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Thread: POFO Anything Goes Thread. ((Warning do not enter if you can't handle fire))

  1. -2661
    Spesh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob19 View Post
    I wouldn't belly-ache at Chance Warmack. Especially if we sign Wallace or Jennings in FA, & pick up maybe a Tyler Eifert with the early second rounder.

    I don't think there's any Julio Jones', Dez Bryant's, or A.J Green's in this draft anyway. Cordarrelle has some breath-taking highlights, but he's infinitely more risky than Warmack. If Warmack makes 10 pro-bowls he'll have been a damn fine choice.
    Value matters. Everyone agrees this is a good o-line draft class(wonder why Ireland loaded up on picks for this draft...hmm...) but by "good" many mean depth. I believe it was John Clayton who wrote about some of the general managers he talked to being in love with the potential of the 3rd, 4th, and 5th round of this years draft. An NFL.com article also shared that sentiment. Its plausable that we can get a talented playmaker at an important position and a pro-bowl worthy guard, instead of just one or the other.

    To be honest, all these discussions remind me of the 2011 draft. Sure, we walked out of there with Mike Pouncey and hes become arguably the best center in football. But the Raiders and Chiefs waited and wound up with some good centers in Rodney Hudson and Stefen Wisniewski. Did we get the better player? Sure. But the other teams improved their teams more(or would have had the Raiders not traded their pick away) then we did and still filled their holes.

    Filling a need isnt good enough anymore. Especially when we have other positions of need that are significantly more difficult to find. You can get competent guards in later rounds. By and large you cannot get pass rushers, gamebreaking wideouts, or shutdown corners in later rounds. Not to mention guards are more likely to hit free agency than any of those positions. When building a team you have to take risks, and i think Miami fans are uniquely qualified to judge the "safe" building method.
    "Ignorance is not an excuse" were the words Goodell used when describing why those involved in the Saints bounty scandal would not avoid punishment.
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  2. -2662
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    They looked like strong hands.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rob19 View Post
    I wouldn't belly-ache at Chance Warmack. Especially if we sign Wallace or Jennings in FA, & pick up maybe a Tyler Eifert with the early second rounder.

    I don't think there's any Julio Jones', Dez Bryant's, or A.J Green's in this draft anyway. Cordarrelle has some breath-taking highlights, but he's infinitely more risky than Warmack. If Warmack makes the next 10 pro-bowls he'll have been a damn fine choice.
    Normally I'd say go BPA, period. But our offense is such a joke, I simply don't see how we cannot go skill position early, unless we got pass rush/corner. We can blame that on Ireland. How he has managed to leave us with this joke of an offense is beyond me. It's still biting us in the ass. This draft is DEEP for OL. A team like the Colts is going to come out with 2 legit starters on the OL before the end of day 2, because they already have some skill players on the roster. Us? We're going to be forced to reach for WRs so that we don't totally kill the growth of our young QB. The man can spot talent, but he has got the most ass-backwards position value system I've seen...

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    Re: POFO Anything Goes Thread. ((Warning do not enter if you can't handle fire))

    So much if this draft is going to depend on free agency and the holes we fill...or create. There are a ton of combinations available that could produce results with our wealth of available money and picks. Hopefully, Ireland puts together a very solid mix that anchors our team for a decade or so.

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  4. -2664
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    Don't get me wrong, I like Cordarrelle, & wouldn't at all be disappointed with the pick, but I also wouldn't have a problem with Warmack either.

    It's not like there's a be-all, end-all blue-print for drafting successfully. The 9'ers took 3 first round offensive linemen in a span of 4 years (including a guard) & they were in the Superbowl this past year.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spesh View Post
    Filling a need isnt good enough anymore. Especially when we have other positions of need that are significantly more difficult to find. You can get competent guards in later rounds. By and large you cannot get pass rushers, gamebreaking wideouts, or shutdown corners in later rounds. Not to mention guards are more likely to hit free agency than any of those positions. When building a team you have to take risks, and i think Miami fans are uniquely qualified to judge the "safe" building method.
    I don't know that I agree with that. I haven't done any research on it, but I'd bet the success rate for wideouts or passrushers being productive in later rounds isn't any lower than it is for guards, centers, or tackles (especially tackles). The two top-money receivers in this free-agent class are after all non-first rounders; Greg Jennings was a second round pick & Wallace was a third.
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  5. -2665
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    They looked like strong hands.

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    I still say go BPA. The phins aren't exactly ready to make a superbowl run so I don't think they NEED to fill all their needs in one off season. Nor do I want the FO to try if it means overpaying free agents or making big reaches in the draft. Keep adding talent and building this team up the right way.

    The only caveat I'd add is that I think they need to get Tannehill at least one new weapon, ideally someone who can get some yac.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob19 View Post
    Don't get me wrong, I like Cordarrelle, & wouldn't at all be disappointed with the pick, but I also wouldn't have a problem with Warmack either.

    It's not like there's a be-all, end-all blue-print for drafting successfully. The 9'ers took 3 first round offensive linemen in a span of 4 years (including a guard) & they were in the Superbowl this past year.



    I don't know that I agree with that. I haven't done any research on it, but I'd bet the success rate for wideouts or passrushers being productive in later rounds isn't any lower than it is for guards, centers, or tackles (especially tackles). The two top-money receivers in this free-agent class are after all non-first rounders; Greg Jennings was a second round pick & Wallace was a third.
    SF also took WRs, TEs, and pass rushers in the first round and didn't bust on most of their other picks and FA signings. There may not be a set blueprint to winning, but the one we're using clearly isn't working.

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  8. -2668
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob19 View Post
    Don't get me wrong, I like Cordarrelle, & wouldn't at all be disappointed with the pick, but I also wouldn't have a problem with Warmack either.

    It's not like there's a be-all, end-all blue-print for drafting successfully. The 9'ers took 3 first round offensive linemen in a span of 4 years (including a guard) & they were in the Superbowl this past year.

    I don't know that I agree with that. I haven't done any research on it, but I'd bet the success rate for wideouts or passrushers being productive in later rounds isn't any lower than it is for guards, centers, or tackles (especially tackles). The two top-money receivers in this free-agent class are after all non-first rounders; Greg Jennings was a second round pick & Wallace was a third.
    Yet the 9'ers also struggled until they got competent quarterback play, that play was helped significantly by the weapons of that offense. Though i get the point of your example.

    Research on the topic would be subjective and therefore difficult to accomplish, though ive read interesting articles on similar subjects. How would you judge the "success"? Would Hartline, a 4th round pick, be as much of a success as Calvin Johnson? Greg Little as much of a hit as Julio Jones? Numbers wise, receivers would probably have more hits in the later rounds than the first. Quality would be the question.

    I feel alot more confident about my stance on passrusher than wideout though, even "hit" rate. Apparently defensive lineman have a large bust rate. Surprising because one would think their could be a use for those who dont fill the job you drafted them for(example: if you couldnt rush the passer you could at least stop the run, cant stop the run you could clog the lanes) but supposedly thats not the case. Thats one of the reasons why passrushers go very quick and then drop in the draft. Teams are very hesitant to take flawed defensive ends, which is why teams like the Vikings reap the rewards of the Everson Griffens.

    Again, research on this topic would be difficult for a variety of reasons, but one overwhelmingly important one: interior lineman dont get often go high in the first round. Youd be hard pressed to find a better guard prospect than David DeCastro, but he fell all the way to the Steelers last year. Because there is a importance on certain positions, guards fall, while anything involving quarterbacks go high(be a quarterback, hit a quarterback, protect a quarterback, score for a quarterback...).

    I tried to dig up some articles ive read in the past involving similar stuff, but for the life of me couldnt find anything that looked familiar. Did stumble across this though:

    http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/...truly-valuable

    According to that story, value wise o-lineman and wideout are roughly the same, though the "hit" was judged by if they start.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Locke View Post
    I mentioned my ideal heaven in the Religion forum and Statler seemed none-too-pleased. Apparently doing jaeger bombs with angels and high-fiving the pearly gate guards is blasphemy...?
    If god didnt want jaeger bombs he shouldnt have made the drink that awesome. If Statler is disagreeing, it sounds like hes blaspheming, not you.
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  10. -2670
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    Great teams have good players at all positions and great players at important positions. Guard is not an important position. Wide receiver was not an important position in years past but it's becoming one now, taking the place of running back, which is fading into a not important position.

    Finding great players at important positions is hard. Barring luck (which all great teams have), the only place to find them is at the top of the draft.
    When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.
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