Dave Better Sign An OLB!!! - Page 2

dolphan39 · 02-28-2003, 01:06 PM

Wanne has come out and said we are OK at OLB if we keep Rodgers - which we did. Greenwood is barely starter based on PT and Rodgers is just not that important in this scheme. Until we sign a LT, upgrade STs (P and PR) and add a WR or 2 (if we cut Mck), OLB can wait for the draft.

gottahavefootba · 02-28-2003, 01:07 PM

BLITZKRIEG · 02-28-2003, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gottahavefootba
Before we suffered all the injuries to our offense we were 5-1 and averaging 30 points/game.. after a few injuries to our offense we were 4-6 and averaging 19.8 point/game..

Now you want to put all that on the defense?
When in the HELL did the Jets get the best of our defense??? when they got that field goal in the 4th qt??? thier only score of the second half!?!?! you are right.. they got us good... nobody should score a FG in the second half of a games against us... lets get some OLB and Safeties and even some corners.. that bum Madison was burned alot.

The Jets game came down to our defense having to stop them.....We didn't, and we lost because of it. DEFENSE....

The KC game was a total defensive breakdown all around. Our offense still score 30 points in that game, but it wasn't enough considering our defense gave up 40+.....DEFENSE

The New England game. Defense loses 14 point haftime cushion. They blow an 11 point cushion with just over 2 minutes remaining. DEFENSE.

I'll go on....The Vikings game. Yet again, one stop on defense, and we're in....Didn't happen. DEFENSE....

It's just my opinion, but I don't think the defense lived up to their #3 ranking when we needed them the most....

Trust me, your point is well taken. I think we're still a very tough defense. The problem is we've got no real identity.....Even our own guys can't decide who they are....

PHINZ RULE!!!

gottahavefootba · 02-28-2003, 01:23 PM

OK whatever, but let the Jets game go.. we scored 7 points.. 7, the d gave up 13. you can't blame them for that.. unless you want a defense the shuts every team out every week.

When you talk about the defense losing these games.. I assure you it is not because of personel.. it is because we get soft and allow teams to come back.. a olb is not gonna fix that.. not going into prevent d in the 3rd qt might. If you think bringing in Spikes or Colvin will fix that you will be sadly mistaken.. all the d needs is some killer instinct.. and I don't care who you have on the field, it has to start with play calling.

Now on offense, a Big time WR or a better line would make a difference.. why did NE have the chance to come back on us? because we couldnt get a first down.. we tried to pass because they began stopping the run (oline) but our wr's couldn't get open (boston!).

If we really want to go to the next level we need to upgrade the wr and oline and develop a killer instinct on d.. i feel confident we will do the first this offseason.. but the second.. i don't think even Lawrance Taylor in his prime could fix.

BLITZKRIEG · 02-28-2003, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gottahavefootba
When you talk about the defense losing these games.. I assure you it is not because of personel..

it is because we get soft and allow teams to come back.. a olb is not gonna fix that..

If you think bringing in Spikes or Colvin will fix that you will be sadly mistaken..

all the d needs is some killer instinct.. and I don't care who you have on the field, it has to start with play calling.

Now on offense, a Big time WR or a better line would make a difference.. why did NE have the chance to come back on us? because we couldnt get a first down.. we tried to pass because they began stopping the run (oline) but our wr's couldn't get open (boston!).

In your first paragraph, you mention "getting soft" on defense as a result of poor DCing, and not the players.

You also mentioned that all this defense needs is some "killer instinct". You also mentioned {in not so many words } that you think OLB's like T. Spikes and R. Colvin wouldn't provide that instinct your looking for???.....THAT'S CRAZY!!!

One of those guys alone would provide more "killer instinct" than either D. Rodgers or M. Greenwood combined.....

If you think we lost the NE game because of a lack of offense, you must be losing it IMO.....

I'm done arguing about what side of the ball is to blame. We need help on both sides, but with the FA talent that's available at OLB, how can you just blow it off and say we're fine with who we have??

What we have now is nothing more than mediocre IMO, and just one of these guys would provide that "killer instinct" I think your looking for.....

It's a great debate, and both needs could be filled. I just have a harder time blaming the offense than I do the defense....

PHINZ RULE!!!

Justasportsfan · 02-28-2003, 01:46 PM

Sad to say Blitz is correct. I was hoping the fins would leave the D the way it is and try to upgrade your O. No matter what you do with your O it will not be as good as the Raiders last year and we all know they lost to a defensive team.

WharfRat · 02-28-2003, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by justafan
No matter what you do with your O it will not be as good as the Raiders last year and we all know they lost to a defensive team.

They lost to us also....

gottahavefootba · 02-28-2003, 02:04 PM

If the coaches are calling for Prevent Defense, how are the players gonna have a killer instinct.. just ignore them and play bump and run, maybe blitz? it has to start with the coaching.
Don't get me wrong, I would love to bring in Spikes AND Colvin. but if bringing in one of them means we upgrade our WR's with guys like ward and mcknight, and our LT we leave in the hands of Webb, then no, I would rather keep who we have at OLB and upgrade these positions first. TB's players are not all the much better then ours overall, we are beter at a few positions and they are better at a few positions. but they go after the other team the whole game long.. not just the first 3 quarters.. this is a direct result of coaching... if the coaches tell them to lay back, they will... and once you lay back it is hard to get fired back up again.

ckparrothead · 02-28-2003, 02:20 PM

The coaches aren't going after a free agent OLB. Not unless Wayne Gandy falls through.

If Wayne Gandy falls through, I would be happy with forgetting LT for the moment and placating the press with talks about Richmond Webb and Mark Dixon both having played the position and being veterans etc, possibly someone in the draft etc, and I would wait until after June 1st and see if Derek Deese gets released.

If he does indeed get released, I would release Todd Perry as a June 1st cut, maybe release James McKnight as a June 1st cut, by then we should have Zach renegotiated....and then we can make a big push for Deese to be our starting LT. Of course, we'd make the big push and negotiations and only release those players if Deese agrees to sign on the dotted line.

In the meantime I would be more disposed toward using the money we have now for WR not OLB. We can and probably will draft an OLB in round 2....or 3 at worst. Either way he'll see playing time.

Otherwise, I think the Phins won't go after a veteran OLB until after June 1st if they get their way with Gandy immediately.

Aqua · 02-28-2003, 02:23 PM

We need to sign Gandy and if he wants to be a Fin so bad we should get him for a decent but not cheap price. If we do sign Gandy that gives us probably three years before we even need to think about finding his replacement and it also solifies our OL for the '03 season.

The best bet with our 2nd round pick is drafting a LB. That is one position where the player has the possibility to start immediately and if not at least contribute on special teams and start in '04. Any LT or WR drafted here, in all probability won't start until at least '04. Also with the scheme we run it makes no sense to spend that much money on a guy that is basically a role player.

Last year the top four Rookie WR caught between 43 and 49 balls. Those are the exceptions. We should be able to get a second-tier FA WR to step in and play immediately and then draft a WR with our third round pick. A decent FA signing will easily be more productive than a second round pick WR.

1. Sign Gandy
2. Sign a second-tier WR
3. Draft a LB with #2
4. Draft a WR with #3.

Al13 · 02-28-2003, 02:30 PM

on kffl they say that the 49ers have no interest in cutting Deese and indeed will pay his bonus. i also would like to concentrate on Offense and help the D with the draft.

with that line we have right now ricky rushed for 1800+ and the only questionmark will be nails after his achilles injury but he is ahead of schedule what i read concerning his recovery.

Justasportsfan · 02-28-2003, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by WharfRat
They lost to us also....

Oh you can use that but we bills fans can't ? We beat you twice

BLITZKRIEG · 02-28-2003, 02:47 PM

How is it easier for a drafted LB to come in and start immediately???

That makes no sense to me. It's much harder for a drafted LB to come in and start, than it is for a WR IMO.....

Plus, we don't have a high enough pick in the draft to bring in an impact LB...

PHINZ RULE!!!

finfan54 · 02-28-2003, 03:34 PM

why? we dont need a OLB. we have rogers. rogers is not bad, he plays our crappy scheme to perfection. just worry about offense. if we get scoring 24-30 points /game. then we will do just fine! i say get conway/willie jackson, Webb/Gandy, and a backup QB and we are set.

BLITZKRIEG · 02-28-2003, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by finfan54
why? we dont need a OLB. we have rogers. rogers is not bad

You sound just like Dave!!!

OLB is without question, one of the weakest areas on this team...

D. Rodgers is one of the worst OLB's I've ever seen. It's a miracle he's lasted this long IMO, and any other coach with half a brain would have dumped him their first year!!!.....

PHINZ RULE!!!

02-28-2003, 01:07 PM	#17
gottahavefootba The Predator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Bethlehem PA Age: 33 Posts: 1,645 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	AMEN __________________ ''We probably have guys that make it happen, We have some that watch it happen. And we have some that don't know what the hell's happening. They all fit in one of those three categories.''

02-28-2003, 01:23 PM	#19
gottahavefootba The Predator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Bethlehem PA Age: 33 Posts: 1,645 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	OK whatever, but let the Jets game go.. we scored 7 points.. 7, the d gave up 13. you can't blame them for that.. unless you want a defense the shuts every team out every week. When you talk about the defense losing these games.. I assure you it is not because of personel.. it is because we get soft and allow teams to come back.. a olb is not gonna fix that.. not going into prevent d in the 3rd qt might. If you think bringing in Spikes or Colvin will fix that you will be sadly mistaken.. all the d needs is some killer instinct.. and I don't care who you have on the field, it has to start with play calling. Now on offense, a Big time WR or a better line would make a difference.. why did NE have the chance to come back on us? because we couldnt get a first down.. we tried to pass because they began stopping the run (oline) but our wr's couldn't get open (boston!). If we really want to go to the next level we need to upgrade the wr and oline and develop a killer instinct on d.. i feel confident we will do the first this offseason.. but the second.. i don't think even Lawrance Taylor in his prime could fix. __________________ ''We probably have guys that make it happen, We have some that watch it happen. And we have some that don't know what the hell's happening. They all fit in one of those three categories.''

02-28-2003, 02:04 PM	#23
gottahavefootba The Predator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Bethlehem PA Age: 33 Posts: 1,645 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	If the coaches are calling for Prevent Defense, how are the players gonna have a killer instinct.. just ignore them and play bump and run, maybe blitz? it has to start with the coaching. Don't get me wrong, I would love to bring in Spikes AND Colvin. but if bringing in one of them means we upgrade our WR's with guys like ward and mcknight, and our LT we leave in the hands of Webb, then no, I would rather keep who we have at OLB and upgrade these positions first. TB's players are not all the much better then ours overall, we are beter at a few positions and they are better at a few positions. but they go after the other team the whole game long.. not just the first 3 quarters.. this is a direct result of coaching... if the coaches tell them to lay back, they will... and once you lay back it is hard to get fired back up again. __________________ ''We probably have guys that make it happen, We have some that watch it happen. And we have some that don't know what the hell's happening. They all fit in one of those three categories.''

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

02-28-2003, 01:46 PM	#21
Justasportsfan FinHeaven Elite Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 15,530 Thanks: 9 Thanked 47 Times in 25 Posts	Sad to say Blitz is correct. I was hoping the fins would leave the D the way it is and try to upgrade your O. No matter what you do with your O it will not be as good as the Raiders last year and we all know they lost to a defensive team.

02-28-2003, 02:20 PM	#24
ckparrothead Premium Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Tampa, FL Posts: 32,876 Thanks: 16 Thanked 2,059 Times in 670 Posts FH Badges Total Awards: 1	The coaches aren't going after a free agent OLB. Not unless Wayne Gandy falls through. If Wayne Gandy falls through, I would be happy with forgetting LT for the moment and placating the press with talks about Richmond Webb and Mark Dixon both having played the position and being veterans etc, possibly someone in the draft etc, and I would wait until after June 1st and see if Derek Deese gets released. If he does indeed get released, I would release Todd Perry as a June 1st cut, maybe release James McKnight as a June 1st cut, by then we should have Zach renegotiated....and then we can make a big push for Deese to be our starting LT. Of course, we'd make the big push and negotiations and only release those players if Deese agrees to sign on the dotted line. In the meantime I would be more disposed toward using the money we have now for WR not OLB. We can and probably will draft an OLB in round 2....or 3 at worst. Either way he'll see playing time. Otherwise, I think the Phins won't go after a veteran OLB until after June 1st if they get their way with Gandy immediately.

02-28-2003, 02:23 PM	#25
Aqua Starter Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Delray Beach, FL Posts: 333 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	We need to sign Gandy and if he wants to be a Fin so bad we should get him for a decent but not cheap price. If we do sign Gandy that gives us probably three years before we even need to think about finding his replacement and it also solifies our OL for the '03 season. The best bet with our 2nd round pick is drafting a LB. That is one position where the player has the possibility to start immediately and if not at least contribute on special teams and start in '04. Any LT or WR drafted here, in all probability won't start until at least '04. Also with the scheme we run it makes no sense to spend that much money on a guy that is basically a role player. Last year the top four Rookie WR caught between 43 and 49 balls. Those are the exceptions. We should be able to get a second-tier FA WR to step in and play immediately and then draft a WR with our third round pick. A decent FA signing will easily be more productive than a second round pick WR. 1. Sign Gandy 2. Sign a second-tier WR 3. Draft a LB with #2 4. Draft a WR with #3.

02-28-2003, 02:30 PM	#26
Al13 My Baby girl growin fast Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Berlin, Germany Age: 35 Posts: 4,743 Thanks: 0 Thanked 12 Times in 10 Posts FH Badges Total Awards: 2	on kffl they say that the 49ers have no interest in cutting Deese and indeed will pay his bonus. i also would like to concentrate on Offense and help the D with the draft. with that line we have right now ricky rushed for 1800+ and the only questionmark will be nails after his achilles injury but he is ahead of schedule what i read concerning his recovery.

02-28-2003, 02:47 PM	#28
BLITZKRIEG ~LACUNA LEGIONS~ Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL Age: 38 Posts: 6,668 Thanks: 189 Thanked 497 Times in 160 Posts FH Badges Total Awards: 1	How is it easier for a drafted LB to come in and start immediately??? That makes no sense to me. It's much harder for a drafted LB to come in and start, than it is for a WR IMO..... Plus, we don't have a high enough pick in the draft to bring in an impact LB... PHINZ RULE!!!

02-28-2003, 03:34 PM	#29
finfan54 Zachattack Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: CRAPCHESTER Posts: 12,478 Thanks: 0 Thanked 41 Times in 33 Posts	why? we dont need a OLB. we have rogers. rogers is not bad, he plays our crappy scheme to perfection. just worry about offense. if we get scoring 24-30 points /game. then we will do just fine! i say get conway/willie jackson, Webb/Gandy, and a backup QB and we are set.