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ABrownLamp
08-06-2004, 04:51 PM
So... 32,000 new jobs in July, huh? *whistles sarcastically* You guys go on and on about Clinton's "false economy" But yet here is a case of an administration taking credit for a booming economy...where salary doesn't keep up with inflation and only 32,000 jobs are created in one month. Wow. I guess numbers and statistics don't really matter when reality can't keep up with its pace.

Karl_12
08-06-2004, 05:06 PM
They also went back and revised May's and June's employment report. He is the only President since Herbert Hoover to have a net jobs loss under a President’s administration.

ABrownLamp
08-06-2004, 05:14 PM
They also went back and revised May's and June's employment report. He is the only President since Herbert Hoover to have a net jobs loss under a President’s administration.
It's Clinton's fault, watch.

Section126
08-06-2004, 06:11 PM
They also went back and revised May's and June's employment report. He is the only President since Herbert Hoover to have a net jobs loss under a President’s administration.


Not going to happen............

Look at the numbers again......

ABrownLamp
08-06-2004, 08:45 PM
Not going to happen............

Look at the numbers again......
STOP LOOKING AT NUMBERS...IT DOESN't COINCIDE WITH REALITY

ohall
08-06-2004, 10:15 PM
So... 32,000 new jobs in July, huh? *whistles sarcastically* You guys go on and on about Clinton's "false economy" But yet here is a case of an administration taking credit for a booming economy...where salary doesn't keep up with inflation and only 32,000 jobs are created in one month. Wow. I guess numbers and statistics don't really matter when reality can't keep up with its pace.

Just like a DEM to make light of something like this. Just like a DEM to take pride in something that hurts this country.

Some of you are so flipping clueless it's sickening!

Oliver...

PhinPhan1227
08-07-2004, 12:05 AM
STOP LOOKING AT NUMBERS...IT DOESN't COINCIDE WITH REALITY



ROFL...you should change your signature to "don't bother me with facts".

Clumpy
08-07-2004, 12:54 AM
Just like a DEM to make light of something like this. Just like a DEM to take pride in something that hurts this country.

Some of you are so flipping clueless it's sickening!

Oliver...


The problem lies in the fact that very recently, Bush claimed the economy was booming. This economic data clearly shows that companies, despite growing profit margins, are not hiring. If they do, it's lower paying jobs. People are forced into accepting jobs at 15-20% lower than what they were previously making, if they accept them at all. CEO pay rose 27% in 2003 (no inflation adjusted data available but I suspect it's still above 20%), but the average American income growth was negative when adjusted for inflation. Bush administration has made the wrong decisions in the labor markets by increasing the number of working visas, thus allowing people from other countries with much lower reservation wages to accept these jobs.

ohall
08-07-2004, 01:58 AM
The problem lies in the fact that very recently, Bush claimed the economy was booming. This economic data clearly shows that companies, despite growing profit margins, are not hiring. If they do, it's lower paying jobs. People are forced into accepting jobs at 15-20% lower than what they were previously making, if they accept them at all. CEO pay rose 27% in 2003 (no inflation adjusted data available but I suspect it's still above 20%), but the average American income growth was negative when adjusted for inflation. Bush administration has made the wrong decisions in the labor markets by increasing the number of working visas, thus allowing people from other countries with much lower reservation wages to accept these jobs.

I haven't given up on this economy. Now that gas prices are lower things will pickup.

Oliver...

Clumpy
08-07-2004, 02:08 AM
Hmmm....great, I save a frickin nickel a gallon :rolleyes:

PhinPhan1227
08-07-2004, 02:24 AM
Anybody notice the Bush has the same unemployment figures Clinton had before his reelection?

ohall
08-07-2004, 02:45 AM
Hmmm....great, I save a frickin nickel a gallon :rolleyes:

And this is why your political party is fading. Your cheerful out look of the state of this country is so up lifting!

Oliver...

ohall
08-07-2004, 02:46 AM
Anybody notice the Bush has the same unemployment figures Clinton had before his reelection?

Yup, but there's no point about having a rational convo with some of these DEM's. They want our country to do poorly so their man can win. It's a sad flipping thing, but I think it's pretty obvious to anyone that is very true.

Oliver...

caneproud117
08-07-2004, 08:49 AM
Yup, but there's no point about having a rational convo with some of these DEM's. They want our country to do poorly so their man can win. It's a sad flipping thing, but I think it's pretty obvious to anyone that is very true.

Oliver...

I'm not taking pride in our economic status right now. This is not a reflection of any candidate, it's just an outlook on how we're doing and I'm not happy. These's a big difference between people saying "yay, now my guy will win" and people calling for change.

PhinPhan1227
08-07-2004, 11:01 AM
The problem lies in the fact that very recently, Bush claimed the economy was booming. This economic data clearly shows that companies, despite growing profit margins, are not hiring. If they do, it's lower paying jobs. People are forced into accepting jobs at 15-20% lower than what they were previously making, if they accept them at all. CEO pay rose 27% in 2003 (no inflation adjusted data available but I suspect it's still above 20%), but the average American income growth was negative when adjusted for inflation. Bush administration has made the wrong decisions in the labor markets by increasing the number of working visas, thus allowing people from other countries with much lower reservation wages to accept these jobs.


Excuse me? The last per hour rates I saw were considerably higher than the inflation rates over the last three years. Were did you get your information?

ABrownLamp
08-07-2004, 12:40 PM
ROFL...you should change your signature to "don't bother me with facts".
Was there something I said that wasn;t true?

ABrownLamp
08-07-2004, 12:43 PM
Just like a DEM to make light of something like this. Just like a DEM to take pride in something that hurts this country.

Some of you are so flipping clueless it's sickening!

Oliver...
Just like a REP to think I'm being un American. Who said I was taking pride in a limp economy? How am I clueless?

The economy is NOT doing well despite all the numbers the administration throws at us. Why would I want there to not be jobs for me when I graduate? Does that make sense to you?

ABrownLamp
08-07-2004, 12:45 PM
Anybody notice the Bush has the same unemployment figures Clinton had before his reelection?
Do not compare the two. Clinton created a quarter of a million jobs per month while in office...Bush just created 32,000.

ABrownLamp
08-07-2004, 12:48 PM
And this is why your political party is fading. Your cheerful out look of the state of this country is so up lifting!

Oliver...
Fading? Do you know who is going to win the election? Because I don't.

PhinPhan1227
08-07-2004, 02:54 PM
Was there something I said that wasn;t true?


"STOP LOOKING AT NUMBERS...IT DOESN't COINCIDE WITH REALITY"

Sure...statistics are useless...it's much better to just go with whatever crappy anecdotal evidence you can find. Refresh my memory...which poster here talked about his faith in science?

PhinPhan1227
08-07-2004, 02:56 PM
Do not compare the two. Clinton created a quarter of a million jobs per month while in office...Bush just created 32,000.

Yeah...every month that Clinton was in office he created exactly 250k jobs. No better months or worse months...exactly 250k. Just out of curiosity...do you know when most of Clintons jobs were created, 1st term or 2nd term? Also, could you name me ONE job that Bill Clinton created? Exactly who did he hire? Which company did he stary?

ABrownLamp
08-07-2004, 04:47 PM
"STOP LOOKING AT NUMBERS...IT DOESN't COINCIDE WITH REALITY"

Sure...statistics are useless...it's much better to just go with whatever crappy anecdotal evidence you can find. Refresh my memory...which poster here talked about his faith in science?
OMG. Are you serious? There's a famous Benjamin Disraeli quote that goes..."there are three kinds of lies...lies, damn lies, and statistics." You show me how the statistics point in one direction, I'll show you how they point in the exact opposite. I bet if you did a correlational study on traffic accidents and drinking milk, the rates would be alarmingly high.
I believe in the science of facts...as they relate to reality.

I don't think there is anything even remotely anecdotal about the fact that there were only 32,000 jobs created last month. In addition to the fact that the Labor Department reported that the average hourly wage in July was $15.70 , up only 1.9 per cent over the previous year, but well below the 3.2-per-cent inflation rate.

ABrownLamp
08-07-2004, 04:55 PM
Yeah...every month that Clinton was in office he created exactly 250k jobs. No better months or worse months...exactly 250k. Just out of curiosity...do you know when most of Clintons jobs were created, 1st term or 2nd term? Also, could you name me ONE job that Bill Clinton created? Exactly who did he hire? Which company did he stary?

Let's not get into semanitcs. You know exactly what I meant. During the Clinton era, an AVERAGE of approximately one quarter of a million jobs were created each month. Both of his terms produced about the same average. I think the first term created a bit more though. Not that that has anything to do with anything.
Why on earth would you think I meant that Clinton himself went out and hired one quarter of a million people per month?

Section126
08-07-2004, 05:53 PM
Let's not get into semanitcs. You know exactly what I meant. During the Clinton era, an AVERAGE of approximately one quarter of a million jobs were created each month. Both of his terms produced about the same average. I think the first term created a bit more though. Not that that has anything to do with anything.
Why on earth would you think I meant that Clinton himself went out and hired one quarter of a million people per month?



Not true......There was not 24 million NEW jobs created during the Clinton Admin..........

PhinPhan1227
08-08-2004, 01:27 AM
Let's not get into semanitcs. You know exactly what I meant. During the Clinton era, an AVERAGE of approximately one quarter of a million jobs were created each month. Both of his terms produced about the same average. I think the first term created a bit more though. Not that that has anything to do with anything.
Why on earth would you think I meant that Clinton himself went out and hired one quarter of a million people per month?


"Clinton created a quarter of a million jobs per month while in office...Bush just created 32,000."

I'd like to know how Clinton created those jobs. Pray tell, exactly what did he do to create ONE job?

Clumpy
08-08-2004, 06:26 AM
:lurking:

Section126
08-08-2004, 12:32 PM
It now turns out that the 32,000 number is crap.......using the same math that the Clinton admin used to us........The number would be revised to 632,000........


Did any of you realize that the Clinton Admin used to count reservists that had been called to active duty and had to leave their jobs as EMPLOYED? They are not being counted now.........The Clinton Admin also used to add in Self-Employed numbers as NEW jobs also.......using that math....The Bush Admin created 632,000 NEW jobs in July.

Bling
08-08-2004, 02:14 PM
ROFL...you should change your signature to "don't bother me with facts".

I thought it was "don't bother me with the facts, my mind is made up"?

PhinPhan1227
08-08-2004, 02:28 PM
I thought it was "don't bother me with the facts, my mind is made up"?


Nah, that makes me too tempted to make a rude comment which isn't really in my character...just tempting because of the word play :D

ABrownLamp
08-08-2004, 02:39 PM
It now turns out that the 32,000 number is crap.......using the same math that the Clinton admin used to us........The number would be revised to 632,000........


Did any of you realize that the Clinton Admin used to count reservists that had been called to active duty and had to leave their jobs as EMPLOYED? They are not being counted now.........The Clinton Admin also used to add in Self-Employed numbers as NEW jobs also.......using that math....The Bush Admin created 632,000 NEW jobs in July.

What on earth... Dude, the Labor Department comes up with those figures not the Presidential administration. If it was up the administration we would have record setting numbers of new jobs every month. www.bls.gov (http://www.bls.gov).

Yes, 24 million NEW jobs were created under Clinton. According to the Bureau of Labor and Statistics. If you have a discrepancy with this information, take it up with them.

ABrownLamp
08-08-2004, 02:47 PM
"Clinton created a quarter of a million jobs per month while in office...Bush just created 32,000."

I'd like to know how Clinton created those jobs. Pray tell, exactly what did he do to create ONE job?
Through many different programs which helped to stir the economy. If you really want me to sit here and list some of them I will, but I know you will discredit each of them, so I am hesitant to take the time to do it. Yes, the dotcom bubble helped the cause, but there were many programs and reformations under his administration which also led his eight years in office to be one of the most prolific job creationism eras in history. There were porograms he initiated which facilitated the dotcom era to be what it was. It didn't just magically happen over night. I don't think the dotcom era could have been what it was if it wasn't for the Clinton administration.

Section126
08-08-2004, 06:40 PM
Through many different programs which helped to stir the economy. If you really want me to sit here and list some of them I will, but I know you will discredit each of them, so I am hesitant to take the time to do it. Yes, the dotcom bubble helped the cause, but there were many programs and reformations under his administration which also led his eight years in office to be one of the most prolific job creationism eras in history. There were porograms he initiated which facilitated the dotcom era to be what it was. It didn't just magically happen over night. I don't think the dotcom era could have been what it was if it wasn't for the Clinton administration.



AND THAT IS A GOOD THING??????

Maybe he should have been impeached for that instead.

PhinPhan1227
08-08-2004, 11:12 PM
Through many different programs which helped to stir the economy. If you really want me to sit here and list some of them I will, but I know you will discredit each of them, so I am hesitant to take the time to do it. Yes, the dotcom bubble helped the cause, but there were many programs and reformations under his administration which also led his eight years in office to be one of the most prolific job creationism eras in history. There were porograms he initiated which facilitated the dotcom era to be what it was. It didn't just magically happen over night. I don't think the dotcom era could have been what it was if it wasn't for the Clinton administration.

Actually, had the "dotcom era" been reigned in it wouldn't have been so disasterous when it burst. Kindly tell me Clintons actions which promoted the dot com era however.

ohall
08-08-2004, 11:14 PM
Actually, had the "dotcom era" been reigned in it wouldn't have been so disasterous when it burst. Kindly tell me Clintons actions which promoted the dot com era however.

He chose his VP who invented the Internet?

Oliver...

DolFan31
08-08-2004, 11:34 PM
He chose his VP who invented the Internet?

Oliver...

That was the biggest misquote of someone I ever saw, and Im not saying you misquoted him, but that damn "liberal" media did. What Gore said was he and others in Congress initiated and voted for some bills that basicially led to the invention of the internet.

ohall
08-09-2004, 12:16 AM
That was the biggest misquote of someone I ever saw, and Im not saying you misquoted him, but that damn "liberal" media did. What Gore said was he and others in Congress initiated and voted for some bills that basicially led to the invention of the internet.

Yup that's what I said, Gore invented the Internet! :D

Oliver...

PhinPhan1227
08-09-2004, 02:58 AM
That was the biggest misquote of someone I ever saw, and Im not saying you misquoted him, but that damn "liberal" media did. What Gore said was he and others in Congress initiated and voted for some bills that basicially led to the invention of the internet.

Which was still a crock of poop. Private enterprise created the Internet we know today, and academia/military created the original.

Section126
08-09-2004, 10:22 AM
Which was still a crock of poop. Private enterprise created the Internet we know today, and academia/military created the original.


I saw a Doc on the History channel that said that the Internet was created by the Military and the scientific arm of NASA. (I forgot the agencies name)

Clumpy
08-09-2004, 10:25 AM
I saw a Doc on the History channel that said that the Internet was created by the Military and the scientific arm of NASA. (I forgot the agencies name)


I believe it was a collaboration between the military and academia

Clumpy
08-09-2004, 10:27 AM
http://www.zakon.org/robert/internet/timeline/

P4E
08-09-2004, 05:17 PM
Al Gore was WAY ahead of the political curve in supporting the kinds of programs and initiatives that helped create the internet. He deserves credit for that. His quote about the internet was clearly hyperbole. Anyone who listened to the quote and the way he said "practically" in the key sentence knows that the meaning was not literal. He sure got his *** hammered on it, though.:)

He should have gotten hammered more for other things, so I'm okay with it. He is really showing himself to be an unstable, un-"centered" dope with his recent shrill blatherings.

DolFan31
08-09-2004, 06:07 PM
So basically it was yet another stupid attack. Why do REPs always attack stupid things about DEMs(in fairness, some DEMs do the same, but REPs, especially this Bush administration, seem to pick the dumbest thigns to attack with).

MDFINFAN
08-09-2004, 07:03 PM
I saw a Doc on the History channel that said that the Internet was created by the Military and the scientific arm of NASA. (I forgot the agencies name)

TCP/IP was created by the military..it's the best used Protocol out there, but it's not the only one. Other's actually created the internet.

P4E
08-09-2004, 08:08 PM
So basically it was yet another stupid attack. Why do REPs always attack stupid things about DEMs(in fairness, some DEMs do the same, but REPs, especially this Bush administration, seem to pick the dumbest thigns to attack with).
No, it was an excellent thing to attack. Gore is so un-"centered", so prone to a chameleon-like uncertainty of what HE HIMSELF is, that he made many odd, self-aggrandizing, self-contradictory, hypocritical and misleading statements that they all added up to give the voters a sense of discomfort with him. As much as anything else, that is why he lost. So the excess of the internet comment was a part of what defined and defeated him. It spoke to his problem with how he presented himself, and that problem was central to his character or lack thereof. He is now history, and that is perfectly appropriate.