only 3-3 in the regular season. I don't consider a 3-3 record domination. Even if you want to include NE's playoff win and take away the Pitt win in 2008 (No Brady), the record is 4-2.





Tom Brady against Pitt as a stater is 6-2 including playoffs, that's pretty much domination.

Now we are going all the way back to 2001 when Tommy Maddox and Kordell Stewart were playing QB for Pitt? :lol: You are giving Brady credit for a win in the 2001 playoff game where he led NE to 0 points before being knocked out of the game before half time? NE's special teams scored 14 points on a kick off return for a TD and a blocked FG return for TD. Bledsoe scored the other 10, but Brady gets the credit for the win. :lol2:




Pitt, bal and the jets were all on a similar level in 2009 & 2010. pitt and Bal would not have won a div title in either year and the Jets could have won the AFC North in either year.

How are the Jets going to win the AFC North in 2009 when they couldn't win 9 games on their own? How are they going to win it in 2010 when they were 1-1 against Pitt that year, and 0-1 against Bal? How are they going to win the division when Pitt and Bal both won 12 games that year? The Jets have won 12 regular season games once in franchise history.

nyjunc
01-28-2013, 01:18 PM
Who cares if you win in January if you are not playing in February?



Pitt missed at 9-7 and 8-8 in between a Super Bowl app. The Jets made it at 9-7, and missed at 6-10 and 8-8 with no Super Bowl app. Pitt has been the better team over the last 4 years.




NE would still have plenty of division titles, but Bal and Pitt would have a few of their own unlike the Jets, Dolphins or Bills.

Didn't you just tell say "Who cares if you can win Sept-Dec if you can't win in january"? We are talking about how they would fair in the North playing Bal and Pitt head to head two times a year instead of the Jets, Mia, or the Bills. You want to take away 2 Bal wins over NE because they came in the playoffs? Division games are more important than regular season conference games. Playoff games are more important than both. If NE was in the AFC North, their division matchups would be more like those playoff matchups than the regular season conference games they played against each other.



So now you want to include playoff games when NE beat Pitt (by 14 points) in Ben's rookie year, but you don't want to include playoff games when the Ravens beat NE (by 19 points) in 2009 and beat them in 2012 (by 15 points). :lol:

The record is exactly what I said. NE is 1-1 versus Pitt in the last 4 years, and if you want to go all the way back to 2004, they are still only 3-3 in the regular season. I don't consider a 3-3 record domination. Even if you want to include NE's playoff win and take away the Pitt win in 2008 (No Brady), the record is 4-2.





Now we are going all the way back to 2001 when Tommy Maddox and Kordell Stewart were playing QB for Pitt? :lol: You are giving Brady credit for a win in the 2001 playoff game where he led NE to 0 points before being knocked out of the game before half time? NE's special teams scored 14 points on a kick off return for a TD and a blocked FG return for TD. Bledsoe scored the other 10, but Brady gets the credit for the win. :lol2:




How are the Jets going to win the AFC North in 2009 when they couldn't win 9 games on their own? How are they going to win it in 2010 when they were 1-1 against Pitt that year, and 0-1 against Bal? How are they going to win the division when Pitt and Bal both won 12 games that year? The Jets have won 12 regular season games once in franchise history.

Some people feel that way, I don't.

did they msis? It doen't matter if they missed at 13-3, they still missed.

The Jets have the ONLY AFC East title in the Brady era(in a year he played the majority of snaps) but Bal and Pitt would be playing for 2nd place in this division.

I am not taking anything away from bal beating them in the playoffs but those games don't count toward div titles. It's funny how we are bashed for finishing 2nd then whipping NE in the playoffs but yuo aren't applying the same logic here.


Obviously you didn't watch the 2004 AFC Championship Game. 41-27 score, "only" won by 14 pts but that game was over in the 1st half. They led 24-3, 31-10 and 41-20. It was a thrashing at 15-1 Pittsburgh.

I brougt up possteason b/c you scoffed when I said Brady has dominated Pitt.

we both know they beat Pitt if Brady stays in the game, he left the game w/ a lead and just completed a 1st down on a 28 yd pass to the Pitt 40 which set up their only offensive TD of the game. W/o Brady NE wouldn't even have made the playoffs that year.

The Jets were 2-0 against the 2009 AFC North champs, leading 27-0 at home in week 17 before Cincy pulled starters then beating Cincy by double digits on the road 6 days later. The same Cincy team that swept BOTH Pitt and Baltimore.

In 2010 we went 3-1 agsinst the AFC North w/ the lone loss being a 1 pt loss to Bal.

games against common opps 2009 & 2010 reg seasons:

2009:
(NE, Cin, Ind, Mia)

NYJ: 3-3(50%)
Bal/Pit: 1-6(14%)

2010:
(NE, Mia, Buf, Cle, Cin, pit, Bal, NYJ, Den, Hou)

Bal/Pit: 16-6(72%)
NYJ: 9-3(75%)

The New Guy
01-28-2013, 05:12 PM
did they msis? It doen't matter if they missed at 13-3, they still missed.

If I am trying to compare which team is better based on playoff apps, it matters a lot to me.



The Jets have the ONLY AFC East title in the Brady era(in a year he played the majority of snaps) but Bal and Pitt would be playing for 2nd place in this division.

Which happened to come in a year that the Pats were losers of 4 out of 5 at one point and finished 9-7. The Jets needed Miami to lose the final two games of that season to win the division at 9-7. The Jets didn't win it because they were a great team. They won it because NE struggled and Miami choked. Like I said before, NE would still have their share of division titles if they were in the North, but Pitt or Bal would have competed the 5 times that NE won the East winning 11 games or less, or the 7 times they won it winning 12 or less.




I am not taking anything away from bal beating them in the playoffs but those games don't count toward div titles. It's funny how we are bashed for finishing 2nd then whipping NE in the playoffs but yuo aren't applying the same logic here.

They count for a head to head comparison just like the regular season head to head games do. Bal and Pitt have won 12 or more games 50% of the time in the last 4 seasons.

I'm not using 1 playoff game and claiming Bal is better. I'm just using all of their head to head games and regular season records to compare how they would do against each other if they were in a division together. I'll count the Jets win in the playoffs. NE is still 6-3 against the Jets in the last 4 years. Compare that to the 2-3 record NE has against Bal and Pitt the last 4 years. NE has blown out the Jets several times, and the Jets largest margin of victory over NE is a 14 point win in 2009. NE has never blown out Bal in the last 4 years and Bal beat NE by 19 in 2009 and by 15 in 2012. The Jets have one close loss to NE. Bal has lost 3 close games to NE by 6 or less points.



Obviously you didn't watch the 2004 AFC Championship Game. 41-27 score, "only" won by 14 pts but that game was over in the 1st half. They led 24-3, 31-10 and 41-20. It was a thrashing at 15-1 Pittsburgh.

I thought playoff wins didn't win a division? :lol: Pitt was 15-1 that year and beat NE in the regular season. How would it have been possible for NE to win the North that year?



I brougt up possteason b/c you scoffed when I said Brady has dominated Pitt.

I actually brought up the post season games, and included it the 4-2 record Brady has against Pitt in the Big Ben era. I scoffed at you calling that domination when you have consistently marginalized that same 4-2 record the Dolphins have over the Jets in their elite years. :lol:



we both know they beat Pitt if Brady stays in the game, he left the game w/ a lead and just completed a 1st down on a 28 yd pass to the Pitt 40 which set up their only offensive TD of the game. W/o Brady NE wouldn't even have made the playoffs that year.

Scott Zolak could have won that game had he been the starter. The STs and D won that game, not Brady. It ridiculous to give him credit for that win.



The Jets were 2-0 against the 2009 AFC North champs, leading 27-0 at home in week 17 before Cincy pulled starters then beating Cincy by double digits on the road 6 days later. The same Cincy team that swept BOTH Pitt and Baltimore.

And still had trouble winning 9 games on their own.




In 2010 we went 3-1 agsinst the AFC North w/ the lone loss being a 1 pt loss to Bal.

Even if you include the win against 4-12 Cincy, the Jets are only 2-1 in the regular season against the AFC North. 2-2 if you count the AFCCG loss to Pitt. How is a 2-1 regular season record against the North going to help the Jets win the division that year when both Bal and Pitt still won more games than the Jets?




games against common opps 2009 & 2010 reg seasons:

2009:
(NE, Cin, Ind, Mia)

NYJ: 3-3(50%)
Bal/Pit: 1-6(14%)

2010:
(NE, Mia, Buf, Cle, Cin, pit, Bal, NYJ, Den, Hou)

Bal/Pit: 16-6(72%)
NYJ: 9-3(75%)

The common games for Pitt and the Jets in 2009 were:
(Titans, Bengals, Raiders, Dolphins)

3-2 for Jets. Though it is hardly fair to count the game in which Cincy had no desire to win.
2-3 for Pitt.

The common regular season games the Ravens and Jets had in 2009 were:
(NE, Oak, Indy, Cincy)

4-1 for the Jets. Again, hardly fair to count the Indy game and Cincy game.
1-4 for Bal.

Bal and Pitt won 9 games with no gimmes in 2009.

Common regular season games for Bal and the Jets in 2010 were
(Jets/Ravens, Bengals, Browns. Pitt, Hou NE, Buff, Mia)

8-3 for Jets.
8-3 for Ravens.

Common regular season games for Pitt and the Jets in 2010 were:

(Pitt/Jets Bal, Cle, Mia, Buff, Cincy, NE)

7-3 for the Jets
7-3 for Pitt

Ravens and Pitt both won 12 regular season games that year, and the Jets won 11. Pitt made the Super Bowl by beating the Jets.



Common regular season games for Pitt and the Jets in 2011 were:
(Bal, Jax, NE)

1-4 for the Jets
2-2 for Pitt

Common regular season games for Bal and the Jets in 2011 were:
(Bal/Jets, Jags)

2-0 for Bal
1-2 for the Jets

The Ravens and Pitt both won 12 games again while the Jets won 8. Bal goes to AFCC game.

Common regular season games for Bal and the Jets in 2012 were:
(Pitt, NE, Hou, SD)
3-2 for Bal
1-4 for Jets


Common regular season games for Pitt and the Jets in 2012 were:
(Pitt/Jets Tenn, SD)
1-2 for Pitt
0-3 for the Jets.

Jets miss the playoff again at 6-10 while Bal goes to the Super Bowl.

What was the point of this whole thing again? Are we trying to compare the Jets to Bal and Pitt? I can make that a lot easier for both of us.

Pitt 1 division title, and 1 Super Bowl app in the last 4 years.
Bal 2 division titles and 1 Super Bowl app in the last 4 years.
Jets 0 division titles and 0 Super apps in the last 4 years.

nyjunc
01-28-2013, 05:31 PM
If I am trying to compare which team is better based on playoff apps, it matters a lot to me.



Which happened to come in a year that the Pats were losers of 4 out of 5 at one point and finished 9-7. The Jets needed Miami to lose the final two games of that season to win the division at 9-7. The Jets didn't win it because they were a great team. They won it because NE struggled and Miami choked. Like I said before, NE would still have their share of division titles if they were in the North, but Pitt or Bal would have competed the 5 times that NE won the East winning 11 games or less, or the 7 times they won it winning 12 or less.




They count for a head to head comparison just like the regular season head to head games do. Bal and Pitt have won 12 or more games 50% of the time in the last 4 seasons.

I'm not using 1 playoff game and claiming Bal is better. I'm just using all of their head to head games and regular season records to compare how they would do against each other if they were in a division together. I'll count the Jets win in the playoffs. NE is still 6-3 against the Jets in the last 4 years. Compare that to the 2-3 record NE has against Bal and Pitt the last 4 years. NE has blown out the Jets several times, and the Jets largest margin of victory over NE is a 14 point win in 2009. NE has never blown out Bal in the last 4 years and Bal beat NE by 19 in 2009 and by 15 in 2012. The Jets have one close loss to NE. Bal has lost 3 close games to NE by 6 or less points.



I thought playoff wins didn't win a division? :lol: Pitt was 15-1 that year and beat NE in the regular season. How would it have been possible for NE to win the North that year?



I actually brought up the post season games, and included it the 4-2 record Brady has against Pitt in the Big Ben era. I scoffed at you calling that domination when you have consistently marginalized that same 4-2 record the Dolphins have over the Jets in their elite years. :lol:



Scott Zolak could have won that game had he been the starter. The STs and D won that game, not Brady. It ridiculous to give him credit for that win.



And still had trouble winning 9 games on their own.




Even if you include the win against 4-12 Cincy, the Jets are only 2-1 in the regular season against the AFC North. 2-2 if you count the AFCCG loss to Pitt. How is a 2-1 regular season record against the North going to help the Jets win the division that year when both Bal and Pitt still won more games than the Jets?




The common games for Pitt and the Jets in 2009 were:
(Titans, Bengals, Raiders, Dolphins)

3-2 for Jets. Though it is hardly fair to count the game in which Cincy had no desire to win.
2-3 for Pitt.

The common regular season games the Ravens and Jets had in 2009 were:
(NE, Oak, Indy, Cincy)

4-1 for the Jets. Again, hardly fair to count the Indy game and Cincy game.
1-4 for Bal.

Bal and Pitt won 9 games with no gimmes in 2009.

Common regular season games for Bal and the Jets in 2010 were
(Jets/Ravens, Bengals, Browns. Pitt, NE, Buff, Mia)

8-3 for Jets.
7-3 for Ravens.

Common regular season games for Pitt and the Jets in 2010 were:

(Pitt/Jets Bal, Cle, Mia, Buff, Cincy, NE)

7-3 for the Jets
5-3 for Pitt

Ravens and Pitt both won 12 regular season games that year, and the Jets won 11. Pitt made the Super Bowl by beating the Jets.



Common regular season games for Pitt and the Jets in 2011 were:
(Bal, Jax, NE)

1-4 for the Jets
2-2 for Pitt

Common regular season games for Bal and the Jets in 2011 were:
(Bal/Jets, Jags)

2-0 for Bal
1-2 for the Jets

The Ravens and Pitt both won 12 games again while the Jets won 8. Bal goes to AFCC game.

Common regular season games for Bal and the Jets in 2012 were:
(Pitt, NE, Hou, SD)
3-2 for Bal
1-4 for Jets


Common regular season games for Pitt and the Jets in 2012 were:
(Pitt/Jets Tenn, SD)
1-2 for Pitt
0-3 for the Jets.

Jets miss the playoff again at 6-10 while Bal goes to the Super Bowl.

What was the point of this whole thing again? Are we trying to compare the Jets to Bal and Pitt? I can make that a lot easier for both of us.

Pitt 1 division title, and 1 Super Bowl app in the last 4 years.
Bal 2 division titles and 1 Super Bowl app in the last 4 years.
Jets 0 division titles and 0 Super apps in the last 4 years.

I combined them.

It's very fair to count the Cincy game, they played starters for a half and we whipped them.

Bal and Pitt got SWEPT by Cincy, the jets went 2-0 against Cincy.

so we were better in common games in 2010 too?

The point is not that we were better just that we were on the same level, since the last 3 games of 2011 we have dropped off. Pitt has dopped off too but that's mostly b/c Ben got hurt.


I'm not ddebating 2011 and 2012, they were better than us both years obviously. It's about 2009 & 2010.

again, Pitt and Bal don't have to go through NE so they get home playoff games. it makes life easier.

Vaark
01-28-2013, 06:16 PM
It's very fair to count the Indy game as halfway through before the starters were pulled, they were beating the jets, and confirmed the probable outcome by outscoring them 45-27 overall and 24-zero in the last 31 minutes of the playoffs,- and that's wiith 2 of their 3 best defenders either being out (Sanders) or hobbled (Freeney). So posture all you want about the jets ever coming out on top of the Ravens and Steelers in any AFCN recent season.. a more persuasive argument can be made that they were not good enough to legitimately make the playoffs in their own division. Playoff competition not as a result of hardware or wins not resulting in hardware are nothing more than blue balls or "fools gold"

The New Guy
01-28-2013, 07:34 PM
I combined them.

You also left out games and got the records wrong. You gave Pitt and Bal a combined 1-6 record in common regular season games in 2009 when Pitt alone won 2 games agasint Ten and Mia.



so we were better in common games in 2010 too?

No, I just forgot to include the other division wins against Cle, Cincy and each other for Bal and Pitt. Their records head to head and in common regular season games are the same in 2010. Bal and NYJ were 8-3 each, and Pitt and NYJ were 7-3 each.



The point is not that we were better just that we were on the same level, since the last 3 games of 2011 we have dropped off. Pitt has dopped off too but that's mostly b/c Ben got hurt.

The closest year you could argue would be 2009, but the Jets got help winning 9 games while Pitt and Bal won 9 games each on their own. You also have to consider that Pitt was coming off a Super Bowl win the year before while the Jets were coming off a season in which they missed the playoffs. Bal was also in the AFCC game the year before. You can't just focus on 2 year window and ignore everything else.



again, Pitt and Bal don't have to go through NE so they get home playoff games. it makes life easier.

Bal and Pitt get home playoff games because they are capable of having quality regular seasons. The Jets can't even win the 5 seed. Is that because of NE as well? :lol: If the Jets could win 12 games in a season, they would have won a division title and had a home playoff game in 2009.

nyjunc
01-29-2013, 09:29 AM
It's very fair to count the Indy game as halfway through before the starters were pulled, they were beating the jets, and confirmed the probable outcome by outscoring them 45-27 overall and 24-zero in the last 31 minutes of the playoffs,- and that's wiith 2 of their 3 best defenders either being out (Sanders) or hobbled (Freeney). So posture all you want about the jets ever coming out on top of the Ravens and Steelers in any AFCN recent season.. a more persuasive argument can be made that they were not good enough to legitimately make the playoffs in their own division. Playoff competition not as a result of hardware or wins not resulting in hardware are nothing more than blue balls or "fools gold"

It was a 5 pt game midway through the 3rd qtr. we have no idea how the game ends but even removing that game we still come out on top in common games.

We didn't have any injuries? our most improtant defender going into that season was out since midseason and our best playmaker on O was out since midseason but it only counts when jets opponents get hurt. how come no mention of the Jets winning in the title game before Shonn Greene and all the DBs went down? I wonder why that is?


You also left out games and got the records wrong. You gave Pitt and Bal a combined 1-6 record in common regular season games in 2009 when Pitt alone won 2 games agasint Ten and Mia.



No, I just forgot to include the other division wins against Cle, Cincy and each other for Bal and Pitt. Their records head to head and in common regular season games are the same in 2010. Bal and NYJ were 8-3 each, and Pitt and NYJ were 7-3 each.



The closest year you could argue would be 2009, but the Jets got help winning 9 games while Pitt and Bal won 9 games each on their own. You also have to consider that Pitt was coming off a Super Bowl win the year before while the Jets were coming off a season in which they missed the playoffs. Bal was also in the AFCC game the year before. You can't just focus on 2 year window and ignore everything else.



Bal and Pitt get home playoff games because they are capable of having quality regular seasons. The Jets can't even win the 5 seed. Is that because of NE as well? :lol: If the Jets could win 12 games in a season, they would have won a division title and had a home playoff game in 2009.

Either way the jets come out on top though, right?

so just as good in 2010 kind of meaning that we were on a similar level, right? which has been the point of this discussion. Thanks for clearing it up.


bal and Pitt are 2 very good teams in most years but they wouldn't be hosting any playoff games(unless they were a 5 seed and faced a 6 seed in the title game which almost happened for the Jets in '09, had bal beaten Indy the week before the Jets would have hosted Bal in the title game) if they were in a division w/ NE.

13ktownguy
01-29-2013, 12:22 PM
do you realize that most of your jokes are of the "I know you are but what am I" variety? That's one of the reasons you aren't funny even though you desperately try to be.
No we actually find Vaark very funny and you're funny too but not in a good way!

nyjunc
01-29-2013, 12:28 PM
No we actually find Vaark very funny and you're funny too but not in a good way!

That's says more about you than me if you really think his amateur photoshops are funny.

Vaark
01-29-2013, 12:52 PM
The utter lack of self-awareness of some individuals widely considered to be azzclowns across several fan sites is both curious and mind-boggling.. Just sayin':idk::

The New Guy
01-29-2013, 12:56 PM
Either way the jets come out on top though, right?

If you include the Jets wins against Indy and Cincy, they come out on top of Pitt by 1 game in 2009.



so just as good in 2010 kind of meaning that we were on a similar level, right? which has been the point of this discussion. Thanks for clearing it up.

They played common games, but the number of times they played certain teams is different. They each played their division opponents twice while playing the East/North just once. Meaning the Jets only had to play Pitt, Bal Cincy, Cle just once while playing NE, Mia, Buff twice. Pitt and Bal played Mia, NE, Jets, Buff, just once while playing their division opponents twice. Just becasue they have the same record, doesn't mean they were on the same level. The more important stat is head to head. The Jets are 0-1 against Bal, and 1-1 against Pitt, including the loss in the AFCC game, which is more important than the 5 point win the Jets had against them in the regular season.




bal and Pitt are 2 very good teams in most years but they wouldn't be hosting any playoff games(unless they were a 5 seed and faced a 6 seed in the title game which almost happened for the Jets in '09, had bal beaten Indy the week before the Jets would have hosted Bal in the title game) if they were in a division w/ NE.

Bal and Pitt have been much better than the Jets, Mia, or Buff have been in a long time. Either team would have ben able to challenge NE for a division title in at least 5 of the 12 years NE has won it.

nyjunc
01-29-2013, 01:23 PM
The utter lack of self-awareness of some individuals widely considered to be azzclowns across several fan sites is both curious and mind-boggling.. Just sayin':idk::

AGAIN, the only times you are funny is when you are not trying to be. EVERYTHING you whine about me are character flaws YOU exhibit.


If you include the Jets wins against Indy and Cincy, they come out on top of Pitt by 1 game in 2009.



They played common games, but the number of times they played certain teams is different. They each played their division opponents twice while playing the East/North just once. Meaning the Jets only had to play Pitt, Bal Cincy, Cle just once while playing NE, Mia, Buff twice. Pitt and Bal played Mia, NE, Jets, Buff, just once while playing their division opponents twice. Just becasue they have the same record, doesn't mean they were on the same level. The more important stat is head to head. The Jets are 0-1 against Bal, and 1-1 against Pitt, including the loss in the AFCC game, which is more important than the 5 point win the Jets had against them in the regular season.




Bal and Pitt have been much better than the Jets, Mia, or Buff have been in a long time. Either team would have ben able to challenge NE for a division title in at least 5 of the 12 years NE has won it.

Pitt didn't play Indy in 2009 and if we remove Cincy then we need to remove Miami for Pitt in week 17.

against reg season teams:
(Cin, Oak, Mia, Ten)

NYJ: 3-2
Pitt: 2-3

reg and postseason:
(Cin, Oak, Mia, Ten, SD)

NYJ: 5-2
Pitt: 2-3

NE in NFC North w/ Pitt or Bal: still win 4 games b/c they'd play Cin/Cle 4 times then would split w/ Bal or Pitt so that's 5-1 like they always seem to be in our division(or 6-0).

The Jets had to go to Pitt b/c they couldn't beat out NE, if the '10 title game is at home the Jets beat pitt. Switch the Jets and Pitt in 2010 and the Jets go 12-4 and win the AFC North and host the title game IF another team beats NE in the div rd.

Don't put us w/ Mia and Buf- 2 teams combining for ONE playoff app and ZERO playoff wins since 2002. We are just behind bal, Bal pulled away w/ this postseason but heading into it we were almost in a dead heat over the last decade.

Phinatic8u
01-29-2013, 02:36 PM
How does every single thread get derailed about bull**** PO appearances.

Nobody gives a **** and frankly I'm getting tired of seeing it.

Just stop arguing over nothing all the goddamn time.

lurking
01-29-2013, 05:35 PM
how does every single thread get derailed about bull**** po appearances.

Nobody gives a **** and frankly i'm getting tired of seeing it.

Just stop arguing over nothing all the goddamn time.
this ...... Twice

The New Guy
01-29-2013, 07:50 PM
Pitt didn't play Indy in 2009 and if we remove Cincy then we need to remove Miami for Pitt in week 17.

I know, but you still had Ptt and Bal combined for 1 win and counted the Jets wins against Indy and Cincy. Miami had a desire to beat Pitt in week 17, Cincy and Indy didn't have any desire to beat the Jets.




against reg season teams:
(Cin, Oak, Mia, Ten)

NYJ: 3-2
Pitt: 2-3

reg and postseason:
(Cin, Oak, Mia, Ten, SD)

NYJ: 5-2
Pitt: 2-3


Pitt didn't make the post season and didn't get to play those teams again. Who knows what would have happened? 2009 was a down year for Pitt and Bal, but I don't just focus on 1 year. Pitt won the Super Bowl the year before, and the Ravens were in the AFCC game the year before.



NE in NFC North w/ Pitt or Bal: still win 4 games b/c they'd play Cin/Cle 4 times then would split w/ Bal or Pitt so that's 5-1 like they always seem to be in our division(or 6-0).

Not necessarily. Cle was one of only 2 teams two beat NE in 2010. The Jets being the other team. Superior teams don't always win, especially division opponents. Even if they sweep Cin/Cle and split with Bal and Pitt, Bal and Pitt are capable of doing the same. The biggest difference is that they win enough regular season games to compete with NE for a division title. The Bills, Jets and Dolphins have not been able to do that. It is not because of NE, it is because they haven't been good enough. The Jets won 11 games once in 4 seasons.



The Jets had to go to Pitt b/c they couldn't beat out NE, if the '10 title game is at home the Jets beat pitt. Switch the Jets and Pitt in 2010 and the Jets go 12-4 and win the AFC North and host the title game IF another team beats NE in the div rd.

The Jets lost to Bal in 2010, and Bal won 12 games in the North. The Jets split with NE and Mia in 2010 and only won 11 games. The Jets were not sweeping Pitt or Bal if they had to play them twice.



Don't put us w/ Mia and Buf- 2 teams combining for ONE playoff app and ZERO playoff wins since 2002. We are just behind bal, Bal pulled away w/ this postseason but heading into it we were almost in a dead heat over the last decade.

Prior to 2009, the Jets were nearly in a dead heat with Miami. I know you like to take the small window of playoff success and ignore everything else, but the Jets have not been on the level of teams like Pitt, Bal and NE. Just the last 3 seasons prove that. Pitt in the Super Bowl, NE in the Super Bowl, and now the Ravens in the Super Bowl. The Jets???



How does every single thread get derailed about bull**** PO appearances.

Nobody gives a **** and frankly I'm getting tired of seeing it.

Just stop arguing over nothing.

It's a message board. Threads go in different directions sometimes. I know it tends to happen a lot when junc gets involved and it can get annoying, but no one is forcing anyone else to join in on the debate, or keep coming back to read this thread. When I get tired of a thread, I no longer respond and move on to another.

nyjunc
01-30-2013, 09:36 AM
am I allowed to respond or is this being shut down? I don't see the issue w/ two knowledgeable posters debating, we let so many goofball posters who know nothing ruin threads and now we have a good one w/ 2 guys who know their stuff so I'm not sure what the issue is.

Let me know.

The New Guy
01-30-2013, 01:43 PM
am I allowed to respond or is this being shut down? I don't see the issue w/ two knowledgeable posters debating, we let so many goofball posters who know nothing ruin threads and now we have a good one w/ 2 guys who know their stuff so I'm not sure what the issue is.

Let me know.

I don't see why not? This is the Beast of the AFCE forum. I could understand a little more if this were in the main forum, but it is not. If we can't debate about this silly stuff here, then where can we? With that said, I'm cool with moving on to something else if you are.

nyjunc
01-30-2013, 01:54 PM
I don't see why not? This is the Beast of the AFCE forum. I could understand a little more if this were in the main forum, but it is not. If we can't debate about this silly stuff here, then where can we? With that said, I'm cool with moving on to something else if you are.

We rarely agree but I enjoy our debates, I'm fine discussing anything but if the mods don't want it then I guess we'll move on. I don't get it though.