Jeff Fisher chimes in on public critcism of Ireland

[J Tes]

Having final say over personnel means you have power exceeding the GM. Wanting final say over personnel and being required to perform the daily functions of a GM while also being the head football coach are where it's different.

Fisher disagreed with Ross on whether or not Jeff Ireland should have final say, so would I.

Is it at all possible the Ross disagreed that Fisher deserved final say?

[Zounds]

Having final say over personnel means you have power exceeding the GM.

No, it just means you have final say on the roster. Its doesn not give the head coach the power to direct scouts, negotiate contracts, deveolp a draft board, or trade picks for picks.

[TedSlimmJr]

Is it at all possible the Ross disagreed that Fisher deserved final say?

Of course he did. Obviously Jeff Fisher and Stephen Ross had to disagree with each other in order for there to be a disagreement. The difference is, Ross took the advice of Carl Peterson to keep the structure in place where Ireland has final say on personnel. Peterson is Ross' "football guy" that he leans on for advice in football matters. Ireland got his start in the NFL because of Carl Peterson to begin with.

I prefer the structure where the GM has final say, but only if I believe he's a competent GM. Ireland should've been gone with the rest of 'em.

But it's Ross' team he can do whatever he wants to with it.

[TedSlimmJr]

No, it just means you have final say on the roster. Its doesn not give the head coach the power to direct scouts, negotiate contracts, deveolp a draft board, or trade picks for picks.

You make no sense. All of this is how you build a roster with the exception of managing scouts... who also have no say over personnel on draft day.

If you don't have final say over trades and acquisitions, you don't have final say over personnel. You're not in charge of your roster.

That's why Bill Parcells made his "buying groceries" comment in New England before he left. He wanted final say over personnel, not the daily duties of a GM while also being the head football coach.

In other words, you let the GM do his job until he's about to do something you as the football coach see as completely stupid or off the cuff... that's when you step in and have final say. All personnel proposals are put on your desk and approved before being made.

Most of the time the GM and head coach with final say will see eye-to-eye and there's no friction, but just in case there is... the coach wants final say.

[J Tes]

Of course he did. Obviously Jeff Fisher and Stephen Ross had to disagree with each other in order for there to be a disagreement. The difference is, Ross took the advice of Carl Peterson to keep the structure in place where Ireland has final say on personnel. Peterson is Ross' "football guy" that he leans on for advice in football matters. Ireland got his start in the NFL because of Carl Peterson to begin with.

I prefer the structure where the GM has final say, but only if I believe he's a competent GM. Ireland should've been gone with the rest of 'em.

But it's Ross' team he can do whatever he wants to with it.

I agree and said the samething in an earlier post. I don't think Ireland is as bad as he's portrayed to be but I do agree he should have been let go with Sparano. With that being said, I would have been okay with Fisher as the HC but not with the authority that he wanted

[Vaark]

Sorry but a guy who's put up 6 out of 17 winning seasons, and ironically a few of them with a QB who was foisted on him by a meddlesome owner, hasn't earned the credibility, let alone the right to "buy the groceries." For anyone who argues that it's all on Bud Adams, well what does it say about the judgment of the dumbazz who actually renewed his contract 2 or 3X knowing the lay of the land instead of extricating himself from such oppressive circumstances (and would still contendedly be there if not kicked to the curb)?

Ross was right. Period!!!

[Zounds]

You make no sense. All of this is how you build a roster with the exception of managing scouts... who also have no say over personnel on draft day.

If you don't have final say over trades and acquisitions, you don't have final say over personnel. You're not in charge of your roster.

That's why Bill Parcells made his "buying groceries" comment in New England before he left. He wanted final say over personnel, not the daily duties of a GM while also being the head football coach.

In other words, you let the GM do his job until he's about to do something you as the football coach see as completely stupid or off the cuff... that's when you step in and have final say. All personnel proposals are put on your desk and approved before being made.

Most of the time the GM and head coach with final say will see eye-to-eye and there's no friction, but just in case there is... the coach wants final say.

Im differentiating between the coaches who "want final say over personnel" and coahces who have the dual role of GM and Coach. Completely different. Bill Parcells' role here was essentially a GM position and quite different than the responsibilities Fisher asked for. You cant compare the two. Every coach wants final say on who plays on his team, and its not a slight against Ireland, is a slight on the GM position in general. If Fisher had asked for the GM tag, or ask to have Ireland replaced, then I would definitely take that as a negative towards Ireland.

[finfan54]

lets face it, he is afraid of matt moore kicking his ass when we play the rams. lol. in miami too. less we forget. he really knows who is the better team at this point.

[TedSlimmJr]

Sorry but a guy who's put up 6 out of 17 winning seasons, and ironically a few of them with a QB who was foisted on him by a meddlesome owner, hasn't earned the credibility, let alone the right to "buy the groceries." For anyone who argues that it's all on Bud Adams, well what does it say about the judgment of the dumbazz who actually renewed his contract 2 or 3X knowing the lay of the land instead of extricating himself from such oppressive circumstances (and would still contendedly be there if not kicked to the curb)?

Ross was right. Period!!!

Jeff Ireland has even less credibility. I don't think Ross was right here in regards to Jeff Fisher. He's already helped the Rams swing a deal to get them out of the #2 pick and rape the Redskins in the process.

Where's Jeff Ireland's strategic draft moves? Trading up for a slow runningback with ball security issues to pass up a quarterback Miami could use pretty bad right now? Passing up a franchise quarterback for a left tackle with the #1 overall pick who they're currently afraid to give a long term deal to?

We'll find out who was right. I know I'll take Jeff Fisher at what he does over Jeff Ireland at what he does 10 out of 10 times.

[Vaark]

Jeff Ireland has even less credibility. I don't think Ross was right here in regards to Jeff Fisher. He's already helped the Rams swing a deal to get them out of the #2 pick and rape the Redskins in the process.

Where's Jeff Ireland's strategic draft moves? Trading up for a slow runningback with ball security issues to pass up a quarterback Miami could use pretty bad right now? Passing up a franchise quarterback for a left tackle with the #1 overall pick who they're currently afraid to give a long term deal to?

We'll find out who was right. I know I'll take Jeff Fisher at what he does over Jeff Ireland at what he does 10 out of 10 times.

You're right, we'll see. IMO what Fisher "accomplished" with that trade was a no brainer, most any decent GM could have done (although didn't 2 up and comers turn down interviews because of whom they'd be answering to?). However when you have an 8-8 QB the first year, sucked badly last season and is fragile as a china doll, the wisdom of trading out of RG3 will remain to be seen.

All I know is that someone who uses a meddlesome owner as a straw man although re-upping with him several times and still being there if not outwearing his welcome is not someone whose judgment I'd trust on the basis of faith.

And you know Teddy, how I feel about "franchise QBs." I like them when they do more than go 1 and out in instant death since college... and the last I looked Ireland wasn't the one who passed on Rodgers or Brees version 2
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Not defending him, but the administration seems to be graded on what I call a "Raw Meat Curve" If it's agenda-suiting negative information it's salivated over, accepted and embraced no questions asked; if it's anything positive, it's adjudged self-serving hype to be discredited. Just some even-handed objectivity por favor. That's all I require.