Obama/Republicans reach deal on new budget before Fiscal Cliff

[TheWalrus]

So social security, Medicare and defense spending are at acceptable levels for you? Even the likes of bill maher agree that the big 3 need to be addressed.

Defense spending needs to be cut. Absolutely.

The reason Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid spending is so high is because of out of control health care costs. What the government does with those programs is agree to pay for health insurance and other benefits. But what it doesn't do is establish what those benefits should cost. That part is still left up to private enterprise, and whatever price is set must be paid.

Cutting back on the benefits themselves would help reduce the deficit, sure. But the better goal is reducing the price tag of the benefits (by allowing Medicare part D to negotiate for better drug prices, for example).

Why is that the better goal, you ask? Think about Social Security and Medicare for a second. These are programs for the elderly, who are now retired, and who have spent their entire lives paying into these programs. Their money, out of their paycheck, every two weeks. This is not an entitlement, it's a promise, a good that's been paid for. How can you morally justify turning to these people and telling them that the benefits they paid for and were promised are going to be cut?

There ARE other options. We just don't pursue them because we're too afraid of ruffling the feathers of health care companies.

16 trillion in debt is dumb.

The Constitution mandates that the full faith and credit of the United States must be maintained, so I'm not sure how the debt limit even works legally. $16 trillion is a huge number but it's also an arbitrary number. If you don't understand why the US Government failing to pay it's obligations is bad then frankly... that's on you.

Think about what would happen if you told your credit card company that you had exceeded some arbitrary level of spending for the year and weren't going to pay your bill until you decided for yourself whether that level of spending versus income was acceptable. Try it some time and see how it works out.
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

[Spesh]

Im asking for specifics to curtail our debt issue, not the bs you just stated.

Negotiate in good faith. Everything comes from that. Thats the most basic thing i ask from our paid representatives. And they cannot do that.

If they cant do that, then specifics mean nothing because nothing will get done. Production wise, this is the worst House we have ever had in the history of the nation. Id personally be overjoyed if it was replaced.

Because youll demand to know where i sit on this position: i believe we need to take a knife to our defense spending and allow some of the (supposedly) temporary Bush Tax Cuts to expire. I also believe we do spend to much on unnecessary entitlement programs but not nearly the amount that Republicans believe. I dont believe in strict austerity measures.

[Dolphins9954]

I'm not a fan of the GOP, but let's be honest here. No matter where you are politically this is a terd sandwich of a bill. How can anyone defend it and worse vote for it???

[Dolphins9954]

One thing is for sure. The military industrial complex always gets it's way.

[registeredguy]

I'm not a fan of the GOP, but let's be honest here. No matter where you are politically this is a terd sandwich of a bill. How can anyone defend it and worse vote for it???

It's a bad bill, but all bills are bad. That's the way Washington works.

The only reason you wouldn't want to see this bill get passed is if you believe in accelerationism and you want to see the United States get the crashing and burning over with now as opposed to thirty years from now. My guess is that the vast majority of Americans aren't in that camp and wouldn't be happy with the results of this bill failing to pass.

[Dolphins9954]

It's a bad bill, but all bills are bad. That's the way Washington works.

The only reason you wouldn't want to see this bill get passed is if you believe in accelerationism and you want to see the United States get the crashing and burning over with now as opposed to thirty years from now. My guess is that the vast majority of Americans aren't in that camp and wouldn't be happy with the results of this bill failing to pass.

It's a total failure of government, leadership, representation. fiscal and monetary policies. In no way, shape or form is this bill a positive. Band-aid on a bullet wound.

[Dolphins9954]

Looks like it passed. Once again the government proves that it's a complete failure.

[registeredguy]

It's a total failure of government, leadership, representation. fiscal and monetary policies. In no way, shape or form is this bill a positive. Band-aid on a bullet wound.

It's not a failure of government. The government is representative of the people, who are ultimately the ones responsible for this mess. Anyone who has read Thucydides can probably predict what's going to happen next.

I do pity future historians, they will have to decipher incomprehensible Twitter nonsense as they try to make sense of this crap.
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

[Dolphins9954]

It's not a failure of government. The government is representative of the people, who are ultimately the ones responsible for this mess. Anyone who has read Thucydides can probably predict what's going to happen next.

I do pity future historians, they will have to decipher incomprehensible Twitter nonsense as they try to make sense of this crap.
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

True but the people don't have much choice in the matter when both parties are controlled by the same interests.

[GoFins!]

The only reason you wouldn't want to see this bill get passed is if you believe in accelerationism and you want to see the United States get the crashing and burning over with now as opposed to thirty years from now.

Does anyone have any confidence that our government will mend their ways without a crash?

I don't.

I'm not looking forward to a crash but I think it might lead to a better outcome in the long run.

30 years ago we were worried about a $1 trillion national debt. Now our deficits exceed that. Where will we be in another 30 years?


To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.