'Made in America' must make a comeback

[PhinPhan1227]

Sorry, but we are probably going to see just the opposite. With the push to reinvigorate Labor, and ramp up corporate tax rates in America we aill see more companies pull up stakes rather than try to compete in a hostile culture. How do we expect GM to compete with Honda when GM is paying its workers 2-3 times what Honda does? How is GM supossed to compete when its tax rates are higher as well? I'm not saying that the head honcho's at these companies aren't blameless, but lets be real, would YOU start a major manufacturing company in America today? I wouldn't.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by PhinPhan1227

Sorry, but we are probably going to see just the opposite. With the push to reinvigorate Labor, and ramp up corporate tax rates in America we aill see more companies pull up stakes rather than try to compete in a hostile culture. How do we expect GM to compete with Honda when GM is paying its workers 2-3 times what Honda does? How is GM supossed to compete when its tax rates are higher as well? I'm not saying that the head honcho's at these companies aren't blameless, but lets be real, would YOU start a major manufacturing company in America today? I wouldn't.

I know we're going to see the opposite. Its unfortunate that its the auto-industry going under since they are one of the few who have kept jobs domestic. We need to see other industries move jobs back here.

The Citibank credit card division has 5-6 call centers in India,Mexico, and the Phillipines. Those Call-centers employ ~1,000 people. Imagine those somewhere like Michigan. Thats 1,000+ more jobs locally per call center, and they can be put anywhere. Thats 1,000+ families with health insurance, steady incomes, and it also leads to better customer service for their consumers, because, frankly, customer service from outside the US is horrible. They can b*tch and moan about costs, but the fact of the matter is they will get MORE business from us if we're happy with them. Personally, I don't use my credit cards because I know if I have a problem, I have to talk to someone in India who'll, even though they are usually nice people and really do try, end up making the situation worse. Its a win-win situation...

[Dolphins9954]

Originally Posted by swordfish54

No they won't. People want cheap not quality. They've already made their decision. We reap what we sow.

Americans still spend plenty of money on Japanese products like sound and audio equipment, TV's, cars and trucks. Which are not cheap. Toyota is number one in sales. For good reason. They make the best cars. Americans spend alot of money to buy Toyota vechiles. We need to start making better products. Only then will things turn around.

[phinfan3411]

Originally Posted by Locke

I know we're going to see the opposite. Its unfortunate that its the auto-industry going under since they are one of the few who have kept jobs domestic. We need to see other industries move jobs back here.

The Citibank credit card division has 5-6 call centers in India,Mexico, and the Phillipines. Those Call-centers employ ~1,000 people. Imagine those somewhere like Michigan. Thats 1,000+ more jobs locally per call center, and they can be put anywhere. Thats 1,000+ families with health insurance, steady incomes, and it also leads to better customer service for their consumers, because, frankly, customer service from outside the US is horrible. They can b*tch and moan about costs, but the fact of the matter is they will get MORE business from us if we're happy with them. Personally, I don't use my credit cards because I know if I have a problem, I have to talk to someone in India who'll, even though they are usually nice people and really do try, end up making the situation worse. Its a win-win situation...

Many foreign car manufacturers have plants in this country. NBC nightly news just did a story on this, can you guess where in this country they build, and why they all seem to build in the same area?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by phinfan3411

Many foreign car manufacturers have plants in this country. NBC nightly news just did a story on this, can you guess where in this country they build, and why they all seem to build in the same area?

I have no idea, but I would guess somewhere rural..

[phinfan3411]

Originally Posted by Locke

I have no idea, but I would guess somewhere rural..

On this particular story they showed Alabama, and all the companies that were there, and were BUILDING there. The two reasons they mentioned where as far away from unions as they could get, and lower taxes......hmm imagine that.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by phinfan3411

On this particular story they showed Alabama, and all the companies that were there, and were BUILDING there. The two reasons they mentioned where as far away from unions as they could get, and lower taxes......hmm imagine that.

Well there ya go, a company being part of the solution, not the problem. Its sad that we have to rely on foreign companies to give US citizens jobs. I know the theme of your post is that I'm against tax breaks for corporations. I'm not. I'm against tax breaks for our current generation of corporations. They've had their breaks for the last 8 years, and their jobs in the US have been decreasing. They aren't holding up their end of the deal...

[PhinPhan1227]

Originally Posted by Locke

I know we're going to see the opposite. Its unfortunate that its the auto-industry going under since they are one of the few who have kept jobs domestic. We need to see other industries move jobs back here.

The Citibank credit card division has 5-6 call centers in India,Mexico, and the Phillipines. Those Call-centers employ ~1,000 people. Imagine those somewhere like Michigan. Thats 1,000+ more jobs locally per call center, and they can be put anywhere. Thats 1,000+ families with health insurance, steady incomes, and it also leads to better customer service for their consumers, because, frankly, customer service from outside the US is horrible. They can b*tch and moan about costs, but the fact of the matter is they will get MORE business from us if we're happy with them. Personally, I don't use my credit cards because I know if I have a problem, I have to talk to someone in India who'll, even though they are usually nice people and really do try, end up making the situation worse. Its a win-win situation...

I have exerienced the same thing with Dishnetwork. Calling their customer service is a one way ticket to hell. But I still have dishnetwork. Very few consumers are going to make a switch solely based on customer service. Not when price is a bigger issue. And considering that those 1000+ jobs in the Philipines probably cost as much as 100+ jobs here in the US, what do you think that does to the price of the service offered? Or, on the flip side, say you now have 10X the hold time because the company can only employ 1/10th the number of call center employees? Meanwhile, the company that is either based overseas, or employs overseas labor, is cheaper, or offers a much quicker response. Oh, and don't count on that disparity in quality holding up. We already do a worse job educating Americans than any other industrial nation. So why would our quality be better? You want to save America, fix the schools first. Get accountability BACK into the equation. Schools are broken, either make them fix themselves, or close them down and open a new one. We spend 10k per kid per year on education in America. It's INSANE that we get worse results than the rest of the world.

[Dolphan7]

You want companies to build stuff in America? Here is the formula:

Low taxes and cheap labor.

Those are the two main reasons companies seek to set up operations elsewhere. Oh and a not too distant third is environmental controls and regulation.

When we empower Unions, we increase the cost of labor. When we raise the minimum wage, we increase the cost of labor. When we overtax, we increase the cost to do business. When we place environmental constraints and over-regulate we increase the cost to do business in the USA.

When companies answer to shareholders who demand a return on their investments, it forces companies to look at all possible ways to increase profits by cutting costs and/or raising prices. Hard to raise prices in a global competitive market, so cost cutting is king.

If America wants to bring back the "Made in America" tradition, it will have to be competitive with the rest of the world.

This means America that you can't expect to make $50K to twist a screw driver, you can't have a government that seeks to over-tax the corporations and over-regulate them.

[MDFINFAN]

Originally Posted by finintheburgh

i dont understand the blame on big business. dont you see were to blame for the loss of jobs. your feeling of entitlement is scary.

how can you expect a company to say here and pay 50% of there profits to the gov when they can go else where and pay less than 15%. thats the problem we have. its not the wages that drive business away. its the taxes. yet we want to raise taxes on them more. that will force those who can go to go. if you lower taxes enough so that shipping there goods half way across the world would hurt them. then they will come back in record numbers.

Taxes, what? you don't know the history, Our compaines only pay 33%, and with loop holes they actually only pay around 15-20%. When we were at our manufacturing high they paid 70-90%, when Reagan came to office they were at 50% and he cut it down to about 28% when it was all said and done. and it's pretty much been there, no higher than 36% base in clinton years, with loopholes of course... so don't blame it on taxes.. the tax cuts the corps have enjoyed is why CEO's are paid between 20-200 million a year. That where the tax dollar is going, in their pockets.. What do you guys want us to do, not tax them, just so their here, they benefited from this great country just like the rest of us and should pay some of the burden..period. They got started here, make it big and then left, even when Reagan was cutting their taxes, so that's not going to bring them back...no standards is what they look for and where they go.. they don't care about americans who help make them the companies they are today.

[PhinPhan1227]

Originally Posted by MDFINFAN

Taxes, what? you don't know the history, Our compaines only pay 33%, and with loop holes they actually only pay around 15-20%. When we were at our manufacturing high they paid 70-90%, when Reagan came to office they were at 50% and he cut it down to about 28% when it was all said and done. and it's pretty much been there, no higher than 36% base in clinton years, with loopholes of course... so don't blame it on taxes.. the tax cuts the corps have enjoyed is why CEO's are paid between 20-200 million a year. That where the tax dollar is going, in their pockets.. What do you guys want us to do, not tax them, just so their here, they benefited from this great country just like the rest of us and should pay some of the burden..period. They got started here, make it big and then left, even when Reagan was cutting their taxes, so that's not going to bring them back...no standards is what they look for and where they go.. they don't care about americans who help make them the companies they are today.

At our manufacturing high we had no competition. We could afford to tax our companies because our companies set the worlds prices. That no longer exists. The world sets the prices. And foreign nations now subsidise their companies just to take out our industries. China pumps money into their industries while we pump money out of ours. Who do you think wins that price war? See, that sort of thing is illegal here in the US, but other countries don't play by he same rules.

As to CEO's getting ridiculous bonus', the law actually allowed that to happen. The law prevented share holders from having control over executives salaries and bonus'. I believe that has now been canged.

[MDFINFAN]

Originally Posted by PhinPhan1227

At our manufacturing high we had no competition. We could afford to tax our companies because our companies set the worlds prices. That no longer exists. The world sets the prices. And foreign nations now subsidise their companies just to take out our industries. China pumps money into their industries while we pump money out of ours. Who do you think wins that price war? See, that sort of thing is illegal here in the US, but other countries don't play by he same rules.

As to CEO's getting ridiculous bonus', the law actually allowed that to happen. The law prevented share holders from having control over executives salaries and bonus'. I believe that has now been canged.

We've subsidized our companies for years...that's why there's that thing called corp welfare.. our compaines fail to continue to make good products, the ceo's wanted to line their pockets and stockholders, they sent the jobs over seas, kept the tax cuts, and are making millions... just like you'd be hard press to see the gas companies drill in the US...not as profitable as buying and selling with a built in profit..why drill when you can import and still make a killing... drilling cost almost a billion to set up... don't believe the hype..

[rickyfan85]

Originally Posted by swordfish54

That's the way it should be but it won't happen. Big business has to make every dime they can squeeze out of anybody. They'll never return back to America where they have to pay a higher wage and keep up with environmental standards, safe working conditions and such. Companies aren't loyal to America they are loyal to the All Mighty dollar. The quality of the products a US worker made used to be something to be proud of. Now everything is made elsewhere and it's cheap crap. Big business loves it that way because we have to keep buying more of this cheap crap because it doesn't last as long, more money in their pockets. We get what we deserve. We want everything on the cheap (walmart) and that's exactly the quality we get. Nobody wants to pay the extra dollar for quality. That's what happened to specialty shops on mainstreet, nobody wanted to pay an extra buck to local business. They had to go get the rollback prices at walmart. Our individual greed has hurt us all as a whole. We've made our bed and now we have to lie in it.

This is one thing I don't get about some conservatives and I mean some. They staunchly support big business even if it hurts them and their loved ones. It's like they support it out of stubborness. I say some because a lot of the traditional conservatives are making a lot of money with outsourcing, but some conservatives barely get by. I guess the ones I'm talking about put a higher priority on other things aside from the economy or their own well being. More power to them, I just don't want to hearing the b***ching when it's their turn to pay the piper.

Thats just it the upper crust of the modern G.O.P. are the same people going to washington, hat in hand, to ask for tax payer money because of their individual coorporate failure.

Take the auto industry for instance, they are holding GM jobs like a knife to America's throat, and unwilling to compromise on their ludicrous salaries.

These were the same people that, for the past 25 years were chanting "less regulation, free market economy," and they are still doing that, but at the same time saying "well, go ahead and socialize this for us, we're too rich to fail. But for the rest of America, no let them worry about higher taxes and less government benefits.

It's a joke.