NFL Wants Ability to Destroy Whatever Walsh Turns Over

[MR NFLFAN]

Originally Posted by MattM

I've said about all I can on this topic, but one last thing to Mr. NFL Fan--if Walsh does have a walkthrough tape of the Rams SB (which no one but Walsh currently knows whether he does or not), the Pats* can spin it all they want but no one outside of Boston will believe that he was acting alone in producing it. End of story. If the Commissioner "chooses to believe" the Pats* that Walsh was a "lone gunman" in such a case, there will be heck to pay with the NFL fanbase all over the League and it will show the League is about as straight as the WWF.....

It isn't a matter of spinning it. Its a matter of can you
1) produce a tape of a Rams walk thru
2) Authenticate with reasonable proof to the commisioner that this tape was ordered by the Patriots chain of command.
If you put hatred aside wouldn't you expect that your team or any team for matter be afforded the benefit of doubt from the league. Don't you believe that the burden of proof should be put on the accuser?

Belichick is no saint by any means but neither is walsh and thus he shouldn't be taken merely at his word. Were not talking about a $50 fine were talking about something that could severely affect a franchise for many years.

I myself don't believe there is a tape of any walk thru but thats my opinion.

As far as Heck to pay with the Fan base i think your mainly speaking out of anger.
Tell me MattM as a fan what are you going to do to bring down the house on the commisioner? Will you not watch your bills play next season? Will you not attend a bills game if you do attend games? Will you not purchase Bills merchandise? Will you not visit any nfl team message boards? Will you boycott all things NFL? I don't believe you will.
What exactly is your plan to teach the commisioner a lesson?
Fact of the matter is the commisioner holds all the cards in this. The Broncos and the 49ers were both caught doing an end run around the salary cap and they did it during seasons when the both won SB's. The league and the game never skipped a beat and I don't believe it will now.

If your a fan of the game as many of us are we'll all be tuned in ready to kick off the season this year just like we do every year.

[shula_guy]

Originally Posted by mrnflfan

As far as Heck to pay with the Fan base i think your mainly speaking out of anger.
Tell me MattM as a fan what are you going to do to bring down the house on the commisioner? Will you not watch your bills play next season? Will you not attend a bills game if you do attend games? Will you not purchase Bills merchandise? Will you not visit any nfl team message boards? Will you boycott all things NFL? I don't believe you will.
What exactly is your plan to teach the commisioner a lesson?
Fact of the matter is the commisioner holds all the cards in this. The Broncos and the 49ers were both caught doing an end run around the salary cap and they did it during seasons when the both won SB's. The league and the game never skipped a beat and I don't believe it will now.

If your a fan of the game as many of us are we'll all be tuned in ready to kick off the season this year just like we do every year.

I must say I think you are severly overstating the consequences of this. It will not put an end to the nfl but if it is not resolved in a way the the majority views as fair it will hurt the nfl.

It is true the football junkies will continue to watch football but if its crediability is viewed on the same level as the wwf, how many new fans do you think it will recruit?

how do you think it will effect fantasy leagues and betting in general if the gweneral belief is that the games are rigged?

[MR NFLFAN]

Don't you think "Rigged" is a bit of a stretch? There are just too many veriables involved to fix a game and I don't believe this will have any more effect on the game than all the chants we've heard for years about the refs bad calls. I myself think the video gate episode and any advantage has been blown way out of proportion as many of the experts have stated.
1)Teams regularly change up signals for many reasons. Players and coaches change teams on a yearly basis plus it isn't like other means besides video tape aren't used to steal signals because they are. Dummy calls and dummy callers are also used to conteract the effort plus the offense still has to execute. Not quite as easy as many like to try and make it out to be.
I just don't see this having any great effect on business of the nfl.

[MattM]

Originally Posted by MR NFLFAN

It isn't a matter of spinning it. Its a matter of can you
1) produce a tape of a Rams walk thru
2) Authenticate with reasonable proof to the commisioner that this tape was ordered by the Patriots chain of command.
If you put hatred aside wouldn't you expect that your team or any team for matter be afforded the benefit of doubt from the league. Don't you believe that the burden of proof should be put on the accuser?

Belichick is no saint by any means but neither is walsh and thus he shouldn't be taken merely at his word. Were not talking about a $50 fine were talking about something that could severely affect a franchise for many years.

I myself don't believe there is a tape of any walk thru but thats my opinion.

As far as Heck to pay with the Fan base i think your mainly speaking out of anger.
Tell me MattM as a fan what are you going to do to bring down the house on the commisioner? Will you not watch your bills play next season? Will you not attend a bills game if you do attend games? Will you not purchase Bills merchandise? Will you not visit any nfl team message boards? Will you boycott all things NFL? I don't believe you will.
What exactly is your plan to teach the commisioner a lesson?
Fact of the matter is the commisioner holds all the cards in this. The Broncos and the 49ers were both caught doing an end run around the salary cap and they did it during seasons when the both won SB's. The league and the game never skipped a beat and I don't believe it will now.

If your a fan of the game as many of us are we'll all be tuned in ready to kick off the season this year just like we do every year.

Number 2 above is ridiculous--if a tape exists, what are the odds that Walsh did this on his own? Personally I'd say less than 1% and I'd say most fans would be on my side on this one, dude. Only Pats* homers would believe otherwise. As I said, spin all you want about "burden of proof", but this ain't a court of law, it's the court of public opinion that Goodell is going to have to answer to here, and saying that the Pats* had nothing to do with it doesn't pass any objective party's smell test.

In terms of what I'd do as an individual fan, you may be right in that I'm hooked, but then again, I used to be hooked on baseball, too, as a kid (i.e., reading my team's box score every game, spending hours on Sundays reading up on stats, etc.), yet today, after baseball became "moneyball", with some teams (i.e., big market wealthy teams) in the playoffs every year and others consigned to the permanent scrap heap, I could care less and they get none of my money. Remember when baseball used to be on Saturday afternoon and Monday nights? What was the value of their latest network deal versus those days? The NFL ought to learn that lesson--you need to work to maintain your popularity, it isn't a given.....

[MLTKRT]

reading all the Pats* explain this one is great

[MR NFLFAN]

Originally Posted by MattM

Number 2 above is ridiculous--if a tape exists, what are the odds that Walsh did this on his own? Personally I'd say less than 1% and I'd say most fans would be on my side on this one, dude. Only Pats* homers would believe otherwise. As I said, spin all you want about "burden of proof", but this ain't a court of law, it's the court of public opinion that Goodell is going to have to answer to here, and saying that the Pats* had nothing to do with it doesn't pass any objective party's smell test.

In terms of what I'd do as an individual fan, you may be right in that I'm hooked, but then again, I used to be hooked on baseball, too, as a kid (i.e., reading my team's box score every game, spending hours on Sundays reading up on stats, etc.), yet today, after baseball became "moneyball", with some teams (i.e., big market wealthy teams) in the playoffs every year and others consigned to the permanent scrap heap, I could care less and they get none of my money. Remember when baseball used to be on Saturday afternoon and Monday nights? What was the value of their latest network deal versus those days? The NFL ought to learn that lesson--you need to work to maintain your popularity, it isn't a given.....

Well I suppose the odds would be that low if Matt Walsh were a model citizen but we both know he isn't. The fact that he has to have a kitchen sink indemnity from the league with out recourse even if he lies isn't bringing the thought of model citizen to the top of my mind and I'm sure its put more than a few questions in the commisioners mind also. Being fired for secrectly taping conversations with Pioli and stealing league properity along with lying about his actual position with the Patriots and a non exsistant confidentiality agreement doesn't pass my smell test either. His actions alone raise credibility issues and its reason enough to not take the man merely at his word.

[late again]

Originally Posted by MR NFLFAN

Well I suppose the odds would be that low if Matt Walsh were a model citizen but we both know he isn't. The fact that he has to have a kitchen sink indemnity from the league with out recourse even if he lies isn't bringing the thought of model citizen to the top of my mind and I'm sure its put more than a few questions in the commisioners mind also. Being fired for secrectly taping conversations with Pioli and stealing league properity along with lying about his actual position with the Patriots and a non exsistant confidentiality agreement doesn't pass my smell test either. His actions alone raise credibility issues and its reason enough to not take the man merely at his word.

I've come to believe that the only thing Walsh has is his eye witness accounting of anything. To me that's why he is insisting on this blanket immunity. Because he has nothing tangible to offer as proof. So it'll become a case of him making some less than flattering statements concerning the Pats operations. The Pats' FO will deny anything unseemly. And it will end in a stalemate.
The only ones who will know the whole truth will (still) be those directly involved. The rest of us will be left to speculate and draw our own conclusions. There will be some who will still insist that the Pats did absolutely nothing wrong. And there'll be others who will continue to believe that Belichick is the Antichrist....didn't Revelations say he would come out of the East?.....eh..???....don't scoff just yet. .
Anyway then there are going to be others, like myself that believe, as in most cases the truth is somewhere in the middle. Nonetheless, once Walsh finally gets his 15 minutes, the media will quit talking about it. Once that happens, the rest of us will also move on. Let's face it, whether we want to admit it or not, the media drives the current buzz.

[jimmy42jack0]

Originally Posted by MR NFLFAN

Well I suppose the odds would be that low if Matt Walsh were a model citizen but we both know he isn't. The fact that he has to have a kitchen sink indemnity from the league with out recourse even if he lies isn't bringing the thought of model citizen to the top of my mind and I'm sure its put more than a few questions in the commisioners mind also. Being fired for secrectly taping conversations with Pioli and stealing league properity along with lying about his actual position with the Patriots and a non exsistant confidentiality agreement doesn't pass my smell test either. His actions alone raise credibility issues and its reason enough to not take the man merely at his word.

so you think we should believe that belicheat, pioli, and kraft dont have any credibility issues? where there is smoke, there is fire...and from where im sitting up here in upton, ma...its pretty cloudy and hot for march

[MR NFLFAN]

Originally Posted by jimmy42jack0

so you think we should believe that belicheat, pioli, and kraft dont have any credibility issues? where there is smoke, there is fire...and from where im sitting up here in upton, ma...its pretty cloudy and hot for march

Nope didn't say that at all. Its up to the accuser to prove his accusations. Funny thing in America thats the way its always been.

[MR NFLFAN]

Originally Posted by late again

I've come to believe that the only thing Walsh has is his eye witness accounting of anything. To me that's why he is insisting on this blanket immunity. Because he has nothing tangible to offer as proof. So it'll become a case of him making some less than flattering statements concerning the Pats operations. The Pats' FO will deny anything unseemly. And it will end in a stalemate.
The only ones who will know the whole truth will (still) be those directly involved. The rest of us will be left to speculate and draw our own conclusions. There will be some who will still insist that the Pats did absolutely nothing wrong. And there'll be others who will continue to believe that Belichick is the Antichrist....didn't Revelations say he would come out of the East?.....eh..???....don't scoff just yet. .
Anyway then there are going to be others, like myself that believe, as in most cases the truth is somewhere in the middle. Nonetheless, once Walsh finally gets his 15 minutes, the media will quit talking about it. Once that happens, the rest of us will also move on. Let's face it, whether we want to admit it or not, the media drives the current buzz.

Yeah thats what I'm starting to believe. Walsh never stated he had walk thru tapes that came from a hearld reporter who got it from an anonymous source...Arlen perhaps?
Every 3 or 4 weeks a press release comes out that states the lawyers are getting closer to a deal, were real close, almost a done deal etc. Even front page Arlen has been rather silent.

[jimmy42jack0]

Originally Posted by MR NFLFAN

Nope didn't say that at all. Its up to the accuser to prove his accusations. Funny thing in America thats the way its always been.

what america do you live in? the one i live in...you accuse people of things and watch them try to defend themselves...it may not be the law of the land...but its the law of initial public reaction

[MR NFLFAN]

Originally Posted by jimmy42jack0

what america do you live in? the one i live in...you accuse people of things and watch them try to defend themselves...it may not be the law of the land...but its the law of initial public reaction

Well Walsh hasn't really accused anybody of anything yet. So far all we've heard are reports from anonymous sources and lip service from a grandstanding Senator with special interest trying to position himself to reward the hand that fed him.

[jimmy42jack0]

Originally Posted by MR NFLFAN

Well Walsh hasn't really accused anybody of anything yet. So far all we've heard are reports from anonymous sources and lip service from a grandstanding Senator with special interest trying to position himself to reward the hand that fed him.

are you inferring that the only reason spector is involved is because comcast is paying him to be interested? forgive me but that seems like an embarrassed fan grasping at straws that just simply arent there

[MR NFLFAN]

Originally Posted by jimmy42jack0

are you inferring that the only reason spector is involved is because comcast is paying him to be interested? forgive me but that seems like an embarrassed fan grasping at straws that just simply arent there

The words are "has paid" and heres a news flash for you. In washington senators and member of the house grease the palms of those who funded their campaigns every day. Did you just arrive in America?


I have to laugh at some of you guys. You'd believe Hitler as long as he wanted to punish the Patriots. Forgive me but that seems like nothing other than a jealous fan grasping at any straw to see a team punished weather they are proven guilty or not. How sick is that.

[late again]

Originally Posted by jimmy42jack0

are you inferring that the only reason spector is involved is because comcast is paying him to be interested? forgive me but that seems like an embarrassed fan grasping at straws that just simply arent there

As a Fin fan I'll say this - IMO Spector has involved himself because he's an Eagles fan and he was disappointed that they lost the SB. Last year the world found out that the Pats had violated league rules with the video taping thing.
So quite naturally the fan in him wondered if the Pats had done the same thing in that SB. Now he's using his position of power to drive this to the end.
I do not for one minute believe that Arlen Spector has come to own this crusade because he's interested in "truth, justice and the American way", however. I seriously doubt if he even cares about the average Eagles fan. He's just another politician who has his own interests and agenda to serve.
His interests may very well include Comcast. Certainly a case could be made for that line of thinking.
Whatever the reason may be, as MRNFLFAN stated, you can believe it's driven by money.