No love for Daniel Thomas

[MarinoEqualsGod]

DT is NOT our primary starter and no where in this post did I suggest that he should be. He's a good second back that can get some tuff yards when you need them. That's all.
Like you said keep him around until his contract expires and then move on or resign if he improves.

Agreed.

But lets say Reggie leaves via free agency this offseason, who do you want as your primary starter, DT, Miller, sign a free agent or draft someone new?

[Fins1971]

4 rushing TDs on 256 carries...how many attempts does it take him to get in the end zone? How many of the 256 were near the goal line? Where is your logic coming from or are you just making stuff up?

In the first game against the Jets Reggie got hurt and missed most of the game, right? Thomas had 19 carries for 69 yards...3.6 ypc. Those 19 carries weren't all goal line carries or would you like to make everyone believe they were. Against Cincy Reggie got pulled for fumbling, Thomas had 10 carries for 29 yards...were all of those at the goal line? In the second game against the Jets he had 15 carries for 42 yards...2.8 ypc.

Are you really going to try and say that most of the 256 carries Thomas had were near the goal line when he only scored 4 TDs on the season...if that's true then he's a woefully ineffective goal line RB. Either way he's not very good.

Of those 256 carries, 22 were inside the opponest 10 yard line. 4 TD's in 22 attempts.

And without Dt we don't win the Cincy game. I was there. he only had 29 yards but they were crucial yards when we were backed up against our own goal line late in the game.
He helped move the ball out to close to mid field and then we punted. Cincy drove to long Fg range and missed. without those yards it was a sure 3 points for Cincy.
Then at the end they would have only needed a FG to win instead of Td that they didn't get.

[Fins1971]

Agreed.

But lets say Reggie leaves via free agency this offseason, who do you want as your primary starter, DT, Miller, sign a free agent or draft someone new?

I'd let Miller have a chance and keep DT as #2 and short yardage/goal line. Maybe look at reasonable free agents. But i would really like to see Reggie back.

[Fin Thirteen]

The reason people have a difficulty with Thomas, in my view, is that he is the embodiment of Ireland's draft philosophy, ie to go for low downside safe picks in the top of the draft. Worse still, Ireland put such a premium on him being a solid, low risk, starting player that he moved up for the guy.

Then to top it off, the guy turns out to be not so safe after all. I feel for him, despite him being underwhelming, because its Jeff Ireland most of us are disappointed with, more so than Thomas.

We owe Daniel Thomas a debt of gratitude, in that he is a lesson to Ireland that you can never be sure of a safe, cant-miss starter. I think Ireland took more risk on playmakers in the last draft (Tannehill, Miller, Egnew, Vernon) and hopefully will refine his style and do it better this time round. But his failed Thomas ploy was probably one of the factors that pushed him to be more aggressive last time out.

[Fins1971]

The reason people have a difficulty with Thomas, in my view, is that he is the embodiment of Ireland's draft philosophy, ie to go for low downside safe picks in the top of the draft. Worse still, Ireland put such a premium on him being a solid, low risk, starting player that he moved up for the guy.

Then to top it off, the guy turns out to be not so safe after all. I feel for him, despite him being underwhelming, because its Jeff Ireland most of us are disappointed with, more so than Thomas.

We owe Daniel Thomas a debt of gratitude, in that he is a lesson to Ireland that you can never be sure of a safe, cant-miss starter. I think Ireland took more risk on playmakers in the last draft (Tannehill, Miller, Egnew, Vernon) and hopefully will refine his style and do it better this time round. But his failed Thomas ploy was probably one of the factors that pushed him to be more aggressive last time out.

Yeah, same thing with Ginn. Don't hate the player just because we picked him earlier than we should have.

He is right were he should be with the running backs of the 2011 draft.

[Irishfinfan1]

Thomas was a waste of a 2nd round pick, and a traded up one at that, that is why there is no love for Thomas. We could have had talent like that as a free agent, and this coming from and Ireland supporter.

[Mogwai]

He's a relatively decent backup RB. 3.5 ypc. 4 TDs for a goal line back. 5 fumbles. Injured often. And vastly inferior production than our other runners. What exactly is there to love? That we moved up to take him over Demarco and Ridley is just ridiculous.

[Fins1971]

We could have had talent like that as a free agent

Easy to say things like that but you better be ready to back them up.

Here are the big free agent running backs from last year with salary and production compared to DT

Green-Ellis to Cincy for 3 year $9M contract ($3M per) 1198 yards from scrimage
Bush to Bears for 4 year $14M contract ($3.5M per) 494 yards from scrimage
Tolbert to Carolina for 4 year $8.4M contract ($2.1M per) 451 yards from scrimage
Hillis to KC for 1 year $3M contract ($3M per) 371 yards from scrimage
Benson to GB for 1 year 825K contract (825K per) 345 yards from scrimage
Grant to GB for 1 year 700K contract (700K per) 161 yards from scrimage

DT drafted by Miami for 4 year 3.2M contract (800K per) Averages 567 yard from scrimage per year

As you can see the Free Agent card very seldom works. The only free agent running back that did better than DT last year was Green Ellis.
And Cincy is paying him 4 time what we are paying DT. The only backs with comparable contract are Grant and benson and there is no way they sign with us for the same price.
Both gave the Packers discounts to be on possible Super Bowl team. So yeah you can replace him with a free agent and probably pay 3 to 4 times as much for the same or lesser production

The number above give a good guideline about the value of Free agent running backs and should help set a price guideline for what to offer Reggie Bush this year.

[Fins1971]

He's a relatively decent backup RB. 3.5 ypc. 4 TDs for a goal line back. 5 fumbles. Injured often. And vastly inferior production than our other runners. What exactly is there to love? That we moved up to take him over Demarco and Ridley is just ridiculous.

Ridley and Murray have 100 more touches than DT and both are on better offensive teams. Patriots #1, Cowboys #6, Dolphins 27th.

Better teams, more chances and only slightly better production.

[Strangeworld]

Another in a long line of mediocre players Ireland has drafted.

Next please