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Thread: Atheist Eschatology

  1. -11
    Locke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by emeraldfin View Post
    Perhaps, I do see the reasoning as you can say its your only shot at life, etc. However, it can also make you uneasy depending on what way you look at it. I mean, some will embrace it like you said, but others may become fearful, apprehensive, etc and the prospects of this life is be a slave to society and having little control on your life. Also if your prone to depression/stress, live in poverty, a life of sickness, then its not a very attractive prospect either.

    At least with faith in a higher being, you do have the comfort zone that your life does have meaning and that every action you take is vital to your salvation. I'm personally not trying to take a certain side on this, just trying to put out different lines of thought.
    There have been studies that have shown those who are deeply religious have lower rates of depression, so what you say does hold some level of scientific validity. On the other hand, if you're deeply religious, you're also at risk of being extremely judgmental, which is the first step towards extreme hate, like those Westboro douchebags. It's a double-edged sword to say the least. It's a topic where there is no right answer. It would be pretty amazing if everyone judge accepted that they believe in something different than someone else, and left it at that. All this attacking other beliefs garbage has one ending, and it isn't a good one...

    If I could take your pain and frame it, and hang it on my wall,
    maybe you would never have to hurt again...

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  2. -12
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    Quote Originally Posted by emeraldfin View Post
    Perhaps, I do see the reasoning as you can say its your only shot at life, etc. However, it can also make you uneasy depending on what way you look at it. I mean, some will embrace it like you said, but others may become fearful, apprehensive, etc and the prospects of this life is be a slave to society and having little control on your life. Also if your prone to depression/stress, live in poverty, a life of sickness, then its not a very attractive prospect either.

    At least with faith in a higher being, you do have the comfort zone that your life does have meaning and that every action you take is vital to your salvation. I'm personally not trying to take a certain side on this, just trying to put out different lines of thought.
    None of this matters either way. You shouldn't believe or not believe in something based on its validity - not whether or not you think it'll make life easier on you.
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  3. -13
    JDOE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spydertl79 View Post
    Tide comes in, Tide goes out... you can't explain that
    Um, that would be the result of the moon's gravitational pull on the earth.

    What you are postulating is the "God of the gaps" concept. People/scientists can't explain x, therefore x somehow supports god or the supernatural. It's false equivalency. At one point in history humankind couldn't explain germ theory or natural disasters or even thunder storms. The default explanation was "god did it". We (well, most of us anyway) now know the basic causes of these phenomenon. But there are obviously current questions that we can't satisfactorily answer such as "How did the universe begin?" or "How did life start?" There are several theories for these kinds of questions ofcourse, some better than others. In my opinion, saying "god did it" doesn't satisfactorily answers questions like this. In fact, it simply stifles critical thinking and leads to even more absurd questions such as "Where then did god come from?".
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    Locke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDOE View Post
    Um, that would be the result of the moon's gravitational pull on the earth.

    What you are postulating is the "God of the gaps" concept. People/scientists can't explain x, therefore x somehow supports god or the supernatural. It's false equivalency. At one point in history humankind couldn't explain germ theory or natural disasters or even thunder storms. The default explanation was "god did it". We (well, most of us anyway) now know the basic causes of these phenomenon. But there are obviously current questions that we can't satisfactorily answer such as "How did the universe begin?" or "How did life start?" There are several theories for these kinds of questions ofcourse, some better than others. In my opinion, saying "god did it" doesn't satisfactorily answers questions like this. In fact, it simply stifles critical thinking and leads to even more absurd questions such as "Where then did god come from?".


    He is quoting Bill O'Reilly, which makes it funny, and also very very depressing at the same time...
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    (Tursiops)

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    Quote Originally Posted by emeraldfin View Post
    Is it really a mischaracterization? I understand it was a poor attempt by the OP to demonize Atheism, but if you dont believe in an after life/meaning to life, then is a humans life any more significant than that of an insects?
    The theist assumes being only has meaning with a "meaning giver" aka god. The question becomes does the meaning giver have to have meaning itself? If meaning needs an external meaning giver does god then have meaning? I would say that answer is no, what external to god gives god meaning? So humans have a meaning giver that has no meaning according to the theist. So I can (as a meaningless being) give myself meaning, which then makes me meaningful. In the atheist worldview every meaning giver also has meaning. The only worldview that wouldn't have meaning is the theist worldview because the meaning giver is meaningless. One could say humans give god meaning. That would make god's meaning dependent on human existence. Do you want to say god is a dependent being?
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    God, in all forms from one to many is based on faith, not fact. Some want answers, others want logical answers. The divide is pretty much that simple. I remember when I was questioning the logical flow of the God construct as a teen, and my mom was pissed, not because I was right or wrong, but simply because I questioned. Whenever there is an ideology of non-questioning thought, expect man-made devices to be at the center......

    Quote Originally Posted by nyjunc View Post
    The Giants absolutely win it all w/ buttfumble and they probably have more playoff wins and playoff apps if buttfumble is their QB, we probably don't even make a title game w/ Eli the last 2 years........
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    Quote Originally Posted by emeraldfin View Post
    That's the key TBH. As you said, Atheism is based on evolutionary theory, whereas I would look at it from a philosophical perspective.
    Atheism has nothing to do with evolution. Evolution is a process, not a religion. Evolution could very well have been begun by some supernatural being, and perhaps even guided, though all evidence seems to dispute that. Atheism is merely the belief that there is no "God" that rules us and created us.

    I think many people, both theists and atheists, view this thing from the wrong angle. They view it as if the universe is external to them. That God is external to them. However, when you look at everything in totality from a critical point of view, the interconnectedness of the entire system becomes quite clear. God is not something external, not some guy in the sky making creatures in his shop, but rather, that this entire universe, and every spec of matter and energy, both animate and otherwise, IS God.

    Inside of each of you, there are cells and organs that have a particular role in the function of the whole organism comprising "you." Likewise, we, as conscious beings, have a particular role in the organism of God. We, conscious beings, are the "cells" that allow God, the universe, to experience itself.
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    TheWalrus's Avatar
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    Religious suffering is, at one and the same time, the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people.

    The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is the demand for their real happiness. To call on them to give up their illusions about their condition is to call on them to give up a condition that requires illusions. The criticism of religion is, therefore, in embryo, the criticism of that vale of tears of which religion is the halo.

    Criticism has plucked the imaginary flowers on the chain not in order that man shall continue to bear that chain without fantasy or consolation, but so that he shall throw off the chain and pluck the living flower.

    -- Karl Marx
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  9. -19
    Alter2Ego's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkapePhin View Post
    Atheism has nothing to do with evolution. Evolution is a process, not a religion. Evolution could very well have been begun by some supernatural being, and perhaps even guided, though all evidence seems to dispute that. Atheism is merely the belief that there is no "God" that rules us and created us.
    ALTER2EGO -to- SKAPE PHIN:
    I wouldn't be so sure about that, if I were you. Evolution is the atheist's explanation for the variety of life forms on planet earth. To put it simply, evolution is the atheists' god. That's why atheists argue tooth and nails over macroevolution theory--despite the fact there's no evidence to prove it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkapePhin View Post
    I think many people, both theists and atheists, view this thing from the wrong angle. They view it as if the universe is external to them. That God is external to them. However, when you look at everything in totality from a critical point of view, the interconnectedness of the entire system becomes quite clear. God is not something external, not some guy in the sky making creatures in his shop, but rather, that this entire universe, and every spec of matter and energy, both animate and otherwise, IS God.
    ALTER2EGO -to- SKAPE PHIN:
    That makes as much sense as saying that the house and the furniture within it are the man that built the house and put the furnishings inside it. Things that were created cannot equate to the person or the being that created them. Your argument fails.
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