Greenberg says Manning to SEA, Edwards says MIA

[tay0365]

Totally different situations, NE had a young QB on their roster for years who could play and knew the system. Indy picked up a retired 40+ yr old QB off his couch w/ a couple weeks to go before the season started and Indy quit on the season. NE was also coming off 16-0 and had a younger, better team at the time. Indy was coming off 10-6 and wasn't expected to be great w/ Manning. Look at BB's record w/ and w/o Brady for more clarification.

The young QB the Pats used in 08 had no experience, and has done so well in KC, he is about to be replaced.

[2413fanphins]

Typical greenie being a hated.

[Daytona Fin]

Typical greenie being a hated.

greeny is the queen of douchers

[The New Guy]

In '08 the Jets were not very good despite the record.

I don't agree with that. They were just as good if not better when Favre was healthy. They were 8-3 before finishing the season 1-4. The 09 Jets only got to 9 wins by playing 2 teams to end the season that had no desire to win.

In '08 Ari made the playoffs but in 3 NE trips they lost by an average score of Ari 21 Opps 50 and in the NE game Ari barely played their starters-
In '08 NE beat 2 playoff teams, Ari and one of the worst playoff teams of the past decade the Miami Dolphins. In 2009 they beat a team that reached the AFC Championship Game and another team that reached the div rd.

The Cardinals got blown out by two good teams in 08. The Jets 56-35 and Patriots 47-7. I don't understand your logic. You want to discredit the Pats win without Brady against the Cardinals in 08 because they didn't have a great regular season (9-7), yet they won their division and made it to the Super Bowl that year. Then you want to uplift the Pats win with Brady against the Jets in 09 when they wouldn't have even gotten to 9 wins and made the playoffs had it not been for Indy letting them in, and they only made it to the AFCC game. You are not looking at the facts. The 09 Pats with Brady coming off the knee injury were not a much better team than the 08 team without him.

Remember, as great as people think those defenses were the Pats were 5-11 in 2000 w/o Brady and started 0-2 in 2001 including a loss to the lowly Bengals. They magically won 11 of 14 when Brady became the starter. Please look up BB's record w/ and w/o Brady.

A coach can't have a bad first season with his team and then turn it around the next year? The Pats were 6-10 in 1995, and started 0-2 the next year, but they went on the make it to the Super Bowl with the same starting QB. I really believe that the 2001 Pats would have made it to the Super Bowl had Brady not come in to start. The D and special teams carried that team. They would not have had the long term success that they have had, but I think 2001 plays out the same without Brady.

[nyjunc]

Brady needed help to reach and win all his superbowls, Payton won his superbowl without much of a defense, or running game.

Brady went down a few years ago, the great Patriot machine continued to win 11 games, Payton goes down, the Colts are now in position to get Luck with the #1 pick after having the worst season they have had since.....well, since Payton got there.

Really? Peyton's D in 2006 allowed 12.8 PPG in 4 playoff games, Peyton threw 3 TDs and 7 INTs, Addai & rhodes rushed for 600 yds on 4.4 YPC. That certainly shows Peyton winning w/o much help from the D or run game.

In NE's 3 SBs runs the D allowed an average of:

2001: 15.7 PPG, good but not as good as '06 Indy
2003: 19 PPG
2004: 17 PPG

NE run game:

2001: Antowain Smith averaged 3.8 YPC in playoffs
2003: Smith averaged 3.9 YPC
2004: Dillon averaged 4.5

NE was a sinking franchise until Brady took over and rescued it.

Brady went down a year after winning 16 games and despite a much easier sched they only won 10 w/ Cassel as their starter and MISSED the playoffs. Indy was a team ont he decline and went from 10 to 2 wins when the team quit on the season and didn't have a competent QB.

The young QB the Pats used in 08 had no experience, and has done so well in KC, he is about to be replaced.

No experience but he watched the best QB in the game for 3 seasons and whether he will be replaced or not means nothing as he helped them win the AFC Weast in 2010. let me know when Curtis Painter helps any team even into playoff contention.

I don't agree with that. They were just as good if not better when Favre was healthy. They were 8-3 before finishing the season 1-4. The 09 Jets only got to 9 wins by playing 2 teams to end the season that had no desire to win.



The Cardinals got blown out by two good teams in 08. The Jets 56-35 and Patriots 47-7. I don't understand your logic. You want to discredit the Pats win without Brady against the Cardinals in 08 because they didn't have a great regular season (9-7), yet they won their division and made it to the Super Bowl that year. Then you want to uplift the Pats win with Brady against the Jets in 09 when they wouldn't have even gotten to 9 wins and made the playoffs had it not been for Indy letting them in, and they only made it to the AFCC game. You are not looking at the facts. The 09 Pats with Brady coming off the knee injury were not a much better team than the 08 team without him.



A coach can't have a bad first season with his team and then turn it around the next year? The Pats were 6-10 in 1995, and started 0-2 the next year, but they went on the make it to the Super Bowl with the same starting QB. I really believe that the 2001 Pats would have made it to the Super Bowl had Brady not come in to start. The D and special teams carried that team. They would not have had the long term success that they have had, but I think 2001 plays out the same without Brady.

Don't buy the Favre injury excuse, he could throw the ball just fine in December and he supposedly got hurt in noctober then played his best football in November(his onl;y good stretch of football for us all year). We were 8-3 more b/c of an incredibly weak schedule.

The '09 Jets were MUCH better than the '08 Jets and our QB not choking was one of the reasons.

Good teams don't get blown out like that consistently, they also lost by a similar score to Philly. The team in postseason was ot the same team as in the reg season. If we played Ari in January they would have smoked us.

You don't know if we would have beaten Indy or not, we were only down 5 pts. Using that logic down 4 midway through the 3rd at SD we had no shot but they played the game out and we won.

It was just a coincidence that NE was 5-11 in 2000 w/o Brady then started 0-2 in 2001 w/o him before winning 11 of 14 w/ Brady. The 2001 Pats wouldn't have made the playoffs let alone win a SB if Brady didn't take over, BB wouldn't have had a job much longer.

BB w/o Brady(7+ seasons):

51-62, 45%
1 playoff app
1 playoff win
zero div titles
zero div rd wins
zero AFC tile game apps
Zero SBs
2 winning seasons
5 losing seasons

BB w/ Brady(10 seasons):

[nyjunc]

BB w/o Brady(7+ seasons):

51-62, 45%
1 playoff app
1 playoff win
zero div titles
zero div rd wins
zero AFC tile game apps
Zero SBs
2 winning seasons
5 losing seasons

BB w/ Brady(10 seasons):

124-35, 78%

9 playoff apps
9 div titles
16-6 postseason record
5 AFC Titles
3 SB titles
5 6 AFC title game apps
no losing seasons
only one season w/ lesss than 10 wins

[utahphinsfan]

The greatest QB of this generation has no chance to be released next week

You mean Eli, right? Brees? Rodgers?

[nyjunc]

You mean Eli, right? Brees? Rodgers?

I was thinking Matt Moore

[Roman529]

. Greenberg then gave his opinion, the whiny little tart, about how Seattle would be a much better fit, and that it doesn't make sense for Manning to play under a first year head coach in Philbin.

Of course Greenie is saying "Manning is likely going to Seattle....he is a Jet's fan and doesn't want Manning killing his team. For what it is worth, Skip Bayless said, "The Phins are on the rise and he felt Manning would likely end up in Miami." But Greenie, Bayless and even Herm Edwards know about as much as where he is going as you and I. They are not insiders. They're just guessing like everyone else.

[The New Guy]

Don't buy the Favre injury excuse, he could throw the ball just fine in December and he supposedly got hurt in noctober then played his best football in November(his onl;y good stretch of football for us all year). We were 8-3 more b/c of an incredibly weak schedule.

I saw a lot of Jets games that year, you could see his arm strength get worse each week. That 08 Jets won 9 games and beat:

11-5 NE
11-5 Miami
13-3 Titans (Made it to the AFCC game)
9-7 Cardinals (NFC Champs)

The 09 Jets were a joke in the regular season with the biggest win being against 10-6 NE (in the second game of the season) That NE team would later get pummeled in the playoffs by Bal. They lost 6 of 7 at one point, and Indy gave them the game. The 09 Jets couldn't even beat teams like 7-9 Miami, 7-9 Jacksonville, 6-10 Buff, and with the playoffs on the line, 9-7 Atlanta. There was no way they were going to beat the undefeated Colts had they kept their starters in. It was a 9-3 Colts lead at the half. The Jets got back in the game with a kick off return for a TD. Manning came back in for 1 drive and they scored a TD giving them the 15-10 lead. Then they quit. Painter came in and on his first pass attempt, gives the Jets 7. At that point, not just Manning, but all of the starters were out. I know you are going to bring up the playoff game and say they were leading by 4 at the half, but games are 4 quarters, not 2. Indy went on to win 30-17. There is no way that team would have beat Indy had they kept their starters in.

It was just a coincidence that NE was 5-11 in 2000 w/o Brady then started 0-2 in 2001 w/o him before winning 11 of 14 w/ Brady. The 2001 Pats wouldn't have made the playoffs let alone win a SB if Brady didn't take over, BB wouldn't have had a job much longer.

BB w/o Brady(7+ seasons):

51-62, 45%
1 playoff app
1 playoff win
zero div titles
zero div rd wins
zero AFC tile game apps
Zero SBs
2 winning seasons
5 losing seasons

BB w/ Brady(10 seasons):

What do you base that on? An 0-2 start after a 5-11 season the year before? Parcells had an almost identical 6-10 record and started out 0-2 in 96 and not only made the playoffs, but went to the Super Bowl.

Bledsoe did it before in 96 against tougher competition, and he could have done it again in 01 against easier competition.

Brady didn't play like the Brady we know today in 01. That team was carried by the D and special teams and didn't have a very tough schedule. In 2001 they faced 10 teams with a losing record. The Dolphins, Jets and the Rams were the only teams they faced that had a record above .500. They split with the Dolphins and Jets, and lost to the Rams.

Brady won his first start against the 6-10 Colts. He lost his next start to the 11-5 Dolphins. His next 2 games were against the 5-11 Chargers, and the 6-10 Colts again. He lost to the 8-8 Broncos before beating the 7-9 Falcons and the 3-13 Bills. He also beat the 7-9 Saints, the 7-9 Browns, the 3-13 Bills again, and the 1-15 Panthers. You can't tell me that it is not possible that Bledsoe could have had the same success against those weak teams.

What does Bill's record in the 90's with a different team have to do with Brady? It was a completely different team. His record without Brady in 08 is the only thing that we have as a fair comparison. Yes, belichick went 5-11 in 2000, but that was his first year, and they were only 8-8 in the previous season.