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Thread: Gotta be honest.....

  1. -41
    The New Guy's Avatar
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    You have not made a case. Everything you have said is not true.



    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    When I said "clock stops when whistle blows" I didn't mean 'clock stopped when whistle blew'. The clock stops only after the whistle is blown. And the whistle blew a good 2-3 seconds after the clock had stopped. Watch the play and please stop talking about 6.3 seconds...yet again. We are not talking about how long the play took. We are talking about when the clock stopped.
    This is not true, and I proved it by quoting the rulebook. Here it is again for you:

    The game clock operator shall stop the game clock (timeout) upon a signal by any official or upon the operator’s own positive
    knowledge:
    Where does it say that the clock only stops when the whistle blows? It says "Upon a signal" which includes waving of the arms.

    How long the entire play last is very important. There were 2:06 seconds on the clock, and you say the clock should have gone to 2:00, meaning all 6 seconds passed in full. You claim that the whistle blew 2-3 seconds after the clock had stopped. There are several problems with that. First, you have no clue when the clock actually stopped. (I do and will show you below) You can see it move to 2:01 and think that it stopped, but you have no clue how many tenths ran off before the clock was stopped. When the clock hits 2:01, all 10-tenths of that second have to pass before the clock moves to 2:00. We have 9-tenths of a second (nearly a full second) where we don't know when the clock actually stopped. It could have been stopped as soon as it hit 2:01, or maybe it didn't get stopped until it was about to change to 2:00 (5.9 seconds pass)

    Here is how we can know. It can be proven when it was stopped by watching the next play. If it was stopped as soon as it his 2:01, then nearly a full second would have to go by on the next play before the clock changed to 2:00. If you watch the next play, the clock changes to 2:00 as soon as the ball is snapped to Tebow. This proves that the clock was stopped right before it was going to change to 2:00. (5.9 seconds)

    You say that the whistle came 2-3 seconds after the clock stopped. That is impossible. I just proved that the clock was stopped after 5.9 seconds, and we know that we heard the whistle after 6.3 seconds. That is a difference of 4-tenths of a second, not 2 to 3 seconds.



    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    Yes, but the ref raised his hand to wave and inhaled a breathe at the same time, and then blew the whistle. The whole process? Maybe one fourth of a second before the whistle blows.
    So you are saying that it takes at least 2-tenths of a second (2.5 tenths is 1/4 of a second) to inhale and blow the whistle? Good! Now we are only 2-tenths away from the clock reading 2:01.




    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    No, u can easily see the ref when he starts to wave his hand.
    Unless you have a different shot of it, this is also not true. The Ref is not in the shot and we only see a hand in the bottom left of the screen.

    http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/7395/kickoff5.jpg

    We know that is not when he started since his hand is up in the air when we first see it in the video. He was out of the shot and is walking towards the players when we first see his hand in the air. He has to bring it up from his side to wave it in the air. It is very reasonable to assume that he started doing that at least 2-tenths of a second sooner then what we can see in the video. Remember, you agree that we can see him waving his arms at least 2-tenths of a second before we heard the whistle.

    Just put all the evidence together.

    #1. There was 2:06 on the clock, and from the time he enters the field of play to the time we hear the whistle blow is only 6.3 seconds.
    #2. We know the official was waving his arms before we heard the whistle blow.
    #3. We know 5.9 seconds ran off the clock since the clock immediately changed to 2:00 (as soon as the ball was snapped) on the next play.
    #4. The pictures show the Jets having possession and being touched down before the official is seen waving his arms.


    There is no evidence to prove that the clock should have gone to 2:00. There is plenty of evidence to prove why it should have stopped at 2:01.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    Im sure u agree with junc on everything. Players reaction is the FIRST clue after the play.
    Then you would probably argue that Holmes is interfered with on every play. The reaction of the player means nothing to me. I go on what the rules are and what I see. Wilson interfered with Hernandez. Me and Junc very rarely agree, so if we both see something the same way, it is most likely accurate.
    Last edited by The New Guy; 10-26-2012 at 03:22 PM.
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  2. -42
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    I like your style Dude

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    Tannehill 171972 Dolphins Logo2013 Dolphins Logo
    Quote Originally Posted by nyjunc View Post
    but that rookie was in the same system he played in at A&M which was a HUGE advantage for him. Mark's first game he was excellent playing in the same building.
    Well buttfumble is the best QB in the league and Tannehill, ha, what's he thinking having a tough first game of his NFL career? J.J. Watt is awful, what an overrated hack he is. Why couldn't Tannehill be more like the fabulous buttfumble?
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  3. -43
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    I like your style Dude

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    Tannehill 171972 Dolphins Logo2013 Dolphins Logo
    they missed the playoffs by one game, if they beat us week 1 they would have made the playoffs.
    This is the same exact **** you cried about when people said the Dolphins could have been 5-1 at this point. Why would Houston have gone to the playoffs if they won in Week 1? You think it's so easy to just assume the rest of the year would've played out the same exact way had the first game been different?
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  4. -44
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhinzN703 View Post
    This is the same exact **** you cried about when people said the Dolphins could have been 5-1 at this point. Why would Houston have gone to the playoffs if they won in Week 1? You think it's so easy to just assume the rest of the year would've played out the same exact way had the first game been different?
    they missed by 1 game, we beat them. if they win maybe the season doesn't play out the same- maybe the win 2 or 3 more games? who knows? but what we do know is they missed by one game on a tiebreaker to us b/c we beat them.
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  5. -45
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    Quote Originally Posted by The New Guy View Post
    You have not made a case. Everything you have said is not true.
    Its all true.

    This is not true, and I proved it by quoting the rulebook. Here it is again for you:
    The clock stopped way before the ref signaled.

    Where does it say that the clock only stops when the whistle blows? It says "Upon a signal" which includes waving of the arms.
    Waving of the arm and whistle were almost simultaneous, not three seconds apart.

    How long the entire play last is very important.
    No its not. We are talking about when the clock stops. I could care less what happened before that.

    There were 2:06 seconds on the clock, and you say the clock should have gone to 2:00, meaning all 6 seconds passed in full. You claim that the whistle blew 2-3 seconds after the clock had stopped. There are several problems with that. First, you have no clue when the clock actually stopped. (I do and will show you below) You can see it move to 2:01 and think that it stopped, but you have no clue how many tenths ran off before the clock was stopped. When the clock hits 2:01, all 10-tenths of that second have to pass before the clock moves to 2:00. We have 9-tenths of a second (nearly a full second) where we don't know when the clock actually stopped. It could have been stopped as soon as it hit 2:01, or maybe it didn't get stopped until it was about to change to 2:00 (5.9 seconds pass)
    Again, a whistle is what calls the play dead. Without a whistle, players don't know if play is dead. The whistle blew three seconds after the clock had stopped. Maybe the clock didn't stop on 2:01. Maybe it stopped at 2:00:20. Then the whistle blew TWO seconds after.

    Here is how we can know. It can be proven when it was stopped by watching the next play. If it was stopped as soon as it his 2:01, then nearly a full second would have to go by on the next play before the clock changed to 2:00. If you watch the next play, the clock changes to 2:00 as soon as the ball is snapped to Tebow. This proves that the clock was stopped right before it was going to change to 2:00. (5.9 seconds)
    Wrong again. We were never arguing over two tenths of a second.

    You say that the whistle came 2-3 seconds after the clock stopped. That is impossible. I just proved that the clock was stopped after 5.9 seconds, and we know that we heard the whistle after 6.3 seconds. That is a difference of 4-tenths of a second, not 2 to 3 seconds.
    You are wrong again. Let me prove it to you in ur words. If the play took 6.3 seconds then from 2:06:00 minus 6:3 seconds is 1:59:70.

    If the clocks shows 2:01, does it mean it might be 2:00:2? As in 2 tenths of a second away from 2 minute warning?
    If yes, then 2:06 can be anywhere between 2:05:01 to 2:06:00. Agreed? Now do the math and deduct 6.3 seconds from 2:06, the most time remaining on that sixth second possible. You also have to consider the operators reaction time, which is about one tenth of a second to say the least so even the 5.9 second bs is wrong.

    So you are saying that it takes at least 2-tenths of a second (2.5 tenths is 1/4 of a second) to inhale and blow the whistle? Good! Now we are only 2-tenths away from the clock reading 2:01.
    Either way you slice, 3 seconds can not be cut down to .2 to .4 seconds u claim.

    Unless you have a different shot of it, this is also not true. The Ref is not in the shot and we only see a hand in the bottom left of the screen.
    Yes, hes not in the screen, but when he waves his hand, its easy to tell he was right there just outside the visible area and the moment he waved his hand, it showed up in the screen. You have to use judgement, which I know you won't cuz ur stuck with ur made up 4 tenths of a second bs.

    #1. There was 2:06 on the clock, and from the time he enters the field of play to the time we hear the whistle blow is only 6.3 seconds.
    #2. We know the official was waving his arms before we heard the whistle blow.
    #3. We know 5.9 seconds ran off the clock since the clock immediately changed to 2:00 (as soon as the ball was snapped) on the next play.
    #4. The pictures show the Jets having possession and being touched down before the official is seen waving his arms.

    There is no evidence to prove that the clock should have gone to 2:00. There is plenty of evidence to prove why it should have stopped at 2:01.
    Yes, there is more than enough evidence to prove the clock should have stopped at 1:59 to say the least. Here is the proof. Watch the replay of the recovery from another angle. You will see the Jets player didn't have full control of the ball when the returner touched him. The angle you can see this is shown after Jets first down play when clock stops at 1:56 for the 2-min warning.

    Then you would probably argue that Holmes is interfered with on every play. The reaction of the player means nothing to me. I go on what the rules are and what I see. Wilson interfered with Hernandez. Me and Junc very rarely agree, so if we both see something the same way, it is most likely accurate.
    I never said players reaction is what should be considered a PI. But if PI truly occurred, the WR will ask for a flag...generally speaking. A few plays later, the same player was begging for a flag against the same defender. I wonder why he was begging for the flag on that play and not on one of the most crucial play of that drive? And u agreeing with Junc has no meaning. WVDolphin agrees with me, does that mean me and him are also correct? How can two people have different view of the same play, yet both be right? You don't make any sense when u say junc agrees with u so you must be right. You should visit theganggreen.com and see how many of us disagree with Junc on several things.

    You still fail to get the point. Point is, Jets had every opportunity to win that game. They couldn't. Refs made some bad calls, but they were not the reason Jets lost.
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  6. -46
    The New Guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    The clock stopped way before the ref signaled.
    No, it didn't. Do you agree that the clock should have stopped when the whistle blew? If yes, then you are whining over 4-tenths of a second. From the time he enters the field of play to the time the whistle blows is only 6.3 seconds. There was 2:06 on the clock when the play started, which means 5.9 seconds can pass and the clock would read 2:01. That is exactly what happened. You are whining over 4-tenths when the whistle blew. We know the official was signaling the play dead at least 2-tenths before he blew the whistle, and it is clear that he had possession and was down by contact at least 4-tenths before the whistle blew.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    Waving of the arm and whistle were almost simultaneous, not three seconds apart.
    Who said anything about 3 seconds apart? I said at least 2-tenths and you said 1/4 of a second which is 2.5 tenths. So, we agree on at least 2-tenths of a second.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    No its not. We are talking about when the clock stops. I could care less what happened before that.
    You already agreed that the clock started when it should have, and we know how long the play took until the whistle blew. (6.3 seconds) If the clock reads 2:06, and the whistle blew 6.3 seconds after the clock started, it is impossible for the whistle to have come 2-3 seconds after the clock had stopped and the clock to read 2:01. Even if it stopped as soon as it turned to 2:01, the most it could be is 1.3 seconds. 6.3 seconds minus 5 seconds (2:06 to 2:01) = 1.3 seconds.

    I already proved that we know it didn't stop as soon as it hit 2:01 because it immediately changed to 2:00 on the next play.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    Again, a whistle is what calls the play dead. Without a whistle, players don't know if play is dead. The whistle blew three seconds after the clock had stopped. Maybe the clock didn't stop on 2:01. Maybe it stopped at 2:00:20. Then the whistle blew TWO seconds after.
    We are not talking about the players. We are talking about when the game clock operator is supposed to stop the clock. He is looking for the officials signal, not listening for a whistle. Did you not read the quote from the rule book that I posted?

    We know the clock stopped closer to 2:00:10 (It would actually be 2:01.01 since the clock is counting backwards, but I know what you mean) by watching the next play when it immediately changes to 2:00. This means that the clock can stop after 5.9 seconds and still read 2:01. You can hear the whistle blow at 6.3 seconds. 6.3 seconds minus 5.9 seconds = 0.4 seconds. Not 2 or 3 seconds like you keep saying.



    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    Wrong again. We were never arguing over two tenths of a second.
    We absolutely are. The clock read 2:06 and we heard the whistle after 6.3 seconds. That is 4-tenths away from the clock reading 2:01. We saw the official waving his arms at least 2-tenths before that, so you are really whining over 2-tenths of a second. It is easy to tell that he had possession and was down by contact long before the whistle came, but even if you want to take it to the whistle, the clock stopped only 4-tenths of a second before the whistle blew. 4-tenths is not getting screwed like you guys keep whining about.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    You are wrong again. Let me prove it to you in ur words. If the play took 6.3 seconds then from 2:06:00 minus 6:3 seconds is 1:59:70.

    If the clocks shows 2:01, does it mean it might be 2:00:2? As in 2 tenths of a second away from 2 minute warning?
    If yes, then 2:06 can be anywhere between 2:05:01 to 2:06:00. Agreed? Now do the math and deduct 6.3 seconds from 2:06, the most time remaining on that sixth second possible. You also have to consider the operators reaction time, which is about one tenth of a second to say the least so even the 5.9 second bs is wrong.
    No, I am not wrong, and no we don't agree. You made a critical error. 2:06 could potentially be anywhere from 2:06.01 to 2:06.99. If it was at 2:06:00, the clock would have immediately changed to 2:05 as soon as he enters the field of play on the KO return. You are trying to skip a full second.

    2:06.99 minus 6.3 seconds is 2:00.69, which is 4-tenths away from the clock reading 2:01. We know it was 2:06.99 by watching the play before the KO fumble. It was the Jets FG attempt to tie the game. The clock was at 2:11 before the attempt, and the official is giving the signal as soon as it changes to 2:06. The football actually hits the back of the net at the end of the 2:07.00 mark. So we know there should be 2:06.99 on the clock for the next play. That means 5.9 seconds can easily pass and the clock would still read 2:01. We heard the whistle after 6.3 seconds, so again, the difference is only 4-tenths of a second when we heard the whistle.

    We already know that the play was being signaled dead before we heard the whistle, so again we are actually talking about 2-tenths of a second.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    Either way you slice, 3 seconds can not be cut down to .2 to .4 seconds u claim.
    This is proven to be incorrect above. It is 2-tenths, and it is impossible for it to be 3 seconds.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    Yes, hes not in the screen, but when he waves his hand, its easy to tell he was right there just outside the visible area and the moment he waved his hand, it showed up in the screen. You have to use judgement, which I know you won't cuz ur stuck with ur made up 4 tenths of a second bs.
    How is it easy to tell when we can not see him? How do we know he was just outside the visible area and not further away? There is nothing made up about 4-tenths. What is made up is the 2-3 seconds you keep saying. Get a stop watch and time the play for yourself. I have no faith in you coming up with the correct time, but it is 6.3 seconds to the time we actually hear the whistle. There was 2:06.99 on the clock and 5.9 of it ran off. 6.3 minus 5.9 = .04.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    Yes, there is more than enough evidence to prove the clock should have stopped at 1:59 to say the least. Here is the proof. Watch the replay of the recovery from another angle. You will see the Jets player didn't have full control of the ball when the returner touched him. The angle you can see this is shown after Jets first down play when clock stops at 1:56 for the 2-min warning.
    It is impossible for the clock to have reached 1:59 when it started at 2:06 and we heard the whistle after 6.3 seconds. I'm not saying he had possession and was ruled down as soon as the clock turned to 2:01. I am saying that it was well in to the 2:01 second (2:01.10 counting down right before it was going to change to 2:00) when possession was determined. This shot is a 5.5 seconds:

    http://imageshack.us/a/img42/8266/kickoff3e.jpg

    He clearly has possession at that point and is touched down. The clock would still read 2:01 at that point. The clock operator still has another 4-tenths of a second after that shot to stop the clock and it would still read 2:01. You can't honestly tell me that if NE had stripped the ball away after the above photo, that you would not be arguing that he already had possession and was touched down. You know you would be, and I would as well because it is easy to tell.

    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    I never said players reaction is what should be considered a PI. But if PI truly occurred, the WR will ask for a flag...generally speaking. A few plays later, the same player was begging for a flag against the same defender. I wonder why he was begging for the flag on that play and not on one of the most crucial play of that drive? And u agreeing with Junc has no meaning. WVDolphin agrees with me, does that mean me and him are also correct? How can two people have different view of the same play, yet both be right? You don't make any sense when u say junc agrees with u so you must be right. You should visit theganggreen.com and see how many of us disagree with Junc on several things.
    I have no idea what goes through a players mind. I do know the rules and what I see though. It was PI. Me and Junc agreeing that it was pass interference is meaningless. I only said that because Junc is a big Jets fan. He has no reason to say it was PI if it was not. You as a bias Jets fan do. Me and Junc and you and WV can not all be right. Obviously, you and WV are wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    You still fail to get the point. Point is, Jets had every opportunity to win that game. They couldn't. Refs made some bad calls, but they were not the reason Jets lost.
    I fully understand that point and said the same thing many times. That is not what I am debating. I am debating that the correct calls were made. I don't like to hear whining and claims of getting screwed when they are simply not true.
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  7. -47
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    Quote Originally Posted by The New Guy View Post
    No, it didn't. Do you agree that the clock should have stopped when the whistle blew? If yes, then you are whining over 4-tenths of a second. From the time he enters the field of play to the time the whistle blows is only 6.3 seconds. There was 2:06 on the clock when the play started, which means 5.9 seconds can pass and the clock would read 2:01. That is exactly what happened. You are whining over 4-tenths when the whistle blew. We know the official was signaling the play dead at least 2-tenths before he blew the whistle, and it is clear that he had possession and was down by contact at least 4-tenths before the whistle blew.
    No and no, and Im not gonna continue to be repetitive.

    Who said anything about 3 seconds apart? I said at least 2-tenths and you said 1/4 of a second which is 2.5 tenths. So, we agree on at least 2-tenths of a second.
    YOU are whining over the tenths of this and tenths of that. not me. Im claiming seconds.

    You already agreed that the clock started when it should have, and we know how long the play took until the whistle blew. (6.3 seconds) If the clock reads 2:06, and the whistle blew 6.3 seconds after the clock started, it is impossible for the whistle to have come 2-3 seconds after the clock had stopped and the clock to read 2:01. Even if it stopped as soon as it turned to 2:01, the most it could be is 1.3 seconds. 6.3 seconds minus 5 seconds (2:06 to 2:01) = 1.3 seconds.
    Whistle comes at 6.9 seconds, now that I have the game on my pc and playing it on VLC. 6.3 seconds is ur figure.

    We are not talking about the players. We are talking about when the game clock operator is supposed to stop the clock. He is looking for the officials signal, not listening for a whistle. Did you not read the quote from the rule book that I posted?
    How do u know he wasn't listening for the whistle and only looking for the signal?

    We know the clock stopped closer to 2:00:10 (It would actually be 2:01.01 since the clock is counting backwards, but I know what you mean) by watching the next play when it immediately changes to 2:00. This means that the clock can stop after 5.9 seconds and still read 2:01. You can hear the whistle blow at 6.3 seconds. 6.3 seconds minus 5.9 seconds = 0.4 seconds. Not 2 or 3 seconds like you keep saying.
    Wrong. 15:00 means the clock can be anywhere between 14:59:01-15:00:00. It doesn't mean it has between 15:00:00 to 15:00:99, obviously. Just look at any first play of any quarter. Clock doesn't tick to 14:59 until after a second. 14:59 means the clock less than 14 minutes and 59 seconds left on the clock. 2:06 means the clock is anywhere between 2:05:01 to 2:06:00. So deduct the 6.3 you claim (or the 6.1 from where the ref indicates the signal) and you have a 2 min warning. I counted 6.9 seconds till the whistle. Add in the reaction time and u have 7 full seconds. Compare that against the 5 seconds the clock ticked down and u have yourself a 2 second difference, the same difference I continued to talk about (2-3 seconds).

    We absolutely are. The clock read 2:06 and we heard the whistle after 6.3 seconds. That is 4-tenths away from the clock reading 2:01. We saw the official waving his arms at least 2-tenths before that, so you are really whining over 2-tenths of a second. It is easy to tell that he had possession and was down by contact long before the whistle came, but even if you want to take it to the whistle, the clock stopped only 4-tenths of a second before the whistle blew. 4-tenths is not getting screwed like you guys keep whining about.
    Read above. Im not whining. I already agreed that the Jets had their chances to win and that the bad call there wasn't the reason they lost.

    No, I am not wrong, and no we don't agree. You made a critical error. 2:06 could potentially be anywhere from 2:06.01 to 2:06.99. If it was at 2:06:00, the clock would have immediately changed to 2:05 as soon as he enters the field of play on the KO return. You are trying to skip a full second.
    Wrong, because 15:00 doesn't potentially mean from 15:00:01 to 15:00:99 in the NFL, although any countdown clock will disagree with it.

    2:06.99 minus 6.3 seconds is 2:00.69, which is 4-tenths away from the clock reading 2:01. We know it was 2:06.99 by watching the play before the KO fumble. It was the Jets FG attempt to tie the game. The clock was at 2:11 before the attempt, and the official is giving the signal as soon as it changes to 2:06. The football actually hits the back of the net at the end of the 2:07.00 mark. So we know there should be 2:06.99 on the clock for the next play. That means 5.9 seconds can easily pass and the clock would still read 2:01. We heard the whistle after 6.3 seconds, so again, the difference is only 4-tenths of a second when we heard the whistle.
    The ball crossed the goal post as soon as clock read 2:07. What took the operator to wait an entire second before hitting the stop button? The usual reaction time of looking at the refs signal or whistle.

    The rest of the entire theory is just proven wrong above about clock potentially being 2:06:99.

    We already know that the play was being signaled dead before we heard the whistle, so again we are actually talking about 2-tenths of a second.
    No, we are still talking about much more than a second.

    This is proven to be incorrect above. It is 2-tenths, and it is impossible for it to be 3 seconds.
    Repetitive.

    How is it easy to tell when we can not see him? How do we know he was just outside the visible area and not further away? There is nothing made up about 4-tenths. What is made up is the 2-3 seconds you keep saying. Get a stop watch and time the play for yourself. I have no faith in you coming up with the correct time, but it is 6.3 seconds to the time we actually hear the whistle. There was 2:06.99 on the clock and 5.9 of it ran off. 6.3 minus 5.9 = .04.
    Repetitive, and because judging by refs signal, he was not running towards the play. He was either standing still, or moving slowly towards the new LoS (moving alongside the camera angle). An earlier signal would have shown up earlier.

    It is impossible for the clock to have reached 1:59 when it started at 2:06 and we heard the whistle after 6.3 seconds. I'm not saying he had possession and was ruled down as soon as the clock turned to 2:01. I am saying that it was well in to the 2:01 second (2:01.10 counting down right before it was going to change to 2:00) when possession was determined. This shot is a 5.5 seconds:

    http://imageshack.us/a/img42/8266/kickoff3e.jpg

    He clearly has possession at that point and is touched down. The clock would still read 2:01 at that point. The clock operator still has another 4-tenths of a second after that shot to stop the clock and it would still read 2:01. You can't honestly tell me that if NE had stripped the ball away after the above photo, that you would not be arguing that he already had possession and was touched down. You know you would be, and I would as well because it is easy to tell.
    You must have missed the replay from another angle I told u about. U can not determine if the player had control of the ball or not by looking at a still picture. The ball was moving. Clock operator determined it wasn't, way beyond the refs determined. In such instances, clock operator generally takes his time to stop the clock. Many times we see as many as 10 seconds being taken off the clock before it stops. Its common, so please do not tell me you've never seen it happen.

    I have no idea what goes through a players mind. I do know the rules and what I see though. It was PI. Me and Junc agreeing that it was pass interference is meaningless. I only said that because Junc is a big Jets fan. He has no reason to say it was PI if it was not. You as a bias Jets fan do. Me and Junc and you and WV can not all be right. Obviously, you and WV are wrong.
    So I guess u and junc have the higher authority over who is wrong and who is right. However, Im pretty sure WV is biased against the Jets to some extent, yet he agrees with me. But again, he is doesn't have the higher authority you or junc possess...for some reason.

    I fully understand that point and said the same thing many times. That is not what I am debating. I am debating that the correct calls were made. I don't like to hear whining and claims of getting screwed when they are simply not true.
    Not whining, and not claiming we got screwed. Not the one who created the thread...and no, I just showed how ur entire theory was flawed with the timing.
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    BTW, congrats on the victory. You guys played a near perfect game all around and fully deserved the victory. I've been surprised by the Dolphins emergence this year as a team that was once considered to be a 5-6 win team.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    YOU are whining over the tenths of this and tenths of that. not me. Im claiming seconds.

    Whistle comes at 6.9 seconds, now that I have the game on my pc and playing it on VLC. 6.3 seconds is ur figure.
    Your claims are dead wrong, and you prove them wrong with your own post. If you start timing when he catches the ball in the end zone, it might be 6.9 seconds. The clock is not supposed to start until he enters the field of play. Even at 6.9 seconds, and the clock stopping as soon as it his 2:01, the most it can be is 1.9 seconds. Not 3 seconds. We know the clock did not stop as soon as it hit 2:01 because the clock immediately changed to 2:00 on the next play. That means the clock read something like 2:01.10.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    How do u know he wasn't listening for the whistle and only looking for the signal?
    It is the game clock operators job to stop the clock when the play is over. Unless he is blind, I doubt he is only listing for a whistle. A whistle is not the only signal that calls the play dead. I posted the rule several times and you have yet to post something that backs up what you are saying.



    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    Wrong. 15:00 means the clock can be anywhere between 14:59:01-15:00:00. It doesn't mean it has between 15:00:00 to 15:00:99, obviously. Just look at any first play of any quarter. Clock doesn't tick to 14:59 until after a second. 14:59 means the clock less than 14 minutes and 59 seconds left on the clock. 2:06 means the clock is anywhere between 2:05:01 to 2:06:00. So deduct the 6.3 you claim (or the 6.1 from where the ref indicates the signal) and you have a 2 min warning. I counted 6.9 seconds till the whistle. Add in the reaction time and u have 7 full seconds. Compare that against the 5 seconds the clock ticked down and u have yourself a 2 second difference, the same difference I continued to talk about (2-3 seconds).
    You could not be more wrong, and your own post proves it. 14:59.01 means that the clock is less than 1-tenth of a second away from changing to 14:58. When the clock reads 15:00.00 on the first play of a quarter, that means there is a full 10-tenths on that seconds. The tenths reset at 0, so going backwards would go like this:

    15:00.00
    15:00.99
    15:00.98
    15:00.97
    15:00.96

    Ect...Ect... until that 9-tenth goes to the 8-tenth, and the 8-tenth goes to the 7 ,6 5, 4 ,3 ,3 ,2 ,0 and then the clock changes to 14:59.00, then 14:59.99 and so and so on. You prove this to be true with the statement I highlighted above. You said "The clock does not tick to 14:59 until after a second. (10- tenths)

    15:00.99 is a tenth of a tenth away from a full 10-tenths which would read 15:00.00. The resting zeros is what is confusing you. As soon as the clock changes to 2:06, there is a full 10-tenths that must be counted before it changes to 2:05. That means starting at 2:06 that 5.9 seconds can pass and the clock will still read 2:01.

    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    Wrong, because 15:00 doesn't potentially mean from 15:00:01 to 15:00:99 in the NFL, although any countdown clock will disagree with it.
    If this were true, then it would be impossible for a second to pass before the clock changed to 14:59, because no tenths would be counted. It would change immediately.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    The ball crossed the goal post as soon as clock read 2:07. What took the operator to wait an entire second before hitting the stop button? The usual reaction time of looking at the refs signal or whistle.

    The rest of the entire theory is just proven wrong above about clock potentially being 2:06:99.
    It doesn't take a full second to stop the clock. It takes less than a tenth of a second. The clock is reading 2:07.10 and he can get the signal and stop the clock at 2:06.99 (which is a tenth of a tenth away from 2:06.00) If there is that long of a delay in stopping the clock at the right time, then there should also be that long of a delay in starting it at the right time which would cancel it out.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    No, we are still talking about much more than a second.
    No, we are not. Watch the play before the KO fumble and the play after the KO fumble. You will see that the clock just changes to 2:06 when the clock should be stopped, and changes to 2:00 immediately on the next play. Because of this, we know that we have a full 2:06. The play took 6.3 until we hear the whistle, and 5.9 seconds passed on the clock. That is a difference of 4-tenths of a second.

    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    Repetitive, and because judging by refs signal, he was not running towards the play. He was either standing still, or moving slowly towards the new LoS (moving alongside the camera angle). An earlier signal would have shown up earlier.
    You can see him taking steps towards the players in the video. We don't know how many since we don't get to see where he started from. It doesn't even matter since we can see him waving his arms at least 2-tenths before the whistle blows. It is ridiculous to whine about getting screwed if the clock operator stopped the clock 2-tenths of a second too soon.

    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    You must have missed the replay from another angle I told u about. U can not determine if the player had control of the ball or not by looking at a still picture. The ball was moving. Clock operator determined it wasn't, way beyond the refs determined. In such instances, clock operator generally takes his time to stop the clock. Many times we see as many as 10 seconds being taken off the clock before it stops. Its common, so please do not tell me you've never seen it happen.
    The pic is from the video, and you can clearly tell in the video that he had possession and was being touched down. Are you telling me that you would be arguing that it should be NE's ball if they manage to strip it away from the Jets player after that point in the picture? No, you would be saying that he is clearly down by contact with possession. That pic came at 5.5, and the whistle came at 6.3.

    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    So I guess u and junc have the higher authority over who is wrong and who is right. However, Im pretty sure WV is biased against the Jets to some extent, yet he agrees with me. But again, he is doesn't have the higher authority you or junc possess...for some reason.
    The authority is the rules of the game and the officials who enforce them. I am not an official, but I can clearly see that it was PI. I have no way to prove it to you.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    Not whining, and not claiming we got screwed. Not the one who created the thread...and no, I just showed how ur entire theory was flawed with the timing.
    It is your posts that have been wrong, and continue to be.


    Quote Originally Posted by JETSJETSJETS View Post
    BTW, congrats on the victory. You guys played a near perfect game all around and fully deserved the victory. I've been surprised by the Dolphins emergence this year as a team that was once considered to be a 5-6 win team.
    Thanks! That was a bad way for Jets to enter the bye. Things look really bad for them, but with all the mediocrity in the AFC and the schedule, you never know what can happen in the 2nd half of the season.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The New Guy View Post
    Your claims are dead wrong, and you prove them wrong with your own post. If you start timing when he catches the ball in the end zone, it might be 6.9 seconds. The clock is not supposed to start until he enters the field of play. Even at 6.9 seconds, and the clock stopping as soon as it his 2:01, the most it can be is 1.9 seconds. Not 3 seconds. We know the clock did not stop as soon as it hit 2:01 because the clock immediately changed to 2:00 on the next play. That means the clock read something like 2:01.10.
    2 seconds is within my 2 to 3 second claim.

    It is the game clock operators job to stop the clock when the play is over. Unless he is blind, I doubt he is only listing for a whistle. A whistle is not the only signal that calls the play dead. I posted the rule several times and you have yet to post something that backs up what you are saying.
    U said "He is looking for the officials signal, not listening for a whistle".

    You could not be more wrong, and your own post proves it. 14:59.01 means that the clock is less than 1-tenth of a second away from changing to 14:58. When the clock reads 15:00.00 on the first play of a quarter, that means there is a full 10-tenths on that seconds. The tenths reset at 0, so going backwards would go like this:

    15:00.00
    15:00.99
    15:00.98
    15:00.97
    15:00.96

    Ect...Ect... until that 9-tenth goes to the 8-tenth, and the 8-tenth goes to the 7 ,6 5, 4 ,3 ,3 ,2 ,0 and then the clock changes to 14:59.00, then 14:59.99 and so and so on. You prove this to be true with the statement I highlighted above. You said "The clock does not tick to 14:59 until after a second. (10- tenths)
    When the clock hits 0:00, that doesn't mean it still has anywhere from 0:00:00 to 0:00:99. It means, the most the clock can have on it is 0 seconds. Similarly, when the very first play of the quarter takes place, the clock doesn't tick down to 14:59 until after a complete second, plus reaction time. Just look at any play and it'll prove u wrong, just like on every subject you are talking about.

    15:00.99 is a tenth of a tenth away from a full 10-tenths which would read 15:00.00. The resting zeros is what is confusing you. As soon as the clock changes to 2:06, there is a full 10-tenths that must be counted before it changes to 2:05. That means starting at 2:06 that 5.9 seconds can pass and the clock will still read 2:01.
    Again, on the NFL clock, the clock is different from a countdown clock or the nba clock. NBA clock has tenths of seconds (or maybe even hundredths of seconds?) to show that 0:00 can be 0:00:9, almost an entire second. In the NFL, the clock only ticks to the next second (2:01 for instance) when it has 2:01 seconds OR less. 2:00:01 will read as 2:01 on the NFL clock and my theory is proven when u see the very first play of any quarter where the clock doesn't change to 14:59 until a full second after the snap.

    If this were true, then it would be impossible for a second to pass before the clock changed to 14:59, because no tenths would be counted. It would change immediately.
    I should, but it doesn't. just take a look.

    It doesn't take a full second to stop the clock. It takes less than a tenth of a second. The clock is reading 2:07.10 and he can get the signal and stop the clock at 2:06.99 (which is a tenth of a tenth away from 2:06.00) If there is that long of a delay in stopping the clock at the right time, then there should also be that long of a delay in starting it at the right time which would cancel it out.
    Wrong as proven above.

    No, we are not. Watch the play before the KO fumble and the play after the KO fumble. You will see that the clock just changes to 2:06 when the clock should be stopped, and changes to 2:00 immediately on the next play. Because of this, we know that we have a full 2:06. The play took 6.3 until we hear the whistle, and 5.9 seconds passed on the clock. That is a difference of 4-tenths of a second.
    2:06 means that it has 2 mins and 6 seconds OR less on the clock.

    You can see him taking steps towards the players in the video. We don't know how many since we don't get to see where he started from. It doesn't even matter since we can see him waving his arms at least 2-tenths before the whistle blows. It is ridiculous to whine about getting screwed if the clock operator stopped the clock 2-tenths of a second too soon.
    Again, those 2- tenths of a second according to ur reading (or more than a second according to my calculations) makes a huge difference.

    The pic is from the video, and you can clearly tell in the video that he had possession and was being touched down. Are you telling me that you would be arguing that it should be NE's ball if they manage to strip it away from the Jets player after that point in the picture? No, you would be saying that he is clearly down by contact with possession. That pic came at 5.5, and the whistle came at 6.3.
    I didn't say anything about the ball being stripped. U are still not looking at the following replay I've mentioned. Maybe because u don't want to. It shows the player didn't have full control of the ball when he was touched...and the clock operator can not determine all by himself to stop the clock before getting the signal from the ref. Where the clock operator does have the right to stop the clock would be on an incomplete pass where he doesn't need a refs signal to determine the play is dead, not on a fumble recovery where there is a pile. Common sense. Clock operator has rules to follow, and they are not very complicated.

    The authority is the rules of the game and the officials who enforce them. I am not an official, but I can clearly see that it was PI. I have no way to prove it to you.
    Apparently, the official standing couple of steps away from the play didn't think it was PI, but you, who hardly had a good angle of the play, determines that it was a clear PI. You don't have a way to prove it to me because there is NO evidence of it.

    It is your posts that have been wrong, and continue to be.
    My posts are wrong according to you, not according to the nfl time clock.

    Thanks! That was a bad way for Jets to enter the bye. Things look really bad for them, but with all the mediocrity in the AFC and the schedule, you never know what can happen in the 2nd half of the season.
    When Revis went down, so did my hopes for the season. He was a big part of how Jets play D. They played well against the Pats but Jets needed everything to go in their favor to win many games. Then Holmes went down. Keller had been out. Hill was out with hammy too. Kerley wasn't 100%. Shonn got bruised up. Bilal Powell got knocked out. McKnight, Schillen, Bart Scott. The list is long with the injuries on the Jets side. The OL is playing terrible and so are the defensive front 7. And then a lot of boneheaded plays by the CS. I still think Jets can win 9 games, but thats only because its a weak schedule for our division this year. buttfumble played very good against the Pats but threw some bad passes under pressure a 9 year old could complete. When there's no pressure, buttfumble plays well. Now its up to the CS to prove their worth for the 2nd half to keep their jobs.
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