Fangio Vs. Weaver/McDaniel - A Referendum On Cam Smith And The Defense Overall

[Mello Yello]

Fangio didn’t want to be here. He accepted the job before realizing the Philadelphia job...

I wish Vic hadn't wasted Miami's time...

If Fangio actually felt that way and went to McDaniel & Grier declaring he'd had a change of heart and really didn't want to spend 2023 in Miami, the Dolphins would've immediately let him walk.

It would've been in the best interest of both parties for the deal to have been dissolved right then and there if Fangio planned to (or the Dolphins thought he would) purposefully lay down and give a half-hearted effort. Moreover, that doesn't correlate with what we know people say about Vic Fangio and his character.

The Dolphins very clearly wanted Fangio to stay (even if just for a single year) and went about convincing him to stick around for 2023, most likely to maximize their potential for a SB run.

The idea that Fangio "wasted Miami's time" doesn't make any sense at all. If he didn't want to be in Miami he could've easily just sat the year out entirely as many coaches have done before. He stuck around in Miami to help the Dolphins. And the thanks he gets for that are a few bitter fans labeling him a traitor.

It was most likely the Dolphins begging him believing they could make a run and that the 12 months he was aboard would be sufficient for them to scout out the DC landscape for a long-term replacement.


Blaming every coach/player who leaves Miami only to pretend the Miami Dolphins are victims is a binary that has never mapped onto reality. IMHO, it's entirely unbecoming of fans to do that.

 

[NY8123]

If Fangio actually felt that way and went to McDaniel & Grier declaring he'd had a change of heart and really didn't want to spend 2023 in Miami, the Dolphins would've immediately let him walk.

It would've been in the best interest of both parties for the deal to have been dissolved right then and there if Fangio was going to purposefully lay down and give a half-hearted effort. Moreover, that doesn't correlate with what we know people say about Vic Fangio and his character.

The Dolphins very clearly wanted Fangio to stay (even if just for a single year) and went about convincing him to stick around for 2023, most likely to maximize their potential for a SB run.

The idea that Fangio "wasted Miami's time" doesn't make any sense at all. It was most likely the Dolphins begging him believing they could make a run and that the 12 months he was aboard would be sufficient for them to scout out the DC landscape for a long-term replacement.


Blaming every coach/player who leaves Miami only to pretend the Miami Dolphins are victims is a binary that has never mapped onto reality. IMHO, it's entirely unbecoming of fans to do that.

You sort of contradicted yourself and illustrated a point, it was a waste because Miami had a deal with Vic, Vic then dragged it out and then the deal looked to fall apart only to reconfirm and later accepted and Vic came to Miami.

I am certain that once Miami made him the highest paid coordinator in the league it wasn't for a one year rental. Miami did that to bring him here until he decided to retire or at least you could easily draw that conclusion. This "one year Super Bowl" all in is just fans saying that is the mode they were in, it's clear it wasn't a "one year" sell out run. Things have progressed and the team is good shape this season and has a shot. Why change coordinators in the middle of your best years?

Vic clearly had reservations about accepting a tenure in Miami, the entire process and the way it played out became apparent. As many have pointed out, if that Philly job was available Vic would have taken it. That to me it is a waste of time to both clubs, he could have just declined and moved on. Hindsight I know and there was a lot of money on the table and if it were me, I'd probably would have taken the cash too but replacing coordinators who are brought in an organization and move on to become head coaches is one thing, to bring on a DC as a DC and then replace him after one season is a waste of time. If Weaver leaves after 2024 I'll have the same feeling and you can make the case it was ultimately caused by Fangio's departure.

With all that said let's hope Weaver is legit and brings this D to the next level. I just want to be alive to watch Miami in a Super Bowl again!

 

[utahphinsfan]

It is a good one. I am working on some others.

I think I called the Falcons the EBT Enabled Swill Vultures.

Bills are the Western NY Meth Carnies.

I need to come up with some other stuff.

IIRC, you had a one for Tampa as well.

 

[MrClean]

Can we ban Vic Fangios name from this site and all things dolphins ???

Hate that mother grabber

Oh, come on DJ. Since the day VF and the Dolphins parted ways, you have probably brought up his name more than any other single poster. Here and elsewhere. Now you want to ban his name? lol. But could you even adhere to this ban that you suggest?

 

[Rick Cartman]

If Fangio actually felt that way and went to McDaniel & Grier declaring he'd had a change of heart and really didn't want to spend 2023 in Miami, the Dolphins would've immediately let him walk.

It would've been in the best interest of both parties for the deal to have been dissolved right then and there if Fangio planned to (or the Dolphins thought he would) purposefully lay down and give a half-hearted effort. Moreover, that doesn't correlate with what we know people say about Vic Fangio and his character.

The Dolphins very clearly wanted Fangio to stay (even if just for a single year) and went about convincing him to stick around for 2023, most likely to maximize their potential for a SB run.

The idea that Fangio "wasted Miami's time" doesn't make any sense at all. If he didn't want to be in Miami he could've easily just sat the year out entirely as many coaches have done before. He stuck around in Miami to help the Dolphins. And the thanks he gets for that are a few bitter fans labeling him a traitor.

It was most likely the Dolphins begging him believing they could make a run and that the 12 months he was aboard would be sufficient for them to scout out the DC landscape for a long-term replacement.


Blaming every coach/player who leaves Miami only to pretend the Miami Dolphins are victims is a binary that has never mapped onto reality. IMHO, it's entirely unbecoming of fans to do that.

The situation could have been handled better by all parties, it did seem like Fangio didn't want to be here once he agreed to the job and realized there were other openings he desired.
With that said, to suggest he mailed it in this past season, as some here have, is absurd.

 

[Rick Cartman]

I think Cam Smith is a detrimentally aggressive corner that got caught out of position a lot in college that happened to be boys with the general manager's son.
That has nothing to do with Vic Fangio.

 

[MrChadRico]

As you know Fangio is now the DC in Philadelphia:

-Philadelphia drafted 2 CBs, in the first and second round. Can they understand Fangio's defense and do they get on the field? How do they look? At the same time, how will Cam Smith do for us this year, with the benefit of an extra year and a new DC? We have two ways of figuring out how much of the issue was Cam Smith, and how much of the issue was Fangio?

-Then the other question is how does the Philly defense look outright and relative to last year, and then the same for the Dolphins? Who gets better, and who gets worse? Which team ends up with the better D? Both teams are starting from scratch with a new DC, so a fair compare. Granted, talent levels may be different, I am not sure. But it will be interesting to watch as well.

Any guesses as to how this all plays out?

I think Mitchell and Dejean and far better prospects than Cam Smith was.

Parcells quote about "if they don't bite as pups" comes to mind.

I'm hoping he sees the field next year and shows a better career trajectory than the Noah Igbonogonee track he's on. I'm worried.

 

[Mello Yello]

You sort of contradicted yourself and illustrated a point, it was a waste because Miami had a deal with Vic, Vic then dragged it out and then the deal looked to fall apart only to reconfirm and later accepted and Vic came to Miami.

I am certain that once Miami made him the highest paid coordinator in the league it wasn't for a one year rental. Miami did that to bring him here until he decided to retire or at least you could easily draw that conclusion. This "one year Super Bowl" all in is just fans saying that is the mode they were in, it's clear it wasn't a "one year" sell out run. Things have progressed and the team is good shape this season and has a shot. Why change coordinators in the middle of your best years?

Vic clearly had reservations about accepting a tenure in Miami, the entire process and the way it played out became apparent. As many have pointed out, if that Philly job was available Vic would have taken it. That to me it is a waste of time to both clubs, he could have just declined and moved on. Hindsight I know and there was a lot of money on the table and if it were me, I'd probably would have taken the cash too but replacing coordinators who are brought in an organization and move on to become head coaches is one thing, to bring on a DC as a DC and then replace him after one season is a waste of time. If Weaver leaves after 2024 I'll have the same feeling and you can make the case it was ultimately caused by Fangio's departure.

With all that said let's hope Weaver is legit and brings this D to the next level. I just want to be alive to watch Miami in a Super Bowl again!

I just don't believe the MD are naive.

Nor do I believe that VF or the MD have time to waste.

OTOH, there is a ton of evidence to show fans are homers and will concoct self-serving narratives.

 

[Mach2]

I just don't believe the MD are naive.

Nor do I believe that VF or the MD have time to waste.

OTOH, there is a ton of evidence to show fans are homers and will concoct self-serving narratives.

You aren't wrong in that some fans wear aqua an orange glasses. At least I can understand that in an emotional sense.

On the other hand, the same concocting of self serving narratives apply to the negative Nellie's who bitch about everything the organization does.

That, I do not understand.

 

[JamesWsenior]

You aren't wrong in that some fans wear aqua an orange glasses. At least I can understand that in an emotional sense.

On the other hand, the same concocting of self serving narratives apply to the negative Nellie's who bitch about everything the organization does.

That, I do not understand.

Exactly. Some times as an org they screw up. Some times as players they **** up.

At the end of the day it is the team we support...win or lose.

Does that mean we accept losing and mediocrity? HELL NO.

But deep diving and criticizing every single bloody thing, while interesting for some, takes much of the fun out of it. For me at least.

If Teddy Two Gloves is our starting QB I will support him although my expectations might be a tad lower than with Tua running the show.

Wilkins I liked and was unhappy to see him go. I wish him well and thank him for his efforts here. But that's where it ends. I am totally focused on our DTs and don't give a rats ass if CW lights it up in Vegas. Gotta keep moving forward and stop looking back. We have work to do.

 

[dolfan91]

There was a lot of uncertainty surrounding Vic Fangio and his hunt for a new DC job after taking an advisory role in Philly. It never felt right.

I don't know what happened in Miami. But on the surface it seemed like there was a disconnect right from the beginning, between Fangio and McDaniel, as well as, Fangio and the players.

Weaver's hiring was a breath of fresh air. He seemed truly enthusiastic about the Dolphins DC position. It appears he's bringing along what he learned in Baltimore with him; playing tough hard nosed defensive football.

Not sure what actually happened between Fangio and Cam Smith. It truly felt like Miami had a true star in the making in Cam Smith, after lighting up the OTA's, Training Camp and Practices. It seemed more personal than talent related. Especially after reading the comments made about Fangio, by the Dolphins players. Even Trill Williams had a negative comment and he never played a meaningful snap as a Dolphin.

The worry for me is a less than stellar debute for Weaver and the return of Fangio's scheme being a success in Philadelphia. Especially after reading how well DeJean and Mitchell performed at Philly's recent rookie camp. On a personal note, I never hid my admiration and preferences for both Mitchell and DeJean to be Miami Dolphins. They look like the real deal. Just like Smith did last year, prior to the start of the regular season.

I have high hopes Weaver's appearent solid relationship with McDaniel, results in a very good and long lasting winning football product.

 

[Jssanto]

As you know Fangio is now the DC in Philadelphia:

-Philadelphia drafted 2 CBs, in the first and second round. Can they understand Fangio's defense and do they get on the field? How do they look? At the same time, how will Cam Smith do for us this year, with the benefit of an extra year and a new DC? We have two ways of figuring out how much of the issue was Cam Smith, and how much of the issue was Fangio?

-Then the other question is how does the Philly defense look outright and relative to last year, and then the same for the Dolphins? Who gets better, and who gets worse? Which team ends up with the better D? Both teams are starting from scratch with a new DC, so a fair compare. Granted, talent levels may be different, I am not sure. But it will be interesting to watch as well.

Any guesses as to how this all plays out?

I don’t care about Philly. I do care about Cam and Tindall

 

[Bob512]

I think Cam Smith will be productive and have a chip on his shoulder this year to prove himself. I am not sure of all of the circumstances that kept him from the field last year, but we know he can play from his college career….so let’s see what he has. I suspect we are going to like what we see.

As for Fangio…….I could care less. He isn’t a Fin anymore……

 

[gfish24]

As you know Fangio is now the DC in Philadelphia:

-Philadelphia drafted 2 CBs, in the first and second round. Can they understand Fangio's defense and do they get on the field? How do they look? At the same time, how will Cam Smith do for us this year, with the benefit of an extra year and a new DC? We have two ways of figuring out how much of the issue was Cam Smith, and how much of the issue was Fangio?

-Then the other question is how does the Philly defense look outright and relative to last year, and then the same for the Dolphins? Who gets better, and who gets worse? Which team ends up with the better D? Both teams are starting from scratch with a new DC, so a fair compare. Granted, talent levels may be different, I am not sure. But it will be interesting to watch as well.

Any guesses as to how this all plays out?

Fu$k Fangio- I think his stupid bullshit cost us a win or 2… and as far as I’m concerned he stole $ from Ross- he wasn’t invested in this team from the jump…. He may be a sought after defensive coordinator, but it doesn’t change the fact that he’s a complete a$$hole

 

[MrClean]

Considering how Cam Smith was kept off the field last year, for whatever reason, it is like having an extra rookie. I suspect their high expectations for Smith is one reason we passed on Mitchell and DeJean, et al.