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Thread: Wallace:" Tannehill takes some chances and believes in his arm."likes 5 receiver set.

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    Phindog's Avatar
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    Player Wallace:" Tannehill takes some chances and believes in his arm."likes 5 receiver set.

    Dolphins' Wallace: Tannehill "takes some chances and believes in his arm"

    Dolphins wide receiver Mike Wallace seems to have a high opinion of quarterback Ryan Tannehill. And on Wednesday, after Wallace and Tannehill hooked up on several short and intermediate pass routes late in practice, Wallace gave his opinion of Tannehill.
    Hes a guy who takes some chances and believes in his arm, said Wallace, the free agent signee from Pittsburgh. A lot of times those work out for him. Today was one of those days.

    By the way, the Dolphins showed some five-receiver sets Wednesday, which should give defenses something to ponder. They had Wallace, Hartline, Keller, and running back Lamar Miller on the field together with an empty backfield and H-back Charles Clay and Gibsoon alternating in the fifth receiver spot.
    Wallace seems to like that formation, and he thinks Tannehill likes it, too.
    Its fun because all of our tight ends are really like hybrid tight ends, Wallace said. So anytime we have two of those guys in the game, its like were going five-wide.

    I only paisted two parts of the atricle Read full story...

    http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/m...,1263035.story
    Last edited by Phindog; 08-15-2013 at 10:27 AM.
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    A 5 receiver set with those players makes me happy in my pants.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fintastic2124 View Post
    A 5 receiver set with those players makes me happy in my pants.


    ---------- Post added at 10:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:46 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Phindog View Post
    Dolphins' Wallace: Tannehill "takes some chances and believes in his arm"

    Dolphins wide receiver Mike Wallace seems to have a high opinion of quarterback Ryan Tannehill. And on Wednesday, after Wallace and Tannehill hooked up on several short and intermediate pass routes late in practice, Wallace gave his opinion of Tannehill.
    Hes a guy who takes some chances and believes in his arm, said Wallace, the free agent signee from Pittsburgh. A lot of times those work out for him. Today was one of those days.

    By the way, the Dolphins showed some five-receiver sets Wednesday, which should give defenses something to ponder. They had Wallace, Hartline, Keller, and running back Lamar Miller on the field together with an empty backfield and H-back Charles Clay and Gibsoon alternating in the fifth receiver spot.
    Wallace seems to like that formation, and he thinks Tannehill likes it, too.
    Its fun because all of our tight ends are really like hybrid tight ends, Wallace said. So anytime we have two of those guys in the game, its like were going five-wide.

    I only pasted two parts of the atricle Read full story...

    http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/m...,1263035.story
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    Phindog's Avatar
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    Thats only one of a half a dozen hybrid sets,Omar tweeted about another one but wouldn't say who was on the field.A lot of these will be worked on in closed practices.The TE's lining up as half back and the RB in the slot,it just messes with defenses a little.Still dont know who's gonna run our reverses.I figured Wallace or Mathews.
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    Awsi Dooger's Avatar
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    Generally not a good idea to run empty sets unless you have a premier quarterback. I discovered that more than 10 years ago for betting purposes and have mentioned it on countless sites, including here. The teams with terrific quarterbacks actually should run empty more often than they do, while everyone else is typically better off leaving it alone.

    Buffalo has been the one hysterical example in recent years. They've abused empty even with awful quarterbacking, as I've mentioned a few times. There have been years when the Bills run empty 4 or 5% more frequently than any team in the league, despite woeful results. It was great theater at that game I attended last December. I guess it's like the 3rd down screen pass, that certain teams don't bother to check the results. It looks cute in practice, so let's run it.

    Football Outsiders finally got around to looking at empty a few years ago. Familiar trends, with the best quarterbacks at high DVOA while mediocrities lagged. Some coaches just don't like it even if their quarterback probably would fare well, like Coughlin with Eli.

    At this stage I don't think Tannehill is ready. Empty might work against lesser foes but I hope we abstain in the big games against top quarterbacks. That comparison won't work in our favor, trying to force the same style the opponent is using.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Awsi Dooger View Post
    Generally not a good idea to run empty sets unless you have a premier quarterback. I discovered that more than 10 years ago for betting purposes and have mentioned it on countless sites, including here. The teams with terrific quarterbacks actually should run empty more often than they do, while everyone else is typically better off leaving it alone.

    Buffalo has been the one hysterical example in recent years. They've abused empty even with awful quarterbacking, as I've mentioned a few times. There have been years when the Bills run empty 4 or 5% more frequently than any team in the league, despite woeful results. It was great theater at that game I attended last December. I guess it's like the 3rd down screen pass, that certain teams don't bother to check the results. It looks cute in practice, so let's run it.

    Football Outsiders finally got around to looking at empty a few years ago. Familiar trends, with the best quarterbacks at high DVOA while mediocrities lagged. Some coaches just don't like it even if their quarterback probably would fare well, like Coughlin with Eli.

    At this stage I don't think Tannehill is ready. Empty might work against lesser foes but I hope we abstain in the big games against top quarterbacks. That comparison won't work in our favor, trying to force the same style the opponent is using.
    I think you might be missing the point. We won't be coming out in 5 wide. We will be coming out in 2 WR, 2 backs, 1 TE. Out of that package we can run I-form, Pro sets, and other base running formations, but then we can run some hurry up, with that same package, keeping the defense in base 4-3, or 3-4, and send that same personnel grouping into a 5 wide look. Suddenly Clay who was playing FB, Miller who was playing RB, and Keller who was playing blocking TE are now spread out lined up against 3 LBs. There isn't a team in the league that has 3 LBs that can cover those three. The NFL is about mismatches and versatile personnel groupings is one way to force them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by KTOWNFINFAN View Post
    I think you might be missing the point. We won't be coming out in 5 wide. We will be coming out in 2 WR, 2 backs, 1 TE. Out of that package we can run I-form, Pro sets, and other base running formations, but then we can run some hurry up, with that same package, keeping the defense in base 4-3, or 3-4, and send that same personnel grouping into a 5 wide look. Suddenly Clay who was playing FB, Miller who was playing RB, and Keller who was playing blocking TE are now spread out lined up against 3 LBs. There isn't a team in the league that has 3 LBs that can cover those three. The NFL is about mismatches and versatile personnel groupings is one way to force them.
    also creates mismatch opposite way as far as blocking
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    Interesting.

    I wonder if Sherman/Philbin wanted to implement this last year, but lacked the team speed to do it. Going to a hybrid set that could either line up in a pro or a five-wide formation would probably require deep and seam threats to work. Hello, Mr. Wallace and Mr. Keller....
    "If foot fetish videos of your wife surface online, and the voice of the cameraman sounds like you, just admit that it was you ... because the alternative is that someone else was filming foot fetish videos of your wife, and I'm pretty sure that's worse." - Bill Simmons's enduring lesson to Rex Ryan.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Awsi Dooger View Post
    Generally not a good idea to run empty sets unless you have a premier quarterback. I discovered that more than 10 years ago for betting purposes and have mentioned it on countless sites, including here. The teams with terrific quarterbacks actually should run empty more often than they do, while everyone else is typically better off leaving it alone.

    Buffalo has been the one hysterical example in recent years. They've abused empty even with awful quarterbacking, as I've mentioned a few times. There have been years when the Bills run empty 4 or 5% more frequently than any team in the league, despite woeful results. It was great theater at that game I attended last December. I guess it's like the 3rd down screen pass, that certain teams don't bother to check the results. It looks cute in practice, so let's run it.

    Football Outsiders finally got around to looking at empty a few years ago. Familiar trends, with the best quarterbacks at high DVOA while mediocrities lagged. Some coaches just don't like it even if their quarterback probably would fare well, like Coughlin with Eli.

    At this stage I don't think Tannehill is ready. Empty might work against lesser foes but I hope we abstain in the big games against top quarterbacks. That comparison won't work in our favor, trying to force the same style the opponent is using.
    As usual, lots of awesome stuff here, Mr. Dooger. I think empty sets can be effective, when used sparingly, out of the 1 RB, 2 WR, 2 TE sets - especially in no-huddle situations. But I emphasize "when used sparingly." I think you're absolutely right that Tannehill is not ready to have that kind of responsibility. Our O-line isn't built for it either. We're built to run the ball well, take advantage of uncertainty (play action passing and formations that don't telegraph our intent) in the D.
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    Sherman is probably looking at Coyle's myriad and exotic defensive schemes and getting a bit of "scheme envy". On the defensive side, we suspect but don't know yet whether we have the CBs to handle a blitz-heavy aggressive defense and on offense we suspect but don't know yet whether we have the QB to run the more exotic offensive wrinkles like read option and empty sets.

    One thing is for sure, successful of not, it makes a refreshing change to be anticipating these sets and not "3 yards and a cloud of punts".
    Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. - S. Beckett
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