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mor911
05-18-2005, 04:01 PM
I'm posting this to let some comments off my chest. :D

First, I think we try and put next-gen consoles against each other too often. Granted, Miscrosoft (MS) and Sony are not friends. They are, infact, enemies in this next-gen war. Nintendo is also in there somewhere.

I guess my point is this. People are too quick to pick sides. It's totally ok to be rooting for MS, Sony, or Nintendo in this whole race. But it makes no sense to downtalk the other side. LEt me explain my reasoning.

Say the 360 is released this November, only to receive lackluster sales. 6 months later PS3 comes out and shatters records. Because everyone spent $300-$400 on their new Sony, nobody buys a Revolution either. MS and the big N both drop out of the console wars after just one year of next-gen service. What happens now? Sony is the only game in town, and there's no need to push the envelope because people have no choice but to use them. If there was no Saturn and N64, would PS1 have been that good? If there were no DreamCast, Xbox, and Gamecube, would the PS2 would have ever released innovative new games like God of War? This is just a scenario that probly won't happen, but I'm giving you an example of why we would actually root for the competion to step it up.

Me? I'm probly gonna get a 360 this year, and a PS3 next year (considering its not too expensive). Nintendo's really gotta show me something to get back into my heart. Nobody wants to say it, but they ar following Sega's steps perfectly.

Well... That's all. :D

Motion
05-18-2005, 04:23 PM
You make some very good points. However, I doubt things would fall off if any company became the console monopoly. Take EA for example, they signed an exclusive deal with the NFL for the next 5 years, meaning they are the only company that can make a football game using the NFL teams and players. When that happened everyone said this is terrible for gamers because EA would have no reason to push the envelope and add anything to Madden. Turns out that the 2006 version of Madden will by far be the best one ever. I've played every Madden game ever, and I've never seen them add so many features from one year to the next as they have this year.

All that said, I see what your saying. Competition is always good to push everyone involved.

mor911
05-18-2005, 04:30 PM
You make some very good points. However, I doubt things would fall off if any company became the console monopoly. Take EA for example, they signed an exclusive deal with the NFL for the next 5 years, meaning they are the only company that can make a football game using the NFL teams and players. When that happened everyone said this is terrible for gamers because EA would have no reason to push the envelope and add anything to Madden. Turns out that the 2006 version of Madden will by far be the best one ever. I've played every Madden game ever, and I've never seen them add so many features from one year to the next as they have this year.

All that said, I see what your saying. Competition is always good to push everyone involved.
Well... Before we go saying that Madden 06 is good, let's wait and see. 05 was a glorious feet for cheaters and scammers everywhere. Pretty next-gen graphics doesn't mean a good game. I'm 100% against the EA monopoly thing. :D

Edit - I also wanted to note, because I'm a football nut, I will be forced into buying Madden this year... So I do hope it is good. But how much better will it have to be in the coming years with nothing to compare it to.

DoLpHiNz34
05-18-2005, 05:05 PM
Well... Before we go saying that Madden 06 is good, let's wait and see. 05 was a glorious feet for cheaters and scammers everywhere. Pretty next-gen graphics doesn't mean a good game. I'm 100% against the EA monopoly thing. :D

Edit - I also wanted to note, because I'm a football nut, I will be forced into buying Madden this year... So I do hope it is good. But how much better will it have to be in the coming years with nothing to compare it to.

EA's Madden has progressed every single year. That's why it will continue to get better regardless of whether or not there is competition...they have a name and reputation to uphold.

The cheating is a serious problem. I don't know what they can do to rectify the problem but ESPN or anyone else having a football game isn't going to help. The same thing happens with Socom....it really sucks.:fire:

Motion
05-18-2005, 05:15 PM
Well... Before we go saying that Madden 06 is good, let's wait and see. 05 was a glorious feet for cheaters and scammers everywhere. Pretty next-gen graphics doesn't mean a good game. I'm 100% against the EA monopoly thing. :D

Edit - I also wanted to note, because I'm a football nut, I will be forced into buying Madden this year... So I do hope it is good. But how much better will it have to be in the coming years with nothing to compare it to.

Your missing my point. My whole point was even though they have no competition in the NFL gaming market, they're still going above and beyond to try and improve the game. The "Superstar" mode alone is a genius idea.

mor911
05-18-2005, 05:21 PM
Your missing my point. My whole point was even though they have no competition in the NFL gaming market, they're still going above and beyond to try and improve the game. The "Superstar" mode alone is a genius idea.
This year they have no chice but to try an prove that they will continue to make it better.If they didn't, the public will revolt. I'm talking about the years to come. Who can tell if Madden 06 and 07 will not be the same game with some cheesy mode thrown in.

TarHeelFinFan
05-18-2005, 10:21 PM
You make some very good points. However, I doubt things would fall off if any company became the console monopoly. Take EA for example, they signed an exclusive deal with the NFL for the next 5 years, meaning they are the only company that can make a football game using the NFL teams and players. When that happened everyone said this is terrible for gamers because EA would have no reason to push the envelope and add anything to Madden. Turns out that the 2006 version of Madden will by far be the best one ever. I've played every Madden game ever, and I've never seen them add so many features from one year to the next as they have this year.

All that said, I see what your saying. Competition is always good to push everyone involved. EA blows. The "improvements" they make every year are usually pretty lame and have nothing to do with actual gameplay. They brag every year about the great features and every year they rehash effectively the same game as the year before, including new stupid bells like the "hit stick" and "crowd meter". ESPN completely kicked EA's butt in gameplay and now that stupid exclusive license killed it.

Motion
05-18-2005, 10:35 PM
EA blows. The "improvements" they make every year are usually pretty lame and have nothing to do with actual gameplay. They brag every year about the great features and every year they rehash effectively the same game as the year before, including new stupid bells like the "hit stick" and "crowd meter". ESPN completely kicked EA's butt in gameplay and now that stupid exclusive license killed it.

I somewhat agree, I've never been big on Madden's actual gameplay. Always like the NCAA gameplay better.

Phinsfan1980
05-18-2005, 11:06 PM
Nintendo has been letting alot of their die hard fans down.... I was really disappointed with the DS. The GBA was good but the Gamecube wasn't that great and they feel no need to put their games online. Sad really they don't look at what the people want they just say hey we are nintendo and you will buy this sh*t. Since the SNES nintendo has gone down hill.

Slappy8800
05-19-2005, 12:01 AM
gotta see what the prices will be..right now it looks as if

360 will be 299
ps3 will be about 450-500
nintendo???

in time i will have all 3

Motion
05-19-2005, 08:01 AM
gotta see what the prices will be..right now it looks as if

360 will be 299
ps3 will be about 450-500
nintendo???

in time i will have all 3

Based on what? Where are getting these numbers from?

Deus Ex Dolphin
05-19-2005, 12:49 PM
Your missing my point. My whole point was even though they have no competition in the NFL gaming market, they're still going above and beyond to try and improve the game. The "Superstar" mode alone is a genius idea.


The irony of this comment is that it goes completely against the point of this thread by mor911. :D His point is that it is GOOD to have more than one console, that we benefit by having MS, Sony and Nintendo each doing different things with videogames, and pushing each other to build bigger and better systems/games.

Makes sense, right?

Yet, in the same thread, we have the thought that EA/Madden will get better and better WITHOUT any competition??? :confused: That EA will go above and beyond despite knowing they are the only NFL game in town?

I don't believe it. We lose as gamers when deals like this between EA and the NFL go down. We get no choice, and get only the features that EA decides belong in a football game. I'm not happy with that at all. :yell:

UltraDol-Fan
05-19-2005, 04:30 PM
I agree, ESPN 2k5 rocks, and to me is way better than Madden ever was. It sucks that EA is taking over.

Motion
05-19-2005, 05:25 PM
The irony of this comment is that it goes completely against the point of this thread by mor911. :D His point is that it is GOOD to have more than one console, that we benefit by having MS, Sony and Nintendo each doing different things with videogames, and pushing each other to build bigger and better systems/games.

Makes sense, right?

Yet, in the same thread, we have the thought that EA/Madden will get better and better WITHOUT any competition??? :confused: That EA will go above and beyond despite knowing they are the only NFL game in town?

I don't believe it. We lose as gamers when deals like this between EA and the NFL go down. We get no choice, and get only the features that EA decides belong in a football game. I'm not happy with that at all. :yell:

:shakeno: No irony, I wasn't going "completely against" his statement merely stating an example of a similar situation that has already happened. He was talking about a hypothetical monopoly on gaming systems and I was talking about one thats already happened with games. I agree with you with the part about that not being good for gamers. My point was at least EA is trying to improve Madden and not just coming out with another version of 2005 with updated rosters.:rolleyes:

Motion
05-19-2005, 05:28 PM
The irony of this comment is that it goes completely against the point of this thread by mor911. :D His point is that it is GOOD to have more than one console, that we benefit by having MS, Sony and Nintendo each doing different things with videogames, and pushing each other to build bigger and better systems/games.

Makes sense, right?

Yet, in the same thread, we have the thought that EA/Madden will get better and better WITHOUT any competition??? :confused: That EA will go above and beyond despite knowing they are the only NFL game in town?

I don't believe it. We lose as gamers when deals like this between EA and the NFL go down. We get no choice, and get only the features that EA decides belong in a football game. I'm not happy with that at all. :yell:

You tell me where in this post I said its good for gamers? All I said was at least their still trying to improve the game.


You make some very good points. However, I doubt things would fall off if any company became the console monopoly. Take EA for example, they signed an exclusive deal with the NFL for the next 5 years, meaning they are the only company that can make a football game using the NFL teams and players. When that happened everyone said this is terrible for gamers because EA would have no reason to push the envelope and add anything to Madden. Turns out that the 2006 version of Madden will by far be the best one ever. I've played every Madden game ever, and I've never seen them add so many features from one year to the next as they have this year.

All that said, I see what your saying. Competition is always good to push everyone involved.

Deus Ex Dolphin
05-20-2005, 10:53 AM
Isn't it ironic, don't you think? It's like rain, on your wedding day. It's the good advice, you just didn't take. :D

Okay, we both agree competition is good. Believe me when I say that few people are more eager to see EA/Madden step it up with the 2006 versions and beyond. I want to continue to enjoy NFL videogame football.

DoLpHiNz34
05-20-2005, 11:55 AM
I don't know how you guys like any of the ESPN games. All of their games have sucked to this point imo. They've had semi cool features in all their games but nothing to make them the front runners in any of the sports genres. I bought last years ESPN NFL because it was 20 bucks and played it for all of 45 minutes. Aside from having the nice pre game stuff and cool replays, the game stunk...very very arcady feel to it. After 2k1 on the Dreamcast, they've been decent at best and declining every year. While I understand the point the original poster was trying to make, I disagree with the notion that EA will just stop implementing new ideas and making Madden better every year. Just because some of the stuff they've done wasn't to your liking, like the hit stick, doesn't mean they're not adding to their games. All of you that have chimed in have sounded like ESPN fans and have put down the Madden. I guess you guys wouldn't be so upset about the issue if it had been ESPN that signed that 5yr deal with the NFL. If that had been the case, I'd be the one ranting about how much it sucks and claiming that Sega/ESPN would be doing nothing to improve their game.;)

*EDIT* Before I get blasted about missing the point...I do agree that competition is good and forces improvement...I would rather there be some competition for EA out there BUT I don't think I'll be displeased with what EA will bring to the table the next 5 years.

byroan
05-20-2005, 03:01 PM
I don't know how you guys like any of the ESPN games. All of their games have sucked to this point imo. They've had semi cool features in all their games but nothing to make them the front runners in any of the sports genres. I bought last years ESPN NFL because it was 20 bucks and played it for all of 45 minutes. Aside from having the nice pre game stuff and cool replays, the game stunk...very very arcady feel to it.

How was it arcady? It's more realistic than Madden. On madden you can take any QB and throw it 60 yards downfield every play. NFL 2k5 is the most realistic game on the market.

DoLpHiNz34
05-20-2005, 04:26 PM
How was it arcady? It's more realistic than Madden. On madden you can take any QB and throw it 60 yards downfield every play. NFL 2k5 is the most realistic game on the market.

The way they move and jerk back and forth. The dives are ridiculous and to me it just has a NFL street feeling to it.

The QB thing in the Madden has been somewhat addressed. The days of dropping back 20 yards and throwing it off your back foot across the field are gone. I don't know what difficulty you play on but in the 2005 version you can't complete 60 yard passes with any consistency. I don't know where you got that from. Maybe you're playing on rookie or something.:rolleyes:

Deus Ex Dolphin
05-20-2005, 06:34 PM
The way they move and jerk back and forth. The dives are ridiculous and to me it just has a NFL street feeling to it.

The QB thing in the Madden has been somewhat addressed. The days of dropping back 20 yards and throwing it off your back foot across the field are gone. I don't know what difficulty you play on but in the 2005 version you can't complete 60 yard passes with any consistency. I don't know where you got that from. Maybe you're playing on rookie or something.:rolleyes:


You'd have to play for a few hours to really get a feel for the 2K football games if you are used to Madden. Both games had flaws, but the "arcade" label on ESPN 2K5 is wrong. The game is much more sim than given credit for by Madden fans.

Really, combine the best of Madden and ESPN and you'd have a near perfect football game.

There is some truth to the fact I'd be less upset if VC/Take 2 had gotten the NFL exclusive instead of EA/Madden. I'd still be concerned about lack of competition, but it is easier to take when you still have your favorite game around.

I hope Madden steals all the best ideas from the ESPN game and creates a game worthy of the next-gen consoles. I don't have a lot of options, now do I? :(

Slappy8800
05-20-2005, 06:45 PM
ESPN NFL was more of a SIM than Madden....had better graphics

DoLpHiNz34
05-23-2005, 04:46 PM
You'd have to play for a few hours to really get a feel for the 2K football games if you are used to Madden. Both games had flaws, but the "arcade" label on ESPN 2K5 is wrong. The game is much more sim than given credit for by Madden fans.

Really, combine the best of Madden and ESPN and you'd have a near perfect football game.

There is some truth to the fact I'd be less upset if VC/Take 2 had gotten the NFL exclusive instead of EA/Madden. I'd still be concerned about lack of competition, but it is easier to take when you still have your favorite game around.

I hope Madden steals all the best ideas from the ESPN game and creates a game worthy of the next-gen consoles. I don't have a lot of options, now do I? :(

No you don't. :tongue: You should be glad the superior game got the rights..:lol:

I agree with you. I hope they did take all the cool features and mesh them well. The quick clips they had of Madden during the draft showed a completely different Madden. It wasn't the same play selecting process, the menus looked totally different, and the previews I've read so far have completely new features. So far, it looks like they have made significant changes...hopefully for the better.

Despacio
05-24-2005, 08:11 AM
Comparing ESPN 2K5 to NFL Street is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard, even more ridiculous than playing a football game for 45 minutes and coming to the conclusion that it sucks.

As for system wars, I learned in the last console release period that all the ranting and raving gets you nowhere, every system has something great to offer, and the ideal situation would to be owning all three consoles. Of course thats an expensive proposition, but a true gamer is in it for the fun and creation of fun games, not to pledge blind loyalty to one console.

As for the concerns of everyone exiting the hardware race except for say Sony. Well theres no need to worry as all three companies made it very clear that they will be in the race for years to come at E3. Microsoft has the deepest pockets, Nintendo has too much pride, and Sony, well there the Patriots of gaming at the moment, so theres not too many worries.

DoLpHiNz34
05-24-2005, 09:54 AM
Comparing ESPN 2K5 to NFL Street is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard, even more ridiculous than playing a football game for 45 minutes and coming to the conclusion that it sucks.

Another 2k5 fan...:cry:

Despacio
05-24-2005, 12:16 PM
Another 2k5 fan...:cry:

Yes, and theres plenty of us out there because the 2K series was a great series, why else do you think EA had to reach deep into their pockets. But enough of that the 2K vs Madden forum wars, they've been played to death. I dont disregard Madden as some "arcadey" irrelevant title, its popular for a reason.

I just really hope EA offers something a little more than that brief clip they showed of Next Gen Madden. In my opinion the character models look, well, short and the animations still seem off. And those jerseys could use some better texture work. As for gameplay, who knows untill its playable.

I really want to play a great football game this year so I can put Feeley, Williams, Brown, Boston, Booker, Chambers, and McMichael all on the same field and kick my friends a%#. So I hope EA pulls through.

Motion
05-24-2005, 12:18 PM
Comparing ESPN 2K5 to NFL Street is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard, even more ridiculous than playing a football game for 45 minutes and coming to the conclusion that it sucks.

As for system wars, I learned in the last console release period that all the ranting and raving gets you nowhere, every system has something great to offer, and the ideal situation would to be owning all three consoles. Of course thats an expensive proposition, but a true gamer is in it for the fun and creation of fun games, not to pledge blind loyalty to one console.

As for the concerns of everyone exiting the hardware race except for say Sony. Well theres no need to worry as all three companies made it very clear that they will be in the race for years to come at E3. Microsoft has the deepest pockets, Nintendo has too much pride, and Sony, well there the Patriots of gaming at the moment, so theres not too many worries.

:yeahthat: