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Thread: Hartline seeks L.Robinson's 5yr 32.5mil

  1. -61
    hooshoops's Avatar
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    not sure i agree with the hartline played against the oppositions top corner all season long...
    hoops scoops 2012 season ..."in 2014 ryan tannehill etches his name in stone amongst the games elite qbs"..."ryan tannehill and andrew luck will carry the afc for the next decade plus the way peyton manning and tom brady have this last decade plus"
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  2. -62
    LandShark13's Avatar
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    2013 Dolphins LogoMike Wallace 11Cam Wake 91Tannehill 17
    Quote Originally Posted by 3rdandinches View Post
    So what's the excuse when B.Marshall was here?
    I didn't make a single excuse for him so..... You tell me?
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    I keep seeing how it would be terrible to lose Hartline because of the chemistry he had with Ryan Tannehill.

    This doesn't make sense to me. What is the basis for this argument? To me if the two had a special chemistry together, it would've shown up in the end zone, where things are especially tight, everything happens more quickly, and so chemistry and being on the same page is a bigger part of the equation. Hartline and Tannehill didn't even work together until the regular season anyway. I don't think they got what they got together due to chemistry. I think Hartline is just a pretty good player at what he does, and Ryan Tannehill is a pretty good quarterback at what he does. Chemistry is something you would hope the two would improve upon significantly if you re-signed Brian Hartline.

    But as things stand, I think Hartline is just too physically limited as a player to invest in with such a large amount of money. And since he's not very far along with Hartline from a "chemistry" standpoint anyway, I'd just assume bring in a Greg Jennings and have those two start working on their chemistry.

    Yeah, I get it...Jennings is 29 years old. So was Anquan Boldin when the Ravens signed him in 2010.
    Twitter: @ckparrot
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  4. -64
    Lost in the fog

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    Quote Originally Posted by ckparrothead View Post
    I keep seeing how it would be terrible to lose Hartline because of the chemistry he had with Ryan Tannehill.

    This doesn't make sense to me. What is the basis for this argument? To me if the two had a special chemistry together, it would've shown up in the end zone, where things are especially tight, everything happens more quickly, and so chemistry and being on the same page is a bigger part of the equation. Hartline and Tannehill didn't even work together until the regular season anyway. I don't think they got what they got together due to chemistry. I think Hartline is just a pretty good player at what he does, and Ryan Tannehill is a pretty good quarterback at what he does. Chemistry is something you would hope the two would improve upon significantly if you re-signed Brian Hartline.

    But as things stand, I think Hartline is just too physically limited as a player to invest in with such a large amount of money. And since he's not very far along with Hartline from a "chemistry" standpoint anyway, I'd just assume bring in a Greg Jennings and have those two start working on their chemistry.

    Yeah, I get it...Jennings is 29 years old. So was Anquan Boldin when the Ravens signed him in 2010.
    Well said. Chemistry doesn't just eat up yards between the 20s...it gets the ball into the endzone.
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  5. -65
    Billk78's Avatar
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    I agree with most of you that the amount is too high. But using TDs as a reason isn't that strong of an argument. Brandon Marshall didnt score here either and he went to Chicago and got what, 15 tds?

    Touchdowns aren't all about the talent of the player. It has to do with the team they are playing for also. You dont think if hartline was playing for NE last year he wouldnt have had more than 1 td?
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  6. -66
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    Quote Originally Posted by LandShark13 View Post
    I didn't make a single excuse for him so..... You tell me?
    Yes he needs to score for TDs but last season he played against the other teams top CB and still caught 74 Receptions for over 1K yards, averaging over 14.5 YPC
    That sounded like an excuse on why he doesn't score TD's. That would be your quote equaling your excuse. When BM was here I'm pretty sure BH never saw a #1 CB and still couldn't score.
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  7. -67
    LandShark13's Avatar
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    2013 Dolphins LogoMike Wallace 11Cam Wake 91Tannehill 17
    Quote Originally Posted by 3rdandinches View Post
    That sounded like an excuse on why he doesn't score TD's. That would be your quote equaling your excuse. When BM was here I'm pretty sure BH never saw a #1 CB and still couldn't score.
    Nice how you conveniently left out the part where I said he needs to score more TD's. As for me stating he played against the other teams top CB that was purely for context. No reason to make an excuse for his stats as they were pretty solid.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billk78 View Post
    I agree with most of you that the amount is too high. But using TDs as a reason isn't that strong of an argument. Brandon Marshall didnt score here either and he went to Chicago and got what, 15 tds?

    Touchdowns aren't all about the talent of the player. It has to do with the team they are playing for also. You dont think if hartline was playing for NE last year he wouldnt have had more than 1 td?
    Nobody's saying that touchdowns are ALL about the receiver's talent though. But it certainly plays a part.

    Brandon Marshall suffered a RELATIVE touchdown drought in Miami (emphasis on term 'relative') but he still scored literally more than 4x more touchdowns than Brian Hartline did over the same time period. Marshall scored 9 touchdowns in 2010 and 2011. That includes 6 touchdowns in 2011 when the offense got an upgrade on Henne at quarterback in Matt Moore. Over that time period Hartline scored 2 touchdowns, 1 each year. No increase in touchdowns when Moore took over. No increase in touchdowns when Tannehill took over, either.

    The fact of the matter is if you look at targets and catches from 2002 to 2012, you get 367 wide receivers that qualify with either 60+ catches (2002 to 2005) or 100+ targets (2006 to 2012). Only 2 of those 367 wide receivers had a lower touchdown percentage on their catches than Brian Hartline did in 2012. That's it. Torry Holt in Jacksonville the year before he retired, and Laveranues Coles in Washington when Pat Ramsey was throwing the football.

    And maybe you could even forgive that, IF he had shown a tendency to stick the ball in the end zone in previous years (as had both Holt and Coles). But in 2011 he had 1 touchdown and in 2010 he had 1 touchdown.

    You could also forgive it IF you've seen the kind of physical ability that suggests he can do this regularly, and circumstances just worked against him. But that's not the case either. He's weak after the catch so he's not going to bull his way in from inside the 5 yard line the way Rishard Matthews did in the preseason, or the way a Hakeem Nicks does. He's not a strong catcher of the football in 50/50 or physically challenged catch situations, so no jump balls happening there. When he does get behind a defense, he gets caught from behind unless it is a ridiculously blown coverage (literally, see the Cardinals game).
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  9. -69
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    Quote Originally Posted by LandShark13 View Post
    Nice how you conveniently left out the part where I said he needs to score more TD's. As for me stating he played against the other teams top CB that was purely for context. No reason to make an excuse for his stats as they were pretty solid.
    I left nothing out, you stated you made no excuse. I obviously didn't understand your quote as it certainly sounded like an excuse. I still can't get to his "solid" stats that justify sining him for 6.5mil or so. I see a guy that gets you the same numbers a rookie wr or bottom FA gets you but at a minimum pay scale. I think there are much better ways to invest that money than B.Hartline.

    I would love to sign the guy but at half the cost being bantered about, but I also have zero problems walking away from players that expect a payday that does not reflect the production they bring to the team.
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  10. -70
    LandShark13's Avatar
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    2013 Dolphins LogoMike Wallace 11Cam Wake 91Tannehill 17
    Quote Originally Posted by 3rdandinches View Post
    I left nothing out, you stated you made no excuse. I obviously didn't understand your quote as it certainly sounded like an excuse. I still can't get to his "solid" stats that justify sining him for 6.5mil or so. I see a guy that gets you the same numbers a rookie wr or bottom FA gets you but at a minimum pay scale. I think there are much better ways to invest that money than B.Hartline.

    I would love to sign the guy but at half the cost being bantered about, but I also have zero problems walking away from players that expect a payday that does not reflect the production they bring to the team.
    Contracts are a funny thing. 6.5 Mil per season? On face value I wouldn't pay that either BUT using the same numbers you could sign him to a contract that averages 6.5 Mil over the length of the contract and if its black loaded who cares? The Fins could always release or trade him before they have to pay the bulk of it. Like I said In a previous post I'm going to kick back and see how this whole off-season plays out.
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