Fangio Vs. Weaver/McDaniel - A Referendum On Cam Smith And The Defense Overall

[RichmondWeb]

There was a lot of uncertainty surrounding Vic Fangio and his hunt for a new DC job after taking an advisory role in Philly. It never felt right.

I don't know what happened in Miami. But on the surface it seemed like there was a disconnect right from the beginning, between Fangio and McDaniel, as well as, Fangio and the players.

Weaver's hiring was a breath of fresh air. He seemed truly enthusiastic about the Dolphins DC position. It appears he's bringing along what he learned in Baltimore with him; playing tough hard nosed defensive football.

Not sure what actually happened between Fangio and Cam Smith. It truly felt like Miami had a true star in the making in Cam Smith, after lighting up the OTA's, Training Camp and Practices. It seemed more personal than talent related. Especially after reading the comments made about Fangio, by the Dolphins players. Even Trill Williams had a negative comment and he never played a meaningful snap as a Dolphin.

The worry for me is a less than stellar debute for Weaver and the return of Fangio's scheme being a success in Philadelphia. Especially after reading how well DeJean and Mitchell performed at Philly's recent rookie camp. On a personal note, I never hid my admiration and preferences for both Mitchell and DeJean to be Miami Dolphins. They look like the real deal. Just like Smith did last year, prior to the start of the regular season.

I have high hopes Weaver's appearent solid relationship with McDaniel, results in a very good and long lasting winning football product.

This should be two threads, one about the Dolphin's defense and another about controversial draft picks. I am more interested in the first one, the Dolphins' defense:

@dolfan91 said "I have high hopes Weaver's apparent solid relationship with McDaniel, results in a very good and long lasting winning football product." This relationship is the most important factor in producing a winning defense.

McDaniel is still learning on the job. Last year he brought in Fangio's "system" hoping it would complement his offense by producing impact plays. It worked for that, when healthy, but it didn't win enough games or have enough depth. The OP wants to compare last year's stats with this year's. I don't care (well maybe for FF!), the only stat I am focused is winning %. I like the idea of having a flexible adaptable defense rather than a system. Weaver helped do it at Baltimore and he seems to be retooling here by dropping system players who are good, but only at their job, and bringing in athletic guys who he hopes can play multiple roles to keep opponents off-balance and provide more depth. If they can find and construct a defensive unit that will best limit the other team's points and time of possession then they are on their way. So far McD's defenses have been well... "school of hard knocks", but with him and Weaver working together they could be great. Maybe they don't get the FF stats everyone wants but they might still play better defense.

Good teams don't hire a DC to run the defense in a separate camp with separate leaders. And the defensive style must complement the offense.

 

[42March]

Hopefully, its heavy rotation up front with pressure mainly from the edge, keep the backers clean and Ramsay and to a lesser extent Holland moving around. Why Do I think that's the case.
IDL - One, maybe two penetrators in Seiler & Tart. Everybody else is a lane clogger. We will have at least 5 of them - Seiler, Tart, Jones, Gallimore & Harris.
Edge - different style of rushers on the edge Speed/Power - Phillips, Power - Chubb, Speed-Chop, Power/Speed - Barrett & Mo, we can rotate them on a game by game basis to exploit different weaknesses based on player strengths.
LB - Both Long & Brooks can thump as can Walker, whereas Riley is more coverage, but Brooks may never leave the field as he can cover too. Lord knows what Tindall is.
Backend - Ramsey as big Nickel, Smith & Fuller outside, Holland & Poyer.
Ramsey outside with Fuller, Kodou in the slot, Holland & Poyer.
Alt. Big Nickel - Ramsey & Fuller outside with Holland in the slot & Poyer & Needham deep.
Of course if we sign Diggs or Simmons they step into Poyer's role and he becomes the 3rd S

Just my rationale

 

[SF Dolphin Fan]

I am hopeful that Weaver turns out to be great. I love what Baltimore consistently delivers on that side of the ball. If that's the vision, with perhaps a few added wrinkles, I'm all in.

But, based on Fangio's track record, Miami has downgraded there until (or if) Weaver proves otherwise.

 

[AMakados10]

Pretending like Miami hasn't had two outstanding DC minded guys in Flores and Fangio is just being bitter. However, understanding that Flores while great on D absolutely struggled to run a viable offense is key, he needed a better OC on the roster. Fangio absolutely maximized the edge rushing potential of the outside linebackers / DEs, his blitz disguises were superior but it was clear his heart was in Philly. He's old and wanted to be near family and I am sure that caused the riff.

I wish Vic hadn't wasted Miami's time, switching coordinators year after year is just detrimental to success, hopefully Weaver is here for some time and runs a good D.

Honest question, why are the offensive woes counted as Flores struggled to run a viable offense instead of the OC; whereas, McD was given grace by calling out his DC instead?

McD also struggled to run a viable defense that ranked 25th and 22nd over his tenure.

Flores in 2020-2021 seasons, after the organization tanked the 2019 roster, the offense ranked 15th and 22nd, so actually not as “bad” as McD’s defenses.

 

[JamesWsenior]

Honest question, why are the offensive woes counted as Flores struggled to run a viable offense instead of the OC; whereas, McD was given grace by calling out his DC instead?

McD also struggled to run a viable defense that ranked 25th and 22nd over his tenure.

Flores in 2020-2021 seasons, after the organization tanked the 2019 roster, the offense ranked 15th and 22nd, so actually not as “bad” as McD’s defenses.

Flores fired XX offensive coordinators no?

 

[keller377]

It is a good one. I am working on some others.

I think I called the Falcons the EBT Enabled Swill Vultures.

Bills are the Western NY Meth Carnies.

I need to come up with some other stuff.

Name doesn't fit for Atlanta. Mostly highly educated city in the US. Low rate welfare compared to rural areas.

 

[VAFinsfan72]

As you know Fangio is now the DC in Philadelphia:

-Philadelphia drafted 2 CBs, in the first and second round. Can they understand Fangio's defense and do they get on the field? How do they look? At the same time, how will Cam Smith do for us this year, with the benefit of an extra year and a new DC? We have two ways of figuring out how much of the issue was Cam Smith, and how much of the issue was Fangio?

-Then the other question is how does the Philly defense look outright and relative to last year, and then the same for the Dolphins? Who gets better, and who gets worse? Which team ends up with the better D? Both teams are starting from scratch with a new DC, so a fair compare. Granted, talent levels may be different, I am not sure. But it will be interesting to watch as well.

Any guesses as to how this all plays out?

Yeah I want to see how well it goes over in Philly when Fangio's lack of trust and dislike of rookies causes him to keep Mitchell and DeJean on the bench.

 

[NY8123]

Honest question, why are the offensive woes counted as Flores struggled to run a viable offense instead of the OC; whereas, McD was given grace by calling out his DC instead?

McD also struggled to run a viable defense that ranked 25th and 22nd over his tenure.

Flores in 2020-2021 seasons, after the organization tanked the 2019 roster, the offense ranked 15th and 22nd, so actually not as “bad” as McD’s defenses.

Defense:
2023 Miami was 10th in yards per game and gave up 23pts per game.
2021 Miami was 15th in yards per game and gave up 22pts per game.

Offense:
2023 Miami was 1st in yards per game and scored 29pts per game.
2021 Miami was 25th in yards per game and scored 20pts per game.

Scoring Differential:
2023: +6
2021: -2

 

[j-off-her-doll]

Honest question, why are the offensive woes counted as Flores struggled to run a viable offense instead of the OC; whereas, McD was given grace by calling out his DC instead?

McD also struggled to run a viable defense that ranked 25th and 22nd over his tenure.

Flores in 2020-2021 seasons, after the organization tanked the 2019 roster, the offense ranked 15th and 22nd, so actually not as “bad” as McD’s defenses.

Because Flores' process was bad in hiring OC's, and McDaniel's process has been good in hiring DC's.

 

[Ray R]

I am hopeful that Weaver turns out to be great. I love what Baltimore consistently delivers on that side of the ball. If that's the vision, with perhaps a few added wrinkles, I'm all in.

But, based on Fangio's track record, Miami has downgraded there until (or if) Weaver proves otherwise.

We don't know what we don't know and still the "Lemmings" are whining. - LOL

Defense:
2023 Miami was 10th in yards per game and gave up 23pts per game.
2021 Miami was 15th in yards per game and gave up 22pts per game.

Offense:
2023 Miami was 1st in yards per game and scored 29pts per game.
2021 Miami was 25th in yards per game and scored 20pts per game.

Scoring Differential:
2023: +6
2021: -2

Speak up all you "Lemmings".
Don't let all these facts go unanswered. - LOL

 

[Ray R]

Because Flores' process was bad in hiring OC's, and McDaniel's process has been good in hiring DC's.

Now that's a twist that hadn't occurred to me, but it is historically "right on the money". - LOL