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Thread: James Holmes confirmed to be an atheist

  1. -61
    irish fin fan's Avatar
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    Ah, there are posts in this thread with the same sort of holier than thou attitude that my grandmother used to have. She still had the same church can do no wrong attitude when the stories of child rape by priests came out. Only the brain washed follow this nonsense.
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    Quote Originally Posted by irish fin fan View Post
    Ah, there are posts in this thread with the same sort of holier than thou attitude that my grandmother used to have. She still had the same church can do no wrong attitude when the stories of child rape by priests came out. Only the brain washed follow this nonsense.


    You see, you’ve totally missed the points I’ve made…

    1. As a non-believer you cannot even define a logically defensible definition of what makes an act right or wrong, so pointing to acts and calling them “wrong” is utterly meaningless and only refutes your own position.
    2. The fact that any professing Christian has done something wrong in their life is completely irrelevant. Christianity can be absolutely true and there can be professing Christians making mistakes at the same time, they are not mutually exclusive events.

    The truth of the matter is that you’d rather discuss such an irrelevant point than actually attempt to defend your stance as a non-believer, I don’t blame you one bit, if I were a non-believer I’d be trying to do the same thing because it’d be the only card I could play.
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  3. -63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Statler Waldorf View Post
    A person’s view on theism is their most fundamental belief. It affects every other belief in their belief system. If a person doesn’t believe god exists, it completely changes the way they view themselves, others, morality, life, death, justice, suffering, purpose, and the list goes on and on. So to say Stalin’s atheism didn’t directly affect his action is imply absurd.
    Maybe it is for you. It's certainly not for me. My belief in God has fluctuated greatly throughout my life. I have been extremely committed, and I have been extremely skeptical. Meanwhile, my moral and ethical beliefs have not fluctuated very much. If anything, becoming more skeptical of God and an afterlife leads me to disdain injustice even more.

    Quote Originally Posted by Statler Waldorf View Post
    It’s simple, when an atheist murders someone he is acting in a manner that is completely consistent with his atheism, man is just another animal, or even just glorified pond scum, so one man destroying another is completely meaningless. When a professing Christian murders someone he is acting in a manner that is completely contrary to his professed belief system. Christ taught that murder was wrong and that man was made in the image of God and had a level of dignity not found in any other living creature. So the murderous Christian is actually rebelling against Christ, which really doesn’t make him a Christian now does it?
    Religious rates and murder rates don't even directly correlate, so I don't know how you can try to claim a causal relationship.
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    Statler Waldorf's Avatar
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    Maybe it is for you. It's certainly not for me. My belief in God has fluctuated greatly throughout my life. I have been extremely committed, and I have been extremely skeptical. Meanwhile, my moral and ethical beliefs have not fluctuated very much. If anything, becoming more skeptical of God and an afterlife leads me to disdain injustice even more.


    Well we were discussing Stalin, not you or me. Injustice? How do you determine whether something is just or not?


    Religious rates and murder rates don't even directly correlate, so I don't know how you can try to claim a causal relationship.


    Huh? Where did I say anything about a causal relationship? I was merely pointing out who was acting consistently in regards to their worldview and who was acting inconsistently.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Statler Waldorf View Post

    Well we were discussing Stalin, not you or me. Injustice? How do you determine whether something is just or not?
    By our own moral compass. It just so happens that most people have similar morals for the most part. Its a part of our evolution. We, like many other animals, learned to peacefully coexist with one another and to do that you have to have a sense of right and wrong.




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    Quote Originally Posted by tylerdolphin View Post
    By our own moral compass. It just so happens that most people have similar morals for the most part. Its a part of our evolution. We, like many other animals, learned to peacefully coexist with one another and to do that you have to have a sense of right and wrong.
    So in Saudi Arabia where they feel it is just to kill a homosexual for being gay we are seeing justice in action?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Statler Waldorf View Post
    So in Saudi Arabia where they feel it is just to kill a homosexual for being gay we are seeing justice in action?
    Interesting argument, considering that Saudi Arabia is one of the most devout countries in the middle east...

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    TheWalrus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Statler Waldorf View Post
    So in Saudi Arabia where they feel it is just to kill a homosexual for being gay we are seeing justice in action?
    Can poop be empirically said to smell bad? Yes or no.
    Last edited by TheWalrus; 08-23-2012 at 08:21 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Statler Waldorf View Post

    Well we were discussing Stalin, not you or me. Injustice? How do you determine whether something is just or not?
    You made a general statement about theism and how it affects a person's viewpoint in order to make your claim about Stalin.

    How do I determine whether something is just or not? I use reason.


    Quote Originally Posted by Statler Waldorf View Post
    Huh? Where did I say anything about a causal relationship? I was merely pointing out who was acting consistently in regards to their worldview and who was acting inconsistently.
    You're implying that it is a causal relationship, but let me rephrase my point. You claim that atheists view humans as just another animal. And thus the destruction of one animal by another is meaningless.

    Firstly, your premise is questionable because one can view human life as more valuable than others without the presence of religion. Attributes such as sentience and reason distinguish humans from animals. But even if we accept your premise that doesn't mean an atheist must view the destruction of a person (or animal) as meaningless. He/she can view destruction of any life as a generally negative thing. Or he/she can hold the destruction of other people as something that is incompatible with a functioning society.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Statler Waldorf View Post
    So in Saudi Arabia where they feel it is just to kill a homosexual for being gay we are seeing justice in action?
    I suppose in their mind its just, but its definitely against my moral code and many others who dont subscribe to their muslim laws. Way to make your point though about how we need religion for morals.
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