Don't make your assumption a fact. You don't know and you can't know if Irish was trying to invoke Nazi Germany with that comment.
If that comment is glib, stupid and utterly ****ing ridiculous I leave for others to decide.
I find it utterly ridiculous though to trash Irish for using a political ideology while the right is throwing around the words socialism and communism freely. I don't see your uproar there.
Germany used Nazism in a way the former USSR used the word socialism. In both countries killing for political purpose was on the daily agenda. In both countries millions of people died in an ideological , domestic war. What took in the USSR decades happened in Germany in a relative short span. Neither was politically what they claimed to be.
Americans don't know any socialism or communism unless it is associated with countries (regardless if they are or not) like Cuba, the former USSR, maybe Venezuela, the former North Vietnam and North Korea. Socialism and communism in the minds of Americans is indoctrination, imprisonment, killing for political purposes, no free speech, no human rights, no justice.
If - under your assumption that Irish was automatically invoking Nazi Germany because America doesn't know any better - a right winger uses the words 'socialist', 'socialism', 'communist' and 'communism' to describe a liberal and/or the President why aren't you outraged then?
Believe it or not, this part of Finheaven isnt intended for finger pointing and name calling. Its made for discussions. Granted, name calling and finger pointing have become the norm, but when it gets out of hand people get banned. Why anyone wants to become the next SnakeOilSalesman or CashinFist is beyond me.
Throwing around names like Nazi, Socialist, or Communist is not for discussional purposes. Its to make people angry and defensive, which makes rational discussions impossible. How you choose to deal with those intellectually incapable of doing anything but that is your own prerogative. Personally, i recommend mockery. This is just my lay opinion, im not a mod and cant make policy. That said, all of it is getting really tiring and the Anything Goes thread is getting less and less use for its intended purpose. To me, the solution to both problems is obvious.
IMO besides throwing around terms like socialist, communist, Nazi and whatever the misquoting, using partial quotes or adding false information to somebody's post or using assumptions on someone's intention is throwing discussions into the crap hole just as well.
I personally don't care if any of these terms are being thrown around. Someone could call me a Nazi, a socialist, a communist or whatever. I have a thick skin and when people call me these things I know they run out of arguments and I just simply smile.
Now if your last sentence is indicating that you would/could leave (I am assuming) I put the virtual chain on you and tie you up here. No way Jose.
You don't seem to know very much about the Nazis or the history of Nazism.Originally Posted by phins_4_ever
Nazism is synonymous with Germany because it was invented there. Originally the Nazis were simply one of many political parties in Germany and were called the German Workers Party. But in the aftermath of the humiliation of WWI, their brand of virulent nationalism struck a chord with the German public, and with Hitler as their inspirational leader began to gather steam in the 1920s.
It was Hitler himself who changed the name of the German Workers Party to the National Socialist German Workers Party, the German name for which was abbreviated NSDAP, or Nazi for short.
So you see what I mean by this all being a very silly argument you're making? When you reference the Nazis, people do not sit there and wonder what that means. It's clear. Even irish fin fan hasn't thrown his weight behind suggestion of yours that he could have been talking about any number of other Nazis.
Because it's not equivalent. Socialism is a political philosophy. What happened in Russia, in China, in Cambodia and in several other places was an obvious and deliberate adaptation of that idea (which had been adapted into Marxism and then into Marxism-Leninism) that took many forms in many different countries.If - under your assumption that Irish was automatically invoking Nazi Germany because America doesn't know any better - a right winger uses the words 'socialist', 'socialism', 'communist' and 'communism' to describe a liberal and/or the President why aren't you outraged then?
When a right winger says Obama is a socialist, can anybody really be so dense as to assume they're only referring to Stalism, for instance, and not the quite different Maoism, which was different again from the Khymer Rogue, or Mussolini, or Castro, or Tito, or the various Kims of North Korea?
It's vague. That's why people when people hear "socialism" or "communism", what they think of is a totalitarian nanny state, without property rights, ruled by a cult of personality. That's what they assume about Obama, not that he's going to kill everyone who wears glasses (since that implies you have an education) as the Khymer Rogue did.
Nazism, on the other hand, refers to one country, with one philosophy, that is guilty of many clearly defined acts, including genocide. If you refer to it, you invoke not just a philosophy but those acts. The same would be true of calling someone a Stalinist, which also refers to a particular country at a particular time and therefore particular acts. To compare such unspeakable atrocities to a conspiracy theory about a jobs report is ridiculous. It's ignorant. It demeans history.
Last edited by TheWalrus; 10-07-2012 at 03:45 AM.
The only difference between communism ans fascism is semantics.