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Thread: Coaching- ForBetter or Worse?

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Gift received at 02-24-2014, 02:26 PM from hooshoopsTannehill 17Tannehill 17

    Coaching- ForBetter or Worse?

    We have pretty much dissected every player in every way possible. Now, it's time for the coaches to go under the microscope. This is a very tuff thing to do with a new coaching staff bringing in a new system, with players not of his choosing However, I'm sure Phinatics will be up to the task.

    We're gonna break this up to O and D from last year, and then a look ahead.

    2012 O

    Last year, we threw for 3425 yards, a 199 yard per game average, and 13 TD's
    In 2011, amazingly, we threw for 3425 yards, a 193 average, and 20 TD's

    Last year, we ran for 1802 yards, 112 a game, a 4.1 average, and 15 TD's.
    In 2011, we ran for 1987 yards, 124 a game, a 4.2 average, and 11 TD's.

    That's it for the stats. All things considered, I think they look pretty good, and a little surprising.
    ___________________________________________________________________________________

    Now for the fun part in everyone's "eyeball tests" and opinions on how the coaches did on O. There were many who questioned Sherman on some of his play calling. I do understand but, with what he had to work with, I thought he did well

    The bigger question for me is how the coaches developed the players we had, and the new ones over the course of the year. This is where a big difference can be made. So, my main question is what players got better or worse from what your eyeballs told you?

    I'll start with a couple on both sides.

    I thought Jerry got better, and Tannehill got better almost every week. On the other side, I thought Fasano was worse, and Bess the same. They are both gone.

    Your opinions?
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    For me personally I feel the biggest differences between this year and last are:

    A). Stability in coaching. Last year EVERYTHING was new to EVERYONE. We had new HC, OC, and DC. We had a new system, and new plan and a new way of doing things. This year players know what to expect. They know what Philbin expects and they know the vast majority of the playbook and what their role will be. A lot more of the starters are already in place and players can work on timing with starters, and fine tuning their craft, rather than learning a whole new system. Yes there are new players but EVERYONE was new last year. The vets this year can get others up to speed this year along with the coaches.

    B). Stability at QB. This is no longer a team with a QB battle. We KNOW who the starter is going to be. We can get him up to speed, get him most of the snaps with the starters, and work on the small things rather than trying to see who does what best. I really can't tell you how big I feel this really is. In many ways we will be on the first day of TC, close to where we were on the last day of training camp last year.

    C). More time to get the timing down between the starting QB and the starting WRs. Last year Hartline was hurt and didn't really even get on the field until deep into preseason if I remember correctly. We had no idea who our 2nd through 5th WRs were going to be. This year we have 4 WRs pretty much decided. We pretty much know who are TEs are going to be. If everyone stays healthy it will give us a much better chance of having our timing down for the start of the season.
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Gift received at 02-24-2014, 02:26 PM from hooshoopsTannehill 17Tannehill 17
    Quote Originally Posted by KTOWNFINFAN View Post
    For me personally I feel the biggest differences between this year and last are:

    A). Stability in coaching. Last year EVERYTHING was new to EVERYONE. We had new HC, OC, and DC. We had a new system, and new plan and a new way of doing things. This year players know what to expect. They know what Philbin expects and they know the vast majority of the playbook and what their role will be. A lot more of the starters are already in place and players can work on timing with starters, and fine tuning their craft, rather than learning a whole new system. Yes there are new players but EVERYONE was new last year. The vets this year can get others up to speed this year along with the coaches.

    B). Stability at QB. This is no longer a team with a QB battle. We KNOW who the starter is going to be. We can get him up to speed, get him most of the snaps with the starters, and work on the small things rather than trying to see who does what best. I really can't tell you how big I feel this really is. In many ways we will be on the first day of TC, close to where we were on the last day of training camp last year.

    C). More time to get the timing down between the starting QB and the starting WRs. Last year Hartline was hurt and didn't really even get on the field until deep into preseason if I remember correctly. We had no idea who our 2nd through 5th WRs were going to be. This year we have 4 WRs pretty much decided. We pretty much know who are TEs are going to be. If everyone stays healthy it will give us a much better chance of having our timing down for the start of the season.
    Well said, and completely agree KT. However, I'm trying to break this down with last year O, and last year's D before moving n to this year so we don't have posts all over the place, may be dreaming. LOL
    Last edited by Southbeach 2; 05-09-2013 at 10:37 AM.
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Gift received at 02-24-2014, 02:26 PM from hooshoopsTannehill 17Tannehill 17
    Last year, which players on O got better with coaching, and which ones did not? Should the coaches be given credit or blame?
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    sometimes it feels like we have two head coaches in Sherman and philbin... maybe its just me.

    i thought the team was similar to the year before. couldn't score in red zone, couldn't run consistently, a lot of negative plays, couldn't throw it deep enough, couldn't stop the pass.

    the improvement imo was in redzone defense. teams couldn't punch it in on us.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southbeach 2 View Post
    We have pretty much dissected every player in every way possible. Now, it's time for the coaches to go under the microscope. This is a very tuff thing to do with a new coaching staff bringing in a new system, with players not of his choosing However, I'm sure Phinatics will be up to the task.

    We're gonna break this up to O and D from last year, and then a look ahead.

    2012 O

    Last year, we threw for 3425 yards, a 199 yard per game average, and 13 TD's
    In 2011, amazingly, we threw for 3425 yards, a 193 average, and 20 TD's

    Last year, we ran for 1802 yards, 112 a game, a 4.1 average, and 15 TD's.
    In 2011, we ran for 1987 yards, 124 a game, a 4.2 average, and 11 TD's.

    That's it for the stats. All things considered, I think they look pretty good, and a little surprising.
    ___________________________________________________________________________________

    Now for the fun part in everyone's "eyeball tests" and opinions on how the coaches did on O. There were many who questioned Sherman on some of his play calling. I do understand but, with what he had to work with, I thought he did well

    The bigger question for me is how the coaches developed the players we had, and the new ones over the course of the year. This is where a big difference can be made. So, my main question is what players got better or worse from what your eyeballs told you?

    I'll start with a couple on both sides.

    I thought Jerry got better, and Tannehill got better almost every week. On the other side, I thought Fasano was worse, and Bess the same. They are both gone.

    Your opinions?
    Very Nice post - one of the better ones I think I have encountered in a while.

    I am not sure how much one can apply individual statistics as a team since there is so much personnel difference from 2011 to 2012. But I certainly agree with looking at the trends of individual players where possible. My take is that almost all players should be trending up in abilities/performance as they continue to develop their experience in the system they have, with the exception of those who seem to be constantly nursing an injury. That said however, I think there are some players who have already shown us their peak abilities - and it was not consistently good enough (Jimmy Wilson, Nolan Carroll come to mind). They can win awards for heart, grit, determination, and toughness, but not for the desired result - consistent top-level performance on the field; tackles and takeaways.

    From a coaching perspective, I was most impressed last year when I saw 2 offenses and 2 defenses running at the same time in camp to maximize the practice time and player involvement. Getting players as many reps as possible can only make them better - they have more film to dissect, more opportunity to learn where they can improve, and more opportunity to demonstrate that they learned what was necessary for them to have consistent success on the field.

    I am convinced the better players are those whose maturity facilitates their ability to learn, concentrate, and be fully "in the moment" in terms of participation in the meeting rooms with position coaches, with the teaching, with the system's intricacies, taking their job seriously, etc. For example, given two athletes with very similar height, weight, speed, agility, and overall athleticism, what are the differences between a Jeff Fuller, a Rishard Matthews, and an Anquan Boldin? I think the coaches are emphasizing maturity as much as they are teaching, and they are being life mentors to young men as much or more than they are being position managers. Especially early in the season. The position coaches must develop as much of their talent capital as possible on the players side, and manage the use of that capital on the team side. I have seen that demonstrated more in the past year than I have in the past 15 years.

    It seems Philbin's approach is to keep sacred cows off the football field. Everyone must earn their spot and prove themselves on every play. I like that. Overall, keeping the consistency in the coaching and system should prove a major step forward. Upgrading the team speed should also herald greater expectations.

    Player-wise, I think Tanehill will improve dramatically - I see that self-improvement drive in him. He already has the skills, he's got to continue to develop his mental abilities.

    QB depth and consistency should also make a statement. If something happens to T-hill, we have some of the best backups in the business. Reminds me of the season Greise broke his leg and Earl Morrall took this team to the Super Bowl.

    WR core is improved. on paper. Can't wait to see the jello this koolaid makes when all the chemistry comes together. Reminds me of Warfield, Duper, & Clayton. With a little O.J. McDuffie thrown in for good measure.

    OL is improved for the most part - partly due to player consistency in the middle and a significant improvement in depth. And I liken them to Dwight Stephenson, Larry Little, Jim Langer.

    DL can/should only be better than the top 7 we were last year. If Dion Jordan can mature fast and compliment Cam Wake, that will be a scary combination.

    LB core SHOULD be much better - better speed = more QB pressure/more underneath passing lane coverage. EDIT: I have yet to see that ultimate quarterback of the defense. That Zach Thomas, AJ Duhe, John Offerdahl, Nick Bouniconti intensity and leadership that we have enjoyed such a great legacy of; the Ray Lewis, Patrick Willis, Brian Urlacher, Mike Singletary, Dick Butkus type whose energy, football smarts, and gravitas transcend their mortal abilities. That's the exciting linebacker who can single-handedly destroy an opposing team's running game -and is the linebacker I am still looking for.

    DB core is also much better. on paper. Again - the chemistry teacher needs some time here - but all looks more optimistic than pessimistic.

    Overall, I think the collaboration between the coaching and scouting/Gm is highly self-evident. We have top coaching talent (finally) and they should be extremely proud of what they will be putting on the field this year, and probably a few years hence. Granted, the future wins will only tell that real story. But it is only Spring, and September seems so long away. A fan can still dream can't he?
    Last edited by FinFilbert; 05-08-2013 at 08:42 PM.
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    I am really impressed with the way coach Philbin handled the team as a rookie head coach , and the arrow is finally pointed up for us. How about on hard knocks when he cut Chad Johnson and some of the players called a meeting with the coach about letting this comitee know about personnel moves like this. I think the comitee was Jake Long Karlos Dansby and there was a third person I can't remember who but I wonder if he is still on the team ?
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    After one season cannot make a judgement on the main coaches.
    The offense still a work in progress, defense still a work in progress and head coach same.
    Didnt see anything out of oc or dc that made me stand up and say their principles were better than the guys they replaced.

    I would think that Sherman is an upgrade to Daboll whom I never liked and I think we downgraded from Nolan to Coyle because I think Nolan is one of best DC in league.
    Those are just thoughts though with no evidence concluded from last year
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Gift received at 02-24-2014, 02:26 PM from hooshoopsTannehill 17Tannehill 17
    Quote Originally Posted by Dolphin herbie View Post
    I am really impressed with the way coach Philbin handled the team as a rookie head coach , and the arrow is finally pointed up for us. How about on hard knocks when he cut Chad Johnson and some of the players called a meeting with the coach about letting this comitee know about personnel moves like this. I think the comitee was Jake Long Karlos Dansby and there was a third person I can't remember who but I wonder if he is still on the team ?
    That was Bush. All three gone.
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Gift received at 02-24-2014, 02:26 PM from hooshoopsTannehill 17Tannehill 17
    Let's add in Coyle and our D, which switched to a base 4-3. Nolan is one of the best DC's in the NFL but, I was impressed with what Coyle did on the switch, considering what he had to work with.

    DL- Wake had his best year and was FANtastic. Starks and Soliai were mostly what they were in being VG. Odrick is not a DE but, Coyle did get some good production from him. Vernon and Shelby did progress.

    LB- Dansby and Burnett were MUCH better than the year before. Misi also improved, and I really like what we did late in the season in moving him to DE with Vernon dropping back.

    S- Coyle's change in schemes really benefited Jones and Clemons. Both were much improved.

    CB- This position is tuff to have an opinion on. Apparently, Coyle wanted Marshall, who was injured, and Smith was as inconsistent as can be. Carroll improved, and we don't know enough on what he saw in Patterson. Add in the late trade of VD, and I have to wait and see what he can do this year after adding Grimes, two very promising rookies, a healthy Marshall, and Patterson from day #1. This position will define how good he is.
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