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BAMAPHIN 22
09-28-2004, 11:42 PM
Despite opening this season with two losses, and having won only six of their last 18, the Bills anticipate to record their 10th consecutive home sellout with this Sunday's game against New England. Why can't our fin fans be as loyal???:confused:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/football/nfl/09/28/bc.fbn.bills.fansupport.ap/index.html

FinsNCanes
09-29-2004, 01:53 AM
Um.


We had quite a bit of sold out games last year and quite a bit this year.

Icer
09-29-2004, 03:13 AM
Miami fans are fickle, and mostly fairweather.

Look at the Marlins/Heat/Panthers when they dont win, nobody shows up

dolfan_101
09-29-2004, 08:00 PM
Despite opening this season with two losses, and having won only six of their last 18, the Bills anticipate to record their 10th consecutive home sellout with this Sunday's game against New England. Why can't our fin fans be as loyal???:confused:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/football/nfl/09/28/bc.fbn.bills.fansupport.ap/index.html
1. Hurricanes

2. I live in California :cry:

TripleThreat
09-29-2004, 10:53 PM
What else is there to do in Buffalo???

nyjunc
09-30-2004, 05:29 AM
Their 10th consecutive sellout? Wow! that's impressive :rolleyes: We've sold out every game since the late 70s, of the 4 teams in the division the Bills sell out the least.

AmishJihad
09-30-2004, 06:13 AM
of the 4 teams in the division the Bills sell out the least.
Thats not saying much because all the teams in our division sell very well. And being that Miami, NY and Boston are in the Top 10 largest population, Buffalo is tiny compared to them. Besides, I actually think Miami sells out the least.

FinsNCanes
09-30-2004, 03:48 PM
Much more things to do in Miami compared to the other cities IMO.


You can watch/enjoy the game somewhere else. Personally I like going to the game even being 2 hours away.

But what's wrong with going to hooters, checking out ***, going to the beach, checking out *** and watching the game?

nyjunc
09-30-2004, 03:51 PM
Much more things to do in Miami compared to the other cities IMO.

Yeah there's nothing to do in NY. :rolleyes:

Icer
09-30-2004, 04:12 PM
Or Boston rofl

KYPhinFan
10-17-2004, 01:44 AM
Because I live so far away I've never been able to go to a Phins game in Miami... been to a few at the RCA Dome. But from what I see on TV and hear from fans that do attend the games, I can conclude that the Phins do have pretty piss poor fans.
I know I'm going to be taking a lot of heat for saying that, but if you look at most any stadium in the NFL on game day (excluding say Arizona...) Miami probably has the least rowdy fans of any team. There is so much tradition within our team's history but hardly none within the fan base. It's really sad.
And just an edit to add: For evidence of our piss-poor fan base one need not look any farther than the fact that we couldn't even sell out our HOME playoff game against the Colts a few years back. It pisses me off, because I know if I lived in the area I'd show up every game, whether we sucked or not, and be as loud as I possibly could. :fire:

BuffRangePigpen
10-18-2004, 10:11 PM
Their 10th consecutive sellout? Wow! that's impressive :rolleyes: We've sold out every game since the late 70s, of the 4 teams in the division the Bills sell out the least.


Dude, that's a super lame argument. NY's population is what, 20 times larger? plus, the ralph sits over 73 thousand. Used to be 80K in the 90's. What's the meadowlands seat?

Icer
10-18-2004, 10:44 PM
77k

But yeah, Buffalo is a small city so it's not really comparable. But Miami is pathetic

AmishJihad
10-18-2004, 11:54 PM
Dude, that's a super lame argument. NY's population is what, 20 times larger? plus, the ralph sits over 73 thousand. Used to be 80K in the 90's. What's the meadowlands seat?
The Ralph has the 5th largest capacity, behind only FedEx (Was), Arrowhead (KC), Giants and Pro Player.

Please note that of those 4, that 3 are major cities and one is the only show anywhere near town. To boot, none are nearly as economically depressed as Buffalo.

nyjunc
10-19-2004, 05:15 AM
Dude, that's a super lame argument. NY's population is what, 20 times larger? plus, the ralph sits over 73 thousand. Used to be 80K in the 90's. What's the meadowlands seat?


That's a super lame argument. The surrounding Buffalo area has more than enough people to fill up that Stadium every week and there isn't much to do in Buffalo besides the Bills. In Ny we might have alot more people but we also have alot mroe professional teams(including a 2nd NFL team) and there are many more choices for your entertainment dollar. I don't recall anyone complaining during the 90s that the Buffalo area population was too small to sell out games b/c they were selling out every week.

Chauncey
10-27-2004, 03:16 PM
Don't forget that 30-40 % of the crowd in the stands at a Bills game on any given Sunday are Canadians from the greater Toronto area

TakeoSpikes51
10-27-2004, 06:14 PM
If case you did know, the Bills dont even play in the city, the play in Orchard Park New York, which is about 20mins from the downtown area. I love south of the city so the Ralph is closer than going to the city. But we do manage to sell out almost every game every year with the 75,000 seats we have.

PayTheBills
11-11-2004, 12:45 AM
Holy CRAP this thread is full of a bunch of ignorant statements.

First off, there is NO WAY 30-40% of the Bills' attendance every sunday comes from Canada. It's closer to 15%. The Fort Erie/St. Catherines market is roughly 500,000, while the Buffalo metropolitan area is 1.15 million. Furthermore, a strong percentage (in the 10% range) come from Rochester every game. It cracks me up when I hear these outrageous claims that make it sound like the Bills might as well move to Hamilton because they are so heavily supported by Southern Ontario.

Second off, Buffalo is BY FAR the smallest market in the AFC East, with one of the largest stadiums in the league, BUT Buffalo also has the cheapest tickets. Keep that in mind.

Also, this dumbass statement "what else is there to do in Buffalo?" is so ludicrous I don't know whether to laugh or cry. Buffalo is not the ghosttown you all think it is. There are plenty of things to do in Buffalo. You have to remember, Buffalo was once a MAJOR city, so it still has the amenities from its major days. Buffalo's amenities are abundant compared to comparable-sized cities such as Raleigh or Jacksonville. Visit sometime. You might be surprised.

Last point is that this thread is about how the DOLPHINS aren't filling the seats, remember? The Bills are doing just fine. Sure, not every game sells out, and some sell out at the last second, causing a tv blackout in Western New York, but the fan support is unquestionable in Buffalo. And this is during a down period, with the Bills struggling. As much as Bills fans yell and gripe about Bledsoe or any other player who isn't pulling his own weight, the truth is that the Bills are like family, and are really the city's identity. That's why Bills fans don't bandwagon. They are there through thick and thin. Libraries might close down, industries may move out, and the city might fall into lake erie, but you can still count on Bills fans showing up en masse every game. It's in our blood.

DaQuix
11-11-2004, 11:18 AM
PayTheBills - I could'nt have said it better myself. People who think Buffalo is a ghost town have never been there. Buffalo use to be in the top 5 cities in the COUNTRY.

Not to mention that we have LESS THAN HALF the population that Miami, NE, and Jets have and we STILL sell out more games on a consistent bases.

nyjunc
11-11-2004, 11:54 AM
PayTheBills - I could'nt have said it better myself. People who think Buffalo is a ghost town have never been there. Buffalo use to be in the top 5 cities in the COUNTRY.

Not to mention that we have LESS THAN HALF the population that Miami, NE, and Jets have and we STILL sell out more games on a consistent bases.

You don't sell out more than we do, we have been sold out eevry game since the late 70s.

DaQuix
11-11-2004, 06:18 PM
You don't sell out more than we do, we have been sold out eevry game since the late 70s.

That is only because you have literally 12 million more people than we do!!

Oh and maybe you should look at your attendance some years. You may sell out, but there have been times I have went and seen 2,000 - 3,000 empty seats.

PayTheBills
11-11-2004, 06:53 PM
Buffalo: a market of 1.2 million people supporting two pro teams (Bills and Sabres). That's 600,000 people per pro sports team.

New York: a market of 21 million people supporting 10 pro sports teams (Jets, Giants, Mets, Yankees, Islanders, Rangers, Devils, Nets, Knicks, and I'll even throw the Liberty in there). That's 2.1 million people per pro sports team.

Just more food for thought...

nyjunc
11-12-2004, 06:31 AM
That is only because you have literally 12 million more people than we do!!

Oh and maybe you should look at your attendance some years. You may sell out, but there have been times I have went and seen 2,000 - 3,000 empty seats.

That is just an excuse, there are more than enough people throughout the surrounding areas of Buffalo. yes we have alot more people but we also have ALOT more ways to spend the entertianment dollar and we have such a diverse population that I'd say at leat half of the people in the City and suburbs have never even heard of the NY Jets. There are so many people that don't care about sports whereas in a place like Buffalo it's more like a College town where the area almost shuts down on gameday.

As for the Bills selling out, to me when you can do it considtently when you are winning them you can do it consistently every yeara nd they always sold out during the Kelly years but growing up when yuo guys were brutal around the time Kelly got there that Stadium was about 1/4 full and in the past deacde or so you guys have had some bad crowds and have had more blackouts than sellouts(or at least would have been blackouts had local TV stations or Ralph Wilson not purchased the remaining tickets)

PayTheBills
11-12-2004, 09:35 AM
Look who's talking about excuses! You live in a metro of 21 million people. The numbers show that the ratio of population to pro sports teams clearly favors New York.

I will agree with you about the passion for sports in Buffalo. I think sports plays a much larger role in Buffalo's character than sports plays in New York's. New York is the Big Apple, with Broadway, Time Square, the Brooklyn Bridge, the Statue of Liberty, and so on. New York wears many different faces. Buffalo is a blue-collar sports town, bottom line. Is there a theater district in Buffalo? Sure. Is there Niagara Square, Lafayette Square, the Peace Bridge, etc? Sure, but the identity of Buffalo, more than anything else, is that of a gritty, blue-collar city that comes together to pull for its football team every week. And that's why li'l old Buffalo, a metro of 1.15 million, manages to pack in that 73,000-seat stadium pretty much every gameday.

nyjunc
11-12-2004, 09:39 AM
And to top it all off your stadium (which isn't even in the state of New York) is SMALL by NFL standards.

Really? We have the # 2 or 3 largest capacity in the NFl but that is small by NFL standards?

PayTheBills
11-12-2004, 01:41 PM
I stand corrected. I was thinking of Dallas' stadium. None-the-less, my point stands. I've corrected my post for you.

upstart
11-12-2004, 09:41 PM
Foxboro is a small town but,the Super Bowl Champions sell out All the time.

AmishJihad
11-12-2004, 10:13 PM
Foxboro is a small town but,the Super Bowl Champions sell out All the time.
Boston, RI and New Hampshire form a very large region.

And Foxboro has between 8-10,000 less seats than the other 3 AFC East stadiums.

PHINATIC13
11-12-2004, 11:12 PM
WE HAVE A WINNER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:tongue:
What else is there to do in Buffalo???

PayTheBills
11-13-2004, 12:19 AM
WE HAVE A WINNER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
and it's clearly not you. As I already said, there are plenty of entertainment options in Buffalo. The city used to be a top 10 city in terms of population. It still has amenities of a much more major city. A theater district, four separate nightlife districts, two pro sports teams not to mention minor league teams (the Bisons won the championship this year, woo hoo!), one of the oldest zoos in the nation, Niagara Falls, the museum of science, the botanical gardens, the waterfront, the Naval shipyard, the historic society, albright knox art gallery, incredible architectural and historic tours, and so on and so on. Heck, just look at the metro rail. Buffalo is the smallest city in the nation to have lightrail...remnance from Buffalo's 'big city' mentality, even though the population is shrinking.

Now am I saying Buffalo is New York, Boston, or even Miami? No. It simply isn't at that level. No denying that. But to say that the only reason Bills games sell out is because it's the only thing to do is simply absurd, and only people that don't know Buffalo would say such a thing.

Oh, and if you ever do venture up to Buffalo, I highly recommend you set aside some good time for good eatin'. Be sure to get:

Anderson's beef on weck
ted's hot dogs
mighty taco
Duffs' wings
La Nova's bbq wings
a chicken finger sub from Mike's
Bocce Club pizza
and some sponge candy from Antoinettes to top it all off.

Wash it down with some ridiculously sweet loganberry. :)

PHINATIC13
11-13-2004, 12:29 AM
I'll give you a call when I run out of things to do in SoCal, when I feel like freezing my a** off, maybe I'll head to Buffalo.Who am I kidding there is no way in Hell in going to Buffalo.:tongue: :lol:
and it's clearly not you. As I already said, there are plenty of entertainment options in Buffalo. The city used to be a top 10 city in terms of population. It still has amenities of a much more major city. A theater district, four separate nightlife districts, two pro sports teams not to mention minor league teams (the Bisons won the championship this year, woo hoo!), one of the oldest zoos in the nation, Niagara Falls, the museum of science, the botanical gardens, the waterfront, the Naval shipyard, the historic society, albright knox art gallery, incredible architectural and historic tours, and so on and so on. Heck, just look at the metro rail. Buffalo is the smallest city in the nation to have lightrail...remnance from Buffalo's 'big city' mentality, even though the population is shrinking.

Now am I saying Buffalo is New York, Boston, or even Miami? No. It simply isn't at that level. No denying that. But to say that the only reason Bills games sell out is because it's the only thing to do is simply absurd, and only people that don't know Buffalo would say such a thing.

Oh, and if you ever do venture up to Buffalo, I highly recommend you set aside some good time for good eatin'. Be sure to get:

Anderson's beef on weck
ted's hot dogs
mighty taco
Duffs' wings
La Nova's bbq wings
a chicken finger sub from Mike's
Bocce Club pizza
and some sponge candy from Antoinettes to top it all off.

Wash it down with some ridiculously sweet loganberry. :)

VanDolPhan
11-13-2004, 07:07 PM
Wow winner of the most pointless thread by the most pathetic people ever.

PayTheBills
11-14-2004, 01:07 AM
I do find it funny that this thread ended up being about how well the cities of New York and Buffalo support their teams (to the point of bickering between forumers from these respective cities), while the whole reason the topic was started was because the Dolphins aren't getting that kind of support from Miami. You're right, it was a pointless thread. It is beyond obvious that Miami is simply not up to par with its AFC East rivals in terms of fan support. End of debate.

Now if you want to say that it's because there are soooo many other entertainment options in Miami, then so be it. Let the Dolphins move to, I don't know, BIRMINGHAM, or somewhere with less entertainment options. You all apparently don't want them.

goodfella11
12-01-2004, 01:16 PM
What is there to do in Miami? I visited my buddy who lives there and stayed over 1 month. Entertainment, I don’t think so. You have to go to Orlando to get entertainment. There’s just as much to do in buffalo then there is in Miami. You Floridians spend way to much time in the sun.

TigerJ
12-02-2004, 12:26 AM
Their 10th consecutive sellout? Wow! that's impressive :rolleyes: We've sold out every game since the late 70s, of the 4 teams in the division the Bills sell out the least.

Duh! What's your population base? 8 million in NYC, another 3-4 million in the Jersey metro? In all of Western NY including the cities of Buffalo and Rochester, the Bills market consists of maybe a million people. Moreover the average income in the NY metro area is a lot higher than in Buffalo and the price of a Jets ticket even though it's probably a good bit higher than a ticket to see the Bills still represents a lot smaller percentage of a fan's paycheck.

Considering the size of their market and the size of Ralph Wilson Stadium, we do pretty well.

nyjunc
12-02-2004, 07:11 AM
Duh! What's your population base? 8 million in NYC, another 3-4 million in the Jersey metro? In all of Western NY including the cities of Buffalo and Rochester, the Bills market consists of maybe a million people. Moreover the average income in the NY metro area is a lot higher than in Buffalo and the price of a Jets ticket even though it's probably a good bit higher than a ticket to see the Bills still represents a lot smaller percentage of a fan's paycheck.

Considering the size of their market and the size of Ralph Wilson Stadium, we do pretty well.

I've gone over this so you can check my posts from earlier in the threead but ther are more than enough people to draw from in Buf and the surrounding areas. I would buy your excuses but why is the building always sold out when you are good? If you had trouble selling out during your great run then I'd buyt it but you were always sold out and if the Bills fans are such great fans and have enoughh people that can afford tickets in good times why can't they afford them in bad times?

TigerJ
12-02-2004, 10:10 AM
We're talking comparison of the two areas, nyjunc. Sure, Western NY has enough fans to sell out the stadium, and most of the time they do. For every available seat in the Meadowlands, however, I'm guessing there are at least six times as many fans in the NYC area as there are for every fan in the Buffalo area. I'm also guessing that the Jets, like the Giants have a waiting list for season tickets. There may be a few other large market teams where that is also true, but most NFL teams are like Buffalo which currently has in the neighbohood of 45,000 season ticket holders. A Jets fan has to know that if he drops his season ticket when the team is in a down cycle, someone else is going to get it, and he may never get it back again. When the Bills are in a down cycle, seaon ticket holders know that while they may not get the same seat, they can always get a new season ticket when team fortunes are reversed. Don't tell me that if the Jets are stinking up the Meadowlands with poor play, there aren't fans who would like to punish the team by not buying tickets. The fear of not getting back in keeps them from doing so.

BTW, I am not a season ticket holder and almost never go to games. I happen to be a church pastor. When I'm done conducting a service on Sunday morning, I cannot get to a 1 PM game in time. I would if I could.

nyjunc
12-02-2004, 10:22 AM
You are right about the waiting list, we have a large one BUT this isn't about us. Like i said earlier I wouldn't have a problem if the Bills had trouble selling out when they were winning but they did not so why can the building be filled when the times are good but not bad especially when really the Bills are THE thing to do in Buffalo.

TigerJ
12-02-2004, 01:47 PM
I guess I begin with a fundamental assumption, nyjunc. It is that there is no fundamental difference between the fans of one team and the fans of another, the possible exception being the Green Bay Packers, many of the fans of which are also stock holders. Therefore, when there is a difference in the behavior from one city to another, the difference is precipitated by circumstances and not some fundamental aspect of fan character. I maintain that if you took a million fans out of the NY metro area and traded them to the area around Buffalo for a million typical Bills fans that they would soon behave the same way as Bills fans, and vice versa. Of course, that experiment can never be done so we'll never know.

AmishJihad
12-02-2004, 10:35 PM
You are right about the waiting list, we have a large one BUT this isn't about us. Like i said earlier I wouldn't have a problem if the Bills had trouble selling out when they were winning but they did not so why can the building be filled when the times are good but not bad especially when really the Bills are THE thing to do in Buffalo.
Actually, we did have trouble selling out occasionally in the 90's.

nyjunc
12-03-2004, 06:11 AM
Actually, we did have trouble selling out occasionally in the 90's.

If that's the case than things are different but are you talking about early 90s or late 90s? I know you didn't sell out all the time in the late 90s but I always remember that Stadium packed w/ your great early 90s teams.

cmsubillsfan
12-03-2004, 06:02 PM
Despite opening this season with two losses, and having won only six of their last 18, the Bills anticipate to record their 10th consecutive home sellout with this Sunday's game against New England. Why can't our fin fans be as loyal???:confused:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/football/nfl/09/28/bc.fbn.bills.fansupport.ap/index.html


ooh ooh I've got this one. Miami is full of a bunch of band wagon fans. Buffalo has real fans. Some of us have been fans for almost forty five years. I've personally cheered for the bills since 1988. This isn't to say that all fish fans are bandwagon fans, but it seems that many who live in Miami are.

goodfella11
12-03-2004, 06:24 PM
The Ralph has the 5th largest capacity, behind only FedEx (Was), Arrowhead (KC), Giants and Pro Player.

Please note that of those 4, that 3 are major cities and one is the only show anywhere near town. To boot, none are nearly as economically depressed as Buffalo.
Amish I love your avatar, how can I get that?

nyjunc
12-04-2004, 06:53 AM
Originally Posted by AmishJihad
The Ralph has the 5th largest capacity, behind only FedEx (Was), Arrowhead (KC), Giants and Pro Player.

Please note that of those 4, that 3 are major cities and one is the only show anywhere near town. To boot, none are nearly as economically depressed as Buffalo.

That wasn't alwyas the case. The Meadowlands has increased cpacity in the past decade while when RWS underwent renovations they scaled back the seats but up until about '97 RWS(or Rich Stadium as it was known then) held a few thousand more than The Meadowlands and they always sold out.

harmonkoz
12-04-2004, 09:09 AM
Amish I love your avatar, how can I get that?

Right click on it and select 'Save picture as'...

Or if using Firefox 'Save link to disk'

goodfella11
12-04-2004, 01:09 PM
Thanks harmon.

musphinzfan
12-04-2004, 02:20 PM
Is this for REAL???....The Bills fans are just as bad as the Phins fans...I remember going to the Bills Oilers playoffs game and I sat there and Watched over half the stadium empty out by half time....I dont care what the score was you dont walk out of a Playoffs game.

shoey920
12-04-2004, 06:04 PM
35-3 = leave

nobody knew what was gonna happen that day