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Thread: If the draft were today, would you take Johnny Football over Tannehill?

  1. -11
    Birdmond's Avatar
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    I would absolutely take Johnny football over Tannehill. Like Luck, Wilson and RGIII, Johnny Football has been great. Tannehill has never been great on any level. Now before the homer's come out crying about bashing Tanny, let it be known that I like Ryan Tannehill and think he'll be a very good NFL QB. I just don't think he'll be great because he never has been.

    ---------- Post added at 06:28 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:26 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisJNelson View Post
    I don't think people here realize that Manziel is not a starting NFL quarterback prospect. He's closer to Eric Crouch than he is Ryan Tannehill.
    According to who?
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    Is this an honest question or a troll? If it's a troll, you did well because I'm not sure.

    When looking for an NFL QB, the 2 things you require are 1) Accuracy, and 2) Decision Making. Tannehill is at the top of the charts for accuraacy truthfully. His decision making has been shockingly good and seems to be improving, but I'd say isn't better than above-average by NFL standards yet.

    Johnny Football has poor accuracy and rudimentary decision making. I fully expect his decision making to be fine by the time he graduates as a senior, but accuracy is mostly a born ability much like footspeed. It can be improved, but basically either you have it or you don't. NFL accuracy is kinda like hitting Major League fastballs ... very few have the skill at that level, and without it, you abjectly fail at that level.

    There are other things that help too, such as 3) Size, 4) Arm Strength, 5) Pocket Presence, 6) Play Extension, 7) Pre-Snap Reads, 8) Progressions, 9) Touch, 10) Play-Action. Tannehill has better evaluation on these too. Sure, JF is the better runner ... which means the 1.5 seasons before the concussions begin to take their toll he'll add a a different dimension, but very soon that "different dimension" will become "onfield dimensia" as he stops hearing pass rushers footsteps or hears phantom footsteps. As he starts to drop the ball and the different dimension becomes turnover dimension. As he progresses slowly because at the first sign of trouble he pulls the ball down and runs for 7 yards and loses the ability to extend the play for a 30 yard pass or a TD the way Rothleisberger (sp?) does. This is all predicated on whether he has a knee injury or not. With a knee injury he becomes just another subpar pocket passer with underdeveloped skills, too short to see over the OL and DL, not enough arm to make the deep out and other sideline throws. The defense stacks the near side and his arm can't get the ball to single coverage on the far sideline.

    In a vacuum would I want Johnny Football ... no, he doesn't project to be a decent NFL QB. Would I prefer Johnny Football to Tannehill ... HELL TO THE NO, because Tannehill not only projects to be a good NFL QB, he's already making significant progress towards getting there. For the record, I am happy for Johnny Football and like the guy--he seems like a pretty good kid. But no, I don't want any part of him in the NFL. Just in case anyone is unsure, I also don't want Tim Tebow, who I also like and think is a pretty good guy. But in the NFL, the passing game is HUGE, and all a running QB does is constantly take the fulcrum of your passing offense out of the protective rules the NFL carved for pocket passing. On the edge the QB is gambling with rent money ... if he loses, it's soon going to be a catastrafic loss.
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  3. -13
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    Re: If the draft were today, would you take Johnny Football over Tannehill?

    yawn
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  4. -14
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    This has to be the dumbest thread ever......are you kidding me? Not only did the OP started this stupid thread, but to think that some people agree that they'd take this kid over Tannehill is even worse....this kid might not even get drafted and if he does it'll be in the 6 or 7 round. What he's doing in college doesn't translate to the NFL. Have people forgotten about Pat White?

    Ozzy rules!!
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  5. -15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digital View Post
    Is this an honest question or a troll? If it's a troll, you did well because I'm not sure.

    When looking for an NFL QB, the 2 things you require are 1) Accuracy, and 2) Decision Making. Tannehill is at the top of the charts for accuraacy truthfully. His decision making has been shockingly good and seems to be improving, but I'd say isn't better than above-average by NFL standards yet.

    Johnny Football has poor accuracy and rudimentary decision making. I fully expect his decision making to be fine by the time he graduates as a senior, but accuracy is mostly a born ability much like footspeed. It can be improved, but basically either you have it or you don't. NFL accuracy is kinda like hitting Major League fastballs ... very few have the skill at that level, and without it, you abjectly fail at that level.

    There are other things that help too, such as 3) Size, 4) Arm Strength, 5) Pocket Presence, 6) Play Extension, 7) Pre-Snap Reads, 8) Progressions, 9) Touch, 10) Play-Action. Tannehill has better evaluation on these too. Sure, JF is the better runner ... which means the 1.5 seasons before the concussions begin to take their toll he'll add a a different dimension, but very soon that "different dimension" will become "onfield dimensia" as he stops hearing pass rushers footsteps or hears phantom footsteps. As he starts to drop the ball and the different dimension becomes turnover dimension. As he progresses slowly because at the first sign of trouble he pulls the ball down and runs for 7 yards and loses the ability to extend the play for a 30 yard pass or a TD the way Rothleisberger (sp?) does. This is all predicated on whether he has a knee injury or not. With a knee injury he becomes just another subpar pocket passer with underdeveloped skills, too short to see over the OL and DL, not enough arm to make the deep out and other sideline throws. The defense stacks the near side and his arm can't get the ball to single coverage on the far sideline.

    In a vacuum would I want Johnny Football ... no, he doesn't project to be a decent NFL QB. Would I prefer Johnny Football to Tannehill ... HELL TO THE NO, because Tannehill not only projects to be a good NFL QB, he's already making significant progress towards getting there. For the record, I am happy for Johnny Football and like the guy--he seems like a pretty good kid. But no, I don't want any part of him in the NFL. Just in case anyone is unsure, I also don't want Tim Tebow, who I also like and think is a pretty good guy. But in the NFL, the passing game is HUGE, and all a running QB does is constantly take the fulcrum of your passing offense out of the protective rules the NFL carved for pocket passing. On the edge the QB is gambling with rent money ... if he loses, it's soon going to be a catastrafic loss.
    Thank You

    Manziel is Doug Flutie 2 and will probably be third string back up in the NFL then go on to light up the CFL then go back to the NFL
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    yes i would, but since we have tanne I would take both!
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    Quote Originally Posted by electrolyte View Post
    Johnny Football is a FRESHMAN. Won the Heisman in his first damn season of playing collegiate ball, something never done before in history. Just watch as he develops. His ceiling is higher than Tannehill's, much higher.
    Didn't Saint Tebow win it as a Soph??

    And now back to reality... The A & M player the phins should take a long look at is Uzoma Nwachukwu. He could be the speed guy Miami's offense needs and has chemistry w/ RT17.
    Itís reassuring to know the world is crazier than you are. - Erik Selvig, Thor: The Dark World











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  8. -18
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    Quote Originally Posted by electrolyte View Post
    Johnny Football is a FRESHMAN. Won the Heisman in his first damn season of playing collegiate ball, something never done before in history. Just watch as he develops. His ceiling is higher than Tannehill's, much higher.
    No, it's not. Not as a pro. They are two very different games.

    ---------- Post added at 12:22 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:22 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Birdmond View Post
    I would absolutely take Johnny football over Tannehill. Like Luck, Wilson and RGIII, Johnny Football has been great. Tannehill has never been great on any level. Now before the homer's come out crying about bashing Tanny, let it be known that I like Ryan Tannehill and think he'll be a very good NFL QB. I just don't think he'll be great because he never has been.

    ---------- Post added at 06:28 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:26 AM ----------



    According to who?
    Reality.

    ---------- Post added at 12:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:22 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Digital View Post
    Is this an honest question or a troll? If it's a troll, you did well because I'm not sure.

    When looking for an NFL QB, the 2 things you require are 1) Accuracy, and 2) Decision Making. Tannehill is at the top of the charts for accuraacy truthfully. His decision making has been shockingly good and seems to be improving, but I'd say isn't better than above-average by NFL standards yet.

    Johnny Football has poor accuracy and rudimentary decision making. I fully expect his decision making to be fine by the time he graduates as a senior, but accuracy is mostly a born ability much like footspeed. It can be improved, but basically either you have it or you don't. NFL accuracy is kinda like hitting Major League fastballs ... very few have the skill at that level, and without it, you abjectly fail at that level.

    There are other things that help too, such as 3) Size, 4) Arm Strength, 5) Pocket Presence, 6) Play Extension, 7) Pre-Snap Reads, 8) Progressions, 9) Touch, 10) Play-Action. Tannehill has better evaluation on these too. Sure, JF is the better runner ... which means the 1.5 seasons before the concussions begin to take their toll he'll add a a different dimension, but very soon that "different dimension" will become "onfield dimensia" as he stops hearing pass rushers footsteps or hears phantom footsteps. As he starts to drop the ball and the different dimension becomes turnover dimension. As he progresses slowly because at the first sign of trouble he pulls the ball down and runs for 7 yards and loses the ability to extend the play for a 30 yard pass or a TD the way Rothleisberger (sp?) does. This is all predicated on whether he has a knee injury or not. With a knee injury he becomes just another subpar pocket passer with underdeveloped skills, too short to see over the OL and DL, not enough arm to make the deep out and other sideline throws. The defense stacks the near side and his arm can't get the ball to single coverage on the far sideline.

    In a vacuum would I want Johnny Football ... no, he doesn't project to be a decent NFL QB. Would I prefer Johnny Football to Tannehill ... HELL TO THE NO, because Tannehill not only projects to be a good NFL QB, he's already making significant progress towards getting there. For the record, I am happy for Johnny Football and like the guy--he seems like a pretty good kid. But no, I don't want any part of him in the NFL. Just in case anyone is unsure, I also don't want Tim Tebow, who I also like and think is a pretty good guy. But in the NFL, the passing game is HUGE, and all a running QB does is constantly take the fulcrum of your passing offense out of the protective rules the NFL carved for pocket passing. On the edge the QB is gambling with rent money ... if he loses, it's soon going to be a catastrafic loss.
    Very well said.
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    If the draft were today, would you take Johnny Football over Tannehill?

    Also keep in mind Manziel is doing this against SEC defenses. Not the garbage defenses Tannehill faced.
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  10. -20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Birdmond View Post
    Also keep in mind Manziel is doing this against SEC defenses. Not the garbage defenses Tannehill faced.
    Just like the defenses Tebow faced in the SEC. Still doesn't make him an NFL-caliber quarterback.
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